Wow! this is the absolute best explanation of demon Ti that I have come across yet. People always bring up demon Ti is someone who is completely illogical. In real life, I find that those with demon Ti are often very capable of being logical, especially on an academic level. It is far more about stepping back in social situations and objectively holding up requests in the light of your own personal principles and needs. As a dominant Fe user, I find this is as difficult as using my non-dominant hand. And yes, we constantly worry about whether people think we are stupid or not.
Well as a Ni-dom that has suffered from neglecting my Se this makes sense as Fe/Ti work together just like my own Ni/Se work together as a team. They're supposed to help each other out so just like my Se is supposed to put my Ni plans into action (and let me as an NJ learn to relax a bit) but my neglect of Se has caused even my Ni to suffer. So it makes sense that your own Fe ultimately suffers from ignoring your Ti too much despite the fact that it's all your Fe's fault in the first place. Also the way you described demon Ti, you're making the mistake I suspect a whole bunch of people do: forgetting that the inferior function is one of your favoured/valued functions. Te is one of your unloved and uncared for functions not Ti.
It's funny, that as an INTP, I totally relate to Barbara's bully problem. I often have that same feeling, that I'm up against some big bully and I feel like I'm back in the schoolyard again. It's just that my Ti always gave me that stubbornness to keep going. I still have that fragile little Fe crying in the corner, because somebody was mean to me, but there's also my Ti screaming way louder like "FUCK YOU, IMMA DO IT ANYWAY!" I don't lose my confidence, I kind of gain confidence, because I can tell myself that I am better than that asshole and that gives me the drive to keep going. But on the outside I'm still Fe hiding away. I guess that's also a lack of confidence, but in a different way. It's more like I have confidence in myself, but I'm just simply afraid of other people. They don't affect me on such a personal level, but they do deeply anger me.
In most school systems, dyslexic kids are still being called dumb, still being bullied and still thought as a nuisance/problem by teachers and admins. THINGS HAVE NOT CHANGED MUCH AT ALL.
@@Cucababy5 Because it's not the purpose of the video- You're doing her a DISERVICE by demonstrating that your take home message for the video is... that Shannon is pretty (well durr I have eyes too). Ya how you like that Ti reason? saviour Fe. - I love your Fe response... "You don't have the same tribe values as me... therefore you don't' count. Bravo!
@M Muss @HyperDrive dude, ever heard of a compliment. Fans leave random complements on a TH-cam channel's videos all the time. Stuff like "x person is so beautiful" usually wemon but even men get these nice comments from time to time. Why would, this video be such a special case?
As a demon ti trying to build it everyday so I am less reliant on my fe, dyslexia was a big part of my childhood so I feel this struggle. Thank you for putting out this content.
She's totally right, you have to take other people's negative energy and transform that energy into something positive... use it to rise above. Other people want to bring you down so they can stand on your shoulders and call themselves tall. I can recall one situation where someone was mocking my ideas and trying to prove her ideas were better, so I said to myself, thank you for that boost of energy you just gave me, psychopath. And used it to win the day. Needless to say, I had her eating her words and congratulating me at the end of the day.
It blew my mind to hear you talk about that at the end. Propping up a "fake" persona to cover your ass - this is exactly the revelation I had about myself just last year as I processed y'all's reading. It was starting to disrupt my life, big time. I've stopped starving my "original" self and started attempting to "parent" it and the initial results are very exciting.
I've found that there are two types of ExFJs. On one hand, you have these super empathetic awesome people, who you can always count on. On the other hand, you have those who act nice on the outside, but actually are manipulative shit-stirrers. I think it has to do with that "hero's journey" that Dave mentions so often. The empathetic ExFJ has gone through hell and gained complete control over their demons, which gives them that Ti drive and a sort of wisdom that doesn't really happen with other types. While the manipulative ExFJ didn't go through all that and their Ti is still this extremely fragile thing nobody must touch. One has made peace with themselves and knows how to roll with the punches, while the other interprets any minor transgression as a personal insult and will go ballistic if their empathetic facade gets challenged. I see it a lot with old people. It's always the ones who have many stories about people telling them how good people they are. It is way too easy to get on their bad sides and will blame you for it, even if you've done literally nothing. It's like your mere personality is insulting to them.
you're speaking as if you would've looked inside my soul or some shit.. ENTP here and I'm having *major* issues with my grandma. She's a 90 year old ESFJ and definitely on the "manipulative-shit-stirrers" side of the spectrum. I'm trying really hard not to blame her since she has experienced WW2 in it's fullest so it that sense she has gone through hell, but she is still running from it instead of facing her demons inside. And it's not only me having these issues, my ENTP uncle has *exactly the same* issues as me. Btw: I'm not the one having the issues, I'm only having issues because she is having them. I generally value my piece of mind, "live and let live" is my motto, but it is not possible with her. At all. So if you're also an ENTP out there having problems with your ESFJ grandma, well, you're not alone. Some random stranger on probably the other side of the planet has them aswell.
ENFJ here. I've been both of what you described, and, from my experience, I'd say the difference is how the EXFJ views the tribe. Lead Fe means you start off as what you view as a considerate idealist. You follow the golden rule (Ti supporting Fe) even when the situation doesn't call for it since not everyone wants to be treated the way you want to be treated. You run into several people in life who think short term and aren't considerate of other people, and Ti becomes pessimistic and thinks, "Oh, the tribe isn't what I thought it was. I can't believe how dumb I was. These are the (Ti) rules everyone else seems to be following that I should follow too if I want to protect myself/interests. I have to look out for myself because other people won't be there for me either because they're selfish or because they're dumb." From experience, I can tell you that an EXFJ who's thinking like that isn't happy on the inside and doesn't feel fulfilled regardless of what they think on the surface. You only break out of the line of thinking when you think, "Is this who I really want to be?" An EXFJ can break the cycle by deciding to be the greater fool and leading by example. He/She has to decide that they would rather actualize into the person they want to be than protect themselves from further harm. You decide to be a "good person" regardless of whether that means being burned again. (Still EXFJs learn from past experiences like everyone else, so they're not going to do something they know will have a bad outcome.) Ti can be stubborn and aggressive, but it can be reasoned with. Just ask a pessimistic EXFJ, "Is this who you want to be?" or "Is that line of thinking making you happy?" Regardless of that they say in the moment, he/she will probably stew on what you said until they change his/her mind. Guilt is a powerful weapon against lead Fe. The hero's journey for EXFJ's is: being the change you want to see in the world/choosing to make decisions because they're consistent with you you want to be; knowing your limits, accepting your flaws, and building on your strengths so that you have something valuable to give; realizing that trying to help when you aren't asked directly by the person who needs it may cause more harm than good; and being patient with and accepting of people for who they are, even when you feel/know they'll make what you consider to be poor decisions. Lead Fe can be really helpful in life, but it can also be a tremendous personal burden to feel what someone else is feeling. If another person's negative emotion doesn't feel like it will ever be resolved, a lead Fe user will choose to shut it off to maintain his or her own sanity-- Even someone with lead Fe can become very cold. At the end of the day, lead Fe wants everyone to feel good, but it won't work properly if it thinks being empathetic or being selfless is the dumb thing to do--for the user, for the individual it want to help, or for the tribe at large. On the sensitive Ti point-- EXFJs can come to enjoy being challenged if they see it as constructive or beneficial towards accomplishing their goals. Lack of confidence in Ti means we usually seek external validation for Ti anyway. Life experience (of being correct when everyone else disagreed or thought you were wrong) and repeated challenges can build an EXFJ's confidence in their own thinking. Other EXFJs can chime in if they think differently.
You might be onto something. As far as I can tell, these manipulative ExFJs exhibit signs of straight narcissism. As in, extreme self-doubt, that reflects as aggression on the outside. It's probably that Ti demon self-doubt that the channel has touched up on already. I described it as fragile, because of the things I have seen it being set off by. As an INTP, I probably come off as very cold, but certain ExFJs can see through that and see that teeny tiny Fe I'm hiding. But when a narcissistic ExFJ is faced with it, they get confused. Confusion leads to self-doubt, self-doubt leads to anger and now they hate me and I didn't even have to do anything. I have seen this happen multiple times now. Honestly, it's really annoying. An angry ESFJ can really push you down on the social ladder and they won't admit they're doing it. Because that'd be morally objectionable and they're the paragon of morality. They'll twist your words, rewrite what happened, straight up lie and become extremely exhausting to deal with. And you didn't even have to do anything.
@@JesterOfDestiny I don't have much to go on based on your experiences, but here's my guess based on my own-- You're dealing with people who lack self awareness and who project their own thinking onto your behaviors. Unconsciously, EXFJs don't like cold behavior/attitudes because: (1) coldness = being mean or cruel and hurts the positive feeling atmosphere of the tribe; (2) warmth and positivity = wanting to contribute to the tribe; and (3) (young) EXFJs are only cold when they're unhappy/tired/mean (later in life, it can be seen neutrally as a necessity). If you're correcting an EXFJ and they don't trust your intentions because of your body language, because they're being called out publicly in a way that doesn't feel constructive, etc., they will want to make things even (Ti) by getting back in some way. That can be proving you wrong (possibly constructively) or taking you down a peg to protect themselves socially. Yes, it can be dumb, but trust must come before advice/help/information, regardless of type. When EXFJs learn people process things differently than they do and display emotions differently and for different reasons, they become less suspicious of intentions and more accepting of people. INTPs and ESFJs may always struggle to see eye-to-eye, but at least you can figure out appropriate boundaries and find a way to see value in what they bring, even if you don't need it.
I think my mom is like this. She calls people EVREY DAY to check what how they are feeling today. Not just children friends, family, distant relatives, and neighbors. It's her superpower.
I can really relate to this. Like Barbara, I was teased severely in school. In my case, it was because I was fat. I still have confidence issues as an adult and definitely have that Savior Fe/Demon Ti combo. If I don’t feel appreciated or am engaged by the tribe, I feel stupid or worthless. Now to figure out the middle two. 🙃
I remember being stupid at school. From middle to high school I had trouble with maths. I really wanted to understand addition and algebra but my brain just said no. From learning about learning I now do a drip drip approach to some stuff like computer programming.
i’ve found that my sister is an ENFJ and my poking at her demon Ti has sparked a lot of insecurities. it’s hard because i’d think ‘well that’s their problem if they’re gonna take it personally’, but i just kept getting these repetitive tidal waves of “you’re being so mean to everyone and now no one wants to be around you”. pretty much a wake up call.
Oh okay, so this says a LOT. I didn't know that Te also means caring about people... I always thought that was Fe. I'm definitely lead Te. The best example I remember would be that only a few months ago, my friend was sad and emotional about his fatty liver problem and I remember that I felt bad about it, so I helped him entirely with the logic side of it. Go see a doctor, ask him about how long it will take to be cured, is an operation necessary, why haven't the meds made much of a difference, what is the cause of this, etc... And I couldn't fake myself into comforting him, so I handled the side I'm good at. I couldn't express my emotions empathetically, so I helped him about with his problem. There are several such instances. I'm not good at patting a person on the back and tell them it'll work out, but I will actually help them work it out. And all of this at the cost of my own needs and wants. I'm saviour Te for sure.
In Rocketman movie, in one of the final scenes, Elton John hugs his child-self in rehab. This video reminded me of that scene. In the movie, Elton wanted to be hugged by his father but never got that. And maybe that's why he tried to get attention from outside (public) through various ways. He finally hugs his child-self and becomes better.
This is such a wholesome video guys. Also Dave I remember in you're te vs ti video you mentioned how ti is more aggressive than te. Do you still stand by that claim ?? If so is that why Barbara with her demon ti has such a driving force ?
@@SekRanger Technically, I know this. I suppose it comes from one extraverted function leading to the introverted function and the two getting mixed up in my head.
Well... look on the bright side: your mind only really cares about using one of those introverted Judging functions. So you only really have to work on one of them and ignore the other. See right there? I've just doubled your productivity. You're welcome! :p
Kevin Paterson not 💯 % but I think it turns one into a narcissist. If you’re really interested there’s a channel called gerlach. He was a therapist that specialized in family systems therapy, and talks about healing the child self. He has since past away, but he knew he was terminal, and posted a series of educational videos on the subject beforehand.
I was officially tyoed SiTe ISTJ by Dave and Shannon. I'm still very sensitive to insults on my intelligence both real and perceived. So I think it can affect multiple types not just Ti demon.
I watched you get typed by Eric I am Intj and was shocked I could do all the Si polr tests you cleared and even the Ti polr tests with ease really rethinking my type now
@@E3Zombie I had trouble with the harder Ti PoLR questions- I had a hard time keeping track of all those relationships in my head without writing them out on paper. If I had paper, I would have probably gotten the harder ones right.
Interesting. All my life I have dealt with the pain and the isolation of *not being able to feel others* I always felt like an alien or that I was trapped in this bubble because I just couldn't pick up on people's feelings, I couldn't emotionally connect, I couldn't care about others or form bonds. Demon Fe
What if you feel their feelings like they’re your own but end up wanting to DO shit for them so they stop fucking up their lives and making you deal with the FEELINGS fallout?
Being the opposite; savior Ti/demon Fe, what it would look like for *me* to tap into Fe in her situation at 2:30 is walking up to this person and being like, "Go cry over there. I'll deal with this."
Uhh can you help me understand, to me the terminology of demon means the 8th function, the last function of the shadow/unconscious but it seems like you’re talking about the fourth function in the ego. Can you just clarify please
Something I've noticed about (some) EXFJs, is that when you question what they are saying or ask them to explain their logic so that you could understand it, they can get pissed easily. I think it's that fragile Ti not being very developed or realised yet. Legitimately, I've just simply asked an ESFJ friend to explain _why/how_ a thing, that according to him works, works in the real world or is logical. Now I have to say here that I'm an INFP and so I have low Te / unconscious Ti and so people really have to be clear with me sometimes on how something works or I won't buy it. To continue with my point: I'm not usually even belittling their logic, but I'm just simply curious on understanding how that mechanical fact works, and if I don't get a proper explanation or I don't see the logic/rationale, how am I supposed to just agree with what they just said to me? I'm usually honest about what I understand, or if I don't understand, and I can be very stubborn sometimes. BUT, in this case, I'm not intentionally being an unagreeable asshole or even being stubborn, I just want to know how things work and even that can trigger that fragile Ti. I've heard them (EXFJs) sometimes say "I don't want to argue with you, I know I'm right!" (...and because I'm *right* I don't have to explain _why_ I am right, or to argue with you) Basically that low Ti knows something works, but haven't thought it through enough to understand how it works or how to explain it, then gets angry because they feel you don't take their viewpoint or logic seriously. When an ESFJ knows they have a point, they can focus so hard on that one fact that they ignore all the other facts or possibilities in the conversation, if they feel like their point is not taken into consideration. This is just my experience and how I understand the demon (/inferior) Ti.
You've got it spot on for me! Especially when I was younger when my Fe was so dominant, if anybody questioned my logic and how I reached an answer/solution/conclusion to something, despite it being more often than not correct, I'd always just get angry because my demon Ti was so insecure and weak (and just instead take it personally that the other person didn't trust me etc etc...). I can't tell you the number of times my ENTJ mum and ENFP dad (Te in their immediate function stacks) simply ask me for the logical reasoning behind a conclusion I'd made, and I'd just get angry, take things personally, and eventually just get into arguments with them for no real reason haha. Now that I'm a bit older my Ti is a lot more mature and I'm consistently trying to consciously improve my Ti by studying typically 'logical' subjects which interest me (philosophy, psychology) and I actually study law which has definitely been a struggle but has improved my Ti tremendously no doubt. It feels so much better to experience more of a balance between my Fe and Ti so to any ExFJ's out there, I know it doesn't feel right to be using your Ti but trust me once you develop it and it's in balance with your Fe your decision making and organization will improve massively!
Gender doesn't matter to MBTI, the order of your cognitive functions does. Certain types are more male or female as a percentage (ISTP is the most "male" type being about 70% male, ISFJ is the most "female" type being 70% female), but there's no "masculine" or "feminine" cognitive functions, technically everyone has all of them, but you will naturally tend to use the function pair Ne/Si or Se/Ni, and either Fi/Te or Ti/Fe more, and you'll also have a dominant and auxiliary function (such as Ne Ti for ENTP for example)
Except that she's on shark tank which means she's an ESTP with savior Se and "demon" Ni. What we're seeing is her child Fe. It's her "softer" side which she's comfortable showing in interviews and tv because it's also her hidden agenda or measure of success. But otherwise, as a business person she's Se knocking over barriers all the time. She talks about "taking a rejection or hard bump personally and internalizing it" which is Ni in the 4th trying to understand the pattern. Weirdly she has parent (tool) Ti so she's actually very logical in her explanations (despite her dyslexia). Critical parent (6th) Te so she doesn't like being labelled or called "stupid".
Do ESTPs have the over-empathy issue she described in the video? I don't think so. That's more of an EFJ problem. She's just developed the ISTP part of her mind.
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 85 | คู่เอก "ยอดเหล็กเพชร vs ผึ้งหลวง"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Qq_19bnnxEo/mqdefault.jpg)
Dang! You can really see Barbara's secret to success - She knows herself!
Admirable woman indeed. 👍
Me when do I do something nice for someone: ''That should shut them up for a while...''
I relate to this so much.
Wow! this is the absolute best explanation of demon Ti that I have come across yet. People always bring up demon Ti is someone who is completely illogical. In real life, I find that those with demon Ti are often very capable of being logical, especially on an academic level. It is far more about stepping back in social situations and objectively holding up requests in the light of your own personal principles and needs. As a dominant Fe user, I find this is as difficult as using my non-dominant hand. And yes, we constantly worry about whether people think we are stupid or not.
Well as a Ni-dom that has suffered from neglecting my Se this makes sense as Fe/Ti work together just like my own Ni/Se work together as a team. They're supposed to help each other out so just like my Se is supposed to put my Ni plans into action (and let me as an NJ learn to relax a bit) but my neglect of Se has caused even my Ni to suffer. So it makes sense that your own Fe ultimately suffers from ignoring your Ti too much despite the fact that it's all your Fe's fault in the first place. Also the way you described demon Ti, you're making the mistake I suspect a whole bunch of people do: forgetting that the inferior function is one of your favoured/valued functions. Te is one of your unloved and uncared for functions not Ti.
@@mutantmacrophage6653 Exactly. Don't neglect your functions everyone,
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It's funny, that as an INTP, I totally relate to Barbara's bully problem. I often have that same feeling, that I'm up against some big bully and I feel like I'm back in the schoolyard again. It's just that my Ti always gave me that stubbornness to keep going. I still have that fragile little Fe crying in the corner, because somebody was mean to me, but there's also my Ti screaming way louder like "FUCK YOU, IMMA DO IT ANYWAY!"
I don't lose my confidence, I kind of gain confidence, because I can tell myself that I am better than that asshole and that gives me the drive to keep going. But on the outside I'm still Fe hiding away. I guess that's also a lack of confidence, but in a different way. It's more like I have confidence in myself, but I'm just simply afraid of other people. They don't affect me on such a personal level, but they do deeply anger me.
Jester of Destiny I’m an INFP and I too relate to it.
"FUCK YOU IMMA DO IT ANYWAY!" sounds like demon/masculine Fe, brah.
I completely empathize.
Low Fe: afraid of other people. You’re aware of how others feel, but you’re not confident you can control them like high Fe is.
OMFG i feel this, i understand
In most school systems, dyslexic kids are still being called dumb, still being bullied and still thought as a nuisance/problem by teachers and admins. THINGS HAVE NOT CHANGED MUCH AT ALL.
Shannon's so pretty
@M Muss I care why?
She isssss
@@Cucababy5 Because it's not the purpose of the video- You're doing her a DISERVICE by demonstrating that your take home message for the video is... that Shannon is pretty (well durr I have eyes too). Ya how you like that Ti reason? saviour Fe. - I love your Fe response... "You don't have the same tribe values as me... therefore you don't' count. Bravo!
@M Muss @HyperDrive dude, ever heard of a compliment.
Fans leave random complements on a TH-cam channel's videos all the time.
Stuff like "x person is so beautiful" usually wemon but even men get these nice comments from time to time.
Why would, this video be such a special case?
ur picture look good to me
As a demon ti trying to build it everyday so I am less reliant on my fe, dyslexia was a big part of my childhood so I feel this struggle. Thank you for putting out this content.
She's totally right, you have to take other people's negative energy and transform that energy into something positive... use it to rise above. Other people want to bring you down so they can stand on your shoulders and call themselves tall. I can recall one situation where someone was mocking my ideas and trying to prove her ideas were better, so I said to myself, thank you for that boost of energy you just gave me, psychopath. And used it to win the day. Needless to say, I had her eating her words and congratulating me at the end of the day.
It blew my mind to hear you talk about that at the end. Propping up a "fake" persona to cover your ass - this is exactly the revelation I had about myself just last year as I processed y'all's reading. It was starting to disrupt my life, big time. I've stopped starving my "original" self and started attempting to "parent" it and the initial results are very exciting.
I've found that there are two types of ExFJs. On one hand, you have these super empathetic awesome people, who you can always count on. On the other hand, you have those who act nice on the outside, but actually are manipulative shit-stirrers. I think it has to do with that "hero's journey" that Dave mentions so often.
The empathetic ExFJ has gone through hell and gained complete control over their demons, which gives them that Ti drive and a sort of wisdom that doesn't really happen with other types. While the manipulative ExFJ didn't go through all that and their Ti is still this extremely fragile thing nobody must touch. One has made peace with themselves and knows how to roll with the punches, while the other interprets any minor transgression as a personal insult and will go ballistic if their empathetic facade gets challenged.
I see it a lot with old people. It's always the ones who have many stories about people telling them how good people they are. It is way too easy to get on their bad sides and will blame you for it, even if you've done literally nothing. It's like your mere personality is insulting to them.
you're speaking as if you would've looked inside my soul or some shit..
ENTP here and I'm having *major* issues with my grandma.
She's a 90 year old ESFJ and definitely on the "manipulative-shit-stirrers" side of the spectrum.
I'm trying really hard not to blame her since she has experienced WW2 in it's fullest so it that sense she has gone through hell, but she is still running from it instead of facing her demons inside.
And it's not only me having these issues, my ENTP uncle has *exactly the same* issues as me.
Btw: I'm not the one having the issues, I'm only having issues because she is having them. I generally value my piece of mind, "live and let live" is my motto, but it is not possible with her. At all.
So if you're also an ENTP out there having problems with your ESFJ grandma, well, you're not alone.
Some random stranger on probably the other side of the planet has them aswell.
ENFJ here. I've been both of what you described, and, from my experience, I'd say the difference is how the EXFJ views the tribe. Lead Fe means you start off as what you view as a considerate idealist. You follow the golden rule (Ti supporting Fe) even when the situation doesn't call for it since not everyone wants to be treated the way you want to be treated. You run into several people in life who think short term and aren't considerate of other people, and Ti becomes pessimistic and thinks, "Oh, the tribe isn't what I thought it was. I can't believe how dumb I was. These are the (Ti) rules everyone else seems to be following that I should follow too if I want to protect myself/interests. I have to look out for myself because other people won't be there for me either because they're selfish or because they're dumb." From experience, I can tell you that an EXFJ who's thinking like that isn't happy on the inside and doesn't feel fulfilled regardless of what they think on the surface.
You only break out of the line of thinking when you think, "Is this who I really want to be?" An EXFJ can break the cycle by deciding to be the greater fool and leading by example. He/She has to decide that they would rather actualize into the person they want to be than protect themselves from further harm. You decide to be a "good person" regardless of whether that means being burned again. (Still EXFJs learn from past experiences like everyone else, so they're not going to do something they know will have a bad outcome.)
Ti can be stubborn and aggressive, but it can be reasoned with. Just ask a pessimistic EXFJ, "Is this who you want to be?" or "Is that line of thinking making you happy?" Regardless of that they say in the moment, he/she will probably stew on what you said until they change his/her mind. Guilt is a powerful weapon against lead Fe.
The hero's journey for EXFJ's is: being the change you want to see in the world/choosing to make decisions because they're consistent with you you want to be; knowing your limits, accepting your flaws, and building on your strengths so that you have something valuable to give; realizing that trying to help when you aren't asked directly by the person who needs it may cause more harm than good; and being patient with and accepting of people for who they are, even when you feel/know they'll make what you consider to be poor decisions.
Lead Fe can be really helpful in life, but it can also be a tremendous personal burden to feel what someone else is feeling. If another person's negative emotion doesn't feel like it will ever be resolved, a lead Fe user will choose to shut it off to maintain his or her own sanity-- Even someone with lead Fe can become very cold.
At the end of the day, lead Fe wants everyone to feel good, but it won't work properly if it thinks being empathetic or being selfless is the dumb thing to do--for the user, for the individual it want to help, or for the tribe at large.
On the sensitive Ti point-- EXFJs can come to enjoy being challenged if they see it as constructive or beneficial towards accomplishing their goals. Lack of confidence in Ti means we usually seek external validation for Ti anyway. Life experience (of being correct when everyone else disagreed or thought you were wrong) and repeated challenges can build an EXFJ's confidence in their own thinking.
Other EXFJs can chime in if they think differently.
You might be onto something. As far as I can tell, these manipulative ExFJs exhibit signs of straight narcissism. As in, extreme self-doubt, that reflects as aggression on the outside. It's probably that Ti demon self-doubt that the channel has touched up on already.
I described it as fragile, because of the things I have seen it being set off by. As an INTP, I probably come off as very cold, but certain ExFJs can see through that and see that teeny tiny Fe I'm hiding. But when a narcissistic ExFJ is faced with it, they get confused. Confusion leads to self-doubt, self-doubt leads to anger and now they hate me and I didn't even have to do anything.
I have seen this happen multiple times now. Honestly, it's really annoying. An angry ESFJ can really push you down on the social ladder and they won't admit they're doing it. Because that'd be morally objectionable and they're the paragon of morality. They'll twist your words, rewrite what happened, straight up lie and become extremely exhausting to deal with. And you didn't even have to do anything.
@@JesterOfDestiny I don't have much to go on based on your experiences, but here's my guess based on my own-- You're dealing with people who lack self awareness and who project their own thinking onto your behaviors. Unconsciously, EXFJs don't like cold behavior/attitudes because: (1) coldness = being mean or cruel and hurts the positive feeling atmosphere of the tribe; (2) warmth and positivity = wanting to contribute to the tribe; and (3) (young) EXFJs are only cold when they're unhappy/tired/mean (later in life, it can be seen neutrally as a necessity). If you're correcting an EXFJ and they don't trust your intentions because of your body language, because they're being called out publicly in a way that doesn't feel constructive, etc., they will want to make things even (Ti) by getting back in some way. That can be proving you wrong (possibly constructively) or taking you down a peg to protect themselves socially. Yes, it can be dumb, but trust must come before advice/help/information, regardless of type. When EXFJs learn people process things differently than they do and display emotions differently and for different reasons, they become less suspicious of intentions and more accepting of people. INTPs and ESFJs may always struggle to see eye-to-eye, but at least you can figure out appropriate boundaries and find a way to see value in what they bring, even if you don't need it.
"I've found that there are two types of ExFJs"
Yeah, ESFJs and ENFJs 😂
Just kidding. Great insights!
I think my mom is like this. She calls people EVREY DAY to check what how they are feeling today. Not just children friends, family, distant relatives, and neighbors. It's her superpower.
It has taken me two years to understand how very deeply true this is and what a huge unconscious motivator it is to me to prove that I'm smart
I can really relate to this. Like Barbara, I was teased severely in school. In my case, it was because I was fat. I still have confidence issues as an adult and definitely have that Savior Fe/Demon Ti combo. If I don’t feel appreciated or am engaged by the tribe, I feel stupid or worthless. Now to figure out the middle two. 🙃
Wow I love this. Helpful for every personality
I remember being stupid at school. From middle to high school I had trouble with maths. I really wanted to understand addition and algebra but my brain just said no. From learning about learning I now do a drip drip approach to some stuff like computer programming.
i’ve found that my sister is an ENFJ and my poking at her demon Ti has sparked a lot of insecurities. it’s hard because i’d think ‘well that’s their problem if they’re gonna take it personally’, but i just kept getting these repetitive tidal waves of “you’re being so mean to everyone and now no one wants to be around you”. pretty much a wake up call.
Oh okay, so this says a LOT. I didn't know that Te also means caring about people... I always thought that was Fe. I'm definitely lead Te. The best example I remember would be that only a few months ago, my friend was sad and emotional about his fatty liver problem and I remember that I felt bad about it, so I helped him entirely with the logic side of it. Go see a doctor, ask him about how long it will take to be cured, is an operation necessary, why haven't the meds made much of a difference, what is the cause of this, etc... And I couldn't fake myself into comforting him, so I handled the side I'm good at. I couldn't express my emotions empathetically, so I helped him about with his problem. There are several such instances. I'm not good at patting a person on the back and tell them it'll work out, but I will actually help them work it out. And all of this at the cost of my own needs and wants. I'm saviour Te for sure.
It’s HOW you solved the problem not WHY. Entjs are emotional too :)
Male or female savior Te?
Cries in corner 😭
Fe is showing emotions? Maybe I've got Fe..
Love this. You guys are so on it
Really like your approach to shadow work. Great vid.
This insecurity lead me to overcome it forsure. It took me a long time to put together my own way to become better at Ti
You're videos are very informative and your chemistry makes them fun to watch! :)
In Rocketman movie, in one of the final scenes, Elton John hugs his child-self in rehab. This video reminded me of that scene. In the movie, Elton wanted to be hugged by his father but never got that. And maybe that's why he tried to get attention from outside (public) through various ways. He finally hugs his child-self and becomes better.
It may apply with anyone with demon thinking (Ti/Te) particularly single deciders.
Yes, for INFP with demon TE
This is such a wholesome video guys. Also Dave I remember in you're te vs ti video you mentioned how ti is more aggressive than te. Do you still stand by that claim ?? If so is that why Barbara with her demon ti has such a driving force ?
I DON'T OWN ANY SHOES.
My Fi and my Ti both kinda suck. You wouldn't know it by how "That's not necessarily so" I am, but the ol' ego is kinda delicate here.
you cant have 2 judging functions in your main stack.
@@SekRanger Technically, I know this. I suppose it comes from one extraverted function leading to the introverted function and the two getting mixed up in my head.
@@AlastorTheNPDemon uhh ... okay.
Well... look on the bright side: your mind only really cares about using one of those introverted Judging functions. So you only really have to work on one of them and ignore the other. See right there? I've just doubled your productivity. You're welcome! :p
@@mutantmacrophage6653 Abjectly, of course. Thanks in any case.
The child self needs nurturance, understanding, and the empathy it didn’t get, then it grows up.
Heidi M
I’m wondering how best to treat my child self. What are the long-term consequences of Dave’s method, of letting it die and rot in the corner?
Kevin Paterson not 💯 % but I think it turns one into a narcissist. If you’re really interested there’s a channel called gerlach. He was a therapist that specialized in family systems therapy, and talks about healing the child self. He has since past away, but he knew he was terminal, and posted a series of educational videos on the subject beforehand.
I was officially tyoed SiTe ISTJ by Dave and Shannon. I'm still very sensitive to insults on my intelligence both real and perceived. So I think it can affect multiple types not just Ti demon.
I watched you get typed by Eric I am Intj and was shocked I could do all the Si polr tests you cleared and even the Ti polr tests with ease really rethinking my type now
@@E3Zombie I had trouble with the harder Ti PoLR questions- I had a hard time keeping track of all those relationships in my head without writing them out on paper. If I had paper, I would have probably gotten the harder ones right.
You two have cracked the code of life. Who needs a psychologist when you have DaveSuperpowers?
Hmmmm you might want to reword this comment lol like saying who needs a doctor when your wife is a veterinarian.
Good point Rob. Its more of a tongue in cheek comment
Empathy is not only a Fe trait though
You guys give me hope
Can confirm, am stupid
I think what you are talking about, from carl jung, is persona, a face to the public. Cheers-Alan
I think the saying can also go “savior Ti, you’re stupid”
Interesting. All my life I have dealt with the pain and the isolation of *not being able to feel others*
I always felt like an alien or that I was trapped in this bubble because I just couldn't pick up on people's feelings, I couldn't emotionally connect, I couldn't care about others or form bonds.
Demon Fe
Mr. Spaghetti
The fact that you actually believe in chakras astounds me.
Press F if you liked this video.
What if you feel their feelings like they’re your own but end up wanting to DO shit for them so they stop fucking up their lives and making you deal with the FEELINGS fallout?
I am questioning my type again what do i do...
Look back on all the thousands of instructional videos this channel has.
@@blastoff2086 LOL that makes sense😂
Miss you Dave ;-)
Being the opposite; savior Ti/demon Fe, what it would look like for *me* to tap into Fe in her situation at 2:30 is walking up to this person and being like, "Go cry over there. I'll deal with this."
it may be general with demon thinking, either Ti or Te
my brain is very strong
I can create and control my brain
Really enjoyed this video.
Hmmm can’t decide if she’s an ESFJ or ENFJ. Either way, her Fe is really great.
Uhh can you help me understand, to me the terminology of demon means the 8th function, the last function of the shadow/unconscious but it seems like you’re talking about the fourth function in the ego. Can you just clarify please
I love this channel
Something I've noticed about (some) EXFJs, is that when you question what they are saying or ask them to explain their logic so that you could understand it, they can get pissed easily.
I think it's that fragile Ti not being very developed or realised yet. Legitimately, I've just simply asked an ESFJ friend to explain _why/how_ a thing, that according to him works, works in the real world or is logical.
Now I have to say here that I'm an INFP and so I have low Te / unconscious Ti and so people really have to be clear with me sometimes on how something works or I won't buy it.
To continue with my point: I'm not usually even belittling their logic, but I'm just simply curious on understanding how that mechanical fact works, and if I don't get a proper explanation or I don't see the logic/rationale, how am I supposed to just agree with what they just said to me? I'm usually honest about what I understand, or if I don't understand, and I can be very stubborn sometimes. BUT, in this case, I'm not intentionally being an unagreeable asshole or even being stubborn, I just want to know how things work and even that can trigger that fragile Ti.
I've heard them (EXFJs) sometimes say "I don't want to argue with you, I know I'm right!" (...and because I'm *right* I don't have to explain _why_ I am right, or to argue with you) Basically that low Ti knows something works, but haven't thought it through enough to understand how it works or how to explain it, then gets angry because they feel you don't take their viewpoint or logic seriously. When an ESFJ knows they have a point, they can focus so hard on that one fact that they ignore all the other facts or possibilities in the conversation, if they feel like their point is not taken into consideration.
This is just my experience and how I understand the demon (/inferior) Ti.
You've got it spot on for me! Especially when I was younger when my Fe was so dominant, if anybody questioned my logic and how I reached an answer/solution/conclusion to something, despite it being more often than not correct, I'd always just get angry because my demon Ti was so insecure and weak (and just instead take it personally that the other person didn't trust me etc etc...). I can't tell you the number of times my ENTJ mum and ENFP dad (Te in their immediate function stacks) simply ask me for the logical reasoning behind a conclusion I'd made, and I'd just get angry, take things personally, and eventually just get into arguments with them for no real reason haha.
Now that I'm a bit older my Ti is a lot more mature and I'm consistently trying to consciously improve my Ti by studying typically 'logical' subjects which interest me (philosophy, psychology) and I actually study law which has definitely been a struggle but has improved my Ti tremendously no doubt.
It feels so much better to experience more of a balance between my Fe and Ti so to any ExFJ's out there, I know it doesn't feel right to be using your Ti but trust me once you develop it and it's in balance with your Fe your decision making and organization will improve massively!
i can create my brain
Awesome!
I was in special Ed from 2ng grade to the day I graduated ha.
she is type 3
And he is type 6.
Can everyone tell me what the hell he thinks Anton Chigurh's type is???
I am genius.
Great video
PoLR Ti.
DEMON TE PLS
Oh shit i call people stupid as a joke now i have to be thinking who i offended?😹
God damn it
Do you mean demon 4th function or 8th? If you mean 8th why do you say first is fe? It should be fi
Iron Man Ti demon
No you!
Go back and tell your story differently. This is gonna make me think for a while ...
ExxJs are some of the worst bullies though. So this is hilarious.
Oh my god i feel so early
One F- ing hour agooooo
Demon _Feminine_ Ti
Gender doesn't matter to MBTI, the order of your cognitive functions does. Certain types are more male or female as a percentage (ISTP is the most "male" type being about 70% male, ISFJ is the most "female" type being 70% female), but there's no "masculine" or "feminine" cognitive functions, technically everyone has all of them, but you will naturally tend to use the function pair Ne/Si or Se/Ni, and either Fi/Te or Ti/Fe more, and you'll also have a dominant and auxiliary function (such as Ne Ti for ENTP for example)
Can an IxxP be blast first?
NO
She seems ESFP to me (with trickster Ti).
Proof of the internet: I'm Te! INTJ, then
too cute you guys!!!
So Barbara is an INFP? I totally relate to her.
No. Either ESFJ or ENFJ in this system. Most likely ENFJ
Dave, you're gonna get a kick out of this. When I was in school I was bullied by an I - FP.
The demon function is the eighth function not the fourth function..
eh i wanted to say something, but just watch their vids and stop talking nonsense
Joseph Ross ah, got it. Thanks for explaining.
Except that she's on shark tank which means she's an ESTP with savior Se and "demon" Ni. What we're seeing is her child Fe. It's her "softer" side which she's comfortable showing in interviews and tv because it's also her hidden agenda or measure of success. But otherwise, as a business person she's Se knocking over barriers all the time. She talks about "taking a rejection or hard bump personally and internalizing it" which is Ni in the 4th trying to understand the pattern. Weirdly she has parent (tool) Ti so she's actually very logical in her explanations (despite her dyslexia). Critical parent (6th) Te so she doesn't like being labelled or called "stupid".
Andrew Dickson you mean aspirational Ni www.cognitiveprocesses.com/16Types/ESTP.cfm
Do ESTPs have the over-empathy issue she described in the video? I don't think so. That's more of an EFJ problem. She's just developed the ISTP part of her mind.
my brain is very strong
i can create my brain
i can create my brain
i can create my brain
i can create my brain