SACRED SYMPTOMS: How the Numinous Heals
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 23 พ.ย. 2024
- Jung states “the main interest of my work is not concerned with the treatment of neurosis but rather with the approach to the numinous…the real therapy. In as much as you attain to the numinous experiences you are released from the curse of pathology.” Jung defines numinous as “a dynamic agency or effect not caused by an arbitrary act of will” that conveys a mysterious yet deeply meaningful message. Numinous experiences happen to us, yet we can approach the numinous by engaging in practices like active imagination, recording dreams, or religious and esoteric modalities. Wisdom traditions-and Jung-have marked the trails. Life crisis and trauma can also open us to the numinous: fairy tales, myths, and religious texts relate happenings of help when all seemed lost. Whether sought or suffered, something greater appears when ego yields. We can act on the guidance that is given, and may attain the healing gifted by experience of the numinous.
HERE'S THE DREAM WE ANALYZE:
"I have a joined a circle of men and women studying something psychological. I watch and wait for their leader to welcome me but he wanders off. It is part of a festival and people are lying around sexually pleasuring each other. I explore downstairs but when I come back the workshop members have put on costumes of gods and goddesses (the theme is Celtic, Nordic) They are coming to a gate at the centre of the ritual and I am in the way. Suddenly, a door opens and I'm pulled out of the way. It is the workshop leader and he takes me to a workbench. I can't remember his name but his book is on the bench. He is called Loki. Suddenly, the screw falls out of my glasses frame and lens falls out. I look on the floor but it is made of sand and there are lots of screws which are too big. After a long search, with no success, I discover something thin and fine in my mouth. I take it out. It is part of my glasses. There is more in my mouth. It is a sliver of the lens and rather than being plastic it is made of glass. I must get it out of my mouth or I will swallow and cut my own throat."
REFERENCES:
William James. The Varieties of Religious Experience: A Study in Human Nature. a.co/d/5mvRUNJ
C.S. Lewis. The Problem of Pain. a.co/d/dFxdbQa
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“We don’t so much solve our problems as we outgrow them. We add capacities and experiences that eventually make us bigger than the problems.”
- C.G. Jung
I was so struck by the example of the pregnant woman who was not comforted by rational arguments about how unlikely it was for the feared event to occur. I had twins randomly right before the COVID-19 pandemic started and had multiple rare pregnancy complications. Since then I find myself completely uncomforted by the idea that something is rare or unlikely. Once you’ve lived something very few people ever experience (and unexpected multiple pregnancy complicated by rare health issues followed by caring for two premature infants during a global pandemic) you are no longer soothed by statistics because you know you could be the one in a thousand again.
When you think about it, that woman’s thinking was entirely rational… direct experience of the most unlikely… what a humbling experience for Lisa and any therapist
My father who is spiritist, talked to me yesterday about this hidden world wich one way to get acces too is doing profound meditation. Now Joseph is talking about this experience wich my dad was talking about.
I thinks this is what you guys call "synchronicity". Theres more pointers in my life that indicates that this is, indeed, one.
I just wonder, what does this inner intelligence, what does God want from me?
Really looking forward to what is ahead in my life!
Really grateful you guys made this episode!
2:45 the numinous is the cure
3:50 Jung's quote on his own work.
6:00 AA (12 steps) numinosity
7:55 CS Lewis the numinous
10:00 OCD [("life doesn't like me, doesn't want me here")]
12:30 the reality of the nature of existence
29:15 an extraordinary story, from Joseph Lee
The distinction between "manipulating neurologic states" and genuine transformation is, I think, subtle and not recognized among certain schools of meditation. Thanks for articulating that!
I had a direct revelation from my unconscious. It was a Jesus figure that told me I was loved.
This vision changed my life continues to support me. I’m grateful 😇
I wish I had such an experience.
@@karate4348 I once had a "real" flash in a dream, beautiful man who saw me and said to not b afraid, my "life" has not changed but it is a first step. stay open.
The first few Numinous encounters are experienced as dread,. Once the deeply held fear and dread coming up from the unconscious is faced head on, purged ,and integrated, the dark side of the Imago Dei is transformed. It gets dis-burdened of its long held standiing negative charge of repression. Then all subsequent spiritual experiences take on a wonderful blissful character. The hot solar aspect is the most intense. But then the luna aspect emerges almost immediately to balance the solar aspect. When these two opposites are integrated, the affective background of consciousness is constant pure bliss and supreme clarity of consciousness. Peace.
This comment is amazing!
Wisdom ☯️
I like this! Thank you. ✨🔥🖤🌠🙏💛✨
I can’t love this episode enough. Thank you for your work.
yes
Yes - we love Jung and thank you for bringing him to us.
I can't help but think of the work that a neuroscientist named Dr.Joe Dispenza does with people through meditation and healing and the many MANY experiences that people describe of healing, very much like the story Joseph described about his own healing in this episode. He teaches people how to overcome their ego, or conscious blocks through meditation and they experience healings of all kinds through source (numinous)
Beautiful story Joseph, thank you for sharing!
Wonderful 🌼 however I want to adress the fact that Dr. Joe Dizpensa is not a medical doctor nor a neuroscientist. He is a chiropractor. May very well be good at other areas, but is not a neuroscientist 🙂
Thank you, this really resonates, a few lights went on! Very enjoyable.
Just curious if anyone can explain what is meant by the sensate realm. This is mentioned during the dream interpretation segment where it is said that the dreamer may have been spending too much time in the realms of the mind and of pleasure and not enough time in the sensate realm.
My initial thought is that the sensate realm is awareness of the body and therefore a window into an older precondcious knowledge contained in the body. I'm not certain whether this us the case.
Regardless, my question is this: What is meant by the sensate realm and how does apply to the approach/attainment to the numinous?
❤ thank you again for this lovely theme, I say lovely, but actually, it is profound and shaking sometimes….
The numinous asks for us to come out of our own way, or at least so it has been in my life, especially as sometimes we have kind of crystallized too much and have lost our softness and flexibility, qualities that maybe would allow us to grow, live or evolve with more ease and grace …. It calls for humility…. Surrendering on some levels….. I’ve had persistent and mysterious pains going away from one moment to another almost like my magic as something in me gave…. As I surrendered to my fragile existence and state….. surrendered to the ‘more’…..
Thank you your experiences are known to me and my heart is overjoyed at the gentle reminder how close numinous is.
There are stories of children lost in forests who report getting help from bears, big dogs, or other creatures. There is a recent story of rescuers seeing a large dog leaving the scene as a child is found.
Things are happening backwards again! What is that?! Anyone else having this?
Maybe I'm just catching up? I don't know. I've been working my !@# off, on my own since the only one of many Psychiatrists, SW, MH, Nursing, clinical psychology. They've all had a shot. I've honestly? Tried to connect. That was 21 yrs. ago. Wo. What a freakin ride!
I am really curious about your perspectives on what numinous can look like for an atheists - one that keeps an open mind towards spirituality, particularly through our connection to nature.
Took a break from listening to the Golden Three. Feeling clearer, happy to be back. And the title gripped me for some reason. 💚
I truly believe in serendipity - this of all episodes had to be the one I came back to. Thank you 🙏
God bless Jung and Rowland Hazard them + Wilson = My cure
In the opposite order!?
Bless them, always sending gratitude to those who carried the gold to us all 🎉❤🎉
My own attainment of that has not sat well with others. Beware ones expectations in regards to them .
If bogged down by this weight , refresh the numinous ; it will be somehow different each time but one "knows" when its encountered. Bearing no tradition in these matters ,I can see how such could help with that.
Great conversation!
Thank you!
I want to ask Joseph about the MRI and Dr's saying there wad trauma but never told him what the trauma was?
Probably the forced stretching, I would assume.
You guys are awesome
Thanks
Thank you so much for your contribution!!
❤️
I wish I could have some profound positive healing supernatural or numinous experience.
I'm in no way a therapist or professional, just someone who's bumped up a few such experiences and done a lot of reading. But if I can help you find such experiences too I'd love to chat.
@@pastverb1 Thank you
I only really have youtube, but Im happy to chat here.
Do you know what you're inwardly wrestling with? I remember going through my major depressive episodes (weeks sitting on the couch hopelessly knowing the universe had no point) and having no idea what weighed on me holding me down there.
@@pastverb1 No, I dont think I do. Except, perhaps, that Im in a bad life circumstance at the moment.
That's the hardest in some ways. I'm sorry. Is it personal or interpersonal?
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