LED fire simulator teardown and schematic
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 พ.ย. 2021
- I've featured a smaller version of this unit before, but was travelling with work at the time, so didn't go into it too deeply. So here's the bigger version with a complete teardown and schematic.
If you look at the warp core on Star Trek you'll see it's a scaled up version of this effect. It's actually very good. The simplicity of construction is quite pleasing.
This unit is actually worth getting just for the parts inside. The power consumption as supplied is just half a watt (118mA at 4.5V).
This unit came from a local hardware store called JAC stores in Ramsey, but they seem to be common on eBay. They keywords are fireplace lamp.
In hindsight, the power jack probably breaks the negative connection as usual. There is a pin on the chip that comes out to a pad which I marked with a question mark. It's probably just an option to test for a clock signal or as a spare pin for an extra feature.
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#ElectronicsCreators - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
Its amazing how convincing the effect is compared to how simple the mechanism is
You can improve its fire simulation capabilities by connecting it to a few car batteries in series
Infinite Solutions approves your method.
That's not simulation, that's emulation (lol!).
Lol
More like realization.
🤣🤣🤣🤣made my day
Makes me happy that things are still made like this instead of being purely done in software :3
I double that, having seen modern software.
Anybody else want to see what happens when you combine two or three methods?
Plus, doing it using computers would cost a LOT MORE! 👎😂
Doing it in software would require an expensive screen. Well, expensive compared to this thing, anyway. This is probably just a few dollars' worth of parts. A screen and suitably-powerful processor to generate a fire effect in software would easily be ten times the cost.
@@Roxor128 well, you could use projections, maybe differently, but still could.
I'm always impressed with how real these fire boxes look.
@ツMoon Owner - Owner of the Moon Patreon.
@ツMoon Owner - Owner of the Moon Yup, Patreon. I consider it my Adblock tax. 😅
You should have a look at the Dimplex Opti-myst. Far better effect.
@Matt Quinn Yeah they aren't cheap, in most cases a bioethanol-powered real fireplace is probably cheaper. But these are permanent fixtures, and people do spend it large on these showcase products as they add more value to their real estate, when it's time to flip.
They've been using the same technique for at least 70 years. My mom had an old incandescent version from the 50s that functioned exactly the same way. I took it apart when I was a kid. And put it back together too. Otherwise, I wouldn't be here now telling you about it. The actual materials weren't the same of course, but the principles involved are the same. Except for one thing. That one actually had a 1400 watt radiant heater built into it.
And I have recently sold a “vintage Belling fire suit” on eBay that has the same flame effect as the one you have described - as the customer wanted a 50/60s themed interior to their recently bought house 🥰
I remember the one my grandparents had - a disc that rotated in the convection current caused by the incandescent orange bulbs. I found it mesmerising!
I've *always* wanted one of those. *watches the video*
I think I have a project.
This commentator knew what was good for them
I'd be very tempted to cut out some letters in a bit of my own mylar to see of it's possible to sneak a rude word into the effect.
I think you've just given me a Christmas present idea!
The profaniflame.
🔥🅱️🔥🔥🔥🔥
🔥🔥🅾️🔥🔥🔥
🔥🔥🔥🅾️🔥🔥
🔥🔥🔥🔥🅱️🔥
0r a shape ;)
@@JaRobot Too bad Halloween is just past. Flame images of ghosties and ghoulies would be terrific!
Excellent idea
The effect is truly well done. Lots of hackability in this, too! I could see playing around with this a long time to create different effects.
Colour changing LEDs would be a good way to start.
@@zh84 First thing that came to my mind was slowing the rotation, putting white LED's in, and cutting out ghosts for a Halloween effect.
@@Okurka. True, though you could take the filter out.
It's an OK effect for the price, but once you see it in person you'll find the effect to be just a plain 2D projection. Good fake fire effects use water vapour (e.g. Dimplex Opti-myst).
6:00 was the best and simplest description as to why quartz are relevant to computing clocks yet.
thank you
I feel like using flicker flame LEDs would be a logical mod here. The intensity changes coupled with the reflections could expand the effect nicely.
would self-flickering LEDs look cool to add to the dynamic mylar reflections I wonder?
only thing that seemed missed out was that the lights are also illuminating the ember'd logs. which flickering leds might make a little odd. now if you could get a few fading leds, possibly slightly differently tinted that might look rather nifty. pulsing would seem more natural than a flicker. although if you added about 4 flickering leds in there with a timer to fire them off one at a time in an alternating pattern vs a linear one, it could add to the effect . just my 2 cents on the idea.
This teardown is inspiring me to build a custom insert for my unused fireplace I can scale up the reflectors and use some led strips with WLED where I could have a mixture of fading and fire effect lights. I just need to buy some sheets of milar
I was wondering about trying to shove 2 sets of rotating mirrors in, so the speed difference stops you getting repeating patterns
@@nathanlucas6465 Just had a similar thought myself. Didn't see your comment in time!
I really should read more comments before posting my own. Just posted this myself.
Its beginning to look a lot like Christmas... BigClive is now into the Christmas style electronics...
I predict a future video where Clive makes his own supersize version of this :)
We had something like this back in the 70's. On a bigger scale, it was a 3 bar fire place with a light bulb and metal spinning disc for the flame effect. Only downside was the horrible fake polystyrene brick effect surround. As young children at the time, we would normally poke holes in the polystyrene bricks.
As you do.
@@oldbatwit5102 right? like the polystyrene drop ceiling panels in my grade school... every classroom you went into there were a bunch of pens and pencils that had been blasted into orbit by means of a flexible ruler... now they just hung there, ominously threatening to randomly let go and imbed themselves into your skull on their way back to earth =)
We had a much classier one... Spinny, shiny disc thing with a 60w lightbulb painted red + orange (definitely hand painted)
But the 'real log' effect fibreglass fakery at the front was absolute top notch... The sort of thing you would expect to find in a Rolls Royce foot well
Cheap and nasty can also be high class!
I had one of those also back in the 70's but instead of one bulb there were four 10 watt small color bulbs and a long spinning tube with what appear to be hairs of aluminum for the flame effect.
@@javiergt wow, that's really posh!
Good job on the teardown, as always, Clive. I like of these units so much that the gears wore down and got loud, so I spent the time to figure out how to drive it with a silent stepper motor system, so that it runs with no noise and will never have gear problems 😀🤓😂
Great Idea.
Wouldn't mind seeing an instructional video on that.
A £10 solution to a £2 problem 🤣... But so would I... They are great!
what type of engine is it? step motor? with which characteristics can I search for it?
I used to have an old "Magicoal" heater that used something very similar but with two 'flame orange' incandescent lightbulbs and a small geared synchronous motor
o for the love of the wee man. yes! magicoal was the bees knees at one time, ae. i took one apart, like clive jus did. had great fun
We had one when I was small. I had forgot the name but as soon as I saw "Magicoal" I was a kid again for a few seconds.
Ah yes, the good old "Berry Magicoal" - I remember seeing the adverts on the telly, back in the 1960s, back in the days when brand names meant something.
My parents had something similar: a red bulb for the light and a vaned wheel to provide the effect. No motor; the wheel was entirely driven by the hot air rising from the bulb. Heat came from standard electric fire elements mounted either side of and below the fire effect.
@@Michael75579 Even old school gas fires (e.g. Flavel Welcome - installed in mum's house in the late 1980s, still manufactured and made today) had the twin bulb, vaned spinner and fibreglass fake coal below and in front of the radiants.
Now I want to see DIY Perks do his version of an LED fireplace
He will start by doing a spectral analysis of a real fire and recreate the spectrum completely including the heat radiation. It will also be water cooled.
£12,000 later and he'll have an led fireplace you can make with just £40 and impossible DIY skills.
Fairs fair though I was impressed with the microphone.
@@3dlabs99 ...
Yes, and it would all be made out of 3mm Aluminium sheets.
Back in the 1960s my gran had an electric bar heater with this sort of effect. It worked using a red painted 60w light bulb and a metal disc above it. The heat from the bulb caused the disc to rotate thus producing the flickering effect.
Yes, that's what I was alluding to!
The end of the video would make me feel like I was having a white Christmas with Christmas music or just some instrumental music or even the sounds of having a fire in a fireplace on a at home date.
I kept flinching when you touched the 'hot' surface. It reminded me too much of the fire our caravan when I was a child - barely felt any heat from it until you'd accidentally touched the mica window.
Never taken a look at the innards of one of these before, remarkably simple yet clever method.
I opened one of these fake fireplaces up once because I wasn't happy with it and saw how it worked. I improved it and made it very realistic using some tinsel and aluminum foil (which really works well and can be manipulated however you want and gives a softer effect. The tinsel combined with it fills it out and gives more depth and a bit of sparkle to it like flames and sparks. These were just additions to what they already used) and gluing a mirror behind it as well as repositioning some of the LEDs and I still have it. It's too long to go into all tye details of everything I did but It looks like real fire now and is twice as bright. An unexpected but happy consequence was that it makes some realistic crackling sounds as the aluminum foil hits the back as it spins. I was going to fix that but It was a nice feature and wasn't hurting anything. Great video because for many years those were a mystery to me.
Thanks. My 5th wheel RV (caravan) has a fireplace like this, but is larger and includes a 1200 watt electric heater. I've been dying to find out how the effect works but didn't want to tare it apart to find out.
Some older fireplace simulators had a single low wattage light bulb with a fan mounted on top of it that rotated by warm air rising from that bulb. It was as effective for its simplicity.
Ours had the heater fan that wouldn't turn and by the time I realized something wasn't right, the fireplace died right there and then. I had a quick look at it but just visually, without real tools other than just a screwdriver, I haven't seen any physically broken part . I really want to revive it cause it was the best bedroom ambiance while watching TV , just reading a book or, you know. ☺
Thank you for mentioning the use of a diode to drop the voltage from usb. I purchased one of these for my van over a year ago planning this conversion and hadn't thought to use one
Reminds me of an old electric fire we had when I was a kid..it had red bulbs inside, and disc type things that balanced on top, the heat from the bulbs made the discs turn which created the smoke/flame effect on the panel at the back. Simple but effective.
Thanks for your videos Clive they are really helping me take my mind off pain while in hospital. Just wish I had not watched most of your back catalogue before I went in :/
Keep in mind there's the slightly rude BigCliveLive channel for marathon 3 hour streams.
Speedy recovery!
Yes. A veritable MARVEL of SIMPLICITY.
BUT-BUT (The Inevitable arse of Creative Afterthought): THE LOGS! Wouldn't convince an EYE-SHORN Beaver!
Coaly-like cubics of Plassticks! With light-emitting HOLES and variegated, colored bits-o-transparent FILIM! Maybe even real COAL! What with the UP-AND-COMING NO-COAL MANDATE on the Isles' Horizon, it might give a BOOST to the folks back home in NEWCASTLE.
I, myself, would be pleased as PUNCH to TRANSACT my collection of CLINKERS, acquired through FOUR DECADES of Christmas Stockings, HUNG by the fire. (Never saw no "Folks Dressed-up like ESQUIMOS", though. Potato sacks, YES. De Rigueur for keeping the fly-ash off yur COIF.)
I tender this EYE-DEE-UR
w/out desire for compensation, in the interest of better LIVIN' AN' JOY THRU SCIENCE!
BUT! TUT-TUT (Is HE the Ghist-o-Christmas Past, or what!?) I would NOT defer from donations of Single-Malt Spirits in recognition of my contribution. 'Tis the Season, mind you, to be JOLLY! AND engage the Gift imparted in GIVIN'.
💬*
🐧
*[WTF!? How'd I wind up in BRIGHTON!? Musta been BAAAD in Hell.🐑]
Get well soon 🤗
I wish you a speedy recovery Leah.
Neat. I bought an electric fireplace this year and my one complaint is that it's not bright enough. Good to know how it works so I may dare to modify it eventually.
+Looks like kinda slow motion footage.
Go for it, put bigger LEDs in, but I think they would have to be quite a focused sharp LED.
I just harvested some printer stepper motors & spindles, and hard-drive motors, time to upgrade my non-fire fire effects! I'd love to try making an led 'flame vortex' effect, - any ideas come to mind? I respect your mad science, been following since 'back in the day' you made brick splitting gauntlets with some hinges to focus the strike. It worked like a charm for a patio diy.
@@TheOrganicartist You know, you could unwrap a Flame Effect lamp (type Big Clive showed in another video) this way flames would be coming at the reflective material from all angles. How well this might work? Only one way to find out!
another great video by MASTER CLIVE! thanks for all you do and share with us here on the channel!
What is missing? Two things. sparks and the popping sound that comes with them. As B.C. said I like it.
I have enjoyed B.C. for quite a few years probably every episode since day one. thankyou for the entertainment and education. 70yo and still want more. Keep it up Clive and I hope you have a very good Christmas and a happy new year. Don't get too wasted. I"m just getting in early.
Berry "Magicoal" electric and gas "fires" used a similar effect in the 1960s-1970s, except the reflector (onto a backplate) was a non-uniformly bladed horizontal aluminium fan blade powered by just the convected heat from a red film coated non-frosted incandescent lamp of about 25-40 watts, which also illuminated the glass-fibre fake logs in front of the bulb and the flicker-fan. These were totally separate from the heating elements, which were usually situated above the coal or log - effect display. Unusually these bulbs had 3 bayonet pins IIRC.
I've got a LED flame candle that has a timer function on it where it comes on for 6 hours and is off for 18 hours as well, chances are that it uses the same timing controller.
I can't trust my clumsy self around real candles so my led candle is perfect and it switches itself on and off too😁
Always wondered how these worked, thank you Clive
The circuit polarity is because the chip output is probably an N-channel driver for a single LED candle. Driving the higher current of 3 LEDs and a motor thus needed an extra transistor with opposite polarity.
Loved how Clive used cells from two different manufacturers at the start, I almost felt “triggered” there myself - great wind up.
That's how it came from the shop. I get the feeling it had been the display model.
Shows how little things have changed in some ways. In the 60s my Nan's new electric 4 bar fire came with a "coal effect" front with the usual ceramic/wire glowing bars and a crappy moulded plastic blocks of coal.
The magic happened when you switched on a small red bulb with a very thin tinplate fan on top. Eventually the heat from the bulb created enough heat to spin the blades and the glowing coals started to burn. Quite effective and with the lights off it did seem to make the room warmer. This one is better, but very similar in concept
I remember making such a prop for a local small theatre group but it was a vertical cylinder with spiral cutouts covered with coloured lighting gel and with fins on top that rotated from the heat of a light bulb on the base; just like spinning Christmas angels with bells and candles. None of that fancy electronic stuff for me....didn't really exist back then.
Amazingly simple for such a great effect.
That’s actually flamin’ impressive
Reminds me of those 3 bar electric fires with the clear orange lamp with the fan that rotated using the heat from the lamp...the fake logs were clear and it projected on to the back of the frame...3k flat out not exactly cheap to run but we were fiddling the meter!!!👉🧿👈👉🫂
I got the fireplace version with is like a foot wide. It doesn't have any timer function that I know of. It just has a flat top to it. It didn't come with a DC jack, so I added one. I didn't want to burn through batteries or have them leak. The stem is just a wooden dowel, but it has the same Mylar and hot glue arrangement. I got it a couple of years ago. It takes like 4 batteries for 6 volts, but I actually run it on 5 volts. I thought it might make the LEDs last longer, and 5 volt power supplies are much easier to get.
High power pink LED's? Yes, I need one!
Thanks for including footage of the device at the end of the video! I was going to hit replay as soon as the video ended to behold the awesome effect once more, but you read my mind :)
I enjoyed the yule logs at the end. You'll have to put it back together and have it on hand for a Christmas Big Clive Live.
Perhaps modify it with an electric scent diffuser filled with liquid smoke?
I saw one of these in a hotel lobby, but wired up backwards. The "flames" were going _down_. I filed it under "unclear on the concept".
The old motors had a part that made them turn one way only. With age they would go bad and it was a 50/50 chance as to what direction it would go when power was turned on. I used to remove the part and run them on a sound-to-light unit that turned the wheels in my disco projectors. The same could be done to one of these so the flames would move to music.
They bought the Australian version by mistake!
😁 - opps,
I have a similar unit about the same size that I run off a 5V PWM signal from an ESP board. As my heating power goes up the "fire" gets brighter and faster.
thats VERY cool. gotta try that too if i get one
I did an "amateur" version of this decades ago. 4000-series CMOS, 4020s to divide it down and NANDs for the 1-of-4 (6hrs of 24hrs) and crystal oscillator. Bunch of orange Christmas-light bulbs for the "fire", and tinsel wrapped around a motor shaft for the effects. Looked good if you squinted your eyes just right. :D
I remember an old electric fire with 'Flame Effect' --- the rotating reflectors turned by the heat of the bulbs.
Really enjoy your videos. Thanks for knowledge information.
Awesome led fire simulator Big Clive
I always wondered how those work. Thank you!
Thank you for your videos ... I really am so intrigued as to how these things work. :)
I used to have a Fan Heater with this same effect. Looked like a real fire place in the corner.
It used the same mechanism with dim 240V globes
NIce very cleaver design, had no idea, i tought it was a video loop ore something...
Got two of these last year in (coach lamp size) purely based on your ''review)
Some of the best tatt ive ever bought....
Yay! Finally something more fun than ozone machines. We happened to have a fake fireplace in our living room, built into a book case. Now I do not have to disassemble it to see how it works. Our last one used an incandescent bulb that kept burning out.
Hi Big Clive! ....... Little Clive here! 👍😂
Can you do a video, reverse engineering Star Trek Voyager's Warp Core, as you say it works on the same principle? But be careful to ensure you don't cause an anti-matter containment breach! ....... Wouldn't want the Isle Of Man to be vapourised! 💥🔥😂
As an 8 yr old I tore down and old electric fire with flame effect. The flames were produced by 3 shiny propellers powered by the rising heat from the elements.
In the old days, they had a version with ribbons and a fan that blew the ribbons around while back-lighting them.
Not as convincing as these.
Yeah, the ribbons were made of tinsel. 👍
@@TomAlter1000 I've got one in my home (here when I bought it, never used because it is so fricking loud!), the fan is a Cylindrical affair, exactly the same design (so likely the same model) as used in the heater above the not particularly convincing ribbons.
Today I learned that "wake up timer ICs" are a specific type of ASIC, nearly all in TMSOP-8 packaging. They can be set in "pull up" or "one shot interrupt" mode. Ablic's S-35710 series even has internal 32kHz quartz.
We have one of these but it's also a heater. Cool thing is it has multi colored flames and logs, both can be choose independently. Outputs a decent amount of heat too
Tried to guess how these worked before. Imagined all sorts of complicated methods. It turns out to be so simple, I'm embarassed. Very clever and simple.
Quite a pleasant flame effect. Is there anything else comparable?
Very engaging video. There's a connection with beauty and electronics.
Very fascinating to see a "real-life simulation?" of fire without burning anything.
amazing effect so simple & basic 10/10 for the makers
I worked at a store that sold electric fireplaces, the really big ones with a heater. The same principle and mechanism though, as I learned when I fixed a couple of them. In the large version it's common for the reflector bar to have a pillow block with a bearing at the non-motor end. It also likes to rip free from the housing because they just rivet them in. Then your fireplace comes complete with a horrible grinding pinging noise.
The end of this video reminds me of years gone by when there were only three or four TV stations and one of them would show the Yule Log burning all day on Christmas. (Tell me you're old without saying you're old.)
Makes you feel cosy just looking at it, much better than the old flame effect fires! Simple and effective. I like it as well, not seen one that small, I will have to look for one. :-)) Seen it running in the background of your live videos, very effective :-)) 😎
Its kinda like a lava lamp for a cozy Winter evening!
Thanks for the video.👍🏻 Very interesting.
It's nice. Might be a good Christmas present. The search term would be nice, also if ali or ebay
You know it's good when Clive likes it.
Just saw this thing at the store for the first time a few days ago. Was wondering how they achieved that, then saw this very video. Good timing!
Very smart engineering right there!
Just bought one for my old mum see love's it she doesn't care how it work's but I do - great timing 🔥
You can improve the flame effect by slightly creasing each mylar reflector which makes the flames finer. I've done that with a full size one.
Simple but very nice looking. I want one please.😃
Very satisfying effect indeed.
It's amazing how effective some of the simple methods are. I often wondered what was inside one of these "fireplaces" but never had an opportunity to open one.
Now.... To build a larger version for Halloween. Muh ha ha....
I rented a 1 bedroom in Colorado for $2500/mo, the listing said fireplace but it was a 36'x24' one of these with a space heater. Pretty pleasant all things considered.
The heater ones typically use Mylar blown by the fan that inevitably blows over the heating elements. Thankfully those use replaceable bulbs instead of Non-replaceable LED strips.
Very cool, I've never seen one taken apart and I have wondered how they were built. I would have made the reflectors so they rotated somewhat with as random a pattern of gearing as possible, so the flames didn't repeat.
Got a good idea, stick a chicken on it an line up some heat emmiting LEDs an you can do a version of Cook with Clive, 😂😂😂🔥🔥🔥
That really is effective. Seems that the Aldi Xmas lights use a timer chip like that.
Our local Wendy's had one of these installed when they "updated" it to be more like a coffee shop (because, you know, all the cool kids hang out at the burger joint) and I realized how it worked when I heard it squeaking loudly next to my booth. :P
The ending was good 😀
On repeat here.
i was remembering the good old days with log effect electric fires that used 60w fireglow bulbs, picked up a new heater two years ago with the newfangled led's effect is very good not sure why it's fitted with a dimmer control though.
Impressive effect.
I was gonna sleep but who needs sleep when there's a Clive teardown going on?
Just recently I bought one like this but bigger and with a wall plug. I was wondering how the fake flames are made, now I know!
Mine has a small spiral type of heater inside, which is not very useful.
I love the warm light; the plastic logs even have a bit of glitter on to make it look like they’re glowing on the inside.
I also have it as a fan heater. It also crackles like a fire. I enjoy the effect and it makes my room very cozy
@@NyanyiC got a link to it please, sounds like just what I need now autumn's here.
The last part showing a full screen fireplace. Make continuous loops of it, cue up some Christmas music and get some hot cocoa!
I always thought these devices had a hidden magical property to them. I would have never thought the concept behind the cover is so simple and effective.
Lol magic!
This is very ingenious.
Now that I know how it works, I can see the cylindrical rotation in the flame pattern in the video end-shot. That does not mean that I don't like it! I have several battery clocks with smooth-running 'second hands'. Toaster pastries come wrapped in flimsy Mylar. Let's hope the clock motor doesn't smoke.
I like this effect so much, that is, LEDs and rotating Mylar. Something similar has been used in lots of Star Trek, in simulations of computers and warp cores. I'm really thinking of doing something for myself at home. If I put Mylar bits on a rotating shaft, so that they can move and swing individually, it would make for truly random reflections and not just repetition as it spins. Looks like that gear motor outputs about 12 rpm.
what type of engine is it? step motor? with which characteristics can I search for it?
Great video, if I had seen that in a store running I would have had to buy it just to take it apart 🤔
Nice a new video love your videos Clive your the best !
Berrys Magicoal fires from the 1950s had two 60 watt red enamelled bulbs. The heat from them drove aluminium rotors with a glass centre. These pivoted on a vertical needle. We `lubricated` this with graphite from a pencil but it was impossible to get both rotors to run at the same speed. The bulbs had a short life and were expensive so I wired them in series. They lasted forever but weren't hot enough to operate the spinners. What a long way we've come from those days, we couldn't have imagined getting light from a diode or a tiny motor and gearbox or reflective plastic sheet or using hot wax to glue parts together or...............
I want to put one of these in a computer case. "Yeah, it runs a little hot, but it's a workhorse."
Now that's real innovation.
Very impresive look. I think its got some good hacking bits too. I wounder if you warpper a cylinder round it and lit from both ends with colour-change LEDs.
There are some larger wall mounting versions with RGB LEDs.
@@bigclivedotcom So that would HAVE been a ggod idea. 🤣🤣Im just a bit slow.2x👍 Bet they look great too just going to see if I can get one now.
Very nice video Sir