As soon as control 4 allows end users to program and add their own devices with the dealer interface software , I'll buy one immediately. I'll happily pay the $1k price point. But I'm in charge, not some dealer that may or may not understand how to program my system to my satisfaction. Would be super easy to put dealer training videos online to educate advanced end users to program their own remotes.
Check out my reply to the last comment and check out Composer HE. I agree with you but some dealers have dealt with this very badly indeed creating this reputation. We hate that and are working hard to change this. I think where Control 4 sits now is pretty good.
Your comment is spot on , Control 4 , Crestron , Savvant , and all control systems that I know of live to serve the dealer , the customers are not their concern,This is a backward way of doing business, not interested,
@@dempsey3 This is not for the DIY person but I have to disagree.. a bit. The model has been abused by dealers and installers. I would like to believe our clients have a very different experience. They get a reliable robust solution to relatively complex rooms that make the room simple and easy to enjoy. They can still program it themselves to a vast degree and we have next to no service calls and they have next to no problems. We need IP control RS232 sometimes, IR of course and integration into multiple other systems. I have had fights and disappointing discussions with selfish and ruthless dealers that “lock clients in” thats not the way it should be. Our clients get full transparency and so far this has been the best solution we have found IF you dont want to DIY your system. For those that want to we support them too. Its the customers choice and thats the way it should be
@@HomeTheatreEngineering Yeah that NEO remote was great and it certainly lived up to the hype, now dealers can just sell everyone another remote 1 year later
@@dempsey3 I can't disagree with your comment on the Neeo. In our case though Control 4 has credited or replaced every one we sold that has had issues, so we are not reselling replacements to clients... But it was not by any means a stable product!
The Control 4 has good potential but agree it should allow theatre owners to setup their own systems. I've been running a Logitech Harmony Hub (AUD$180) for the last 2 years and can control my whole theatre off my iphone. It's not quite as sophisticated as the Control 4 but does everything I need. :)
Thankfully my Apple TV remote is all I need to switch on my LG TV, Marantz amplifier and of course my Apple TV box. I use the remote to navigate through the apps and adjust the volume on the Marantz. One remote, be it Apple TV or Control4 is so very easy. Of course, I can just ask Siri to carry out some operations as well. Thanks for a fun, light hearted, yet informative video Andrew & Enzo.
Hi David Yep we (and Aaron) fully agree that this can be a solution. It gets more challenging controlling everything like changing sound modes on a Trinnov, for which even Aaron uses a phone app for, or switching asoec rstios etc. For those willing to invest time and effort a lot can be done with an Appletv remote. So for many this works. Once you get to Trinnov, madvr, Barco you need to “Aaron” your system. Aaron is a client who has taken appletv remote control to the next level but probably well above the ability of most users.
I understand with Control 4 you can't program any of it yourself. I'm told if you want to add a feature or a device, someone has to do that for you. Personally I wouldn't want that. Fortunately I bought two Harmony Elite with hubs about the time they stopped making them so at least I have those. I'm also looking at this Home Assistant open source option. Maybe I'm wrong about control 4? Is it possible to have control, the ability to add features/devices yourself?
Hi, that is partially true but there is Composer HE software that allows the user to make considerable changes and program and customise etc. But this is a bit of a situation made worse arisen by a reputation created by unscrupulous Control 4 dealers who "lock their clients in" but this is not correct. I had a huge fight with one once over this! The user should have access to their customer.control4.com site which allows them to change their support specialist any time they want. Some dealers even set up these sites without telling the clients! We are fully transparent. The client sets this up, we show them how to change their support supplier so they have freedom of choice. If our clients want to add a device they just call us up and it takes a minute or two and we normally don't charge for that unless the change is considerable. Hope that helps...
Good video. Control4 has the same issues as all the other solutions. And depending on what you need to do it is a very expensive solution to do what the average consumer needs. I have an EA3 and four EA1s and five Neeo remotes and the only room the Neeo remote comes out is in the Home theater and that is because ability to control the projector, Lumagen and Apple TV with one remote. The Oppo 203 driver has always been hit and miss. As far as the other rooms go it’s far easier to just grab the Apple TV remote and let CEC do its magic. Or just grab the Oppo remote. You need to be comfortable withth programming to use Control4 home composer which I would submit the average user isn’t nor has the desire to be or they wouldn’t have a dealer based system in the first place. Plus composer is limited. There are still things I need my programmer to do that I can’t. And if you stop paying the yearly fee you lose the ability to donate if/then statements. Apple HomeKit is not cloud based. Im not saying HomeKit is the solution I don’t believe that at all. I’m just saying depending on your individual needs something like Savant or Control4 may not be either. I spent a lot of money to find that out. Again thanks for the content and hard work.
@@HomeTheatreEngineering Who knows, if I tried it I might like it but I'm just too much of a DIY guy, I really prefer just doing it all myself which is why I'm building everything myself in my theater. I haven't actually set up the Harmony remotes yet, I just haven't gotten to it but hopefully next time I have any time at home I can get that going. I expect Control 4 is perfect for the guys that want everything set up for them so it's just plug and play but that just isn't me.
It sounds like you are controlling a whole lot more than a home theatre and yes it can be expensive though I am also yet to see a robust whole home solution that is not a bit costly. In Australia we have C-Bus and it "ain't cheap!" It would be interesting to know what you are doing with the EA3 and four EA1's but if it is whole home that could easily make sense.. While we do provide whole home solutions our focus here today is the cheapest possible, most robust and reliable solution for a home theatre enthusiast. So sometimes just and EA-1 and setup and that's it with the client using phone/tablet. But of course there is a world of options available but most of all our goal is making the room easy to use for everyone and anything that does this is welcome. From our side being able to offer support to our clients is a high priority so they know we are there if they need us.
Hi. Nothing wrong with being a DIY guy! That's how we all start! I fully understand your focus and any automation system may not suit a particular client.. We have sent partially set up control 4 units out to DIYers who want stability and they have pretty much set the rest up themselves with us a fallback if needed. Have fun with your cinema and we wish you well.
Good remote for the right setup/use case. I’m guessing this applies to only the most hardcore enthusiasts or those with extremely complex setups. For the price and self-programmability, I’m not sure they’re quite there yet for me. Even though Logitech isn’t doing much support for it anymore, the harmony hub can be ebay’d cheaply and will run 99% of users’ theaters. It’s the one I still recommend and use myself. Runs DVD, projector, processor (and amps with a trigger), Apple TV, navigation (pause/play/volume etc). I have 6 folks in the house and regardless of age (8-42) everyone can use it because it’s one touch for any of those features. What might be useful is a comparison of where Logitech stops and where control4 does more. That down and dirty comparison is what will help folks make a decision that’s right for them.
Good question. Halo has not long been available in Aus and Halo touch we have been told is not available. We have very little to no experience with them therefore. But to be totally honest the one Halo we thought we jad lying around and were going to use for the video had just been sent out. So we didnt have one to hand and therefore simply forgot to mention it! Mea Culpa. I am also a little gun shy after varying Neeo experiences. But yes good call and definitely an omission on our part!
@@HomeTheatreEngineering Gotcha. Here in the states, we’ve had Halo’s for awhile now. So far, so good. The design and screen are welcome updates to the SR-260 cosmetic, and it is much better than the Neeo. Early returns were that they were a bit buggy, but we seemed to have worked our way through that. The Halo Touch just is starting to ship here, so no direct experience with it yet. Thank you for the great content and always good advice. You’re true pros!!!
@@scottwallace1 Wow ! Thanks Scott.. We will be keen to try Halo and see how it goes.. Sorry we missed it in the video! And thank you, we do try and have based our business on a pretty simple philosphy.. “How would we like to be treated if I were the customer?” And we try hard to put ourselves in their shoes. It’s not always the most profitable approach but I sleep at night!
Maybe for a simple setup but our rooms use Barco, Trinnov MadVR and multiple other systems plus integration into homes that have standard lighting (non hue etc). If it was that simple we certainly wouldn’t bother with anything more involved why would we? Simple is best we fully agree with that…Many of our clients also want support. When something does go wrong (firmware update changes behaviour) we login fix it in 2 mins. No charge to the client. Hone Assistant must use Home Assistant Cloud or be accessible from the Internet and secured with a valid, non self-signed, SSL certificate for location tracking. Our clients can fully pull the plug on us and still operate perfectly. Not everyone wants their control system cloud based, open source or not.
compared to harmony Wireless with smart hub, $1500 bux is still crazy. As long as the harmony hub lasts, I’ll continue to use it with the iOS app. The hardware remote that is synced is aging, mainly the battery, but still very much usable. I only run two sources AppleTV4K (HDR10+ edition) and a Zidoo. CEC is so close for me with the AppleTV remote unfortunately my JVC projector is the only holdout. I can’t control it with CEC, or 12V trigger, so my only realistic option is IR.
With 2 sources and a projector only then yes it’s a no brainer. But we specialise in cinemas with multiple sources, selectable sound and video formats, video and audio processors with integrated room lighting and customers who want support and generally don’t want to do this all themselves. In a case like yours then harmony was a good solution. But these days $1500 (aus) base price including processor, installation, setup and programming and 12 months free support on a highly stable and reliable unit with a very long life expectancy is a good deal for our kind of clients. It also gives us full IP control over many products like JVC projectors, bluray players and a host of other devices not to mention rs232 control and integration into pretty much any existing lighting system. So its a case of the right product for the right person.
@@HomeTheatreEngineering That’s the thing 99% of the viewing is from what source? I had a UB9000 but don’t remember the last time I played a UHD disc. Harmony also integrates with my Lutron lighting so that’s a plus. But yes, $1500 isn’t so bad considering the tens of thousands of $$ USD I spent on my Theater. I actually had URC but it was more a pain than useful. I needed the integrator to change custom settings every time I change something.
@@smptactical259 Integrators have done a lot of damage.. even on control 4 customers can do a massive amount of the programming. They just don’t like telling people that!
As soon as control 4 allows end users to program and add their own devices with the dealer interface software , I'll buy one immediately. I'll happily pay the $1k price point. But I'm in charge, not some dealer that may or may not understand how to program my system to my satisfaction. Would be super easy to put dealer training videos online to educate advanced end users to program their own remotes.
Check out my reply to the last comment and check out Composer HE. I agree with you but some dealers have dealt with this very badly indeed creating this reputation. We hate that and are working hard to change this. I think where Control 4 sits now is pretty good.
Your comment is spot on , Control 4 , Crestron , Savvant , and all control systems that I know of live to serve the dealer , the customers are not their concern,This is a backward way of doing business, not interested,
@@dempsey3 This is not for the DIY person but I have to disagree.. a bit. The model has been abused by dealers and installers. I would like to believe our clients have a very different experience. They get a reliable robust solution to relatively complex rooms that make the room simple and easy to enjoy. They can still program it themselves to a vast degree and we have next to no service calls and they have next to no problems. We need IP control RS232 sometimes, IR of course and integration into multiple other systems. I have had fights and disappointing discussions with selfish and ruthless dealers that “lock clients in” thats not the way it should be. Our clients get full transparency and so far this has been the best solution we have found IF you dont want to DIY your system. For those that want to we support them too. Its the customers choice and thats the way it should be
@@HomeTheatreEngineering Yeah that NEO remote was great and it certainly lived up to the hype, now dealers can just sell everyone another remote 1 year later
@@dempsey3 I can't disagree with your comment on the Neeo. In our case though Control 4 has credited or replaced every one we sold that has had issues, so we are not reselling replacements to clients... But it was not by any means a stable product!
The Control 4 has good potential but agree it should allow theatre owners to setup their own systems.
I've been running a Logitech Harmony Hub (AUD$180) for the last 2 years and can control my whole theatre off my iphone. It's not quite as sophisticated as the Control 4 but does everything I need. :)
Thankfully my Apple TV remote is all I need to switch on my LG TV, Marantz amplifier and of course my Apple TV box. I use the remote to navigate through the apps and adjust the volume on the Marantz. One remote, be it Apple TV or Control4 is so very easy. Of course, I can just ask Siri to carry out some operations as well. Thanks for a fun, light hearted, yet informative video Andrew & Enzo.
Hi David Yep we (and Aaron) fully agree that this can be a solution. It gets more challenging controlling everything like changing sound modes on a Trinnov, for which even Aaron uses a phone app for, or switching asoec rstios etc. For those willing to invest time and effort a lot can be done with an Appletv remote. So for many this works. Once you get to Trinnov, madvr, Barco you need to “Aaron” your system. Aaron is a client who has taken appletv remote control to the next level but probably well above the ability of most users.
I understand with Control 4 you can't program any of it yourself. I'm told if you want to add a feature or a device, someone has to do that for you. Personally I wouldn't want that.
Fortunately I bought two Harmony Elite with hubs about the time they stopped making them so at least I have those. I'm also looking at this Home Assistant open source option. Maybe I'm wrong about control 4? Is it possible to have control, the ability to add features/devices yourself?
Hi, that is partially true but there is Composer HE software that allows the user to make considerable changes and program and customise etc. But this is a bit of a situation made worse arisen by a reputation created by unscrupulous Control 4 dealers who "lock their clients in" but this is not correct. I had a huge fight with one once over this! The user should have access to their customer.control4.com site which allows them to change their support specialist any time they want. Some dealers even set up these sites without telling the clients! We are fully transparent. The client sets this up, we show them how to change their support supplier so they have freedom of choice. If our clients want to add a device they just call us up and it takes a minute or two and we normally don't charge for that unless the change is considerable. Hope that helps...
Good video. Control4 has the same issues as all the other solutions. And depending on what you need to do it is a very expensive solution to do what the average consumer needs. I have an EA3 and four EA1s and five Neeo remotes and the only room the Neeo remote comes out is in the Home theater and that is because ability to control the projector, Lumagen and Apple TV with one remote. The Oppo 203 driver has always been hit and miss. As far as the other rooms go it’s far easier to just grab the Apple TV remote and let CEC do its magic. Or just grab the Oppo remote. You need to be comfortable withth programming to use Control4 home composer which I would submit the average user isn’t nor has the desire to be or they wouldn’t have a dealer based system in the first place. Plus composer is limited. There are still things I need my programmer to do that I can’t. And if you stop paying the yearly fee you lose the ability to donate if/then statements. Apple HomeKit is not cloud based. Im not saying HomeKit is the solution I don’t believe that at all. I’m just saying depending on your individual needs something like Savant or Control4 may not be either. I spent a lot of money to find that out. Again thanks for the content and hard work.
@@HomeTheatreEngineering Who knows, if I tried it I might like it but I'm just too much of a DIY guy, I really prefer just doing it all myself which is why I'm building everything myself in my theater.
I haven't actually set up the Harmony remotes yet, I just haven't gotten to it but hopefully next time I have any time at home I can get that going.
I expect Control 4 is perfect for the guys that want everything set up for them so it's just plug and play but that just isn't me.
It sounds like you are controlling a whole lot more than a home theatre and yes it can be expensive though I am also yet to see a robust whole home solution that is not a bit costly. In Australia we have C-Bus and it "ain't cheap!" It would be interesting to know what you are doing with the EA3 and four EA1's but if it is whole home that could easily make sense.. While we do provide whole home solutions our focus here today is the cheapest possible, most robust and reliable solution for a home theatre enthusiast. So sometimes just and EA-1 and setup and that's it with the client using phone/tablet. But of course there is a world of options available but most of all our goal is making the room easy to use for everyone and anything that does this is welcome. From our side being able to offer support to our clients is a high priority so they know we are there if they need us.
Hi. Nothing wrong with being a DIY guy! That's how we all start! I fully understand your focus and any automation system may not suit a particular client.. We have sent partially set up control 4 units out to DIYers who want stability and they have pretty much set the rest up themselves with us a fallback if needed. Have fun with your cinema and we wish you well.
Good remote for the right setup/use case. I’m guessing this applies to only the most hardcore enthusiasts or those with extremely complex setups. For the price and self-programmability, I’m not sure they’re quite there yet for me.
Even though Logitech isn’t doing much support for it anymore, the harmony hub can be ebay’d cheaply and will run 99% of users’ theaters. It’s the one I still recommend and use myself.
Runs DVD, projector, processor (and amps with a trigger), Apple TV, navigation (pause/play/volume etc).
I have 6 folks in the house and regardless of age (8-42) everyone can use it because it’s one touch for any of those features.
What might be useful is a comparison of where Logitech stops and where control4 does more. That down and dirty comparison is what will help folks make a decision that’s right for them.
Just curious…why no Halo or Halo Touch love?
Good question. Halo has not long been available in Aus and Halo touch we have been told is not available. We have very little to no experience with them therefore. But to be totally honest the one Halo we thought we jad lying around and were going to use for the video had just been sent out. So we didnt have one to hand and therefore simply forgot to mention it! Mea Culpa. I am also a little gun shy after varying Neeo experiences. But yes good call and definitely an omission on our part!
@@HomeTheatreEngineering Gotcha. Here in the states, we’ve had Halo’s for awhile now. So far, so good. The design and screen are welcome updates to the SR-260 cosmetic, and it is much better than the Neeo. Early returns were that they were a bit buggy, but we seemed to have worked our way through that. The Halo Touch just is starting to ship here, so no direct experience with it yet.
Thank you for the great content and always good advice. You’re true pros!!!
@@scottwallace1 Wow ! Thanks Scott.. We will be keen to try Halo and see how it goes.. Sorry we missed it in the video! And thank you, we do try and have based our business on a pretty simple philosphy.. “How would we like to be treated if I were the customer?” And we try hard to put ourselves in their shoes. It’s not always the most profitable approach but I sleep at night!
Do it with Home Assistent and IR Blaster like "Boadlink RM" = Done
Maybe for a simple setup but our rooms use Barco, Trinnov MadVR and multiple other systems plus integration into homes that have standard lighting (non hue etc). If it was that simple we certainly wouldn’t bother with anything more involved why would we? Simple is best we fully agree with that…Many of our clients also want support. When something does go wrong (firmware update changes behaviour) we login fix it in 2 mins. No charge to the client. Hone Assistant must use Home Assistant Cloud or be accessible from the Internet and secured with a valid, non self-signed, SSL certificate for location tracking. Our clients can fully pull the plug on us and still operate perfectly. Not everyone wants their control system cloud based, open source or not.
@@HomeTheatreEngineering True, i can agree with that :)
An even more transformation would be a pad or tablet, with down-loadable interfaces that match the each machine.
Agreed!
compared to harmony Wireless with smart hub, $1500 bux is still crazy. As long as the harmony hub lasts, I’ll continue to use it with the iOS app. The hardware remote that is synced is aging, mainly the battery, but still very much usable. I only run two sources AppleTV4K (HDR10+ edition) and a Zidoo. CEC is so close for me with the AppleTV remote unfortunately my JVC projector is the only holdout. I can’t control it with CEC, or 12V trigger, so my only realistic option is IR.
With 2 sources and a projector only then yes it’s a no brainer. But we specialise in cinemas with multiple sources, selectable sound and video formats, video and audio processors with integrated room lighting and customers who want support and generally don’t want to do this all themselves. In a case like yours then harmony was a good solution. But these days $1500 (aus) base price including processor, installation, setup and programming and 12 months free support on a highly stable and reliable unit with a very long life expectancy is a good deal for our kind of clients. It also gives us full IP control over many products like JVC projectors, bluray players and a host of other devices not to mention rs232 control and integration into pretty much any existing lighting system. So its a case of the right product for the right person.
@@HomeTheatreEngineering That’s the thing 99% of the viewing is from what source? I had a UB9000 but don’t remember the last time I played a UHD disc. Harmony also integrates with my Lutron lighting so that’s a plus. But yes, $1500 isn’t so bad considering the tens of thousands of $$ USD I spent on my Theater. I actually had URC but it was more a pain than useful. I needed the integrator to change custom settings every time I change something.
@@smptactical259 Integrators have done a lot of damage.. even on control 4 customers can do a massive amount of the programming. They just don’t like telling people that!