The obviously best game in the lot, the best game on the console, a game that still kicks the shit out of most games that come out today, a game that is fascinating, deep, profound, and beautiful, was voted into the losers' bracket in its first round based on a cacophony of erroneous and nonsensical criticisms and only narrowly edged out Super Smash Bros. 64, of all things, in the minds of the panel. His annoyance is pretty legitimate.
Voidaken Are you implying that Majora’s Mask doesn’t deserve being deepthroated...?? The game truly is timeless, I’ve been begging for a Majora’s Mask based sequel in my heart since the first time I fully completed it, but I know it shouldn’t get one, I just want to experience something so emotionally mature and atmospherically enveloping for the first time all over again. I get that it’s a very controversial, game but I think that objectively it can’t be argued that it isn’t a god damn masterpiece. It’s more unique than most games, it has more heart (52 pieces to be exact) than any other game I’ve come across, and it captured my interest in a way that no game has ever been able to do except for Dark Souls.
100% in the same boat as Austin on this one. I don't find myself 100%ing very many games, but Majora's Mask is one that I just HAVE to every time I play it. The incentive for it is so strong, and the payoff is so worth it. Not just in what you get, but because of the love and care put into every quest you get to be part of in order to get there.
This is precisely why I think Majora’s Mask is indisputably the best Zelda game. It does way too many things right for the other Zelda games to even hold up.
is not about the same engine, u see a lot of companies using unreal engine, but u don't see them using the same fucking characters, they barely created new characters an only reuse the old models. tou majora's mask is a better game, it has a fantastic story and the sense of adventure
I very much ejoy the discussions in this series, but what they mean by "the best N64 game" is still a bit fuzzy and seems to change depending on the game 😅
OsricRexor this isn't about which is the best N64 game, this is the loser bracket, so rules aren't the same I guess. See it as between all of those games, whichever one is the most enjoyable.
I agree, there’s a lot of inconsistency in the series. I enjoy it, but sometimes it’s “what’s the best game?” “What’s the best N64 game?” “If we sat and had to play a game right now which would it be?”. The definition changes constantly
It means multiple things; - Which was influence towards Nintendo - Did the fans like it - Did it fit with the N64 era But it changes from that to that within seconds
I still remember looking up into the sky in MM, trying to see if the moon was actually getting bigger, and being pretty unsettled when I realized it was. That was some scary crap. Oh well, at least pretty soon here we'll get to see it happen super fast! And for no reason!
If you build something out of Lego, take it apart, and build something new out of the exact same parts, that's *reuse.* Not a *rehash.* *JUST LIKE MAJORA'S MASK.* A rehash is OVERUSING THE SAME ARGUMENT IN IRRELEVANT SITUATIONS, *_JARED._* _...I'm sorry for getting heated._
That's not a good analogy. You'd be referring to polygons (Legos) for an apples to apples. But you're not. This is like building cars out of Legos, making a movie based on them, then writing a new script for a new game, and making a whole new movie with the exact same cars
Couldn't have worded it better if i had a week. Jesus Jared, i love you but you've been stuck with the same argument since 3 episodes ago and YOU'RE WRONG. Damn
Majora's mask, easily. Smash 64 is a classic, but it's pretty broken and not super well polished. Majora's mask is an amazing game that still holds up today.
Egg Benedict A huge point is that you can still go back to the original version of Majora's Mask and still have an amazing time. There is absolutely no reason to go back to Smash 64 other than nostalgia
hmm, nothing against Majora's mask cause I think it should've won back in the winners bracket but have you seen a speed run of it? It's almost more broken then, if not as broken as Ocarina of Time and that's saying something.
With such dissimilar games I think you have to judge each one based on how well they accomplished what they set out to do, so is Majora's Mask a better action-adventure game than Smash Bros. is a multi-player party fighting game. I'm voting for Majora.
They get into all the arguments about what truly makes MM a fantastic game against Smash, I wonder what the outcome would have been versus OoT if they got this deep in haha
OoT isn't bad but today... it's kind of underwhelming. Yeah it's good but I have more games I have more fun with, doesn't help I really born when OoT was still a new thing so the big major twist of Sheik being Zelda wasn't that mind blowing. As for the gameplay it's... eh I didn't really find it as great as other games in the series like WindWaker or Botw
Right about now, it's time to rock with the biggity Buck Bumble Right about now, it's time to rock with the biggity Buck Bumble Bump to the bump to the bump to the bass bump to the bump to the Bumble Bump to the bump to the bump to the bass bump to the bump to the Bumble Bump to the bump to the bump to the bass bump to the bump to the Bumble Bump to the bump to the bump to the bass bump to the bump to the Bumble Bump to boop to the boop to the boop boop Bump to the base to the base base base base Bump to boop to the boop to the boop boop Bump to the base to the base base base base Badabadaba Badabadaba He say Badabadaba Badabadaba He say ma te ulla eh 'Ey!
Jirard started off the series saying that multiplayer is what makes a game better for the N64, but then in this, he started saying that the single player was the heart of the 64.
ya that annoyed me, especially considering if u compare N64 to its rival, the PS1, it was certainly the multiplayer console whereas PS1 was the single player console. One had 4 controller ports, and the other used disks for extra storage space, need i say more?
Chris Richfield Well I disagree completely. Single-player was instrumental to the N64 Console. I do agree that Jared keeps flopping left and right. But I fondly remember my time in Perfect Dark, DK64, OoT/MM, and Mario 64 as single-player experiences. Yes I also had fantastic and equally as memorable times playing Mario Party 2 with the rest of my family, but it’s too much of an oversimplification to say the N64 was the multiplayer to PS1’s single-player. I don’t agree with that paradigm at all.
TheVoraciousCatArmy all I'm saying is if the n64 is either one of those, I consider it more of a multiplayer console. Not saying it didn't have great single player games, just that hardware was better suited to multiplayer and I have far more memories of playing Smash Bros all night with friends than I do the Zelda games. I didn't really appreciate the single player games of the n64 until I played them much later on different hardware. As a kid I didn't have the patience to get into those stories, I just wanted to pummel my friends in smash. I love Zelda now but MM is the more stressful Zelda game, it's not really fun to me, there are satisfying moments but overall It just doesn't draw me in to play it.
Chris Richfield Funny because I was the exact opposite. I didn’t get hardcore into multiplayer Nintendo games until GameCube’s iteration of Double Dash (Still my favorite. That game was excellent) and Melee (Needs no introduction. It’s personally the pinnacle of competitive Smash) N64 was for me a more personal console. Majora’s Mask, while definitely more stressful, was also the deepest narrative of the 3D Zelda games and the best Single Player game on the N64 personally. The side quests and real, deep dive into characters was what impressed me when I played. Also the tone. Other Zelda’s, with potentially the exception of Twilight Princess, had drastically lighter tones. MM deals with depression, death, solitude, hatred, and desperation throughout the quests if you really are patient and just go slowly step by step. Also even though Perfect Dark was a spiritual successor to Golden Eye I only fought the bots in multiplayer funny enough. Lol. I don’t know. I personally took the N64 as a single player experience and the GameCube as a much clearer example of a multiplayer orientated console. Not saying your interpretation was wrong; I just had a very different experience.
You know, as much as people tote around about the reused assets in Majora's mask as a negative to the game, I find it funny how the ignore that about 80% of the game is still original content - this is including character models, enemy designs, boss designs, dungeon designs, over world layout, in some cases textures, and I could probably go on for a bit more but I think I made my point. People often forget about all of the original content in Majora's Mask and how it heavily outweighs the reused content from Ocarina of time, just... that's it, really.
And one of the previous video's arguments in favor of _Paper Mario_ could be applied to _Majora's Mask,_ what with seeing (some) familiar monsters now as people.
Majoras Mask had various minigames you didn't bring up, the Goron Race, the Deku Playground, the Floor wall maze, the Zora Target Shoot, the Zora time trial, Bomchu/Bomb/arrow Spinny game, two shooting games (three if you count the horseback one), Dog racing, all the other side quest minigames...
I feel the same as Jirard about games 100%. Very few games hit that mark, but they deliver. Games like BOTW, Majora, Portal (1&2), Doki Doki Literature Club, and a couple others really resonate with me, so I'm so glad he said that. I never really thought about it, but I've always felt a connection to certain games. BOTW, for it's world. Majora, for it's characters. Portal, for it's story. DDLC, for everything. Thanks for the great discussion!
Next time they do these best of comparisons, I think choosing one game per franchise would be good, to ensure more interesting titles are being considered rather than the obvious few. I love a lot of the games they've discussed over this series, but so many others are worth talking about; Worms Armaggedon, Rayman 2, F-Zero X, Shadowman, Jet Force Gemini. Donkey Kong 64 and Perfect Dark, to name but a few. Better yet, have the public vote in specific categories and they pit the top three voted against each other. Racing would have likely been Mario Kart, Diddy Kong and F-Zero. Adventure would have likely been Ocarina of Time, Paper Mario and Banjo-Kazooie. Shooting games would have likely been Goldeneye, Starfox 64 and either Turok 1 or 2. I think the format is wicked and the group discussion is very interesting but without categories, we're pitting essentially mini-game compilations against genuine arguments for videogames as art, which can only lead to one winner which is inherently pointless. Categories would help define the voting and would guarantee games of a similar ilk were being pitted against one another. I'll carry on watching and supporting the channel, this isn't like a resignation rage post, just a few suggestions for the next console wars you decide to produce and how to ensure no two games meet without a proper system in place. Given that eventually you'd come out of the categories, voting should be contested comparing things that all games share; presentation (boxart, advertising and the boot-up/file select), graphics, sound and replay factor. Comparing Starfox 64 and Ocarina of Time for example, Starfox would win for in presentation, lose but not by much in graphics, win in sound and in replay factor, exploring all the different routes you can take, all the secrets you missed in your first dozen or so runs. Tally the points in each of the four categories and either a draw occurs, in which case Furst casts his vote in each category to sway the outcome, or a game wins 3 categories to 1. It's efficient and I think would lend well to a group discussion. In all probability, none of you will see this as you're all incredibly busy people but if you do, have a wicked day chaps and keep up the good work!
I think Majora’s Mask was the first game I played that helped me develop emotionally as a child. It helped teach me to be sympathetic and help others even though I had other things going on. It taught me to invest in other people, and that has always resonated with me.
Hannah Rose It was probably the first game I played that made me think, “Hmmm, games can totally be as emotionally substantial as a book.” Slowly coming to understand the psychological desperation of the village, the woman profusely drinking at the bar on Night 3, and the older sister crying in Lon Lon Ranch if the younger one is captured all really resonated with me. I guess that’s why I remember it more fondly than Ocarina of Time. To me Ocarina felt like a pure adventure-fantasy story. Majora’s Mask delved into deeper, more human topics like loneliness, rejection, and anger.
Ok they got all weepy eyed about MM but seriously!? We all have that memory of playing Smash with long forgotten friends and having an absolute blast with the customization of game modes. “My worst character vs your worst” battles and such. So much fun. My buddies and me have at least 8 different drinking games to smash. MM is a great game, but Smash is N64.
I'd love to watch these guys just sit down and discuss why they love different games. Like, if they took an hour and just gushed over games together, I'd totally watch that.
I’m happy that we’re FINALLY in the Winner’s Bracket. There REALLY shouldn’t be a Loser’s Bracket; Madness should be a Single-Elimination tournament in my opinion.
My favorites in order: #1 - Banjo kazooie #2 - Paper mario #3 - Banjo tooie #4 - Mario 64 #5 - Vigilante 8 cause I played so much of it so long ago, I still remember the 14 digit unlock code and I haven't played in at least 15 years.
I agree with their decision... buuut, I also feel like they spent most of the video talking about Majora's Mask and how good of a game it is and that doesn't help Smash Bros's chances at all. They do the same in other videos and doesn't feel as bias and fair as it's supposed to be. I'm enjoying these videos though, I'm not hating, that's just my opinion.
Well, when talking about Smash 64, there isn't really a whole lot to talk about. Smash Bros is meant to be pure fun and entertainment, and if you played it for 10 minutes you've pretty much played everything the game has to offer. Majora's Mask, however, is an experience that can change every time you play it depending on the routes you take, sidequests you choose to play or ignore, and characters you choose to spend time with.
I actually thought this was one of the more fair arguments they have had. All the others they dont stick with the "better N64 game" argument in some and some they do. This video made the most sense out of all of them.
Maybe there's not a lot to talk about when it comes to Smash 64, but there isn't that little either lol I mean, last time they talked about its music and this time they didn't even mention that, but they did point out Majora's side quests and characters for the 10th time. But I agree with you, like I said, I think their decision is the right one. The point of my comment is mostly to point out that this isn't the first time they spend most of the video talking about whatever game ends up winning, giving other games even less of a chance. Like when they put Mario Kart 64 completely aside at the beginning of the video... I personally think it's a better game than Diddy Kong Racing even tho I enjoy DKR a lot.
The big problem is the time frame they have to put this discussion in. Also Furst is the one that should be calling to the table that needs to be spoken about. Its easy to get lost on conversation. They should be talking about key subjects from both like Gameplay of both titles then moving on to music of both then moving on etc. Its basically a free-for-all of opinions with sudden subject changes then its choice time.
Agreed. Jareds logic changed too much. He said Majoras is a better game but Ocarina is a better N64 game..WHAT??? I think the loser should get to battle the winner again. Its prob gonna me Ocarina vs Majoras again though.
its subjective i personally love ocarina more then majora. its not like ocarina does not deserve to be on the winners bracket. you like majora more and thats fine. but your opinion isn't fact
Well obviously I'm speaking subjectively. Just my personal feelings, and like Crutch & Wheels said, the logic behind Ocarina's win certainly didn't really make sense. But it is what it is I guess.
Polly Bonanzas i think it was a valid loss to OoT because MM is only possible because it came second. OoT is a better N64 game because it is essentially a great SNES game on a 3D console done to the best of its ability. And I don’t even mean to say it’s a rehash of LttP but it does translate well mechanically and still hold up. I would also say OoT used the hardware more efficiently. Even if MM looks better and has a more emotional and bold story, it does run the hardware down. Idk I definitely think MM deserved this bracket but I don’t really know if I would have put either as the best overall N64 game but these are just my opinions. Have a great day y’all
Majora's Mask rised up back from the (Har)grave! Sorry for the surname pun but really, god damn, you were prepared Austin! Good Job with making everyone vote for MM.
My problem with Majora's that I sadly can't get over is that I found absolutely none of the dungeons fun. I didn't even have fun reaching any of them. The entire Great Bay chapter was one of my least favorite sequences in the entire series. I hated how the Zora controlled and the stealth segment at the pirate base. The side content and general story are pretty awesome especially compared to any other Zelda game but I just hated the actual GAME part. I still don't like it even after playing the 3DS version. In both versions of the game, I reach the Ikana region and then I just completely fall off the whole game.
I think Majora’s Mask is great and so beloved because they were able to really overhaul it and have fun partly BECAUSE they didn’t have to worry about making a new art style or new engine or God forbid new console. They had the essential bits already so they decide to focus on the artistic part and they ended up with probably the best Zelda game lol.
This is an awesome series! I love ur guys content separately so seeing u all together talking about the greatest games of my childhood is amazing. Thank you guys!
Lovin' the show, and I completely agree...although I would've had Majora take gold in the winner's bracket myself. Still, what Shane said at the end was spot on. How uncannily appropriate.
Jared keeps saying Majora was just an attempt to shit out a sequel in a year, but it was more a case of: the director wanted to make a sequel and Nintendo said "Fine, but you've only got a year to get it done."
I’ve been listening to HOME for years and I’ve been noticing many channels recently starting to use his music makes me happy the guy is getting big recognition now he deserves it
As someone that never grew up with an N64, and therefore doesn't have nostalgia goggles, I really do think that what it comes down to with these is which ones better stand the test of time. And in that sense, Majora's Mask takes this by a landslide. While Smash has an amazing legacy, that legacy is also its downfall. I see no reason to play Smash 64 when Smash 4 exists. Meanwhile, Majora's Mask is a unique experience that has never (and probably will never) be replicated, and it's a game that I can still go back to and get something out of today.
One thing I am kinda surprised was never brought up is the argument that Majora's Mask probably influenced many story heavy games that get praised nowadays for their emotional stories and connections to the characters.
Honestly... I don’t think that re-hashing assets is a weakness. We’ve all heard the phrase, “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.” If you had to COMPLETELY build a game from the ground up without grabbing literally anything from previous titles, there’d be years upon years before the next game would ever come out. Right off the bat, there’s game engines that are reused constantly, updated over time but it’s still fundamentally the same engine. There’s textures, characters, and so on. The list goes on. Majora’s Mask might have reused a vast majority of Ocarina of Time assets, but it doesn’t feel close to the same game. I mean you can tell it’s on the same engine and whatnot, but Termina feels very different from Hyrule and most of the characters have completely different personalities, they are different people in all but looks... that’s why it’s not just a re-hash. That’s why it’s great
This was so close and I'm happy it came out the way it did. Can we get a loser vs winner final showdown? (It'd be really funny if that was OOT vs MM again)
As a diehard Smash fan, I think they could have talked more about how Smash 64 essentially invented the platform fighter. That said, I completely agree with the unanimous result.
Majoras mask was made as a sequel from the engine and assets of Ocarina of Time (although they did add a lot of assets), Smash was s concept that had another concept added to it and struck gold. Sakurai was making the game that would become smash bros before the "Nintendo all stars" concept was added. It was gonna be a platform fighter either way. But he couldnt think of the proper characters to make it pop. So then he thought "what if it was Nintendo characters" after he had already made the basic engine etc.
What should've obvioulsy been the grand final is the "Loser's round"... These guys. Majora's mask is such a turning point for one of the most important Nintendo IPs... It was the game where Miyamoto "passed the mantle" to Eiji Aonuma; and in this regard you could say that Majora's Mask is the one that actually set the model for what a Zelda game should be in comparisson to the previous one. Because it is Eiji Aonuma the one making them.
Yeah honestly. I was given a choice at a friends house to play smash 4 or majora's mask recently and we sat down and played the first 2 temples of majora's mask. That was a good time
As far as reusing assets from Ocarina of time, It makes sense if you think of the game as a dream sequence. Its like when Dorothy woke up in the wizard of oz and she was telling her family about how they were all there. Imagine link doing that, after he wakes up back in hyrule.
I kinda think this would work better if everyone had like a thing they weighed it on like if Jirard was doing "Which is better to complete" or Jared did "Multiplayer/social thing" and they voted on that?
They mention at the end that no one goes back and plays the original smash anymore. But my brothers and I still play original smash to this day, because it brings back so many memories of our childhood. And I would defiantly choose smash over majora, simply because it was the best time that I had on the consol
MM vs Smash64 is really just Smash64 Announcer: *CHOOSE YOUR PLAYSTYLE!* But yes I totally agree with the outcome even though I have fond memories of both!
I like the show, but fuckin hell, you guys are inconsistent. Smash was the more iconic N64 game, EASILY. and yet you voted for Majora's Mask which IS the better game. Normally you've been choosing the game that 's more iconic to the system instead of the game that's actually better. I think this might be the first time you've actually fulfilled the stated objective of this series. Congrats, I guess? Too bad you haven't been doing this the whole time though.
I almost expected them to turn to the camera and say "JK Smash Bros is my vote" at the end, since this video did completely turn around the point of the series up until now.
ikr, when they said "both these games are the epitomy of singleplayer and multiplayer games" but this is the loosers bracket... like chose one or the other but not both
Dan Scott Don’t think he was taking it hard. He’s just criticizing how inconsistent they pick their winners. Which is more valid than saying “It’s just an opinion, don’t whine about it”.
I had my mind set on Majora's Mask. Smash was great, but today, I'd just keep wishing I was playing any other Smash game, where I would still play the original Majora's Mask.
"Basically none of the masks are useless". -- Technically true, but very few of them do you ever actually use with any kind of regularity; a huge number of them are only really used once to get a piece of heart or something like that, and then of course, there's the Circus Leader's Mask. While Nintendo amended this in the 3DS remake, in the N64 version, the Circus Leader's Mask is utterly purposeless. The only actual practical use for it in the game is to aid you in a side-quest that you would already have had to have completed successfully in order to have obtained the mask in the first place.
Majoras Mask is by far one of the best single player games, and still one of my favourite games of all time. So is Super Smash - except, like you say, one of the best Multi-player games (if not the best). But i would vote for Smash. If you are looking for a fun single player game, there are a ton of other good games out there, for all consoles. But if you are looking for an awesome multiplayer game, nothing beats Super Smash.
The real winner this season has been seeing Austin get trolled.
he looked offended... he's a tad sensitive
U thicc 💦👌
The obviously best game in the lot, the best game on the console, a game that still kicks the shit out of most games that come out today, a game that is fascinating, deep, profound, and beautiful, was voted into the losers' bracket in its first round based on a cacophony of erroneous and nonsensical criticisms and only narrowly edged out Super Smash Bros. 64, of all things, in the minds of the panel.
His annoyance is pretty legitimate.
Voidaken Are you implying that Majora’s Mask doesn’t deserve being deepthroated...?? The game truly is timeless, I’ve been begging for a Majora’s Mask based sequel in my heart since the first time I fully completed it, but I know it shouldn’t get one, I just want to experience something so emotionally mature and atmospherically enveloping for the first time all over again. I get that it’s a very controversial, game but I think that objectively it can’t be argued that it isn’t a god damn masterpiece. It’s more unique than most games, it has more heart (52 pieces to be exact) than any other game I’ve come across, and it captured my interest in a way that no game has ever been able to do except for Dark Souls.
100% in the same boat as Austin on this one. I don't find myself 100%ing very many games, but Majora's Mask is one that I just HAVE to every time I play it. The incentive for it is so strong, and the payoff is so worth it. Not just in what you get, but because of the love and care put into every quest you get to be part of in order to get there.
Nitro Rad hey Nitro Rad fancy seeing you here. Love your content!
You should join normal boots and this show 👏
oh damn, love the content man! One of the bests
Nitro Rad f
This is precisely why I think Majora’s Mask is indisputably the best Zelda game. It does way too many things right for the other Zelda games to even hold up.
There is a difference between rehash and reuse.
Yes, tone. You try to make something look good, reuse. You try to make something look bad, rehash.
you know he said that was a joke right?
yeah many games use the same engine
is not about the same engine, u see a lot of companies using unreal engine, but u don't see them using the same fucking characters, they barely created new characters an only reuse the old models. tou majora's mask is a better game, it has a fantastic story and the sense of adventure
Majora’s Mask is a reuse.
Twilight Princess is a rehash.
I very much ejoy the discussions in this series, but what they mean by "the best N64 game" is still a bit fuzzy and seems to change depending on the game 😅
Not every game is the same. So it's hard to define.
OsricRexor this isn't about which is the best N64 game, this is the loser bracket, so rules aren't the same I guess. See it as between all of those games, whichever one is the most enjoyable.
OsricRexor i think its kind of a concept that varies with the type of player.
In their context they say "good n64 game" as something specific to them.
I agree, there’s a lot of inconsistency in the series. I enjoy it, but sometimes it’s “what’s the best game?” “What’s the best N64 game?” “If we sat and had to play a game right now which would it be?”. The definition changes constantly
It means multiple things;
- Which was influence towards Nintendo
- Did the fans like it
- Did it fit with the N64 era
But it changes from that to that within seconds
I still remember looking up into the sky in MM, trying to see if the moon was actually getting bigger, and being pretty unsettled when I realized it was. That was some scary crap.
Oh well, at least pretty soon here we'll get to see it happen super fast! And for no reason!
SUPER MARIO BROTHERS TWO BABYYYYYY WHAT AN INCREDIBLE GAME WHO COULDVE PREDICTED ITD BE THE WINNER HERE
STILL THE KING AFTER ALL THESE YEARS!
N64 GAME OF THE YEAR FOR 30 YEARS IN A ROW
WAIT WAIT WAIT!!!
knack 3.
Hey, look at this dunkey clone
Even when it loses, it's still the winner here!
Finally, at least the true King receives some crown
subjectivity
fact
Shane is still upset about his Paper Mario loss
As am I.
Second that
I still am a year later
Pbg has an empty cup but he keeps trying to drink it
If you build something out of Lego, take it apart, and build something new out of the exact same parts, that's *reuse.* Not a *rehash.* *JUST LIKE MAJORA'S MASK.*
A rehash is OVERUSING THE SAME ARGUMENT IN IRRELEVANT SITUATIONS, *_JARED._*
_...I'm sorry for getting heated._
I feel like a thumbs-up doesn't go deep enough in conveying how much of a quality comment this is, so might I add: quality comment.
Enthusiastic Dead Guy same
I feel like he was trying to play devil's advocate on this one, but it came across as way too hostile.
That's not a good analogy. You'd be referring to polygons (Legos) for an apples to apples.
But you're not. This is like building cars out of Legos, making a movie based on them, then writing a new script for a new game, and making a whole new movie with the exact same cars
Couldn't have worded it better if i had a week. Jesus Jared, i love you but you've been stuck with the same argument since 3 episodes ago and YOU'RE WRONG. Damn
Majora's mask, easily. Smash 64 is a classic, but it's pretty broken and not super well polished. Majora's mask is an amazing game that still holds up today.
Egg Benedict A huge point is that you can still go back to the original version of Majora's Mask and still have an amazing time. There is absolutely no reason to go back to Smash 64 other than nostalgia
TheNCSmaster Exactly.
Smash 64 isn’t that broken, I hear it’s the most balanced smash game
Zach Collins Um... No?
hmm, nothing against Majora's mask cause I think it should've won back in the winners bracket but have you seen a speed run of it? It's almost more broken then, if not as broken as Ocarina of Time and that's saying something.
With such dissimilar games I think you have to judge each one based on how well they accomplished what they set out to do, so is Majora's Mask a better action-adventure game than Smash Bros. is a multi-player party fighting game.
I'm voting for Majora.
They get into all the arguments about what truly makes MM a fantastic game against Smash, I wonder what the outcome would have been versus OoT if they got this deep in haha
RIGHT
OOT is perfection.
not hardly
OoT is great, still far better than most games, but the most flawed 3d Zolda imo.
OoT isn't bad but today... it's kind of underwhelming. Yeah it's good but I have more games I have more fun with, doesn't help I really born when OoT was still a new thing so the big major twist of Sheik being Zelda wasn't that mind blowing. As for the gameplay it's... eh I didn't really find it as great as other games in the series like WindWaker or Botw
The best N64 game, by far, is Buck Bumble. This whole thing is invalid.
Right?! that intro is enough to win
Right about now, it's time to rock with the biggity Buck Bumble
Right about now, it's time to rock with the biggity Buck Bumble
Bump to the bump to the bump to the bass
bump to the bump to the Bumble
Bump to the bump to the bump to the bass
bump to the bump to the Bumble
Bump to the bump to the bump to the bass
bump to the bump to the Bumble
Bump to the bump to the bump to the bass
bump to the bump to the Bumble
Bump to boop to the boop to the boop boop
Bump to the base to the base base base base
Bump to boop to the boop to the boop boop
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Badabadaba
Badabadaba
He say
Badabadaba
Badabadaba
He say ma te ulla eh
'Ey!
So I gotta say I love Madness, its a great thing to just sit down and watch, listening to the opinions of the TH-camr's I watch regularly
Jirard started off the series saying that multiplayer is what makes a game better for the N64, but then in this, he started saying that the single player was the heart of the 64.
ya that annoyed me, especially considering if u compare N64 to its rival, the PS1, it was certainly the multiplayer console whereas PS1 was the single player console. One had 4 controller ports, and the other used disks for extra storage space, need i say more?
Chris Richfield
Well I disagree completely. Single-player was instrumental to the N64 Console. I do agree that Jared keeps flopping left and right. But I fondly remember my time in Perfect Dark, DK64, OoT/MM, and Mario 64 as single-player experiences. Yes I also had fantastic and equally as memorable times playing Mario Party 2 with the rest of my family, but it’s too much of an oversimplification to say the N64 was the multiplayer to PS1’s single-player. I don’t agree with that paradigm at all.
TheVoraciousCatArmy all I'm saying is if the n64 is either one of those, I consider it more of a multiplayer console. Not saying it didn't have great single player games, just that hardware was better suited to multiplayer and I have far more memories of playing Smash Bros all night with friends than I do the Zelda games. I didn't really appreciate the single player games of the n64 until I played them much later on different hardware. As a kid I didn't have the patience to get into those stories, I just wanted to pummel my friends in smash. I love Zelda now but MM is the more stressful Zelda game, it's not really fun to me, there are satisfying moments but overall It just doesn't draw me in to play it.
Chris Richfield
Funny because I was the exact opposite. I didn’t get hardcore into multiplayer Nintendo games until GameCube’s iteration of Double Dash (Still my favorite. That game was excellent) and Melee (Needs no introduction. It’s personally the pinnacle of competitive Smash)
N64 was for me a more personal console. Majora’s Mask, while definitely more stressful, was also the deepest narrative of the 3D Zelda games and the best Single Player game on the N64 personally. The side quests and real, deep dive into characters was what impressed me when I played. Also the tone. Other Zelda’s, with potentially the exception of Twilight Princess, had drastically lighter tones. MM deals with depression, death, solitude, hatred, and desperation throughout the quests if you really are patient and just go slowly step by step.
Also even though Perfect Dark was a spiritual successor to Golden Eye I only fought the bots in multiplayer funny enough. Lol.
I don’t know. I personally took the N64 as a single player experience and the GameCube as a much clearer example of a multiplayer orientated console. Not saying your interpretation was wrong; I just had a very different experience.
And with that conclusion, the Happy Mask Salesman chuckled, turned around and vanished into thin air.
You know, as much as people tote around about the reused assets in Majora's mask as a negative to the game, I find it funny how the ignore that about 80% of the game is still original content - this is including character models, enemy designs, boss designs, dungeon designs, over world layout, in some cases textures, and I could probably go on for a bit more but I think I made my point.
People often forget about all of the original content in Majora's Mask and how it heavily outweighs the reused content from Ocarina of time, just... that's it, really.
And one of the previous video's arguments in favor of _Paper Mario_ could be applied to _Majora's Mask,_ what with seeing (some) familiar monsters now as people.
*bEtTeR n6⁴ gAmE*
But the question is, which is th-- punches through screen furiously
Majoras Mask had various minigames you didn't bring up, the Goron Race, the Deku Playground, the Floor wall maze, the Zora Target Shoot, the Zora time trial, Bomchu/Bomb/arrow Spinny game, two shooting games (three if you count the horseback one), Dog racing, all the other side quest minigames...
I feel the same as Jirard about games 100%. Very few games hit that mark, but they deliver.
Games like BOTW, Majora, Portal (1&2), Doki Doki Literature Club, and a couple others really resonate with me, so I'm so glad he said that.
I never really thought about it, but I've always felt a connection to certain games. BOTW, for it's world. Majora, for it's characters. Portal, for it's story. DDLC, for everything. Thanks for the great discussion!
Next time they do these best of comparisons, I think choosing one game per franchise would be good, to ensure more interesting titles are being considered rather than the obvious few. I love a lot of the games they've discussed over this series, but so many others are worth talking about; Worms Armaggedon, Rayman 2, F-Zero X, Shadowman, Jet Force Gemini. Donkey Kong 64 and Perfect Dark, to name but a few.
Better yet, have the public vote in specific categories and they pit the top three voted against each other. Racing would have likely been Mario Kart, Diddy Kong and F-Zero. Adventure would have likely been Ocarina of Time, Paper Mario and Banjo-Kazooie. Shooting games would have likely been Goldeneye, Starfox 64 and either Turok 1 or 2. I think the format is wicked and the group discussion is very interesting but without categories, we're pitting essentially mini-game compilations against genuine arguments for videogames as art, which can only lead to one winner which is inherently pointless. Categories would help define the voting and would guarantee games of a similar ilk were being pitted against one another.
I'll carry on watching and supporting the channel, this isn't like a resignation rage post, just a few suggestions for the next console wars you decide to produce and how to ensure no two games meet without a proper system in place. Given that eventually you'd come out of the categories, voting should be contested comparing things that all games share; presentation (boxart, advertising and the boot-up/file select), graphics, sound and replay factor. Comparing Starfox 64 and Ocarina of Time for example, Starfox would win for in presentation, lose but not by much in graphics, win in sound and in replay factor, exploring all the different routes you can take, all the secrets you missed in your first dozen or so runs. Tally the points in each of the four categories and either a draw occurs, in which case Furst casts his vote in each category to sway the outcome, or a game wins 3 categories to 1. It's efficient and I think would lend well to a group discussion.
In all probability, none of you will see this as you're all incredibly busy people but if you do, have a wicked day chaps and keep up the good work!
This may be my new favorite TH-cam series.
Each episode has been very enjoyable.
I think Majora’s Mask was the first game I played that helped me develop emotionally as a child. It helped teach me to be sympathetic and help others even though I had other things going on. It taught me to invest in other people, and that has always resonated with me.
Majora's mask has a really interesting story, and I'm glad it helped someone.(^^)
Hannah Rose
It was probably the first game I played that made me think, “Hmmm, games can totally be as emotionally substantial as a book.”
Slowly coming to understand the psychological desperation of the village, the woman profusely drinking at the bar on Night 3, and the older sister crying in Lon Lon Ranch if the younger one is captured all really resonated with me. I guess that’s why I remember it more fondly than Ocarina of Time. To me Ocarina felt like a pure adventure-fantasy story. Majora’s Mask delved into deeper, more human topics like loneliness, rejection, and anger.
Ok they got all weepy eyed about MM but seriously!? We all have that memory of playing Smash with long forgotten friends and having an absolute blast with the customization of game modes. “My worst character vs your worst” battles and such. So much fun. My buddies and me have at least 8 different drinking games to smash. MM is a great game, but Smash is N64.
Around 5:20 i thought "did i leave my music player going?"
I'd love to watch these guys just sit down and discuss why they love different games. Like, if they took an hour and just gushed over games together, I'd totally watch that.
Loving the Chillwave music! And I thought you guys did really well understanding the argument of best 64 games on this one. Really enjoyed it!
Man, totally thought Smash was more likely to win, but I'm really glad Majora's Mask won, definitely one of my favorite games of all time.
I’m happy that we’re FINALLY in the Winner’s Bracket. There REALLY shouldn’t be a Loser’s Bracket; Madness should be a Single-Elimination tournament in my opinion.
So when are we going to see the loser's loser's bracket? Paper Mario all the way.
This was the losers bracket paper mario got its ass kickex
geoffrey 887 that's why he said "loser's loser's bracket?"
geoffrey 887 /r/whoooosh
I'm calling it:
Loser's Bracket: Majora's Mask.
Winner's Bracket: Ocarina of Time.
One has to lose.
I love the editing style on these videos. The close-ups, special effects, and sound effect are great.
My favorites in order:
#1 - Banjo kazooie
#2 - Paper mario
#3 - Banjo tooie
#4 - Mario 64
#5 - Vigilante 8 cause I played so much of it so long ago, I still remember the 14 digit unlock code and I haven't played in at least 15 years.
Wow! Hardly any insults towards other games. Everyone was very fair in their arguments. Great stuff guys.
I agree with their decision... buuut, I also feel like they spent most of the video talking about Majora's Mask and how good of a game it is and that doesn't help Smash Bros's chances at all. They do the same in other videos and doesn't feel as bias and fair as it's supposed to be.
I'm enjoying these videos though, I'm not hating, that's just my opinion.
Well, when talking about Smash 64, there isn't really a whole lot to talk about. Smash Bros is meant to be pure fun and entertainment, and if you played it for 10 minutes you've pretty much played everything the game has to offer. Majora's Mask, however, is an experience that can change every time you play it depending on the routes you take, sidequests you choose to play or ignore, and characters you choose to spend time with.
I actually thought this was one of the more fair arguments they have had. All the others they dont stick with the "better N64 game" argument in some and some they do. This video made the most sense out of all of them.
to be honest smash 64 doesn't have a lot to talk about. especially what they haven't said before. its a party fighting game. not a lot of depth in it.
Maybe there's not a lot to talk about when it comes to Smash 64, but there isn't that little either lol I mean, last time they talked about its music and this time they didn't even mention that, but they did point out Majora's side quests and characters for the 10th time.
But I agree with you, like I said, I think their decision is the right one. The point of my comment is mostly to point out that this isn't the first time they spend most of the video talking about whatever game ends up winning, giving other games even less of a chance. Like when they put Mario Kart 64 completely aside at the beginning of the video... I personally think it's a better game than Diddy Kong Racing even tho I enjoy DKR a lot.
The big problem is the time frame they have to put this discussion in. Also Furst is the one that should be calling to the table that needs to be spoken about. Its easy to get lost on conversation. They should be talking about key subjects from both like Gameplay of both titles then moving on to music of both then moving on etc. Its basically a free-for-all of opinions with sudden subject changes then its choice time.
Great content and agreed with the final verdict!
Also, please consider using reusable glasses/cups haha.
Majora's Mask got remade and is beloved today for a reason.
Honestly, MM shoulda beat OoT, but I guess this is fine.
Agreed. Jareds logic changed too much. He said Majoras is a better game but Ocarina is a better N64 game..WHAT??? I think the loser should get to battle the winner again. Its prob gonna me Ocarina vs Majoras again though.
its subjective i personally love ocarina more then majora. its not like ocarina does not deserve to be on the winners bracket. you like majora more and thats fine. but your opinion isn't fact
Well obviously I'm speaking subjectively. Just my personal feelings, and like Crutch & Wheels said, the logic behind Ocarina's win certainly didn't really make sense. But it is what it is I guess.
Polly Bonanzas i think it was a valid loss to OoT because MM is only possible because it came second. OoT is a better N64 game because it is essentially a great SNES game on a 3D console done to the best of its ability. And I don’t even mean to say it’s a rehash of LttP but it does translate well mechanically and still hold up.
I would also say OoT used the hardware more efficiently. Even if MM looks better and has a more emotional and bold story, it does run the hardware down.
Idk I definitely think MM deserved this bracket but I don’t really know if I would have put either as the best overall N64 game but these are just my opinions. Have a great day y’all
both are subjective....
My heart goes out to ya, Shane. They did our boi, Paper Mario, dirty. 16:00
I'm just here to say that the video thumbnail is priceless.
Keep up the good work guys, I love madness!
(Proceeds to discard, madness trigger, cast for value)
Do Conkers Bad Fur Day vs Banjo & Kazooie
I'd love to see a Madness on the different Links. Putting the hero of time up against the hero of twilight, etc.
Can I just say, I really appreciate the music choices in all these videos, especially HOME songs.
Majora's Mask rised up back from the (Har)grave!
Sorry for the surname pun but really, god damn, you were prepared Austin! Good Job with making everyone vote for MM.
My problem with Majora's that I sadly can't get over is that I found absolutely none of the dungeons fun. I didn't even have fun reaching any of them. The entire Great Bay chapter was one of my least favorite sequences in the entire series. I hated how the Zora controlled and the stealth segment at the pirate base. The side content and general story are pretty awesome especially compared to any other Zelda game but I just hated the actual GAME part. I still don't like it even after playing the 3DS version. In both versions of the game, I reach the Ikana region and then I just completely fall off the whole game.
Love that Observatory remix at the end
I think Majora’s Mask is great and so beloved because they were able to really overhaul it and have fun partly BECAUSE they didn’t have to worry about making a new art style or new engine or God forbid new console. They had the essential bits already so they decide to focus on the artistic part and they ended up with probably the best Zelda game lol.
11:45 The Nightmares in Link's Awakening all just don't want their world to end, which I think is pretty sympathetic...
New title: Austen defends Majora's Mask for 18 minutes (I'm totally with him, it's my favorite Zelda game)
This is an awesome series! I love ur guys content separately so seeing u all together talking about the greatest games of my childhood is amazing. Thank you guys!
I feel like i other episodes PBG didn't represent Majora's Mask well, but this time he did a really good job of showing why it's an amazing game.
Zackary Korczak It's not an amazing game.
???
"What a day to deal with the fate" - Majora's Mask, 2000, probably
PBG is wasting away to nothing but bones before our eyes with each passing episode
'I cant think of a more interesting Zelda villain' bro?? Ganondorf?!? Literally the main villain?!
Lovin' the show, and I completely agree...although I would've had Majora take gold in the winner's bracket myself. Still, what Shane said at the end was spot on. How uncannily appropriate.
An amazing series, I'm always waiting for the next episode to be released.
Well, when the new smash comes out, people forget about the last one, but to this day people still go back to Majora's Mask.
Nintendo and "rehashing" is a loaded argument in general. You're better off veering away from it.
the fact they are like 'oh what makes a good N64 game, multiplayer' and yet they go back and forth on that constantly
Jared keeps saying Majora was just an attempt to shit out a sequel in a year, but it was more a case of: the director wanted to make a sequel and Nintendo said "Fine, but you've only got a year to get it done."
Majora's Mask: King of the Underdogs.
Truer words have never been spoken. Not just for this series, but for games in general.
Just like in real life!
Tristan R. Ha! Majora’s mask a underdog! XD
I think that kinda belittle's the game. I never thought Majora's Mask as an underdog.
What the hell year do you think this is?
Majora's Mask Team represent!
Love the D&D Pin on Furst's shirt. when will we see a Normal Boots Campaign DM'd by Projared?
13:24
I listen to De Lorra all the time, its awesome to hear it in here
I love this series, hope to see more consoles soon!
This series is just reminding me how great the astral observatory theme is
I’ve been listening to HOME for years and I’ve been noticing many channels recently starting to use his music makes me happy the guy is getting big recognition now he deserves it
Yep. Exactly as it should have went. (Also, holy lord, that was like REAL tension between Lee and Shane. Roomate status changes you.)
As someone that never grew up with an N64, and therefore doesn't have nostalgia goggles, I really do think that what it comes down to with these is which ones better stand the test of time. And in that sense, Majora's Mask takes this by a landslide. While Smash has an amazing legacy, that legacy is also its downfall. I see no reason to play Smash 64 when Smash 4 exists. Meanwhile, Majora's Mask is a unique experience that has never (and probably will never) be replicated, and it's a game that I can still go back to and get something out of today.
That was a surprise, it was a complete butt kicking.
Shouldn’t they get the semifinals of the winners bracket out of the way before finishing up the losers bracket? That’s how tournaments work right?
Oooo that was close, and they’re such different games. Majora’s Mask all the way though. Nice!
One thing I am kinda surprised was never brought up is the argument that Majora's Mask probably influenced many story heavy games that get praised nowadays for their emotional stories and connections to the characters.
Honestly... I don’t think that re-hashing assets is a weakness. We’ve all heard the phrase, “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.”
If you had to COMPLETELY build a game from the ground up without grabbing literally anything from previous titles, there’d be years upon years before the next game would ever come out. Right off the bat, there’s game engines that are reused constantly, updated over time but it’s still fundamentally the same engine. There’s textures, characters, and so on. The list goes on. Majora’s Mask might have reused a vast majority of Ocarina of Time assets, but it doesn’t feel close to the same game. I mean you can tell it’s on the same engine and whatnot, but Termina feels very different from Hyrule and most of the characters have completely different personalities, they are different people in all but looks... that’s why it’s not just a re-hash. That’s why it’s great
This was so close and I'm happy it came out the way it did. Can we get a loser vs winner final showdown? (It'd be really funny if that was OOT vs MM again)
As a diehard Smash fan, I think they could have talked more about how Smash 64 essentially invented the platform fighter.
That said, I completely agree with the unanimous result.
Majoras mask was made as a sequel from the engine and assets of Ocarina of Time (although they did add a lot of assets), Smash was s concept that had another concept added to it and struck gold. Sakurai was making the game that would become smash bros before the "Nintendo all stars" concept was added. It was gonna be a platform fighter either way. But he couldnt think of the proper characters to make it pop. So then he thought "what if it was Nintendo characters" after he had already made the basic engine etc.
What should've obvioulsy been the grand final is the "Loser's round"... These guys.
Majora's mask is such a turning point for one of the most important Nintendo IPs... It was the game where Miyamoto "passed the mantle" to Eiji Aonuma; and in this regard you could say that Majora's Mask is the one that actually set the model for what a Zelda game should be in comparisson to the previous one. Because it is Eiji Aonuma the one making them.
Hell yeah Majora earned this win! It's so timeless!
Yeah honestly. I was given a choice at a friends house to play smash 4 or majora's mask recently and we sat down and played the first 2 temples of majora's mask. That was a good time
damn like obviously majora's mask is a much better game but I really didn't go into this expecting Smash to get dunked on so hard
PBG definently didn't send any death threats
As far as reusing assets from Ocarina of time, It makes sense if you think of the game as a dream sequence. Its like when Dorothy woke up in the wizard of oz and she was telling her family about how they were all there. Imagine link doing that, after he wakes up back in hyrule.
I kinda think this would work better if everyone had like a thing they weighed it on like if Jirard was doing "Which is better to complete" or Jared did "Multiplayer/social thing" and they voted on that?
They mention at the end that no one goes back and plays the original smash anymore.
But my brothers and I still play original smash to this day, because it brings back so many memories of our childhood.
And I would defiantly choose smash over majora, simply because it was the best time that I had on the consol
MM vs Smash64 is really just
Smash64 Announcer: *CHOOSE YOUR PLAYSTYLE!*
But yes I totally agree with the outcome even though I have fond memories of both!
I like the show, but fuckin hell, you guys are inconsistent.
Smash was the more iconic N64 game, EASILY. and yet you voted for Majora's Mask which IS the better game.
Normally you've been choosing the game that 's more iconic to the system instead of the game that's actually better.
I think this might be the first time you've actually fulfilled the stated objective of this series.
Congrats, I guess?
Too bad you haven't been doing this the whole time though.
I almost expected them to turn to the camera and say "JK Smash Bros is my vote" at the end, since this video did completely turn around the point of the series up until now.
ikr, when they said "both these games are the epitomy of singleplayer and multiplayer games" but this is the loosers bracket... like chose one or the other but not both
Phillip [TEC] I like how they did that even tho that was the exact reason MM lost to OOT
Dan Scott Don’t think he was taking it hard. He’s just criticizing how inconsistent they pick their winners. Which is more valid than saying “It’s just an opinion, don’t whine about it”.
I didn't even have to watch this video, I knew they would pick Majora's Mask.
If I had a dollar for every time Jared says “what is the better n64 game”. I’d be rich
Majora's mask,come on guys don't disappoint me
I can't wait to see them discuss GameCube games!
I had my mind set on Majora's Mask. Smash was great, but today, I'd just keep wishing I was playing any other Smash game, where I would still play the original Majora's Mask.
"Basically none of the masks are useless".
-- Technically true, but very few of them do you ever actually use with any kind of regularity; a huge number of them are only really used once to get a piece of heart or something like that, and then of course, there's the Circus Leader's Mask. While Nintendo amended this in the 3DS remake, in the N64 version, the Circus Leader's Mask is utterly purposeless. The only actual practical use for it in the game is to aid you in a side-quest that you would already have had to have completed successfully in order to have obtained the mask in the first place.
They picked up Majora's Mask for sake of not pissing of Toxic Zelda Fanbase.
Majoras Mask is by far one of the best single player games, and still one of my favourite games of all time. So is Super Smash - except, like you say, one of the best Multi-player games (if not the best).
But i would vote for Smash. If you are looking for a fun single player game, there are a ton of other good games out there, for all consoles. But if you are looking for an awesome multiplayer game, nothing beats Super Smash.
I'm going to predict the final results!
1st place: Ocarina of Time
2nd: Super Mario 64
3rd: Majora's Mask
4th: Super Smash Bros.
Jirard's Reaction at 4:06
"Mom, Dad please stop fighting."
Too many beards. Thank you ProJared for representing.