Thanks for the video. I started reloading when I was 20. ....30 years ago. I took a long break on shotshell reloading. Just now getting in to loading TSS. I know the concepts but had no idea how they actually made a roll crimp. I kept seeing people talking about drill presses but I was still drawing a blank. Now I know :)
Very insightful, been researching this for the past few months now, been slowly buying everything i need and you just touched on literally every piece of information I have came across. Very nice video. Watched it a few times 👍👍
I went down the same road myself! Figured a good, comprehensive video with all the info a person could need would be worth while doing. Really glad you enjoyed it and hope you have success putting together some great loads!
Great video. It's very cool the 28 gauge is becoming popular. (again). I bought a 28 about 4 years ago and there were no videos on reloading for it. Awesome stuff. Subscribed!
Definitely making a comeback and rightfully so! More than enough gun for any wild bird and in a size that everyone from a youngster learning the ropes, to a seasoned field hunter can use and appreciate. Appreciate the comment and sub!
1st video I have watched which you have made, very informative, audio and video are excellent. I load 410's and have 3 different roll crimpers, the Gaep brass does the nicest job. The other 2 from other companes works but just not as pretty. My 12 gauge is a hand crank AMMO Daddy , doesn't look like much but crimps beautifully with no drill press.
@@adamwells6355 if you’re loading tss, and shooting more shells as you would waterfowling, it’d be a pretty substantial savings vs. factory tss offerings. I primarily load for turkey and while I don’t have the exact numbers off the top of my head, it’s substantially cheaper, after the upfront investment. If you’re getting into tss, I’d strongly look at a 28 gauge. They’re lower payloads, but kill anything very very well. Less powder usage, less shot usage and a lot more “bang for your buck”. There’s a lot of great reloading groups on FB with some duplex loads to make them even more cost friendly, as well as fold crimp options that allow you to reuse your hulls. I’d “being with the end in mind” and decide what exactly you want them for and how many you anticipate to shoot a year. Work back from there and see if the investment and potential savings is worth diving in 👊🏼
Whats the meat like with that tss load? Ive been getting a shit load of bb's in the meat with everything ive been reloading in 2 3/4" 28 gauge tss. Im about to try loading for 12 with tss and seeing if its the same issue
You mentioned you use a Tristar Raptor..what feedback can you give us about it? You seem to be pretty detailed about your reloading process. Great video and very good setup and editing.
Id like to start loading my TSS for turkey and upland. I understand you do not share the specifics of your receipe but where can I get those specifics, I don’t have any equipment but the drill press, Id be willing to equip myself but wouldnt it be preferable to have a receipe before going shopping?
Any chance you’ll be doing any videos on the MECs you mentioned. Really enjoyed this video and love your products. Hope to see some reloading on the MECs in the future
Thank you! More than happy to do some reloading on the MECs. They’re awesome tools and when setup correctly produce some beautiful shells. More to come 👊🏼
If you add a 1/4” 32ga felt in the wad, it would fill that gap from only running a 1-3/8oz load in the 28ga. You will have no rattle and can drop your buffer amount a few grains.
Tungsten man out of china sells tss, and i have bought it after some haggling, whichbthey are open to, for 31dollars per lb. I bought 10lbs of # 9.5 shot for a total of310dollars. For my .410 ill be dropping ducks all season for the cost less than a case of factory loaded boss shotshells when im throwing a half ounce charge. Worked EXCELLENT last year on teal, to divers, to mallardsn and a bunch of snows and canadas. Zeto issue dumping birds out to 45 yards.
I'm gunning to do some waterfowl with the .410. We shoot a lot of field geese and I have no doubt a hornets nest of TSS on a decoying bird will work just fine!
@@6.5ruger tungsten man It's a Chinese dude or company that sells bulk tungsten products The more you buy the cheaper it gets per lb Find some buddies that want to order a good amount and lay into a stash.
Lol. I roll crimp my first shot of the morning with tss, using black powder for that first shot at 6:30 am.with 1 and 1/8 of of #7, 15 gram tss with 100 grains of black powder. In an over/under 12 guage. Really smokes out the hunting blind!!!!
Bismuth for upland is wonderful before for subgauge turkey loads, TSS is unmatched due to its density. Smaller shot 8/9/10s that hit like much larger shot size, but you get the pattern density because you have more shot. Plenty of birds killed with lead and everything else each year so no one way to skin the cat. Personally love and won’t shoot anything but tss for turkeys from the .410 and 28s 🤘🏼
Hi its me again why are you loading a 1&3/8 load in a 28 bore am i missing something over here in the UK? What distances are you using that shell at? You only need a max of 1 pellets in its neck to kill the Turkey depending on distance. So why are you wasting all that TSS it cost to much. I have a Vid TSS Shell 28 bore reloading UK. i hope you like it if you need info please get back Yours again Alan Robinson TSS
Fold crimps, 8 or 6, will have more longevity as it's not melting and rolling the hull back onto itself. Most my 28 and .410 roll crimps are a 1 and done where my fold crimp lead loads I've gotten up to 8 reloads on a hull. The more aggressive the load (speed, powder, payload) the quicker the hull will break down, but a fold crimp will usually (not always) give you multiple reloads.
Best hull undoubtedly is win aa hulls. A close tie for a second place for me are the herters hulls. They are just as tough if not maybe better than aa hulls in 410 and 28ga. I can't speak for other gages
Trouble I have with roll crimps is the “one and done” part of it. I have never managed to have a reusable hull from a roll crimp in either .410 or 28ga.
Totally get that! For my turkey loads I'm usually okay with it and like to stuff the beard of the bird inside the spent hull for a plaque mount. At least I get a little more "use" after I pop the primer :)
This isn't the first video I've seen on roll crimping with overshot cards -- but I've never seen a good explanation of why this time consuming process is more desirable than a fold crimp (especially given that commercial shells, even with tungsten shot, are almost universally fold crimped for efficiency reasons). I'm relatively new to loading shotshells -- I've loaded metallic cartridges for decades, but this is a somewhat different process -- so maybe I'm missing something?
Great question. The biggest reason for roll crimping w/ overshot cards is to reduce the pressure of the load. Most TSS loads, specifically turkey loads like the ones we load in this video, are packing substantially more total weight in payload vs lead, due to the extreme density of TSS. Most TSS manufactures claim TSS is 222% denser than standard tungsten and 50%+ more dense than lead. A standard 28 gauge lead shot shell is 3/4oz to 7/8oz and a few 1oz loads, the majority being 3/4oz. This load is 1 3/8oz and there are even 28 gauge loads going to 1 1/2 oz. Simply put, the volume capacity of most shot shell wads only hold so much, be that lead, TSS, steel, bismuth, etc., but if you increase the total weight of the shot inside the wad, even if it's the same overall volume, you increase the pressure of the shell. Short answer gone long.. the primary reason is to keep shot shell pressures safe and within SAAMI specifications of the corresponding gauge and TSS is much more dense and roll crimping keeps pressures down. If you get a chance to flip through some shot shell manuals, give the load data a look as far as pressure. It's amazing how one small thing can really make a difference. Hope this helps!
@@finalrise So a roll crimp opens with less resistance (when the round fires) than a fold crimp? Good to know. That would surely explain why I normally only see them on slugs, buckshot, cut-down short shells, and heavy hunting loads. Since I (at present) only shoot skeet (and hopefully soon trap) and have no reason in those sports to pound my shoulder, I'll stick with the nice neat fold crimps my Load All II produces without any extra effort.
@@SilntObsvr - yes sir, you're absoluetely correct! I'm right there with you on sporting loads. I have a few MEC Jr's I use for my 28 and .410 field loads and they, like the Lee Load Alls, make loading a breeze! Best of luck on the reloading journey. Always fun to 'do it yourself' and have that extra touch of fulfillment when you shoot good score at the range and in the field.
@@finalrise Well, still working on the "shoot good score" -- but once I have a good load (probably 1 1/8 ounce of #9 at about 1100) that doesn't beat me up or cost a mint (with reused hulls and buying 1000 primers at a time, I can get down below 40 cents, just about the same as Fiocchi, Rio, or Estate target loads if I get them the right place) I'll be able to shoot more. And that's how you get better, right? First time out for skeet I broke *one* target in two rounds (50 targets offered). Second time out, a couple weeks ago, I broke around ten in each of three rounds (but shooting all the pairs as singles). A little calculation (shot flight time and target speed are known, compensate for angle of travel) makes a big difference. Now I need to work on pumping the slide for the pairs, probably starting with loading two for the singles. Yeah, I should have a double gun or semi for clay sports -- but that's half a year's shooting budget even for a bottom end Turkish model.
I've been reloading custom rounds for over 40 years while buyin factory ammo at the same time. Since the plandemic put the kibosh on ammo and reloading supplies availability and the prices have gone astronomical, I've been reloading exclusively using components that I spent 30 years stacking. Tungsten wasn't much of a thing when I was buying and stocking up on shot so all I have is lead and a little steel shot and that's what I use for my reloads. I'm not about to go spend the money to get some now either, if it can even be found. I have plenty of paid for lead and that's gonna have to do.
That's no joke brother. That was a wild couple years and the ripple effects are still being felt. Good to see the availability slowly recovering on things so we can get back to tinkering and having a good time at the range!
Like you said...all we have to have happen now is those major ammo manufacturers stop buying up EVERY SINGLE 410 HULL that comes off the line and let us little guys have some to load too. It's just ridiculous anymore
To the manufacturers (of the hulls, of the finished shells, etc.) it's all about money. Yes, they'd charge us more for 100 hulls than they do the shell makers (assuming they aren't filling both roles), but they save on shipping, packaging, storage -- selling a whole run of .410 hulls in a rail car or two costs them a lot less and assures they'll sell what they've made. Even if they ultimately make more profit selling to us, it's likely a better "business decision" to sell to the shell maker. Then again, if they're like Federal or Remington and make the hulls and load them all in house, once again they make a lot more profit on a pallet of finished shells than they do on a pallet of primed hulls...
Anything worth learning, is worth learning in depth, if it's of actual interest. Plenty of other videos out there with lots of 'show' and no ' tell'. If you're after good, safe and consistent reloading results, it's worth the watch. If you don't want to learn why or how, buy a box online. World would be pretty boring if we were all the same.
![[79] Roll Crimping Old, Previously Star Crimped Shot Shell Hulls: Can It Work?](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/WqnETjvG3lg/mqdefault.jpg)
![[79] Roll Crimping Old, Previously Star Crimped Shot Shell Hulls: Can It Work?](/img/tr.png)
Thanks for the video. I started reloading when I was 20. ....30 years ago. I took a long break on shotshell reloading. Just now getting in to loading TSS. I know the concepts but had no idea how they actually made a roll crimp. I kept seeing people talking about drill presses but I was still drawing a blank. Now I know :)
Very insightful, been researching this for the past few months now, been slowly buying everything i need and you just touched on literally every piece of information I have came across. Very nice video. Watched it a few times 👍👍
I went down the same road myself! Figured a good, comprehensive video with all the info a person could need would be worth while doing. Really glad you enjoyed it and hope you have success putting together some great loads!
Great video. It's very cool the 28 gauge is becoming popular. (again). I bought a 28 about 4 years ago and there were no videos on reloading for it. Awesome stuff. Subscribed!
Definitely making a comeback and rightfully so! More than enough gun for any wild bird and in a size that everyone from a youngster learning the ropes, to a seasoned field hunter can use and appreciate. Appreciate the comment and sub!
That was a helpful and well done video. Thanks! This makes me want to start reloading my own turkey shells!
Good video. Thanks!
Show us your go to upland loads and how you whip them up! I find these interesting
Great suggestion! I have a few 28 and .410 loads that are real thumpers. We'll get to recording :)
I too would like to see your 28ga loads…
Working with Hal is great. Terrific video.
Thank you! Hal is a stud for sure.
Good job explaining the process, thx
Great video! Very informative being I’m about to start loading myself. This helps a lot!
Clear-colored bingo chips work well, and you can see the load.
I like that! Thanks for the idea!
Un travail de professionnel par le soin apporté au chargement de vos cartouches de chasse. Algérie
1st video I have watched which you have made, very informative, audio and video are excellent. I load 410's and have 3 different roll crimpers, the Gaep brass does the nicest job. The other 2 from other companes works but just not as pretty. My 12 gauge is a hand crank AMMO Daddy , doesn't look like much but crimps beautifully with no drill press.
Excellent video
Best video I have found man! Love it! Do some waterfowl 28!
Where did you get the rack for your dewalt tools?
Where did you get the vibrating machine thing
I shoot a MB 930 semi auto shotgun . If I were to load # 4 Buckshot the way you do will they cycle through the gun ??
Just curious why the low brass hulls. Great video btw you got a good system
Have you figured out cost savings reloading your own? I've been debating reloading for ducks and geese
@@adamwells6355 if you’re loading tss, and shooting more shells as you would waterfowling, it’d be a pretty substantial savings vs. factory tss offerings. I primarily load for turkey and while I don’t have the exact numbers off the top of my head, it’s substantially cheaper, after the upfront investment.
If you’re getting into tss, I’d strongly look at a 28 gauge. They’re lower payloads, but kill anything very very well. Less powder usage, less shot usage and a lot more “bang for your buck”.
There’s a lot of great reloading groups on FB with some duplex loads to make them even more cost friendly, as well as fold crimp options that allow you to reuse your hulls.
I’d “being with the end in mind” and decide what exactly you want them for and how many you anticipate to shoot a year. Work back from there and see if the investment and potential savings is worth diving in 👊🏼
Whats the meat like with that tss load? Ive been getting a shit load of bb's in the meat with everything ive been reloading in 2 3/4" 28 gauge tss. Im about to try loading for 12 with tss and seeing if its the same issue
You mentioned you use a Tristar Raptor..what feedback can you give us about it? You seem to be pretty detailed about your reloading process. Great video and very good setup and editing.
Can you use already shot shells to reload?
Id like to start loading my TSS for turkey and upland. I understand you do not share the specifics of your receipe but where can I get those specifics, I don’t have any equipment but the drill press, Id be willing to equip myself but wouldnt it be preferable to have a receipe before going shopping?
Which gaep are you using? I’m looking at the otp and bn2. Thanks bud
I am using BN2 and i got it from ebay directly from italy. fantastic quality crimpers. love my shells
can you go over you shotshell for upland game if the components are any different
How do used fired star crimped cases roll crimp ?
Any chance you’ll be doing any videos on the MECs you mentioned. Really enjoyed this video and love your products. Hope to see some reloading on the MECs in the future
Thank you! More than happy to do some reloading on the MECs. They’re awesome tools and when setup correctly produce some beautiful shells. More to come 👊🏼
If you add a 1/4” 32ga felt in the wad, it would fill that gap from only running a 1-3/8oz load in the 28ga. You will have no rattle and can drop your buffer amount a few grains.
Great tip, thank you! Will definitely give that a try next spring.
Tungsten man out of china sells tss, and i have bought it after some haggling, whichbthey are open to, for 31dollars per lb.
I bought 10lbs of # 9.5 shot for a total of310dollars. For my .410 ill be dropping ducks all season for the cost less than a case of factory loaded boss shotshells when im throwing a half ounce charge. Worked EXCELLENT last year on teal, to divers, to mallardsn and a bunch of snows and canadas. Zeto issue dumping birds out to 45 yards.
I'm gunning to do some waterfowl with the .410. We shoot a lot of field geese and I have no doubt a hornets nest of TSS on a decoying bird will work just fine!
@@finalrise oh yeah I've killed a filthy pile of snow geese this year with 9/16oz of #8s in a.410 with a tps wad and mylar wrap roll
Crimped.
Who’s the guy you are buying tss from that’s cheap
@@6.5ruger tungsten man
It's a Chinese dude or company that sells bulk tungsten products
The more you buy the cheaper it gets per lb
Find some buddies that want to order a good amount and lay into a stash.
Rub everything down with a dryer sheet. Helps with static
Lol. I roll crimp my first shot of the morning with tss, using black powder for that first shot at 6:30 am.with 1 and 1/8 of of #7, 15 gram tss with 100 grains of black powder. In an over/under 12 guage. Really smokes out the hunting blind!!!!
Isn’t bismuth better? It’s softer then steel and tungsten and heavier then steel ?cheaper ?
Bismuth for upland is wonderful before for subgauge turkey loads, TSS is unmatched due to its density. Smaller shot 8/9/10s that hit like much larger shot size, but you get the pattern density because you have more shot. Plenty of birds killed with lead and everything else each year so no one way to skin the cat. Personally love and won’t shoot anything but tss for turkeys from the .410 and 28s 🤘🏼
Hi its me again why are you loading a 1&3/8 load in a 28 bore am i missing something over here in the UK?
What distances are you using that shell at? You only need a max of 1 pellets in its neck to kill the Turkey depending on distance.
So why are you wasting all that TSS it cost to much. I have a Vid TSS Shell 28 bore reloading UK. i hope you like it if you need info please get back Yours again Alan Robinson TSS
What is best for hull longevity? Roll, 8 or 6 point crimps?
Fold crimps, 8 or 6, will have more longevity as it's not melting and rolling the hull back onto itself. Most my 28 and .410 roll crimps are a 1 and done where my fold crimp lead loads I've gotten up to 8 reloads on a hull. The more aggressive the load (speed, powder, payload) the quicker the hull will break down, but a fold crimp will usually (not always) give you multiple reloads.
Best hull undoubtedly is win aa hulls. A close tie for a second place for me are the herters hulls. They are just as tough if not maybe better than aa hulls in 410 and 28ga. I can't speak for other gages
Should use drill press stop
What specific GAEP are you using there? One of the BN models (1,2,3,4) or the OTP model?
OTP ebay
Trouble I have with roll crimps is the “one and done” part of it. I have never managed to have a reusable hull from a roll crimp in either .410 or 28ga.
Totally get that! For my turkey loads I'm usually okay with it and like to stuff the beard of the bird inside the spent hull for a plaque mount. At least I get a little more "use" after I pop the primer :)
This isn't the first video I've seen on roll crimping with overshot cards -- but I've never seen a good explanation of why this time consuming process is more desirable than a fold crimp (especially given that commercial shells, even with tungsten shot, are almost universally fold crimped for efficiency reasons). I'm relatively new to loading shotshells -- I've loaded metallic cartridges for decades, but this is a somewhat different process -- so maybe I'm missing something?
Great question. The biggest reason for roll crimping w/ overshot cards is to reduce the pressure of the load.
Most TSS loads, specifically turkey loads like the ones we load in this video, are packing substantially more total weight in payload vs lead, due to the extreme density of TSS. Most TSS manufactures claim TSS is 222% denser than standard tungsten and 50%+ more dense than lead.
A standard 28 gauge lead shot shell is 3/4oz to 7/8oz and a few 1oz loads, the majority being 3/4oz. This load is 1 3/8oz and there are even 28 gauge loads going to 1 1/2 oz.
Simply put, the volume capacity of most shot shell wads only hold so much, be that lead, TSS, steel, bismuth, etc., but if you increase the total weight of the shot inside the wad, even if it's the same overall volume, you increase the pressure of the shell.
Short answer gone long.. the primary reason is to keep shot shell pressures safe and within SAAMI specifications of the corresponding gauge and TSS is much more dense and roll crimping keeps pressures down.
If you get a chance to flip through some shot shell manuals, give the load data a look as far as pressure. It's amazing how one small thing can really make a difference. Hope this helps!
@@finalrise So a roll crimp opens with less resistance (when the round fires) than a fold crimp? Good to know. That would surely explain why I normally only see them on slugs, buckshot, cut-down short shells, and heavy hunting loads.
Since I (at present) only shoot skeet (and hopefully soon trap) and have no reason in those sports to pound my shoulder, I'll stick with the nice neat fold crimps my Load All II produces without any extra effort.
@@SilntObsvr - yes sir, you're absoluetely correct!
I'm right there with you on sporting loads. I have a few MEC Jr's I use for my 28 and .410 field loads and they, like the Lee Load Alls, make loading a breeze!
Best of luck on the reloading journey. Always fun to 'do it yourself' and have that extra touch of fulfillment when you shoot good score at the range and in the field.
@@finalrise Well, still working on the "shoot good score" -- but once I have a good load (probably 1 1/8 ounce of #9 at about 1100) that doesn't beat me up or cost a mint (with reused hulls and buying 1000 primers at a time, I can get down below 40 cents, just about the same as Fiocchi, Rio, or Estate target loads if I get them the right place) I'll be able to shoot more. And that's how you get better, right?
First time out for skeet I broke *one* target in two rounds (50 targets offered). Second time out, a couple weeks ago, I broke around ten in each of three rounds (but shooting all the pairs as singles). A little calculation (shot flight time and target speed are known, compensate for angle of travel) makes a big difference. Now I need to work on pumping the slide for the pairs, probably starting with loading two for the singles.
Yeah, I should have a double gun or semi for clay sports -- but that's half a year's shooting budget even for a bottom end Turkish model.
Beginner really now
I've been reloading custom rounds for over 40 years while buyin factory ammo at the same time. Since the plandemic put the kibosh on ammo and reloading supplies availability and the prices have gone astronomical, I've been reloading exclusively using components that I spent 30 years stacking. Tungsten wasn't much of a thing when I was buying and stocking up on shot so all I have is lead and a little steel shot and that's what I use for my reloads. I'm not about to go spend the money to get some now either, if it can even be found. I have plenty of paid for lead and that's gonna have to do.
That's no joke brother. That was a wild couple years and the ripple effects are still being felt. Good to see the availability slowly recovering on things so we can get back to tinkering and having a good time at the range!
Like you said...all we have to have happen now is those major ammo manufacturers stop buying up EVERY SINGLE 410 HULL that comes off the line and let us little guys have some to load too. It's just ridiculous anymore
You aren't kidding brother. I did see some TPS wads for 28 today. Scooped up a bag and a few hulls. No luck on the .410 stuff though.. SMH
To the manufacturers (of the hulls, of the finished shells, etc.) it's all about money. Yes, they'd charge us more for 100 hulls than they do the shell makers (assuming they aren't filling both roles), but they save on shipping, packaging, storage -- selling a whole run of .410 hulls in a rail car or two costs them a lot less and assures they'll sell what they've made. Even if they ultimately make more profit selling to us, it's likely a better "business decision" to sell to the shell maker.
Then again, if they're like Federal or Remington and make the hulls and load them all in house, once again they make a lot more profit on a pallet of finished shells than they do on a pallet of primed hulls...
شكثر يهرمل دخيل ربه
Wut
How the hell you make a 30min vid of 5 second job?!?
Anything worth learning, is worth learning in depth, if it's of actual interest. Plenty of other videos out there with lots of 'show' and no ' tell'. If you're after good, safe and consistent reloading results, it's worth the watch. If you don't want to learn why or how, buy a box online. World would be pretty boring if we were all the same.
Let's be honest, you couldn't do it in 15 seconds let alone 5.
Don't be a mouthy prick.
I'm not even 5 minutes in and I'm already done...