Thank you so much for making these videos. You didn't have to take your time to teach the world to hammer. Without people like you, the human race would have perished from the earth.
Thanks Sage. I appreciated your real time cadence with the multiprocess techniques. I learned a lot and will try to apply on my projects. Your skill and technique are impressive and your generosity with them is bracing.
my blacksmith friend next door send me this site as something broke my glass bird feeder, the video was one of the best I have seen. I am good wood worker and I am sure with a little practice and help from my friend I with have that bird bath plus a lot more projects to use with my wood working. Thank you for the help.
What great music comes from your hammering mate. Excellent rhythm, full Body sound with a deep kick and the the pitch is elevating as you rotate the disc and truly working that turntable.
Hi: Your videos are very helpful. This method is considerably better than using sand bags - faster and more effective. I am just starting to learn and experiment with forming bowls and the like. Thanks for sharing!
I am using 18 gauge in the video, 18 and 20 gauge will give you enough metal to work with. If you are going to decorate with chasing use the18g which will allow for a higher relief. 20 g will be fine for most applications and shaping operations AND it will be a substantial vessel when you are finished. you can also decorate the 20g with stamps if you so desire.
A viewer recommended www.riogrande.com/category/metals/base-metals/copper, but they only have 3"&6". 18 gague as their biggest and it's labled as half hard? Around 15$ per
This is great! we are going to make our own copper sinks for our skoolie build instead of buying them! We will give your technique a go for the bathroom vessel sink! Thanks for sharing @Sage Reynolds! - Erin + Brian too
It's one thing to make a small bowl and entirely another to make something as large as a sink. Try a small piece first and see if you can do it. I think there are videos of some Mexicans making large pieces like sinks on TH-cam that will give you an idea of how to handle large pieces of copper. Thanks for watching and good luck with your project.
This reminded me of Summer Camp. I was 6,7 and 8 years old when I went and we made ashtrays like this. Copper and Ceramic. That was the mid 60s. Today it would probably be considered corrupting the morals of a minor :P
Very nice video. Look forward to more! I don’t know if this is relevant; (I’m old! Lol) but as a young man I went to one of the finest auto-body schools in the country. They had us hold the hammer with the thumb at the 12 o’clockwork and directly aimed at the workpiece. The degree of control was much finer. Keep ‘em coming!
It was called Vale Technical Institute. Located in Southwestern Pennsylvania. The problem is I’m so old now I really can’t recall if it was the thumb or the index finger. Try one then the other. You’ll know instantly the difference in control.
Thank you I'm using a 4" wood dapping block and was trying to figure out how to get rid of the dipples. Now I know I need to keep hammering. I'm using to working with 1-1.5" circles which is easier with my steel punches.
Very quick work and nice work, would help you if you polish your hammer head a little better, even with that you smoothed it out very nicely. Thanks for the video.
Thanks for your answer,bloody hell I asked this a year ago!! time fly's :O , yes aluminium is a funny material,can be a right pain in the arse to weld at times but very satisfying.
Long time no see Sage. You don't know my name, but we talked about pasting book blocks in, when I wasn't sure how to make the paste some years ago. Who would have thought we'll meet again. Now I'm exploring ways to make kojiri for a japanese knife/sword I forged during last months. I managed to make a kashira, which is basically a copper cup, but kojiri is more of a challenge, also because I'm trying to make it in mild steel by cold forging, but I can tell my techniques are wrong. Keep up the good work.
Thanks for the message. I don't know what Kojiri is so I'll look it up. I keep brushing up against blacksmiths and need some of the basic skills to make tools that I use in silversmith work. I have great admiration for the Iron working blacksmiths, the precision and demands for making multiples has me enthralled and then there's the Damascus steel and knife makers. . . Hope you are enjoying yourself. If you need some chased decorative work keep me in mind. Take care, Sage
***** I mostly make edged tools. Few knifes, plane irons, chisels, drawknifes and such. Some unusual stuff too, like a bent 'saya nomi' chisel, or a 'sen' which is basically a drawknife for use on steel. Also stuff like punches, fire starting steels. All that's pretty simple, since I've been doing it for a year now, and don't even own a proper anvil as prices here in europe are enormous(400$ for a beat up 100lb? Not for a college student for sure). I wouldn't call myself a blacksmith, since I don't have much experience, but creating either beautiful or useful items is a thrill, as you know. I needed to make a scabbard, so I had to plane some wood - I built a hand plane and forged an iron for it. Needed to chisel out a cavity in the scabbard, forged a saya nomi, and so on. I love how I find projects inside projects. First draw knife I forged was for that scabbard too. As for the kojiri, look for the fish hook type ones. Probably easy to make if you have a punch and die, but it's not worth making them, since it's one job, so I decided to explore rasing and sinking. Even if I won't make that piece, I'll learn something new. And if it'll work with thin mild steel... well, I've got some of it stashed in my workshop :) Take care, R.
Ah, also one more thing I forgot to write. You said that you want to pick up some blacksmithing skills. While I'm not a greatly experienced in blacksmithing, feel free to ask anything you might want to know. I do simple stuff, but still, first hand experience is gold. I had to spend months to figure out why my forge wasn't working. Somebody who actually did this would go "hey, you need more pressure and a bigger firepot" and hey presto : ) That being said, I won't be able to help you with propane forges, but bituminous coal, anthracite, charcoal, feel free to drop me a PM. Same things about basic steel, heat treatment and tools. Sadly I won't be there to help you in person, but I can tell you who will be. :) Raph.
Awesome! Could this work with a much larger piece of copper sheet? I want a copper sink for my sink, but they're very expensive. Thanks for the video, you did a great job.
Yes there are many tools to use doing this; this video was made in my early days. When doing silver I used a bossing mallet, sometimes I need the extra weight of the ball peen hammer. Being done in a wooden depression there is no thinning of the metal regardless of the hitting device. I think it is preference and circumstance (material) for this stage of making a vessel. I appreciste your comment, Thanks for watching.
@@Ceropegia Extra weight? Bigger mallet. I make my own mallets and the choice of timbers for the head and the size of the head comes into it. Being in Australia we are 'blessed ?' with a vast array of 'hard as all fuck' timbers easily sourced. In fact most of the timbers I use come from my own back yard.
Fantastic vid and thanks for uploading!,until now i have been looking for a tutorial like this for a while now although i would like to ask can this technique be used for other metals like aluminium or steel,i assume it could but your opinion would be appreciated as im looking forward to trying this myself to use for medievil style armour :)
The Ball Peen end of the hammer is flattened a little. If it was a true ball shape the dent would be much smaller, this can also be done with a convex shaped raising hammer but I didn't have one at that time. Thanks for your careful watching.
I always anneal first, no matter what. And I always use pear shaped wooden hammers. Why? To not get any thin spots. And it also lessens the amount of annealing you have to do.
Your use of a mallet is fine, the hammer will not thin the metal unless it is struck onto a metal base, that's why I am using a stump. Thanks for watching.
Seems you are doing it backwards. Every single thing I've read or watched says to start in the center and work out. You don't get the wrinkles and folds the way you did by going the opposite way...
You’d think but it’s actually counterintuitive to do it that way, it makes it harder to raise because it becomes work hardened too quickly pushing from the centre, so much more depth can be achieved with the outside in and that also lowers the chance of tearing through the middle Plus you can fix the wrinkles in about 2 minutes as seen in the video
Have you tried Metalliferous online? It is often less expensive to buy sheet and cut the circles you need. I find that I am doing that more and more because I need specific diameters and finding the disks has been difficult for many years now. Good luck and thanks for watching.
nice vid man I’m starting to get into this stuff , copper is such a great metal to work with, have yo ever made a copper dolphin , my mom loves them and I wanna make her one , any tips or any vids I should check out
I used a wood gouge, which is a chisel with a bend in it, and a mallet to make a rough shaped bowl and then used a convex faced hammer to smooth it oit a little. The depression smooths out as you use it to sink vessels. Thanks for watching.
I used a wood carver's gouge with a mallet, shaving little bits at a time from a circle that I had drawn on the stump. It's about half an inch deep at the center. It doesn't have to be perfect, it will even out as you use it. Thanks for watching.
***** thanks so much for letting me know! My Father has a router and we were going to try using it as per Ganoksin - but I really appreciate your insight!
Juliette, regarding the beads on my latest blog post, yes--they are translucent Premo clay with oil paint. All my polymer pieces are surface-colored. Say "hello" to Nevada City for me--I love that little town!
floopy312 Copper is very pliable but work hardens and can become hard and brittle as it is hammered/bent. This is fixed by annealing the metal, which is to bring it up to a certain range of temperature which will cause the structure of the metal to relax, softening it.
Julia Macdonald thank you ,it’s difficult to see what thickness is needed I’ve pin holed my first one trying about 2 millimetres Thick so far , I guess practice more and maybe get some better hammers🙂
The copper was not thinned by sinking in the stump. And as the cup was raised on an iron stake, the metal remained 18 gauge all over. If metal is moved properly it will not be thinned. thanks for watching.
Thanks for the great tutorial. Would this process work for sheet steel as well, to make a shield with a large dishing stump, or would I need to heat the steel as I go along? The curve would be a lot more shallow if that makes any difference.
I have not worked with steel but other people have and used similar techniques. You should try with a smaller piece of steel first. I'm not sure about annealing the metal. You might find a blacksmith as there are many steel alloys and you'll probably get a better answer. Thanks for watching.
Yes, you can, start with a smaller disk, say 2.5 - 3 inches. Be advised that working that small is difficult. You will need a smaller diameter stake for raising and a small flat top stake to set the base. I have done a few small cups and they are difficult to hold while hammering, if you are making a short glass it might be more useful to do it in silver. Good luck and thank you for watching.
how much did the disk shrink from planishing before annealing? I'm curious. I'm starting a project and am wondering how much to compensate for. did it remain same diameter?
Copper, being a pure metal will take more hammering than an alloy like sterling silver. I am using a ball peen hammer on the copper over a wooden surface, the ball peen spreads the pressure in the metal wider than a raising hammer so the metal is not truly work hardened and I can make a second round. Using a raising hammer on a metal stake hardens the metal more and annealing is necessary to continue raising, however you can go lightly over the surface with a planishing hammer to flatten some areas where the metal may have bunched up, especially the edges before annealing. Thanks for watching.
If you follow what I do in the video , working from the outside edge you should be able to get it going. It won't be very deep until you start to raise it. Thanks for watching.
John, The leather sand bag will not give a consistent surface and curve against which to strike. The goal at this point is to stretch the metal a little and give it a uniform shape from which to raise the beaker. Since the beaker will go through 5-7 annealing-raising cycles hammer marks, at this point, are not an issue.
Hi Sage Thanks for answering my question because I found your video interesting because I was trained to do copper work many years ago in my apprenticeship. We used hard leather sandbags, which you initially form a depression to work in. We were trained to use a round domed mallet to raise the copper disc into a bowl, beaker, goblet etc.
+Math.S The curve and depth of the depression is more important than the actual diameter. You want something that is near the size of the piece you are working on and not to deep for starting and if you are smoothing out you need a hammer or mallet with a convex face and a depression that is close to the final curvature of the bowl. It all depends on whether you are raising a vessel or making a shallower bowl, doing it a few times and trying different depressions will answer a lot of your questions. Thanks for watching!
+barronredneck _Mallet and gouge, (curved chisel). The depression does not have to be perfectly smooth. Use will flatten any little irregularities. Thanks for watching!
Some hardware stores carry sheets of copper but you can also go to places like riogrande.com & search for copper. Usually if you live in a fair sized city, 20k+, you will have metal supply shops that have a good selection to choose from.
+Erika Heinen You could probably get some thiong this large close to a hemisphere, but you will need a deeper and more perfect depression. To get a true half globe shape you should do some raising and careful planishing. Thanks for watching!
+Sage Reynolds here's the thing, I'm in art metals 101 at my school and I don't know much yet. x.x I'm not sure if my teacher would allow me to do what you demonstrated. She only showed us hemisphering, sinking, and a couple of other forming techniques. I want to make a pumpkin and she said it'll be very challenging, but I want to try to do it! I want the top of the pumpkin, where the stump is to come off, so the entire thing acts as a box with a removable lid. So I'm kind of trying to form a little cauldron type of shape.
What you want to do is challenging. Especially making the top and bottom work together. Try to raise a few simple vessels first and get to know your hammers and what they will do. I made a silver teapot body that is more of a topless sphere shape, it took me ten weeks from a 7" disk. Look at some of the shapes in my video on metal work projects 2012 and you will also get an idea of what ribs and gadrooning look like on smaller bowl. There are also still shots on my Face book pages, and in the Face Book Silversmith Gallery. Good luck, take your time a keep that goal in mind.
You use a double strike. Are both strikes in the same place and strength? Is this the preferred method, or a personal thing to maintain a rhythm? Take care.
I am striking in two different places as I turn the metal. Once to bend the metal and the second strike is slightly forward or inside so I don't have to advance the metal with each strike. This is my method that, for me , works very well. You will notice that I am always moving the metal especially on the second round from the center. I am constantly watching the reflections and aiming to flatten any high area to smooth the surface. It is subtle movement and a beginner should probably move a little more slowly and deliberately, it takes a while to figure out where the hammer is striking and in the beginning I had to be conscious of what each strike did, strike and look, strike and watch for the last mark made. As I made more vessels the striking became faster as confidence and control became a part of raising a vessel. You never stop watching and your control gets better all the time. Thanks for watching.
I home school my children and we've combined different classes that has led to a very interesting project. We have built a complete homemade drum set. I'm at the limit of my knowledge when figuring out how to construct a crash symbol. I purchased 2 very thin decorative brass/copper plates (only type I could find)they are too thin to be suitable. My question to you you, is there a way to solder/weld the 2 thin plates together to create a cymbol w a decent ring? I've shaped and planished them smooth but asi mentioned they are far to thin. When you strike them even lightly they sent/crush at the POI. Any advice or suggestions keeping in mind I must use these we've reach our budget limit. This is all I have to work with so I must find a way to make them work. Respectfully yours, Teacher Dad
symbols are brass and are formed by what is called spinning. The brass is forced into shape on a lathe. Your not going to get a symbol tone from sheet copper.
Thank you so much for these videos. I've been trying my hand at it. I've been trying to replicate the cup vessel you did the video on and I can't get it to chase all the way up. It seems like I've got too much material at the top. Started with the same diameter disc. Any suggestions? Thank you so much once again.
Hi Greg, without pictures I can't really say what is happening. If I could see the cup you're working on I will be able to suggest something. There are too many variables from the stake and hammer to the force you use to strike the metal. Also the angle you hold while striking, beginners often have difficulty to raise and close the diameter because they are not yet aware of how to hold the cup on the stake, it will take about three cups to get the movement, angle and striking coordinated. If you could send a photo I might be able to suggest something more specific.
I don't know how to insert a photo into this comment section, but I can tell you I gave up on the cup in this case and left it as a flared bowl, wide flutes at the top and flame painted it.
you can send me email, other viewers have found my address, I also have facebook and instagram, I don't want to post it here as there would be too many requests...
Metal spinning is another trade, I don't have a lathe or access to one. So the answer is no. Also, my needs are for one of a kind cups and bowls , not multiples of the same thing ( even if I do make sets of 5 and pairs of cups) which would make sense for spinning. Thanks for watching.
Do you keep a rhythm intentionally or is it just coincidence? Thanks for making the video! I’ve always been interested in copper smithing but never really watched much on it. I guess because there isn’t much on it!
After you know what you are doing, the rhythm builds as you are moving the copper and striking in coordinated movements. Everyone will strike to their own rhythm and depending on what they are doing there will be breaks as decisions are being made constantly. Thanks for watching.
The copper I buy is soft to begin with. You may have to anneal if the metal is not working for you like it does in this video. You will have to anneal after this initial phase and all after all subsequent rounds. Thanks for watching.
Current coppersmith, totally agree! Even half soft copper will eventually work harden and split with ease. I make copper cylinders for a living, I often get asked 'can you weld copper' lol In my opinion it is very similar to welding aluminium!
+Tanya McCormick This was awhile ago, I was using 18 for most of my work early on but this could be 20 as I use 20 for all but large pieces now. Thanks for watching!
+Sage Reynolds, Wonderful thank you. I also want to say that this is a great series of video tutorials, I am a copper jewellery designer and have watched several videos on techniques and I find yours very insightful and easy to follow. Great Job! I can't wait to explore the rest of your videos
This is a great little tutorial! I did this in college and want to get back into it but that was quite a while ago so my brain needs some refreshing! I never used a stump before (I used a mushroom stake) so I am excited to try this method :-) What gauge copper did you use? Thank you for making it seem manageable!
This is only the first step in raising a cup. The center is needed for raising on a stake and for setting the base. If I was making a bowl it wouldn't be necessary unless I planned to chase a design and put in rims and borders. Thanks for watching.
@@Ceropegia I was wondering too, because the marked center was facing away from you. Beautiful piece of copper. Isn't Copper expensive now? I kind of want to have a fork and spoon made by a metalsmith or whoever does that sort of thing. I have this image in my head.
The first marks left a hollow space (kind of triangle), the divider adjustment put a mark into the center of that space from which I could determine the center. Thanks for the question and thanks for watching.
Is it possible to make something like a helmet using this technique? If I make the right sized sink and a wide enough piece of metal, could I bring the sides in enough to make a sufficient helmet dome?
You can make the helmet or components that will be riveted or soldered together to make a finished helmet. You won't need a larger sink but you will need a larger piece of metal. It's too complicated to discuss here, Try looking at info about raising vessels (which is not far from the helmet shape). Thanks for watching.
I may have commented on this video before. If you use dividers to score a center then use a center punch , you are in danger of causing your work to split along the scribe lines and center punch mark. How do I know? I did the same when I raised a complicated oval teapot in silver when I was an apprentice. Fortunately the company I was apprenticed to accepted the cost of starting again. I only suffered embarrassment and wasted hours of hard work. Please never use a sharp point on copper / silver or gold if you are that fortunate. A pencil compass is by far the best thing to use.
Thank you for the warning. I have been doing it this way for about 12 years and have never had that happen in more than 100 vessels and cups. I'm working primarily 18 and 20 gauge metal and that may have something to do with my work not splitting. My scores are very light, just enough to see. When I am raising and need guide lines, I do use a compass and pencil or sharpie on the sides of the vessel. Thanks for watching.
I'am English but live in France and went on an educational course for aircraft aluminium work. We were taught to shrink over a ball rather than in a hollow and for me it seems to be more precise.However, the French don't seem to know about electrolitic reactions. They use pencils and felt tip pens on the aluminium and DO NOT understand the consequences. I once saw a photo of the fuselage of a deHavilland Comet that had depressurised after 20 years of service because someone had drawn a circle on the fuselage with a pencil during construction. The result was a very nice round hole. Not one of the French people I contacted,Airbus,SOCATA or the instructors who taught me had any idea of this .I have a very good friend who is an engineer at Rolls Royce who told me that pencils are not allowed in British aircraft factories for this very reason. When will others learn.
Thank you so much for making these videos. You didn't have to take your time to teach the world to hammer. Without people like you, the human race would have perished from the earth.
Lindas palabras y dices toda la verdad !!!
Thanks Sage. I appreciated your real time cadence with the multiprocess techniques. I learned a lot and will try to apply on my projects. Your skill and technique are impressive and your generosity with them is bracing.
Thank You Matt
my blacksmith friend next door send me this site as something broke my glass bird feeder, the video was one of the best I have seen. I am good wood worker and I am sure with a little practice and help from my friend I with have that bird bath plus a lot more projects to use with my wood working. Thank you for the help.
Really nice to see how you work and explain what you’re doing and the sound of the hammer is all the music l need
I love the videos!! I am a self taught Jeweler and metalsmith and enjoy seeing what everyone else is doing!
What great music comes from your hammering mate. Excellent rhythm, full Body sound with a deep kick and the the pitch is elevating as you rotate the disc and truly working that turntable.
Hi: Your videos are very helpful. This method is considerably better than using sand bags - faster and more effective. I am just starting to learn and experiment with forming bowls and the like. Thanks for sharing!
I am using 18 gauge in the video, 18 and 20 gauge will give you enough metal to work with. If you are going to decorate with chasing use the18g which will allow for a higher relief. 20 g will be fine for most applications and shaping operations AND it will be a substantial vessel when you are finished. you can also decorate the 20g with stamps if you so desire.
A viewer recommended www.riogrande.com/category/metals/base-metals/copper, but they only have 3"&6". 18 gague as their biggest and it's labled as half hard? Around 15$ per
We did that in Jr. High metal shop. Called it a candy dish, or an ash tray if Dad got to it before Ma.
This is great! we are going to make our own copper sinks for our skoolie build instead of buying them! We will give your technique a go for the bathroom vessel sink! Thanks for sharing @Sage Reynolds! - Erin + Brian too
It's one thing to make a small bowl and entirely another to make something as large as a sink. Try a small piece first and see if you can do it. I think there are videos of some Mexicans making large pieces like sinks on TH-cam that will give you an idea of how to handle large pieces of copper. Thanks for watching and good luck with your project.
This reminded me of Summer Camp. I was 6,7 and 8 years old when I went and we made ashtrays like this. Copper and Ceramic. That was the mid 60s. Today it would probably be considered corrupting the morals of a minor :P
lol
John Di Francisco Sigh, why didn’t we have that at camp? So much time wasted not knowing. You were blessd.
Very nice video. Look forward to more! I don’t know if this is relevant; (I’m old! Lol) but as a young man I went to one of the finest auto-body schools in the country. They had us hold the hammer with the thumb at the 12 o’clockwork and directly aimed at the workpiece. The degree of control was much finer. Keep ‘em coming!
What was the school?
It was called Vale Technical Institute. Located in Southwestern Pennsylvania.
The problem is I’m so old now I really can’t recall if it was the thumb or the index finger.
Try one then the other. You’ll know instantly the difference in control.
Thank you I'm using a 4" wood dapping block and was trying to figure out how to get rid of the dipples. Now I know I need to keep hammering. I'm using to working with 1-1.5" circles which is easier with my steel punches.
Thanks for watching!
Nice work...thanks for sharing....looks like fun and rewarding...........
Great demonstration and lesson. tyvm
thanks for the video, this is helpful info.
that was a nice reggae beat there had me busting a dance while I watch
I’m going to fall asleep listening to that tapping lol
Thank you for sharing
reminds me of High School but we had hardened steel instead of a wood stump
gr8 job tyvm for sharing
Nice I was a blacksmith.. I would have started from near to the centre depending upon what base you wanted ..
My new passion! Thank you! :))))
Very quick work and nice work, would help you if you polish your hammer head a little better, even with that you smoothed it out very nicely. Thanks for the video.
Thank you for sharing your wonderful skill and craft....very much!
Excellent craftsmanship buddy. 🤔
Thanks for uploading! Very informative 👍
Thanks for watching.
Love the simple tools and the beautiful outcome. What is the best method for making the indentation in the piece of wood?
it's pretty. I like copper too
so you do need to go back and anneal it. that was something i was wondering about.
as im sure if the copper were overworked it would eventually tear.
Good work and thanks for the tutorial.
Thanks for your answer,bloody hell I asked this a year ago!! time fly's :O , yes aluminium is a funny material,can be a right pain in the arse to weld at times but very satisfying.
Very nice tutorial.
Thank you very much.
Then how you polish it to mirror surface you use a grinder stone a brush or a liquid
Nice beginners tutorial. Thank you!
WOW !! Very interesting !
Long time no see Sage. You don't know my name, but we talked about pasting book blocks in, when I wasn't sure how to make the paste some years ago. Who would have thought we'll meet again. Now I'm exploring ways to make kojiri for a japanese knife/sword I forged during last months. I managed to make a kashira, which is basically a copper cup, but kojiri is more of a challenge, also because I'm trying to make it in mild steel by cold forging, but I can tell my techniques are wrong. Keep up the good work.
Thanks for the message. I don't know what Kojiri is so I'll look it up. I keep brushing up against blacksmiths and need some of the basic skills to make tools that I use in silversmith work. I have great admiration for the Iron working blacksmiths, the precision and demands for making multiples has me enthralled and then there's the Damascus steel and knife makers. . . Hope you are enjoying yourself. If you need some chased decorative work keep me in mind. Take care, Sage
***** I mostly make edged tools. Few knifes, plane irons, chisels, drawknifes and such. Some unusual stuff too, like a bent 'saya nomi' chisel, or a 'sen' which is basically a drawknife for use on steel. Also stuff like punches, fire starting steels. All that's pretty simple, since I've been doing it for a year now, and don't even own a proper anvil as prices here in europe are enormous(400$ for a beat up 100lb? Not for a college student for sure). I wouldn't call myself a blacksmith, since I don't have much experience, but creating either beautiful or useful items is a thrill, as you know. I needed to make a scabbard, so I had to plane some wood - I built a hand plane and forged an iron for it. Needed to chisel out a cavity in the scabbard, forged a saya nomi, and so on. I love how I find projects inside projects. First draw knife I forged was for that scabbard too. As for the kojiri, look for the fish hook type ones. Probably easy to make if you have a punch and die, but it's not worth making them, since it's one job, so I decided to explore rasing and sinking. Even if I won't make that piece, I'll learn something new. And if it'll work with thin mild steel... well, I've got some of it stashed in my workshop :) Take care, R.
Ah, also one more thing I forgot to write. You said that you want to pick up some blacksmithing skills. While I'm not a greatly experienced in blacksmithing, feel free to ask anything you might want to know. I do simple stuff, but still, first hand experience is gold. I had to spend months to figure out why my forge wasn't working. Somebody who actually did this would go "hey, you need more pressure and a bigger firepot" and hey presto : ) That being said, I won't be able to help you with propane forges, but bituminous coal, anthracite, charcoal, feel free to drop me a PM. Same things about basic steel, heat treatment and tools. Sadly I won't be there to help you in person, but I can tell you who will be. :)
Raph.
I’m gonna sub. Thanks for the tutorial!
Beautiful piece of art. For those of us who don't have a tree stump with the indent, what would you recommend? Thank you.
Awesome! Could this work with a much larger piece of copper sheet? I want a copper sink for my sink, but they're very expensive. Thanks for the video, you did a great job.
How did you cut that perfect round? Thank you!
very nice art
Very helpful video, thank you!
Excellent tutorial, thanks for making it. If I wanted to make a bowl, say 12 inches in diameter, what size disk should I begin with?
Two words: Bossing Mallet!
Yes there are many tools to use doing this; this video was made in my early days. When doing silver I used a bossing mallet, sometimes I need the extra weight of the ball peen hammer. Being done in a wooden depression there is no thinning of the metal regardless of the hitting device. I think it is preference and circumstance (material) for this stage of making a vessel.
I appreciste your comment, Thanks for watching.
@@Ceropegia Extra weight? Bigger mallet. I make my own mallets and the choice of timbers for the head and the size of the head comes into it. Being in Australia we are 'blessed ?' with a vast array of 'hard as all fuck' timbers easily sourced. In fact most of the timbers I use come from my own back yard.
Fantastic vid and thanks for uploading!,until now i have been looking for a tutorial like this for a while now although i would like to ask can this technique be used for other metals like aluminium or steel,i assume it could but your opinion would be appreciated as im looking forward to trying this myself to use for medievil style armour :)
....It appears as if the "ball pien" isn't very smooth in shape!... it looks like it is imparting a bit of a sharp dent, with each blow.
The Ball Peen end of the hammer is flattened a little. If it was a true ball shape the dent would be much smaller, this can also be done with a convex shaped raising hammer but I didn't have one at that time. Thanks for your careful watching.
I always anneal first, no matter what. And I always use pear shaped wooden hammers. Why? To not get any thin spots. And it also lessens the amount of annealing you have to do.
Your use of a mallet is fine, the hammer will not thin the metal unless it is struck onto a metal base, that's why I am using a stump. Thanks for watching.
Seems you are doing it backwards. Every single thing I've read or watched says to start in the center and work out. You don't get the wrinkles and folds the way you did by going the opposite way...
You’d think but it’s actually counterintuitive to do it that way, it makes it harder to raise because it becomes work hardened too quickly pushing from the centre, so much more depth can be achieved with the outside in and that also lowers the chance of tearing through the middle
Plus you can fix the wrinkles in about 2 minutes as seen in the video
I prefer to take a heavier hammer and forge harder. This product can be forged in 2 minutes.
The perpendicular bisector of a chord is the diameter
I love raising but I do not have the equipment to do things like that these days. 😥
Welcom my steiner childeren
Any idea on where to buy these disc's not at $22 each per disk?
Have you tried Metalliferous online? It is often less expensive to buy sheet and cut the circles you need. I find that I am doing that more and more because I need specific diameters and finding the disks has been difficult for many years now. Good luck and thanks for watching.
nice vid man I’m starting to get into this stuff , copper is such a great metal to work with, have yo ever made a copper dolphin , my mom loves them and I wanna make her one , any tips or any vids I should check out
How did you hollow out the stump it looks smooth and precise. I have always wondered how they did copper that way. Great video. Thanks
I used a wood gouge, which is a chisel with a bend in it, and a mallet to make a rough shaped bowl and then used a convex faced hammer to smooth it oit a little. The depression smooths out as you use it to sink vessels. Thanks for watching.
any relation to the wrap?
cool! what thickness of copper sheet did you use?
how are you making the depression in your wood? I want to make my own, and am not sure what tool to use.
I used a wood carver's gouge with a mallet, shaving little bits at a time from a circle that I had drawn on the stump. It's about half an inch deep at the center. It doesn't have to be perfect, it will even out as you use it.
Thanks for watching.
***** thanks so much for letting me know! My Father has a router and we were going to try using it as per Ganoksin - but I really appreciate your insight!
Juliette, regarding the beads on my latest blog post, yes--they are translucent Premo clay with oil paint. All my polymer pieces are surface-colored.
Say "hello" to Nevada City for me--I love that little town!
bonnybrookmuggsy Thanks so much! They are gorgeous beads! Nevada City says 'Hello!!" to you :)
So this is how was like to make tools during the copper age... I didn't know copper was so easily pliable.
floopy312 Copper is very pliable but work hardens and can become hard and brittle as it is hammered/bent. This is fixed by annealing the metal, which is to bring it up to a certain range of temperature which will cause the structure of the metal to relax, softening it.
What thickness of copper sheet was this? Do you cut the disc yourself and if so how do you? Many thanks
Hi sage you’re work is beautiful ,I’m gonna have a go myself but what thickness copper will I need?
David Gibbings 20 gauge I’d recommend. Otherwise you’d be annealing very often.
Julia Macdonald thank you ,it’s difficult to see what thickness is needed I’ve pin holed my first one trying about 2 millimetres Thick so far , I guess practice more and maybe get some better hammers🙂
How thick is the disc?
Please read the first comment below. Thanks for watching.
How thick was your copper when you started?
I used to start off by sinking. I stopped, because the metal is “pushed out” and thinned. I have gone to using wood stakes.
The copper was not thinned by sinking in the stump. And as the cup was raised on an iron stake, the metal remained 18 gauge all over. If metal is moved properly it will not be thinned. thanks for watching.
Sage Reynolds Thank you for your reply. Sometimes, the sides actually thicken. If you like, I will give you my email and exchange photos.
How thick was your copper when you started and where can you get it
Please read the comment below. I get the copper from Metalliferous online. Thanks for watching.
Thanks for the great tutorial. Would this process work for sheet steel as well, to make a shield with a large dishing stump, or would I need to heat the steel as I go along? The curve would be a lot more shallow if that makes any difference.
I have not worked with steel but other people have and used similar techniques. You should try with a smaller piece of steel first. I'm not sure about annealing the metal. You might find a blacksmith as there are many steel alloys and you'll probably get a better answer. Thanks for watching.
I was going to use a pre-annealed .025" sheet of 4130, so it should be soft enough to work hopefully. Thanks for the response!
Could this be done so extremely as to fashion a copper shot glass?
Yes, you can, start with a smaller disk, say 2.5 - 3 inches. Be advised that working that small is difficult. You will need a smaller diameter stake for raising and a small flat top stake to set the base. I have done a few small cups and they are difficult to hold while hammering, if you are making a short glass it might be more useful to do it in silver.
Good luck and thank you for watching.
how much did the disk shrink from planishing before annealing? I'm curious. I'm starting a project and am wondering how much to compensate for. did it remain same diameter?
Why didn’t you anneal it after found the center?
Copper, being a pure metal will take more hammering than an alloy like sterling silver. I am using a ball peen hammer on the copper over a wooden surface, the ball peen spreads the pressure in the metal wider than a raising hammer so the metal is not truly work hardened and I can make a second round. Using a raising hammer on a metal stake hardens the metal more and annealing is necessary to continue raising, however you can go lightly over the surface with a planishing hammer to flatten some areas where the metal may have bunched up, especially the edges before annealing. Thanks for watching.
Ive been having a hard time getting my bowls to sink, does anyone have any tips I could try? Working a stump setup like this one atm
If you follow what I do in the video , working from the outside edge you should be able to get it going. It won't be very deep until you start to raise it. Thanks for watching.
@@Ceropegia my hammer was the issue I was having!
I am big famn of your book binding series -- can you show me how to bind books in metal?
Why don't you use a leather sandbag and a rounded mallet instead of the ball-pane hammer? That way you have less hammer marks on the copper.
John, The leather sand bag will not give a consistent surface and curve against which to strike. The goal at this point is to stretch the metal a little and give it a uniform shape from which to raise the beaker. Since the beaker will go through 5-7 annealing-raising cycles hammer marks, at this point, are not an issue.
Hi Sage
Thanks for answering my question because I found your video interesting because I was trained to do copper work many years ago in my apprenticeship. We used hard leather sandbags, which you initially form a depression to work in. We were trained to use a round domed mallet to raise the copper disc into a bowl, beaker, goblet etc.
does the size of the depresion makes a diffrent ?
+Math.S The curve and depth of the depression is more important than the actual diameter. You want something that is near the size of the piece you are working on and not to deep for starting and if you are smoothing out you need a hammer or mallet with a convex face and a depression that is close to the final curvature of the bowl.
It all depends on whether you are raising a vessel or making a shallower bowl, doing it a few times and trying different depressions will answer a lot of your questions.
Thanks for watching!
thanks i have allready maked two and it worked
NICE! you had reprofiled the head of your pien or not?
All I did was to polish it so that it would not add texture or marks on my work. Thanks for watching.
👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
stress work hardening the metal out. in turn is making the metal harder to work with.
Did you not hear him say, at the end of the video, he was going to anneal it?
how did you make the depression on the log?
+barronredneck _Mallet and gouge, (curved chisel). The depression does not have to be perfectly smooth. Use will flatten any little irregularities. Thanks for watching!
Metal Craft
This is not raising. This is dishing. I'm right?
In the title it says "Sinking" , Thanks for watching.
A ball pien should not leave gouges in the metal you need to make the end a ball.
Just polish it! I think he re profiled the pien for the end result.
Where do you get sheets of copper like that? Is that something I could buy from a hardware store?
Some hardware stores carry sheets of copper but you can also go to places like riogrande.com & search for copper. Usually if you live in a fair sized city, 20k+, you will have metal supply shops that have a good selection to choose from.
what about hemisphering it?? would that still work?
+Erika Heinen You could probably get some thiong this large close to a hemisphere, but you will need a deeper and more perfect depression. To get a true half globe shape you should do some raising and careful planishing.
Thanks for watching!
+Sage Reynolds here's the thing, I'm in art metals 101 at my school and I don't know much yet. x.x I'm not sure if my teacher would allow me to do what you demonstrated. She only showed us hemisphering, sinking, and a couple of other forming techniques. I want to make a pumpkin and she said it'll be very challenging, but I want to try to do it! I want the top of the pumpkin, where the stump is to come off, so the entire thing acts as a box with a removable lid. So I'm kind of trying to form a little cauldron type of shape.
What you want to do is challenging. Especially making the top and bottom work together. Try to raise a few simple vessels first and get to know your hammers and what they will do. I made a silver teapot body that is more of a topless sphere shape, it took me ten weeks from a 7" disk. Look at some of the shapes in my video on metal work projects 2012 and you will also get an idea of what ribs and gadrooning look like on smaller bowl. There are also still shots on my Face book pages, and in the Face Book Silversmith Gallery.
Good luck, take your time a keep that goal in mind.
You use a double strike.
Are both strikes in the same place and strength?
Is this the preferred method, or a personal thing to maintain a rhythm?
Take care.
I am striking in two different places as I turn the metal. Once to bend the metal and the second strike is slightly forward or inside so I don't have to advance the metal with each strike. This is my method that, for me , works very well. You will notice that I am always moving the metal especially on the second round from the center. I am constantly watching the reflections and aiming to flatten any high area to smooth the surface. It is subtle movement and a beginner should probably move a little more slowly and deliberately, it takes a while to figure out where the hammer is striking and in the beginning I had to be conscious of what each strike did, strike and look, strike and watch for the last mark made. As I made more vessels the striking became faster as confidence and control became a part of raising a vessel. You never stop watching and your control gets better all the time. Thanks for watching.
Im suprised you dont anneal the copper halfway through this proccess?
I home school my children and we've combined different classes that has led to a very interesting project. We have built a complete homemade drum set. I'm at the limit of my knowledge when figuring out how to construct a crash symbol. I purchased 2 very thin decorative brass/copper plates (only type I could find)they are too thin to be suitable. My question to you you, is there a way to solder/weld the 2 thin plates together to create a cymbol w a decent ring? I've shaped and planished them smooth but asi mentioned they are far to thin. When you strike them even lightly they sent/crush at the POI. Any advice or suggestions keeping in mind I must use these we've reach our budget limit. This is all I have to work with so I must find a way to make them work. Respectfully yours, Teacher Dad
symbols are brass and are formed by what is called spinning. The brass is forced into shape on a lathe. Your not going to get a symbol tone from sheet copper.
Thank you so much for these videos. I've been trying my hand at it. I've been trying to replicate the cup vessel you did the video on and I can't get it to chase all the way up. It seems like I've got too much material at the top. Started with the same diameter disc. Any suggestions? Thank you so much once again.
Hi Greg, without pictures I can't really say what is happening. If I could see the cup you're working on I will be able to suggest something. There are too many variables from the stake and hammer to the force you use to strike the metal. Also the angle you hold while striking, beginners often have difficulty to raise and close the diameter because they are not yet aware of how to hold the cup on the stake, it will take about three cups to get the movement, angle and striking coordinated. If you could send a photo I might be able to suggest something more specific.
I don't know how to insert a photo into this comment section, but I can tell you I gave up on the cup in this case and left it as a flared bowl, wide flutes at the top and flame painted it.
you can send me email, other viewers have found my address, I also have facebook and instagram, I don't want to post it here as there would be too many requests...
have you tried turning a copper cup?
Metal spinning is another trade, I don't have a lathe or access to one. So the answer is no. Also, my needs are for one of a kind cups and bowls , not multiples of the same thing ( even if I do make sets of 5 and pairs of cups) which would make sense for spinning. Thanks for watching.
@@Ceropegia I'm sure you could make one of a kind objects by spinning but was just wondering if you ever dabbled in it, keep up the good work
Do you keep a rhythm intentionally or is it just coincidence? Thanks for making the video! I’ve always been interested in copper smithing but never really watched much on it. I guess because there isn’t much on it!
After you know what you are doing, the rhythm builds as you are moving the copper and striking in coordinated movements. Everyone will strike to their own rhythm and depending on what they are doing there will be breaks as decisions are being made constantly. Thanks for watching.
Did you anneal before you started? Or did you hammer without annealing?
The copper I buy is soft to begin with. You may have to anneal if the metal is not working for you like it does in this video. You will have to anneal after this initial phase and all after all subsequent rounds. Thanks for watching.
it can be, aluminium gets really brittle and weird though.. i know you're not askin me but there's your answer lol
You would get better results using a mallet and annealing more often.
Regards, an ex- coppersmith.
hairyplums1 I keep waiting for the copper to tear at one of those creases.
Current coppersmith, totally agree! Even half soft copper will eventually work harden and split with ease. I make copper cylinders for a living, I often get asked 'can you weld copper' lol
In my opinion it is very similar to welding aluminium!
I can silver braze copper then electroplate with more copper, so it looks like one piece.
hairyplums1 what kind of mallet?
Park Inglot carpenter's wood mallet with flat face, then rounding one of them untill desired. If not, car shaping or silversmith's made of nylon
Forgive me for saying but that's called dishing not raideing you use stiles to raise metal ( impaments that goes in the hole of your anvil )
In America we call it Sinking as it says in the title. Did you read my description before you made the comment? Thanks for watching.
What gauge of copper are you using for this project?
+Tanya McCormick This was awhile ago, I was using 18 for most of my work early on but this could be 20 as I use 20 for all but large pieces now.
Thanks for watching!
+Sage Reynolds, Wonderful thank you. I also want to say that this is a great series of video tutorials, I am a copper jewellery designer and have watched several videos on techniques and I find yours very insightful and easy to follow. Great Job! I can't wait to explore the rest of your videos
Thank you!Tanya McCormick
Geht auch ohne Vertiefung im Holz
This is a great little tutorial! I did this in college and want to get back into it but that was quite a while ago so my brain needs some refreshing! I never used a stump before (I used a mushroom stake) so I am excited to try this method :-) What gauge copper did you use? Thank you for making it seem manageable!
Please see my reply directly below, thanks for watching!
You carefully found and marked the center ... WHY??? A hammer and stump do not require that kind of precision.
This is only the first step in raising a cup. The center is needed for raising on a stake and for setting the base. If I was making a bowl it wouldn't be necessary unless I planned to chase a design and put in rims and borders.
Thanks for watching.
@@Ceropegia I was wondering too, because the marked center was facing away from you. Beautiful piece of copper. Isn't Copper expensive now? I kind of want to have a fork and spoon made by a metalsmith or whoever does that sort of thing. I have this image in my head.
The first thing is to always mark the center. It’s easier to mark when it is a flat disc.
at 1:17 you readjust your divider. Doesn't that negate the first three marks? Doesn't make sense.
The first marks left a hollow space (kind of triangle), the divider adjustment put a mark into the center of that space from which I could determine the center. Thanks for the question and thanks for watching.
Is it possible to make something like a helmet using this technique? If I make the right sized sink and a wide enough piece of metal, could I bring the sides in enough to make a sufficient helmet dome?
You can make the helmet or components that will be riveted or soldered together to make a finished helmet. You won't need a larger sink but you will need a larger piece of metal. It's too complicated to discuss here, Try looking at info about raising vessels (which is not far from the helmet shape).
Thanks for watching.
I may have commented on this video before. If you use dividers to score a center then
use a center punch , you are in danger of causing your work to split along the scribe lines and center punch mark. How do I know? I did the same when I raised a complicated oval teapot in silver when I was an apprentice. Fortunately the company I was apprenticed to accepted the cost of starting again. I only suffered embarrassment and wasted hours of hard work.
Please never use a sharp point on copper / silver or gold if you are that fortunate. A pencil compass is by far the best thing to use.
Thank you for the warning. I have been doing it this way for about 12 years and have never had that happen in more than 100 vessels and cups. I'm working primarily 18 and 20 gauge metal and that may have something to do with my work not splitting. My scores are very light, just enough to see. When I am raising and need guide lines, I do use a compass and pencil or sharpie on the sides of the vessel. Thanks for watching.
I'am English but live in France and went on an educational course for aircraft aluminium work. We were taught to shrink over a ball rather than in a hollow and for me it seems to be more precise.However, the French don't seem to know about electrolitic reactions. They use pencils and felt tip pens on the aluminium and DO NOT understand the consequences. I once saw a photo of the fuselage of a deHavilland Comet that had depressurised after 20 years of service because someone had drawn a circle on the fuselage with a pencil during construction. The result was a very nice round hole. Not one of the French people I contacted,Airbus,SOCATA or the instructors who taught me had any idea of this .I have a very good friend who is an engineer at Rolls Royce who told me that pencils are not allowed in British aircraft factories for this very reason. When will others learn.
the curled sides looked better
:)
I have made many bowls with the curled or rippled edges. This became a cup so it needed to be smoothed out. Thanks for watching.