(483) ESP32 precision GPS receiver (incl. RTK-GPS Tutorial). How to earn money with it (DePIN)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 พ.ค. 2024
- Determine your location to the centimeter around the globe? For everybody, not only for the military? Only with an ESP32 and a decent GPS receiver module? Not possible! Wrong; it is possible by using real-time kinematics. You can even earn money by building a base station and connecting it to a global network (Decentralized physical infrastructure network)!.
When I got a board from Michael, a viewer of this channel, I was hooked on trying to understand this relatively new technology. Are you interested, too? Then, follow along.
My second channel: / hb9blawireless
Links:
Book about navigation: amzn.to/44sNNts
ESP32 mini: s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DEP...
UM980 RTK-GNSS receiver: s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DDO...
RTK all-band GNSS antenna (order the "S" type): s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DDY... or s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_Dlk...
Cable (TNC male to SMA male): www.aliexpress.com/item/10050...
Splitter (with a case, not needed for single receiver): s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_Dmu...
DC Block (for 2 receivers): s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DF9...
u-blox RTK receiver: www.u-blox.com/en/product/zed...
Sparkfun RTK solutions: www.sparkfun.com/rtk
Michaels project: github.com/mazgch/hpg
How to build a base station: simeononsecurity.com/guides/b...
Base software for t services: github.com/incarvr6/esp32-ntr...
RTK2GO: rtk2go.com/
Onocoy: www.onocoy.com/
euspa report: www.euspa.europa.eu/sites/def...
Patreon supporter companies:
www.welectron.com/
The links above are usually affiliate links that support the channel (at no additional cost to you).
Supporting Material and Blog Page: www.sensorsiot.org
GitHub: www.github.com/sensorsiot
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Please order the "S" type of the antenna (all band). It is in the same link I provided.
I think Ardusimple product pricing is quite competitive with those items you've linked
Crypto scams have had plenty of opportunities to justify themselves. They can’t. Avoid everything associated with them.
Thanks Andreas. Very interesting, although I didn't quite grasp all of the nuances after listening once. More reading is required!
The major weakness of GPS is the satellite constellation; a powerful CME, or a man-made EMP from an orbital nuclear explosion, can disable or damage numerous satellites. While it works though it's superb.
well the price went up 140E for S 110E for D
There are some interesting distributive set ups.
ADS-B monitoring leads to a business that makes money
Blitzortung is another interesting one for citizen science.
The general model of distributed sensors sending information to a central website, which merges and presents the data is interesting. It's an area where libraries should lower the cost considerably.
RTK is clearly an area where this model works, particularly if costs can be lowered. A raspberry pi, a hat and an internet connection surely has to be the model.
Part of the reason that the US Military stopped degrading signals after the Gulf War is because scientists and land surveyors had already figured out how to get drastically improved results even with the degraded signals. But RTK is even better with non-degraded signals we all have access to today. I love this video!
You are right. Plus the competing systems were not degregated…
And another reason was the military was unable to supply enough special units and had to resort to commercial. Turning off the encryption on the lower bits allowed them to use commercial units with full functionality.
@@Sylvan_dB Indeed, this was mentioned in the book.
Their reasoning was simple: Always obfuscate the signal and everyone ends up with a workaround rendering it useless. Don't obfuscate during peacetime and most receivers won't bother with extra tricks and will therefore be impacted when obfuscation is reinstated during war.
Gulf war ? It's only a game why did people go to war over it..
Knowing how GPS works only makes it seem more impossible. The precision is hard to comprehend.
I completely agree. BTW: My 1995 GPS still found its position after many years in a drawer...
@@AndreasSpiess I remember how excited my uncle was when he got one around the same time. 😂
Just imagine image stitching but 3d... Once the image is built and verified and checked and updated over time, once that work is done... You are just checking points. The more points you get to check routinely the more confidence u have. Certain devices are verified very trustworthy or sent into the field to take readings to verify stuff. One the network is big enough, it works. Is that accurate at all?
I remember getting my first GPS receiver in early 90s. I remember how disappointed I was to find out about the "ambiguities" the US Military put into it, and I sure was glad when they stopped!
(I had " insider info" back then, lol).
Still, it's so amazing that it works so well, and that it's used for so many things.
As a ham operator, I use APRS regularly.
I've been wanting to build an RTK for several years, just been waiting for the cost to come down a bit ...
Thanks, Andreas! 🤪
👍 👌
When they put the technology into keys and wallets, one will never lose anything again.
Fun fact: the GNSS satellites constantly apply corrections to their timers, because they move fast enough and need to measure time precise enough that relativistic time dilation becomes relevant. 🙂
Thank you for the addition!
Gps also do that i think
@@TymexComputingCorrect. If not adjusted for relativity, GPS is way off.
@@TymexComputing AFAIK, all of them do - they're all going at several km/s, so they all need to compensate for relativity. (at a guess, about 0.00003c)
@@realulli even if they are not moving, they are affected by the gravitational field of the earth. A clock outside the earth's field with run slower. A different clock is needed for space application. The problem is currently managed by applying small corrections.
I too pay my respect to the engineers 40 years ago who devised this technology. Amazing
Indeed!
I'm an engineer in Brazil, power electronics and lately developing circuits for use in the field in agriculture. The use of RTK was discussed the year before last, but it was not applied Brazil everything is very expensive and bureaucratic. It was used for planting with tractors. Today this idea was abandoned and they hired the company Kimble .. today my project consists of lora modules with the llc68.. where each device has 4 inputs, 4 isolated outputs, 1 GPS, and a Gateway with just 1 GPS module and covers 5km.. tractors, gates, motor pumps, sirens, everything done by this system...your videos are the best...congratulations
If I understand this correctly, you use lora mudules to broadcast, and then receive the signals with GPS to triangulate location of equipment?
@@FullCircleTravis every device on tractors, for example, has a GPS. each device has its ID, a Gateway accesses all devices within a 5km area. The algorithm I wrote for lora radios They work like this: for example, tractor 3 has ID number 0x34. The user requests the position of tractor 3 (0x34) The Gateway acts as a broker, it requests data from 0x34, all devices receive it, but only ID 0X34 responds, and the complete package comes (ID, sensor status, actuator status and GPS)... The Gateway publishes this data to the broker and the user finds out
RTK is now widely used for precision farming. It seems you had a different use case
@@FullCircleTravis
The initial idea in 2021 would be to use RTK to map irrigation pivots. But due to the cost and the difficulty of development, it was an abandoned project. And the GPS modules purchased were used in tractors which send the position through a LorA network. Sorry for my English hehehe
@@AndreasSpiess Unfortunately, I had to abandon it, who knows, maybe one day I will use it again.
Absolutelly great video. I looked at RTK 10years ago and it was just out of reach.. Now it seems nearly magically simple.. Amazing times.
Indeed, we live in amazing times!
As your subscribers we too want more. I would second the suggestion already made by a viewer: another video on base station setup. I was hoping this video would cover that but that would have made it too long. I know you weren't planning on doing one but I and I'm sure others would very greatly appreciate it. At any rate, thanks very much for the video - very interesting technology. All the Best!
We will see. The video performs much better than anticipated…
@@AndreasSpiess I would love such a video. I've been looking into setting up my own RTK station and building my own auto-steer for my tractor setup on my farm. Commercial systems typically costs minimum 8-10k euros for the initial purchase of the system. On top of that a yearly subscription to RTK costs from €500 to €1000. From what I've been able to gather, I could probably build my own auto-steer system for €2000-€3000.
@@ste1l1 In the meantime, I started a project to build an autonomous rover (using Ardupilot). I hope it will be ready after summer break...
Totally want this, I appreciate the links and options but its overwhelming how many there are to choose from - what did you end up picking, what worked well or didn't, are the cheaper options good enough etc. Thanks! Love your videos.
@@hypercube33 I used the UM-982, but the 980 will work too as a base. The info for the antenna is in front of the link.
The first GPS receiver I used was a Sony Pyxis in 1992. It chewed through a pile of AA batteries in just a few hours and it took something like 10 minutes to lock on every time, and it couldn't deal with even a little bit of tree cover or heavier clouds. I now have a < $100 watch that can get a lock INSIDE a lot of the time in just a few seconds and can track for many hours on a tiny internal battery.
Indeed, we came very far…
Your watch is continuously searching and has no accuracy standards to meet so it can take a half informed guess based on other hints. It doesn't actually aquire satelite locks that fast.
I work with aviation GPS, and from a completely cold boot even with an external antenna on an open field they still take several minutes to aquire and verify enough satelites. After acquiring they update position multiple times per second, and with a quick power-down and reboot they retain some information and know they couldn't have been transported too far in the elapsed off time so they can reaquire much faster.
I built one with an arduino to clock the speeds of my RC boat a few years ago...maybe $10-15 in parts lol. The $5 ublox units are pretty amazing.
@@mytech6779it's actually pretty interesting how phone and watch gps actually get a lock, whereas with a traditional GPS system you need to wait for the packet where the stations transmit location information (almanac), cell phones download this data over the internet, same typically is done over to the watch but that depends on the brand. What's crazy is that some gps chips will only work with a data connection and without it have no ability to get a gps lock.
Your explanatory videos are stupendously useful Andreas. Thank you!
Glad you like them!
I've got one of those gps guided mowers, Luba 2. It is mind blowing how precise it is. It runs right up to my curb consistently. RTK is a gamechanger.
Thank you for sharing your experience!
I have my RTK mounted in my air conditioned house attic which communicates with the LUBA. The attic has wood trusses. Is this an acceptable location? I would have to hire someone to mount on my roof. Would I gain more antenna views moving it?
@@golfshoe9321 I do not know, You have to try. Wood usually does not have a lot of attenuation (if no metal is inside).
I don’t know your model but normally this have cameras. Because GPS is not accurate enough with the small view of the sky under trees and next to buildings..
@@Stefan-st My model does not have cameras. I am playing with GNSS planning software to time an optimal window for hight SN ratio.
Thank you. I have anxiously awaited this episode since you hinted you would explore this topic.
It took way more time…
Crazy! I’ve been into AG RTK for over 15 years for sure and probably have close to 500k into gear.
Warms my heart to see you put together a base station for $300! I want to say my first station way back then was $50k!
This price drop was one of the reasons for this video. With the prices you mentioned this for sure was nothing for Makers like on this channel. And it seems that prices will fall even more in the future as there is some comptetition.
@@AndreasSpiess , All:
This one: simpleRTK2B - Basic Starter Kit is around 250 US$. They also used it in the Ardumover.
What you have shown (also UBlox) seems to be better especially re communication. Correct me when wrong but your setup for the rover is (around 200-400 US$) and similar to the base station (300-600 US$).
When there is somehow access to the Base Station only the rover is necessary.
Just for a field or to follow a vehicle where the leading one has a driver or much better navigation (Range max 400m) and where there is just a cm accuracy but no link to the GPS necessary (includes precision farming and gardening, lawnmower..) I think I had seen different much cheaper technology. Any ideas?
Dyson farming division where the produce a lot of strawberries etc inside, the must use s.th. different. And they say, they have an accuracy, when remembering correct below 10mm.
I love how you structure your videos and set the expectations at the beginning. Marvelous work for educational content. Thank you.
Thank you very much!
Ditto! I'm new to all of this yet I could follow your presentation ! Thank you Thank you Thank you!
This is revolutionary. I'm a road surveyor/inspector in the US and use a Trimble RTK receiver with my state's free correction network over a 4G hotspot and it gives me awesome accuracy in the field all by myself but it cost $20k for the receiver (6 years ago) and when I opened it to replace a part, it was layer after layer of complicated circuit boards. To think it's been simplified this much is inspiring. Now if only I can find a way to do DIY tilt-compensation for the pole I'd mount it on.
These "layers over layers" are now in the chip, I assume. And therefore cheaper to produce. I agree, with this pricing it becomes attractive for DIY
Didn't know about the free state's services!
Cant you simply mount two spirit levels 90 degrees of etchever to the pole and adjust them to center = pole plum ? Or is more complex to solve?
That's what one of those really cheap MEMS gyros can do for you.
@viktorakhmedov3442
Trimble proprietary IMU tilt is based on electronic bubble technology that is not proprietary. Moreover, an electronic inclinometer is not so hard to execute. A little plumbob and a little protractor. Electronic totalstations have been doing it since the 80s for zenith angle compensation.
Hope you’re doing well Andreas. Going from studying your videos to working in industry has certainly dampened my passion, but thank you for everything you do. It’s great to be reminded of why I do this to myself 😃
You are welcome. I hope you still find time for your passion…
Haven't been here for some time but you've caught my attention with this video. Glad to see you're doing well Mr Andreas
Indeed, I am still healthy and curious. Thanks for visiting.
Yet again I learned a lot from this video of yours, Andreas. Super.
Glad to hear that!
I am SO going to build this, thank you! I have been looking for an rtk system for my drone and this allows me to build something and learn new things too!
Have fun!
Same here! This will be very useful for my drone research.
Hi Andreas, great video about a technolgy that fascinates me since more than 25years. Thanks for mentioning the HPG project and the various u-blox GNSS/GPS modules and services.
You are welcome. You know who started this journey ;-)
I spent half my life with GNSS technology, so maybe also for you it might not be the last time you discuss GNSS in your awesome channel!
GORGEOUS! GENIUS! and so awesome! Thank you so much Andreas for your clear explanations and pedagogy. Great experiment with practical demonstration.
Glad you liked it!
God bless our engineers! We owe our cellphones, computers, tv's, and all other 'smart' objects to their ingenious work! Respect!
Indeed, it is a valuable profession ;-)
I agree with you to an extent but before the engineers are the scientists who do the base physics. Then engineers can design systems based on the science. I absolutely love being a designer and owe it all to the scientists that give me technology to work with.
Dude with the Swiss accent, you are awesome! Thanks so much for sharing this information with us! I love your content! ❤️
Glad you enjoy it! And thank you for commenting and following my channel for a long time!
Fascinating. Thanks for taking so much time to explain how GPS works.
My pleasure!
Thank you for being the first one who explained how RTK really works. Unlike LORA devices I think there will be an explosion of RTK enabled devices and your average consumer will not want the hassle of base stations and positioning them with a good view of the sky. So definitely a good case for depin i think.
I also think it is more mainstream than LoRa. But we will see what the future offers…
This is the best tech video I've seen all day. It is clear and information dense.
Thank you for your kind words and your support!
A superb intro into GNSS!
Glad you like it!
I agree. It was awesome! 🛰️
Yes it was
Thank you for your very good RTK-GPS explanation.
I use such a system to operate my lawn mower without a guide wire and receive my RTK correction data from our state SAPOS service without having to set up my own correction station. Nowadays almost every country has one or a similar service. In Germany, this service is available free of charge depending on the federal state. In Switzerland there is also a satellite positioning service called swipos that is available to everyone.
You are welcome! In Baden Würtenberg, they ask for a one time fee of 150 Euro and in Switzerland it is 1500CHF per year. At least this is what I found with Google
@@AndreasSpiess Thats’s correct, Baden-Württemberg charges for registration 150€, but the SAPOS service is free of charge. Swispos-NAV (GSM/GPRS) is obviously free, but it “only” has an accuracy of half a meter.
Thank you for your effort and sharing RTK knowledge. Keep us informed, please. RTK has huge impact on ariculture and so also on the production of food. Precise farming optimizes the amount of seeds and fertilizers etc.
You are welcome!
I saw some examples in agriculture, and they are very promising. We will see if these new possibilities will change other industries the same as Google maps changed my way of driving ;-)
Yet another brilliant production Andreas! A perfect explanation without getting 'stuck in the weeds'.
Watching this video has produced, in me, the same 'peak of joy' as in that moment when you first construct a digital coherer and resolve a hidden signal - that just 'pops up' magically out of the noise.
Suitably invigorated, I can now return to yet another dead project, that could now work at a reasonable price - given your excellent research and guidance provided here.
See you at the next WEF meeting in Davos - where we could share some of our massive gains?
Thank you! Indeed, these modern modulations are so different from what we knew before. Extracting a signal out of this "noise" seems impossible. Shurely is for conventional technology.
I am not sure if I would go just to Davos if I get rich, BTW ;-)
@@AndreasSpiessI look back at the 'old days' of analog modulation and all of the problems involved. I feel sorry for all the folk who spent so much time trimming and aligning circuitry - when just mixing high speed digital circuits to/from RF circuits is such a breeze (using digital processing to do the 'heavy lifting' (as they say). The thing I really appreciate about your research is the time and effort you put into it and the practical outcomes. Too many times I have looked at these pages (and like Helium) think that they are a scam. Now you have taken the dive into these murky waters and given them your approval, I will follow as I too 'want more'! Thanks again. As for Davos - I thought that it was a little closer than Cardiff. Much love and good health to you. Richard
@@richard_wenner I know I never made it to Cardiff. You know, it is still on my bucket list. This year, we will go to the other end of the UK (Orkney). It was the wish of my wife. I hope this is enough proof of her existence. As you know, I would never choose such a destination myself! I would have chosen Cardiff ;-)
@@AndreasSpiess Why Orkney?
There were people who figured this out ... and then there are people who think the world is flat.
Indeed, unbelievable!
@@AndreasSpiess The average IQ is 100, average means there are people with
hi neumi, I think the earth is flat.
I suggest watching _Level with Me (2023)_ by Hibbeler Productions to see evidence that space agencies are fraudulent.
hi neumi, I think the earth is flat.
I suggest watching _Level with Me (2023)_ by Hibbeler Productions to see evidence that space agencies are deceitful.
hi neumi, I think the earth is flat.
I suggest watching _Level with Me (2023)_ by Hibbeler Productions.
Got my first GPS, the Garmin GPS 2, back in 1997. That time SA was still active. The accuracy of 50m fascinated me. It is quite a long way from 50 meters to mm accuracy with the equipment in similar size and budget. I build an NTP Server for my home lab from RPi and GPS hat. Your video make me think to start to make base station for GNSS RTK soon.
Indeed it the relation between time and position is an interesting one. So we can solve two problems at once.
I've been looking at this topic a while ago and couldn't find anything of use to make it work. Thanks for this Andreas!
Happy to help!
Entrants in a GA Tech competition were using differential GPS for 1cm resolution some 25yrs ago. About time it became easy for everyone.
Indeed, technology advanced a lot!
Very interesting - it fills in some big gaps in my understanding of how RTK works. It's also potentially useful to me, as there are many potential applications for accurate positioning on a nerd's hobby farm.
Glad it was helpful! And enjoy your first project. We want to know about it!
When you make the Helium-hate video several years ago, I posted a comment to it. I said that the bussiness idea is so good but in reality even if the beginning of the implementation of the idea welcomes some more doors to be open. Thanks for your videos
Very inspiring video Andreas. I can’t wait to get started building my own.
Cool. Enjoy!
There's also centipede with quite good coverage in Western Europe.
We use F9P receivers in our AgOpenGPS projects for both base (pi based) and rovers (tractors with Arduino )
Thanks for the info. It seems to be very good in France in Slovakia.
@@AndreasSpiessFarmers in Hungary (not Slovakia) build these base stations by themselves. The cost of a station (~500€) is cheaper than one year of commercial correction subscription offered by tractor manufacturers / dealers for one tractor. Ater install, its free for all of the farmers' tractors within 20km radius :)
We are running rtkBase (opensource) on a RaspberryPi4 + UbloxF9P, caster is Centipede
@AndreasSpiess mainly France & Hungary!
Nice open source project
Andreas, thanks for teaching me how the X-31 Vector team pulled off this pioneering trick to auto land at high angle of attack using centimeter precision. In 2001 and 2002 I had the honor of being part of the international X-31 Vector team, and worked with the Boeing GPS expert to achieve successful flight tests and auto landing. The Navy is probably using this tech for Aircraft carrier operations.
I assume that this tech is used in many areas. Landing on a (moving) carrier probaly needs a lot of relative precision between the plane and the carrier...
Super interesting topic and details, thanks Andreas for the summary and video!!!
Glad you liked it!
Dear Andreas, I highly recommend you watch a beautiful English movie entitled "The Last Bus" which had my wife and I smiling and crying simultaneously at the ending. Also, I'm retired, disabled and poor as dirt but still marching forward on a project which will benefit grandly by a DIY indoor base station that makes it affordable enough. Thank you so much for addressing RTK the way that you have!
I loved that movie, it was extremely well done.
Thank you for the tip. I will watch it!
Original Garmin 1993 was funny. It did not work right in the southern hemisphere. I bicycled in Australia and it reported negative speeds and sun rising in the evening.
That is interesting! I had no chance to test mine in Australia...
hah I saw that setting on my old garmin gps and wasn't totally sure what it was for- i mean certainly the model wasn't so simple it would think people were upsidedown in the south. I guess it was..
If you bought one in Australia it didn't work right in the Northern Hemisphere!
AND it took ages to get a lock when starting up
@@mjgrebert They took 12-15 minutes to get the Almanac.
Thank you Andreas ! You beutifully covered the subject, both theory overview and the nuts n bolts for the end product
Glad you liked it!
Extremely interesting. Of course, the fully detailed explanation would take a pretty long series of videos. Going over to your playlists... Thanks!
There is a whole lecture available on TH-cam. But you have to invest a bit more time for that. For sure very interesting as a next step.
Very nice and informative video. Just an addition by a physicist. The engineers designing the gps system had to include the effect due to the fact that time flows differently on Earth surface with respect to satellite orbit, as explained by general relativity. The legend says that they at the beginning did not believe that it was necessary, so they introduced a software switch to activate/deactivate this correction, but then they had to use it in order to achieve the wanted precision.
Interesting detail! We engineers are always a little less to the detail than the physicists. But we accept reality (at least in a technical sense) ;-)
You have to account for speed and height of satellite.
How would they not know? If you can calculate the correction, you can also calculate the error incurred by not using it.
The developer of the most advanced GNSS chips and firmware, UBlox, are also more people with the Swiss accent
Yes, they are headquartered in Switzerland. Daniel Amman is one of the founders…
I really enjoyed this. Thanks for taking the time to research and demystify!
Thank you. Indeed, it took me quite some time 😉
Grazie per aver messo a disposizione le tue conoscenze. Molto interessante. Complimenti....
You are welcome!
Andreas, would you please stop filling my aliexpress shopping cart?
:-)) For me, this purchase was expensive, but worth the money. The time I invested in understanding it was even more "expensive".
@@AndreasSpiess You are lowering these "understanding costs" for all of us.
if we could select a handful of people to make immortal so they can keep innovating and moving our civilization forward, i'd nominate this guy.
As always, very interesting and educational videos! ❤
Glad you think so!
I take my hat of to you, You explained that very well in English and English is not your first language. I hope you make money as you deserve to.
Thank you for your kind words!
What I find bordering on science fiction are the new GPS/Altimeter/Compass modules for drones. (M10)
In the size of a fingernail and a couple of grams they also include the antenna and have an accuracy of around one metre.(They are just a little slow in initial signal acquisition.)
Considering that my first Garmin weighed like a brick and gave me 50 meters of accuracy in the middle of a flat plain, after about 10 minutes of waiting, only when all the planets were aligned looks like there was a "slight" evolution of technology.
Indeed. Fascinating!
If you combine rtk with imu sensor in rover (with eg kalman filter) you will receive even better results.
I can imagine. And I am sure this will be combined in modern warheads because of GPS jamming...
That was a very useful and interesting video, thank you for producing it.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Great video! You managed to explain some advanced concepts neatly
Thank you!
I'm curious if it would be viable to transmit RTK correction data over Lora. That way you don't need a power-hungry mobile connection on a remote device. Also, how often does the correction signal need to be transmitted for good accuracy?
I am sure it can be done (and maybe is already done). But only by a direct connection (not LoRaWAN)
GPS RTK data is latency critical. The data shouldn't have a latency larger than a few seconds from the RTK base until it reaches the RTK rover. Also, it is a continuous stream of ~1kB/s. Not sure whether Lora could fulfill both requirements
Sehr interessant. Du kannst mal auf den Cheisacher wandern, da steht neben der Sternwarte auch ein Mast einer Bodenstation für Vermessung.
Du bist ein guter Beobachter. Ich vermute, ich werde ab diesem Video auch welche sehen ;-) Es muss ja einige geben.
@@AndreasSpiess Die Bodensender sind glaube ich auch in der swiss geo admin map in einem Layer angegeben. Es ist eine sehr schöne Ecke dort mit dem Turm als Highlight ;-)
@@saxpert Ich hab ihn gefunden. Ersteht neben der Sternwarte shop.swipos.ch/Map/SensorMap.aspx
@@AndreasSpiess Sehr gut. Die Schweizer sind da einfach top wenn es um offene Daten und Kartierung geht.
Video with high quality standards, fact based criticism where needed and professional content. I've seen so many "hobbyist"-youtubers tinkering in their videos, making low quality products, repeating well-known mistakes and reinventing things - just in lower quality.
Thank you! I try my best.
Interesting video as always Andreas!
Glad you enjoyed it!
6:58 1ns corresponds to an error of about 30cm, not 30m.
I knew that I get it wrong somewhere :-(
At 6:17, too
Also, at 9:25 (and further), you say the wave length for 1500 MHz is 20 cm (which is correct), but on the image, it’s drawn as a length of 2 wave periods, not 1 (ie 4pi, not 2pi).
Also you put your socks on backwards.
@@Xsiondu it’s a technical discussion, about specific technical issues. Nothing personal. I fully respect Mr. Spiess. If you think your joke about the socks is appropriate here, you probably are in a wrong place.
Could you do a more indepth video to follow to build such a base station and rover?
So far I have no such plans. But you never know…
I remember buying the google G1 with GPS maps. Iphone was released a year before, but it didn't have google maps. It was about 5 years after that apple finally had gps maps on their phone. I loved that I had maps at my finger tips, always knowing where I was on a map was a game changer. All the iphone people were jelous because they couldn't do that, and they already spent their money so the G1 being out the next year was a huge hit. Life changed during that time. Instead of guessing where you were, you knew exactly where you were and could easily get to any place you dreamed of going without trying to get out the atlas or large maps. Now everyone uses maps on their phone almost every day. Its probably one of the most used apps on a daily basis. Amazing how we are so dependant on it today, and yet before the G1, we had to basically guess about where we stood in relation to a map.
Thank you for telling your story! Very interesting.
Thank you Andreas - another well defined video with a great business case and engineering insight.
Thank you for your kind words.
It's not that new. I've been using centimetre accurate GNSS for 25 years. RTK, PPK and static observations. Trimble, NovAtel, Leica, Topcon etc.
After looking at photos of GNSS base station installs for DePin projects, I would never use the service for anything that required precision. Many of the GNSS antenna installs I've seen are terrible:
* Tall, unstabilised masts on rooftops that flap around in the wind.
* Masts secured poorly with zipties
* PVC pipes, or lengths of timber with a 5/8 thread stuck on top
* People regularly adjusting, or moving their antenna will cause errors in connections broadcast.
* People not installing their base antennas level, thinking that placing it on a slant will solve their 10 degree elevation mask issue with nearby trees.
* People installing antennas on highrise buildings (thermal expansion and contraction from sun causes the building to move)
* Installed on apartment balcony balustrade with >50% of sky blocked.
Amateurs installing these bases have no concept on how GNSS systems work and cannot be trusted.
I've installed many official GNSS base stations, and there are strict requirements for how they are established. Deep concrete base in stable ground. Calibrated and certified antenna. Several days of observations to establish base coordinates etc.
Anyone using GNSS for commercial use would no use DePin network corrections. We spend $20k to $50k+ on our survey grade GNSS receivers and generally use our own base station setup over a known coordinated point and broadcast corrections over UFH, VHF or LoRa.
These DePin GNSS networks will never get a foothold in the GNSS correction market. The only users will be hobbyists. I see founders of these projects claiming that agriculture will be a big market. That's not true either. Machine guidance systems generally come with a GNSS base to install at the farm. One base can transmit corrections to all farm equipment over radio. No need to pay a DePin project for corrections when you can supply your own for free.
Thank you for sharing your knowledge. I am no specialist in this matter. So we will see how and if such networks will evolve. For my part, at least I avoided the mistakes you mentioned ;-) And it took a while till my antenna was validated by Onicoy. I assume they try to do some tests about the facts you describe in your comment.
Still, for a noob like me it was mind-boggling to see the accuracy and understand at least a bit how it is made.
@@AndreasSpiess It's great that people are learning about precise GNSS as a hobby, as you mentioned, but as soon as startups start aiming their products at the crypto crowd, the network quality deteriorates. 99% of helium hotspot owners are never going to use helium LoRa devices, they're just in it for the money. Same goes for GeoDNET, ONOCOY etc. people are drawn to the $ instead of the tech, which isn't sustainable long term.
Going forward, GNSS corrections will be required for many applications like ADAS etc, and government bodies will broadcast corrections over the internet, NB-IoT, LTE-M etc. free of charge. It's already happening in Australia. Nearly every GeoDNET base station in Australia is a government run base station (Geoscience Australia), and public access is free.
Base stations don't need to be spaced at 20km intervals. Using surrounding base stations, the ionosphere can be modelled and virtual base stations established anywhere inbetween. That way GNSS bases can be spaced at 100+km intervals.
Another way to receive RTK corrections is via satellite. Trimble RTX is one example. Centimetre accurate positioning without a local base or internet/radio connection.
It's great to see that affordable RTK GNSS receivers are now available, and accessible.
Sure, what you are describing is highest-end RTK networks which can deliver mm-accuracy, as is required in surveying use cases, and a sub-1000$ equipment installed by a broad community can not deliver that.
However, for many use cases, 1-2cm accuracy is sufficient.
And things like long antenna masts that move in the wind, or antennas moved can be identified by QA through processing the inbound data
This kind of video should come with a blockchain crypto bro warning 😂
Another great tutorial Andreas. Please make more on this topic 🙏
We will see…
@@AndreasSpiess I’ve just recently started to get into rtk-gps and it can be very confusing, you’re a fantastic teacher and I hope you make more tutorials on this topic. I see that you already have almost 270k views, I hope that this helps convince you to continue . 🙏
@@markmaker2488 It helped to convince me ;-) I started a project for an autonomous rover...
@@AndreasSpiess that’s absolutely fantastic, great news!
I really like how you explain things. Thanks 🙏
My pleasure!
Very nice, thank you for sharing this project. It's still amazing that we can now achieve nanosecond precision with some COTs !
I agree.
This type of solution gets me really excited! If commercial versions are expensive for those living in developed countries, imagine here in the third world where every dollar equals 8 local currencies.
Perhaps it's a little beyond my abilities, but I would like to understand better. Thank you for sharing this.
The short of it is a base station knows where it is, and runs on-the-fly position calcs on the SVs it sees every few seconds to derive a delta between otf position, and known position. It then sends corrections equal and opposite of the deltas to the rover.
"I know I am at X, but OTF says I'm 1m S. Pseudorange correction for this moment=1m N."
Very interesting content I had only general idea about GPS. Very well explained! Thank you.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Yes please tell it to us!
Each year your english becomes more precise, just as public GPS services ;)
That's the plan! Thank you.
NICE VIDEO especially for an EE student. Thanks sir for explanation.
Glad it was helpful!
Hello Andreas. I don't comment a lot but I've followed your videos on and off since 2016. I was pleasantly surprised by seeing the subject of my Masters Thesis in one of your videos, and I wanted to thank you for doing the subject justice (it's been 8 years since I worked with RTK and I still can't fully comprehend the dark magic behind it). Cheers from Portugal!
So you were pretty fast in adopting this technology! Indeed, it is complex.
@@AndreasSpiess In the mainstream, yes! It's seen a lot of increase in popularity since, due to the availability of cheap GPS receivers that offer carrier phase measurements, which is always satisfying to see.
Eindrücklich, vielen Dank für die Erläuterungen!
Danke!
Glad you are getting into rtk! In the USA we have free rtk correction service through transportation department.
Cool. Everywhere in the US?
@@AndreasSpiessyes.
@@dachoeks3How do you get access to local correction or base station? I looked up rtk 2 go and the closest station on their map shows about 100 km away!
@@billosland672 So you have to build your own 😞
It's always interesting to see the crossover between experts in the industry and the stuff that I do which is focusing on DePin
I can't post the link but my channel has videos on two projects that are adding quite well from this technology
I am not yet convinced, but DePINs with a business case have a better chance of surviving.
very cool! thanks for publishing this!
My pleasure!
GPS is an EXTREMELY interesting technology that is very rarely talked about, and usually very vaguely, there are many great details very cool to know, people should study GPS way more
I agree!
The progress in GPS receivers is amazing. My first modules were surplus motorola units which could track 8 satellites and that was amazing for the time. They used a lot of power and were closer to 100cm2.
The real magic to me still, is in getting all that data by dealing with signals that are below the noise floor. 🤯
Indeed, many miracles have to happen to get a precise location!
I've Always been lasy to read how it works - thanks 1000 Times for this vidéo Andreas!!!
My pleasure!
Thanks for the video, sir! Very insightful 👍🏼
My pleasure!
I use gps clocks for large area show synchronisation. Independent locations over 100 miles run perfectly in sync. Brilliant technology
Indeed. This would be hard without these satellites.
This was very interesting. Thank you.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Thank for introducing me to RTK!
You are welcome!
You are such a geek I love it 😁. With things like this and meshtastic I can see it might be very handy in disasters.
Indeed, I am fascinated by technology!
Very nice video. Thank you Andreas.
You are welcome!
great clip. interesting and amazing technology.
Glad you liked it!
Really interesting video! Very well presented content. thanks.
Glad it was helpful!
Speaking of Swiss accents, I just returned from Geneva where I was attending the ITU WP4A meeting. Always enjoy my visits there. Next trip in October :)
Indeed, our accents are similar because we both speek a kind of German as a first language.
Danke für das sehr informative Video!❤
Thank you for your support!
I’ve been running a GEODNET GNSS Station for little over 2 years…. DePIN is the future ❤
Thank you for sharing your experience!
Very impressive! Thank you
Glad you liked it!
Part of the reception process is to determine the slight frequency difference of each satellite, as received, due to doppler shift. This helps spread the signals out a bit. If they truly were all on one frequency at one time, it really would be essentially impossible to make sense out of it. Even with the signal spreading and the frequent repitition of the code, it is still very difficult to receive. These tiny units do an amazing job for a small price. Thanks for the great, interesting video.
I was not aware that the doppler effect is necessary for the decoding. And I agree that these are wonderful small devices!
Andreas released a new video, yes! Today is a good day!
Also, this one is really really funny.
Thank you for your kind words!
Yes! This was interesting. There is such a beauty in numbers and in mathematics. It is a true genius that thought of looking to the phase to get a higher resolution to the navigation.
One day even this will be perfected again and again, the receiver can detect if it is standing upright or upside down by looking at the phase. But then it is necessary to know the exact polarisation of the satellite's antenna. Than the next improvement would be the checking of the phase in combination with the satellite's Doppler status, if one of the satellites is moving towards the receiver or from the receiver, then again another fine correction can be made to the timing. Then there is something with the steepness of the up-going flank of the sinus and the lesser steepness of the down-going flank, but I have no clue what we can do with it, yet!
Life is so beautiful!
Let's unwrap this:
* upright or upside down:
This is not accurately possible with a single antenna RTK rover - but there are "heading" receivers which use two antennas and a short (1m or less) baseline between them, and can then determine orientation of this in space. A simple upright / upside down detection would best be done with a cheap MEMS accelerometer
* antenna polarisation:
The GNSS signals are RHCP polarization, and the antennas are designed to this [except for mobile phones, where antenna polarization for GPS is of little concern - usually linear polarized, at the expense of gain and multipath resistance]
* phase versus doppler:
It is the other way round: Doppler is measured by a GPS receiver already (as part of tracking the code and the frequency adjustments required to keep tracking it). Doppler is a relatively coarse (compared to carrier phase) measurement. GPS receivers determine the 3D velocity vector of the antenna out of doppler (and not by differencing consecutive positions as one may assume).
Further, the phase measurement is actually reconstructed from doppler and can not be measured directly by a PLL. So only thanks to doppler measurements can the accurate carrier phase be "tracked" - by integrating "instantaneous" doppler measurements at a high rate.
* "steepness of the up-going flank"
Unclear to me what you mean by that
@@onocoy Not even so long ago we could not even dream about measuring and pointing out a specific point at the phase. All of these innovations you spoke about are one by one wonderful achievements. At this moment in time it is almost impossible to make a prediction about what would be next.
Nice explanation. Made me think of DGPS or WAAS.
These are similar. Just not use the phase.
Lovely video! thank you for covering this topic :)
greetings from another Swiss accent guy!
You are welcome!
Finally, a correct explanation of GPS. How often did I heared "triangulation" instead of "trilateration" (/ multilateration)
I am glad I got it right. I am an electronics, not a civil enginner ;-)
Excellent work!
Glad you like it!