High Temp CF-PET Prints Like A DREAM (aeForce™)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 ส.ค. 2023
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In this video we dive into aeForce™ Pet-CF from Phaetus. I have printed with a lot of filaments over the years but this is without a doubt the highest temp resistant PET I have seen. Combined with 15% carbon fiber I was blown away with how clean the parts came out. In this video we take a look at the filaments specs, what is required to print with it, and we do some 3d printing!
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Man, those prints look clean!
Great video! great explanation on CF-PET.
Interesting compo.
The print is Looking great 👍😀
cf petg prints like a dream!! My experience with CF-PETG from extrudr was great.
Thank you. I have been looking for a video on this stuff for a while.
Awesome! I was very surprised. I didnt know much about it prior and was expecting it to require a fair bit of tuning but that ended up not being the case.
You are the Best Man! I just ordered my First ever printer Ender 3 Si Pro. Ive been a Solidworks designer for 15 years. You are the most to the point No BS guy, thank you.
Phaetus is the GOAT. I use the Rapido UHF on my VzBot and couldn't be happier with everything I've ever used from them.
Thanks! Makes me want to reprint the parts for my MPCNC in this filament... might end up stronger than PLA.
Been printing with their cf-petg alot lately and i love it, honestly the most consistent prints that ive gotten, and at the price its a no brainer, love this stuff
I hope you have great ventilation or you accept the high risk of cancer for your and anybody in your home.
Cool story bro 😎
nice video man i appreciate your work 👍
cf-petg is my all time favorite to print with. I made a motor bracket for an electric bike using it. strong stuff.
Great video, thanks!
Thank you :)
I have this and the Qidi version. I think they’re the same honestly. I LOVE this filament and I’ve been using it for a ton of stuff.
Excellent video as always, man.
I honestly had no idea Qidi had a version of this. I will have to take a look. Thank you 🙏
@@ModBotArmy yes they have the entire line of these engineering filaments now, around the same prices but because they’re all on Amazon there are some significant sales that have popped up.
This looks so great! Looks like SLS nylon depending the angle you look at it
Its gorgeous. I have seen a lot of printed parts over the last decade and I was very impressed with the way these turned out.
it was stated the glass transition temp is above 100C. did you managed to test that? would be nice to use this as an alternative to ABS.
Would be nice to see another manufacturer for CF ASA.
Rather than adjust a bunch of speeds in the quality profile, you should be able to convert the max speed you want to print at from mm/s into mm/s cubed, and simply set it in the filament profile under Max Volumetric Speed. The slicer will then automatically scale all the other speeds for you, and only when that particular filament is chosen.
You are absolutely right. I have used that in the past when I have determined my hotends max flow rate but hadnt considered doing it in this case.
Any chance i could get more info on this? This sounds like exactly what i need to learn. Im still pretty new to printing
Cool!
This might be why I never experienced the steep lear curve when I started printing 5 years ago. I always treated the printer sort of like an oven and always preheated for at least 15 minutes before printing. Sometimes a lot longer because I would get sucked into TH-cam videos 😂
Nice. I'm a CF junkie myself. That said, I hope Phaetus sent you some of their ASA-GF. I have had a really hard time dialing in the flow rate for that stuff. Love to see others experience with it.
Just checking: Did you predry it? All fiber reinforced materials should be predried even if the base (matrix) material usually does not require it as the interface between material and fiber may absorb additional water.
@@Bapate-rh9be Yep. I dry all my new filaments right out of the box. Learned that lesson the hard way.
I really dig the look/texture of the parts.
Are there any other filaments that are able to achieve this? (maybe a tad cheaper)
I would like to see this compared to bambu labs version
And qidi
It’s the same
Do they have a PET-CF? Or is it a PETG? It is probably more comparable to their PETG then.
@@ModBotArmy they both have a pet cf but it’s identical
@@tadhgd350 you mean Phaetus manufacturers it?
I'm printing hotend stuff with resin. High toughness or hightemp both work great
Duuude! I bought a rool of CF-PET from BambuLab ....this shit is crazy good!!! I used supports and they detached way easier than I imagined, it's easy to print and it's tough and stiff! It's not looking as good as yours (might be settings or the brand difference) but still my favorite CF filament I've tried by far! Thanks for that video!
Dont forget filtration he does not mention anything about the health risk, this is really irresponsible
Filament looks great but too expensive for my taste. Maybe one day when I have some extra to splurge lol Side note, I was looking for a filter to put in my upcoming V0.2 build, that Bento Mini looks perfect. Thanks ModBot!
Totally, if you dont need the high temp stuff just check out CF PETG its less than half the price and still awesome.
@ModBotArmy where's paht-cf fall into the list? What's the most moisture resistant and strong cf filament? For outdoor or use on cars
Wow this material looks insane. Been really struggling with Bambu basic PETG in black for 3 weeks now. TPU is easier to print with than this stuff!
Is this a fume free option like PET-G? Thinking this is the ticket for my PRUSA fan shrouds, instead of ABS/ASA, and maybe even for a set of Voron parts. I have small kids and dion't like the idea of printing Styrene filaments, even with the filter in the X1C. This looks to have the advantage in heat resistance anyway, so for the PRUSA shrouds and parts near the nozzle that warp at high temps, I am failing to see the downside. Great vid!
Keep in mind to get peak temperature properties you need to anneal it (like 4h at 100C)
There is no mention on annealing to get the mentioned properties. This prints at 300C which is WAY hotter than any PET or PETG I have seen previously.
how did the fan change the layer strength ? I had the same problems with pc-cf it needed 10% fan all the time and upto 30% on overhangs otherwise it was a mess.
I didnt notice any difference when pulling on the parts with my hands from 0 to 30% fan speed. That being said it isnt very scientific and it is possible that it did have at least a slight affect on interlayer adhesion.
Love these videos! It would be cool if you added in some quick strength comparisons. Nothing crazy rigorous or scientific (because that’s a ton of extra work) but even just an anecdotal subjective report of how hard it is to bend a part made of filament A vs a part made of filament B with your hands. I’m intrigued by exotic filaments but sometimes I wonder if they’re really any stronger than standard PLA/PETG for normal temp usage.
Thanks for the feedback. I would LOVE to create some sort of test rig. Even if it isnt quite as detailed but just to give a comparison table. I cannot make any promises but I will definitely look further into this.
There are a bunch of test out there. CF does not increase strength btw.
@@sierraecho884 I don’t want to look at “other tests”, I watch @ModBotArmy for a reason-I like his content and I appreciate his take on things. That’s why I suggested that he add those comparisons.
Yes, CF doesn’t increase strength, it increases stiffness-I know. I’m not a material scientist or engineer, so I use terms like “strength” to cover any enhancement of physical robustness even if they aren’t 100% precise.
I understand that you want to see those test done by your favorite TH-camr, however he has little incentive to do so if the content is already out there. This type of content is also tedious and time consuming, nobody likes to reinvent the wheel. Strength and stiffness are not the same thing though. CF generally speaking has very little advantage in 3D printing over base material. But is has a serious health risk. I know the parts look cool and feel strong I just wish youtubers would create a bigger picture here by mentioning all advantages and disadvantages.@@nonchalanto
@@sierraecho884 he responded to my message positively, so he does have an incentive to do it. And I specifically suggested that he do it in a different way than other TH-camrs. I said it does *not* have to be rigorously scientific, but just a quick subjective comparison of how robust the parts feel in his personal opinion. It’s very easy, not tedious, and not reinventing the wheel.
And as I already acknowledged, I know strength isn’t the same as stiffness. I’ll repeat this again because you didn’t read my comment. I used the word strength informally to cover a wide range of qualities regarding physical robustness. Not everyone is as tediously pedantic as you are, and they wouldn’t be bothered by my using that word. I understand how much it bothered you though, and I hope you make a speedy recovery from the trauma.
can you recommend a cheaper option mainly for the surface finish look alone. I'd love to try some thanks.
Yeah! Check out their CF-PETG. It is $30 instead of $70.
If you had to print a super strong part that pulls a cable with a lot of weight on it, what filament would you use?
So I'm understanding this correctly; you were able to print this material open air, no cooling fan, and it printed without warping and essentially no stringing or layer lines?
Sort of sounds like a miracle Filament. How long would you say it took you to dial in the settings before having a good profile for it?
I think the reason it's easy to print is because the added CF makes it easy. Standard PET is said to be much more annoying.
Yeah, I was almost as suprised as you. I went with pretty standard settings and the middle of their recommendations. The only issue I ran into was cooling related but once I adjusted I got near perfect prints after that first print. This stuff is beautiful. Something tells me they have done more to this polymer than they state. I dont see how a PET and CF would get temps this high. Not sure what the secret sauce is but it prints very well, looks incredible, and is super stiff.
I am looking for high temp in sunlight or a car but I don't need the cost of carbon fiber and my project does not need to be any stiffer than PLA. And ABS is out for me due to the fumes and settling of partials all over your printer. I am looking for something in the cost range of PLA or PETG per Kg. I am able to print PLA these days with 8-10% infill that is quite strong. I use a REVO 0.6mm high flow hotend and nozzle and a direct drive Extruder. It would make for a nice video if you have any recommendations.
What slicer is that?
I am curious if the heat resistance is straight after printing or the parts need to be annealed first. Recently UltiMaker also released a PET CF, that also comes in blue colour and has even higher heat resistance after annealing about 181C, while without annealing it is just 76C. Which is closer to other PETG CF filaments available in the market. PETG can not be annealed (glycol prevents crystalization) and PET can, but it would a bit disingenuous to claim 112-148C heat resistance and not mentioning anything about annealing, IF it is required to get the heat resistance at that level.
Correct me if I’m wrong, in one breath you say you can’t anneal PETG, in the other why don’t you say whether you’re annealing this blend. If you can’t anneal PETG, why should you expect a blend to be annealed? 🤔
@@ziggystardog I am not expecting the blend to be annealed... I think you misunderstood me. I will try to phrase my question as clear as I can. *Does this filament "aeForce PET-CF" have an ISO 75 heat resistance of 112C straight of the printer OR does it require annealing to reach that level?* Is this more clear?
@@Dramaican88 thanks, I’d missed that this was CF-PET rather than the more common CF-PETG which explains the added expense. Per your question, it’s most likely on the data sheets he referenced.
There is zero mention of annealing in any of the testing whatsoever including their test parameters. It is my understanding that this is straight from print bed. The filament prints at 300C which is stupid hot and helps to confirm what I am seeing. I agree completely putting values that require additional post processing like annealing without mentioning it would be deceitful.
@@ModBotArmy Thank you very much for the response. Indeed the print temperature is quite high so maybe this is a really nice super material. I will see if I can find it in Europe or I will try the very similar QIDI PET CF that also prints at 280-300C and is at a similar price. For computer parts near heatsinks the temperature resistance of PETG CF is not good enough. This filament might be a very good and relatively affordable alternative option to PA6-CF and PC-CF. Maybe Phaetus will also make ABS or ASA with CF in the future, because currently I only see glass fiber reinforced versions.
do you have a bambu affiliate link?
PET in general prints like a dream but sadly almost no one knows this because we've all been sold on the PETG 🤮 that creeps and gunks up the nozzle and delaminates if printed with fan at the recommended temperatures.
I've never had creeping, gunking and I print petg with 100% fan. Used a few different brands and use the same settings for all of them. Actually Im lazy and print pla and petg with the same settings besides nozzle temp. Never had an issue. I use an old, outdated printer as well.
Allot of the CF Filled Filaments are just far to pricey for me to afford. I can afford a nice PLA CF (1 Kg ) by Jayo it is low cost compared to the rest but great filament.
I wished to get a PETG CF filament to use as it be stronger than the PLA CF. But most of those few I found were very pricey like £40 upwards.
I then was on Amazon UK and found a ERYONE Carbon Fiber PETG Filament for only £24.99p ( 1 Kg ) black. which is amazing! I will try it soon? it has got god reviews.
I use hardened or stainless steel nozzles as standard now on my 4 printers so the filament wear will not be a issue.
I just got the 4th new 3D printer the Elegoo Neptune 3 Max. it is my 1st direct drive printer and I love it. I hoping to upgrade the head to a all metal throat soon?
Phaetus does have a CF-PETG that wont have the high temp properties but should still be a great filament for less than half the price of this.
Awesome! I dont have the 3 but I believe I have seen videos of others upgrading the heatbreak to make it all metal.
Carbon fiber is now in any type of filament, but is it possible that no one worries about the fact that breathing carbon particles is harmful?
They are embedded in plastic, so there is no chance they will become airborne. Manufacture is another matter, hopefully they take the required precautions.
If you think this stuff can go hot, check out the heat resistance numbers on the Bambu Labs PET-CF.
I'm about to order a roll to see what it's like.
Not sure if i missed it in the video but is an enclosure necessary for this filament?
Nope! No enclosure needed :). Control moisture by drying it and have an all metal hotend are the main things.
@@ModBotArmy beautiful. I may give this a shot. Those prints look super smooth.
man i hate when people keep saying it increases strength.
no,it does NOT increase strength,it increases rigitdity. and in exchange,you weaken your part.
Me too, fucking influencer TH-camr. He didn´t mention anything about health risks as well.
I still would love to know how much of the bad lung stuff gets into the air with cqrbon fibre parts not only as the head rubs across the already printed material but also through the objects lifespan.
Im hesitant because I feel like CF might be the next asbestos.
It most likely is the next asbetos, the way it influences our body is pretty much the same.
When you change the hot end on phetus do you heat it up to 250?
Yeah at least. Since I printed at 300C I may have even gone a little hotter when tightening but yeah 250 is normally what I do.
@@ModBotArmy thanks
I like your videos. How do you like the carbon fiber? And does it smell?I printed some but only the one from bambu.
@@emanuelcalderon i appreciate it 😊 I did notice a faint smell. Nothing too strong but if I was doing a lot of cf I would opt for added filtration or better ventilation than my small studio.
Which printer is that?
This is the RatRig V-Minion
CF filaments that AREN'T PLA, that stuff is a prime example of throwing money at something doesn't always make it better and in some cases makes it worse(CF-PLA is worse in every way compared to regular PLA...)
Wish someone would start making more GF filaments instead of fixating on the 'uber CaRbOn' trope as GF is likely to be as good or even better that CF when added to many plastics, and it is SIGNIFICANTLY cheaper...
It´s all marketing. CF does not increase strength, it can give you cancer and it is expensive but it sounds cool and it looks cool and fame driver influencer have to show that shit even though it does not provide any benefit beside improved printability.
Is this stuff stronger than cf petg?
Pet cf is better than nylon cf when wet
you will destroy the heatbreak of the dragonfly with CF filaments, its not made for it
They are not carbon fiber filaments, there are no fibers. Just bits of carbon. Carbon fiber is a totally different thing.
The parts are also not stronger, just stiffer but also more fragile.
2:50 Uhh, when you say "the MPa are different" here, you do know you're highlighting the error bars on the measurements here - not the actual measurements? The +/- sign on the original table shows that clearly; I'm not sure why you replaced that with brackets
Good catch. I did miss that in the table. Hopefully that is seen in the previous screen grab.
pleaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaase someone test Fillamentums Aramid AF-80
Added it to my list! Thanks for the recommendation.
what is this printer?
140 degrees ??? That's nothing compared to Bambu lab's pet-cf, it's heat deflection temperature is over 200 degrees celcius!
Ok better choice would be PC-CF
Depends on application. This stuff printed way easier than any PC I have previously tested. PCCF is also on my list though.
Want me to send you a roll ?@@ModBotArmy
"increases the strength and stiffness of the part" - since many, many tests of this claim on youtube seem to show this is not true, bold claim, lets see your evidence?
There is no evidence, it does not increase stength at all. It is also a health risk.
Bambu lab PET-CF is $44.99. you should review this one. im currently having clumping issues on stock settings and new nozzle and would like to see if this is the same with others.
CF does NOT increase strength in nearly ever filament ever done. It is EXTREMELY rare (basf is the only exception I know of) for CF to make a filament stronger.
Informative, but inaccurate...
It does help with temp and wear resistance, but part strength is typically weaker.
Pla is stronger, at least the video I just watched proves it is, that blows my mind
I’m what way though? Impact? Tensile? Stronger could mean multiple things.
I find it weird that acronyms like JPEG, GIF, RADAR, SCUBA are spoken as words, but PETG never makes it past the awkward spelling individual letters out. We J-PEG, what about PET-G then.
I have heard both over the years. I definitely switch them up without realizing it sometimes. As long as you know what I am talking about :)
@@ModBotArmyPET-G seems to flow better in speech
i don't believe this, it's just carbon dust, reducing layer adhesion ! to make this stuff work, it needs to be long strings, or patches of material - this is how carbon fiber works. i bet layer adhesion is super weak, max ~20% of pla. snapping filament is pretty much proof. but it looks cool
Not super weak but impact resistance is measurably worse than for non-CF-contaminated materials. The only reasons for using CF-filled filament is if you absolutely want that surface finish and, in the case of nylon, to make it slightly easer to print.
It is definitely not as strong as continuous fibers like what you get with Markforged. That being said it can provide some really nice characteristics. For Nylons it is super strong but doesnt warp as much and gives you a little less flex. For strength continuous fiber would be better. I am not sure why we havent seen it. Maybe cost or that it is patented? I have heard of some buying it from Markforged and printing on their machines so it should be possible with fairly standard printer hardware.
Any filament over $20 a spool isn’t worth it 😂
Why would you print parts that do not need cf, do functional parts that actually need this filament.
Because he can lol
It’s a gorgeous filament. And the heat properties are perfect considering this will be in an enclosed printer printing fairly high temp materials. Depending on what you are printing I know a few that only print in cf for their products. They don’t technically need it but it looks great and customers are happy to pay a little extra for it.
As he said in the video, aesthetics. CF makes gorgeous parts. He didn't pay for the filament, so why not. Plus it's his job to use these things for review purposes and let us know how they perform.
@@ModBotArmy But literally the reason to buy it is for the CF properties and we have ZERO clue if they are worth it or even functional with this review. I don't buy engineering materials for aesthetics and I doubt anyone does.
@@kf4hqf2 refer to my reply to him.
It’s the same filament with cheaper FusRock PET-CF :)
PETG is not PET !!! 🙄
It is literally the same material, the G stands for Glycol.
@@sierraecho884As a filament for 3D printing it is not food safe !!!
@@sierraecho884In addition, abrasive filaments produce very high amounts of UFPs (UltraFineParticles)!!!
@@jamesbont7052 No filament is food safe, not only due to it´s material composition but due to the print process and the layered structure.
@@sierraecho884Explizit !!! 👍