Are Ernie Ball Music Man Heat Treated Pickups A Gimmick - Gear News
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I'm going to start claiming my pickups are quenched in a proprietary bath.😉
🤣
Aloe?
I've seen Hendrix heat treating his pickups, the whole guitar in fact 😄
It definitely sounded warmer afterwards...
Now that
Was Damm funny. 😀
😂🤘
Nice!
heat treatments of metals can make steels harder, or softer, it depends on the method of the heat treatment. making metals softer is generally called annealing, vs normal heat treatments which make steels harder, either all the way through, or just a surface hardness. can it make a difference in how a pickups reacts, sure. is it going to be something most people can notice, idk.
I am a Materiels Engineer
In answerer to You ..
No. 🤬
@@embreesmith7613 LOL
Heat treating alters the reactive/magnetic properties of most common alloys, generally both when it's hot and after it's been treated. It's a more invasive change than say, causing a screwdriver to become magnetic by dropping it.
I don't know that in this application it would make a noticeable difference but hook one up to a spectrum analyzer is how I would take a quick look to see if there is something audibly different in the spectral response footprint.
The only way to easily apply repeatable stimulus is to have guided metal dowels (rounded on the ends) dropped from the same height on different strings.
It wouldn't be necessarily representative of anyone but a slap player as far a a use case goes but the point is to get physical stimulus into the energy system in a way that's repeatable and strong enough to provide solid response. Maybe a dulcimer hammer pinned on the handle end as a hinge could be dropped from a centimeter or so but it has to be high enough to catch if we want to observe decay/sustain fingerprints as well as our touching the hammer to catch it isolated so we aren't injecting ourselves into the signal.
I'd also make sure (should go without saying) to isolate the system under test from both external vibration and EMI noise, which can both way swamp out any sort of clear measurements of the system or system parts we were trying to inspect.
It could be done by mounting the pickups on an isolated surface, matching the test gear input impedance to be what's usually facing an instrument (this can also be automated, for doing instrument and line level testing, most test gear has it built in now) and setting up something to strike strings across it that are also isolated from the pickup, except for their disruption of its magnetic flux.
We're testing if the materials have changed properties and if so is it great enough to bother actually trial and error tone testing by ear, not seeing if they're sweet or harsh or whatever. Pure science...
*sigh*
I miss my old job (metrology/materials test).
It's my understanding that heat treating steel makes its surface much harder. That's why knife makers do the file test after heat treatment. If the heat treatment is effective, the file won't bite the blade. If the file bites the blade, the heat treatment is ineffective. The heat treatment makes the steel more brittle, though, so to address this, the steel is tempered or annealed to give it the flexibility it needs to be of practical use.
EBMM already produces high quality instruments, I don't think they need to use gimmicks to sell more. Better that than to say it's a limited edition with sacred himalaian woods without specific names blessed by monks and the pope and naturally aged for 47 years in a temperature controlled room
Well, obviously the heat treatment realigns the Mumbo molecules into the same orientation as the Jumbo orgone atoms causing sensitivity and feel to be magnified by a factor of - 12 angstrom units thereby reversing the flux and causing a geometrical increase in MOJO emanating from the TONE WOOD, relative of course to the force of your picking. Just imagine if Hendrix had access to this technology -- it bogles the mind...
I’ve been trying to find a good HSS lately…those Kramers are looking reeeeal fun!
Nice. I’ve really grown to like Kramer guitars. Unfortunately my $ circumstances are not good and I have two on reverb now. Both 80s Strikers too. A 200ST and a 100ST both with Floyd’s. The 100 has the nonblocking trem. The 200 has the Floyd Rose II which I like a lot. For a Floyd anyway. I’m not the greatest with tremolos thus why they’re two of the guitars I listed for sale. I’d say of all the guitars I’ve had with locking trems the 200 might be my favorite. Take it with a grain of salt, I haven’t had a ton of them. I usually gravitate to ToM style bridges.
Without knowing exactly what the heat treatment cycle is - times, temperatures, heating and cooling rates and the starting material - it is hard to determine exactly what the outcome is.
All these parameters will change the size/shape/distribution of the alloy crystals in the steel and the ratios of the different crystal types.
And whether it is just the surface that is changed or the entire pole piece.
Plus (I'm not sure) I don't think that there is a linear relationship between that structure and it's magnetic properties.
Then add in the complexities around what strings you use - Slinky vs D'addrio and coated vs uncoated and the differences in wound vs plain.
Can you please do a video on how to place and set up the bridge saddles? For example if you don’t know the factory setting placements of the saddles, how do you correctly place and adjust the saddles to the correct placement. I know that they should be stair stepped but what else is involved? Thanks!
Just did that Monday
Got it ! Thanks, Dylan. Just one question if you will, so the stair stepping should come about ad a result of the measurement adjustment? I mean, I’ve seen some of my guitars where the saddles are significantly spaced one from another and others are just minutely spaced from each other. And just to be clear; when first placing the saddles they should all be level and even with each other and the screws should be barely screwed into the saddle? Thanks man but I just want to get it right.
Basically they are just buying a different grade of steel for the pickups. The Devi is in the details as they say.
My pickups got heat, air conditioning and four wheel drive.
Interesting. In my opinion it's probably gimmicky and just marketing hype. I'm surprised they don't call them Roasted Pickups.
Better is not the right term, different is a better term when talking about these. I use ceramic and alnico pickups. I don't say either magnet type is better, just different.
Whether the 'heat treatment' makes more difference than the type of alloy or winding pattern will be interesting.
But i doubt they will be 'better'.
Ya know. ..
I might buy domma them fancy Dyla Pups if they were cryoed ..
No room in the Camper ??
This could rocket your stuff to the top. 🙂
I emailed Ernie Ball / Music Man factory in SLO if I could tour their factory, they said no but I could come pick up a free shirt. So when I finally got there (I was only there for the day), I showed up after they closed 🤪😆🤣😭 haha just my luck. The hours on the email didn't reflect the correct time I guess.
One thing i got pissed at EBMM about was when they did the guitar for EVH they made dimarzio sign off on a guarantee
that dimarzio would NOT sell the Custom pu's that are in the guitar as part of their product line.
Well there are many players including myself that think those are the best sounding dimarzio has
made so to get them we either had to buy the guitar or find a used set in the classifieds at a ridiculous price.
They sell for as much as $400 on ebay.
@@These_go_to_eleven_1959 and it'll stay that way
@@IRevealTheMagic That's a shame because
dimarzio would have a hell of a set to offer the public. I am hoarding the extra sets i bought used over the years. Never will sell them.
@@These_go_to_eleven_1959 Well sir, if DiMarzio got the rights to openly sell those pickups to the public, they'd make a whole lot of money for sure..but then the appeal to buy a Music Man Axis is now driven down..and we'll sir..simply put...We here at Music Man don't take too kind to that idea...
@@IRevealTheMagic I can understand that but also feel the AXIS holds its own regardless of what pu's are in it.
For instance there have been quite a few that have taken the dimarzio's out and put something else in. All i am saying is the AXIS is a stellar guitar even if i had to play it unplugged all the time.
Sooo basically what is going on with the EBMM pickups is that they spare on a larger/stronger magnet and use a more conductive pole piece instead for the same effect.
No, I believe the magnet is fairly strong as well.
To me the HT pickups seem awfully similar to G&L's MFD "Magnetic Field Design" pups.
Cryo is absolute marketing bullchidtz
Someone explain to me the Benefit of such. 😀
I assume you are referring to reducing the temperature of a material as close as possible to absolute zero ? Right it's been a long time since I learnt about this but to put it in simple terms when materials (metals / plastics etc. ) are reduced to such a low temperature the molecules of the material will realign to a even pattern ( years ago engineers would take a block of plastic, Perspex If I remember correctly, which had been treated so and machine it (drill, cut, stamp, punch etc) when light was shone on it the stress it had been subjected to could be seen in the defraction (the rainbow colours seen in plastic ) as a relatively cheap & quick way of testing possible weakness etc.of a components design due to its manufacturing process)
That even realignment of molecules is also used a lot in industry to make cutting tool edges last a lot longer ( it is one of the main uses ) the other thing that realignment does is allow electrons to flow evenly, now whether that effects the response of a pick up to a noticeable level is a moot point !
T
Never been a fan of any of the Wampler products. They just don't sound right...
I want an upgrade for my LTD factory pickups, but I don't want to pay $100 each for em. I wouldn't be against some EB pickups if they're priced right and sound good.
I very much doubt they'd be selling them in the open market.
They'll restrict them to their guitars for a while.
$100 ???
Good freaking luck there
SSH ? or HSS pickup configuration ? Lol.
Everything is a gimmick.
Heat treating is a marketing gimmick to me. What they are doing with the magnets will have more to do with the tone than the pole piece material.
Why is he talking about heat-treating steel as if there are pickups that use it as their magnetic material? It's my understanding that they use Alnico or ceramics. I'm asking.
Left handed Guitarists aren't in their right mind.
Im sorry i love EBMM and their products but this heat treated p'u thing is going too far.
I just do not see how one of their "Heat treated" p'u models would be vastly better than what we have out now?
Ok so the poles are more magnetic, wouldn't that also effect sustain,tuning and intonation more by creating more pull on the strings?
I get it that it will make the p'u have more output but i do not like a lot of "output" from the p'u itself. I prefer the old Gibson P.A.F types.
Steven blucher at Dimarzio said a softer field gives better sustain and the tuning/intonation is not as effected.
Dimarzio offers Air buckers with reduced string pull(magnetism) for this reason.
I prefer even lower output single coils. But if other people want a hotter sound, I don't care any more than I object to other people playing flatter 12" or 14" radius finger boards. Just not for me.
Better watch the video on string pull.
It's a fallacy.
Sorry but don't care cool the moxie a ts10 clone
But........ I'd rather just goddam wait until ibanez makes remakes cause its all about the way the dam ts10 LOOKS
It's only cool cause jt looks cool
The heat treated pups also they PATENT pended it, I only think the copper wire is gonna be heat treated
You know the shit sound that BRAND NEW pups have? Cause it isn't broke jn yet
So maybe it'll just .. idk lol you get it
We need to look up the patent tho
Fender needs to push out their other brands.
You have the whole heat treating explanation totally wrong. Heat treating steal makes steel harder. Tempering makes it softer.
um..... tempering is a heat treatment too so.......
@@DylanTalksTone yeah... it is used to soften previously heat treated steel so its not so brittle.
@@DylanTalksTone and did you like your own comment? LOL
I don't think it's a new thing in terms of their marketing.
Musicman is always very gimmicky.
Not cool at all
Cryo is absolute marketing bullchidtz
Someone explain to me the Benefit of such. 😀
Compare Dean Markley's Blue Steels vs regular Ernie Ball Slinkies. You'll understand the difference. Blue Steel stays in tune and lasts longer.