Can the ASM Hydrasynth sound analog ? (My take on the ASM Hydrasynth keys)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 ส.ค. 2024
- 0:00 opening and build quality
4:26 the keybed and poly aftertouch
6:50 lets try and make it sound analog
10:00 Warm mode / Analog Feel / Voice panning / Free running oscillators
15:54 the filter
21:38 the chorus
23:10 delay
26:10 oscillator bit crushing
28:31 wave stack
30:30 emulating the prophet 6's sub oscillator
32:38 bring in another oscillator as a 5th
33:56 filter envelope for pads
35:24 different filter types
36:00 the reverb and why it is awful
39:00 The Hydrasynth as a modern blofeld ?
41:00 more thoughts and closing - เพลง
If you haven't already, take a really deep bath in the "Voice Modulation" Feature (as of V2.0 firmware). Step 1) Set a Variation for each Voice, example Set randomly to values between minus 10 to plus 10. Step 2) Assign the Variations to different Parameters in the Mod Matrix. Mod Amounts need not be large, example 2, 3, 4, 5, etc (use your ears). Typical assignments:-
Osc1 Pitch, Osc2 Pitch, Osc3 Pitch.
Osc1 Level, Osc2 Level, Osc3 Level.
Filter 1 Cutoff.
Env1 Decay, Env1 Release.
Env2 Decay, Env2 Release.
Now... it sounds Analog.
DEFINITELY need to explore the voice mod features - it makes a world of difference!
I actually sold my super 6 a couple months after the voice mod feature came out for the hydrasynth. if you have a deluxe, you can actually turn the hydrasynth into a 8 voice binaural synth using the voice mod source.
just max out the values for the voice mod on one set of 8 voices, then use the voice mod + modulation on the other set of voices as a way of inverting the phase. then use this mod source as the amount for any other modulation you have; thus every single modulation has its phase inverted between left and right.
Very cool! Thanks for this. Just played around with it.
I hate when people say it sounds digital. Of course it sounds digital it's a freaking digital synthesizer. But I must say people who say they don't like this synthesizer you probably aren't good at creating patches from scratch. I called them preset surfers
it's digital in a good way. I don't get why so many people TRY to make it sound analog, or compare it to analog. Maybe it gets views.
Well apparently there must be a huge amount of them with everyone selling "fresh sounds" that they could make themselves.
That is probably not that big a deal if they actually end up making music with them.😁🎶🎹🎶Play On
Sounds real good 👍
Great review! Again your recent videos have been really good touching on real issues we face but few discuss
Fantastic video. I appreciate the level of detail you go into. It's refreshing to hear someone with knowledge and experience talk in depth without the usual marketing hype of TH-cam. Can't wait to see you do some sound design on this synth!
Have a Hydrasynth and a MatrixBrute. And I love when people say the HS can't sound Analog. I can make my HS sound exactly my my MB. All the low end, warmth, Analog drift of my MB, but with 7 more voices and so much more sound design opportunity.
So the Hydrasynth modulation is equal to or greater than MatrixBrute's extensive mod matrix?
@@WildernessMusic_GentleSerene The he Hydrasynth has more. It has 32 user defines slots with 191 destinations. The MB has 16 slots with 28 destinations , plus it has all the CV ins/outs on back. The Hydrasynth also has 8 Macro slots vs the MB's 4.
@@lucid484 Plus the use of 5 envelopes and 5 LFO's over MB's two or three. Thanks for the info! That many destinations then must include modulation routing to effects.
@@WildernessMusic_GentleSerene Yup, there are lots of things you can do with them. I love both of them equally. I would be hard pressed to choose just one. But I always find myself turning on the MB first and really enjoying twisting all the knows and stuff.
@@lucid484 I understand. When beginning a composition, I always begin with my knob per function synths for fast and creative sound design. Gaia / MicroBrute / Minilogue / Boutiques, and now Gaia2.
Great overview. Thanks!
Happy I found your channel....
Last thing great job on the video. Sounding lovely.
I'm pretty sure if you hold Shift while adjusting parameters, it makes the values snap to some step size.
They nailed the tone on this synth which is the most important part.
Yes please on the comparison vs a sequential! Would love to hear it up against the OB-6
Yes! SEM vs SEM esp. modulating through the different types!
Would be great to see a similar demo/overview from you of one of the UDO synths if you get your hands on one :)
very cool.
I think we have the same taste in synths. I have a Deluxe and it’s great, though I tend to use it as a digital synth and use my analog synths for analog things. But for those who want a synth that can do it all, this is it. BTW, check out my piece “Prom Night” on my channel, it predominately features my HS Deluxe and also some OB-6 and Take 5.
The CPU/DSP in the Hydrasynth is the Medeli A5, it's used in a number of their other high-end products. They describe the A5 as: 256 polyphony, 11-core, 1500 MIPS, Arm9 CPU, 32-bit RISC.
ASM (maybe by accident) released the 2.0FW with some tools to read-back the memory of the device, these were discussed a bit on Reddit and there's a GitHut project called 'A5Pack'.
Brilliant info, why they don't use more polyphony if what's said as true is a shame.
Part of why I don't get into the whole digital synth, I prefer analog gear where I know what I am paying for.
@@dankeplace It will be a theoretical polyphony capability based on the capacity of the chip if only generating oscilators, but it doesn't only generate oscillators in practical application. The chip also generates all the other engines for VCA, Filters, modulations, displays, effects etc so is probably working near to full capacity.
@@Fuzzfooger It's not theoretical, it exists.
DP650K/BK
I would also like to hear the hydra up against your peak! That way we can hear it vs a hybrid and an analog
the only thing i don't like about the Hydrasynths is that they run off wall warts.
Understanding synth programming, modulations and the relationships between them opens your world up to where most good synths can sound top flight and sound like other synths. There are filter considerations and morphing features that make certain synths sound different, but the basis of synthesis and the technical creative approach is similar whether it is wavetables or oscillators or both.
I thought I was gonna sell mine, because I'm just not skilled enough with synthesis yet to get the most out of it. I can't hear tones in my head, which makes using this hard compared to a "what you see is what you get" synth. But, I still really value the keyboard and ribbon, so I think I'm going to choose to grow with it for awhile. Enjoy yours, it is a quality instrument for playing, and the fact that Vangelis owned one and liked it is enough for me.
Other than Summit name a synth with great sounding onboard reverb. (The 2 slot V2 reverb on Modal kit is actually pretty good...) As another mentioned voice mod with firmware 2.0 can bring it to another level of "analog" sounding. It has been on sale twice now. Anyone considering it does themselves a favor maybe waiting for the next sale when deluxe will only be $200 more than this which is nuts.
I will counter saying the modal reverb on firmware 2 is actually worse than what the hydra has. I have owned both a cobalt and argon and those had horrendous reverb even with version 2.
@@YukiTheSynthDragon memory seems to be such a malleable thing - I honestly remember quite liking the V2 cobalt reverb, but it has been gone almost a year now. Of my current gear only the TB-03 (which is probably going on the chopping block) has internal effects and I never use them.
@@klstay I need to also mention the Minifreak has really usable and decent sounding reverb.
@@YukiTheSynthDragon a full size 2 engine 5 octave "Freak" with a somewhat expanded interface for each layer and shared full size matrix similar to matrix/polybrute would be fantastic. Maybe even put that fancy new keybed on it?
I really loved the Virus TI reverb (and the whole FX section, especially after some of the later OS patches). I think the Analog 4 has a pretty good reverb as well. I've never owned a Summit but it always sounds great in demos, etc.,
Had the desktop. Sold it and then a year later I bought the Explorer, which is all I need for what I do.
I think the keybed is great. I personally like minikeys, but as minikeys go (relative to other minikey synths) it's top notch even before the polyphonic aftertouch. even without the synth engine, i use it as my main vst keyboard now, absolutely phenomenal with pigments.
Hi 👋🏻
I was going to buy the desktop version because I own the Expressive E Osmose
so I can use the poly after touch.
But I think the Keyboard version seems cooler.
What do you think
I value your opinion.
Never tried the osmose but I hear it feels nice. I really do like the keybed on the Asm though.
You mentioned the trigon 6 which I am not only gazing for but also heartfelt about adding to my set up. Though your comparison comment to the hydrasynth really has me thinking in a different direction now. Can I ask? How is having both good or choosing between both? The teo 5 is also in my radar. Some of the preset packs I’ve heard of the hydrasynth are awfully impressive as well
The things is all the synths listed are great so you can’t go wrong with any, but especially for ambient and synthwave music. I can’t say yet for the teo5 but I will cover that when I get one. The trigon 6 has very little benefit over the hydrasynth but it has unique character and if you like the sound it’s great. I will compare it against the hydra one day soon in a video.
Thank for the reply your channel is inspiring. When you said I can’t words I laughed and said “you speak synth!”
Is there another one of these but The keyboard starts from left and the pots are right, that way you could double the keyboard leghth without gap. 😳🤔
This keyboard has been on my watch list, mainly for the polyAT, I have never experienced this aftertouch before and would like to see what it can do. So far, most the patches by Hydra and others I have not liked much, yours was good though :) . Mutant is FM, I am assuming, and easy to get out of control when designing pleasant tones. Musicians who have owned Yamaha CS80's for years tell me this a synth to get you close to the CS. But now the keyboard has me concerned, is that a Medeli keybed? I owned Medeli's top of the line arranger, and that keyboard was not playable, not usable for expression, I had to turn off the velocity. I spent weeks trying to dial in parameters to control an acoustic piano patch and never was successful. Then tried a Epiano, still unusable. Then tried MIDI connection to my Fantom and failed, the problem lies in the keybed. I would return the HydraSynth in a second if it has the same Medeli keybed.
I’m assuming the keybed is specific to the hydra and to a Korg controller keyboard that I assume uses the same keybed.
One last question about the hudrasynth
Could you use the hydrasynth as a controller for the polyps within the trigon? Meaning can you play the trigon with poly aftertouch?
Yes, with the latest update on the 6 series you can, the ob6, trigon 6, and p6 support Mpe.
Currently have a minilogue and keeping going looking for a deeper option in the 500 range. Since I already have a microfreak, would you go explorer or minifreak?
Explorer for sure. Just ended up selling my Minifreak since I hardly use it over my asm.
This video made me start looking at the hydra the hydra can do amazingly real 90s va supersaw via jp 8000 and that’s what’s really interesting
The wave stack mutator will get you to that supersaw for sure.
There is a lot I like about the design of this synth. Would really like the poly AT. As you mentioned , the UI is really innovative. But I just can’t get past the sound. I already have the Summit, and an Access Virus TI2. Based on the audio from videos like yours, I just don’t like the sound of the Hydra versus those two. I have been tempted to buy the Explorer just to compare head to head against the Virus.
What are your thoughts on the newly announced TEO-5? I keep saying that when it drops im gonna sell the hydra to pick one up but the sonic range of the hydra is just so insane. Yeah you cant upload custom wave tables and you have to work to get good bass out of it but name another hardware (hell even software synth) with such a fantastic and well thought out interface. Not to mention the 5 Envelopes, 5 on board LFOs (+ the extra ones) which can emulate analog wave shapes including S&H and can be turned into an 8 step stepsequencer with note locking, voice modulation and like you said - the damn fine analog modeled filters
My only real gripe with the hydra is the lacking FX section but thats what pedalboards and DAW post processing is for, sequential synths are only limited to 2 digital FX anyway. I do lust for a real SEM filter though 🥺
The teo5 will have very little overlap with the hydra. I will be getting a teo but keeping the hydra.
I'm no pro but I love my Explorer for the first synth I've ever really bought.
Blofeld was my 1st synth, still have it, sold my HS desktop and got the Explorer 3 years later as needed a cheap PAT keybed and the engine sounded so much nicer this time round as the custom patches were getting more love.
Keybed is a little better than KSP/Minifreak has longer travel. xd I have too and that's not in the ball park of either synth mentioned above.
Great vid, thx.
Perfect timing, I'm on the fence about the Hydrasynth Explorer....hoping this video nudges me in either direction
Get one
@@LoVeAmBiEnT explorer is awesome. the synth engine is great (though it does not sound analog, digital in a good way) and the mpe on the keybed makes for an awesome vst controller (assuming you are ok w mini keys), makes playing something like Pigments that much better. th-cam.com/video/DXfh7nJUBKI/w-d-xo.html
explorer is awesome. the synth engine is great (though it does not sound analog, digital in a good way) and the mpe on the keybed makes for an awesome vst controller (assuming you are ok w mini keys), makes playing something like Pigments that much better. th-cam.com/video/DXfh7nJUBKI/w-d-xo.html
@@LoVeAmBiEnT explorer is awesome. the synth engine is great (though it does not sound analog, digital in a good way) and the mpe on the keybed makes for an awesome vst controller (assuming you are ok w mini keys), makes playing something like Pigments that much better.
It’s a great synth , get one
The fact someone would spend $900 on the Vongon replay over the hydra explore for what five or $600 doesn’t make any sense in my opinion
The vongon synth turned me off of that company.
Yeah, crazy - worse than TE, maybe!
Annoying question -- Peak or Hydrasynth (desktop) if you could have only 1 poly? And why?
Personally it would be the peak because the effects are fantastic and has the ability to load user wave tables as well as having analog filters, vca’s, and distortion and drive. It will distort more pleasantly.
I think it was MajorOSC U-Toob channel that does a head to head comparison between the Summit (Novation’s 2 Peaks in one synth) vs. Hydrasynth. Worth having a deep listen to see which made the most usable timbres for your style.
@@YukiTheSynthDragon Thanks for the input! Cheers
@@entropybentwhistleThanks, will check it out. Cheers
@@YukiTheSynthDragon +1 to this - the Peak's reverb is the gold standard amongst all synths for effects.
Your right, the reverb is not the best. I have a Bigsky - together they are wonderful.
Sounds digital AF, to me. But I’d like one for Industrial sounds.
I have a Deluxe, it's my only hardware synth.
IDK, I *really* like the keybed. That's why I bought it. Some of the sounds are really delightful, and this has been the best tool for learning synthesis in a practical sense I've ever run across.
It is a joy to play, and a joy to use.
It has a lot of cool sounds in it! Some that I love. It *doesn't* have the kind of sound that really speaks to my heart and makes me feel joy. I really like instruments that have that vibe - a guitar, bass, piano, whatever - something that has a lovely sound to it.
This, for my purposes, doesn't.
So it doesn't give me a like, open filter/raw oscillator warm fuzzy feeling the way that other synths (even VSTs) do. It can sound "analog" but I haven't had much success getting the vibe that I'd get from something like an Oberheim, Prophet, Juno, etc.
I kind of wanted to have one synth that I use, and this is probably not actually gonna work for me. The answer is probably some vibey analog synth module, sitting on top of the Hydra.
But even though it's huge and heavy, I love playing the Deluxe.
I adore my Explorer. My only criticism is that the PolyTouch feels a bit "overqualified" for the smaller keys, but it's not a dealbreaker for me. Super-sturdy design otherwise. I get something new out of it everyday.
I think this is a fair video, but warm and digital are not opposites. This synth sounds noisy aliased and harsh up top IMO, and it's probably because it has a fairly low internal samplerate, the price for so many features. If you make lo-fi music it may not make as much of an impact, and it can also disappear in a mix. So it's not necessarily a deal breaker.
We can't speak of "sample rate" as there's no sample in Hydrasynth.
@@liviou2004Hi, I get what you are saying, but sample rate as I referred to is about the processing frequency used internally for digital audio processing. Any digital audio stream you listen to has a sampling rate, including any digital synth. It is unrelated to using samples, aside from digital audio being made up of a stream of samples of sound.
Higher internal processing frequencies require more powerful or dedicated hardware, and is more expensive in both production and research. For example, the Novation Peak and Super-6 use an FPGA for internal processing that is in the MHz audio rate where most digital synths use 48 or 96Khz internal sample rates for processing (sometimes literally using a raspberry PI inside).
The benefit of higher sample rates is a reduction in digital aliasing artifacts and inter modulation distortion when filtering. These are audible as a harsher and somewhat rougher tone usually.
@@Christian-op1ss Ok, Christian, I get it, you're right, thanks.
But, I don't fully agree with you : I get some warm and "soft" sounds on my Hydrasynth Deluxe, without any aliasing. Saying that this "synth sounds noisy aliased" is not the truth, I'm sorry. There are many parameters designed especially to "round" warm or soften the sounds. All depends on how the sound has been designed.
@@liviou2004 I don't think we disagree there. What you say is what I meant when I said "warm and digital sounding are nit opposites".
There's a lot of people saying that sample rate is related to warmth, but you can equalize for a warmer sound, like the Hydrasynth does with its new modes in the 2.0 firmware. In my original comment I did not say the Hydrasynth sounds cold, I said it (to me) has a noisy and aliased sound to it. My very subjective name for it would be "scratchy" and "less depth" but that may just be how I hear and name things. But not cold or clean.
I think you can make any synth tune to sound warmer or colder, that's a matter of filtering. Also, sound perception is subjective, and I don't want to diminish anyone from enjoying it! In fact I seriously considered the Hydrasynth myself, for its flexibility and fantastic interface.