Obama Says "Defund Police" Hurts Democrats, Part 2 | The View
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.พ. 2025
- After former Pres. Obama spoke out saying the term hurts Democrats, the co-hosts discuss how the movement is interpreted and if opponents have given it a new meaning.
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it’s beyond refreshing to hear a constructive and respectful conversation and disagreement
Except Sunny can’t listen to anyone not even her hero Obama. She’s a basket case.
They’re not being honest. In truth when it started it was radical. SHEEPLES! WHY FDO YOU THINK PORTLAND AND SEATTLE ARE CUTTING THEIR BUDGETS BY 15 percent and higher? Because those protesters demanded it BLM said that having police to call was white privilege and since the cops weren’t anything but brutal ALLEGEDLY they would rather DEFUND completely and rebuild.
You can find the BLM crowd SAYING THIS ON TH-cam!
Ross Darnicky bro chill
I agree with Sunny all the way. This is a demand from the people following police overreach. America is becoming a police state and that needs to change.
@@rossdarnicky4949 So basically the protesters demanded it and it worked for them in those cities. Cutting a budget by 15% or more is not " defund completely". Also, I think you missed the actual point about the white privilege/calling the cops, just like Meghan did on the show before she was on leave. What they are saying is that as a white person, you can call the cops without fear they might then shoot you or in some way bring additional harm instead of helping. For example when a black business owner called cops to help protect his business from looters and they assumed he was the criminal and went to arrest him at the scene, as onlookers shouted that he was the business owner. I would also point to all the instances where white people call the police of black people BBQing, walking their dogs, selling water, waiting at Starbucks, using a private gym, etc as though the police are their own personal security team for whenever they feel slightly uncomfortable 😬
Sara is incredibly articulate.
She is a breath of fresh air compared to Me-again McCain.
@@CouldntfindaYTname true
...yet the USA had to suffer through 4 years of Trump. That's insane.
I liked how she said that she had been “excused” because of the hue of her skin. I will remember that one.
@@tyler4093 you’re absolutely right. I remember that too.
That’s why a lot of people refer to it as “police reform” instead. Much more accurate.
Defund. They get paid to protect the wealthiest materialistic things. Dimwit.
NOT LIVES 🤣
activists want more than just reform. When I hear reform I think of bandaid solutions
"police reform" has been a term for the last couple of decades. Meanwhile, cops have been getting away with murder for even longer than that.
The problem is that police reform keeps on being used and talked about for band aid measures, and therefore is not representative of a complete overhaul of the system.
@@richardmaclean7581 Looks like you're getting pretty good at copying and pasting. What will you work on next?
When Republicans say “defund Planned Parenthood” they aren’t talking about reallocating funds to make it better - they’re talking about eliminating it. No wonder “defund the police” is being interpreted as “abolish the police.” We need a better slogan!
Exactly. Defund the police started as a rallying cry to ABOLISH the police. The mayor of Minneapolis was booed off the stage, for saying "I do not support the full abolition of the Minneapolis Police Department"
What is irritating to me is that it is the job of politians to do that, come up with better talking points, slogan whatever. Instead they are publicly whining about how this hurt the party which, in my opinion does further damage to the party and is weak.
@liacashmere58 attaching themselves to democrats? What do mean like by voting for democrats? Like it or not a majority of these "far left" are a significant part of the Democratic party. Maybe democratic leaders who disagree with the messaging should take a stance and actually lead instead of blaming their perceived problems on their own voters whose bottom line is they don't want innocent people killed by police over and over again. It shouldn't be that hard.
@liacashmere58 we can agree to disagree but if the country is so squarely center/conservative as you describe, why and how was Bernie Sanders so nearly the democratic nominee (twice)? Would you rather have Trump than include progressives in the party? Because if they had all voted 3rd party as you suggest should happen, that's where we'd be right now. In my view very, very few people in the progressive wing want completely open borders or to erase sex based spaces or to completely abolish police. Those sound like right wing talking points meant to further divide us. This is part of my frustration with the obsession over defund the police and making the "far left" out to be the bad guy. It's a losing proposition. There are many shared ideals we can work towards together IMO.
As a black man I agree.
the other side weaponized it because they knew people didn't understand it.
Exactly!
I agree.
Truth 👏💯
Yes yes yes!! the right is filled with 99% idiots that believe in QAnon!
And they knew ppl would not research it..they counted on it.
Whoopie hit it on the nose !!!! She explained it very well and it's exactly what Obama is saying. Love ya Sunny, but their right.
Defund. They get paid to protect the wealthiest materialistic things.
NOT LIVES 🤣
You guys are idiots, even if they changed it now Republicans would still be dishonest about what "renaming" means lol...
Whoopi is a out of touch pro choice conservative
@@richardmaclean7581 not true.
Whoopi is right and explained it well.
I agree. Sonny seem bit upset about this Topic.
Defund - verb, prevent from continuing to receive funds.
This was a frustrating segment.
That's what the word means. It's an English word and found in the dictionary. It does not talk about rearranging money or reducing funds.
Suny is a bit too much sometimes. 🤷🏻♂️
@Matthew Porter Defund means to defund. We want to defund the police. Simple.
@@bradleyrichard yeah
Sarah is always the voice of both reason and compassion.
Yes and it’s true the last time she tried to chime into the blm debate she got told she wasn’t black so couldn’t comment
She is one of the most intelligent on the show.
She is my favorite 😊
Shes a bit too beige for me. Never has any strong views. Just sits in the middle.
@@sunseeker9581 💯
...watching Sunny miss the point for over 5 min is frustrating. She defending the language more than action. I agree with Joy. ...Still love Sunny tho...
They don’t care about the slogan. People act like these white conservatives would’ve reacted differently if it was different slogan
She just “missed the mark”
@@victoriavictoriac6011 it’s not about white conservatives because a lot of people regardless the race have missed the point. Sorry to say, but it’s about a lack of education and critical thinking skills. A lot Americans fall into that category so you need to meet them where they are at.
I think a major part of her point was that it's not as though the Democratic party came up with the slogan as a tool for winning people over. It was born out of an activist movement with an aim of changing policing, not as a way to help democrats. It is up to our politicians to explain, reframe, or take a more specific stance so as to win support. Don't expect an activist movement to consider political currency when choosing a "rallying cry" as Sunny put it. Also glossed over was the great point she made about defunding schools, which is done all the time and described that exact way, yet no one takes issue with that. I personally find defunding schools way more offensive 🤷♀️
Vernon Patrick she understood she just being stupid for no reason here
Sunny is being oddly dense on this one and she's usually my girl. If you have to EXPLAIN a slogan, it's not a good slogan. How difficult is that to understand?
Same! I don't get why she doesn't understand this as someone who has had to argue points in a court of law. You have to say it in a way that brings people to your side or at least leaves the door open for conversation.
Everyone is not as well read, informed, or aware as Sunny is. And it's almost as if she is like "oh well". Even people on the same side don't get it. I didn't get it initially. A slogan that requires this much reclarification over and over is a no go! Say what you want, but republicans win every time on messaging. Granted their base is simpler to ease bc it's not as diverse of opinion, but still ... "Lock her up" sold. MAGA will prob live on past 45. Sigh. I'm really disappointed with Sunny. If you got 3 people on your side giving you insights... just listen!
You have to explain slogans anyway, though. What does "Hope And Change" mean? How about "Yes We Can"? Or "Make America Great Again"? Those are vague with no explanation or policies attached to them, yet Americans grabbed onto them. Black Lives Matter was unpopular when it started out, yet now people understand what it means. Maybe instead of watering down activist's messages we should inform the public of what needs to be done, instead of cowering to the GOP.
I agree whole-heartedly! It isn't a good slogan if people miss the message or if you have to constantly explain what it means. Sunny's understanding it moot...we dont all having the same understanding.
Thank you!! 🙌🏾🙌🏾
@@thething1710 I disagree completely. The 3 slogans you mention did not have previous meanings incongruent to what the dictionary meaning is so it was easier to make it whatever you want. Most adults have heard the term "defund" before and it is associated with "removing" or "taking away." This is where the confusion lies.
I totally disagree with Sunny on this one!!
Sunny even said “defund the police “ means 'reallocate'. That is an admission that the slogan is bad.
No it’s not. As she pointed out they defund things all the time and people seem to understand it doesn’t mean abolish everything so why is this any different when it comes to police.
You have to explain everything so that's false equivalence.
@@tracim3080 that was for first person
🤣 right!
She also said, it means reimagine! I don’t know what dictionary she is reading from🤦🏾♀️
They always say "Sarah, you know that" or "Sarah knows this." It is demeaning and none of the other women say that to each other.
She’s clearly the one under qualified host though. She knows her spot
@@imgood3549 or the fact she has a Beta type personality and likes peace/understanding/compromise type solutions and not as combative as the other Alpha personalities on the show. Beta personalities are important to make society function and not so competitive towards other personalities ( Alphas especially) in their apporach to solutions
Girl calm down Sarah is fine. If you can’t handle the heat get out of the kitchen.
They can be dismissive of Sarah because she's more willing to be passive than the others. She goes out of her way to make her point but not offend where the others have a "I said what I said" attitude. Sarah this season is a little more willing to engage and she stands her own but it's very .... what's the word? Diplomatic? Is that the word? Might have to check me on that. I relate to Sarah in that sense. I used to be and have moments still where I can be VERY arguementative but have learned to express my thoughts in a more calm, understanding manner. Assersion without aggression if you will. People will often use this to talk over and as you see with Sarah, they do it to her a lot but I've also noticed she shuts down less, waits for a window, continues to try to make her point and fluff with her understanding of the other sides opinion.
Sunny is wrong. Expecting society to study and comprehend your insider jargon is a mistake.
It doesn’t matter what we called it. White conservatives would have misrepresented it because they have a vested interest in a system that benefits them. Defund the police started this year, but these racist mf have been bitching about BLM and kneeling for years, like they still don’t get it. It doesn’t matter. They don’t want anything to change.
The only reason Sonny's pushing that term is because Kamala Harris is pushing it. Alpha Kappa Alpha for life.
@@aris6744
That's maybe, just maybe. AKA is not monolithic.
In fact, I suspect that the Black Greek population overall is maybe more conservative than the general population.
Anyway. Sunny has stated this same position before so are you sure her sorority tells her what positions to take.
Don't get mad. Looking for rational communication here.
@@LivingWithCognitiveDissonance I am all 4 defunding the police, but after that happens, will they fund the schools, hospitals and all the other community service that is vital for living. That's why Obama is trying to warn people ahead of time, because these Republicans will play on words as evidence of today's conversation. So defund vs. allocate funds, I say allocate that way the money will be shifted not simply taken away to be made spent on unwanted projects.
@@aris6744 Yep.
As Victoria commented earlier, no matter what words liberals use to frame the issues the conservatives will reframe them.
The word "defund" sounds innocuous but it could have been replaced with... what?
Kinda like the phrase "Law and Order" where the words themselves are basically okay but liberals and conservatives receive this phrase differently.
Obama is right. Sometimes a term that gets created in a movement can’t work politically. We hate politics because we just want to say whatever and make people understand what we mean. But, Obama KNOWS the politics game and that the conversation is over way before we open our mouths. Obama can give a clinic on Politics. He is probably the most astute politician of our lifetime.
Obama defunded police already and there was a spike in crime and police response time went down and people ended wait like 2 hours for help and a lot of states started to refund their departments
No no no, 'defund' has a very specific meaning in the dictionary. 'Defund: prevent from continuing to receive funds.'
Plain and simple. It is ineffective to have a strong slogan with a fine print trying to explain what you meant by defund. Reform is a term that covers everything. Reform is a positive term. People react better to it. Both have the same endgame.
I agree with Sarah and the others. The word "defund" implies getting rid of. We all agree police is absolutely necessary in any society. I think Sunny secretly also agrees, as she suggests defund means "taking away SOME of the fund". Changing that one word would clarify a lot of things and may help getting more support from everyone.
@Dan Wruck I'm one of those people 👋🏾 f12.
Huge mistake. Defund means remove funding. It’s a distraction from the goal. Your stubbornness to not understand the perception problem is going to sink the cause. It’s plain and simple the incorrect and ineffective approach.
It doesn't matter. Protest groups are not going to be changing the term anytime soon just because a bunch of lazy blue dogs don't know how to campaign.
Defund. They get paid to protect the wealthiest materialistic things. Dimwits.
NOT LIVES 🤣
WRONG defund means defund! Duh!!!! Not remove not destroy not abolish! People dictionaries! My gosh we defund things all the time
Defend doesn't mean remove funding! We are talking about a reduction, rearranging resources into other sectors that can be more beneficial or maybe taking money from a sector of the police force to train them again, extend training courses, more money into social workers who can team up with police during crises etc.
It wont matter what they say.....the dominant group of America doesn't care what the police do to ppl of color
I completely understand Sunny’s point about not wanting to change the slogan, but I disagree. In an ideal world, the slogan would spark conversation, which would then allow the ultimate goal to be communicated. The issue is that we don’t live in a society that is willing/able to have those conversations. The words of the slogan, unfortunately, are all that are communicated. As such, they need to be clear.
Joy is entirely right in pointing out the heightened ambiguity of Defund the Police as compared to Black Lives Matter. BLM is an absolute truth that cannot be placed on a spectrum. You either believe it or you are wrong. The word “defund,” however, has a spectrum. Some can logically interpret it as removing ALL funding, where others can logically interpret it as removing SOME funding. Only the latter is a concept that I believe most logical Americans can support.
Something like Reform or Reimagine or Refine or Perfect the Police are all things that better discuss the goal. And they encompass initiatives that involve things other than funding as well.
Yep. I'm tired of having to explain it to uneducated right wing, who listen to the tea party's explanation, which is taken literally.
@@drfreud65 It is certainly frustrating when people believe the information they receive without questioning it, especially when that information often comes from a single source and/or is misinformation. But I caution against commenting on other’s education levels in a way that implies that education and intellect are synonymous. If anything, we who are fortunate enough to be educated should be the best at communicating our knowledge to those who chose a different path or can’t afford higher education. I catch myself falling into a pattern of educational elitism often, especially as those on the right demonize education. But I think we who identify as being on the left know that we don’t have to stoop to that level.
What a breathe of fresh air with these comments. Spot on Drew! Your response was very eloquent :)
@@drfreud65 Yep, and I'm tired of hearing from right wingers respond "well, if you meant 'reform the police', why didn't you say that instead of defund?"
I'm not going to dumb myself down or change how i protest to please you. People who loathe and hate your movement will make any and all excuses to lie on your exact words and message.
If i hated you, i would make every excuse to hate you. The way you talk, breathe, walk,talk, and anything else to discredit and hate on you. Keep conforming to the Republican demands like all dems do on the hour.
Love Sunny but sometimes she’s got to realize that she can’t be right on everything and actually listen to the other person. This isn’t the first time Sunny has argued with Sarah about something without actually considering her points (that she mostly agrees with)
Pegarius- I am with you here. As a black woman, Sunny thinks, she has authority on this issue.
Sunny is wrong on this one .. she is being a lawyer with word trick and. Not listening
If “defund the police” offends you then I’m sure “abolish slavery” would’ve offended you too. No questions asked..
Why is she wrong? Joy just said she had to explain BLM to her friends. Why can't explain defund the police? The prof came on the show few days ago and he didn't get push back on defund the police. No matter what u call it fox news will find a way to make it sound bad. Obama should know this, they made him giving healthcare to people toxic by naming it Obamacare. When kap knelt they made him into a criminal. Made Bernie socialist policies into Venezuela and I can go on and on. So u changing your language because of fox news is useless
@@MrCleanMachine48 There’s a huge difference. “Abolish” Slavery is accurate since the purpose is to “ABOLISH” slavery. But what’s the point of saying “defund” the police if the purpose isn’t to actually “defund” it?
I agree with Obama. When I first heard "defund the police" I thought it meant abolish the police. I had to do research to find out that it meant reallocating funds to affordable housing, job training, education, mental health counseling, substance abuse treament etc ... Not everyone is going to do that research. Plus defund the police is an aggressive slogan and even though we defund our public schools, it is not a slogan that we use.
What Sunny doesn’t get is not everyone thinks like her. If everyone is as adamant is she was here, we’ll never get anything done.
Totally agree. As an electorate, we love saying we should united and united, but how can we do that if we shut out and don't acknowledge the other side?
"Defund The Police" was EXTREMELY misleading for many many people. They simply thought it meant exactly what it says and they immediately started hating the movement because they simply didn't understand the movement.
At this point, it’s been explained and there are those that still don’t want anything to change though. No matter what it will always be met with opposition.
@@UrbanDecayLova247 Some people simply don't take the time to educate themselves. I had to convince my own brother that the "defund the police" movement did not mean eradicate the police.
As an African American lawyer and social activist, Sunny Hostin was not going to say anything negative on national TV about the "Defund the Police" slogan. However, she was not well prepared to defend it either. Her defense of the slogan was quite weak given her Notre Dame Law School education and many years as a New York City attorney. First, if you're explaining you're losing; if you have to tell people that "defund the police" does not mean what the words say, you've already lost. Her suggestion that "defund the police" is innocuous or even positive like "defund education" misrepresents the education funding debate. "Defund education" to many means further underfunding inner-city public schools and widening quality of education disparities between inner city and suburban schools. Attempts to address such disparities have used funding approaches such as having funding dollars follow the student, and vouchers to expand private/public school options. Public debate has considered whether or not to strip down teachers' unions, eliminate the federal role and thus the department of education, and whether to provide college student loan relief and free tuition at state universities. These are all controversial and unsettled.
---Sunny asserts that "Defund the Police" really means "reimagine the police" and is actually constructive for policing. This is unconvincing, and simply untrue, because the defund the police movement has been loud and clear about stripping down and even abolishing the police. We have all seen news footage of demonstrators calling for this. More importantly whether it be called "defund" or "reimagine" this movement is quite naive, unfocused and counterproductive to the needs of the very communities it seeks to help. The idea of big city mayors moving money from police to mental health and social work is quite naive and not well thought out. A mayor's charge is to protect the citizens and pick up the garbage--thus police, fire and sanitation are first priorities. By contrast, mental health and social work budgets are continually cut year after year because, politically, they are losers. Because of these cuts people with mental health problems are released to the streets every day. We all know this. Thus, if police money is moved today to mental health and social work it likely would be cut in coming years. Then you end up with a stripped-down police department but still no improvement in mental health and social services. Eventually urban communities, including those with high crime rates that the "defund police" movement is seeking to help will demand greater safety from crime. Those communities will say police don't care as long as residents in those communities are harming each other. Mayors will respond by promising to increase police presence; they may even promise to have "beat officers walk the streets like the old days." Police funding would be increased and thus this process will have gone full circle.
---The bottom line is: If you want more money for social and mental health professionals to dispatch to situations more appropriate for them than police officers you must push for that funding separately on its own merits and not at the expense of police departments. You must make mental and social work services as important as police, fire and garbage collection. This requires the difficult task of pushing for it year after year over the long term. You must turn it from a political loser to a political priority. If you can't build a movement to get this funding separately you won't be able to keep it, if it were to come from siphoning off police funding.
---Finally, how can you expect police departments to improve with less funding? You get what you pay for. Less funding means low morale and a downward spiraling organization with less innovation, less training for officers, decreased monitoring to weed out bad officers, decreased hiring of new good prospects and decreased ability to keep good officers. As in any struggling organization, the talented ones will leave; they won't put up with a downward spiraling low morale organization, lacking in innovation because their talents will enable them to pursue opportunities elsewhere. Defund police departments and you will be stuck with bottom of the barrel personal with few prospects elsewhere. What will that do to enhance quality of policing or reduce incidents of police misconduct?
Has Sunny been living under a coconut shell? People are misinterpreting the word "Defund" severely - including myself who wants to end police violence. Sunny, if you truly want to achieve the goal, then you wouldn't be so petty as to not improve/changing the messaging of a simple single word.
When you have to explain a slogan, it’s a bad slogan. President Obama is right. Sunny should listen.
Sunny is not being petty. She is 100% right. Barack Obama is an out of touch wealthy conservative Democrat. When Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. engaged in the civil rights movement many Americans were uncomfortable with the things he did and said. MLK had to continually push America to do the right thing until he was assassinated. Until “Defund the Police” and “Black Lives Matter” America was and is comfortable with the injustices meeted out against Black men and women. From Eric Garner, Treyvon Martin, Rodney King, and more, America has done nothing to remedy the problem. The police continue to dominate city budgets and become more militaristic and violent. Barack Obama was in office when Black Lives Matter was created after Trayvon Martin was murdered. He did nothing to aid that organization and has proven to be a compromiser and chief. Where ever Obama sees the flames of activism rise up he brings his proverbial wet blanket to snuff it out. I am so glad AOC, Cori Bush, Jamaal Bowman, Rashida Talieb, Ilhan Omar, and Ayanna Pressley pushed back against Barack Obama on Twitter. Barack Obama in response to a question about young leaders coming up the pike stated,”We need to get out of the way.” Take your own advice Mr. President. 🤨🤨🤨🤨
@@avalangrin4904 Too bad Biden won then. I wish you could've enjoyed 4 more years of Trump.
@@Raja1938 WOW!!! How simple-minded you must be to assume I am a Trump supporter. I unfortunately cast my vote for Biden to get rid of Trump knowing that a Biden administration would do absolutely NOTHING for the middle class and poor. I am being proven right with each new corporate schill added to Biden’s cabinet. Speaking of Trump, here’s a prediction. The Democrats will loose the House in 2022, and then in 2024 either Trump or a Trump-like figure (but smarter) will win over the millions Americans who are disenfranchised economically by the Biden administration with a populist message that he or she will drain the swamp in D.C. 🤨🤨🤨🤨
@@avalangrin4904 Never accused you of being a Trump supporter. However, since you think Obama was such a disaster and that Biden would be no better, then Trump couldn't have been any worse right? Anyway, I'm sure none of your dire predictions for future elections will come to pass as long as we keep steadfast to the slogan at the expense of everything else.
People knew what “abolish slavery” meant. If you ask the opponents what defund the police means, they don’t understand.
@Laxpint you have a point. Whoopi, Joy, Sara and Sonny did a great job on this Topic. My question is why is Sonny seem a bit upset.
2:29
And slavery and Jim Crow aren’t necessary to civilisation. Law enforcement is.
That's because they only have the dictionary to rely on for what English words mean.
....you do know people called abolitionists extremist back then too, right?
@@Anakim416
A world without slavery and Jim Crow is possible
. A world without law enforcement is not. (Unless you want to re-instate modern militias)
Defund= prevent from continuing to recover funds
Again sunny is just angry and refuses to listen to logic. If you have to keep explaining a slogan it’s not a good one. And then if you can distort a message get rid of it
DEFINITION OF DEFUND: ‘Prevent from continuing to receive funds’. It doesn’t mean reallocate funds. Sunny is that person that would rather stand her ground and make things more complicated for others in the name of a movement than focus on messaging so more can tag along. It’s like saying, kill the president, but what we really mean is get him out of office. Like...... really Sunny? We don’t have time for this movement to get lost in translation. BLM will fade because of this. She is one very stubborn human.
Facts
The word Defund means to prevent from continuing to receive payments. It doesn't not mean reallocation. Sunny you are wrong here.
So isn’t threatening to cut someone’s cash flow an effective way of forcing them to the table? Money speaks in America. So defunding the police means exactly what it says. If people have a problem with that, then just say that rather than trying to redefine what a movement’s goal is to for your personal political strategy
@@amazing625 Based on the outcome of seats lost in key elections, threatening to cut off cash to the police was not effective.
@@GG_11_11 do you have any polling evidence that shows that police protection is the number one voting issue that determined the vote in those areas?
@@amazing625 I have not seen the actual raw polling data but credible publications have reported this to be the case. It depends on whether you trust the reporting institutions, which on this matter I do. It is also logical and in alignment with human psychology, a human seeks basic needs such as safety to exist, therefore if a person feels unsafe they will seek to fulfill that need before moving on to higher order goals. Google "Maslow Hierarchy of Needs", it will lay this out. An organization or movement may have the right intent in theory but if it fails to recognize and address basic human psychology it will fail, every time. We would like to think of ourselves as evolved beings but we are not. Humans are part of the animal kingdom and often act irrationally and from a place of emotion or self interest due to survival instincts. Until we realize and try to work to overcome our selfish nature we will continue to make poor decisions as a collective. Hope this helps 🙏
Defund: "to remove funding from"
To reallocate funds, you need to first remove funding from.
Sunny you’re wrong, period. The outcome is more important than a slogan.
So completely wrong. Thank god people will listen to President Obama over Sunny.
Exactly and she knows it her ego won’t let her let it go
OMG SUNNY! I'm sorry, but you are wrong my love!!! When you have to CONSTANTLY explain "Defund the Police" it means the slogan is NOT working!!!
I love sunny, but she is wrong on this one.
No she isn't. Obama is being clownish.
Protect and serve themselves are you? You pay for it.
@@ThatWTVGuy
Obama is stirring the ambers
I agree she is. She's not getting what Obama said. As soon as someone says Defund the Police, ears are shut, theyre not interested in what the actual message is.
@@courtney2262 exactly..
Why is Sunny so stubborn about this? "Defund the police" isn't an accurate representation of the argument - it was a bad choice of words to run with. The others are right - it *is* confusing. No one is criticizing the idea of police reform or re-allocating funds, but "defund" means exactly that - no more money for the police. That's impractical and not what anyone wants.
Sunny? today she was cloudy skies... Sara ate her up and I didn't like Sunny's attitude towards her, she wasn't dismissing her points she was just stating slogans need to be reimagined.
Her energy toward Sara was a bit condescending... NOT a good look. Sara stood her ground. Good for her.
@@roots4140 I'm glad Sara stood her ground. I'm tired of Sunnys condescending attitude and posturing go without pushback. She needs to be reminded that we don't live in her utopia.
Well explained Whoopi! Very well explained!
Sorry Sunny you're wrong on this one lady.
He’s right tho. Mad people loss seats because of that slogan.
This is just flat out wrong. Do a quick google search to find out for yourself who lost because of Defund the Police. I will be waiting for you to come back and apologize for the miss information you just spread.
@Michael Santarini not true. Not sure why people choose to live in ignorance. The facts are not hard to find. The fact is people who embraced defund the police actually won. Look it up. Don’t take my word for it.
@@CriPPleR_HD this is a bad slogan...no one in their right mind would support defunding policing in any part of the world. Invest in smart marketing rather than being loud mouth
@@gatech5190 I would rather defund the police instead of paying officers to kill unarmed POC while good cops standby and watch and do nothing.
@@Mzisha89 like I said try to come up with a better language for your ideas, no one even with good intentions would agree for defunding a pillar of society whose job is to keep that society civil.
President Obama is right. Defund the police sounds radical to people who do not want to look at the nuanced meaning. Reform or reimagine the police, is a better slogan.
Police Reform is the best word to use...because that is what it actually it means.
"Reform" isn't really specific enough though, given the textbook definition
@@worldof2ndfluteclarinet353 // Does it have to be?
@@Justusson None of these words really have to be per se, however since we're now having to come up w/ new terms to describe what was already implied (at least I thought so), it has now become necessary to point things out like this for every new descriptor we bring up.
@@worldof2ndfluteclarinet353 // Americans still doesn’t know what ACA stands for. I think it’s better to be abstract then, because then it becomes harder to pin it as bad at least. Sure, allocation is what I think they should have gone with, but clearly the American people, unfortunately, often are unknowledgeable. Just look at Trump - 73millions still voted for him! So, I don’t think it would have helped to be specific. People just don’t care about the truth, they just want to see things burn,..
@Dan Wruck “Cut Police Budget” would be the absolute best we can go with, since we strictly have to go by textbook definitions here.
Sunny seriously come up off of it. I’m a Gay black male, that has grown up in Detroit, MI AND has dealt with police brutality and harassment. “Defunding the Police” is NOT the best describe “Police Reform”. My military brother had to explain what “defund the police” meant to me when I heard it and was ENRAGED, because I did think that meant get rid of the police. Sunny come out your feelings.
Sunny is on fire! everything she said is true! haven't been this happy with a View co-host in years
The truth is - there are MANY police abolitionists that openly state that Defund the Police DOES mean abolish the police. There are many Defund the police advocates who also say that it DOES mean abolish the police. If the folks IN the movement don't agree what it means.... come on now..
Sunny just does NOT like to admit when she might be wrong.
Glad someone else notices.
It’s called an opinion panel she kept defending it so she believes that she’s right it’s not about admitting that you’re wrong how can you do that when know and believe in your opinion and they’re many right and wrongs about this topic.
@@khaloodh58 it's not that deep. BTW, I'm allowed to have my opinion and based on your post, you shouldn't reprimand me for mine. ✌
Sara is actually my favorite. Meghan made Sunny look better than she actually is when she was around. Go Sara!
Sarah is so naive to me
I disagree. Meghan did not make Sunny look better. She may be stubborn on this one issue but she is great with law and they need that, too.
Wow Sunny is egregiously stubborn on this issue!
Well she’s right! The phrase itself is not the issue, a bigger problem is that liberals in power are too critical of their own base. You gotta embrace the base despite the controversy or else the other side will divide and conquer
It disagree but appreciate her passion
She is right!!!!
@@Hey-xg8gb you gotta bring people into the conversation..your not doing that by saying defund the police..its a stupid slogan..and depend on who you ask they tell you a bunch of different meanings..that's bad
She’s not being stubborn at all she’s passionate in her approach. And absolutely correct. Get with it!
Typically Sunny has no problem interrupting and challenging Sara's opinion until Sara says "she has formerly been "excused" from the conversation bc of the hue of her skin". Sunny doubles down on poor messaging that hurt the party that supports change by MAKING POLICE ACCOUNTABLE ,, Poor messaging and poor rally cries are not just ineffective but detrimental to any cause. But Sonny doubles down again and again when she is schooled by the entire panel.
if you have to explain something three times when making a sale you've lost the sale
THAAANK YOUUU!!!
You’re talking about it… KKK
Branding matters. Bad cops. Really Bad cops.
Defund. They get paid to protect the wealthiest materialistic things. Dimwits.
NOT LIVES 🤣
@F D KKK
You’re talking about it…
Branding matters. Bad cops. Really Bad cops.
Defund. They get paid to protect the wealthiest materialistic things. Dimwits.
NOT LIVES 🤣
Yeah that’s why you gotta stick with your guns and move on. No matter what you say, the other side will twist it to something you are not. Remember when they would call Obama a socialist? and that was way before Bernie and AOC were popular
So "Black Lives Matter" sucked because Joy, by her admission, needed to explain it to another liberal?
I'm gonna put this in CAPs so that it's clear.
A GOOD SLOGAN SHOULD NOT NEED AN EXPLANATION.
Defund the police is not only just bad messaging, it's also innacurate.
Sunny is wrong, if you can't change minds then it doesn't matter.
Woo.
Not everyone is willing to change
You can’t force someone to change,. They have to do that themselves
If a slogan needs to be explained the slogan is not effective period. Abolish Slavery left no doubt. Those who opposed it knew exactly what they were opposing. Defund the police means abolish the police. Black Lives matter "TOO" would have been a clear & undeniable message that people hearing it could agree to or oppose. Clarity is key in getting a message across. If people who support the cause are confused by the message before you get out of the gate, how can you win over those opposing the cause? Sure Sunny, people "should" inform themselves about the grievances which sparked a slogan but if they did that the need for the movement would not be as pressing.
I see what Sonny is fighting for but because of how dilute people’s maturity has been for the past 4 years, even if you explain it, they chose to believe what they want. So you have to literally name and state things on the surface. If “Defund the Police” sends a confusing message then change it.
“Make America Great Again” brought forth the same level of confusion because it was never great for everyone. “Defund the police” most of the time says to get rid of police for people who aren’t affected by police brutality (from my experience). There has to be a better line of communication.
the issue here is Trump and Trumplican party everytime we speak up against something they take words out of context and uses it for propaganda
Branding matters. Bad cops. Really Bad cops.
Defund. They get paid to protect the wealthiest materialistic things. Dimwits.
NOT LIVES 🤣
@@willywallie48. Blm is a terrorist group!resisting arrest has consequences
@@randycouch2769 KKK
You must be a fan of Timothy McVeigh
@@randycouch2769
Republicans are traitors and murderers and terrorists and kidnappers of Democrat governors KKK
Defund is a negative term. President Obama is on point.
How on earth can Sonny not understand the issue with that slogan 🙄
She does understand. She's pretending like she doesn't.
Branding matters. Bad cops. Really Bad cops.
Defund. They get paid to protect the wealthiest materialistic things. Dimwits.
NOT LIVES 🤣
I swear this is like yanny/laurel because it made perfect sense to me
Did Sunny fall down and hit her head or something before this segment? She's being almost willfully dense here and completely contradicting herself. She is literally explaining why the opposing view is right, even though she claims to disagree with it
Defund: “prevent from continuing to receive funds”
Right..and that isn't what they mean. They mean use the funds given in better training.
@@jenbk2bk275 hence the reason they should never have made it the slogan since anyone who actually knows the what the word means or checks a dictionary will see it means completely something different. Reform Police would have been better... Also there are people in the Defund Police who have said clearly they believe it means "abolish the police.. while others mean no reallocate funding.. thats the problem. Don't choose a word that doesn't accurately present the idea and the fact even in the movement people are in disagreement with what "exactly" Defund means
@@jenbk2bk275 definitely agree with you. That isn’t the intent behind the slogan. However it’s misleading and gives people a reason to boycott the idea of reallocation, which is frustrating!
Um we should be preventing the police from continuing to receive funds though. Their budgets have only been increasing. If it makes you uncomfortable that people want to stop that increased flow of money in order for them to meet our demands, then the slogan isn’t wrong here. It’s you that has a problem with the proposal
@@amazing625 To be less racist and be less inclined to use violence unnecessarily, the police need better recruiment policies and a better and longer education. And for that, *more* funds are needed, not less....
“Defund the police” was clear from the beginning. It meant ABOLISH the police. The Mayor of Minneapolis was booed out of a rally for saying, "I do not support the full abolition of the Minneapolis Police Department".
saying “people don’t really understand what it means” is gaslighting
I agree with sara... messaging is important. Sunny is right too messaging has not always been accepted across history.
Sunny girl its ok to say Defund Police is not a good slogan. I'm glad the other hosts understand that the messaging of it isn't getting across.
I don’t agree with Sunny, but I take it with a pinch of salt because; Any “slogans” put out by Republicans or Democrats will be inadvertently be twisted by the opposing political wing.
They may be twisted by the other side, but you don't have to make it easy for them!
Raja1938 yes I agree with you. That is why I did not agree with Sunny.
The gas lighting is annoying here. Defund the police has been interpreted by many to mean the complete defunding, or effectively the abolishment, of the police department for good reason. It was the slogan used by activists who outright supported the abolishment of the police department. The definition of “defund” means to withdraw funding. If you mean a PARTIAL defunding and a reallocation of funds then this slogan is worded poorly and it’s gas lighting to tell people they are misunderstanding the meaning when the words you are using don’t mean what you say they mean. The problem here is that people who are straddling the fence between far left and center left are trying to change the meaning of true progressive’s words to make them more “palatable.” They don’t want to acknowledge any ideological differences within the Democratic Party.
Sunny.....you are really reaching. There is a much better wording than DEFUND THE POLICE. Defund is a stupid wording.
It’s not stupid wording because part of defund the police is defunding. The police departments don’t need twice as much money as public schools get. Defund the police would be taking away unnecessary MILITARY equipment, would lessen the police caseload but allowing designated social workers and addiction specialists to go and answer calls when safe. It’s not stupid wording because it’s getting talked about🤷🏼♂️
Demand
Protect and to serve… Themselves
@@jonnyt6556
Demand that they protect and serve as they’re supposed to for y’all’s taxpaying dollars
No it’s not. They get paid to protect the wealthiest materialistic things. Dimwit.
NOT LIVES 🤣
I think people need to worry more about the message and less about the wording because while we're here arguing about it, there's innocent people dying at the hands at the police. This is an emergency and we don't have the time to be fighting over semantics.
Not everyone is willing to listen to the explanation that is why changing the language could help.
You’re talking about it…
Branding matters. Bad cops. Really Bad cops.
Defund. They get paid to protect the wealthiest materialistic things. Dimwits.
NOT LIVES 🤣
So just because they don't understand we have to dumb it down? Or y'all can do the homework
If no one is willing to listen to explanations then that means that no slogan will work on them anyway
NEGATIVE. Even if they changed the slogan Republicans would still gas light and call them liars, it's a waste of time, just quit being lazy and *listen to what they mean* the slogan is to get your attention, now it's on you to hear them out.
@@mroctober3583 they just don't care about the movement. I swear they did the same thing with Black lives matter 4 years ago
Abolish slavery is what the phrase is ... Defund the police is not really asking for defunding the police ... Faulty comparison
Down Sunny...they are right!
What is wrong with reform the police. Defund the police makes no exception. The word prefix “de” means to negate. It doesn’t make exceptions, Sunny. Quit being stubborn
Sunny should move out of her gated mansion and into a bad neighborhood. We'll see how she feels about defunding the police
Define a bad neighborhood.
97% of crimes are never solved so exactly what are you talking about. Increasing police spending has NEVER lead to safer communities. Cops are just as incompetent at best and dangerous at worst as they've always been.
She came from a bad neighbourhood.
No one in bad neighborhoods trust that police will help them though lol are you not paying attention. That’s the whole point of blm
@@volcrazy89 Wouldn't that mean we need more police? Rather than "defunding"
Sunny you are WRONG. That fact that YOU think that YOU know better than OBAMA is INSANE. GURL BYE !!!
English is not my first language, and I understood what defund means.
Sorry Sonny, "defund the police" is not a good slogan. Defund and police, don't go togther. The messaging is not clear. The Democrats always have a problem with messaging.
I completely agree with Sunny on this
Defund is the worst "popular" slogan for police reform I've ever heard. I had to put a "Back the Blue" next to my Biden/Harris sign just to clear up the confusion... We need to build support and add voices to the cause of police reform --not give closed minded types rally cry's.
1. Sunny needs to listen for understanding not listen to respond. Active Listening 101. It tries me crazy
Sonny is not getting it I’m a 24 year old black man I run in with the law more than most and I never been in trouble with the law except being mistreated twice for them thinking I was someone else I been harassed and I completely get what Obama is saying still the term is easy to manipulate if we instead had of said “refund the community” (which is what it actually mean) then they can’t manipulate that slogan and if republicans tried it’ll just make them look like fools even to their audience what Sonny has to realize is we got the power of the people but not the the power of the lawmakers (Congress) who could make those changes and in order to make those changes you have to give them a change of heart and the only way to do that is to give them the ideas in a way to please their ears because How many black or Latino senators have power? Answer: not enough! So for the people who work with the police who have police as family members and are uneducated in the black plight they have to be taught by us carefully but first we have to get them to unlearn their ways and the term “defund the police” sounds good to me and people like me but we understand the meaning for them they only hear take away the funds no matter what else you do after you take them or not you still taking them C’mon Sonny and others we all in the same fight but the tactic has to work that’s all Obama is saying.
Clear communication matter Sonny you are not always right none of us are always right.
I'm with Sunny, don't allow opponents to define a movement. I don't think it would matter what they called it, people would have a problem with it and take it out of context. Eventually it would be so watered down that it would lose its meaning and purpose. A lot of people are being deliberately obtuse. They know exactly what it means, and if they don't they can do some research.
Sonny is being stubborn just to make a point. Also, she was just a tad condescending towards Sarah, which was seriously uncool.
Rix, totally agree with you! I tune her out at this point because she acts as if she's always right and everyone who doesn't align with her is wrong. It's called The View for a reason!
Nothing wrong with her being stubborn and I don’t see her condescending at all. She is passionate and this subject obviously means a lot to her.
@@Mint2842 That's the impression I got from the defund crowd: you're either with them or against them when discussing the slogan/mandate/policy.
@@Smartkid2387 I never said there was anything wrong with holding your ground. I have a problem however when you blatantly refuse to see the other side because you think you're better than everyone else.
@@colormeturquoise1 me too! We enjoy flirting with being unified and united, but how can we accomplish that if we don't compromise?
Sunny was really wrong on this one. Instead of wasting time trying to explain what it actually means, why not say "reform the police" and get to actually doing it? People got scared because they thought it means "remove the police" - I thought the same thing until I did some research. But A LOT of people just hear it and take it at face value, they don't bother looking into it, so they're not going to agree with it. So use words that actually mean what you intend to do, cause "defund" ain't it!
Sunny is always so stubborn it's like when everyone else speaks with any opposing opinion she just goes "lalala" in her head.
I agree with your statement. She thinks what she thinks and that's it. She's not going to change her mind or even try to grasp what the others are trying to tell her. It's frustrating at times with her.
They all do that.
I support badly-needed police reforms but defund the police slogan is not working- I agree with President Obama and Joy.
I love how Sarah really gets her point across intelligently and thoughtfully ! You can tell she really takes the time to deliver her argument in a concise fashion.
I usually agree with Sunny but she is so wrong on this issue. Defund was not the right word. Your circle of friends might understand the real meaning without an explanation, but the majority of the country does not. If you want to appeal to everyone, you might need to change the word.
I admire sunny for having the courage to defend her statements despite the pushback from the other cohosts because she typically didn't in the past. She has grown.
She is being stubborn like Meghan here. How is that growth?
If people have to explain what a slogan means constantly, it is not a good slogan. If the same side is confused, opposition will never understand. Defund the police is a terrible slogan. Re imagine the police is great.
I can’t believe how stubborn Sunny is being!
She has become so extreme in her thinking. It's so annoying.
Well she's stuck in this for the time being. I'm just going to excuse her for it. She's usually right on.
@@evelynshannon4831 No she isn't...
Sunny has chosen this hill to die on. Not the underlying issue, but just a stupid slogan that she apparently loves to waste time explaining to people.
She’s right though. She’s standing by what she believes and she has that right
This Sunny woman is a very difficult person. The defunding the police messaging is wrong. To anyone who is not very deep into these issues,when you hear defund the police you will think they mean get rid of the police.If you think you can explain what you really mean to 300 million Americans,then good luck with that!
This kind of thoughtful conversation NEVER coukd have happened with McCain on the show. I know she's coming back but I have certainly enjoyed watching The View again.
I am usually a fan of Sunny, but Sunny is WRONG on the phrase ‘defund the police.”The phrase is polarizing in the extreme and led to great candidates like Jamie Harrison being defeated. How about a compromise so that positive improvements can actually happen instead of stubbornly sticking to your position like the Tea party types, Sunny?
Hahahaaaaa.....!! I just can't stop laughing. I predicted this was going to happen months ago when these ladies first discussed this issue and they were all on the same side against Megan McCain. But as soon as she said "If you have to explain it, you're losing", I realized this was going to happen. I can just picture Megan McCain at home right now laughing at this and I'm going to continue laughing too. 😂😂😂
Republicans always need someone to explain something to them, yet they have no problem fighting against something they need an explanation of.
Tanisha Cox Well, this is exactly what I'm talking about. Anything Democrats say doesn't make sense just like your statement.
Sorry Sunny, but you're wrong in this case. I agree with Obama. The fact that you had to have a 10 or 15 minutes debate about the slogan, is further proof that it's not a good slogan. If you're explaining, you're losing. Do you want to argue back and forth about a slogan or do you want to get the work done. It's ridiculous that some Democrats don't get it. Everything is marketing, and the slogan defund the police is not a good marketing slogan. Stop trying to be so righteous and be practical about what's going to help us get a handle on police reform, so that people can stop being senselessly murdered. Jesus!
I never thought I’d disagree with Sunny. But it happened 😔 messaging matters and I think the slogan just doesn’t work since the right has used it to confuse and scare people.
Sunny is not getting it. When you have to explain a slogan it’s bad. Reallocate, reappropriate, reimagine funding and structure to better the police for both the police and the public would be more accurate. Whomever came up with defund the police simply created confusion. It literally translates to taking money away from.
" DEFUND THE POLICE" THOSE WORDS SCARE PEOPLE , YOU HAVE TO BE MORE SPECIFIC PEOPLE NEED TO BE WALKED , SLOWLY THROUGH THE MEANING
The defund crowd is unwilling to compromise. And some of them actually mean defund to dismantle. The message is inconsistent. I'm kinda over it at this point. I've been called too many names for stating the same thing. Maybe the movement doesn't need allies and people to accomplish their goals.
Exactly, because we grew up learning vocabulary words using the dictionary and that word means to prevent or stop funding.
Let them be scared. Change doesn’t happen very easily in America. Eventually Americans hop on board. We shouldn’t side step our values to appease anyone. That’s not how radical change comes about. Stand your ground, eventually the tide will turn in your favor. Nothing that’s worth it comes easy or without pushback.
I'm sorry Sunny is wrong. It is not opponents saying to change it. It is people that agree with reallocate money for police departments. Defunding means defunding. She's being ridiculous.
Sunny is way off base here. She just doesn't get it. Joy's explanation was spot on.
Sunny is totally wrong.
Well she is a supporter of cancel culture. It should be no confusion as to why she believes that she is correct on this matter when she supports a lot of regressive policies herself.
She's been in her bubble too long
We’re talking about it…
Branding matters. Bad cops. Really Bad cops.
Defund. They get paid to protect the wealthiest materialistic things. Dimwits.
NOT LIVES 🤣
Joy proved Sunny's point lmaoooooo
WHOOPI is absolutely correct about the narrative!!! I don't understand why Sunny is so adament!!
I don't get how Sunny didn't understand what they were saying
Sunny does not like to be wrong or challenged on her opinion
More like they didn't understand what SHE was saying. Telling someone how to protest, speak, or talk because it scares them.
Defund is a wrong term. You need a better term. You need a better slogan. Get over it sunny.