Riding the Most DANGEROUS Dirt Bike of All Time!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 พ.ค. 2024
- We take a ride on the Most Dangerous motocross bike ever built...wish us luck! The 1971 Suzuki TM400 Cyclone has a fearsome reputation and was nicknamed the Widow Maker for a reason. It's considered by some to be the worst dirt bike of all time and one of the most difficult two strokes riders have ever had to try and tame. So naturally we wanted to get our hands on one to take it for a rip!
As well as taking the beast for a spin we are also going in depth on the history of the machine, telling the full story of the 400cc Cyclone, which was the very first Japanese Big Bore 2 Stroke, and of course we are going to see how this 52-year-old antique compares to a modern day MX machine in a hot lap show down! I hope you enjoy watching and be sure to let us know what other bikes you'd like to see us ride on the channel....
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Thanks to Dale and Malcolm for all their work and effort! As always a massive shoutout goes to Sean Smith for all his help on this project.
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Riding the Most Dangerous Dirt Bike in the World!
Riding the Most Dangerous Dirt Bike Ever Made! - กีฬา
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Owned one in 71 at 14 years old... my dad bought 2 for $800 each $1600 otd... my pops shows up at my Base ball practice... he was 1/2 drunk and limping... he said Kid if you can start it one of them is yours.., in my baseball cleats it started second kick... the Suzuki dealer got my dad drunk lol hurt his foot trying to start it... best day of my young life. I wore both of them out fairly quickly... learned how to weld with a clothes hanger too... cracked pipes the first week... finally bought a Basani. Knee on the seat wheelies for miles.
That memory could be the basis of a great movie. Makes me want to hear where it went from there, did Dad heal up and ride with you? Did you go on to get an RM500? Did your tm400s survive? Cool story, cool bike. Thanks for sharing
@4thdimensiontravels855 your too kind.. I did finish 1st Master (I'm 66) at the Christmas Classic desert race last Saturday. That was fun. I rode like an old man though... my wife and I spent 2 years remodeling ( took it down to the studs) home and haven't ridden .. took a 2 week vacation to race this event. Kinda cool :)
FUN STUFF.... SUM DAD.. LUV IT
HOW OLD ARE YOU NOW
He needs to stand up more and we used our legs the way modern riders use the suspension and wheelie over everything else most of the time ⌚ always on the back wheel 🎡
I also had one at 15 but it was 1983 and it was a '74TS. It was reddish orange and looked hust like this.
Loved this guys review and the history. Nobody knows now, how big and nasty Suzuki was. I broke mine in half. Allegedly the downtime were too close to the head pipe which could temper the steel from getting "quenched" and they'd snap.
It tossed me off the bike and bruised my foot for a week one day. Compression stroke is critical on big bikes! 😂😂😂
I raced this bike in the "open" class in the early 70's. I was so small [at 15yrs] my father had to start it for me. I basically cranked the throttle and held on for dear life!! A regular top 10 finisher in the local races in Western New York.
Thanks for sharing this video. My dad and uncle both owned the yellow 1972 version of this bike. Just hearing the unique sound of that loud 2-stroke brought back a lot of memories from the 1970’s. I did ride my dad and uncles bikes in the California desert when I got older in 1987. Both bikes had been modified with large fly wheel weights, and were fast. My dad’s bike still sits in a shed to this day.
Yeah, mine was the yellow and was a beast never lost a race, but I was just racing the kids and some of the older guys that had heard about me, I remember a guy that had a 900 kawasaki and he thought it was baddest thing on the planet until I beat him in eighth mile ,never seen him again!
Its my understanding that these are just coming around the bend. Don't sell it but you sure could make a lot of new friends at the vintage races with that bike! Cool story you shared, too!
@@jonnyconsumer3813 thank you my friend. The bike is in SoCal and I live in Tucson. Our off road club has a small MC museum and I was thinking of donating it to them. I also own a 1985 RM 250 F that I may also donate.
I had a 74 which I raced in 75. I really liked the bike. Gave me my first win and it is the only trophy I have kept. Back then the European bikes cost 50% more and were built with better quality materials. When someone says "Put something exciting between your legs" think of the TM400. If you compare a 1975 TM400 to a 1977 390 Husky The evolution is amazing. Thanks for your videos.
Thank you for watching and taking the time to comment :-) That statement certainly still fits to this day, it was definitely more exhilarating riding the TM over the modern bikes!
@@999lazer
And he's alive!
Hunky said they were lively!😮
I had the tm400 and later a ts400 street legal Enduro, only one that bit me was the ts400, what a awesome machine to have in Tucson in the 70s
And this right here is why I love Suzuki…growing up in the 1970s as a kid this was the one bike I remember wanting …that aside from what Sheene rode lol
@@999lazer
I think my most frightening dirt digger would be a Maico 700 they are just mental machines.
I currently own a 1971 and it still has the original paint, seat cover and pipe. Took a third place on it earlier this year at the prestigious Virginia City GP. Interesting note the bike was raced back in 71 at the VC gp race.
I still own my 72,73, and 74 to this day. 67 years old…Lol
Have owned dozens of old dirtbikes throughout the last 5 decades including the suzuki 400. The one brand of bike that terrified me the most were those old Hodaka dirtbikes. Those things had a powerband that would redline so quickly that they could literally rip your arms off of the handlebars. Combined with the horrible suspensions and terrible handling characteristics they had - those things could(and would!) get you killed before you even realized the impending doom was about to happen to you. Those old Hodakas were brutally insane and definitely not for the faint of heart!
My first bike was a race prepped combat wombat. I rang the snot out of it and tried to destroy it and I couldn’t. Replaced it with a modern at the time Suzuki RM 250
that I tore to pieces. Both bikes just tore ass though.
The Hodaka surprised a lot of people though.
Rode several Hodakas but I never had one pull by arms close to the sockets. A TM400 could hit you with a sudden surge of torque that was fun on a straight away with good traction however in tight cornering that torque surge was terrible and hard to handle. I rode 360 and 400cc Maico bikes back in the late 1960's and early '70's that had a much wider torque band and were much easier to ride fast. If you want to get a surge of arm pulling just ride a 400 or 501cc Maico from the early 1970's they will really stretch you arms from a couple thousand rpm to redline.
Brother the Ace 100 Hodaka mini bike was criminally overpowered! It's a miracle more people didn't die. Nobody needs a minibike that can top 100mph!😂
The Mopar of dirt bikes with the names 😆
I owned a 71 yamaha mx 250. Tore it up in 1 summer, thrashing it in the fields of suburbia souther Michigan. Rochester to be exact. Box cannon. Avon rd and Old Perch rd. Epic summer. The only machine that was IMO better was the 125 Penton with its insanely large head fins. Nimble and crazy power.
Update: Sean knows how to ride these Big 2 strokes - keep the R's up and use the power. ( Not like today's 4 strokes ) And get your Arus off the seat !! You have to work those old bikes !!! Gotta love it !!!
Great Video - brought back a lot of memories 😀!!
Needs more practice though, I think he must have been a late starter 😂
My parents bought me a Suzuki motocross bike in 1971. Absolutely loved the power and sound of the two-stroke. Modern bikes don’t compare.
Yeah they don't compare lmao
@@awfab3517Yea, thank frikkin God they don't. If they did the population would be significantly lower. And insurance costs would be significantly higher.
I had a couple of them, and they had a real good wide power band on the motor. The frames and suspension left quite a bit to be desired, however. You could pull wheelies in third and fourth gear easy. And yes, they would do 86 top speed, with stock gearing. I drag raced mine at Orange County Raceway and it ran low fourteens at 86 mph.
In 1995 I was 14 and had a 1984 Can-Am MX250, A friend of mine brought one of these 400's over to race me down the street and around the trail.. It ran like crap and I let him know it. My dad got home from work and his jaw dropped when he saw the 400. He bought it that day from my friend. Once he got it running decent, it was night and day, and it would walk on my Can-Am. It was a very finicky bike though..
Like Sean said in the review, if you can stretch out the gears long enough this thing is really fast. I can imagine it taking on most challengers in it's day! Thanks for taking the time to watch and comment Lucas :-)
Surprised ur can-am didnt better the suzuki.. that cyclone maybe had 35 or so hp but those can-ams, especially the mx one, had 38-40hp if I recall correctly.. they were Beast motors if running right...way stronger than even the elsinore cr250 which had 28 or 29hp... handling wise, either of those would put the cyclone on the back burner
These are the bikes I grew up around. My first high performance machine was a 73’ CR250M Elsinore. You guys today have know idea what it was like riding a twin shocker with 4” of travel. The front end on the Elsinore was at the time a radical 7” of travel. The Elsinore power delivery was much the same. You get it on the pipe hold on. Riders back the just had to adapt to no travel and light switch power delivery. Don’t get me wrong that Honda took me straight to the podium. Other bikes around just could not compare. I only wish I had kept the Elsinore for the memories.
Bought a old Elsinore 250 off a older gentleman when I was 26 bike was fun sold it the guy still has it and rides it along with a older bsa he has great memories of a animal machine
Team honda!
I use to ride the 125 Elsinore one of the first bikes with a power band and 6 speed box the 250 was a weapon the early yz 400 was a weapon as well
the problem with a lot of those early jap 2 strokes they had the power but the frames , suspensions and handling , like the weight as he mentions , were not compatible to their use had a honda mt 250 elsinore street legal version around '75 underpowered , heavy , and front end was raked out too far which looks kinda like the cyclone has had to sit halfway on the tank to get the front end to stick in turns n powerslides first big jump i took on it bent one of the rear shocks points ignition needed constant attention, messed up one time and burnt a hole in the piston but it ran real good for about 20 minutes neighbor friends dad ran a machine shop n we were constantly makin mods made our own expansion chambers , shaved heads for a lil more oomph , polished exh. ports , stripped them down he had a early mid 70s yam 125 then a used bultaco 360 that was setup for flat track that thing was a beast got rid of mine and later got a used husky 450 2 st. wr around 78-79 with a enduro setup on it that thing was a beast and a blast and handled great still it kept u on ur toes a hard 30 min. ride and it would check ur conditioning still miss that one
Yep, that's all true. My cousin had a 74 Elsinore that I've ridden. The power band was scary & violent.
Back in the mid 70's a groop of us ran the Mint 400 with a TM400 with a flywheel from a TS400 so we could run lights. That heaver flywheel helped a lot in controlling the power. We didn't finish that race but great memories...
Love the TS. Did you know a TS 185 top end will go right on the RM 125? Suzuki❤️❤️
The early TS Suzuki's were great bikes even the 250 was a crazy bike , we were all very lucky to have ridden 1970s YZ Yamaha, the TM and TS Suzuki's, Can-Ams, Maico's, Bultaco's, Montesa's and the first of the CRs , RMs, and I think Kawasaki made a dirt bike lol
I had a '74 TS400... picked it up in '75 for $230 (he had advertised it in the $2 SD U/T "Thrifties" ads) - the guy thought the engine was ruined... it had just thrown a chain, and broke the little cover plate behind the front sprocket and all the engine oil had leaked out... bought a new plate at the dealer, and basically had a brand new motorcycle for "dirt" cheap.
I remember using my Dad's Dark Blue '67 Chevelle "Malibu" Station Wagon to get it home to San Diego Del Cerro from Poway.
My very first motorcycle was the 1979 Suzuki TS125 in yellow. Beautiful bike with headlight, tail light, turns and a fender mounted tool bag. My next door neighbor at the lake had a 1974 Blue Suzuki TS250. Beast of a machine. He was taller than me, a couple years older and not afraid. We rode fire trails and had a gravel pit close to us all to ourselves. I learned SO much! We would take turns following each other and even had our own enduro races where we timed each other. I was envious of the power he had, and he was envious of my new machine. After enjoying the bike for a number of years, getting my motorcycle license, growing more and gaining more confidence and complaining to my parents that it was time for a new machine, I stepped into a brand new Kawasaki KDX 200 Enduro (RED) with white number plates and a digital speedo readout. THAT BIKE more than evened the score. Wow. After that it was a 1992 black Kawasaki Ninja 600. Beautiful bike. Had some close calls. Then I quit riding for 23 years. Now I'm 55 and decided if I'm going to kill myself, it's going to be on a Harley. Own a 2014 Dyna Low Rider AND a 2014 Street Glide Special. Both coming in at 1,700cc. It all comes back like yesterday. Merry Christmas everyone!
I had a PE 175 back in the days of my youth and it was a pretty sketchy machine in its own right. That said, I love the old air cooled big bore 2t bikes they were not the greatest for tracks like we have today by any means but made excellent woods and hair scramble machines for sure. They had a much stronger torque curve due to much lower revs and the longer gearing. I always rode mine on the logging and quarry trails and they were super fast on the top end compared to the MX bikes of the late 80s and up. The benefit of riding one of these dinosaurs was it was so heavy that it built up your endurance and stamina to a point that when you jumped on a more modern machine it was like riding a BMX bike you could throw it around like nothing.
I would say that anyone who is a true 2t MX enthusiast owes it to themselves to throw a leg over one of these all steel monsters at least once in their lifetime because until you have donated a kidney for the sake of a podium spot on one of these you haven’t really dug it out in the dirt. Guys like Hannah were monsters much like the machines they rode and had to have nerves of steel and balls of brass to run more than 30 minutes on one of these bone crushers. Just saying don’t knock these guys for what seem like puny jumps and lame tracks until you have run a few laps on the steeds they were mounted upon because you have no idea the brutalization those guys went through.
got a pe 175 about 1980 after i got out of the marines to get back into trail riding pound for pound and dollar for dollar that was a great all round machine it would power wheelie thru 4 out of 5 gears and had the 'full floater' single shock rear that handled pretty good did a wheelie in the parking lot of the suzuki dealer in orlando just to see salesman flipped out was ridin in ocala national forest one time havin a big ol time by myself n looked down at the odometer n i was about 25 miles out in the middle of nowhere n decided it was prob a good time to turn back only one that was above it i had was a late 70s husky 450wr 2 st. that thing was a blast but it took all ur attn. to not let it bite back if u were pushin it
My Dad and Uncle were both pros in the early 70s, we discussed this bike a few times. The way they explained it was that MX was gaining popularity so fast in the US at that time that lots of super inexperienced riders were going out and buying these cheap Japanese machines and going WAY faster than their skill level. On top of that 40hp the sub par geometry and brakes and that means a lot of injuries. A professional could do a few mods and adapt to the bike if he had to, but there were much better choices mainly the husqvarna. The 400CR was dominant and didn’t need much to be race prepped and weren’t too far from the factory machines.
That's really interesting to know, and it makes sense when you think about it. The sport was so young at the time really wasn't it, i mean the AMA national championships didn't begin until 1972. So it totally makes sense that there wasn't a massive amount of experienced riders ready to try and tame the TM! Thanks for watching and taking the time to comment :-)
Same with the CZ 380. Outside of the weight it was an incredible bike.
You are correct, my Uncle Tony Wynn was one of the few riders to get to go to Czech CZ factory with Lackey, Tripes and a few others 1971. He finished 10th overall in 1972 on The CZ
Wow! Tony Wynn is your uncle? You come from a fine blood line! Family get togethers must be a blast and a history lesson.@@dogtownbrogers2796
That thing sounds nasty starting up , pure 2 stroke Evil 😈
100% nasty :)
Old guy here. Was riding as a young man at the time. Mostly Hodaka, but others too ... This thing was new, so not cheap. And when they came up for sale, you had to ask why?
There were plenty of good bikes around. If you had money you were on CZ, Husky, Maico, or Bultaco. Ossa and Montessa were around, but not big sellers.
We were trail riders in the mountains of Calif and Nevada. Some were doing Baja. We hardly ever saw soil as wet as yours. Much more dry and dusty. And dust is like tiny ball bearings. When this motor hit it was any direction but where you were looking. I did know Suzuki riders who went through all the mods you mentioned. The Kawi's were just as bad. The Elisnore is what really changed the landscape for Japanese dirt bikes. Until then you had to know how to weld, and suspension tune. Step one - ChromeMoly swing arm and new shocks. Terry Kit the front end and start adding frame braces 😁
Agree with you on about everything.
But I think you left out one of the most important bikes of the 70’s: 1971 Yamaha 250 Enduro and YZ version. I think Honda Elsinore and that Yamaha were the game changers in motocross!
Love these old bikes. They're so raw!
You gotta respect the guys who rode them back in the day.
My 76 montesa has put me in hospital twice this year 😅
I tried one at Willseyville, It was unridable, ended up riding a dr400 Suzuki and one my class.
I remember in 1971 a local bike shop brought a cyclone out to the track to test. Being a young guy I watched and then pulled up to the guys at the van as they talked about the bike. I remember them saying it had lots of power, but it is "just weird man." They all said it had good power but none wanted to race it.
I had an Elsinore 125 and my friend had the TM-400...it was a wheelie Monster and sounded so sweet on the pipe! '77RM-370 was my favorite bike I ever owned though.
Lots of comments have mentioned the 370, I'll have to see if i can track one down! Thanks for taking the time to watch :-)
@@999lazer my dad an uncles all raced suzukis in that era savages and cyclones, all of them loved the rm370 the best.
I had the RM 370! Rear suspension sucked! But man, what a powerhouse! Only bike I ever owned with more raw power was my CanAm 480!
Loved the video I never had the 400 but my first bike was a 1974 Suzuki tm 100 which I won several races on Suzuki pretty much dominated Mx racing around here back in the mid seventies I thought the bike was great at the time until 76 when I got a RM 125 but back when I was 12 I didn’t know what good suspension even was hearing that 400 run brought back a lot of good memories I’m 62 now as much as I love them old Suzukis believe I will stick with my 2022 husband FX 350 please keep making videos like this one
I also hat a TM… they were great bikes.
Thanks for taking the time to watch and comment Lyndone. We'll keep the videos coming for sure, I've got lots of ideas in the tank! :-)
Brilliant video, I liked that bike back in the day, but i loved the RM370.
Glad you enjoyed it. Cheers Max
i would love to buy a 1976 Rm 370
Few things about the Cyclone, besides being such a bad handling bike - the spark advance problem was not constant, it had an unpredictable nature - sometimes it worked well, and sometimes it went full advance in an instant. This bike dynoed at around 30-32hp when new. Your beautiful sample is probably doing quite a bit less. A 1975 CZ 250 had about 22 h.p. (rear wheel). Times have truly advanced!
Back then, all Japanese MX bikes where in an embryonic state and it was up to the owners to modify them. Suspension, especially in the back was horrendous, until long travel began in 1974 where it was just "less bad". KONI sold a lot of shocks pre 1974 to help the handling a bit. You should try it on a hard packed track wide full open to feel the chassis flex. Loved the video. Thanks for the memories!
Thanks for taking the time to watch Jaime :-) I've had a few people say we should try it on hard pack...I'm curious but also a little scared to give it a go! haha Thanks again :-)
@@999lazer - thanks for the great content in your channel. Always superbly entertaining!
yeah those early swingarms would do some dancin around too on top of that with rubber bushings to add to the fun of powerslidin
My gosh. This was a trip to watch. I’m 61 now. I rode a friends TM 250 around a few times when I was in high school. I was probably 5‘5“ and 128 pounds. I couldn’t stay on those bikes! Lol. I flew off! Smitty
Really enjoyed watching this! I bought a new leftover '72 TM400J for $700 in the summer of '73. I had ridden a '71 quite a bit and there were some updates on the '72: foam air filter, a different exhaust with a built in baffle to smooth the power hit and lower the decibels, a larger oil injection tank, the kick starter was fixed so it didn't get stuck down after cranking, also it came with a blank plug in the extra sparkplug/compression release hole, (which I'm sure the '71 did too) it and the '71 had a regular type chrome gas cap without the vent tube. It would pull power wheelies in all 5 gears. At our elevation (sea level to 1500 ft) the pilot was a little rich, just drop down one size and then put a flywheel on and it wasn't hard to control. The stock pilot would cause a little loading up and then as it revved up it would come on all at once. Rode mine for 6 years, raced it some, did a lot of hill climbing also, before selling. Also like some have said, having a welder was mandatory to keep the pipe, pipe mount and gas tank welded up after they started cracking from the vibration. Lot's of my friends had them in my area, but haven't seen one in years around here. Also I have the CYCLE magazine when they tested the "71 TM400R against the Maico 400. They preferred the Maico. More controllable and better suspension. The one line I remember from the article said something like " whenever you twist the LOUD throttle on the TM, you'd better have it pointed where you wanted to go or be able to heal quickly".
Great video as always guys. One bike I'd love to see you test would be the 1981 RM 125. As you probably know this was Suzuki's first 125 that was water cooled. It also had the full floater suspension which was new at that stage. It was by far the best 125 of that year and it would be interesting to see how it measures up against the more modern stuff as regards lap times. I think 1981 was the year where things started to advance with motocross development as regards the water cooling and single shock suspension fitted on most of the Japanese machines. I think they handled slightly better than that TM400 !! Keep up the great work guys , your work and effort is much appreciated.
Thanks so much for taking the time to watch and comment Dave. I'll put the 1981 125 on the list of bikes to get featured on the channel :-)
@@999lazer Thanks for taking the time to reply. I look forward to seeing it sometime in the future. As a guy who raced Schoolboy and AMCA in the eighties riding 125 and 250 2 strokes I think your videos are top drawer. You obviously love 2 strokes and your enthusiasm is clear to see.
The Honda XL250-K0 is another really interesting bike. Obviously nowhere near the performance of this Suzuki but Roger DeCosta rode it to victory in California enduro races. It was a one-hit-wonder. Later versions totally lost the cool factor.
I had an '82 RM125 that I bought brand new and raced until '85 when I bought a new one. The '82 was truly a great bike, super easy to ride and that full floater suspension was so incredibly good. At the time, I had never experienced rear suspension like that. I would say the full floater was every bit as good as what we have now. But the forks were only marginal; they had a very smooth stroke, but bottomed out hard and often. So the bike was sort of unbalanced in that regard, a great, superb rear suspension paired with average forks that were nothing like the new bikes have. Power was great though, decent low end, and a fairly smooth transition to top end (for a 125 anyway). Top end power at the time was decent but it would not compare to a modern 125. The shifting was super smooth though, easily just as good as today's bikes. The '85 RM125 was far superior though in every way, lots more power, better forks and brakes, handling, etc.
@@trevorjameson3213 I had a 1985 RM 250F, and I agree that the rear Full Floater suspension was as good as anything on todays bikes. Maybe I’m seeing it though rose colored glasses, but I remember that suspension was just as good as what is on my 2018 Husky TE300 and better than what was on my 2008 KTM 300xcw. My Husky is better in every other way, but not in the rear suspension department.
Love it. My first bike was the 75 RM 125 (used) a couple years later and my brother did the same thing with a 75 Elsinore but a couple kids in my neighborhood had TM 125s. Never saw a TM 400 but it must have been a beast. Still riding dirt and road today. Thank you Suzuki.
Wow, a fantastic video Max, I loved the story of the Suzuki 400, hope you and sean are good , looks like your bodies took a pounding ,looking forward to more of you're excellent videos mate.
It was a bumpy ride for sure, still feeling the affects of it now! lol Thanks for watching as always buddy
I saw the first second of this video and IMMEDIATELY recognized the bike as a TM-400. I had a TS-400. Same bike with turn signals and lights. Lots of power, but not a death trap.
I was lucky enough to have bought a TS 400 back in1972 .Road registered in Australia but was never as popular as in the US. It certainly was a handful in the dirt ,but the power was always so much fun. A memorable bike for me.😅Martin
Having been around at the time and riding bikes like that it's really interesting to hear what current riders think of them .
Yes! I didn't get in many of these until about 1980 but Suzuki was "the" machine back then. 😊
Interesting difference in the times over a 50yr period.....i'd love to see a comparison of the 400 zook motor dropped into a modern chassis 😮
Owned a '72 that was a highly modified motocross racer. Lots of stuff done to the frame for strength and weight reduction. Everything was plastic, the tank, fenders, and the clutch and brake levers on the handlebars. The oil injection pump was removed. Reed valves were added. Bike weighed 218 lbs and had about 45 hp with the Bassani Tuned exhaust. It sounded like 3 chain saws sawing on the same log. Brutal suspension. That bike beat the sh*t out of me. I rode it for 2 years before I could even open it up. I had it for 4 years total, then traded it for SBC stuff.
Dude bought it, bored it out, increased compression from factory 7:1 to 10:1 and a bigger Mikuni. I said you aren't going to be able to start it. Well .... dude wrapped himself around a tree and was hospitalized for 3 months, and was never the same again. He was warned about that bike. I lived with it for 4 years and am uninjured, and I still ride. Dude laughed it off, called me a pussy lol. I'm still sorry that he ruined his life with that bike though. I had a healthy fear/respect for it.
My brother in law has a Tm 400 in the build and i love my 73 MX360 Yamaha trench digging wheelie machine! lm 63 and relive my youth every time I go for a blast. I'm still looking for a SC500 for shits and giggles. Thanks for a great video
Awesome video Max as usual, your motocross is great, and this is from a guy who racing in 1971
The Suzuki TM400 coined the phrase “injury forces sale”
Haha I can imagine that line appearing in a lot of classified ads back in the day!
Thanks for watching as always Angelo :-)
I started in 1972 when I was 5 in Trials on a new Yamaha TY80 and Moto X at 11 on a Yamaha YZ 125c, Mother bought me a 1974 Road Registered Yamaha DT250A for a general purpose bush riding bike when I was 12 😆 Loved the 1970s
Back in the day a kidney belt was mandatory, we rode nearly on the tank if seated and was up on the pegs often because the seat and suspension was well less than average at best. In the late 70's we started to tinker with rear shock positions but honestly nothing helped. Great times, great memories of a era that is long gone.
All true. A friend of mine had one of these back in the day. I rode it, once. That was enough for me. I’m small. I could not keep the rear end under me. It was fast, squirrelly and awesome >>>
As a 13 year old kid in 1973 , I started out my off road riding career on my ‘73 Yamaha Mini Enduro JT-1 . We had canyon lands all over here and there in Southern California that guys were making tracks on. I vividly remember seeing these orange and then later yellow TM Suzuki’s ripping around them. Only saw a few get-offs from guys who rode them & most were after they swapped ends through whooped sections of the notoriously dry courses we had back then. There were lots of old CZ’s & Maico’s & Bultaco’s running around at that time and I was always curious to see what was winning so that I could eventually plan on getting whatever was the hot ticket once I graduated on up the Two Stroke evolutionary chain. Hearing some of those Suzuki owners stories made me stick to my Yamaha’s and their YZ’s became my stepping up bikes. Thanks for a trip down memory lane here, and yup , at 63-1/2 now I still ride my tried & true ‘99 WR-400 f with full Baja Designs street legal kit all over here in Sunny San Diego. I guess once you start to ride dirt bikes you just never grow up or get old ……😏😎👍
This was fun to watch and nicely produced! It would be even more interesting if compared it to a bike or two from the same era- 71 400 Husqvarna, a CZ, etc. Most of the complaints you list about this TM 400 (wide bars, bad suspension, small slippery footpegs) are universal with any early 70s vintage motocross bike when compared to its modern equivalent by riders unfamiliar with riding or racing bikes from that era.
You were shocked that you could buy a new frame for your TM 400, I had a 1972 Yamaha 125MX and one of the first things to do with it to make it better was strip it down and cut the frame apart and weld in a frame lowering kit to lower the engine and make it handle better. Imagine bringing home your new bike and cutting the frame in half.
My generation has been so spoiled! Haha You guys were built different back in the day, i couldn't imagine having to do that. Thanks for taking the time to watch James
And all those problems are why people love them. Thats a thrill bike! Class of 89 here ;)
My buddy had a tm125. And I still remember that wild ride. I was 12 -13 and it kept up with the rms of the era of late 78-80 fun memories. 👍
A friend had a TM 400. Way back in the day. All I really remembered about that bike . Was the sound of the compression release. The sound they let out, was one of a kind. 😮
A long fart,I had one.
When the legend becomes fact, print the legend
Haha, thanks for watching:)
Wow great to see my old Tm 400 ride again ,I thought it was a good bike and affordable ,not any of my friends could beat me on the dirt roads where I rode ,it was a good wheelie bike ,I put a better tire on the back and gave it the traction it needed ,thanks again you made an old man smile
Buddy had a Yamaha 400 dirt bike ,
It would stand up on the back tire in every gear and out run the law on any day of the week ,
It was named Yamadog !
Great to hear the history behind the machine! Thanks
Personally I love the old enduros' and dirt bikes. They just have a flare, personality and temperament that new bikes just don't have. I had a PE250 and you could flat out hammer that thing and it would not die.
The PEs and Yamaha ITs were sort of enduro sort of Moto X sort of general crazy weapon for any type of War you may have found yourself in 😁
My brother had a TM400 that was bored out to a 450. We nicknamed the TM “ The trench monster “ It would dig a huge trench anytime you gassed it. So scary, but so fun!
Hi from Texas, New Subscriber. I bought a used TM 400 back when I was about 14yrs old in 1974. I wasn’t at all a Mechanic back then, and the Top end was blown and missing the Expansion Chamber. I took the Head to the Suzuki Dealer to have it Bored. When I put it back together, I don’t know if I put the new Piston in I may not have faced the right side of the Piston to the Exhaust. Also, all I knew was to put the Rings back on, but I had no clue what order the Rings went back in. Anyway, believe it or not I got it Running. The only thing was getting a Exhaust. I couldn’t afford one so me and my friend made one out of a Pipe and some Sheet Metal. I had no clue how those were supposed to be made either, so it looked like a big Tin Can. I hopped on the Bike and rode it to the 7-11 Store at the end of the Road. I went in and got a Coke Slurpy and when I came out the Bike had been Stolen!!!! They must have put it in back of a Pickup because I never heard it start. Anyway, I had one, rode it one Time, and it was probably a good thing? I would have Killed myself on it. I always Rode Balls to the Wall anyway. Anyway, Thanks for bringing back the Memories.👍👍
Thanks for taking the time to watch and leave a comment Joey! :-) I hope that TM of yours got its own back on those guys that robbed it!
Welcome to the channel :-)
Lmao yeah you covered alot of the issues I remember. I broke the frame at the swingarm pivot twice before completely stripped and rewelding the entire frame... suspension was sketchy at best, would buck you over the bars quicker than a bronco at gilleys but I absolutely loved it for some reason lol
I was riding one of those when I was 12 yrs old....I luv'd it! A wheelie machine! Great video man!
That's awesome, you must have been the coolest kid on the block:) Cheers Max
@@999lazerlol it wasn't my bike! I had a SL70 when I was 12...it was one of the older guys that worked for my stepfather! However, I actually was the coolest kid in the neighborhood by the age of 15 ...I rented a 2 bedroom cabin on a lake and was riding a CR500 then....I was the sh#t!Lol!
This is by far the best video I've seen about the old TM400 cyclone!
bought one in the 80s. Changed the brakes, the sprocket, updated the kidney belt, changed the suspension, changed the rake angle of forks, changed the handle bars and it was fine. Otherwise, we used to take the engine out and put in later bike.
I remember riding a TM 400 back in the 70s.
It was a fast SOB with no suspension.
But, the fastest bike I've ridden is the CR 500.
I have ridden a fair few big bore 2 strokes even the DT360 and 400 YZ and IT 465 and 490s and the 4 strokes like XL500R and XR500R but I think the scariest I have been on is the 1979 Maico 400 and the Mental 490 ( never rode the 700 ) BUT in the end the Crown has to go to the Honda CR 500. I Did however sell my early 80s YZ465 after 3 moths before it killed me. My favorite bike for Bush fun and general Enduro riding was the 1983 Honda XR 350R it was light and therefore faster than riding my XT 600 and 660 🙂🙃
I have a CR500 and an 83' CR480.. I think the 480 is probably faster. It's tall like a horse and has tall gearing ratios. Almost impossible to keep the wheel down. Pretty insane bike. I also used to have an LT500 Quadzilla.. which was comparable. I've had a few different banshee's and a 450R *4stroke.. I like 2 strokes better and I'm partial to big bores. I mastered how to start them and just love that snappy power.
What a fantastic and fun video you have made. Paying homage to this legendary machine!! Simply amazing!! My mom came home one Saturday from the store with a cool plastic model kit. It was the Suzuki TM400. I was 7 years old at the time and totally into motorcycles. I knew of Joel and Roger from going to the local bike shop with my dad. So building this model kit really put the hook in me.
The first MX race i attended in 1970 had the open class and the TM 400 was a rocket, loud along with CASTROL R oil
very aromatic scent. I was inspired and 3 yrs latter I got my first bike the XR 75 and raced to a 2nd position..
All thanks to my supporting twin brother.
Love the sound
Thanks. it sounds incredible. So different to a modern bike :)
I think the 1973 Honda XR-75 was a real game changer in terms of Honda and Japanese bikes going full motocross.
Had a 1974 TM125 when I was 11yrs old. Rode the hell out of it till I was 13yrs old, that's when I got a YZ400. At 16, I got a 86' CR500. Life was good.
The RM line was introduced in 1975, not 1976. The RM 100 & 125 had a downpipe. The RM 250 & 370 had up-pipes. In 1976 all 4 models had up-pipes.
Fab bike and video Max & Team! Don't sell it. You'll get plenty more video opportunities riding it at twinshock events, which is what we/I like to see. you could even ride it in a hill climb event.........Oh yeah, it's one of the few bikes that sounds great through video.
This video is a direct result of the Cannondale vid, lots of people in the comments of that one saying the TM actually has the title as 'worst ever'! Haha I do have a few more ideas for videos with this one and i have eyed up the Red Marley Hill climb also , i think this is the right age for that event. The sound the bike makes is crazy in person, so loud as you'd imagine with those pipes! Thanks for watching as always Guy :-)
@@999lazer Bring it up to Bridlington on 10-12th May next year to do ‘Race the Waves’. It’s an iconic event for customs, vintage and specials. It’s a weekend of doing 1/8th mile drag runs up the beach and it wouldn’t be the only loud 2T by far👍
I am a Suzuki collector/rider/restorer... my buddy in high school used to race one of these exact bikes in the mid-70's... lots of mods later Including home-modified longer travel rear suspension he ran mid-pack at that time. I was smaller than him and I used to ride a 1972 TM-250... I modified the rear end to get ~one more inch of travel than stock (~4.5" vs 3.5")... I didn't race, but it was a great trail bike for several years, and totally reliable. I have 1972 TM250 once again and I it is waiting patiently as gather parts to do a restoration... so far just missing the pipe - very rare indeed - as you mention in your video! Things have come a long way in the last 50 years for sure, but to my eyes, there are still beautiful machines!
Thanks for the video. Brought back great memories. Bought a 71 TM400 in summer of 72 at 16yo. Had great fun & many a white knuckle moment riding the beast .
That bike sounds exactly like my pops 1978 Yamaha MX400. I rode that bike when I could start it. That was when I was 12. It was a scary bike too.
The memories motorcycles can unlock are just awesome! Thanks for watching :-)
I rode my buddy Stu's TM back in the day. He raced it for Fountain Valley Suzuki, in So Cal. It was a rock throwing beasty for sure.
I can only imagine what a full line up of these bikes sounded like and felt like for the back markers! Thanks for watching Patrick
They were real buzz saws. So imagine our awe in 1973 when we took our 360 huskies and 250 Suzuki's to our favorite sand climbing hill in Northern Michigan and watched a family with some pre-teen girls flying up the hill.on 400's! Then ride back down and repeat.
They were both amazing. The bikes, and the girls!
Great Review! My 1st bike was a 1970 AT1 Yamaha Enduro that I stripped down, welded in a lowered frame, added a CDI ignition from El Monte (CA), added a low pipe expansion chamber exhaust, Koni shocks, and ported and polished! Good times!
Yamaha YZED 465 be a gd video. Great stuff. Those old dual shock bikes are terrible handling machines.
I'll put the 465 on the to do list! Tell me about it, my back still hurts from this ride! haha Thanks for watching Eric
2 Seconds of Phil riding the bike???? And he was actually riding the hell out that thing. Better seeing it being ridden by someone who's gonna push it.
Brings back memories. I had the 74 TM125. Had a blast on that old machine
I had one of those as well....ported cylinder and could just barely keep up with the Elsinore's
The @@sstocker31 the baby elsinore cr125 had the super narrow powerband , nothing at all till it came on the pipe then hang on and shift like crazy
Formula 1 power with all the handling characteristics of a rototiller in a rocky field. Great in the whoops as long as there were only 2. (As close to a quote from a magazine reviewer. I cannot remember the name)
I owned one the same color. It fully lived up to it's rep and was in it's 3rd frame when it was stolen in 84.
It never hurt me, but broke the collarbones of 2 of my "let me try that." Friends.
Imagine a modern big bore 500cc air cooled bike!!!
Id be happy with a modern liquid cooled 500cc,they should bring the cr,kx and yz’s back. They wouls sell a shyt ton id bet.
Closest you can get would be a Yamaha WR500 or an ATK 406.
I'd like to see the 1973-74 Yamaha SC 500 tested , I think that would take the title as a Widow Maker . The SC500 was a terrifying bike to ride . It had a claimed 44 horsepower with a powerband like a YZ 80 . Wheelies and trenches would be dug with it's massive 5.00 rear tire . It may not be considered a MX bike but a Scrambler or desert racer with it's 4 speed transmission . It did have it's issues though , piston seizing was a problem until Yamaha came up with a redesigned version . Suspension and handling was not up to par with the European bikes . But this thing was a handful and a terror to ride . Find a nice example and be prepared to make this the Worlds most Terrifying Bike !!!
Holy crap, when the SC500 got on the pipe it was up to God if you stayed on or right side up.
I remember that as well, they were Monster class bikes of the era!
Vintage bikes are so much cooler than modern bikes, they have so much more character and there's usually a cool story behind them.
Very good video. I raced late 60s thru mid 70s. Mostly European bikes. The 74 and 75 TM400 was improved. A friend raced one with an aftermarket heavier flywheel, and better rear shocks. It was a very good bike. I regret not getting one, setting it up like his, and racing it. Very tractable power, and it actually handled ok.
I have always wanted to get a chance to swing a leg over that bike- thanks for doing this video. Fun stuff! IMHO the cyclone is the prettiest dirt bike ever made. I always thought down pipes were cool looking. Too bad they all get smashed after a few rides. As for another bike you might want to evaluate like this - even though it wasn’t billed as a MX tool - you might consider swinging a leg over a Yamaha SC500. 😊
Thanks for taking the time to watch :-) I agree, she's a beautiful looking thing! I've have quite a few comments about the Yamaha, i will have to see if i can track one down!
I really enjoyed this video, brought back memories! I raced motocross in southern California in 1971 when the Cyclone came out. My recollection is that novice and intermediate class MX riders had limited success with the Cyclone, and mostly stayed away from it, and only expert riders had the skill set for it. The Cyclone had an amazing sound when coming “onto the pipe”, and I enjoyed hearing it again in your video. Thanks !
Glad you enjoyed it!
Listen guys, everyone appreciates an honest critique, so let me give u my ten penneth. 👍🏻😊.
Firstly, I've been following your channel for some time as I love your dream builds, like YZilla etc. Plus your unhinged shootouts.
Now, I've been riding MX bikes and a fan of the sport since twin shocks, air cooled, right way up forks, open faced helmets, and Castrol R.
So, from a viewers perspective, I've got to say, your channel and your output epitomises everything I love about not only World MX, but particularly British MX. You even encapsulate that very pride inspiring, family oriented love of the sport. Which see often in British Motorsport from Pro Champion level to the Grass Roots club level, even with amateur non racers. But for me given my age and experience of the subject, what I really admire and appreciate, is that you are honouring the history of the sport. It shows respect. I do wonder how many 21 year olds on their shiny new 450 Yamahas, would know Who TF I was talking about if I mentioned Brad Lackey, or Hurricane Hannah, Danny LaPorte, Jeff Ward, Georges Jobé, Andre Malherbe, Stefan Everts, Häken Carlquist, Kurt Nicoll, Graham Noyce, Dave Thorpe, Dave Watson, etc. etc, They'd be like "Who?", which is sacrilegious!! So, apart from your fun 'Top Gear' style insane Shootouts, which are hugely entertaining, this kind of historical, themed, well researched discussion pieces, makes for Really professional looking Journalism. You come across in camera really well, both as a normal 'geezer', at the track, etc. But as a Professional presenter, in the studio. THAT IS why your channel has continued to grow. 🙏🏻👍🏻😊.
One small tip, (as an ex CR125 Husky owner.) Can I just point out a mistake I've heard both brits and yanks make. Repeat out loud, "HUSK", now say, "VARNA", good, now put them together! It should be HUSQVARNA, not HUSKERVARNA. 😁🤣😂👍🏻.
I'm glad to be of service 😁.
Lets Get an Original YZ power valve (Which I believe was the 'K' model on, and look at the inception and evolution of the model and it's impact and contribution to the sport. Oh, Another one you've GOT to do, is the Awesome invention that never took off. The Boyesen Link rear suspension system. Radical AF, but a brilliant solution to an engineering and physics problem with MX suspension. ESPECIALLY if you can secure a bike with it fitted!!! Probably like Rocking Horse kaka to aquire, but you have the contacts!! Give it some thought. I think it could be really interesting vid. 😁👍🏻😊🙏🏻
Thanks for taking the time to comment. I really appreciate your feedback. I'll take a look at the Boyesen link too. Cheers Max
We(My Awesome Brother and I)had a 73, it was insane! We got it from a close family friend, Great Video! We used to have to pop start ours. It was rebuilt with more power making it hard to start. It was without a doubt a true MUSCLE Bike. We definitely feared it and gave it the respect it deserved. I we eventually knew we were in over our head and sent it down the line. After learning all the Issues they neglected to design into it for safety and so on I feel we made a wise decision. However I would like to ride it again, nostalgia reasons. It was a beast!
I had one. It was my second bike. The first being a 1969 Honda CB 350. So, quite a jump in power and insane speed. But oh so much more fun. And I am still here. The bike put such a gigantic smile on my face and uncontrollable laughter. An endorphin rush like no other.
Sounds mint
Brings back memories of
MX 70s 80s
In 1972 i was riding a 400 huski a friend had just got a tm400.
I rode it one time and said thanks. My huski had a wide power band and torque.
As you said the tm was all or nothing very seldom was the front tire on the ground.
He didnt have it long!!!
But i can still remember the sound.
I had a 73' and it constantly kept cracking the frame at the bottom of the down tube. I also changed out the flywheel and ignition to the TS400. I used it mostly for trailer riding and the TS ignition was better on the low end. It was a fun bike, but wasn't without it's problems.
Great vid, really nicely produced and very informative. Thanks for posting.
Thanks Rob
In the Mid 1990's I ice raced a Kawasaki KX400 in the open class. You guys were talking about frame flex. That old KX 400 in the corners was like riding a bucking bronco. The frame flex was unbelievable. That was one of the funnest winters of my life.
I had one. I went from being very fast, on my old CZ 360, to very slow on my TM 400. The only way to make it turn was to fall down and pick it up pointing in the new direction. The front end did not turn, just pushed.
Loved it.Well done guys.
Excellent video, thanks💥
Oh you wimps... The bike launched in '71 and actually started launching riders over the bars... The tank slappers were knee slappers, at least if you were looking and not riding. 132 DB from the exhaust gave you that fighter plane experience without joining the Air Force! Arr Arr... men were men back then and bones healed way quicker. The trick was to put 1" lower shocks on the back (Konis) and 1" longer bars on the front made of Chrome Moly. A Basani pipe gave a better power delivery but was good for about one race once it got mashed flat against the ground or fellow riders... Luckily had a sponsored ride from my shop and ran a state motocross series with that bike... won a few too... Totally impressed with your cherry ride! Nice to know the "Widow Maker" is still alive!
I was born in 1970, having grown up seeing the now "old dirt bikes when they were not old, being ridden by friends and neighbors I wanted one desperately but alas I am a poor boy from a poor family and could not afford any of the real "Superstars" of the era. It wasn't until 1984 when I got my first motorcycle, a 1974 Honda Elsinore MT 125 which was kind of a turd. A tamed, neutered version of the CR 125 kitted out with lihgts, turn signals, a horn, and a very restrictive exhaust system. I quickly started stripping off the "Enduro" equipment and modifying it. Reworked the piston and cylinder ports for as close to CR performance as possible, a used aftermarket CR exhaust, etc... to almost be able to keep up with a friends 80 something Kawasaki KX 125 (as long as terrain wasn't rough enough to actually require decent suspension ) As time went on and life happened I found little time for dirtbikes, I was building High Performance Harley Davidson streetbike and even dragbike engines for a living along with vintage race car restorations and machinist work. However shortly before I retired from professional wrench turning and machine work I found myself working at a small aftermarket motorcycle shop that was about 40% streetbikes, 40% dirtbikes, and 20% ATVs. And as the "Old Man " in the shop whenever a vintage dirtbike found its way into the shop I was naturally the one chosen to work on it. We were lucky enough to have almost 8 acres behind the shop that we were able to build a reasonable test track on, complete with a small section of whoops, a table top, a series of chicanes and a semi long straight section (good for well over 65 -70 mph on a quick bike with a decent rider (of which I hardly qualify ) Occasionally we would even take in an old bike of early to mid 70 vintage as a trade or outright purchase for resale and after going over the bike to make it ready and reasonably safe I would put in a dozen or so moderately hard laps, at least for me. I would also periodically fire them up and ride them when we were slow in work in order to make sure they would easily start up and run property (it sucks when a customer is interested in a bike that has sat unridden for a couple months to long and you find it doesn't want to start, runs poorly, or leaks fluids suddenly) and I would do the same thing with newer bikes as well. The thing that struck me quite hard was the difference in how I felt after riding 12 laps on say a 1970 TD 250 vs 12 laps on any later model (1986 or newer) dirtbike of almost any make or size. I'd be tired, and more than a little sore after riding the old dirtbike, in fact I could feel the fatigue slowing me down by lap 6 or 7, but on any of the more modern bikes I might be merely starting to breath hard 9 or 10 laps in and I found that even a slow late model, "Trail oriented" bike would give me faster lap times after about lap 5 or 6 than a "Fast in its day" vintage dirtbike that was flat out on smooth terrain much faster than the newer lower performance dirtbike. Its sometimes makes me wonder how the " Rodge Decostas" of the 70s would have done on a modern dirtbike, and how today's young stars would fare on the ealy dirtbikes. I know an old dirtbike will certainly make this old man feel ancient really quickly.
Ah, the 400 TM ,Terror Machine... I owned and rode the orange 1972 model... I figured if Captain Kurt recommended it, and Roger won on it. How could I go wrong...I'm still alive today... Jim
Dude, your channel is the best mx channel going. Im loving these vintage bike vids
I saw a 1971 and 1974 TM400 just two weekends ago. They're A beautiful bike and no matter what people say, I love them. I have a 1982 RM465 that I absolutely love. If it weren't for the TM400, they would never have made my favorite bike of all time.
Exactly, this was just the start for Suzuki, a building block for the greatness to come. Thanks for watching! :-)
Whoever restored that TM400 should be congratulated for their fine work and given an award !
My dad had one set up for trail riding and hill climbing. Geared down and a heavier flywheel, he said it'd climb a tree if it had the traction. He loved it.
Top video as usual,nice balance of info and riding your smashing it matey 👍🏻
The old Bultaco was a scary bike too. Wicked 2-stroke power.
As a teen I had the '79 can am mx6 400cc. It was wild.
My friend had a slightly older yamaha 500, is was quite beat and wore out at the time.
Watching the awkwardness of the tm 400 in this video reminds me of watching that old clapped out yammi.
Great video 👍
Great video! We can thank those bikes for our great bikes today! 👍
I had this same bike when I was 14 back in 1977 , compared to my next bike a Yamaha 1974 YZ 360-B the Suzuki was a heavy-ass pig , both bikes were not new but used because a used bike was all I could afford doing all kinds of work from cutting firewood to mowing lawns and shoveling snow . I would love another YZ like the one I had as a kid again
I was 16 yrs old and owned a 1971 TM400. I broke the frame multiple times so it was at the welding shop a lot. Finally the welder couldn't weld it anymore so I took the frame to the US HQ (Santa Fe Springs, CA at that time), they wouldn't warranty it, but did give me a sweet discount so I could rebuild it. The new frame held together.
Everybody wanted to ride it so my offer was- "if you start start it, you can ride it." Didn't have but a couple of guys who could start it.