Stack Overflow stopped caring about developers a long time ago

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 ก.ค. 2024
  • If you’re a developer and you come across a coding question that needs to be answered, well stack overflow is the first place you would visit. Recently, the platform has been receiving a lot of criticism because of their new partnership with OpenAI. But, upon researching more about stack overflow… it seemed like the decline would have happened either way.
    #programming #developers #coding
    Timeline:
    00:00 Introduction
    00:33 The rise of stack overflow
    03:13 There were cracks in the walls before AI
    07:06 the issue with questions on Stack Overflow
    08:40 When core users start to complain
    11:10 Hello AI, welcome to stack overflow
    15:01 If you can’t beat them, join them
    18:31 The great deletion
    20:25 So what’s going to happen?
  • วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี

ความคิดเห็น • 638

  • @codingwithdee
    @codingwithdee  13 วันที่ผ่านมา +54

    Hey everyone. Sorry for the editing issues with this video and me appearing twice sometimes. I’m not sure what happened but it seemed to just not render properly. 🫠 unlike stack overflow, I will do better next time and make you all happy! Thanks for watching

    • @summerishere2868
      @summerishere2868 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +9

      You actually tricked me into believe that it was an intentional editing. 😄I thought it was a play with AI or something along those lines.

    • @codingwithdee
      @codingwithdee  12 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

      @summerishere2868 No. it was a skill issue… my skill issue ☠️

    • @pauls6447
      @pauls6447 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      I noticed one, but I make mistakes in my code all the time. Nobody's perfect :D

    • @rhodaborrocks1654
      @rhodaborrocks1654 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      I thought wow, this is good stuff 🤪

    • @B_knows_A_R_D-xh5lo
      @B_knows_A_R_D-xh5lo 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      excellent youtube channel 1:31 ❤❤❤❤❤❤

  • @hwhack
    @hwhack 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +227

    It's been terrible for years. The admins are pedantic narcissists.

    • @IllumTheMessage
      @IllumTheMessage 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +7

      Yup

    • @T1Oracle
      @T1Oracle 14 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Narcissists are attracted to positions of authority like flies to 💩. Unfortunately, that's also why everything eventually turns to 💩.
      😔

    • @Perfidion
      @Perfidion 14 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Absolutely. SO is basically a non-interactive site for a lot of people now. You browse for solutions, but you don't engage with the community because it's infested with petulant man-babies who get their jollies from being condescending.

    • @CamAustralia001
      @CamAustralia001 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +5

      Unfortunately yes. My experience when I first joined. Some merit, but some are just as this. Situation has improved in my view.

    • @finhas8865
      @finhas8865 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +14

      Definitely true. Stack overflow has become like a game chat server where the mods and many users try to exert dominance over others.
      The worst part is, you're googling a problem, found the same question by other user on stack overflow, only to find the admin shutting down the question and ask the user to google it. Wtf.

  • @gargara123456
    @gargara123456 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +106

    StackOverflow on job interview:
    -Why do you want to work for us?
    Candidate:
    -What a dumb question to ask!
    StackOverflow:
    -You are hired!!!

    • @demokratifestmariestad6638
      @demokratifestmariestad6638 8 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

      Yes, they believe we have to work for them and be paid by humiliation

    • @WooShell
      @WooShell 5 วันที่ผ่านมา +8

      "Closed as duplicate. Go ask my previous employer for why they hired me."

    • @neanda
      @neanda 4 วันที่ผ่านมา

      🤣

    • @MikkoRantalainen
      @MikkoRantalainen 3 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Seems legit but that wouldn't be about SO job but an admin interview. SO users vote admins and the overall culture is mostly run by popular vote these days. If you think that democracy is a good idea, you should also accept what SO has become.

    • @krzysztofstrojek7175
      @krzysztofstrojek7175 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@WooShell underrated comment

  • @jdobb
    @jdobb 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +220

    Nothing drove me nuts more than finding a post with the exact same question I had only to see one comment "why would you even want to do this," adding zero value to the post.

    • @Kessra
      @Kessra 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +18

      To be fair, lots of questions at StackOverflow are typical XY-questions and comments are exactly there to clarify on or challenge various things, including the basic design to tackle your problem. If you read at SO for like 20 minutes you'll probably find more than a handful duplicate questions. Now consider sitting there for hours trying to "moderate" questions (for whatever reason?!) I can understand why some then get a bit more direct and find the idea posted questionable from the start. I have to say, I'm guilty of that myself when I read posts where people lack an understanding of the topic at hand and just want a one-liner to solve their issues.

    • @catharsis7629
      @catharsis7629 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +5

      See the XY problem

    • @mwwhited
      @mwwhited 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +5

      Yep… so often people are asking for a solution when they can even articulate their problem. Many times there is a better/cleaner solution to the issue once the problem is defined.

    • @finhas8865
      @finhas8865 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

      And the mods shutting down the question.

    • @Notofsoundmind
      @Notofsoundmind 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +7

      I hate those replies, and the ones where they offer an alternative solution that doesn't fit with what you are working on. These replies seem awfully condescending.

  • @user-yg1dg6xm2g
    @user-yg1dg6xm2g 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +56

    Stack Overflow will make money from their deal with OpenAI, but it seems like that might be the last money they ever make.

    • @seaviasfo
      @seaviasfo 3 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      I'm sure they've already trained on all of SO, data after all its public. Could this be just asking permission after the fact to avoid litigation?

  • @bart2019
    @bart2019 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +40

    The top answers that you are referred to if you search on a search engine, are more often than not closed as a duplicate.
    If you then go to the question that SO refers to as the master question, it is often only vaguely related, and has a lower quality in the answers, and even of the questions itself.

  • @sanjaybhatikar
    @sanjaybhatikar 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +37

    I got scolded for not having the latest version of the R programming language even though the question was valid regardless of the version. The person didn't stop and went on with the rant about the evil of not using the latest version. My company had a licensed version that was always some versions behind and he refused to understand or acknowledge that. It was water off a duck's back for me but for many new developers the hostility is intimidating.

    • @zeppelinmexicano
      @zeppelinmexicano 11 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

      Versioning ALONE creates many opportunities for new problems to sound like old problems. Same with the entire stack versus some other stack. It's amazing that experienced mods do not pay much attention to these things.

    • @trentirvin2008
      @trentirvin2008 5 วันที่ผ่านมา

      This is going to sound inflammatory but its genuinely, honestly, a problem that exists because there’s a reaaally disproportionate amount of autistic and antisocial people in the software engineering space. Having an environment where you have zero contact with other human beings and you already don’t understand social queues is random hostility waiting to happen. The people typing out the vitriolic answers honestly don’t understand that they’re being venomous, it’s social ineptitude

    • @ronaldv.7931
      @ronaldv.7931 3 วันที่ผ่านมา

      That's typical of users there, questioning your question instead of providing help.

    • @ForeverZer0
      @ForeverZer0 3 วันที่ผ่านมา

      That would be irritating. There is an abundance of reasons projects use old versions of languages, it isn't even uncommon. Heck, C89 is still widely used, even in new projects.

  • @tiborvegh700
    @tiborvegh700 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +27

    Once I asked a question there, some high rep dude came with this not here for doing your homework attitude, then some time later I answered my own question that I figured out how to solve the issue, then the guy edited my question and said that my own solution did not answer the question. And he was rigth, since he modified my own question the way that the answer no longer covered it. Cool huh?

    • @SiddiqueSukdiki
      @SiddiqueSukdiki วันที่ผ่านมา

      was the guy a moderator or something? How is the person able to edit your question?

  • @dimitrioskalfakis
    @dimitrioskalfakis 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +34

    from the newbie's point of view it used to give the impression of an exclusive club, an elitist group with a purity culture.

    • @zeppelinmexicano
      @zeppelinmexicano 11 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Club atmosphere is right, and we all know that you have to behave in a certain way to join a club. Overflow has so many club rules that it's like walking through a minefield just to post a question.

    • @eightsprites
      @eightsprites 6 วันที่ผ่านมา

      not only from a newbies view.

    • @palecskoda
      @palecskoda 5 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      @@zeppelinmexicano Isn't this just a very exclusive club? Being rejected feels bad, so many complain about the harsh culture. To me, it looks like an Eternal September situation. IMO, the two productive ways to use SO now are either to jump through all the hoops, actually learn the rules and obey them, or just actively participate elsewhere and use SO just as a nice source, without actually contributing. The middle ground may be that you learn some of the rules, specific to e.g. voting or moderation of comments, and you help clean up the mess in those areas while extracting the information you came for.

    • @seaviasfo
      @seaviasfo 3 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

      it was an absolute circle jerk for egomaniacs

  • @dev_time
    @dev_time 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +21

    They are a step away from being forgotten. Nobody likes being treated like a noob for asking a question. They are rude, impolite, and absurd. AI is just the last nail in the coffin.

    • @rostislavsvoboda7013
      @rostislavsvoboda7013 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

      They lost me when I realized I couldn't upvote a particular answer when multiple answers were presented, some of which were provably(!) incorrect. This was because my reputation was only 1 (= new user). That was ~10 years ago. If a website for programmers and engineers values reputation more than proof, then this is not the right place for me anyway.

    • @zapl80
      @zapl80 5 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@rostislavsvoboda7013 the system is in place to prevent salty people from making new accounts to downvote. A downvote costs you a point to discourage it, it's meant to be a very strong indicator that something is wrong with a question. You can upvote the best answer for free so the community can see what a good answer is. It's not really a problem if there are answers that aren't entirely correct, that's often very subjective even, there just need to answers that are good. Reading other answers and usually comments under them explaining why it's not good gives you even more perspective, maybe you also thought about that solution

    • @xcoder1122
      @xcoder1122 5 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      The irony is: You always complain about people asking "stupid questions", but whenever I ask a really compelling question, I get ZERO replies. I might get upvotes for the questions and some "me too" comments, but no answers at all. So apparently most users there are not even able to answer really challenging questions, but they keep complaining about simple questions being too easy.

  • @stevecarter8810
    @stevecarter8810 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +95

    The reputation system works against people who generally stfu but have expertise in a few topics.

    • @MartinMaat
      @MartinMaat 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +7

      If only everyone would stfu about things they lack expertise on... Sounds like utopia to me.

    • @mage3690
      @mage3690 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +6

      ​@@MartinMaatsociety if everyone STFU on things they weren't experts on frfr.

    • @alastairleith8612
      @alastairleith8612 10 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@mage3690that’s a bit of an overgeneralisation. it’s only through social diffusion that understanding of important issues gets established. it’s the bad actors that are the issue.

    • @mallninja9805
      @mallninja9805 6 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      Upvote systems are a really terrible proxy for quality.

    • @MartinMaat
      @MartinMaat 6 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@mallninja9805 Is there a better one?

  • @stephenhauck
    @stephenhauck 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +102

    StackOverflow lost me when the moderators started power tripping … no thanks …

    • @toonkrijthe7565
      @toonkrijthe7565 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Not all of them, but there where some. And now it's a large commercial company.

    • @CodingAbroad
      @CodingAbroad 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +5

      Absolutely agree. One Admin closed a question I wrote that was helping lots of people with lots of upvotes. Eventually this Admin got so much abuse from other commenters saying it should have stayed open he gave up and made the question open

    • @ABehrooz
      @ABehrooz 7 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@toonkrijthe7565 Not all of them? Right. Sure.
      For me it was All of them I encountered.

  • @JSDudeca
    @JSDudeca 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +14

    My favourite gripe is the inability to change the “correct” answer. Often the answer is ambiguous or wrong and it often stays as “correct”

    • @jcoffin01
      @jcoffin01 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +11

      The check mark is selected by the person who posted the question. The very same person who didn't know an answer at all half an hour ago is the one who's now supposed to select which of N answers is the best. Not to sound elitist, but the results aren't always great.

    • @JSDudeca
      @JSDudeca 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@jcoffin01 Or even worse, you get totally unhelpful answers like `WinSCP Installation Issue` on AskUbuntu (same engine as SO). The answer is both wrong and unhelpful and yet cannot be changed.

    • @xcoder1122
      @xcoder1122 5 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@jcoffin01 To the questioner, any answer that works is an acceptable answer. If you want to find out what really is the best answer, that's what the voting system is for. The seal just says "I tried it and can confirm that this answer worked and solved my problem".

  • @mina86
    @mina86 8 วันที่ผ่านมา +8

    A few years ago I saw a question on SO about piece of Linux interface that I’ve written. I’ve created an account just to answer it. As an author of the interface I could provide all the necessary details. My efforts were rewarded by being downvoted by people who had no idea what they were talking about. I’ve closed my account soon after and never been tempted to contribute to SO ever again.

    • @xcoder1122
      @xcoder1122 5 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      This is another common problem with SO. As someone who has been using a development system for maybe two decades, you have to be taught by newbies who have only known the system for 6 months and think they already know everything better, but their answers are so full of mistakes that it's not worth trying to correct them because you don't even know where to start.

  • @mind_of_a_darkhorse
    @mind_of_a_darkhorse 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +57

    There is nothing more discouraging than asking a question and being made to feel like an idiot by someone you hoped could help you out! This is one of the major problems with SO. This is why it is used as a last resort. I even went so far as to avoid asking questions and would just try to do searches for similar questions with hopefully accurate answers.

    • @IARRCSim
      @IARRCSim 14 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Searching for similar questions is good for everyone including you. If you post anywhere, stackoverflow or any other site, without doing your own research for at least a few minutes, then what? Wait for days for someone else to answer your question without even knowing if it was already asked and answered elsewhere? That would be far slower at getting your question's answer than if you find your answer on an existing question. What I find discouraging is that people are marking questions as duplicates when they're not duplicates and just have some vague similarity. Another thing is I had one of my good answers downvoted by the asker simply because the question was asked 4 years earlier. My answer would be good for everyone with a similar problem and that's the majority of people who benefit from finding answers on stackoverflow. I generally don't care about gamification but the fact that seemed so backwards and opposite of grateful just put me off the site completely. Marking almost every new question as a duplicate without looking at how different it is from the question it supposedly duplicates was one big point against it. Feeling punished for contributing was the last straw.
      I contribute to quora instead if I feel like helping people now. It has a lot more questions that are essentially duplicates but that's better than the stackoverflow problems.

    • @PSHomeVideo
      @PSHomeVideo 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +15

      Funny. You SHUOLD first search for answers, and only then ask new question. Do you think all these clever people like to answer the same questions of lazy guys over and over again???

    • @mind_of_a_darkhorse
      @mind_of_a_darkhorse 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@PSHomeVideo At no point do they force anyone to answer anything! Being a jackass is just unacceptable although it is commonplace nowadays! Also, use spellcheck before posting! Grammarly is pretty good and it is free!

    • @StefanReich
      @StefanReich 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +6

      @@PSHomeVideo Are you one of those horror mods? You sound like them :D

    • @talaniel
      @talaniel 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +8

      @@StefanReich Yeah, it sounds like what the mods would say, but basically, it is correct - search first, ask after that :-)

  • @mattfromeurope
    @mattfromeurope 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +16

    Consistently going against the core userbase's interests has killed quite a few platforms over the years. And it will kill StackExchange, if they continue going this way.

    • @dissident1337
      @dissident1337 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

      I hope it does, SX deserves it.

    • @benj1008
      @benj1008 6 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Same for Reddit, probably.

  • @dronicx7974
    @dronicx7974 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +17

    Unfortunately, all of these problems have been apparent for years, as shown in the video, and they still haven't invested anything into solving them, so I don't see them solving their actual issues. Instead, they've invested all their time into growth tactics that make no sense because these tactics are only growth tactics, not stuff that has to do with the user's experience and what they perceive as valuable. Gamifying the experience is only a growth tactic when it doesn't improve anything and it's just there for user retention. This is a huge reason as to why most gacha games don't last more than 2 years. Gacha games are literally developed with user retention in their core and that's why they all shutdown so fast as they have no base to expand on for the unachievable user retention rates these companies aim for based on no true unbiased data and stats

  • @randy918
    @randy918 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +41

    I used to use SO all the time, but would never dare ask a new question. Now I’m using Gemini Advanced, and I love the writing tone of the good information (and code).

    • @CodingAbroad
      @CodingAbroad 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Gemini is so good compared to ChatGPT

  • @bradchellingworth5973
    @bradchellingworth5973 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +42

    Another issue i have noticed recently with SO is people editing your question purely for a bit of rep, like they will edit it in such a way that it doesn't improve the question in any way, they just found a way to re-word it so they can say they edited it, or they edit it so much it actually changes the question. I had this recently and when i reversed the edit, i suddenly got a downvote (I'm assuming from the user that edited my question, he then edited it again, which i again reversed, then i got an email from a mod saying Im not allowed to undo edits, despite this mods edits making no sense. So after 30 mins fighting a mod I deleted the question. I have used the site for 10+ years and have circa 10k rep, Im not a new user I know how the site works, its just frustrating when people try to just piggy back on your question to get some rep for doing nothing of value.

    • @Kessra
      @Kessra 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +6

      I think there is a daily/weekly cap on edit-reputation. With not enough reputation that edit has to go through a peer review anyway and with enough rep there are other ways to "earn" more rep quicker. Worst I've seen was a user that probably had like 40 accounts which he used to upvote his posts he wrote. Problem was, he posted his message and a few seconds later he had all those 40 upvotes when all the other answers just had like 1 or 2 at max and were posted significantly before that user's post and even contained more information on the topic at hand. A mod was then taking action and deleted that answer and probably gave that user (and his accounts) a bit time to think if not even straight out banned.
      I still don't get it that people think that high-rep is really needed or makes you a better "programmer". I also "only" have 12-13k but that does not mean that someone with 100k knows much more than I do or that I know more than someone with 1k rep. I just spend my time on other stuff or answer at niche-topics rather than those basic API/framework questions that quickly gain 100s of votes within a couple of days. I was once invited to a job interview because that company looked for StackOverflow "experts" with I guess 7.5k+ rep and a history to answer certain tags. During that interview their CTO was a bit frustrated because he had like 10-15 50k+ StackOverflow users before that couldn't program a line of code without frequenting SO or Google and that in an area where they even had gold and silver badges.

    • @MrAlanCristhian
      @MrAlanCristhian 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

      It happened to me. They totaly changed the meaning of the question.

    • @HappyCheeryChap
      @HappyCheeryChap 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

      Yeah pretty much every edit I've got made the content worse and more vague. Often with broken Engrish.

    • @agentxyz
      @agentxyz 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@Kessra you sir are a master craftsman of code. Thank you for your service

    • @zapl80
      @zapl80 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

      There's sometimes a valid reason to reword and even change meaning of the question a bit and that is to make it broader or generic. It's not your question anyways, it's meant to be an example so other people with the same question can benefit from the same answer. People's questions are often very specific to their problem but the problem they have often isn't. Misunderstanding questions or just people hunting for rep is a big problem though

  • @bernardmueller5676
    @bernardmueller5676 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +59

    It's always the same. You are new, ask a question, and most people only say: RTFM. Very encouraging.

    • @kaqqao
      @kaqqao 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +5

      Because you should RTFM

    • @talaniel
      @talaniel 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

      @@kaqqao Some manuals are damn hard to read and are incomprehensible or with insufficient information :-)

    • @jcoffin01
      @jcoffin01 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      In fairness, lots of questions on SO really are pretty terrible. An immense number are something like: "I tried to write some code to parse a data file, but it's not working. Can somebody please tell me what's wrong?" And that's it. They haven't shown the code that's failing. They haven't shown what data they're trying to parse. They haven't said anything about what they actually want.
      As much as I (among others) hate to make somebody feel badly, as it stands the question is completely unanswerable. Yes, comments should be polite, and preferably tell the user what they need to add to improve the question. But some programmers (including many who are very good technically) aren't so great on personal communications.

    • @JeffCaplan313
      @JeffCaplan313 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Yea, but did you RTFM?

    • @mallninja9805
      @mallninja9805 6 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      @@kaqqao Never mind the fact that the manual either only provides very high-level information & doesn't help with your specific application, OR it's so dense that the specifics are scattered throughout 900 pages of crap & it will take you a year to piece them all together...

  • @a.m.4154
    @a.m.4154 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +11

    You can see their past comments. Go to activity, then filter it to "All Actions".

  • @noam65
    @noam65 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +9

    Let me get this straight. Quality answers were developed by highly a knowledgeable group, who left because corporate didn't value their expertise and mistreated them, thereby driving them out, only to be replaced by AI. Now, AI works by reading older expert data and spitting out new answers, but the older data is aging out, and nobody wants to waste their time taking a trip down the time wasting rabbit hole, but corporate decided to double down on AI, which cannot actually develop new accurate and correct answers by itself for the foreseeable future...
    Yes, I think I see the flaw in corporate's plan.

    • @pauligrossinoz
      @pauligrossinoz 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      You pretty much nailed it!
      And for emphasis, I'll add this:
      The so-called "Artificial Intelligence" of ChatGPT (and its ilk) isn't the least bit intelligent at all. It's merely rehashing data that has been scraped from the Internet, with an extra dash of obfuscation/paraphrasing to try to skirt copyright laws.

  • @sayo9394
    @sayo9394 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +24

    the negative scores for asking a question at 2:42 was so triggering! God I hated those negative scoring for stupid reasons!

    • @xcoder1122
      @xcoder1122 5 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Most of the time I don't even know the reason. I ask a question on SO, a decent question, well written, with code examples, links to documentation, as well as a detailed explanation of the issue I cannot solve and when I come back 24 hours, it has no answers, no comments, wasn't closed as duplicate but it got three downvotes. Half a year later it is still open, still unanswered, still has no comment but now it has 8 downvotes.

  • @CodingAbroad
    @CodingAbroad 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +5

    Absolutely agree. One Admin closed a question I wrote that was helping lots of people with lots of upvotes. Eventually this Admin got so much abuse from other commenters saying it should have stayed open he gave up and made the question open

  • @Robert-qw3lr
    @Robert-qw3lr 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +6

    It was sliding for years. AI just delivered the death blow

  • @RamonChiNangWong078
    @RamonChiNangWong078 11 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

    Hooray for chatGPT, since it can answer all my trout related love questions

  • @johannesvanschalkwyk304
    @johannesvanschalkwyk304 11 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

    Stack Overflow had it coming. If you have a shitty attitude towards your customers, you can't expect to stay in business. I would not ask a question if I was an expert. I don't mind researching a topic but sometimes you just need a pointer in the right direction, not a shit answer.

  • @algavone
    @algavone 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

    This is why developers need platform cooperatives.

  • @podell111
    @podell111 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

    I started calling them Snark Overflow🤡. Plus a lot of the arrogant star users give terrible long winded BAD answers.

  • @ilricettario
    @ilricettario 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

    Some people are just arseholes, and some of the arseholes have just been allowed to get away with it.

  • @AnnatarTheMaia
    @AnnatarTheMaia 11 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

    The paradox of "Stack Overflow" has always been that the answers are of low quality, even when they work, and it takes someone with deep insight and experience to recognize what the actual clean, high quality solution will be from that low quality answer. The industry's inside joke is "woe to you if you ended up on Stack Overflow looking for a solution!"

  • @test-rj2vl
    @test-rj2vl 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

    I hope AI will one day replace SO completely and they will bankrupt from the lack of traffic. I have had to ask few questions because AI didn't know and google didn't know either and it got downvoted without even explaining what was wrong so I have no way of asking the same thing better or edit the question. I would be happy to see AI getting to the point where I never need to visit SO.

  • @banatibor83
    @banatibor83 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +9

    Maybe the impolite and condescending answers a result of drop in quality of questions. When SO started it was a place for developers to share expertise. With getting more and more famous the community got diluted and high school kids or lazy college kids got onto SO and stared exploiting the very experienced developers.

    • @eng3d
      @eng3d 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

      Gamification ruined SO.
      Maybe some codemonkeys think they will get a better job by simply having a record of useless medals and points in SO.

    • @mikicerise6250
      @mikicerise6250 5 วันที่ผ่านมา

      SO has faced the fate of every social media platform. People are the problem. That is the unvarnished truth.

  • @emkay2
    @emkay2 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

    17:49 Machines can't exploit humans. Humans exploit humans.

  • @grahamashe9715
    @grahamashe9715 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

    One of the best things about AI is that it’s going to help a lot with NOT having to deal with poor teachers (as much).

    • @HaploBartow
      @HaploBartow 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      Yes, a 'teacher' that doesn't actually know whether what it's saying is correct is *exactly* what I want... /s

    • @clray123
      @clray123 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      @@HaploBartow Actually, possibly it is. The process of learning is about the student asking questions and independently finding answers, the teacher's role is to just guide them, perhaps by suggesting new questions to ask. If students learn more critical thinking because of all the contradictory bs current AI gives them, that's a net win for humanity.

  • @0x8badbeef
    @0x8badbeef 9 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

    The foundation of Stack Overflow is flawed. No one should have ever been given credit for their effort. It should have been given freely.

  • @MikkoRantalainen
    @MikkoRantalainen 3 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    16:00 I have been writing to SO quite a lot and before you can write *anything* to SO, you have to accept that all your content is licensed as CC BY-SA 4.0. This was the requirement way before any version of ChatGPT ever existed. So SO or nobody else had no reason to ask anybody for a permission before using all the data as AI training material.
    If you publish stuff to any social media site without bothering to read the license, don't claim that the company doesn't have right to do stuff that you *agreed on* in the EULA.
    And the attribution part of the CC license only applies to verbatim copying which falls under copyright law. If the AI simply explains the same idea, that would be covered by patents only, not by copyright. And CC license explicitly says "Patent and trademark rights are not licensed under this Public License."
    19:00 After you have licensed your content with a perpetual license agreement such as CC BY-SA, you cannot take it back. Even trying to do might be contract breach and therefore illegal.

  • @chriscantplay...2933
    @chriscantplay...2933 4 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Agree with all you say. I rarely use it but when I do it’s usually because I can’t remember the name of the PHP function I want. I search on a description of the function and the answers are always a page of code written, and upvoted, by people who don’t know the function exists.

  • @rhtcguru
    @rhtcguru 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +30

    If everyone moves to AI generated content which is based on original human content, how are the next generation of AI models going to learn new things if communuites like SO are destroyed by first generation AI? Likewise, where will developers go when they have new questions the AI can't answer and no human communities willing to share answers because they don't want to contribute to future AI models? Ugh...

    • @Guishan_Lingyou
      @Guishan_Lingyou 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +6

      I have been wondering this, in general, about LLM's.

    • @carultch
      @carultch 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +6

      Exactly. There in lies the problem with everyone depending on AI. It can only answer from what exists in its training data.

    • @bitmanagent67
      @bitmanagent67 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

      What did developers do before SO and GPT? They relied on each other or just figured it out like real developers. You all act like no one solved coding problems before the last 15 years or, hell, the last 15 months.

    • @ZenTechnologist
      @ZenTechnologist 14 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Wondering about this too

    • @edgeeffect
      @edgeeffect 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +7

      @@bitmanagent67 Before SO languages and, more importantly, libraries were a lot simpler (they had to be because available compute and RAM back then didn't have room for a lot of modern libraries and frameworks)... there was so much less you needed to know back then, it was much simpler for your friends and colleagues to support you.

  • @DataJuggler
    @DataJuggler 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

    I was barred from Stack Overflow for the crime of telling the person whose question I was answering, what opensource project of mine the answer came from. Stack Overflow charges advertisers $10,000 US per month minimum, and doesn't want you leaving their ad revenue to see an opensource project. I am glad AI has forced them to layoff staff.

    • @arugulatarsus
      @arugulatarsus 10 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      My comments were edited in SO to point to a close source competitor to the FOSS project I maintain. This was the community, not SO. But SO is getting what it deserves.
      How can you tell chatgpt answered instead of SO? it was polite.

    • @junkertom7766
      @junkertom7766 7 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@arugulatarsus ...but was it correct?

    • @arugulatarsus
      @arugulatarsus 7 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@junkertom7766 subjective. The question was how do I do X in Y, the answer was use tool Z instead. But they put it under my name. I deleted my account from that.

  • @Veretax
    @Veretax 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Stack Overflow actively blocking people from removing data could be a violation of gdpr laws

  • @test-rj2vl
    @test-rj2vl 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

    This great deletion makes me a bit worried. It makes me feel that I need to write myself a proxy for SO that would save every single question I see to my local computer so that I can read it years later if I need.

  • @JohnRouillard
    @JohnRouillard 5 วันที่ผ่านมา

    What is the little box with the stroked 0 you are wearing around your neck? A throat mic?

  • @paulwary
    @paulwary 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +5

    So many times Ive seen interesting questions which people obviously want to engage with, which are deleted as too general, opinion-based etc. I dont think it profits them to delete every such question. I tried to ask a question of my own, quite specific but a little complex to explain. (It was about an algorithm rather than a specific issue I was having). It was deleted almost immediately. I edited the question to improve the clarity, but it did no good. It was a complete waste of my time.

  • @BrandonOsborn404
    @BrandonOsborn404 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

    Stackoverflow has violated the Wheaton Law for years. I woul like to like it, but can't.

    • @pauligrossinoz
      @pauligrossinoz 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      I had to Google that. Hilarious!

    • @pauligrossinoz
      @pauligrossinoz 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Here in Australia we would state Wheaton 's Law as:
      Don't be a c ...

    • @pauligrossinoz
      @pauligrossinoz 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      ... unt

  • @robgreene3956
    @robgreene3956 6 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Once when I searched, found no answer, asked the question, I was told the question had been asked before but there was no reference to the previous question. Having already failed in the initial search, I still had no answer.
    Another time when I searched, found no answer, asked a question, I was the question had been asked before and there was a link to the previously asked question, but it didn't answer my question.
    But I still get upvotes on a couple of questions I answered years ago. Got one an upvote two months ago!
    These days, I might search Stack Overflow, but I'm more likely to use one of the AIs. They seem to be good at answering simple and weird questions like "what is the syntax of that c# thing where you can embed the variables in the string". (Having not used c# for 6 years, I forgot the syntax)

  • @jerryhall5709
    @jerryhall5709 11 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Stack Overflow usually leaves me with more questions than I had from the beginning. Easier to type a question in Copilot and get an answer.

  • @Tux0xFF
    @Tux0xFF 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

    I dont know why would i ever use that, S.O will be the internet archives of coding, also it was full of prima donas, their life purpose was to mark a question as possible duplicate

  • @krzysztofstrojek7175
    @krzysztofstrojek7175 วันที่ผ่านมา

    i know that there are chapters but i dont know where is the actual answer for the topic and/or conclusion

  • @ABehrooz
    @ABehrooz 7 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    As a dev with 20 years of experience writing low level framework and backend code I can tell You the elitist behavior and calling users stupid, locking questions and linking outdated answers is the reason I will only ever go to stackoverflow after exhausting like 2 pages of google results. probably visited it like only 10 times since 2016 because of this.

  • @privacyvalued4134
    @privacyvalued4134 8 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Don't forget that a ton of devs were let go from their jobs in this sector during the past couple of years. They aren't searching SO because they can't get a job in the sector anymore.

  • @Gabriel_Wangai
    @Gabriel_Wangai 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +6

    Is there an actual stack overflow alternative?

    • @HaploBartow
      @HaploBartow 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Expertsexchange or Codidact are two, plus Spiceworks sometimes but that's more an alternative to general computer use questions.

    • @TNH91
      @TNH91 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      No, just Reddit, it seems

  • @edgeeffect
    @edgeeffect 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +12

    What always gets me with the "did you Google it?" answers is the number of times I have a problem, I Google it and the results I get say "did you Google it?", "did you Google it?", "did you....." GAAAH!

    • @HaploBartow
      @HaploBartow 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Answers asking a question, and nothing more than "did you Google it?" Surely no such answer exists on SO. If you mean *comments* asking that, please do flag those for moderators to delete, as they're noise, unfriendly, and not needed on the site (and the SO community agrees w/ you that those comments don't belong). I rarely see such comments, personally.

    • @starball_tgz
      @starball_tgz 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

      related: meta.stackexchange.com/q/5280/997587 and meta.stackexchange.com/q/8724/997587

  • @zeppelinmexicano
    @zeppelinmexicano 11 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    They seem to often hate their customers. We're trying to get a job done, and we've spent hours researching it on their site and elsewhere and were unable to resolve the issue. That alone means they should STFU and leave us alone as we try to help eachother, but nooooooo, "I'm mister mod and I close your question, period."

  • @michaelmcnally1242
    @michaelmcnally1242 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +11

    A comment asking "Why do you want to do this?" can be asked nicely, and it's generally very much worthwhile. Many questions show up in the form of "X-Y" problems, where a person wants to do "X" and for whatever reasons conclude that they need to do "Y" in order to achieve "X". Finding the real motivation for an unusual question can be very helpful to the original questioner, because it can get them out of "the woods" in pursuit of a bad solution to their actual problem. Civility is sort-of a separate issue, and I agree that there could be more of it. I consider it to be a training ground for being nice to people.
    Another issue that permeates the Stack Overflow world is the phenomenon of people very very new to programming diving in and trying to do something far beyond their abilities. That's a problem that goes way beyond the website; there are really no good pedagogical patterns for new programmers to follow. They're told "learn to code" and that's about it. There's not a lot to be done about that, sadly, at least not from a Stack-like site.
    (Full disclosure: 400K+ reputation on SO)

    • @clray123
      @clray123 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      Being "nice to people" is not an obligation, and those who aren't nice usually do not expect reciprocal "niceness" either. It's a culture and experience thing. Either you want to spend effort on being nice and get back some the same currency, or you don't care. As it happens, and as a rule of thumb, people who are expert in any domain tend to care less about this wrapping than people who are noob. Possibly because their idea of "nice" aligns more with "interesting, intriguring, clever" rather than the shallow "dumb nice" that the broader society considers appropriate. This is not a surprise because by laws of large numbers the broader society is "average" (not leet).

    • @lionbraz
      @lionbraz 11 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@clray123 I think we were colleagues in my last company. Are you Joe M., that asshole without any friends that think was superior to everyone, besides everyone having an approximate wage?

  • @Merrifieldsam
    @Merrifieldsam 7 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

    Yup! These are all reasons why I refuse to ever participate. I've had a few very negative experiences on the platform so I only use it for reference. I never ask or talk to anyone because of this. Even the mods were pretty rude and unhelpful. I've even been redirected to answers that didn't actually answer my question...

  • @user-nu8in3ey8c
    @user-nu8in3ey8c 4 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Stack Overflow is not a way of life, it is just an online forum where people ask and answer questions. Firstly, most the time you ask a question you either get awful answers, rude answers, or it gets closed and redirected to an old post that does not adequately answer the question. I hate to say it, the AI will do a better job than their users have..... unfortunately for Stack Overflow I can access the same level of AI answers from my browser's search bar and as such won't need to visit their website at all to get better answers. It won't affect me at all, since I rarely use stack overflow anyway. AI is slowly taking over the internet.
    The internet for years has largely been a consolidated corporate world of bots and astroturfing. Very little creative or genuine content still exists. The Dead Internet Theory was only partially correct a decade ago or so, but it is getting more true by the minute.

  • @kamertonaudiophileplayer847
    @kamertonaudiophileplayer847 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +9

    Stackoverflow closes all my questions, but not because they duplicated, because it's hard to answer to them. Stackoverflow aren't interested in hard questions.

    • @jojje3000-1
      @jojje3000-1 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

      Agree, this makes SO questions difficulty level ”window” at not to hard and not to easy, which is odd and not productive for developers.

    • @codingwithdee
      @codingwithdee  13 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

      Interesting… they probably want questions that will be easy to rank on search? Easier to search, easier to appear on google -> more traffic?

    • @pedrofigueiredo9146
      @pedrofigueiredo9146 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

      I had the same problem... some years back i had a system for a client that generated code and while maintaining the system i was having problems generating a generic abstract controller... so i had to post a question on stack overflow and was down voted and received a lot of comments like: "just code the controller... why you want to generate it..." i was like: "dear lord i don't need to explain the product and the full story... f just be constructive"... a bit like this example post "i'm having a problem with this code for a text editor i'm writing" awsr: "why do you need to write a text editor?"

    • @jojje3000-1
      @jojje3000-1 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@codingwithdee Highly likely, but they could also harbour really difficult questions within their processes with some design. It suprises me a bit.

    • @jojje3000-1
      @jojje3000-1 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@pedrofigueiredo9146 😂😂⤵️

  • @user-nu8in3ey8c
    @user-nu8in3ey8c 4 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    I left one community and removed all the key words from the text and left word salad, another community that would not allow mass deletion I replaced the text with dots and white space. I have a feeling if users were clever about it they could edit these in such a way no one noticed until it was too late to fix it. Also wonderful channel, I subscribed after seeing your video on the Failure that is Agile.

  • @nickrazes2720
    @nickrazes2720 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

    I thought SO was annoying too after trying to post some questions in the past. Glad it's not just me. I basically only view it nowadays if google returns a link to it as a possible answer to my question.

  • @chaotic-voices-in-my-head
    @chaotic-voices-in-my-head 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +5

    I use it only in a passive way to look for answers. I understand that they need rules and they don´t want duplicates etc. But when I saw the harsh reactions I decided not to dare to ask any questions ever. And I don´t think I would ever be able to contribute there. They have so many highly experienced devs who can write better answers.

    • @clray123
      @clray123 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Huh? Just the risk of getting a rude answer causes you to shut up? I guess you are a perfect obedient citizen for any sort of dictatorship then...

    • @chaotic-voices-in-my-head
      @chaotic-voices-in-my-head 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

      Your answer doesn´t make any sense to me. I don´t speak about political participation and SO is not a political forum.

    • @clray123
      @clray123 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@chaotic-voices-in-my-head I'm referring to your general attitude expressed in the comment. To quote you, "not dare ask questions". My point is you should dare ask questions, in all contexts in life, no matter what.

    • @chaotic-voices-in-my-head
      @chaotic-voices-in-my-head 8 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      My point relates only to SO. I didn´t speak about a general context-unrelated attitude.

  • @markrosenthal9108
    @markrosenthal9108 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

    I've avoided Stack Overflow for years because it stinks of snark. There are much better places to go that are inhabited by people that want to help you.

  • @CamAustralia001
    @CamAustralia001 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

    Reading comments, one has to ask if what really happened to stackoverflow was the phenomena of "Trolls".
    Those who get a kick out of just angering people, mucking things up deliberately, being destructive, trashing things, as their only source of getting their sick jollies? Is it possible this was part of the overflow cultural change?
    (In addition to being bought by a commercial entity.)

  • @seaviasfo
    @seaviasfo 3 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    My first interaction with SO, was in 2013 I was in the first CS courses and had back then what might have seemed like stupid questions to experienced engineers but I was new to the field. I can't even remember what I asked but I was basically publicly berated and humiliated made to feel like an idiot for not having a masters level understanding of CS as a 1st year student. Even the feedback was moronic like the expectation was to essentially answer your own question and upload the answer ....
    This became the excepted culture on SO, and turned a lot of people away especially with the owners actually condoning the toxic culture. ChatGPT doesn't suffer from this fatal human flaw called EGO. I've always hated the SO platform it was everything thats wrong with the whole culture surrounding software engineering.

  • @imaginativename
    @imaginativename 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Pretty interesting, thanks for the insight. I'd noticed that SO doesn't show up as much in search results and even when it does the results don't seem as helpful as they used to.

  • @vdozsa77
    @vdozsa77 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

    Interesting. I remember a time when Stack Overflow outright banned anything AI related stuff from their website.

    • @eng3d
      @eng3d 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      and they still do that

    • @monicacellio7556
      @monicacellio7556 10 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Yes, that's another significant event that didn't make it into this video. SO originally banned answers written by AI, and the company was on board with that. Then the company *secretly* told moderators they weren't allowed to delete that stuff any more, but they wouldn't disclose their new policies publicly, putting moderators in a bind. That led to a nine-week moderation strike in the summer of 2023. The company eventually both disclosed and amended the policy to end the strike. (There were some other promises too, some greatly delayed. I've lost track of whether they have yet, almost a year later, done everything they promised the strikers.)

    • @xcoder1122
      @xcoder1122 5 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@eng3d Of course they still do, you cannot train an AI with data created by an AI. You need human answers to train the AI. If you feed AI answers into an AI, you create a feedback loop where the AI keeps confirming it's own nonsense and then you end up with increasingly more nonsense in the future.

  • @sealsharp
    @sealsharp 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +6

    Me: "How to X? Tried Y, it doesn't work any more."
    So:"closed, it's a duplicate of Y"

  • @privacyvalued4134
    @privacyvalued4134 8 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    SO locking questions is the worst. Especially if the answer is not immediately forthcoming but can be answered years later. I have accumulated enough points to actually be a moderator but I can't stand SO policies, so why would I inflict them on anyone else?

  • @dk6024
    @dk6024 11 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Did anyone think that they didn't open source their SO answers, implicitly?

  • @iainmcculloch5807
    @iainmcculloch5807 2 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Your analysis seems pretty-much spot-on. Just one very small point. If you want to see comments posted by an SO or SE user, just open their profile, click on 'Activity', and then select 'All Actions' on the left of the screen. You can now select comments (I think it's the 5th option on the list above the actions display).

  • @mwdiers
    @mwdiers 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    I bailed on Stack Overflow a long time ago. But ChatGPT and Claude completely killed it.

  • @joshkasap1349
    @joshkasap1349 7 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    The number of times I search for a question and find someone with the exact issue i have only to see they had their question shut down and pointed to and extremely old answer that was either
    - Not at all the same
    - Only partially relevant but not truly the same and was either mostly or entirely unhelpful
    - Worked but was obviously overly complex
    - Worked but had little to no explanation of how the code worked
    - Worked but had a far to technical explanation of how the code worked (AKA the explanation is only useful if you have a higher level of proficiency)

  • @yevhenkozlov286
    @yevhenkozlov286 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

    19:30 btw it was impossible to delete popular answers way ago before AI arrived. I know because I tried to replace my really up-voted but really outdated answer(was not marked as "a solution" btw) with most up-to-date and did not want to edit initial answer into something completely different. Makes sense, every answer and question can be direct-linked from the outside.

    • @Kessra
      @Kessra 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      You can't delete an accepted or upvoted answer. People would need to remove their votes before you can actually delete your post, which is also only possible when you edited your message before. And by deleting it is still on the platform but just not visible to others. With enough rep or with mod-priviledges you can see this deleted posts even years later. When you delete your account i.e. all posts you wrote will then show up your name as "Deleted User" or the like and will change your post to a community answer instead so that questions and answers don't get lost.
      I once produced and answer to a question that tackled the title of the question and a bit of its question context but this was not really what the OP was asking for. The question itself was a bit confusing and ambigious. He then modified his question and added some further tags and clarification which made my answer a bit invalid and thus negative votes came in over time and I couldn't remove that message as some have upvoted that post. A moderator just adviced me to either ignore that post or update it to fit the question again and then upvotes will come "naturally" over time.

    • @starball_tgz
      @starball_tgz 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      If it's your own answer post, just edit to prepend the more up-to-date answer content to the outdated content.

  • @tomasnovellino5980
    @tomasnovellino5980 วันที่ผ่านมา

    As an example, I noticed most Qs related to java-springboot are answered for versions before 3. There are very few new questions for version 3. Even when the question specifies the version, the answer does not work 😢
    And same has been happening with less and less content related to new technologies or approaches

  • @xcoder1122
    @xcoder1122 5 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    The reason people answer questions on SO in comments instead of posting actual answers also has to do with toxic behavior on the site. Comments can only be upvoted, not downvoted, so you can gain points by writing good comments, but you will never lose points just because someone doesn't like your answer or the fact that you answered a question or you personally. Answers, on the other hand, can be downvoted, and you will lose points when that happens, and quite often it's not because your answer is bad, but just because someone is trying to troll you, or people don't like the fact that you answered a question they don't think is worth answering. Yet comments don't even show up when you visit SO on your smartphone, as the mobil version of the page shows no comments at all!

  • @ian_b
    @ian_b 2 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Being patient is a skill. Consider in the workplace if you often have to train up new people. Those new people are going to all be asking the same questions you've heard before from previous ones. Sometimes they may seem obvious to you, the skilled person. Maybe you think they should have been able to work it out for themselves, or that you pretty much told them already. But if you're impatient you will create immediate bad feeling in the trainee, and a sense of hostility. You will put them off asking again, then maybe they won't ask something for fear of your response, and screw up instead. So you really have to be patient, and kind, and make it clear that this is a "ask any question you have" environment. You must remember that the person asking this for the hundredth time is not the person who asked for the 99th time or the 98th or the 1st, and you probably asked this, or similar "obvious" things, when you were the trainee.
    People offering answers for free on the internet, who may be short tempered, in programming or other nerd skills, where they may well be neurodivergent, are probably not good at this. It's an inherent problem.

  • @tomar666
    @tomar666 11 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Awesome video content, and also cool stuff behind you :D Is that all Lego sets? I don't recall Lego having Concorde in their offer, but It's been a while since last time I've checked :P

  • @lucsteffens
    @lucsteffens 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Chatgpt has been replacing and my goto for questions. I think Stackoverflow forgot their vision and got pased by technology. The lack of innovation and vision lead to their decline in the past years. Like you mentioned, AI was just the technology bump that overthrow the company due to lack of direction and entity.
    My expectation is that they will slowly fade away in the history of the internet as they got technologically overthrown. The current decisions they have been taken trying to 'save' rather then to innovate are exposing a true mismanaged company which eroded his valies for growing profit.

  • @WAThomasRKH
    @WAThomasRKH 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

    What about those models behind? Are you also a model maker? They look nice.

  • @kenito2050
    @kenito2050 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +8

    I am fine with SO replacing their commentators with AI. The last thing any new programmer wants when they have a difficult programming problem is rude abusive comments from trolls. I stopped posting questions on SO years ago because of this. So, no, I am not saddened that SO is falling. 😐

    • @ArturdeSousaRocha
      @ArturdeSousaRocha 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      Until AI learns to be an asshole, too.

    • @zeeksthegoblin7564
      @zeeksthegoblin7564 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      AI is not always correct which is a problem. SO gives you multiple solutions and sometimes a combo of those solves your issue. It also adds in creative thinking which AI can't do because it doesn't think at all. I'd rather take a bit of abuse over wasting hours with AI and not realizing the bastard is wrong.

  • @luisgentil
    @luisgentil 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +7

    AI isn't 100% reliable. But if you test the AI's answer and it doesn't work, ask again. If you ask for solutions to small tasks or just show it your error message with a little bit of context, it gives you a solution that works 90% of the time. Learning to program was an absolute pain before AI chatbots. I dropped out of CS many years ago, one of the reasons was I showed my code to the professor and asked for help, he suggested I went to the library and read a book on Java.

  • @norlesh
    @norlesh 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

    Lets be honest though, eventually you would post your question and it would get closed because it was to similar to something that was answered with 10 year old solutions.- it's a dead horse, so the owners are getting what they can for it at the glue factory.

  • @TheEVEInspiration
    @TheEVEInspiration 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    *Key are the aging answers*
    Putting AI on top of it will do nothing to address the core issue.
    They need to archive old information and under certain conditions put it back to the front.
    The site simply needs to feel new and fresh again (information wise).

  • @flybywire5866
    @flybywire5866 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +5

    It has become a normal everywhere to get admonished, belittled and insulted for asking a question by people who have forgotten where they came from, and how much help they got when they were beginners. The cow has forgotten is has been a calf.
    IT is always developing, you need updated answers. If Stack Overflow bans their best contributors, they will notice that an AI needs to be fed, because it is anything but intelligent..

    • @mallninja9805
      @mallninja9805 6 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      It's turned into just another social media platform, where chasing clout is more important than being helpful.

    • @zapl80
      @zapl80 5 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@flybywire5866 most people with high rep on SO are in their 40s or older, they didn't even have the Internet. They didn't get anywhere near the level of help you can get today from online courses

  • @TimBell87
    @TimBell87 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    I'm pretty sure Stack Overflow stopped caring about developers in September 2008 when they chose to launch with terms of use actively toxic towards anyone seeking to learn anything

  • @JojOatXGME
    @JojOatXGME 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    I don't see the big problem with giving the content to OpenAI. The content is publicly hosted on Stack Overflow. Realistically, OpenAI is taking this content regardless of whether Stack Exchange would have signed the agreement. OpenAI would just have to put a tiny bit more work into scraping the content, and Stack Exchange would have less control on how it is used. While I can see why someone may not like how OpenAI and other AI companies take all the data, I don't think that Stack Overflow made it worse by going into such partnership.

  • @fireh3211
    @fireh3211 5 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    GenAI is replacing stackoverflow and there is nothing they can do about it.

  • @undeadpresident
    @undeadpresident 10 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    I've never used any AI stuff to help me. I go to stack overflow often though. And yep I find that the answers often are not what I'm looking for and are outdated. But I still often find useful info and solutions.
    What really bothers me though is when documentation is hard to decipher. I've wasted a lot of time, many times, due to poor explanations. Then hours or days later I finally figure out how it works and it's like "why the hell couldn't they just say that?"
    Like, if the people writing the documentation just put a few more minutes of effort to be clear, it would save me hours or days. Multiply that times how many other people have to go through the same shit and we could be talking years of time saved.

  • @hardboiled7467
    @hardboiled7467 ชั่วโมงที่ผ่านมา +1

    Thank god for chatGPT, answering the most basic questions without humiliating you and answering the most advanced question without you needing to stroke its ego😂

  • @itr00ow93
    @itr00ow93 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +7

    What's better than one Dee? Two Dee's :3

  • @ian_b
    @ian_b 2 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Working in an area I'd not been in before- writing an instrument plugin in the Steinberg VST2 stylee with its poorly documented API, I found ChatGPT invaluable, it acted like an eternally patient tutor. Sometimes its answers were wrong but I could find that out very rapidly rather than the very slow human response time of a website like Stack Overflow, and it never called me an annoying idiot.

  • @juleswinnfield9931
    @juleswinnfield9931 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

    I haven't used Stack Overflow in about 2 years. If you haven't moved onto GPT etc., you're falling behind. GPT is far more powerful, and my delivery speed has increased 10x.

    • @eng3d
      @eng3d 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

      and it won't complain if you question a trivial answer

    • @juleswinnfield9931
      @juleswinnfield9931 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      @@eng3d or complain if it's a question that's been asked before. I often land up asking GPT the same question multiple times to mould it to what I'm looking for.
      If I say thanks, it even replies pleasantly. No developer bloated self importance ego present 😆

  • @aberba
    @aberba 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    The answers there are definitely high quality and less repetitive as a result so I don't mind.

  • @jojje3000-1
    @jojje3000-1 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

    SO has become the basis on which many developers base their daily professional coding, nicknamed Cargo Cult Coding. Without the helpful SO experts sample code snippets, this will be impossible.
    Ourcome is hard to predict, but a growing shortage of developers are one scenario.

    • @clray123
      @clray123 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      But SO is not going away, it is just getting stolen and rebranded as an AI offering by Microsoft.

    • @jojje3000-1
      @jojje3000-1 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@clray123 But the helpful SO experts are going away.

    • @clray123
      @clray123 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@jojje3000-1 Not really, they are just going to start demanding pay for being helpful experts, as was the case before SO arrived and fooled people into free labor in exchange for good feels and dubious "fame".

  • @apocsi
    @apocsi 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

    When I read Yanis Varoufakis' Techno-Feudalism I had a general feeling that he was right. But none of the examples I could think of at the time were really dreading. This example is. I think this is exactly what Yanis was thinking of when writing Techno-feudalism.

  • @Fd4Raf
    @Fd4Raf 2 วันที่ผ่านมา

    The examples that you give in the "There were cracks in the walls before AI", is exactly my experience with StackOverflow as well. I tried to get in a few years ago, I was completely new to the platform, but I asked a few questions, and most of all, I tried to answer some of the questions that I felt I had valid answers for. Every single time, I was discarded, and almost insulted, by a veteran member. They were so rude and obnoxious, it really pushed me away very quickly. After not even one week, I gave up. I never went back since.
    (By the way, pretty much the same experience that I had when I tried reddit, to me all these "old communities"' are quite toxic, so now I just don't really participate in anything online anymore, besides a few comments here and there, and sometimes a discord, but that's it)

  • @TheBeforePhoto
    @TheBeforePhoto 12 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

    AI may be wrong sometimes but it doesn't scold you for asking a question that someone else has asked.

  • @ronaldv.7931
    @ronaldv.7931 3 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Yesterday I posted a very specific question on Stack Overflow and it was soon closed as duplicate, and linked to a very general question I was supposed to have found and read first. But this was not the part that bothered me most, but the mocking comment of a user, and the fact that his comment was the most upvoted. I closed my account! I don't want to be part of a community like that. There's so many other sources of information like blog posts, videos and documentation that I'm probably not going to miss it!

  • @josephmendoza5660
    @josephmendoza5660 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Even as someone that wants to answer questions it sucks because either the question is way above my skill level, or it is closed so it's hard to build reputation

  • @RMDetho
    @RMDetho 13 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

    This is completely backwards.. SO could've used AI to go through the question/answers/comments to generate a metamap of the site and then used that knowledge to redirect users to (actually) related/duplicate issues where people post(ed) answers.. but no, instead it's still people that are locking the threads, and it's AI that's responding..

    • @RMDetho
      @RMDetho 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

      however, to play the devil's advocate, people are growing increasingly more impatient, lazy and uninterested. Especially younger generations that don't care about where the info is coming from as long as it "there in a second" (because, essentially, despite being incredibly crap for programming) that's what chatGPT does.