How to Hotrod a Radon Mitigation System (Badass Mix)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 ม.ค. 2021
- We've been looking forward to showing off this system for a long time- the pipes for it were installed during foundation work at the start of construction, and now 2 years later it's finished, with the Fantech Rn4 EC fan (infinitely variable), multiple drainage systems, and a roof cap. Get the details on all the tweaks we had to use to make sure this system runs perfectly, which it's doing right now.
Radon fan at: shop.fantech.net/en-US/radon-...
Wave Plus radon monitor at: www.trutechtools.com/AirThing...
Pango Wrap at: www.stegoindustries.com/produ... - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
I'd say the lack of handrails on that elevated sitting area will get him before the Radon will
😅
Beautiful system, well done, thank you so much for sharing this!!
Happy you enjoyed it, Gregory, thanks for following
Managing condensate in the radon venting is good to think about. Thanks, I hadn't considered until seeing this.
Rock on Dale
Great video. Plenty of good info. Thank you for sharing.
Corbett it's the first time I have seen condensation drains. Here in Wisconsin I haven't seen that yet. Most systems are installed over the sump pit with plexiglass I am doing a system on my mother inlaws house soon.
Great system. I did it with a aluminum downspout "instead" of PVC on the vertical run. The goal was to makes the radon pipe look like a downspout! Caulk and paint and plumb it up and right "next to the gutter" and most folks would see it! The rest of your system is awesum.
Cool idea, Adolf- whatever works!
How do you know that using aluminum downspout for radon venting is sufficiently airtight? If it leaks anywhere -- but especially near a window -- that would be a problem. Nowadays, many jurisdictions have code requires Schedule 40 PVC for radon venting.
I think the fear of the air coming out of a radon system is overblown. It’s certainly well diluted from running 24/7 and would have very minimal actual radon per liter. Why I can run my gas clothes dryer vent out the back of my house without issue but radon should be vented above the roofline simply does not make sense. I’m sure a rain gutter is more than sufficient even with leaky joints, especially considering PVC does not tolerate UV.
Ok, but if you configure your system against code it’ll be harder to fix if you ever have it inspected for resale.
Love the enthusiasm. Good information you're sharing. One thing I would double check If I was you is the 90⁰ fitting in your crawl space at the start of your system. I'm 12 year veteran of the hvac/pipe fitting industry and the horizontal connection does not appear to be seated properly and looks to be connected very poorly.
Thanks for your concern Alex, I hear you that it’s not pretty- I actually installed this entire system myself, the angle’s a little off because of the clearances but we accounted for it after glue-up. Keep on helping us non-pro pipefitters!
Only problem with "air tight" houses is the inability to have a fire or fire stove as it needs to draw air. We built a cabin very air tight and our fire place (glass surrounded in center of living room) would not stay alive. Turned out there wasn't enough air in the house to allow it to breath.
Additionally on top of radon there is also another uncontrollable invader into homes which is moisture from the ground which wicks through the footings and into the concrete walls into the house.
Having a fire place or wood burning heater etc allows for control of the moisture, making a bit of air even more important.
These are important for a "forever home" especially given the instability of today's economy where if (God forbid) there is some collapse of the grid and electric dehumidifiers are no longer useful... Including stoves etc... Fires become very important.
I'm also a dad building a forever home and thought I'd share.
Nice work, house looks good!
Stay safe!
Did you not install a fresh air intake pipe that is next to your furnace?
Great video, Corbett , What condensation basin do you use? I am looking for one that is air tight .
In Canada we have to keep everything indoors because how cold it gets so our system is very simple. The entire system including the fan is installed in the basement and the vent is vented outside the house a few feet above ground level, and this is all up to code up here .
Nice! I’ll let my Yukon friends know.
Sounds good and likely uses less energy. How long is the pipe to move the radon away from the house? I don't understand the concept of venting above the house as radon is heavier than air and would fall back to earth after the effort/energy of getting it so high.
Thank you for the video. What kind of tube fitting did you use to tap into the 3" PVC pipe? How did you do it?
Simple brass male threaded fitting on one side, tubing nipple on the other. Drill into pipe, screw it in with silicone on the threads. Bam.
@Home Performance - we're building a slab-on-grade, single-level home. I can't think where we'd consider placing the radon mitigation system; or if it'd even be necessary. Any thought on the matter? Great info....as always.
Yes, I highly recommend you do it- costs little to plumb in the pipe, and you only install and activate the fan if you need it. I would bet you will need it, since your home will be legally required to be much more airtight than the ones we all grew up in.
Great video as always! Do you like the wave for iaq monitoring?
I do- the right balance so far, for a simple monitor. Robust, but not annoying. Have yet to meet the perfect monitor that can automatically control ventilation though.
What kind of PVC clamps did you use? To what degree do they (a) bear weight and (b) allow adjustability when working with the rubberized "no hub" gaskets?
Thanks for this video Corbett, this is an interesting installation. Can you consider a video on radon retrofit options? I have a 1950's era home and I wonder if an exhaust fan pulling air out of the basement may help reduce radon in the basement rooms. If I used an in-wall HRV like the Lunos system, heat could be recovered, and fresh outside air would replace the air being exhausted. What do you think about this approach of simply venting basement air outside? This may not be a perfect solution, but seems like it may be an improvement over doing nothing. Thanks for any thoughts on radon retrofit options.
Good idea, Mark- but Lunos is not the solution, since it does not induce a consistent pressure imbalance (it switches back snd forth between two fans). You CAN help your situation by using a simple exhaust fan like this:
th-cam.com/video/bg3AiGUTZR0/w-d-xo.html
But you must airseal the walls of your basement so that the only way to replace its air is from the house above.
Using a rain cap is smart
I thought you only covered hvac. You a badass
Aw shucks, thanks
Curious Corbett, could you have inverted the fan so it was pointing down and run a U shape pipe (two 90 degree elbows) to curve the pipe back up? If so, that would keep all the water out of the fan and require only a small weep hole in the bottom of the U to add drainage since it would be on the high pressure side of the fan.
Yeah, but it hurts the performance of the fan itself. Each turn creates a huge amount of Equivalent Duct Length.
@@HomePerformance, this would definitely be the case if the airflow rate was high, but based on your comments indicating low fan speed and high negative pressure, it sounds like a very low flow system. If you know how many CFM are actually flowing you could estimate the effect of adding the bends.
Also, by doing the upside-down U you’d be adding two 90 degree bends but subtracting two 45s, so the net effect would only be one additional 90.
Hey smart guy!
I recall watching the video prepping for footers for this house. It had a “gutter track, box system’ thingy to move ground water. You mentioned the radon system you’d install would fix if you had soil gasses. Is this the same home as in that video?
Yep, same house
Excellent ideas, it shows how much you care about the safety of your family. I have a question maybe you will answer: since radon is heavier than air, why isn't the pipe directed away from the house in a down hill slant? With venting above house, doesn't it take more energy to lift it and then doesn't the heavier radon fall to the ground near the house?
The wind and general dilution with outdoor air is enough to lower the toxicity, and moving gases around with a fan costs almost nothing
The science behind venting it to a high point is that the air will disperse the gas as it falls to the earth. If you vent it low, you leave an opportunity for the gas to collect near the ground which might impact humans in that area. Most states require venting at or above the roof line.
@@geraldwalsh8277 In the outdoor atmosphere there is enough turbulence that gases stay well mixed. You don't get segregation of heavier gases to the surface
Great video; beautiful home. Do you find the PVC pipe brackets help keep the noise down inside. We just had a mitigation system installed at our home and there is quite an audible hum inside. The exhaust pipe is tight up against the siding, with metal brackets. I e tried to get the installer to come back. He did come back and put a “cushion” between where the main pipe exits the wall before the fan but that made zero difference unfortunately. What about the pipes with foam inside? Would that reduce the pipe resonance? Thanks
Try a better quality fan- our Fantech is so quiet I have to touch it to confirm it’s running.
3:37 can you explain where the condensation is coming from at this portion of your solution?
Is it bc of the diffy in air temp being pulled from under your slab interacting with the temp of condition air temp of pipe?
I would imagine simply having a dedicated air ventilation system would be a huge improvement over a lot of homes when it comes to radon levels?
I actually don’t think it would help as much as you expect- only 150 cfm dilution air, max- we were at 19, hard to bring that down with just ventilation dilution.
I'm building a very air tight home, where every inch is a living space. Since my fan has to be outside, should the exhaust piping run up the outside of my house or can it be run up in the inside walls where pipe runs out to fan, then back into the house and up to the roof exhaust port?
I haven't seen anyone do it but I haven't found any codes or people not recommending doing it this way.
Cool video! Great info! 1 question! Don’t you think those drain hoses are going to deteriorate being left out like that? Maybe it’s just me being from Arizona that makes me think like that! Lol Sun rot is real out here!
Everything dies, yes. We can easily replace when the sun eats at them.
Will gravity fed condensation even open a check valve? Does it have an extremely light spring?
When water builds up, it’ll open almost anything :). Also, what’s the diff between water from condensation and water from a sink?
That’s a nice mits unit - hopefully that lineset gets finished because it looks like ass.
Also the one check valve for your condensate drain is on the positive side of the fan, is it actually needed? Not a fan of the Wye fitting type of design on the downstream of your inline fan. It’s really not required at all.
Lastly, don’t think I didn’t see the over application of primer on those pipes and the 90 should’ve been rolled to accomodate your sloped pipe or add two 45’s to create an offset.
Corbett, Does the radon vent pipe have to exhaust above the roof?
I remember you saying in a past video an additional benefit of the radon mitigation system would be decreasing the humidity from the interior envelope; has this been proven correct?
Yes it does, and yes it does! We’re actually dry as heck right now, below 30% RH inside, and I’m wondering what to do about it.
@@HomePerformance You going to try and keep relative humidity (RH) between 40% and 50%?
30-50 is fine by me, but 29 is pushing it
@@HomePerformance We had a humidifier installed on our furnace. Make sure that if/when you go to do it, you get one with an automatic temperature sensor so you don't end up having to go into your basement and turn a freaking dial depending on the outside temperature. I wish I knew the things I know now, but 3 years ago. It seems that if you don't become an expert or as informed as possible then you will get taken advantage of every single time.
Any recommendations for a company in the ATL area? Thanks in advance 😊
It’s nothing too special, I built this one myself in ATL.
How do you decide between going with a 4" system vs
a 3" system?
Bigger duct is easier on the fan.
So will those drain lines and check valves freeze in the winter
As explained, no, I don’t believe they will
My radon fan is located directly behind my head on the master bedroom wall for various reasons. I can hear it and feel the vibrations through the 6in wall. What can I do? I bought the same hangers that you showed in this video a few months ago in hopes that their rubber boots would dampen the vibration against the vinyl siding (no luck there). I have also tried the big enclosure case by pretending I was a radon mitigation company (because apparently those things are impossible to buy otherwise). It had no positive effect and seemed to reverberate more sound. I then stuffed it full of rockwool insulation, but that returned me to the normal loud state. The tube the company used is sched 10 4in. I am at my wits end. I've disassembled the fan and cleaned the blades, but that did not seem to have any effect. I've called the company that installed it, but they tell me that's normal. It can't possibly be normal. I can't freaking sleep!
Sorry to hear, Phil! This is one reason design is so important- obviously the builder didn’t consider this detail. I’m going to recommend two things that might sound dumb, but I swear they work: add a sleep sound machine to the noise level at night, or move the bed.
@@HomePerformance I ended up replacing my RadonAway XP201 from the original system installer with the FanTech in your video. I didn't do it just on a whim - Matt Risinger also has this fan on his house. The swap was simple enough. I've got the potentiometer set at 6(of 10) and not only is the system dead silent inside, but the vacuum reading in the basement is better than before! Well worth the $350 after YEARS of this shit. I'm back to only hearing my tinnitus! The wall vibrations are gone too. I believe that might have partially been my fault. With the hangerloks, there's always one extra click you can get to super snug them up.
Why does it need to go all the way to roofline for pipe? Could even downturn it once out of house. Seems like overkill. Is it for fan noise? Thanks
It’s a concentrated flow of toxic gas- dump it where no one will be hurt, since you went to all the trouble of installing a system
@@HomePerformance I get what you are saying, and that likely is the case for the design reason, but in reality, I suspect that it is not actually concentrated. I suspect that the air flow is 100 to 1000x what is needed to "concentrate" the gas. It just transports it out so that it doesn't concentrate inside (before). I would be interested in measuring your situation at the pipe for a month and report the average and peak radon at the exhaust tube, where we know you had fairly high levels inside (known source of radon).
My Airthings wave shows an average of 1.1 pCi/L for the last 6 months and I have seen a 1 hour peek of 2.2 a couple months ago. I live in Washington and have a vented crawlspace.
Do you think think there would be any benefit to putting an active fan on the crawlspace that activates when the level goes above 1.0.
I am going to have the crawlspace air sealed from the house this year. I’m sure that will help a bit for what gets inside.
If your crawl space is vented and the vents aren't blocked off You probably won't have a radon issue. You can buy one those fancy Radon meters or use a radon test kit to check.
@Guy Tech the numbers I gave in my post are from one of those fancy radon meters. And as I stated in my post I have a vented crawlspace. I was trying to get peoples opinion if the readings I’m getting are worth dealing with and is an active fan blowing through my vented crawlspace is a useful idea.
@James Meehan thanks I will look at the readings again after everything is sealed up and the vented crawlspace is properly separated from the house.
@Ecospider5, I think you should weigh feasibility and cost to get your 2.2 down. It’s a pretty low reading already, and you might seal the crawl to the extent possible and not make a big dent.
There are a ton of published papers on NIHs database from the last 20 years revising radon research and suggesting new nominal levels and critiquing the model used to arrive at our current regulatory limits.
AND not to mention that the EPA's radon map hasn't been updated since 1993. Homes are WAY more airtight now than they were back then, so the radon levels are probably quite a bit higher everywhere.
Actually, look into the new research changing from the LNR model, a linear extrapolation based on very real and measured risk in miners to the HRR model… it reflects a more modern understanding of alpha and gamma particles on health. One could basically conclude that canadas limits are more optimal… but please don’t shoot the messenger! Thanks for the vid.
I'm surprised you haven't cut the plastic along the edge of the floor and sealed it with something like Lexel caulk as all cold joints tend to leak.
Just finished that project, Tim- there’s always a mountain of to-do’s
Would a minisplit AC system in the basement reduce levels?
Not in any imaginable way
what size of check valve do you use? you weblink for check valve?
Whatever fits your vinyl tube- I think mine are 3/8”.
Why install the fan on the outside? Why not install it in the basement?
drain lines will gunk up with algea. transparant tubes is a bad idea.
The better to know when to clean them my friend
Is the water from the radon acidic like how you have to neutralize a 90% unit?
Ooooh, good question mister fancy- I have absolutely no idea though. You got me.
Radon is a noble gas, so nope, not an issue.
Thanks Nick
All of those bells and whistles are very nice and helpful but more of them you have the more maintenance and things to worry about you have .
Yes, definitely. If you can make a pipe straight from the ground up thru the roof, do it. Not every situation allows that.
I went with an open pier foundation so I wouldn't have to deal with radon mitigation. But now I'm realizing that I have to deal with rodent mitigation l, which is probably more expensive 🤣
You can’t win, O. The Buddhists say that life is like falling down a well, open-eyed.
@@HomePerformance lol. It definitely feels like that when it comes to home building. I liked your saying from the other video- " as expected, the unexpected happens" 😂
I see alot of heavier mesh screens to address that in Maine but actual insulated walls keeps the heat bills down and the radon capture up. You are right, it's hard to get a win-win situation.
It’s not good to have condensation back to the fan either
Another informative video. Living in Minnesota, we had to retrofit a radon mitigation system into our home, thankfully not as complex as yours. That said, I do feel you you'd be better served 86'ing the holocaust/radon reference. It's a sensitive subject in my family, and your use/reference seemed too blase. There are better and more eloquent ways to get your point across. (E.g. second hand smoke/lung disease)
Thanks for the feedback, Eric! Stay warm.
C’mon man!
I’d have used crawlseal 20 mil vapor barrier superior to 15 mil.
No, that’s an oversimplification. The permeability is the important metric, not thickness.
@@HomePerformance 20 mil for concrete is superior due to potential tearing during rebar placement and concrete pouring. They all have to have a perm rating of 0.1 or below so you are splitting hairs. A 15 mil regardless of perm rating is useless if it is torn with a rake or shovel while moving concrete around. And trust me a lot of concrete crews don’t give a damn if they damage it. That’s why I would go with the 20 mil. Crawlspace a are another story. 10-12 is about as high as you wanna go because 20 and even 15 isn’t very pliable for sealing purposes in tight spots. Imma home inspector and I see all kinds of half ass installments in crawlspaces that do absolutely no good. And I live in one of the worst states for radon. It’s crazy how most people don’t know about radon around here. And I see some radon mitigation systems that are a nightmare of 90 degree elbows and ups and downs. It’s pretty crazy. And what’s even more shocking is the slab on grade homes that didn’t even install a vapor barrier under the slab. Lol it’s nuts.
10-4 buddy. No rebar in my 2” slab, so no worries. Fiberglass admixture instead. Agreed on the rest. Crazy people everywhere.
Why should you be concerned about the condensation coming back down why not let it drain back into the gravel under the cement slab
You want it to bypass the fan, that’s all
I suspect all the drains are completely unnecessary. It's a 4" pipe and there's air flowing through it. It will allow moisture to evaporate (if it's liquid) and be pulled out with the airflow. Good example and a mistake I've made myself that Green Building Advisor discusses - you have to plan this stuff before building.
Wrong- when I drilled the drains they poured water into the bucket like crazy. 100% necessary.
@@HomePerformance Corbett, you suggest that others 'rephrase' their comments when you find them to be snarky, but then you immediately start your reply to me with - Wrong.
I didn’t think you were being snarky, I thought you were deducing from building science theory. Theory is wrong a lot of the time, and when real world data shows so, I like to know when I’m wrong. I assumed you’d want to know your idea was disproven. Nothing personal.
I can tell you would be painful to be around even as a neighbor. I feel like you go to door to door and explain to people's lives as we know, and before.
Wow what a sweet lady. Gosh thanks so much for taking the time to share your thoughts and feelings, no matter how small and mean they are. Keep up the good work.
it’s better to install the fan inside, away from environment
Instead of a dyi radon system..Id leave that up to professionals.
Nice system, too bad its totally unnecessary. Higher radon rates equals lower rates of cancer,scientific fact,look it up. Although it should reduce humidity in basement.
You invoked the holocaust to discredit those who question radon policies? Makes you look bad, bro. State the facts and science and let people decide for themselves. No need to be so manipulative.
Everyone is allergic to dairy and wheat...and if you disagree you are a holocaust denier. .
Finally, a radon denier, I knew you’d find this video eventually
Some of the worst looking pvc work I’ve ever seen
Boy you sound like a real sweetheart