No King's New Clothes or smoke blowing here, just basics and thought inducing content. A subjective look at taking images. Great content Steve. Keep safe. Ron
I've never quite been able to articulate just why I prefer a short telephoto lens for landscape photography, you nailed it in this video. The quality of your images, explanations and videos would certainly warrant 10x the number of subscribers you have here on TH-cam. Excellent stuff.
I did a media production course 20 or so years ago. One of the assignments was photography. When we were looking at everyone's pictures, everybody had photos with subjects in the centre, symmetrical framing. And I had those photos as well. For every student, the teacher commented on this, and asked them to reframe the photo, to see if it would've worked better with the subject off to one side. So I was anticipating they'd say the same to me, and I was already imagining how I'd have to reframe them. But no, my photos came up and all the symmetrical ones, the teacher explained how well the composition worked and I didn't need to change anything. So I learned the rules don't always apply, but you need to make sure you break them in just the right way to make it work.
Steve, this video, like many you produce, is an education for photographers. You have leveraged your years of creative imaging, to build an incredible learning opportunity for us amateurs. Especially true when you realize the conditions under which this work was created. Thank You!
When I was first getting started with photography (as opposed to just taking pictures), I found the rules of composition to be very helpful. It opened up my thinking to being more deliberate, and it helped me start producing interesting pictures. It made me think about pictures in a new way. Now that it's been a hobby of mine for several years, I find I don't need the rules all that much anymore. Where as it used to be that I wouldn't know which shots would work before I came back home and sorted through them in Lightroom (and maybe I wouldn't even know then), now I can feel if the picture has potential just by looking through the viewfinder. So there is absolutely a purpose to the rules, it's just that they should be called the guidelines of composition instead.
Another thoughtful and inspiring video Steve. Composition is what marks a good photographer from a bad one. It is my weakest element and your clear and well illustrated examples have been a great help and inspiration. Quite the best photography videos on the web.
I wish you could come to Judge Competitions at Brentwood & District Photographic Club --- your outlook is much better than the Old Fogey Judges we get who repeat the Same Old Things -- but the trouble IS that they have all got SO OLD and been going round Clubs for 50 years and NO YOUNGER ones much are coming through only a FEW but they have been influenced by the 'established Judges' and also none of then have ever used REAL FILM and think they see 'NOISE' and mark it down when in fact it is 'Traditional Film GRAIN' .
Very interesting Steve. Could spend hours chatting about this sort of thing and I always enjoy hearin another photographer’s perspective, especially with the excellent illustrative examples 😊👍🏻
Thanks Steve! Yes -- in photography there are really few rules that *MUST* be followed -- maybe things like "Remove lens cap before taking photos" or " Have film in camera before taking photos" -- many of the composition rules are great starting points and helpful tips for beginners. One great thing about digital cameras is that you have the freedom to take one scene and try out different rules/break different rules and then see which shots came out best. With film cameras there is not quite as much freedom -- but you can possibly use a smartphone camera (or even bring your digital camera along) to "try out" the various composition techniques before committing the shot to film on the film camera. Stay safe!!!
Fantastic series of images Steve! I especially like how the first one captures the mood of the place. This is probably the best video I've seen on composition.
11:54 Thank you for the tutorial Steve. I'm thinking a long lens (from a long way back) in that composition to compress perspective and afford the mountains greater impact. The trees would still kinda spoil it perhaps by eating too much into the mountains.
I feel like sharing this with half of TH-cam's landscape photographers. Rules are so restrictive, stifle creativity. The big leaps forward in art challenged rules, Van Gogh/ Picasso/ Pollock/ Joyce et al
Steve that was a great lesson in composition. You certainly have the "eye" and know when and where to use or break the rules. Very impressed with the photos too. Keep safe
@@SteveONions Yeah, I filmed a video the other day of taking a picture with the 4x5 of something in my office. Can't say what it is, I don't want to spoil it for my subs incase they watch you too and read the comments.
Very enjoyable episode and thought provoking indeed. No need for apologies Steve in the length, the critque and understanding of why certain images are right or wrong what put over really well. I will be honest I know and understand most of the rules but at times will disregard everything if I see a scene that warrants me pressing the shutter - don't get me wrong I will try and compose so that it has one of the rules in but sometimes I find my photography reactive. By that I mean, seeing light dance across a scene or a sudden shift in the mood of the sky will get me reaching for the camera. Saying that when I am out with the camera I am usually in a location/setting that there would be a good chance of getting a photography I suppose. Atb Alan
I’m very reactive too Alan, and let’s be honest M43 equipment lends itself to this approach more than anything else I’ve ever used. I’m itching to get out in Snowdonia and get my eye in again 👍
@@SteveONions Going M43 allows that reactive response in me even more I suppose although I find it hard to leave a tripod behind on my trips at times. Know what you mean about itching to get out, my last trip was just before the lockdown - my last day out with the camera was a month today up in North Wales. Had travelled up 4 days before and the PM had made an announcement whilst I was driving up. We were staying in a converted barn in Talsarnau & kept ourselves to ourselves whilst we were there but I felt increasingly more uncomforatble as the week went on - after my walk to find the abandoned cottage on the Thursday I drove staright home and the 2 chaps I was with stayed on the extra day. My wife is on the vunerable list and had a letter from the Welsh Health Board so we have been isolating since but I did take 2 exercise walks from home last week - I can get up onto my local hill (504m) from the house and it takes me 1h.15m to get up n down - I already live at 1161ft above sea level. My online sub to OS mapping is open most of the time & I been making a list of places when we can get out - most are up in North Wales so I might just catch you on the mountain sometimes..lol. Atb Al
Thank you Steve. When speaking of lead in lines and foreground object, you've actually touched upon a point that I always considered in my compositions but didn't really know why. I prefer using standard or short telephoto when composing landscape, in a way that ties in with your comments. I keep the wide for family shots and indoors.
This was a very useful video for me. Thank you, Steve. One thing I would mention, and nothing new of course, is that after a certain amount of time practicing the rules of composition or any other discipline, one tends to internalize those rules and they become part of how one tends to view things or approach things; automatic so to speak. I am working on getting to that place. It is for me quite valuable that you point out and remind me not to get locked into those rules, however, blinded by them as it were, and miss the better shot.
I have watched almost all of your videos and I find them, and your photography and approach to an image, really inspiring. So much that I bought two rolls of film, ilford fp4+ and portra 160, to use with my father's old camera, a Canon ae1 program. Thank you and keep up the great work.
Thank you for this. I’ve been taking photos for years, no formal training, and recently went through my photo library. I was disappointed with a number of my images resulting from composition errors. This advice was timely.
Glad it was useful Kent. It just takes time and practice to assess compositional choices but good books help too. I think I’ll do a short video on the one that helped me the most many years ago.
Thanka Steve this was refreshing and something I need to keep in me mindset when i am out. Hope you are doing well, are safe, happy & healthy in these troubling times.
Sometimes we tend to forget that the "rules" didn't come first, the art came first. Old masters created what was pleasing to them and over time common components, elements, placements were noted and became the rules. I think when we become experienced in composing images and seeing things artistically, we naturally gravitate to what are called rules today whenever they fit our artistic vision. I am certain that most experienced photographers give little mechanical thought to rules in the field. They compose based on their vision and experience and the results may or may not conform to a given rule. It is for this reason that I teach the participants in my classes to consider the rules not actual rules but rather tools that may be used when they help strengthen the elements in the scene to achieve their vision for the photo. You wouldn't use a pipe wrench when you needed a screwdriver, you would use the tool that best aided the task. Soon, you stop thinking about whether you need the wrench or the screwdriver, you automatically use what helps.
Fantastic video , watched more than once and re-looked at some of my pictures that I was ready to delete. Thank you so much for explaining rules etc BUT also just to say what caught your eye to actually take the picture in the first place, says everything . Thank you, can't wait for next video and keep safe
That's a tricky question Helen as I do most of my scouting subconsciously, it's only when I get close to recognising a composition that I start to work out what I should include (and just as importantly exclude). I think it all starts when I come across something that triggers me to say 'yes, there's something there'. It is often down to the lighting which is why flat grey conditions are very hard to work in. I am also thinking about how I want the final images to look even before I have composed them, for example I will decide up front if I want a smooth and relaxing feel or maybe something coarse and dramatic. Hope this helps.
I don't do landscapes as such. I do photograph trees and clouds. I like trees best as they hold very still, never complain, and provide some incredible images. I quit professional work because of the need to see a therapist after nearly ever session. Trees have awesome Kharma and are the niceest subjects I ever worked with. Clouds however are always going somewhere! If you aren't ready for this find youself a tree. My favorite tree person is Grandma Bonsai, she lives in old downtown Melbourne Fl.FL. She has the most beautiful spirit and has had a rough life which she is willing to show. I've photographed her several times and she's always available! I follow Steve's efforts because he's my idea of the perfect artist. I model my efforts on his sugestions.
great explanations and great examples. One of the best videos on the topic I've seen. Simple, Concise, And especially doesn't treat the rules as much as a "God Sent Gospel" as others :) It demonstrates exactly when these "Rules" can kill your efforts. Sometimes I feel the only rule, For me, is "If it feels compositionally right, It's probably right".
I’d really enjoy seeing an episode where you show us multiple crops and/or treatments of the same image. I don’t know how you feel about changing an image after it’s shot but it would be really interesting to see how it can change the feel of a composition with your input on it
It is important to see the options that were available at the time an image was captured, hard to visualise without. I do crop images at times but usually only a small amount to correct for tilted horizons or some small element at the edge of the frame. Less often I will make a heavy crop either because I didn’t have a long enough lens or perhaps because I saw a better balance in post processing.
Great video! The rules are there because, generally, the photograph feels right when the rules are applied. But, as you say, sometimes what feels right does not conform. Photography is nothing if not emotive and we must use that rather than pure mechanical execution.
Very informative, Steve. Thanks. I often wonder, when watching your videos, how you come to choose that particular aspect of your subject. Rules, or the breaking of them, may be part of the explanation. Loved that photo of the sapling.
Once again your video came at the right time. I love you work Steve, especially your black and white. I know have said it in the past: You inspire people and we, me, appreciate it so much: Where do I go to buy one of your photos?
Brilliant video Steve. I've always been a non-conformist and never been great at following rules. I've always been of the opinion that "if it looks right to me, it's right for me". And that's what I'll take a picture of. Or at least shoot it with the intention of some manipulation later. I think the compositional rules/guidelines are useful for people learning photography. But I've found the more I shoot the less I adhere to those rules. Stay safe Steve. Look forward to your future insights!
In confination times, just as ours sons or grand sons keep up their study on tv classes, this is a master lesson, at least for me. My great respects, Steve
Very good information, Steve. Hope you're doing well and staying safe during the lockdown. Our governor here in Texas just reopened all state parks, so long as you're not in a group of 5 or more (which doesn't affect the solitary landscape photographer) we can finally get back to wee bit of normalcy.
My Photography instructor said I'm going to explain to you the rules of Photography. At least that way you will know what your breaking. Why and when you break them, you will have to figure out yourself' Cracking vlog Steve Cheers Diz
I´m coming from a photography of more spontaneity than landscape photography, but feeling and intuition for me trumps knowledge of rules. Becoming good at composition you have to shoot and experiment, get the feeling of what looks right while shooting. Later look closely at the photos and figure out what works and what not and that´s the time knowledge of composition comes in handy. What do I like? Why do I like it? How did I do that? How do I do something like this again? Than shoot again, analyse again, come to conlcusions again. Eat, work, sleep, repeat. Especially when someone starts in photography working and training the intuition may be a longer way in the beginning and starting with a rulebook might lead to satisfying results quicker, the intuitive eye for harmony and composition is what makes the difference later.
Really very good vid Steve.. some excellent examples for each side of the so called rules. Really very well done; I certainly will save to review from time to time because of its added value. I thank u for work. Take care and be safe.
All of that needs to be in a book and with a nice story and discussion about each image and the critique you just provided. I don't know what you should call the book, but you should put one together with those images. Also perhaps a calendar. That one shot near the beginning with all the trees an growth, now that is a real deal kind of experience, you really often can't see the forest through the trees, and then what do you do - all you have is tangles to work with. Also, where I live if you try to "zoom with your feet" instead of using a telephoto, you can look forward to being arrested for trespass, or maybe something more exciting depending on what the farmer has available for "unwelcome" guests. The only people around here who get around that are the snowmobile clubs who make arrangements with thousands of contiguous land owners to ride all over hell's half acre in the winter. (Despite hell's ownership it is cold.) I wish those clubs would add photographers to their members and get off season permissions, now that would be nice, but probably not practical. (That shot of the mountains and water without the foreground is what I face in my area often.) Great video as usual, one of your best. Stay safe, God bless!
Thanks John. We are quite fortunate in the UK that a lot of the most beautiful scenery is in national parks and access is very good. There are some places I shoot where farmers restrict access but the most dangerous weapon used over here is usually a walking stick 🙂.
Steve having read some comments below I have to agree that you should produce a book. I'd buy it immediately. Now is a good time to think about it during lockdown.
I’d love to make one, I did start 10 years ago but family and work kept interrupting. I’m not the fastest worker so it would take me quite a while but I think it’s got to be done one day. All the best 👍
I agree 100% with your assessment. Unfortunately this awful habit of over using wide and ultra wide angle lenses was promoted by the photographic publications in the late 70s and early 80s. This is what I call gimmicky photography. In fact if my memory serves me right, finding a decent ( high performance ) wide angle lens was quite difficult in the 70s and 80s even within the offerings of the camera manufacturers , certainly Zeiss had a couple ( the 38mm on the Hassleblad SWM ) and perhaps Nikon with the old 20 mm and 28 mm f3.5 . People have forgotten how to effectively use a ' standard ' lens.
I remember those days too. 28mm was wide and anything less super exotic. Suddenly we had a lot of choice below 20mm and it’s become the norm ever since for most landscape work - sadly 🙁
Bonjour Steve. Do you sometimes shoot landscape images in the vertical format? It is another way of breaking rules and the last smartphones seem to like this format.
Hi Christian. I do shoot a fair bit in the vertical format but obviously when using 6x6 cameras this decision is taken away from me 😊. I find each format dictates the orientation with 4x5 and 645 cameras lending themselves to portrait layouts, 35mm can feel a bit too tall.
Hello Steve, thanks for the video, very well explained . Just to ask , what is the app you use in your phone as a framing tool ? You mentioned but I didn't get it . Thank you An stay safe. Dany
I am fascinated by this rule of thirds that photographers refer to. In my four years of art school this "rule" was never mentioned. I think it's an example of something that gets repeated so often that people think it's a thing. I'm not sure it is. Having a familiarity with art and photography history and using your educated instincts creates good compositions. I never think of "rules" of composition.
Perhaps it is peculiar to photographers Curtis, it’s something that used to get a lot of coverage and I often see people striving to get something important onto one of the thirds.
Great video thank you. I would love to see you head into the hills with just your Sony RX100 to really limit yourself. I wonder how good a result you could get with such a tiny camera - both video for the vlog and images for print!
That’s a good challenge to be honest. Making both video and stills with an 8 year compact would be challenging (especially the video) but I can feel a mountain hike coming on ( when we’re allowed out again).
As usual I Iearned something. Thank you. Other sources for my education have been Rene Berger's book "The Language of Art" from 1963 and Alice Bellony-Rewald's "The Lost World of the Impressionists" from 1968. Painters have more control of course, and have moved into areas of pure expressionism, a field that photographers call manipulation. How odd. Neither are any more realistic than the other really, but that's another debate.
Good point Lars. With the advent of digital I see no need to obtain the maximum detail and clarity in an image any longer (unless the scene calls for it).
Steve you did mention one rule or evidence for neglecting the so called rules (lead in lines etc.) and that's the "balance" of the picture. The "centre of the balance" is the interest of the images the rest does convey that interest. Most of the times the centre of the interest its the brightest part of the image. When you do black and white its more easy to see.
That’s true Ruud but it’s much less obvious I think and as you state, more often used in B&W photography. I can think of a few lesser rules too but not many people are aware of them. Stay safe 👍
Very enjoyable video that you put together, I am not a great lover of B & W images overall but here you gave us three beautiful examples of how to take an image, the beach at Barmouth, the Forest Scene with no foreground and near the end the Quarry and the wall leading up to too it, just a stunning threesome, so I eat my words, lovely stuff Steve, regards, Colin.
I came across this a few years ago, don’t remember who said it. The rule of thirds: make the top third interesting, make the middle third interesting and make the bottom third interesting.
I find that having your family standing behind you grumbling about needing to get somewhere stops you from over-thinking shots. I try to grab what looks good, sometimes it is and sometimes it obeys the rules and sometimes it doesn't. 😃 Stay safe everyone.
No King's New Clothes or smoke blowing here, just basics and thought inducing content. A subjective look at taking images.
Great content Steve. Keep safe.
Ron
Cheers Ron 👍
wonderful gallery of photos, the small castle, the pano with the little island, the one with the two rocks on the foreground....
Thanks Paolo, glad you liked it.
I've never quite been able to articulate just why I prefer a short telephoto lens for landscape photography, you nailed it in this video. The quality of your images, explanations and videos would certainly warrant 10x the number of subscribers you have here on TH-cam. Excellent stuff.
Thank you so much 🙂
@@SteveONions, no Steve, thank YOU!
I did a media production course 20 or so years ago. One of the assignments was photography. When we were looking at everyone's pictures, everybody had photos with subjects in the centre, symmetrical framing. And I had those photos as well.
For every student, the teacher commented on this, and asked them to reframe the photo, to see if it would've worked better with the subject off to one side. So I was anticipating they'd say the same to me, and I was already imagining how I'd have to reframe them.
But no, my photos came up and all the symmetrical ones, the teacher explained how well the composition worked and I didn't need to change anything.
So I learned the rules don't always apply, but you need to make sure you break them in just the right way to make it work.
Just goes to show that rules should not dictate art 🙂
The best photography video I have ever seen in TH-cam
Thank you 🙂
Steve, this video, like many you produce, is an education for photographers. You have leveraged your years of creative imaging, to build an incredible learning opportunity for us amateurs. Especially true when you realize the conditions under which this work was created. Thank You!
Thank you Shaun, very kind of you to say.
When I was first getting started with photography (as opposed to just taking pictures), I found the rules of composition to be very helpful. It opened up my thinking to being more deliberate, and it helped me start producing interesting pictures. It made me think about pictures in a new way. Now that it's been a hobby of mine for several years, I find I don't need the rules all that much anymore. Where as it used to be that I wouldn't know which shots would work before I came back home and sorted through them in Lightroom (and maybe I wouldn't even know then), now I can feel if the picture has potential just by looking through the viewfinder. So there is absolutely a purpose to the rules, it's just that they should be called the guidelines of composition instead.
Well said Karreth, they definitely have their place.
Another thoughtful and inspiring video Steve. Composition is what marks a good photographer from a bad one. It is my weakest element and your clear and well illustrated examples have been a great help and inspiration. Quite the best photography videos on the web.
Thanks you David, I really appreciate your comments 🙂
Thanks a lot for putting this together. It is always inspiring to listen to a photographer's thoughts, esp. when it is a good one.
Thank you 🙂
I wish you could come to Judge Competitions at Brentwood & District Photographic Club --- your outlook is much better than the Old Fogey Judges we get who repeat the Same Old Things -- but the trouble IS that they have all got SO OLD and been going round Clubs for 50 years and NO YOUNGER ones much are coming through only a FEW but they have been influenced by the 'established Judges' and also none of then have ever used REAL FILM and think they see 'NOISE' and mark it down when in fact it is 'Traditional Film GRAIN' .
You’ve just reminded me why I’m not a member of a camera club Peter 😊
Steve O'Nions you are so right..
Very interesting Steve. Could spend hours chatting about this sort of thing and I always enjoy hearin another photographer’s perspective, especially with the excellent illustrative examples 😊👍🏻
Thanks Dave 👍
Cheers Steve, some great pointers there, ever thought of writing a book? Stay safe 👍
I’d love to Lenny, I just need to find the time somehow.
Steve O'Nions Put me down for a future copy :)
suggestions. Make it a big coffee table book!
Thanks Steve! Yes -- in photography there are really few rules that *MUST* be followed -- maybe things like "Remove lens cap before taking photos" or " Have film in camera before taking photos" -- many of the composition rules are great starting points and helpful tips for beginners. One great thing about digital cameras is that you have the freedom to take one scene and try out different rules/break different rules and then see which shots came out best. With film cameras there is not quite as much freedom -- but you can possibly use a smartphone camera (or even bring your digital camera along) to "try out" the various composition techniques before committing the shot to film on the film camera. Stay safe!!!
Very true Aengus and my film shots always start with some form of digital preview, usually my iPhone app.
A masterclass brilliant content and delivery. One of the very best videos on the subject of composition. Thank you
You’re welcome 😊
Fantastic series of images Steve! I especially like how the first one captures the mood of the place. This is probably the best video I've seen on composition.
Thank you 😊
Thanks Steve.
You’re welcome Brent.
11:54 Thank you for the tutorial Steve. I'm thinking a long lens (from a long way back) in that composition to compress perspective and afford the mountains greater impact. The trees would still kinda spoil it perhaps by eating too much into the mountains.
Fair point 👍
how delightful
Thanks Dongwei.
I feel like sharing this with half of TH-cam's landscape photographers. Rules are so restrictive, stifle creativity. The big leaps forward in art challenged rules, Van Gogh/ Picasso/ Pollock/ Joyce et al
Totally agree. You’d think with all the freedom that has come with digital photography there would be a lot more creativity out there.
@@SteveONions I think there is but you have to look bloody hard, leave the mainstream. For most, creativity=software filter unfortunately
Steve that was a great lesson in composition. You certainly have the "eye" and know when and where to use or break the rules. Very impressed with the photos too. Keep safe
Thank you 😊
Like the image at 7:35 with layering of hills.
Thank you 👍
So much good information in this video. Very well done in the explanation of everything.
Thank John, I’ve had to content myself with compositions using just the cats and furniture of late 😀
@@SteveONions Yeah, I filmed a video the other day of taking a picture with the 4x5 of something in my office. Can't say what it is, I don't want to spoil it for my subs incase they watch you too and read the comments.
Very enjoyable episode and thought provoking indeed. No need for apologies Steve in the length, the critque and understanding of why certain images are right or wrong what put over really well. I will be honest I know and understand most of the rules but at times will disregard everything if I see a scene that warrants me pressing the shutter - don't get me wrong I will try and compose so that it has one of the rules in but sometimes I find my photography reactive. By that I mean, seeing light dance across a scene or a sudden shift in the mood of the sky will get me reaching for the camera. Saying that when I am out with the camera I am usually in a location/setting that there would be a good chance of getting a photography I suppose. Atb Alan
I’m very reactive too Alan, and let’s be honest M43 equipment lends itself to this approach more than anything else I’ve ever used. I’m itching to get out in Snowdonia and get my eye in again 👍
@@SteveONions Going M43 allows that reactive response in me even more I suppose although I find it hard to leave a tripod behind on my trips at times. Know what you mean about itching to get out, my last trip was just before the lockdown - my last day out with the camera was a month today up in North Wales. Had travelled up 4 days before and the PM had made an announcement whilst I was driving up. We were staying in a converted barn in Talsarnau & kept ourselves to ourselves whilst we were there but I felt increasingly more uncomforatble as the week went on - after my walk to find the abandoned cottage on the Thursday I drove staright home and the 2 chaps I was with stayed on the extra day. My wife is on the vunerable list and had a letter from the Welsh Health Board so we have been isolating since but I did take 2 exercise walks from home last week - I can get up onto my local hill (504m) from the house and it takes me 1h.15m to get up n down - I already live at 1161ft above sea level. My online sub to OS mapping is open most of the time & I been making a list of places when we can get out - most are up in North Wales so I might just catch you on the mountain sometimes..lol. Atb Al
Outstanding, Steve.
Thanks Ram.
Lots of great ideas there. Thanks!
You’re welcome Miley 👍
Thanks very much for this. Although ’ve been photographing for many years, I am still learning . Cheers
We’re all learning - always!
Nice explanation, great examples, thanks.
Thanks Steve.
As always Steve. Excellent content! I always return to your channel when I need inspiration. Thank you for the videos!!
Thanks Frank.
Thank you Steve.
When speaking of lead in lines and foreground object, you've actually touched upon a point that I always considered in my compositions but didn't really know why. I prefer using standard or short telephoto when composing landscape, in a way that ties in with your comments. I keep the wide for family shots and indoors.
Good Matteo, I’m glad I’m
not the only one who sees wideangles as often being detrimental to landscape images 👍
This was a very useful video for me. Thank you, Steve. One thing I would mention, and nothing new of course, is that after a certain amount of time practicing the rules of composition or any other discipline, one tends to internalize those rules and they become part of how one tends to view things or approach things; automatic so to speak. I am working on getting to that place. It is for me quite valuable that you point out and remind me not to get locked into those rules, however, blinded by them as it were, and miss the better shot.
You’re right James and I often forget that some of the best practice is being applied automatically.
I have watched almost all of your videos and I find them, and your photography and approach to an image, really inspiring. So much that I bought two rolls of film, ilford fp4+ and portra 160, to use with my father's old camera, a Canon ae1 program. Thank you and keep up the great work.
Thanks Ricardo, I how the Canon manages to turn out some good images from the two rolls 👍
Well put together Steve.
Cheers Paul :)
Most helpful thank you. Clear, concise and simply explained. Well done.
Thanks Donald.
Thank you for this. I’ve been taking photos for years, no formal training, and recently went through my photo library. I was disappointed with a number of my images resulting from composition errors. This advice was timely.
Glad it was useful Kent. It just takes time and practice to assess compositional choices but good books help too. I think I’ll do a short video on the one that helped me the most many years ago.
Steve, that would be great! And again, thank you.
You’re welcome Kent.
Thanka Steve this was refreshing and something I need to keep in me mindset when i am out. Hope you are doing well, are safe, happy & healthy in these troubling times.
Thanks Michael and I hope you are well too.
Another very inspiring video. Thank you.
You’re welcome Colin.
Sometimes we tend to forget that the "rules" didn't come first, the art came first. Old masters created what was pleasing to them and over time common components, elements, placements were noted and became the rules. I think when we become experienced in composing images and seeing things artistically, we naturally gravitate to what are called rules today whenever they fit our artistic vision. I am certain that most experienced photographers give little mechanical thought to rules in the field. They compose based on their vision and experience and the results may or may not conform to a given rule. It is for this reason that I teach the participants in my classes to consider the rules not actual rules but rather tools that may be used when they help strengthen the elements in the scene to achieve their vision for the photo. You wouldn't use a pipe wrench when you needed a screwdriver, you would use the tool that best aided the task. Soon, you stop thinking about whether you need the wrench or the screwdriver, you automatically use what helps.
Very true Philip, they are guidelines at best and useful when trying to explain some of the ideas that lead to pleasing images.
I love your approach to photography! A rule only works IF it works!
Very true, very true.
Fantastic video , watched more than once and re-looked at some of my pictures that I was ready to delete. Thank you so much for explaining rules etc BUT also just to say what caught your eye to actually take the picture in the first place, says everything . Thank you, can't wait for next video and keep safe
That's a tricky question Helen as I do most of my scouting subconsciously, it's only when I get close to recognising a composition that I start to work out what I should include (and just as importantly exclude). I think it all starts when I come across something that triggers me to say 'yes, there's something there'. It is often down to the lighting which is why flat grey conditions are very hard to work in. I am also thinking about how I want the final images to look even before I have composed them, for example I will decide up front if I want a smooth and relaxing feel or maybe something coarse and dramatic.
Hope this helps.
I don't do landscapes as such. I do photograph trees and clouds. I like trees best as they hold very still, never complain, and provide some incredible images. I quit professional work because of the need to see a therapist after nearly ever session. Trees have awesome Kharma and are the niceest subjects I ever worked with. Clouds however are always going somewhere! If you aren't ready for this find youself a tree. My favorite tree person is Grandma Bonsai, she lives in old downtown Melbourne Fl.FL. She has the most beautiful spirit and has had a rough life which she is willing to show. I've photographed her several times and she's always available! I follow Steve's efforts because he's my idea of the perfect artist. I model my efforts on his sugestions.
Thanks David, that's really kind of you - hope you keep enjoying your tree and cloud studies!
Great content! Excited to watch you grow
I appreciate it!
great explanations and great examples. One of the best videos on the topic I've seen. Simple, Concise, And especially doesn't treat the rules as much as a "God Sent Gospel" as others :) It demonstrates exactly when these "Rules" can kill your efforts. Sometimes I feel the only rule, For me, is "If it feels compositionally right, It's probably right".
I’d really enjoy seeing an episode where you show us multiple crops and/or treatments of the same image. I don’t know how you feel about changing an image after it’s shot but it would be really interesting to see how it can change the feel of a composition with your input on it
It is important to see the options that were available at the time an image was captured, hard to visualise without. I do crop images at times but usually only a small amount to correct for tilted horizons or some small element at the edge of the frame. Less often I will make a heavy crop either because I didn’t have a long enough lens or perhaps because I saw a better balance in post processing.
Great video! The rules are there because, generally, the photograph feels right when the rules are applied. But, as you say, sometimes what feels right does not conform. Photography is nothing if not emotive and we must use that rather than pure mechanical execution.
Very true Thomas, the rules can be very useful but not if they force us to take images we don’t feel comfortable with.
I particularly like the one on 7 minutes. You have a lot of good examples here! Thanks
Thanks Arild.
Very informative, Steve. Thanks. I often wonder, when watching your videos, how you come to choose that particular aspect of your subject. Rules, or the breaking of them, may be part of the explanation. Loved that photo of the sapling.
Thanks Bernard. I’m not sure I know how I go about selecting the subjects elements myself 😀
Another really informative video. Thanks for sharing your perspectives on photography composition Steve. 👍
Thank you Rene 👍
Great examples and explanations, Steve - and beautiful images! Cheers!
Thank you 😊
Once again your video came at the right time. I love you work Steve, especially your black and white. I know have said it in the past: You inspire people and we, me, appreciate it so much: Where do I go to buy one of your photos?
Thank you Brian, that’s so kind of you to say and I really appreciate the feedback. Regarding prints I’ll be putting some up for sale very soon 🙂
Brilliant video Steve.
I've always been a non-conformist and never been great at following rules. I've always been of the opinion that "if it looks right to me, it's right for me". And that's what I'll take a picture of. Or at least shoot it with the intention of some manipulation later.
I think the compositional rules/guidelines are useful for people learning photography. But I've found the more I shoot the less I adhere to those rules.
Stay safe Steve. Look forward to your future insights!
Thanks Gareth. I can’t remember the last time I consciously considered a rule while taking a shot, I’m too busy getting the composition right 🙂
Great video!
Thanks Dav.
Steve, you are an excellent teacher. Thank you for another great video.
Thank you, that’s very kind 🙂
In confination times, just as ours sons or grand sons keep up their study on tv classes, this is a master lesson, at least for me. My great respects, Steve
Thanks Ricardo, very kind of you to say.
Beautiful pieces of work, thanks for sharing.
You’re welcome Stefan.
Good composition is hard to define but easy to recognize.
Very good information, Steve. Hope you're doing well and staying safe during the lockdown. Our governor here in Texas just reopened all state parks, so long as you're not in a group of 5 or more (which doesn't affect the solitary landscape photographer) we can finally get back to wee bit of normalcy.
Thank you. You’re very lucky as we have at least another 3 weeks before any easing of the restrictions on movement 😷
Thanks for another excellent video Steve. Informative and thought provoking. Kind regards - Rob
Thanks Rob.
Beautiful channel Steve! Very helpful. Greetings from Siberia!
Thank you so much and I have two wonderful Siberian cats 😺😺
My Photography instructor said I'm going to explain to you the rules of Photography. At least that way you will know what your breaking. Why and when you break them, you will have to figure out yourself' Cracking vlog Steve
Cheers
Diz
Cheers Diz 👍
I´m coming from a photography of more spontaneity than landscape photography, but feeling and intuition for me trumps knowledge of rules. Becoming good at composition you have to shoot and experiment, get the feeling of what looks right while shooting.
Later look closely at the photos and figure out what works and what not and that´s the time knowledge of composition comes in handy. What do I like? Why do I like it? How did I do that? How do I do something like this again?
Than shoot again, analyse again, come to conlcusions again. Eat, work, sleep, repeat.
Especially when someone starts in photography working and training the intuition may be a longer way in the beginning and starting with a rulebook might lead to satisfying results quicker, the intuitive eye for harmony and composition is what makes the difference later.
Very true, you can’t impart the knowledge overnight so some basic rules will speed up the process.
Really very good vid Steve.. some excellent examples for each side of the so called rules. Really very well done; I certainly will save to review from time to time because of its added value. I thank u for work. Take care and be safe.
Thanks Randy, I’m glad it was useful.
All of that needs to be in a book and with a nice story and discussion about each image and the critique you just provided. I don't know what you should call the book, but you should put one together with those images. Also perhaps a calendar. That one shot near the beginning with all the trees an growth, now that is a real deal kind of experience, you really often can't see the forest through the trees, and then what do you do - all you have is tangles to work with. Also, where I live if you try to "zoom with your feet" instead of using a telephoto, you can look forward to being arrested for trespass, or maybe something more exciting depending on what the farmer has available for "unwelcome" guests. The only people around here who get around that are the snowmobile clubs who make arrangements with thousands of contiguous land owners to ride all over hell's half acre in the winter. (Despite hell's ownership it is cold.) I wish those clubs would add photographers to their members and get off season permissions, now that would be nice, but probably not practical. (That shot of the mountains and water without the foreground is what I face in my area often.) Great video as usual, one of your best. Stay safe, God bless!
Thanks John. We are quite fortunate in the UK that a lot of the most beautiful scenery is in national parks and access is very good. There are some places I shoot where farmers restrict access but the most dangerous weapon used over here is usually a walking stick 🙂.
Very informative Steve. Keep up the good work. Stay safe.
Thanks Phillip, all the best to you too.
Thank you for this video, great images!
Thanks Gopi, so pleased you liked it.
Another great video, thank you Steve! Really cool and interesting, time passes easily with your photography tips! Keep safe, I wait for you soon!
Thanks Maurizio, all the best to you too 🙂
Steve having read some comments below I have to agree that you should produce a book. I'd buy it immediately. Now is a good time to think about it during lockdown.
I’d love to make one, I did start 10 years ago but family and work kept interrupting. I’m not the fastest worker so it would take me quite a while but I think it’s got to be done one day. All the best 👍
I agree 100% with your assessment. Unfortunately this awful habit of over using wide and ultra wide angle lenses was promoted by the photographic publications in the late 70s and early 80s. This is what I call gimmicky photography. In fact if my memory serves me right, finding a decent ( high performance ) wide angle lens was quite difficult in the 70s and 80s even within the offerings of the camera manufacturers , certainly Zeiss had a couple ( the 38mm on the Hassleblad SWM ) and perhaps Nikon with the old 20 mm and 28 mm f3.5 . People have forgotten how to effectively use a ' standard ' lens.
I remember those days too. 28mm was wide and anything less super exotic. Suddenly we had a lot of choice below 20mm and it’s become the norm ever since for most landscape work - sadly 🙁
Hi Steve, this was incredible video. Thank you for your work here.
Glad you enjoyed it Alexey!
Great lesson, Steve! Thank you!
Thanks Cyril.
amazing content. thanks
Love your channel, Steve. You are indeed a well of photographic wisdom! :-)
Thank you 😊
Bonjour Steve. Do you sometimes shoot landscape images in the vertical format? It is another way of breaking rules and the last smartphones seem to like this format.
Hi Christian. I do shoot a fair bit in the vertical format but obviously when using 6x6 cameras this decision is taken away from me 😊. I find each format dictates the orientation with 4x5 and 645 cameras lending themselves to portrait layouts, 35mm can feel a bit too tall.
very very good...pros and cons of the "rules" we all need to roll a little bit more the Weston way !:)
Absolutely Gaius :)
Thanks for this Steve. An interesting video.
Thank you.
Hello Steve, thanks for the video, very well explained .
Just to ask , what is the app you use in your phone as a framing tool ? You mentioned but I didn't get it . Thank you
An stay safe.
Dany
Thanks Dany. The app is called Artists Viewfinder Mk2.
I am fascinated by this rule of thirds that photographers refer to. In my four years of art school this "rule" was never mentioned. I think it's an example of something that gets repeated so often that people think it's a thing. I'm not sure it is. Having a familiarity with art and photography history and using your educated instincts creates good compositions. I never think of "rules" of composition.
Perhaps it is peculiar to photographers Curtis, it’s something that used to get a lot of coverage and I often see people striving to get something important onto one of the thirds.
Great video thank you. I would love to see you head into the hills with just your Sony RX100 to really limit yourself. I wonder how good a result you could get with such a tiny camera - both video for the vlog and images for print!
That’s a good challenge to be honest. Making both video and stills with an 8 year compact would be challenging (especially the video) but I can feel a mountain hike coming on ( when we’re allowed out again).
Another excellent video mate - Love how you explained everything in your usual style. All the best and yes! You need to write a book. lol
Cheers
Jim
Thanks Jim, all the best to you too 👍
As usual I Iearned something. Thank you.
Other sources for my education have been Rene Berger's book "The Language of Art" from 1963
and Alice Bellony-Rewald's "The Lost World of the Impressionists" from 1968.
Painters have more control of course, and have moved into areas of pure expressionism, a field that photographers call manipulation. How odd. Neither are any more realistic than the other really, but that's another debate.
Good point Lars. With the advent of digital I see no need to obtain the maximum detail and clarity in an image any longer (unless the scene calls for it).
Steve you did mention one rule or evidence for neglecting the so called rules (lead in lines etc.) and that's the "balance" of the picture.
The "centre of the balance" is the interest of the images the rest does convey that interest.
Most of the times the centre of the interest its the brightest part of the image. When you do black and white its more easy to see.
That’s true Ruud but it’s much less obvious I think and as you state, more often used in B&W photography. I can think of a few lesser rules too but not many people are aware of them. Stay safe 👍
What is that app you use to simulate different framelines?
It’s called Artists Viewfinder Mk2.
@@SteveONions Thanks for the reply! Unfortunately I have an android and it seems to be apple only :(
Very enjoyable video that you put together, I am not a great lover of B & W images overall but here you gave us three beautiful examples of how to take an image, the beach at Barmouth, the Forest Scene with no foreground and near the end the Quarry and the wall leading up to too it, just a stunning threesome, so I eat my words, lovely stuff Steve, regards, Colin.
Thanks Colin, I’ll make a convert of you yet 🙂
I came across this a few years ago, don’t remember who said it. The rule of thirds: make the top third interesting, make the middle third interesting and make the bottom third interesting.
Haha, perfect 😀👍
I find that having your family standing behind you grumbling about needing to get somewhere stops you from over-thinking shots. I try to grab what looks good, sometimes it is and sometimes it obeys the rules and sometimes it doesn't. 😃 Stay safe everyone.
Composition always come a distant second to a quiet life Brian 😀
golden rule is something different, but you also seem to use it a lot. 1:13
Common sense 👍
A penny for every time you say "Smack bang"
It would dwarf the ad revenue Joseph 😀
Compositional rules are useless except for trying to sound knowledgeable.
👍