Man, i really hope in the future SNK will retro fit rollback to kof13 and make this game alive again, also maybe with some balance change and possibility of new char update Hopefully when that happen, you got the recognition you deserve man, imo your tutorial is better than lot of kof youtuber i found (like dandy j or trulyamiracle, doesnt mean to downplay them), especially when talking about the basic nitty gritty of the game and how the flow of the game work (neutral within kof system, winning condition, what to achieve in neutral, the value of frame advantage in kof, how the combo shortcut work, etc), iam surely will try to share this insight to my friend, especially the one who get kof15 as their 1st kof game
Really appreciate the video man, lots of helpful advice in understanding better the neutral game of KoF. Like, I've heard more or less the same explanation from others before, but I still have trouble really "getting" these concepts. So I keep seeking other people trying to explain these neutral KoF concepts from other people to possibly gain new insights and hope of finally make sense of all this. But man, I've got 2 drawbacks as an FG player in general that reaaaaaaally hurt me hard with the KoF series. One being is that my sense of intuition is really lacking. I'm a real slow learner in general, so it really makes it that much harder for me to see what I'm doing wrong mid-game to begin with. That's why the usual tip of advice for KoF newbies of "just keep moving and throw out attacks along the way, then just go from there and is really difficult for me fo truly understand. Like it always leaves me wondering, "How does one differentiate someone using that advice poorly/randomly vs someone using it effectively/competently?" That really boggles my mind And the second major holdback for myself is that has me from playing KoF decently well is that I tend to play real scared/reserved the moment I feel like I've exhausted all the options I could possibly think of on the spot. Once that happens, I completely forgo at any attempts at playing traditional KoF and just default to playing Street Fighter style in my KoF match. Now, I'm aware that part of that problem is a result of not being fully aware of all my options are that moment. But it's pretty tough to even attempt to adapt on the spot while getting rushed down hella hard....
That's all understandable. KoF is a much more difficult game to "learn" than most fighting games. It takes longer to start feeling like you know what you're doing, because it's so fast-paced. A player that's only moderately better than you is still able to completely overwhelm you. Just know that you don't need to learn everything mid-match. The game has a built-in replay system, or you can record your matches yourself. Watch your matches back, and use that time to learn. Pause a lot, and rewind a lot, so that you don't miss any of the details that are flying by. Things aren't as simple as "Oh, he threw me, I guess I should have teched the throw." Defaulting to doing nothing is a good idea when you're getting attacked. Just block, and there's almost nothing they can do to hurt you. Overheads and throws are one-off things that usually don't lead to full combos. However, because of the guard gauge, you have to EVENTUALLY get them off of you, one way or another, otherwise you get hit for blocking. Consider teching a potential throw, or stand-jabbing a hop, or blocking the frame trap, all of which give you opportunity to escape their pressure. Also don't forget about GUARD CANCEL BLOWBACK. Defaulting to nothing is a horrible idea when you're not directly being attacked. If you have space to move, then move. Use your hop normals to control space, and, suddenly, you're playing the KoF neutral. Only stand still if you're specifically looking to anti-air them with a grounded attack, which requires a prediction on their jump spacing and timing, and isn't the only way to stop jumps. Don't be afraid to go in, but also don't be afraid to back out and make them whiff something.
Your guides are great! While this doesn't fully answer my question of: how to train at neutral on my own? It's a great start! Time to go read over some of your other guides on this topic. Thanks again! Ps. I learned a few new things here off top of my head the window to input a throw tech. Peace.
You can't really practice the neutral fully, because it is so abstract. The best you can do is alternate between match experience and match examination (i.e. watching your replays, particuarly your losses, as well as high level match footage). It's a dense mix of all three skill types: Execution, Knowledge, and Adaptation. Yeah, getting better reaction time helps, and getting better understanding of what happens at all spacings helps, and getting a better sense for what the opponent might do next helps, but at the end of the day you might always be wrong, and that's fine. You shouldn't necessarily completely stop doing something when it doesn't work a few times in a row - it always depends.
if you see this some months later, is the low/throw mix there in all kofs or just 13? wondering for 15, it's gonna be my first one playing more than casually. edit - omg your wordpress is godlike. becoming a patron now.
All of the popular KoF games have nearly identical mechanics, aside from how the super meters function. The balance within the mixup can change a lot, though - in 14, the power of raw MAX mode activation tends to shut down most other offensive strategies. The other mixups still exist, but the risk/reward isn't worth it.
I know I asked about the combo timings before, but I have another question While HD is a KoF 13 exclusive mechanic iirc, how many of these strategies apply to all KoF games? Most of it seems pretty similar in general, and I actually like the idea of even controlling space being something to set up offense (some of my characters in 98 for example being Joe, Shingo, Heavy D, Yamazaki, Kyo & Athena on occasion, etc), but I'm just kinda curious on how many things are different for 13 specifically since this is what's in my sub feed. Plus, i did hear one time that defensive options were a bit weaker in 13 than in other KoF games, but idk how much to believe that when I only heard it once.
HD is in KoF XIII only, yes. Everything in this video applies to all KoF games, including the new ones. KoF doesn't really add new mechanics from game to game, specific stuff with super meter. The main difference with 13 is HD, which lets you get big combos from far range off of any normal attack, which didn't exist in previous titles. I don't think defense in 13 is too weak at all. No idea where that came from. In 14, you can do the same with MAX Mode, except it's much cheaper, and breaks the game. In 15, they're adding a couple of new mechanics which may spice things up a little, but we don't know much yet. And I'm not including... certain KoF games, only the ones people play, like 02UM and 98. KoF 12, for example, is hot trash.
Yeah 12 doesn't look fun at all. Shame too, I think KoF has the coolest 2D Fighter Movement out there, at least for me personally. Though my execution ain't great. Another question I had. You say that Tick Throws don't exist in KoF & GG due to the extended throw invul, which makes sense. It's basically a Strike Throw mixup after a blocked button. But on Dustloop, I still see Tick Throw thrown around a lot. Like for my characters, Order Sol's 5P, 2P & 2K, and Robo ky's 5P, 2P, 5K, 2K, 6H(2), and Ground Missile. So if Tick Throws don't actually exist in Gear or KoF, is a true Tick Throw one where you can only Throw Tech or Jump out of, without any other options like a fast button?
@@KazanmaTheSilverWind The extended throw invulnerability is really short in Guilty Gear. Even in Strive, it's only 5 frames, which is tied for the fastest attack on the slowest characters like Nago. In KoF, every character has either a 4 or 3 frame attack with decent range, and the throw invul window is much larger, somewhere around 8 frames. So ETI is usable by every character all the time in KoF, but is very difficult to use in Guilty Gear. You basically have to use jabs, and no one wants to start combos with jabs in Guilty Gear. But I did manually test this, and I'm 100% sure that Strive has 5 frames of ETI, and 99% sure that Plus R has some amount of ETI, because ABA can consistently jab out of Pot Buster. People online don't know wtf they're talking about more than half the time. When in doubt, test things yourself in training mode.
@@KazanmaTheSilverWind I just did a quick test, and can confirm that there are either 9, 10, or 11 frames of throw invulnerability after blockstun in KoF 13. I would guess 10, but I'll keep testing. It may be shorter after hitstun, wakeup, and air resets, but not by much. I have already confirmed at LEAST 6 frames of throw invulnerability after hitstun. So yeah, MUCH longer than Guilty Gear
This series is tight, man. The KOF community appreciates it
These videos are incredible man I hope you get the recognition you deserve some day.
Just wanna say keep up the good work. You're easily one of the best fg teachers out there.
Man, i really hope in the future SNK will retro fit rollback to kof13 and make this game alive again, also maybe with some balance change and possibility of new char update
Hopefully when that happen, you got the recognition you deserve man, imo your tutorial is better than lot of kof youtuber i found (like dandy j or trulyamiracle, doesnt mean to downplay them), especially when talking about the basic nitty gritty of the game and how the flow of the game work (neutral within kof system, winning condition, what to achieve in neutral, the value of frame advantage in kof, how the combo shortcut work, etc), iam surely will try to share this insight to my friend, especially the one who get kof15 as their 1st kof game
Really appreciate the video man, lots of helpful advice in understanding better the neutral game of KoF. Like, I've heard more or less the same explanation from others before, but I still have trouble really "getting" these concepts. So I keep seeking other people trying to explain these neutral KoF concepts from other people to possibly gain new insights and hope of finally make sense of all this.
But man, I've got 2 drawbacks as an FG
player in general that reaaaaaaally hurt me hard with the KoF series. One being is that my sense of intuition is really lacking. I'm a real slow learner in general, so it really makes it that much harder for me to see what I'm doing wrong mid-game to begin with. That's why the usual tip of advice for KoF newbies of "just keep moving and throw out attacks along the way, then just go from there and is really difficult for me fo truly understand. Like it always leaves me wondering, "How does one differentiate someone using that advice poorly/randomly vs someone using it effectively/competently?" That really boggles my mind
And the second major holdback for myself is that has me from playing KoF decently well is that I tend to play real scared/reserved the moment I feel like I've exhausted all the options I could possibly think of on the spot. Once that happens, I completely forgo at any attempts at playing traditional KoF and just default to playing Street Fighter style in my KoF match. Now, I'm aware that part of that problem is a result of not being fully aware of all my options are that moment. But it's pretty tough to even attempt to adapt on the spot while getting rushed down hella hard....
That's all understandable. KoF is a much more difficult game to "learn" than most fighting games. It takes longer to start feeling like you know what you're doing, because it's so fast-paced. A player that's only moderately better than you is still able to completely overwhelm you.
Just know that you don't need to learn everything mid-match. The game has a built-in replay system, or you can record your matches yourself. Watch your matches back, and use that time to learn. Pause a lot, and rewind a lot, so that you don't miss any of the details that are flying by. Things aren't as simple as "Oh, he threw me, I guess I should have teched the throw."
Defaulting to doing nothing is a good idea when you're getting attacked. Just block, and there's almost nothing they can do to hurt you. Overheads and throws are one-off things that usually don't lead to full combos. However, because of the guard gauge, you have to EVENTUALLY get them off of you, one way or another, otherwise you get hit for blocking. Consider teching a potential throw, or stand-jabbing a hop, or blocking the frame trap, all of which give you opportunity to escape their pressure. Also don't forget about GUARD CANCEL BLOWBACK.
Defaulting to nothing is a horrible idea when you're not directly being attacked. If you have space to move, then move. Use your hop normals to control space, and, suddenly, you're playing the KoF neutral. Only stand still if you're specifically looking to anti-air them with a grounded attack, which requires a prediction on their jump spacing and timing, and isn't the only way to stop jumps. Don't be afraid to go in, but also don't be afraid to back out and make them whiff something.
Your guides are great! While this doesn't fully answer my question of: how to train at neutral on my own? It's a great start! Time to go read over some of your other guides on this topic. Thanks again! Ps. I learned a few new things here off top of my head the window to input a throw tech. Peace.
You can't really practice the neutral fully, because it is so abstract. The best you can do is alternate between match experience and match examination (i.e. watching your replays, particuarly your losses, as well as high level match footage). It's a dense mix of all three skill types: Execution, Knowledge, and Adaptation. Yeah, getting better reaction time helps, and getting better understanding of what happens at all spacings helps, and getting a better sense for what the opponent might do next helps, but at the end of the day you might always be wrong, and that's fine. You shouldn't necessarily completely stop doing something when it doesn't work a few times in a row - it always depends.
amazing
if you see this some months later, is the low/throw mix there in all kofs or just 13? wondering for 15, it's gonna be my first one playing more than casually.
edit - omg your wordpress is godlike. becoming a patron now.
All of the popular KoF games have nearly identical mechanics, aside from how the super meters function. The balance within the mixup can change a lot, though - in 14, the power of raw MAX mode activation tends to shut down most other offensive strategies. The other mixups still exist, but the risk/reward isn't worth it.
Yes good
I know I asked about the combo timings before, but I have another question
While HD is a KoF 13 exclusive mechanic iirc, how many of these strategies apply to all KoF games? Most of it seems pretty similar in general, and I actually like the idea of even controlling space being something to set up offense (some of my characters in 98 for example being Joe, Shingo, Heavy D, Yamazaki, Kyo & Athena on occasion, etc), but I'm just kinda curious on how many things are different for 13 specifically since this is what's in my sub feed.
Plus, i did hear one time that defensive options were a bit weaker in 13 than in other KoF games, but idk how much to believe that when I only heard it once.
HD is in KoF XIII only, yes.
Everything in this video applies to all KoF games, including the new ones. KoF doesn't really add new mechanics from game to game, specific stuff with super meter. The main difference with 13 is HD, which lets you get big combos from far range off of any normal attack, which didn't exist in previous titles.
I don't think defense in 13 is too weak at all. No idea where that came from.
In 14, you can do the same with MAX Mode, except it's much cheaper, and breaks the game.
In 15, they're adding a couple of new mechanics which may spice things up a little, but we don't know much yet.
And I'm not including... certain KoF games, only the ones people play, like 02UM and 98. KoF 12, for example, is hot trash.
Yeah 12 doesn't look fun at all. Shame too, I think KoF has the coolest 2D Fighter Movement out there, at least for me personally. Though my execution ain't great.
Another question I had. You say that Tick Throws don't exist in KoF & GG due to the extended throw invul, which makes sense. It's basically a Strike Throw mixup after a blocked button.
But on Dustloop, I still see Tick Throw thrown around a lot. Like for my characters, Order Sol's 5P, 2P & 2K, and Robo ky's 5P, 2P, 5K, 2K, 6H(2), and Ground Missile.
So if Tick Throws don't actually exist in Gear or KoF, is a true Tick Throw one where you can only Throw Tech or Jump out of, without any other options like a fast button?
@@KazanmaTheSilverWind The extended throw invulnerability is really short in Guilty Gear. Even in Strive, it's only 5 frames, which is tied for the fastest attack on the slowest characters like Nago. In KoF, every character has either a 4 or 3 frame attack with decent range, and the throw invul window is much larger, somewhere around 8 frames.
So ETI is usable by every character all the time in KoF, but is very difficult to use in Guilty Gear. You basically have to use jabs, and no one wants to start combos with jabs in Guilty Gear. But I did manually test this, and I'm 100% sure that Strive has 5 frames of ETI, and 99% sure that Plus R has some amount of ETI, because ABA can consistently jab out of Pot Buster.
People online don't know wtf they're talking about more than half the time. When in doubt, test things yourself in training mode.
@@KazanmaTheSilverWind I just did a quick test, and can confirm that there are either 9, 10, or 11 frames of throw invulnerability after blockstun in KoF 13. I would guess 10, but I'll keep testing.
It may be shorter after hitstun, wakeup, and air resets, but not by much. I have already confirmed at LEAST 6 frames of throw invulnerability after hitstun.
So yeah, MUCH longer than Guilty Gear
@@Moqlnkn I guess it's less that it's a tick throw, but Gear's ETI lets you push a strike/throw mixup quicker than in KoF. Gotcha
How alive is this game? Is it still pretty active? And will we ever get to see a kof fighter with the same kof13 design again?
The online is dead because of bad netcode, but I still play it frequently.
And no. It's too expensive to make sprites like these.
@@Moqlnkn u think if we get better net code the game would be played more than upcoming kof?
@@greenman7131 maybe. I can't see the future, though.