The heavier Armstrong fine thread clamps, the ones you're calling "vee threads" are designed for much higher clamping force. The frame is heavier to prevent bending, and the fine thread screw delivers much higher pressure for the same twisting effort.
Surprisingly, I HAVE been waiting patiently for the definitive elucidation of your favorite C-clamps. And good to know someone else has the appropriate shears for nose-hair trimming. My kiddos at the middle school are always twisting the c-clamps too- we've a bunch of import junk, losing swivels that I have to put back on, with a very few of the old-school Plomb and Proto brands. They will outlast me, a comforting thing to know. Across the road at the high school competition robot shop (the former auto shop whose teacher retired from having forty kids squished into his shop...) there are many quality brands left over from the early 60's, and I'm able to demonstrate how a good tool will make the job easier to accomplish, with a better outcome.
Hi Mr. Pete, I had a swivel to come off an 8" clamp. I made a paper pattern with 6 or so "v" shaped slots in the paper. Wrapped the paper pattern around the 1" future swivel. Then cut out the v's. Next was drilling a partial hole in the future bottom of the swivel (to capture the ball). Put the new bottom in place, turned the threads all the way into the partially drilled hole of the new bottom. Now I heated up the end of the 1" pipe(with the "v" cut outs) bumped the tabs around the top of the ball. Welded the new bottom in. Ground off the extra. Nice and flat. Works great. I make sure to put wd40 on the threads and new swivel often. C-clamps are one of my favorite tools. Appreciate you making your vid. All the best, Pete
Thanks MrPete, Tradesmen of yesteryear didn't have to contend with the junk clamps that many of us have contended with now. I miss the Atlas and cincy clamps that growed legs. Thanks for the history and durability info. Blessings Sir🗿
When I was a little fellow, I thought my Dad was referring to "Sea Clamps" ... I had a mental picture of nautical scenarios, waves, fish, boats - quite confusing to a 4 year old. Then I learned to read and one day it dawned on me, "C". But that original thought still lingers in the back of my mind.
That’s a good story,. When I was a boy, my dad used to refer to a little crank drill as a breast drill but for 20 years I thought he was calling it a brisk drill, and that’s how I pronounce it. L O L.
"Pearlitic" refers to highly refine grain "cast iron". Cast iron is pearlitic in structure after cooling. Nodular iron and ductile iron have different grain structures which would be better iron to use but cost more.
Thank you Mr Pete. I share your love for all things quality. I buy every quality,old school clamp I find. A friend of mine has a fondness for Proto & Challenger mechanic's tools.
I worked at Switchcraft on the northwest side of Chicago which bordered the old Armstrong factory grounds, met many people who grew up around there and worked there over the years, even today my co-worker served his apprenticeship at Armstrong as a diemaker, he said it was a dirty hot place to work. I guess they grew the business during WW2 when they making massive C-Clamps for Navy ship construction and the clamps were welded in place!
I have acquired many Armstrong clamps over the years. Many were from my dads collection from fifty to seventy years ago. They are indeed my favorites and just have a good feel about them.
You have confirmed what I was told by an old mechanic/millwright in the early 1990's. Grab Plomb tools when you can, they were Proto;s parent company. I have several in my tool box. I buy them every time I see them. Wilton clamps are the best.
I am a C clamps nerd too. I own some light duty C clamps and I use them for light duty (mostly woodshop) work, but I also own premium C clamps and use them accordingly. Premium C clamps cost real $, and like you I snap them up when found affordably. My favorite brands are Armstrong, Williams and Wilton. I have never seen a Proto C clamp. I own many Proto tools. I am especially fond of their pullers. I use them before I pick up my Snap-On and OTC versions. My Snap-On loyal son is generally dismissive of Proto pullers, but I recently watched him kit out MAC branded (must be Proto) tools at a flea market. He sometime must have secretly started building a Proto kit. He skipped over some components that I snapped up for my Proto kit. I noticed the Hargrave logo on one of your first shown C clamps indicating that Hargrave was married with other brands at one time. Please examine your fine V thread C clamps. I own several very old Armstrong versions of extremely heavy duty design. Each of mine are double lead so the operation speed is similar to the ACME and square thread designs. I the 1980's Armstrong started marketing high viz painted C clamps for a premium price. I coveted them and wanted to purchase a pair of 4" C clamps. They were priced out reach for my poor man's budget. A co-worker told me to buy the black tools and paint them myself! That was a brilliant idea. I bought a pair and painted them bright orange. The painted clamps was a successful security in a shop full of company owned clamps. That pair of clamps started me on my clamp owning craze. At last count I was well over 250 and I have purchased and given away possibly 150 clamps for family and friends who don't value or can't afford quality tools. Those orange clamps started a foolish demand that all of my clamps (unless plated) get a paint job before going into service. I used to rattle can them, but I I now paint them with an artist brush. This saves masking and the coats are more durable. I have settled on favorite colors. Unpainted shop tools like old Pexto vises, premium bench vises and arbor presses get the paint upgrade too. Retirement affords this nerdy fetish. You kept your video to just C clamps. There are are other clamp styles that warrant similar affection and are often more functional than C clamps. But I have way too many times used my Armstrong C clamps to clamp onto a steel panel or plate for vertical hoisting with a hoisting strap or used them as a hoisting safety on the end of forklift fork for similar function. That first pair of 4" Armstrong clamps are still in pristine condition after that frequent misapplication. (Note that I always loaded the clamp to reduce or eliminate chance of damage, and I never permitted anyone to be under such a lifted load.) Our safety police never expressed any concern over this questionable practice. Armstrong makes multiple grades of C clamps. I only own their two basic grades. They are a joy for me to use. I bought a pair of 8" Record C clamps, double lead screws, but I bent the frames in a misuse application. I straightened them multiple times to complete the task, but now they are just wall hangers. I share your passion for quality C clamps.
I am joyed this comment. Sounds like you are just as crazy as me. Just how many sea clams do we really need, lol. I love quality tools, and they are hard to find, if not impossible in box stores.
Always love your posts. Thanks 👍. I'm interested in learning how swivels are attached to the c - clamps. If, of course, your willing to make a video showing that. Lord bless.
Thanks Mr. Peter for sharing. I had dozens of Wilton c-clamps back in my Welding career days. A few are still with me. Most walked on to different homes.
@@PaulSteMarie Really, I bought a set of Armstrong hand tools about 20 years ago.....they seem to be good quality, I am comparing them to Snap-On, Proto, Mac, Cornwell......sad to see these classic companies go away....
Hes old school tho ill give him that.those bessey slide clamps will take some damn abuse.i used to work in fabricating shop and i would beat the hell out em them,pick up beams with them too.they will take abuse.
@@ypaulbrown Armstrong made excellent tools, both under its own name and for Matco. Unlike Armstrong, Danaher didn't spin off Matco to Apex, and when Apex shut Armstrong down, Matco was unable to get new tools or warrantee existing ones for nearly a year.
Back when we were a busy shop doing different stuff we used loads of C-clamps. The light-duty and deep ones were good for sheet metal clamping or thin-angle iron. We'd clamp it for drilling or welding. The stout clamps with short screws, we'd use them on milling machines to hold plates against angle plates. Once a newer guy used a nice pair of 8" good clamps that was holding about 4" of metal. He didn't use other hold-downs figuring the big plate was so heavy. This was on a good size horizontal and we were cutting T-slots. Well, long story short, something went awry, it crashed, the clamp screws bent, and the thousand-pound plate jumped breaking the cutter. We were fortunate that the plate didn't fall off the machine's table and crush the operator. Thinking about it he may have been boring a 10" or so hole in the center, we did a lot of plates once upon a time
You're 100% right on the PLOMB to PROTO name change. This occurred around 1950. PLUMB did sue PLOMB requiring the name change. I have a PLOMB breaker bar that almost qualifies as ornate in appearance. I sure wish quality was an ingredient in tools as they once were.
You are correct on the Plumb/Plomb law suit, originally they had an agreement to not mess with one another name, but Plumb got nasty and sued Plomb......the shop I worked in and many large, over 1.5 inch Plomb wrenches....very well made....and I got some Plomb tools from my Grandfather;s work mate at Carolina Power and Light in Wilmington , NC who passed in the 1960's, his wife thought I should have them.....if she only knew how much I cherish them, my grandfather thought I would not appreciate and use them......well, I have been using since about 1966......I sure wish they were still around and saw how much I appreciate any tools....well, not the errr, ones form across the Pacific Ocean, Mitatoya excluded......cheers, Paul...p.s. I am thinking the name change came in about 1948......but I could be mistaken....
Good video. I have in my woodworking the absolute WORST c-clamp ever invented. It was part of some tools from my father in law after he passed. It is a 4 inch and consists of two pieces of stamped sheet metal with a v-thread captured between them and the thing spot welded together. I have it hanging on the wall to remind me just how cheesy some tools can be.
You need to do a Mr. Pete makes proper, replacement, C-clamp swivels on the lathe, video. Wilton sells replacement swivels, but can't be bothered to tell you what size balls they fit.
1st thing that came to mind is Mr Clamps from the Animated Tv Show "Futurama' HAHAHAHAHA Worthless Peterson information. Is a treasure to be hold & share ... Much Thanks Lyle... Mike M.
I got a couple awesome drop forged Williams Armstrong and hargrave that were my neighbors after he passed away so they're still be used and taken care of my favorite clamps 👍👍👍
Thanks for the video Mr. Pete. I have a c-clamp addiction myself and have lost count… probably 75 or so. Totally agree about looking for the drop forged steel clamps versus ductile iron. I have speculated before that the finer thread pitch of some clamps was essentially to allow the user to tighten it tighter as each turn of the handle would result in less travel (and more mechanical advantage) than a coarser or faster thread. To my knowledge the Hargrave clamps were the premium line made by Cincinnati Tool.
Well done, Mr. Pete. Your voice has the tone of my last surviving uncle, Uncle Bob, he was a tool n die man for Kellogg's of Battle Creek. He gifted me some of his tooling way back when and they are special.
Pete, Hargrave,Armstrong and Williams c clamps are what I used as a 30 year welder/fabricator. I'll still buy them at an auction if they go cheap enough. Also collected a bunch of Vice Grip brand c clamps of various sizes and locking pliers also.AL B.
I love it, ima G clamp nutter as well ( we call them G clamps in Aus.) I have mountains of G clamps, even many extremely high quality woodworking ones by Record UK, my favourite is Aussie “ Dawn “ G clamps, same maker as the offset Vice photo you showed some weeks ago, all drop forged all fantastic, a man cannot have too many clamps.
Americans must have a strange letter C if they look like G clamps. A few years ago I bought quite a few second hand Record G clamps on eBay. Prices were quite low at the time.
@@frogandspanner the record and dawn clamps are extremely high quality, not drop forged though - nothing, especially those annoying ratcheting clamps can exert the accurate force of a G (C) clamp.
Certainly I got the c/clamp bug from my high school yrs after seeing for the first time how useful c clamps were. Back home in Fiji we exclusively used made in England tools and machinery. Usually on clamps and vises the brand was RECORD. Here in US I find myself collecting the heavy duty Williams clamps. Armstrong clamps are rare but I have 1-2 in collection. And like you i adore the Armstrong logo!
@@mrpete222 and if you keep finding them, you certainly can’t pass on them if they are dirt cheap. I clean them up, oil them and put them in my clamp tool box. Old stuff needs to be appreciated and praised.
Great video! I love c clamps and have many. I especially like those "educated" c clamps like Starrett and Lufkin make--you now the ones with all the numbers on them.
2:10 The term "pearlitic" refers to the microstructure of cast iron. These clamps are made of nodular cast iron. Pearlitic irons have greater hardness and, therefore, greater tensile strength.
The v thread on the heavy Armstrong and Williams clamp is to provide greater clamp force. Williams was out of Buffalo New York in their prime. I believe they closed up shop in the early 90's the brand is currently owned by Snap-on and made in various places to my knowledge. I know when snap on bought them out the williams fine pitch ratchet was changed because it was finer pitched than the snap on model and they didn't want that so it lost a few clicks. American way, if you don't want to improve your product take over the competition. 🙂
Thanks for your knowledge. Those swivels can be aggravating , I put a piece of square stock 1 1/2 or 2 inch in the heavy 8 inch machinist vice and put the swivel on the screw . Then tighten down on square and using a punch and hammer peen down the edges on the swivel, better than new.
The deep throat “Pearlictic” clamps were sold by Sears for light duty clamping. I believe the word refers to malleable, or “nodular” iron where the grain structure is round, or “Pearlictic” in shape. Ford advertised “nodular” Iron crankshafts in their engines for many years.
Hey Mr. Pete, for missing swivels, why not turn some replacement clamp swivel pads on the lathe? You could even machine a retaining ring like the Wilton, and just touch it with a mig or tig welder once installed to lock it in.
Mr. Pete, one thing you failed to explain is the difference between a left hand and a right hand C-clamp for any person needing a clamp for a special situation. Yes, I agree with you that the copper plating is to prevent issues from weld spatter. I have a Wilton clamp plated thusly. I would not call it heavy duty because it utilizes the slide rod and has that pressed on swivel with no locking feature - not inexpensive. I used to be a Snap-on salesman with a route on the Eastern Shore of MD. and Wilton introduced the welding c-clamp in the early 80's. I am not saying it was their idea as I do not know. Their welding clamps are regular duty.
The holes in the two c-clamps may not be as bad as first thought. Under load, the outside part of the c-clamp is under compression while the inside is in tension. You may recall this from your strengths of materials class. The holes being close to the center are near the transition region where the tension transitions to compression, i.e. lower stress. So, yes the hole will make it weaker, but being near the middle reduces the loss in strength.
I could be wrong, but I suspect that having the hole near the corner, as in the video, makes things much worse. Under stress, the outside of the curve is going to want to buckle outward, and the inside of the curve is going to want to pull straight, leaving the web in tension. I think your analysis would be right if the hole were in a straight part of the clamp.
In the UK you would be more likely to find old G clamps will be Record branded, when they were made from quality Sheffield steel in Yorkshire along with vices, wenches and woodworking planes, unfortunately no longer. The branding is now owned by Irwin, however the products now are more chineseium in quality 😞
@@mrpete222 I agree unfortunately it is all too common to see good old trade names being bought and used to hide foreign imports here in the UK as well
There are lots of Record (England) tools around where I live, in Canada. I have several of their C-clamps as well as a very heavy duty 8" vise. Record also made extremely high quality quick-release metalworking vises. One shop I worked at in my boilermaker days was exclusively equipped with them. They stood up very well to heavy industrial use. To this day NOS UK-made Record tools can still be found occasionally here.
I am a C-clamp hoarder. If there are good ones at a garage sale, I will buy them if the price is right. My collection is quite eclectic across brand names, but most are good quality. I plan on experimenting with a couple of them. I have some tool steel hexagon stock. I am going to cut off the tee handle and weld on a piece of the hex stock so I can use an impact driver or ratchet & socket to tighten & loosen the clamp. My tired achy old hands don't like spinning that tee handle any more.
My wife's aunts and uncle worked for J. H. Williams in Buffalo. Somewhere, I have a 100th anniversary wrench key chain from a HS Advisor that worked there. They were bought out by Snap-on in the early 90's.
I love good C-clamps, as a woodworker I have a lot of "light weights", and as you pointed out, they cannot deliver the same clamping force as the heavy duty clamps. My other favorite clamp is the Kant Twist, which I have been collecting for a couple of years after seeing them employed in an Adam Savage video. And as I recall there used to be a shop class kit to make a clamp in the kant twist style. Another clamp, and a special one, is the Manfrotto (tripod) Super Clamp, specialized for rigging photo lights and backgrounds, I will also reach for one if I run short of clamps for other purposes.
Mike, a Kant Twist style kit is still available in a few sizes. I don't recall the vendor offhand. If interested, check out Quinn's build series on her Blondihacks channel.
I like a good C-clamp myself! It would be kinda neat to do a video on the swivels....how they come apart, how to repair them etc. keep up the GREAT work!!!
I like the clamps (both "C" and pipe) that have wings instead of the sliding bar for tightening. They can't be used in all circumstances, but still nice to look at and use.
The fine thread on the v threads will allow a tighter clamp for any given size of ceoss bar. The square thread mooves forward much further in a quarter turn needing greater leverage than thw fine v thread.
Who cares, you say? I care. I have a tool drawer and shelf full of these. I stopped picking them up a few years ago as I finally admitted I really had no use for any more. I think you may have restarted the fire of my avarice.
Funny that we’d think of C-clamps as beautiful, but they are (at least some of them :-) I’m too lazy to get up and go look at it to share the details right now, but I have a beautiful old truly heavy-duty C-clamp in the basement that was my father’s, probably originally bought new 75 years ago now. It’s truly beautiful, with a wonderful patina from years of use. I don’t know the brand offhand, but it’s drop-forged with acme threads. - But you have me wondering about its swivel now though, and whether or not it’s truly worthy in that area… 😮
As a boy I drove a truck for an auto parts store that sold Proto tools. On a number of occasions I picked up orders from a tool factory in Franklin Park Illinois where Proto tools were alleged to have been made. Later (1960s) a neighbor worked there and he took parts from an old pistol I owned and chrome plated them for me.
In the UK we call them "G" clamps. Yet more confirmation that we are two nations separated by a common language! I love Proto stuff too! I'll keep an eye for Plomb tools. Thanks.
huh I didn't know that about plomb and proto. I have some old plomb punches that came in an old tool-chest. It was full of some other interesting stuff, taper pins, old blue point screw removers and, I think there were home made engraving gravers.
I’m going to defend Bubba. I’d bet those clamps with the holes were used by iron workers. We drill the holes to attach a tether to them so when you’re up in the air they don’t fall and kill someone. Clamps are cheaper than people.working in the field is completely different than in the shop
Thank you, that is interesting. Another reviewer said that they drilled a hole for the welding cable. And use the clamp as the ground clamp. There was welding spatter on one of them.
Hello Mr. Pete This past weekend I picked up two Armstrong 78-408 clamps at a yard sale for $25 each! Both in fantastic shape but they both have a 1/4" hole drilled in the same place as in your video I was thinking maybe if a guy is working up high on some steel he could attach a leash to it through the hole to keep it from falling on someone's head and killing him
Yes but it's a microstructure of a certain type of steel, most likely a marketing thing, although I think there is a possibility of those being made of steel.
Thank you Mr. Pete! How are those swivels kept in place? I just saw you mentioned that the last one was held with a retaining clip. Just curious (signed “That annoying student who loved to ask questions”…lol).
I think you under valued Brink and Cotton, they are very good clamps. They may not be your heaviest duty clamps, but they are nicely made. Yes cast as far as I can tell, but the swivel foot is heavier duty than others, and all of mine are intact. They are not as heavy duty as my Armstrongs, but they are not as heavy either, and will hold at least 2000 psi. As far as V threads vs acme, my armstrongs (the big honkers w/no swivel) have V threads.. A Kurt vise has V threads. I questioned that, and it turns out that V thread can handle more pressure than an Acme.. Go figure .
In my 78 years, I have determined that there is only one country in the world that consistently makes certain items of high quality. That is the USA. Those items are bearings, razor blades, drill bits, hack saw blades, electric motors, and C-clamps. Everybody else, it is hit and miss on all of these items.
My dad had some clamps with the short screw. It got aggravating sometimes when you just needed a little more screw length or needed two more hands to hold the shim and clamp and work the screw. I think my brother grabbed them when he passed.
There was a trademark infringement suit in the mid-to-late 1940's over the use of the name "Plomb" on tools. "Plumb", who had a registered mark dating from the 1920's had entered an agreement with Plomb over commecial use of the name after Plumb opposed the registration of the Plomb name at that time. The infringement suit was brought when Plomb allegedly violated the terms of the agreement. I suspect that this arose over the marketing of Plomb hammers and striking tools, a core business for Plumb.
Mr Pete , Which type of clamp/size do you recommend to hold a 5 inch bench vise or Wire wheel. My home shop is a small section of my garage so I have to put each away after use and store? I am on the hunt for clamps at yard sale/estate for this purpose. I saw your video on counter sinking a wood board. For the beginner can you tell me the the type of counter sink (I don't have one and approx bolt type). Sorry for such basic questions. These shorts are very educational. Thank you
The heavier Armstrong fine thread clamps, the ones you're calling "vee threads" are designed for much higher clamping force. The frame is heavier to prevent bending, and the fine thread screw delivers much higher pressure for the same twisting effort.
Surprisingly, I HAVE been waiting patiently for the definitive elucidation of your favorite C-clamps. And good to know someone else has the appropriate shears for nose-hair trimming.
My kiddos at the middle school are always twisting the c-clamps too- we've a bunch of import junk, losing swivels that I have to put back on, with a very few of the old-school Plomb and Proto brands. They will outlast me, a comforting thing to know.
Across the road at the high school competition robot shop (the former auto shop whose teacher retired from having forty kids squished into his shop...) there are many quality brands left over from the early 60's, and I'm able to demonstrate how a good tool will make the job easier to accomplish, with a better outcome.
Hi Mr. Pete,
I had a swivel to come off an 8" clamp. I made a paper pattern with 6 or so "v" shaped slots in the paper. Wrapped the paper pattern around the 1" future swivel. Then cut out the v's. Next was drilling a partial hole in the future bottom of the swivel (to capture the ball). Put the new bottom in place, turned the threads all the way into the partially drilled hole of the new bottom. Now I heated up the end of the 1" pipe(with the "v" cut outs) bumped the tabs around the top of the ball. Welded the new bottom in. Ground off the extra. Nice and flat. Works great. I make sure to put wd40 on the threads and new swivel often.
C-clamps are one of my favorite tools. Appreciate you making your vid.
All the best, Pete
👍👍👍
The V-threads are finer in pitch than the ACME threads, which gives the user a larger mechanical advantage and makes more clamping force available.
Is this for real?!
Thanks MrPete, Tradesmen of yesteryear didn't have to contend with the junk clamps that many of us have contended with now. I miss the Atlas and cincy clamps that growed legs. Thanks for the history and durability info. Blessings Sir🗿
When I was a little fellow, I thought my Dad was referring to "Sea Clamps" ... I had a mental picture of nautical scenarios, waves, fish, boats - quite confusing to a 4 year old. Then I learned to read and one day it dawned on me, "C". But that original thought still lingers in the back of my mind.
That’s a good story,. When I was a boy, my dad used to refer to a little crank drill as a breast drill but for 20 years I thought he was calling it a brisk drill, and that’s how I pronounce it. L O L.
"Pearlitic" refers to highly refine grain "cast iron". Cast iron is pearlitic in structure after cooling. Nodular iron and ductile iron have different grain structures which would be better iron to use but cost more.
Thank you Mr Pete. I share your love for all things quality. I buy every quality,old school clamp I find. A friend of mine has a fondness for Proto & Challenger mechanic's tools.
I worked at Switchcraft on the northwest side of Chicago which bordered the old Armstrong factory grounds, met many people who grew up around there and worked there over the years, even today my co-worker served his apprenticeship at Armstrong as a diemaker, he said it was a dirty hot place to work. I guess they grew the business during WW2 when they making massive C-Clamps for Navy ship construction and the clamps were welded in place!
👍👍
I have acquired many Armstrong clamps over the years. Many were from my dads collection from fifty to seventy years ago. They are indeed my favorites and just have a good feel about them.
👍👍
You have confirmed what I was told by an old mechanic/millwright in the early 1990's. Grab Plomb tools when you can, they were Proto;s parent company. I have several in my tool box. I buy them every time I see them. Wilton clamps are the best.
I am a C clamps nerd too. I own some light duty C clamps and I use them for light duty (mostly woodshop) work, but I also own premium C clamps and use them accordingly. Premium C clamps cost real $, and like you I snap them up when found affordably. My favorite brands are Armstrong, Williams and Wilton. I have never seen a Proto C clamp.
I own many Proto tools. I am especially fond of their pullers. I use them before I pick up my Snap-On and OTC versions. My Snap-On loyal son is generally dismissive of Proto pullers, but I recently watched him kit out MAC branded (must be Proto) tools at a flea market. He sometime must have secretly started building a Proto kit. He skipped over some components that I snapped up for my Proto kit.
I noticed the Hargrave logo on one of your first shown C clamps indicating that Hargrave was married with other brands at one time.
Please examine your fine V thread C clamps. I own several very old Armstrong versions of extremely heavy duty design. Each of mine are double lead so the operation speed is similar to the ACME and square thread designs.
I the 1980's Armstrong started marketing high viz painted C clamps for a premium price. I coveted them and wanted to purchase a pair of 4" C clamps. They were priced out reach for my poor man's budget. A co-worker told me to buy the black tools and paint them myself! That was a brilliant idea. I bought a pair and painted them bright orange. The painted clamps was a successful security in a shop full of company owned clamps. That pair of clamps started me on my clamp owning craze. At last count I was well over 250 and I have purchased and given away possibly 150 clamps for family and friends who don't value or can't afford quality tools. Those orange clamps started a foolish demand that all of my clamps (unless plated) get a paint job before going into service. I used to rattle can them, but I I now paint them with an artist brush. This saves masking and the coats are more durable. I have settled on favorite colors. Unpainted shop tools like old Pexto vises, premium bench vises and arbor presses get the paint upgrade too. Retirement affords this nerdy fetish.
You kept your video to just C clamps. There are are other clamp styles that warrant similar affection and are often more functional than C clamps. But I have way too many times used my Armstrong C clamps to clamp onto a steel panel or plate for vertical hoisting with a hoisting strap or used them as a hoisting safety on the end of forklift fork for similar function. That first pair of 4" Armstrong clamps are still in pristine condition after that frequent misapplication. (Note that I always loaded the clamp to reduce or eliminate chance of damage, and I never permitted anyone to be under such a lifted load.) Our safety police never expressed any concern over this questionable practice. Armstrong makes multiple grades of C clamps. I only own their two basic grades. They are a joy for me to use.
I bought a pair of 8" Record C clamps, double lead screws, but I bent the frames in a misuse application. I straightened them multiple times to complete the task, but now they are just wall hangers.
I share your passion for quality C clamps.
I am joyed this comment. Sounds like you are just as crazy as me. Just how many sea clams do we really need, lol. I love quality tools, and they are hard to find, if not impossible in box stores.
Always love your posts. Thanks 👍. I'm interested in learning how swivels are attached to the c - clamps. If, of course, your willing to make a video showing that. Lord bless.
Thanks Mr. Peter for sharing. I had dozens of Wilton c-clamps back in my Welding career days. A few are still with me. Most walked on to different homes.
Armstrong tools is a subsidiary of Apex tools, and Williams is a Snap-on brand, and Proto is a Stanley brand.
Apex shut Armstrong down a few years ago.
@@PaulSteMarie Really, I bought a set of Armstrong hand tools about 20 years ago.....they seem to be good quality, I am comparing them to Snap-On, Proto, Mac, Cornwell......sad to see these classic companies go away....
These have nothing on a bessey
Hes old school tho ill give him that.those bessey slide clamps will take some damn abuse.i used to work in fabricating shop and i would beat the hell out em them,pick up beams with them too.they will take abuse.
@@ypaulbrown Armstrong made excellent tools, both under its own name and for Matco. Unlike Armstrong, Danaher didn't spin off Matco to Apex, and when Apex shut Armstrong down, Matco was unable to get new tools or warrantee existing ones for nearly a year.
Thank you Mr. Pete. I have some vintage C-clamps missing the swivel. Making a replacement swivel, video idea? I'd watch.
Sounds like a good reason to make a swivel.
Looking forward to see how you design one. A better mouse trap if you will.
Back when we were a busy shop doing different stuff we used loads of C-clamps. The light-duty and deep ones were good for sheet metal clamping or thin-angle iron. We'd clamp it for drilling or welding. The stout clamps with short screws, we'd use them on milling machines to hold plates against angle plates. Once a newer guy used a nice pair of 8" good clamps that was holding about 4" of metal. He didn't use other hold-downs figuring the big plate was so heavy. This was on a good size horizontal and we were cutting T-slots. Well, long story short, something went awry, it crashed, the clamp screws bent, and the thousand-pound plate jumped breaking the cutter. We were fortunate that the plate didn't fall off the machine's table and crush the operator. Thinking about it he may have been boring a 10" or so hole in the center, we did a lot of plates once upon a time
Wow
You're 100% right on the PLOMB to PROTO name change. This occurred around 1950. PLUMB did sue PLOMB requiring the name change. I have a PLOMB breaker bar that almost qualifies as ornate in appearance. I sure wish quality was an ingredient in tools as they once were.
I had quite a few oddball, plomb tools, unfortunately, I sold most of them.
Thanks Mr. Pete! 🙌 🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️🗜️
lol
I agree with the Williams brand and also Armstrong are awesome, but my favorite brand is Billings, which wasn't mentioned. No longer made.
Thanks Mr Pete , I have worked with steel all my life , Armstrong and Williams are the only clamps I buy
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Always a pleasure to see your videos. Thank you so much for posting
I’m envious of your Wilton C Clamp.
That's a very nice collection Mr. Pete.
I agree with your observation about the copper coating
I was thinking as I was watching the video that the only time I have ever seen copper clad clamps is at the welding supply house.
You are correct on the Plumb/Plomb law suit, originally they had an agreement to not mess with one another name, but Plumb got nasty and sued Plomb......the shop I worked in and many large, over 1.5 inch Plomb wrenches....very well made....and I got some Plomb tools from my Grandfather;s work mate at Carolina Power and Light in Wilmington , NC who passed in the 1960's, his wife thought I should have them.....if she only knew how much I cherish them, my grandfather thought I would not appreciate and use them......well, I have been using since about 1966......I sure wish they were still around and saw how much I appreciate any tools....well, not the errr, ones form across the Pacific Ocean, Mitatoya excluded......cheers, Paul...p.s. I am thinking the name change came in about 1948......but I could be mistaken....
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Thanks MrPete enjoyed thanks for sharing . Come south for the meet and greet weather has grate
I probably will not make it this year. I am starting to get a little feeble
Good video. I have in my woodworking the absolute WORST c-clamp ever invented. It was part of some tools from my father in law after he passed. It is a 4 inch and consists of two pieces of stamped sheet metal with a v-thread captured between them and the thing spot welded together. I have it hanging on the wall to remind me just how cheesy some tools can be.
Are used to have one of those, it came in an auction box. So pathetic I threw it out.
You need to do a Mr. Pete makes proper, replacement, C-clamp swivels on the lathe, video. Wilton sells replacement swivels, but can't be bothered to tell you what size balls they fit.
1st thing that came to mind is Mr Clamps from the Animated Tv Show "Futurama' HAHAHAHAHA
Worthless Peterson information. Is a treasure to be hold & share ...
Much Thanks Lyle...
Mike M.
I got a couple awesome drop forged Williams Armstrong and hargrave that were my neighbors after he passed away so they're still be used and taken care of my favorite clamps 👍👍👍
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Thanks for the video Mr. Pete. I have a c-clamp addiction myself and have lost count… probably 75 or so. Totally agree about looking for the drop forged steel clamps versus ductile iron. I have speculated before that the finer thread pitch of some clamps was essentially to allow the user to tighten it tighter as each turn of the handle would result in less travel (and more mechanical advantage) than a coarser or faster thread. To my knowledge the Hargrave clamps were the premium line made by Cincinnati Tool.
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Clamps.....I love my clamps.....but am addicted to F Clamps by Bessey.....great video Mr Peterson......your fan, Paul
Well done, Mr. Pete. Your voice has the tone of my last surviving uncle, Uncle Bob, he was a tool n die man for Kellogg's of Battle Creek. He gifted me some of his tooling way back when and they are special.
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I've always been very pleased with wilton tools and machines 👍👍😎
You and me both!
Pete, Hargrave,Armstrong and Williams c clamps are what I used as a 30 year welder/fabricator. I'll still buy them at an auction if they go cheap enough. Also collected a bunch of Vice Grip brand c clamps of various sizes and locking pliers also.AL B.
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boy oh boy, the Plomb and Wilton clamps have great looking swivels.....I see why you love them so much
My dad left me several Armstrong c-clamps and those are all that I ever used. I guess it spoiled me because they always worked so well.
The best of the best. Your father has good taste.
I love it, ima G clamp nutter as well ( we call them G clamps in Aus.) I have mountains of G clamps, even many extremely high quality woodworking ones by Record UK, my favourite is Aussie “ Dawn “ G clamps, same maker as the offset Vice photo you showed some weeks ago, all drop forged all fantastic, a man cannot have too many clamps.
Americans must have a strange letter C if they look like G clamps.
A few years ago I bought quite a few second hand Record G clamps on eBay. Prices were quite low at the time.
@@frogandspanner We’re lazy.
C is easier to say than G.
@@ellieprice363 I cet that.
@@frogandspanner the record and dawn clamps are extremely high quality, not drop forged though - nothing, especially those annoying ratcheting clamps can exert the accurate force of a G (C) clamp.
The V threads allow for a finer pitch so that the screw can develop more force.
Certainly I got the c/clamp bug from my high school yrs after seeing for the first time how useful c clamps were. Back home in Fiji we exclusively used made in England tools and machinery. Usually on clamps and vises the brand was RECORD. Here in US I find myself collecting the heavy duty Williams clamps. Armstrong clamps are rare but I have 1-2 in collection. And like you i adore the Armstrong logo!
It is good to hear from someone that appreciates these industrial quality C clamps. I run into them quite often around her.
@@mrpete222 and if you keep finding them, you certainly can’t pass on them if they are dirt cheap. I clean them up, oil them and put them in my clamp tool box. Old stuff needs to be appreciated and praised.
I just looked them up. The Wilton is 1 3/8" 5600lbs clamping pressure $101.00
Proto same size $107
Wow, I have thousands of dollars worth of c clamps, LOL
That's per dozen, right?
Great video! I love c clamps and have many. I especially like those "educated" c clamps like Starrett and Lufkin make--you now the ones with all the numbers on them.
Lol
2:10 The term "pearlitic" refers to the microstructure of cast iron. These clamps are made of nodular cast iron. Pearlitic irons have greater hardness and, therefore, greater tensile strength.
The v thread on the heavy Armstrong and Williams clamp is to provide greater clamp force. Williams was out of Buffalo New York in their prime. I believe they closed up shop in the early 90's the brand is currently owned by Snap-on and made in various places to my knowledge. I know when snap on bought them out the williams fine pitch ratchet was changed because it was finer pitched than the snap on model and they didn't want that so it lost a few clicks. American way, if you don't want to improve your product take over the competition. 🙂
So true
My go to clamps are New Haven clamps. They were shielded for wielding. Very heavy duty.
Nice overview of the c clamps. Ito have many. 😊😊😊😊😊😊
How are things in California today Randy?
Thanks for your knowledge. Those swivels can be aggravating , I put a piece of square stock 1 1/2 or 2 inch in the heavy 8 inch machinist vice and put the swivel on the screw . Then tighten down on square and using a punch and hammer peen down the edges on the swivel, better than new.
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I have two Proto clamps like the one showed. Boy do they feel nice in your hand!
The deep throat “Pearlictic” clamps were sold by Sears for light duty clamping. I believe the word refers to malleable, or “nodular” iron where the grain structure is round, or “Pearlictic” in shape. Ford advertised “nodular”
Iron crankshafts in their engines for many years.
Thanks
Armstrong made some Super Strong Backs . We used them to pick up some heavy steel structural column baseplates to weld tack during set up.
Thank you
Hey Mr. Pete, for missing swivels, why not turn some replacement clamp swivel pads on the lathe? You could even machine a retaining ring like the Wilton, and just touch it with a mig or tig welder once installed to lock it in.
Mr. Pete, one thing you failed to explain is the difference between a left hand and a right hand C-clamp for any person needing a clamp for a special situation.
Yes, I agree with you that the copper plating is to prevent issues from weld spatter. I have a Wilton clamp plated thusly. I would not call it heavy duty because it utilizes the slide rod and has that pressed on swivel with no locking feature - not inexpensive. I used to be a Snap-on salesman with a route on the Eastern Shore of MD. and Wilton introduced the welding c-clamp in the early 80's. I am not saying it was their idea as I do not know. Their welding clamps are regular duty.
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The holes in the two c-clamps may not be as bad as first thought. Under load, the outside part of the c-clamp is under compression while the inside is in tension. You may recall this from your strengths of materials class. The holes being close to the center are near the transition region where the tension transitions to compression, i.e. lower stress. So, yes the hole will make it weaker, but being near the middle reduces the loss in strength.
Agreed, as in holes thru center connecting webbing of an I-beam
I could be wrong, but I suspect that having the hole near the corner, as in the video, makes things much worse. Under stress, the outside of the curve is going to want to buckle outward, and the inside of the curve is going to want to pull straight, leaving the web in tension. I think your analysis would be right if the hole were in a straight part of the clamp.
It's Funny why you Americans call them C Clamps. In England they are called G Clamps because they look like the alphabet letter G. Enjoy your day.
Easier to say. If you asked for a G clamp in America no one would know what you wanted.
Record G clamps , always get exited if I spot 1 at a car boot sale 😁
In the UK you would be more likely to find old G clamps will be Record branded, when they were made from quality Sheffield steel in Yorkshire along with vices, wenches and woodworking planes, unfortunately no longer. The branding is now owned by Irwin, however the products now are more chineseium in quality 😞
Many tools in the US are made by Erwin. Mostly foreign, and mostly inferior.
@@mrpete222 I agree unfortunately it is all too common to see good old trade names being bought and used to hide foreign imports here in the UK as well
There are lots of Record (England) tools around where I live, in Canada. I have several of their C-clamps as well as a very heavy duty 8" vise. Record also made extremely high quality quick-release metalworking vises. One shop I worked at in my boilermaker days was exclusively equipped with them. They stood up very well to heavy industrial use. To this day NOS UK-made Record tools can still be found occasionally here.
I love record G-clamps the Armstrong 1ns Mr Pete is showing look great tho too
I am a C-clamp hoarder. If there are good ones at a garage sale, I will buy them if the price is right. My collection is quite eclectic across brand names, but most are good quality. I plan on experimenting with a couple of them. I have some tool steel hexagon stock. I am going to cut off the tee handle and weld on a piece of the hex stock so I can use an impact driver or ratchet & socket to tighten & loosen the clamp. My tired achy old hands don't like spinning that tee handle any more.
Good idea
Great video, nice information on what to look for. Thank you.
My wife's aunts and uncle worked for J. H. Williams in Buffalo. Somewhere, I have a 100th anniversary wrench key chain from a HS Advisor that worked there. They were bought out by Snap-on in the early 90's.
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Wow, ten hours ago. Well some of us do still work for a living. Great video Lyle.
I love good C-clamps, as a woodworker I have a lot of "light weights", and as you pointed out, they cannot deliver the same clamping force as the heavy duty clamps. My other favorite clamp is the Kant Twist, which I have been collecting for a couple of years after seeing them employed in an Adam Savage video. And as I recall there used to be a shop class kit to make a clamp in the kant twist style. Another clamp, and a special one, is the Manfrotto (tripod) Super Clamp, specialized for rigging photo lights and backgrounds, I will also reach for one if I run short of clamps for other purposes.
I like the Cant twist clamps, myself. But I only have two of them. I never heard of that man Frado clamp.
Mike, a Kant Twist style kit is still available in a few sizes. I don't recall the vendor offhand. If interested, check out Quinn's build series on her Blondihacks channel.
I like a good C-clamp myself! It would be kinda neat to do a video on the swivels....how they come apart, how to repair them etc. keep up the GREAT work!!!
Thanks
I too have more clamps than I need and some of them are good ones. Thanks for the video.
Still have clamps my Grandpa left me, old time quality .
I recently purchased a c-clamp from a box store. As I was tightening two 2x4s together, it snapped! I was building a hay feeder. True story.
If it was made in China, I am not surprised at all. But I’m still sickened by it
@mrpete222 it was made in China. I was just looking at the wilton website. I think I'm going to order a set. Thanks, Mr Pete
I’m in hollysprings NC Apex Tools is 10 min down the rd.
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That was a very good video. I wish you would stop putting yourself down. I love your content. Bye friend
I like the clamps (both "C" and pipe) that have wings instead of the sliding bar for tightening. They can't be used in all circumstances, but still nice to look at and use.
The fine thread on the v threads will allow a tighter clamp for any given size of ceoss bar. The square thread mooves forward much further in a quarter turn needing greater leverage than thw fine v thread.
I wish I could find some C clamps where the outside edges of the spine and leg were flat and wide so the clamp could stand on those surfaces.
Who cares, you say? I care. I have a tool drawer and shelf full of these. I stopped picking them up a few years ago as I finally admitted I really had no use for any more. I think you may have restarted the fire of my avarice.
I am always glad to hear from someone that actually cares. Yes, I stopped buying them also when I realized I was evidently hoarding them.
Lyle .
I feel the need for you to show us how to make some "good" swivels to replace the cheap originals.
I would watch.
I’m a C clamp fanatic myself, so thanks for the video. But for any clamp missing a swivel, why not make one as a shop project video?
Funny that we’d think of C-clamps as beautiful, but they are (at least some of them :-) I’m too lazy to get up and go look at it to share the details right now, but I have a beautiful old truly heavy-duty C-clamp in the basement that was my father’s, probably originally bought new 75 years ago now. It’s truly beautiful, with a wonderful patina from years of use. I don’t know the brand offhand, but it’s drop-forged with acme threads. - But you have me wondering about its swivel now though, and whether or not it’s truly worthy in that area… 😮
I have some of those, Armstrong/proto ones bought years ago from Boeing surplus $1 an inch
VERY interesting! I learned a lot
Now, I gotta go pull out all my C clamps... maybe 50? ... and see what I have!
Lucky, I inherited several Arm Strong C- clamps from my father who grew up in Chicago and was a welder.
Armstrong products were excellent. I don’t think they make them anymore. But fortunately there are still millions of them out there.
As a boy I drove a truck for an auto parts store that sold Proto tools. On a number of occasions I picked up orders from a tool factory in Franklin Park Illinois where Proto tools were alleged to have been made. Later (1960s) a neighbor worked there and he took parts from an old pistol I owned and chrome plated them for me.
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In the UK we call them "G" clamps. Yet more confirmation that we are two nations separated by a common language! I love Proto stuff too! I'll keep an eye for Plomb tools. Thanks.
Don't you mean "cramps?" 😊
I thought you people called F clamps G clamps?
@@1pcfred nah, f clamps are f clamps! 😂
huh I didn't know that about plomb and proto. I have some old plomb punches that came in an old tool-chest. It was full of some other interesting stuff, taper pins, old blue point screw removers and, I think there were home made engraving gravers.
Well done!
I’m going to defend Bubba. I’d bet those clamps with the holes were used by iron workers. We drill the holes to attach a tether to them so when you’re up in the air they don’t fall and kill someone. Clamps are cheaper than people.working in the field is completely different than in the shop
Thank you, that is interesting. Another reviewer said that they drilled a hole for the welding cable. And use the clamp as the ground clamp. There was welding spatter on one of them.
Who cares? I care, I really like your short subject videos. Keep making them.
Thanks, will do!
Hello Mr. Pete
This past weekend I picked up two Armstrong 78-408 clamps at a yard sale for $25 each!
Both in fantastic shape but they both have a 1/4" hole drilled in the same place as in your video
I was thinking maybe if a guy is working up high on some steel he could attach a leash to it through the hole to keep it from falling on someone's head and killing him
Nice score
The fine thread on the Williams will result in higher clamping pressure. Notice the diameter of the screw.
Interesting.Thank you.
Nice C CLAMPS
V threads give a higher mechanical advantage over Acme because of the smaller lead angle.
"Pearllite" or "Pearlitic"is not a brand name, but refers to a particular two-phase structure consistng of layers cementite and ferrite.
Yes but it's a microstructure of a certain type of steel, most likely a marketing thing, although I think there is a possibility of those being made of steel.
Thank you Mr. Pete! How are those swivels kept in place? I just saw you mentioned that the last one was held with a retaining clip. Just curious (signed “That annoying student who loved to ask questions”…lol).
lol
I think you under valued Brink and Cotton, they are very good clamps. They may not be your heaviest duty clamps, but they are nicely made. Yes cast as far as I can tell, but the swivel foot is heavier duty than others, and all of mine are intact. They are not as heavy duty as my Armstrongs, but they are not as heavy either, and will hold at least 2000 psi.
As far as V threads vs acme, my armstrongs (the big honkers w/no swivel) have V threads.. A Kurt vise has V threads. I questioned that, and it turns out that V thread can handle more pressure than an Acme.. Go figure .
Thank you for that information
In my 78 years, I have determined that there is only one country in the world that consistently makes certain items of high quality. That is the USA. Those items are bearings, razor blades, drill bits, hack saw blades, electric motors, and C-clamps. Everybody else, it is hit and miss on all of these items.
True
BTW, Armstrong is still around as the Apex Tool Group.
I like the old heavy duty Wilton clamps
Guess I should have watched the entire video because I thought you wasn’t going to mention the Wilton c clamp.
I still favor, Wilton s
My dad had some clamps with the short screw. It got aggravating sometimes when you just needed a little more screw length or needed two more hands to hold the shim and clamp and work the screw. I think my brother grabbed them when he passed.
There was a trademark infringement suit in the mid-to-late 1940's over the use of the name "Plomb" on tools. "Plumb", who had a registered mark dating from the 1920's had entered an agreement with Plomb over commecial use of the name after Plumb opposed the registration of the Plomb name at that time. The infringement suit was brought when Plomb allegedly violated the terms of the agreement. I suspect that this arose over the marketing of Plomb hammers and striking tools, a core business for Plumb.
Thanks
Thanks for that bit of insight. “Plumb” is the name I remember on quality hammers and hatchets. Not “Plomb”
Mr Pete , Which type of clamp/size do you recommend to hold a 5 inch bench vise or Wire wheel. My home shop is a small section of my garage so I have to put each away after use and store? I am on the hunt for clamps at yard sale/estate for this purpose. I saw your video on counter sinking a wood board. For the beginner can you tell me the the type of counter sink (I don't have one and approx bolt type). Sorry for such basic questions. These shorts are very educational. Thank you
Use a four or 5 inch C clamp depends on the thickness of your bench.
3/8 diameter bolts are probably what you need
I must have missed the A and B clamp videos.