Stop Buying HiFi Until They Fix It!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ก.ย. 2024
- In a world where the hi-fi market is becoming increasingly unaffordable, music lovers are fighting back. Join us as we explore the silent protest unfolding, uncovering the impact of skyrocketing prices on both new and used equipment. Will the sound of value prevail, or is this the end of HiFi?
I would love to hear your opinions, comment down below!
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I'm so happy to see someone finally speaking up, not just making more excuses for these ridiculous price hikes. It has gotten to the point that some of these prices are laughable. I get that covid really messed with everything, but there has to be a limit after all. If we weren't so willing to pay up for whatever these companies are charging, they will have to re-think their pricing schemes. Part of it is our own fault. You go Mike! Thank you.
Thank you for the kind words my friend!
This is a general problem in the luxury goods industry. As money gets concentrated in fewer hands, the industry needs to raise prices of high-end items to get access to this money.
Yep. It is a luxury goods industry.
Where I take issue is when companies are presenting products as luxury goods and they don’t deliver.
@@audioarkitekts Agreed. Victorinox pocket knives are luxurious, too. But, I would be happy to pay a little more for that unmatched, high-precision, workmanship. Same goes for Rotring pencils and Tamiya model kits.
@@audioarkitekts Exactly. They find they can make more money from people for whom the extra money is trivial and are more impressed with the price tag. They’re not marketing to people who are looking for value for their hard-earned dollars.
I’m sorry - I lived in the HiFi world in the 70s and 80s. Literally. My basement was a testing lab for Stereo Review. There was SO much crappy gear back then. What you see now is a combination of survival bias and rose colored nostalgia.
We would have lost our minds at the audio quality we now carry around in our pockets.
Things aren’t perfect now, but they weren’t then. Do some price inflation calculations on what Krell or Audio Research or Conrad Johnson gear would cost in today’s dollars. Nothing’s changed here. Heck people still peddle the same snake oil.
Once again Mike pulls one out of the hat. He doesn’t mince words, he says it as he sees it and is not hesitant to slam manufacturers for sc**ing the consumers. I’ve always shopped carefully for audio equipment and it’s difficult to purchase something that has quality these days. Wonderful presentation and we should have more reviewers being so honest!!
Thank you so much for the kind words my friend!
I don't know, in my point of view, there is a lot more good quality audio gear than there used to be. In terms of higher priced stuff, there's always been that and as more and more rich audiophiles emerge the more that market grows. Let's face it just like in every other market, there's always going to be high rollers and what they are after is what you get to hear about most. Some of us have been enjoying some made in China stuff for a while, it lasts and works well, what this means is that while so called premium companies' goods go up in status, the average buyer needs to focus on companies that serve him or her. Otherwise, we appreciate you having some concerns and talking about the popular race to the top.
Agreed this guy has no clue. The equipment today blows away the equipment from the 70's. Just like the auto industry. Look at the price of a car back then and compare it to what the same car cost now. It's called inflation bozo
Totally agreed - but you'll have to spill the beans and name some specific examples. Otherwise, you're part of the problem.
I’m not going to get sued because people aren’t able to use their common sense. What you’re asking for is drama, not a solution to the problem.
@@audioarkitekts You're a reviewer, right? I have yet to see (or read) a review for High-End that doesn't end up with 'But that's MY personal preference - yours may differ'. That goes for the entire internet, as well as the magazines. Nobody will sue your ass for telling the truth about useless tweaks, lazy engineering, VU-meters, crappy LED-screens on streamers (who goes over and watches those tiny screens?) and headphone amp number 6 in your system.
@@audioarkitekts Mate, what are we talking about here? No one is going to sue you for saying the amps of X, Y and Z manufacturers are overpriced.
I’ll take that one……..Naim
@@jespermaintz8993can I ask if you award TH-cam hifi reviewers via Patreon? I do reviews of A is better than B when it exists and where one of those brands won’t be lending me gear or wants the risk of a bad review because they’ve seen me do it before. I say to brands that if they are prepared to loan products , in return they don’t get reviewed on TH-cam if they are not competitive. I tell my patreons instead they are bad.
But the reason that their exists a market where the reviews are not benchmarked , dishonest etc, is because youtube viewers largely dont want to pay the reviewer. The market dictates how those reviewers present their reviews just for the brands then, and if a reviewer keeps saying the products are great and gullible people keep posting ‘great review’ in the comments it self sustains reviews which aren’t reviews.
Is HI FI audio more expensive today than 10 years ago? Absolutely! We have inflation prices on consumer goods on every item you can think of, are people buying records and cds and turntables and amplifiers and speakers etc? Absolutely! Most major brands such as: Yamaha, Denon, Sony, NAD, Emotiva, JBL, etc, have affordable quality models in their audio catalog, and of course we have China Hi FI, with brands such as SMSL, Aiyima, Douk, Topping, etc, to name a few, most models are affordable and have acceptable quality standards, we are in exciting times in audio equipment, for all pockets and all budgets, my job as a consumer is to get informed of the products I want to buy, are some products overpriced for the quality they offer? Absolutely! That's where the information and research I do becomes very important for me and my wallet, thank you so much for all your videos.
My 4 year old AVR and 5 year old speakers has more than doubled the price. I thought I was going crazy, glad I found your video. If I have to replace them I'm probably going to settle vs buying the equivalent updated models, this is insane
Yeah the used market is getting crazy now too!
I concur and yet....with much of the audio "makers" own by corporate conglomerates, the pressure for ROBUST quarterly returns is significant. Yes, it harms the consumers, and even the working musicians, who could NEVER contemplate purchasing even mid-fi stuff, much less the boutique stuff. That said, I'm heartened by the rise of "Chi-fi," and while some if it is out-right crap, some is very, very good, much like the rise of the Japanese audio makers of the late 1960s onwards. I think this is a tough time for reviewers, as well. There is "so much stuff" out there. And sifting through what is real and what is "meh" takes time. Thank you for putting in the time!!!
I agree with the sentiment but think that the reality is that there are quite a number of good options for audiophiles which are quite affordable if they are willing to not be seduced by meaningless distinctions. The Fosi ZA-3 and many of the "Chi Fi" products from SMSL, Douk Audio, Fosi, and others are great examples of value performance that can be had for less money than ever before. Companies like Schiit and Emotiva make great gear that has fantastic performance and is priced realistically. There are still some old time stalwarts like NAD making great gear for reasonable money (I still have my first piece of audio gear - an NAD 7150 receiver from 1982 and it still works). They do have high end product lines but their cutting edge technology moves from the high end lines into the more value-oriented product lines in a reasonable time. You can get the Purifi amplifier modules in the higher end M-series but it's also available in the C298 amp as an example.
I know what you mean. One of the reasons I jumped (back) to CD’s is the rediculous prices of vinyl. The market for hi-fi and records has gone up like 40% in the last 4 yrs
What an excellent video and message. I concur with everything you say. I well remember my 1st decent HiFi - A&R Cambridge (Arcam) A60, Rega Planar 3, Mordant Short MS10s. No remote control, no LED screen, no DACs, just lovely musical sound. Later added a Nakamichi ZX7 and a Marantz CD player. Keep up the good work. And Merry Christmas to you from the other side of The Pond 😊
Thank you so much for the kind words, Merry Christmas! 🎄🎁
I have a completely different take. We are living in a wonderful time when the price of achieving really good sound quality is within the means of everyone. Audiophiles will be audiophiles and they've always been willing to spend money on snake oil. Hype isn't a new trend, and if somebody wants to drop 20k on a DAC that isn't functionally better than a unit you can buy for $300 I don't care. They have the money to waste any way they see fit.
You can achieve it, but you have to go looking for it. It’s not how it was, where you could go into a store, listen to their offerings and then select from good, better, best.
@@audioarkitektsAnd then came the internet, audio dealers were gradually forced to close their businesses, because everybody wants a deal. 😉
I remember exactly how much several amplifier models (from several ranges) cost back in the 80’s and 90’s, and they were not as cheap as it might seem today.
If you wanted a Marantz or Technics stereo amplifier around 2x60 watt rms at 8 Ohm from their dedicated series, you should expect to pay around 300 euros in the mid/late 80’s.
Take this value and add up inflation since then, and these prices don’t seem that cheap anymore.
On top of that, HiFi was at (or near) its peak in popularity and demand, so manufacturers were building and selling loads of products every day.
In 2023, that’s no longer the case, for many well known reasons.
But have you ever wondered why so many AV Receivers have better specs and way many more features than stereo amps from the same manufacturer at the same price point?
It’s the old economies of scale, and in the big picture, there is still more demand for AV Receivers than stereo amplifiers (even if it’s only a shadow of what it was in early 2000’s). 😉
But I do agree with you that we’re living in a wonderful time for music. 🙂👍
For less than a new release CD used to cost, you can have a monthly subscription of a lossless audio service like Tidal, and listen to virtually anything you can think of.
Portable devices are no longer huge things using cassette tapes or CD’s, and running on non-rechargeable batteries that you had to keep on buying.
Tape always had their sonic limitations (and other problems), and before you could even start to think about how good the DAC of the “Discman” was performing, you were happy just by being able to hear music while moving without skipping. 🙂
The offer for good headphones (or in-ears) at decent prices was much rarer than it is today.
Things are a lot better these days.
High-end does increased their prices exponentially, but no one actually needs to spend that kind of money for that level of performance.
Most of the many shiny bits of high end audio don’t do a thing about audio performance, just like expensive watches are rarely better at telling the time.
I look at it as audio jewelry, and although I’m not their target customer, I’m glad that it exists.
The answer, to buy well designed and produced second hand.
If you’re choosing well it will tick all the boxes and go up in value.
Even the used market has gotten out of hand
@@audioarkitekts oh
I agree and disagree at the same time. I currently own a 40+ y/o Bryston amp that out plays anything I can afford today. At the same time that amp did cost a fortune when it was new and a similar replacement from Bryston does cost $$$ today.
Back in the 1970's, at a ripe young age of 19, I took out a bank loan to purchase my new Marantz receiver, JBL speakers and a Dual turntable.
I really don't see how much has changed with the exception of Chi-Fi.
You want quality? Pay up!
I have a 70s Marantz receiver. I love it and it sounds good. But personally I prefer modern amps more
I see the HiFi world differently , we have countless options from used Hi-end audio sites, Chi-fi, great inexpensive external dac's ,great budget amps. We all need to be smart consumers. My issue is there are so few places to check out and listen to Hi-end equipment. The Hi-end audio model of selling at full price is crazy, based on consumers always looking for the best price on-line
These days …we’re all looking for that unicorn 🦄 in the audiophile universe.
Hence , ChiFi …bang for buck .
Great video.
If ChiFi keeps up the good work, it's going to turn the tide for many boutique brands that think they can justify premium pricing without any inherent value!
Already done it. Now aged 65 I purchased all Rotel RC1572MKII, RB1582MKII and RCD1572MKII coupled to B&W ASW600 and B&W 683's and for such little money it sounds amazing. I'm good until I'm 85 and then I might have to replace the CD player at the very least.@@audioarkitekts
Never a truer word spoken, I have a denon amplifier which is over 20 years old fantastic build quality 28kg, and wonderful sound quality. My new QUAD ,amplifier doesn't come close.
Thank you for the support!
Great video! Back in the day before you bought a piece of gear, you had to rely on the knowledge of the salesman and maybe a review in a stereo magazine. No TH-cam reviews or in-depth online opinions you could research for days. There were some brands that were known for their quality that you had to get at a Hifi shop, then there was everything else. But even back then, Circuit City carried decent stuff---now it's vintage today.
Yes!!
My avr I bought 5 years ago and I was looking at the new version and it went up 550 bucks over what I paid for mine…
How do they justify that??
It’s not like it has anything drastically new or different over the one I have….
Ridiculous
I still use a 90's Krell KRC3 pre for instance with a Bryston 4bsst, there are a myriad of older quality stuff made without 'a sea of RF' inside the equipment. I wish I had eBay in the 80's the stuff I see for sale is still desirable.
God Bless U mr Mike!!!!
Somebody had to say it I'm glad U did!!!
Source is so good today we actually only pay to have those micro-details projected 6-15 feet deeper into the space, because that part of making it real
Thank you for your support!
Let me add that caveat emptor is the order of the day, it is up for us as consumers to educate ourselves on the products as to properly ascertain the value of any product and on the flip side free enterprise dictates make as much money as you can, a perfect tango.
You are so right Michael. There are companies selling vintage looking, full size receivers that look great but have cheap Class D amps like NAD and cost over $1000.00. Companies like JBL that have morphed into a bluetooth party speaker company. Keep up the good work young man!
Thank you so much Mike! Your support has been amazing!
Times are not all bad today. In fact, you can buy a great system for under $300. Back in the day, good speakers alone would cost more than $300. Cheaper materials today? Absolutely, but I think that is to keep costs down for more profit. One example is the external belts on turntables saying it's better for sound quality but we know better it's to make save manufacturing costs
Why make a company with dozens of workers, a large network and stock piles of products sold at a fair price when you can produce super expensive gears with just 2 or 3 people, almost zero stock, and a super high end image brand... because it's expensive ?!
You get the idea !
Yeah I understand that point for sure.
The "premium pricing" ploy is not new and happened in the 70's and 80's .... I was in the audio biz back then.
The only remarkable difference was going from the $500 KEF to the $800 Dynaudio bookshelf. Clarity and dynamics doubled. I will report after hearing the $2000 Arendal.
Those are still acceptable prices for 2023. You’ve actually piqued my interest with Dynaudio. I might have to hear some now.
@@audioarkitekts Dynaudio Emit 10 has good crossover circuitry and a "natural" presentation. Neither analytical nor bombastic. It is not as dynamic as a Sonus Faber, and the bass isn't as textured as a KEF reference-unless the source recording truly calls for it. (This I judge by my expensive Audio-technica headphones). I am using a Rotel a11 and a Schiit 4-band eq to bring dynamics and texture to the presentation. Dynaudio, now, provides satisfying midrange presence and mid-bass oomph. (Sounded anemic with Audiolab 6000; veiled with Arcam 20; and confused with Hegel H190)....Looking forward to hearing the much-hyped Arendal.
Do cables, power conditioners, usb cables, etc go on your list as well? 😇
That was part of my Snake Oil video lol
@@audioarkitekts cool I'll have to watch that
I saw the writing on the wall when vintage audio equipment fell victim to price gouging several years ago. I have seen places put a premium price on audio - whether it worked or not.
I can see some pieces that are rare have a collectibility factor but just pricing anything vintage to the sky is not right.
@mykandrew Absolutely 100% agree 👍!! That's very close to my long reserved thoughts on the pricing of vintage units. Buying vintage gear has had mixed results for me. I've stopped doing it for now.
we have a value system disorder - its all about the bottom line and image over substance and its across the board.
A lot of the problem is that consumers don't complain effectively. You see this across the board with lots of consumer goods. Therefore, companies assume everyone is just fine with the garbage they put out. A great example would be the American auto industry in 2008. The companies admitted fault by redesigning and styling of foreign products. In reality vintage hifi is simple and it works, and is repairable. Therefore, it's a no brainer. I'm not interested in music that needs to be converted a time or two before it comes out of my speakers. People like UV meters. Put them back in it's a nice visual to what your listening to. They also tell you when you may have a channel dropping out. And there just plain cool.
You nailed it!!! Enduring and substantial is a lost art in our current world.
Agreed 👍
Current Rotel, Marantz etc are perfectly fine. No need to pay a fortune.@@audioarkitekts
You basically described every industry
What you've stated here is just half the problem...... The other half, which I believe is far more dire, is the overprocessing of music and recordings.... Especially the widespread use of "Auto-Tune," which I believe has not only been a deterrent for people to embrace high-fidelity playback (it subconsciously makes prospective listeners "unimpressed" with high-fidelity playback), but also stunted the development of music artists to become great like they have been in the past. (We have no Sarah Vaughans, Miles Davises, Led Zeppelins, John Coltranes, or Eva Cassidys anymore.) The use of Auto-Tune by recording engineers has been so abusive, it has even applied in the remastering of classic albums of the past.
This is not a new problem. This has been a problem for at least a couple of decades save a break around 2015 through 2017 when makes, both big box and "exclusive" wised up and started putting out very high quality gear at prices within reach of most folks whether enabling immediate purchase or a little saving up with a reachable goal. There were also individuals I will call The Rebel Alliance (Star Wars reference) that gave the "exclusive" brands fits by offering equivalent product as those brands low four figure "entry-level" items for three figures. One leader of that movement is Andrew Jones when he was at Pioneer and Elac. (The Elac gig really ruffled feathers of the elites).
So we know it can be done. My problem today is in agreement with you, what we see now is willful greed. Same problem as before. The added sting is the cost of media along with gear! There is no reason a vinyl record should be $60, $100, $200 and up! Yes, in the beginning of "the vinyl revival" there was reason for high media prices because the cost of new presses or restoring moth-balled ones is a lot as was the cost of consumables for said presses. However, as of about 3+ years ago the consumables (PVC pellets) and such are dirt cheap and the restorations and new pressing machines have been fully paid off. Only the cost of maintenance remains which is about the same as a car, which is also high, but not $20,000+ per month high. A record should not be more than $15 unless it is a double LP or box set of three or more. On top of that, the provenance of today's reissues is highly suspect if not never to be known and the sound quality is hit or miss. (We also have far too many reissues of the same records).
Back to the gear: My system of separates is about 5 years old and at the time while it took a couple of years, I was able to save up for purchase. That same gear of same brand is still being produced and sold and is now triple what it was when I got it and it did not happen gradually. 1.5 years after purchase it went up $100, ok, no big deal. However, less than one year after that each piece has gone up $700 to $800!!!! All that does is cause an insurance headache if one already has said gear and an impossible dream for one who has not! I don't know where the word "fair" would possibly fit in!
When I got into the industry as a reporter/reviewer, whatever it was still during the previous time of the same problem (2012-2014 is when it hit me after attending my first trade show). I was so disgusted at the prices and attitude that I fought back by becoming a journalist which was far from my list of things to do in life, but I was pissed! I'm glad I did that for the four years I did (2014 - 2018), but you could not pay me enough to do it now.
Today the only obtainable now is Chi-Fi and while a portion of it is rather good, it is hit or miss and also in danger of going away very soon due to politics and the like.
The 70s for Hi-Fi gear was the gold standard. I still use turntables from both the early 70s and mid 80s as daily drivers and have had not one issue save the fading of some screen print on the control panel. Everything else is in extremely good condition, including the dust cover. I bought them used and the highest price was $400 for the 80's Denon DP-47f, my two 70s tables were $25 and $30 respectively. This was back around 2002 or so. If I had to replace one of them with equivalency I'm looking at about $10,000 today! It should not be like that, as a result it makes it near impossible to insure them. My insurance company is quite good, but they have their limits like anyone else. They have no problem replacing my separates with new at whatever the current price is, but for the turntables no longer made, they would likely give nothing or perhaps $100 at best. They would not give me $10k to go out and get another Direct Drive table.
I also have two early 70s receivers (Marantz 2836B and Sansui 8080db). I swap them in and out from time to time as they sound entirely different from my main stuff and they are fun. The build on them is unsurpassed (hand built in Japan) back then! Today's Marantz is nothing like the 70s. I paid around $80 for the Sansui and $230 to recap it. The Marantz was gifted to me and it just cost me $120 to have the amp sections redone. I based my purchase of my "big boy" rig on the inside of my Sansui essentially.
Planned obsolescence: The bane of consumers for decades on everything! I had a Kenwood first gen surround receiver and a pair of large Kenwood speakers back in the mid eighties. The receiver lasted until about 2004 (19 years) before giving up the ghost. The same age speakers may still be going in someone's home as I sold them for what I paid 19 years later! They are not the higher quality of today's speakers, but still....what a shelf life!
The connection between the consumer and music is from the quality of the gear and the tastes of the consumer. I'm not sure about "pride in owning gear", that has never been a thing for me. I just want gear that performs well, checks all or 9 out of 10 boxes and lasts for at least 20 years. I don't care who sees it or whatever.
Yes, then there is the environmental impact that we don't even think about much of the time because we are forced into this mess of planned obsolescence and replacement or upgradeidis, even those of us who are not really susceptible!
As for the industry getting back to the values of the 70s and such, sadly, there is no chance, the pull of greed is far to strong and it is a herculean task just to get them to even listen to the music of the 60s and early 70s.
There is one make I can name that still upholds the values of the 70s and such when it comes to gear, even to the point of STILL making it by hand in Japan! That company is Accuphase. The very unfortunate thing there though is the fact, that their products are very hard to get in the US and the cost of their lowest priced integrated is fairly prohibitive (around $5000). I'd kill for even their entry level Integrated knowing I'll never have one. In fact, I have only seen one Accuphase product in the wild once and that was back in 2015! Accuphase gear even looks....no, screams early 70s in looks, but the build is of the same quality! I wonder what Accuphase shelf life is, hmm? I would think it would be pretty up there.
A good example of Brand over quality and value is McIntosh. Today's McIntosh gear is still priced too high and the quality is very cheap. Today's McIntosh gear starts failing around the 1.5 to 2 year mark. It is very much not the same as the McIntosh of yesteryear, which I have also heard and lasts forever. Part of the reason for the poor quality is that McIntosh is now part of a big mass market conglomerate solely focused on consumerism. They used to be private or more cottage, if you will.
What really makes me sick to this day is the misleading notion that the higher the price, the better it is. I'm so sick of hearing audiophiles and others tell others "$10,000 is a bargain because that price is higher in today's money and economy of scale". First of all, they don't know the first thing about economics. Second, they just want to be comforted for the mistakes of ignorance they made by trying to get others to do the same and end up in ruin. Any resistance to that with fact is met with hostility. Example: "your system is crap because it only cost you $5000 or $3000 or whatever". "Your DAC is no good because it did not cost $10k". "You don't know anything because your system is less than $50k". "If you are not willing to pay or do not have enough money for this or that item, then you should not be in the hobby or even listening to music".....etc. Even some manufactures do this crap (PS Audio is a good example). Some dealers are noted for it as well (some, not all, there are a couple of very nice kind dealers who would rather educate and encourage and have patience that I have run into in my days, far and few, but they are there).
These brands you speak to here do not understand economics either. They think they can make more and survive by selling two or three pieces per year to the 1% or something instead of making tens of times more by having a few additional high quality items on offer with accessible pricing to hundreds of thousands more folks.
I think part of it is also attitude. Those who have access to such gear whether real or fake quality want to be an elite group and not let anyone else in while at the same time complaining about lack of interest in it by others.
Man, I think your video here may have triggered me. Not your fault Michael, everything you talked about is very important to be said and needs to be said! I can't agree more with everything you said!
This video should be a sticky or viral or whatever and sent to every audio company and consumer!
Thank you so much for your thoughts and insights on the subject. You are completely right! This hobby has gotten a bit out of hand with brands across the board adopting the same principles as the elite luxury brands. It's not the right direction for this. You mentioned Andrew Jones, but Bob Carver did this as well when he saw prices of amplifiers a bit inflated. It's not a new concept but I feel it's worse now than ever before.
A correction on Bob Carver. I knew him. He is not in the same hero section as Andrew and a couple of others. Let's just say he is not what he wants you to think he is. I have some receipts. Hint: Emotiva is one of very few companies who are hanging onto the values you spoke of. I forgot to mention them. While they are not considered high-end or what have you, even they don't make that bold a claim, but they build stuff according to price point they want to achieve and many folks are quite happy with their products. They also have very good service from those I know who use their products. If I did not have what I have now and was just getting into this or had the need, Emotiva would be on my short list without hesitation. I've met some of the folks there, good people! I'm also glad I met and was befriended by Andrew Jones when he came to ELAC. Andrew showed me the secret of how he does what he does (he is on the side of the consumer) and I was invited to be an insider as well. I don't know why, but Andrew and Chris and folks at ELAC treated me with extraordinary kindness from the get go. They are also true to their word. It is too bad Andrew is not their anymore, I miss visiting and doing lunch from time to time, I live a few minutes away from ELAC North America. I haven't visited in about 5 years though.
I think that inflation since the pandemic has increased the prices of everything including luxury goods like hi-fi equipment. I think with the advent of wireless technology and streaming that music has entered a new era. More people have access to their music in any setting through their mobile devices and relatively affordable Bluetooth speakers. Higher fidelity equipment is more expensive and in some cases unbelievably expensive. That high price ethos is everywhere including luxury items like luxury cars, boats and homes. However consumers can get a music or home theater system that sounds better than ever with some of the latest technology like wireless connectivity for under $1,000 US. That’s a great deal IMO. You can enjoy quality sound whatever your budget.
I’d be interested to learn what brands this video alludes to. I’m assuming NAD, Yamaha, Wharfedale, JBL as they’ve gone large on the vintage vibe ???
It's not just one brand, many luxury high end brands all the way down to cheap generic overseas outfits are guilty of this.
Merry Xmas Michael!
🎄🎄🎄🎄🎄🎄🎄🎄🎄🎄🎄
A certain company out there pushes pricey goods of dubious efficacy,while dressing in a smart suit and owning 2 sports cars that they keep in their factory. They know who they are.
While we are on the subject of marketing, can we talk about TH-cam “reviewer’s” that sell out their audience and themselves for a short term marketing contracts?
Honest opinions are hard to come by nowadays.
Unfortunately I’m not high enough on the totem pole to have yet been offered a “short term marketing contract” from any company to provide biased reviews. I’m sure it happens but nobody will ever admit to it. However publications have been doing it for years so that is nothing new.
The biggest difference to me between then and now is build quality. My Sansui AU-555A is built to the nines.
Otherwise, there are good sounding affordable equipment and better sounding less affordable equipment.
There’s a lot less duds out there now though. Seriously, think about all those awful speakers! Ugh!!
happy with my arendal and benchmark combo!
Thanks for your commentary. Could you give some more specific examples of the types of things that illustrate your concern? What features...? What brands...? Etc...?
AI bot comment.
@mavfan1 No, I am not an AI Bot... just looking to get more information regarding his concerns is all.
To be honest most of the time I’d much prefer AI bot comments.
I think you’re completely wrong on this. There has never been better audio gear across the entire price spectrum. You can put together really good systems today under $1K. There are brands in the industry going further upscale but that’s where their market is. For those who can afford those prices - and there are more of them today than in the 80s - there are companies chasing those buyers. Nothing wrong with that.
I take solace from the knowledge that many of the trinkets bought by wealthy individuals are overpriced and that good products are often affordable, such as the amp mentioned in this video. Products marketed as audiophile equipment have always been expensive, and given their performance, many (but by no means all) were overpriced.
Excellent 👍 💯
Thank you 🙏
Thank you for saying loud, what we all know
I wish you had given some examples; it's hard for me to see the basis for your argument. I think of some brands out there like Schiit, Parasound, Emotiva, and others and wonder -- are these the overpriced and flimsy products? Cambridge? NAD? Wharfedale? Klipsch? Focal? It seems like it's pretty easy to set up a good system for not that much money with quality at or above that of the 1970's and 1980's. So -- I'm interested in why you're making this passionate claim but I really need some particular evidence.
Yes it's depressing but sadly true 😔
Unfortunately so.
Great message, bravo
Thank you!
I am sorry, I cannot agree with your opinions in this video. The bubble I am living in is completely different from yours.
That’s completely fair.
Simple, share all your CD, etc with your friends and when you get your friends CDs, rip them on your computer and listen to that. Streaming is a total scam.
TBH good sound has always been expensive (for the most part). The snake oil salesman have been around since the mid 70's at least. The vast majority of consumers listen to S**T music and have no clue what good sound is and don't care. (unfortunately). It does leave the rest of us in a difficult position as consumers. It does require a good bit of research to find good equipment at affordable prices but it is doable. I have a discreet bi-amplified system that gives great sound at around $1500 not counting the cost of my P.C. I don't see the current rend changing anytime soon. As far as I can tell outside of very old Audiophiles the only other people who care about good sound are musicians and X-musicians. The last few decades have produced a whole lot of musicians and fellow travelers. Enough that they have become a fairly large consumer block that can't be ignored. Its practically the only reason that there is a market for good music and hence a demand for good equipment. (though small compared to the bulk of the market)
Do you guys have a discord server for audio people?
Here you go: discord.gg/ZQhmkHdyyt
For me i wanted something for the next 10+ years.
I now have a marantz 40n with D17 tower speakers.
Not looking and knowing that i have a setup i love.
There will always be better stuff, but i'm done and happy 😄
That's where we should all be! Thanks for the comment.
@@audioarkitekts 😄 thanks man, have a great day.. love you video's.
I really like this view
Thank you!
🙄🤫my Silbersand Sphings plays from 0-500khz on a Dynavox amp push pull and you can easy tune in class A...and you have two tube over...😋Chinese Democrazy
prices for high quality audio products that sound good and are well made are very high. although your idea is good, it will practically not be implemented
Well Articulated.
Thank you so much!
Fosi?
Really?
While I understand and agree with what you’re saying (charging up more just because you can), I don’t see Fosi as real hi-fi amplifiers.
They have too many design problems, and that’s precisely the kind of product that will end up sooner in the trash.
I would like to have seen some clear examples of those 10x more expensive amplifiers that aren’t so good, as I’m suspect you’re not using the best products on that price range as a fair comparison (although I can be wrong). 😉
But this Fosi amplifier is frequency/impedance dependent (unlike any average class A/B or good class D design), which makes them harder to predict how will they make a lot of loudspeakers sound.
That’s the last thing you want or need on an amplifier, even if their power rating is nothing more than science fiction.
Fosi has been doing their “homework” with TH-cam reviewers, and while we can agree that they offer a lot for the price, the price is still very low and you end up getting what you paid for.
If you want to address this price/value issue seriously, any used amplifier from reputable brands will likely sound better, have a much better build quality, replacement parts over the years (_if_ you ever need them), and you can be confident that the advertised power is there (even if the advertised number is lower, because most had to obey regulations that most cheap Chinese amps clearly don’t).
I have absolutely nothing against Chinese manufacturers, and some were able to design great products (the smartphone arena shows what they can do).
But even the smartphone arena, the best (and most popular) Chinese brands are only able to be a little cheaper than other brands like Samsung with similar specs, while making some errors that Samsung also did… …when they were starting on those products, more than a decade ago. 😉
China builds all sorts of products, and in a way, they may be doing what the Japanese manufacturers did many decades ago (and Koreans did a few decades after).
But unlike the Japanese manufacturer culture, China can build both great products as well as terrible and blatant copies of any well known brand!
They level of quality is everywhere, and it’s much harder to know what you’re really buying, at least until it has been independently tested.
Coming back to audio amps, Fosi amps usually show their cheap design while being measured, with severe flaws (at least in the sense of what HiFi should be and has been for many decades).
Take any new HiFi stereo amp from Yamaha today (or 20 years ago) and put them on a test bench.
The cheaper designs won’t be very powerful, you won’t have the same build quality as you have on the most expensive models, and even the volume dial won’t be or feel as good.
It was _exactly_ the same in the 80’s, and I was in a position where I was able to play with all of that in that era (and after).
But you can almost bet that its specs will be achieved, and that they’ll deliver a flat frequency response no matter if you’re using 8, 4 or 3,2 Ohm loudspeakers.
Good luck on achieving this with a Fosi amp….
Fosi could probably make a really decent (or even great) amplifier with none of the issues that they usually have, but they wouldn’t be that much cheaper than some well known manufacturers.
But who would buy a Fosi amp if it was only slightly cheaper than a Japanese one??
There’s a reason why Fosi amps are so cheap, and why good amps aren’t (and never were) _that_ cheap!
There’s only so much any manufacturer can do with such a limited budget, and none is able to do miracles.
Again, you started with an interesting topic, but went terribly off the rail by using such a bad example on so many levels.
What do you (or anyone) believes that it will happen when this cheap device breaks out of the warranty period?
Is anyone going to pay someone to repair it (like it has been done for decades with well established manufacturers), or will it end up in a dump, replaced by a new one, helping to increase pollution to our planet???
What’s the hourly rate of any technician?
More than what this amp costs new, at least on several parts of the world! 😉
The best advice I can give to anyone starting out in HiFi is to avoid spending money on disposable products like this.
They won’t hold none of their initial value over a short period of time (let alone a longer one), it will never be a good HiFi amplifier, and by the time you upgrade anything in your system (like loudspeakers), that huge bottleneck will be there.
Save only a bit more and buy an used stereo amplifier from a well known brand instead.
Try to avoid built in dacs and other digital features that increase the chances of the amplifier failing for things that you can buy on separate components, and upgrade over time if you ever need.
There’s nothing more expensive than a truly cheap product.
Go see the measurement results I did on the ZA3 review. The video before this one. I wouldn’t be cheerleading for Fosi if they hadn’t thoroughly impressed me.
Isn't capitalism great? 😔
Definitely not in HiFi
$149 can challenge something 10xs the price? Yea dont think so. It may come close and after the warranty runs out you'll need to buy a new one because it does not work
Or you’re wrong and you’ll thank me when the warranty runs out
next time name names and products instead of speaking in general. get specific since its been weighing on you so bad
Google high end audio and just pick from there.
Naim, Linn, dCS
Trend is expensive audio jewelry, that is over engineered and full of parts that are use to increase the selling price. Today audio quality is very good for everyday components. Audio product differentiation is currently not based on quality music reproduction.
I can agree!
Im fine with your POV, but in truth there is better sound available for lower prices (adjusted) now than ever before. I was buying in the 70s so have first hand knowledge. See Emotiva, Klipsch. KEF The highest end is an affluent hobby. PS promoting Chinese disposable products is counterproductive to your theme.