I just finished building this after purchasing the plans. I have it paired with klipsch rp-280f towers for L & R channels. This replaced the rp-504c which I was always cranking up the volume and putting closed captions on as my favorite spot in the living room is 40 degrees off axis and I have to admit honestly the rule breaker build sounds so much more audibly clear off axis than the klipsch center channel. I can hear the dialog on movies much more pronounced and LEVEL across the seating from left to right up to around 50 degrees or so. I am not concerned one bit about tamber matching as I was more looking for a better experience with the channel that put out 90 % of movies and television. This thing is a winner!
Thank you! I am so glad to hear that you are enjoying it! That is high praise. Sounds like it is doing exactly what it was intended. It's always good to hear people experiences and see what they paired it with. Thanks again for sharing!
I agree. We really wanted to go with something smaller as there aren’t many good options out there. When you go larger there’s quite a few different options that perform similarly. So the goal with this one was to design something that fits an area that seems overlooked.
Came here to learn something about centre speaker, and then I just sit back and enjoyed the craftsmanship of this beautiful solid cherry wood box. Masterclass! So satisfying to watch!
That's a great solution to the MTM center channel problem with video and measurements to back it up. I've messed with those woofers before... they're little beasts! I bet this setup plays pretty loudly before distortion creeps in.
Great build. Really appreciate the additional focus on showing the measurements and theory in addition to the practical of the build. Also, with the crossover point so low, it makes me wonder if you could get away with dual 8" drivers to further extend the low end. The box would be pretty big, but if size doesn't matter, or if it's behind a projector screen then it could be a interesting build, even as a tabletop / room speaker. 🤔
Very cool project and good idea!! Thx! Facinating how a so important speaker (center) is typically designed to allow placement instead of desiged to reproduce sound correctly on and off axis.
This bmr is on my bucket list of speaker projects to try and listen to. Great video! By the way, the German DIY loudspeaker magazin "Hobby Hifi" has designed an entire series of speakers based around that tectonic bmr with additional Dayton reference drivers. People seem to be quite impressed. The series is called "daydream" for anyone interested.
Wow, I'm super impressed you got those boards that flat with just a planer. I thought for sure you were going to joint them or at least use a jointing sled in your planer. Your project came out amazing.
I notice that you don't use any gasket material. I know some drivers have it but this "tweeter" doesn't nor does the woofers. What's the point of sealing the rest of the box if you leave the drivers unsealed ? Just curious.
That was a nice project, very creative and looks like it turned out quite well. I really liked the way the real wood sandwiched cabinet was cut, assembled and finished. The logic behind the driver choice seems to make sense and the frequency responses were good too. Nice video shooting and editing!
I was just searching all of your videos for a center solution for my space and just as I was starting to think there is no solution, you upload this video 🥳🥳🥳 thank you so much 🥹
This video has so many great details. I like the way you showed the brand of sandpaper. Diablo makes great stuff;I have been using Dura-Gold lately. It is more bodywork than woodwork oriented, but I have been happy with the results. I know it takes extra work to create this way, but I always "like" your production work as well as the project itself.
Doesn't matter if it's a cheap speaker or a highend one, if it's M-T-M laying flat, it will have a bad horizontal off-axis response and pushing crossover point lower will help a lot. Especially with BMR, which has crazy good off-axis response (they measure pretty good even 90° off-axis).
the performance of those BMRs is really amazing. i remember first reading/seeing polar plots of the d'appolito design in one of radio shack's speaker books as a kid and how it controls vertical dispersion (in normal upright mode) - so by flipping it on its side we are getting the worst of both worlds - great vertical dispersion and terrible horizontal.
Very cool little speaker. I see the appeal for a compact center channel with great off axis response for sure but personally I don't do anything with surround sound. I can see a similar version making a great self powered BT speaker though if the bass is good enough on its own. Also do you think that BMR driver would work in open baffle config instead of its own sealed chamber?
@toid just got the plans. But I have a little issue. I have a Marantz nr-1609 AVR and the output is only 70watt per channel. And I only have pre-outs for the front left and right speakers. So… will the speaker work if my amp only has 70watt for it?
Nice build. I would have liked to see the test measurements made at a distance of an average listener (say ~10-15 feet). I went even simpler... I ditched my traditional single center and re-used a pair of older 8 ohm bookshelf speakers I had laying around. I wired them in parallel to get the 4 ohms my AV needs and placed them on their sides (tweeters to the center) under the TV toed out from each other about 15-25 degrees. It actually works great and improved the center radiation pattern, spreading it out plenty to cover my main listening/seating positions. I can adjust them as needed, based on how wide I need it to cover. I can even phase offset them by setting one back a bit from the other to help remove middle low end dead spots. I'm surprised that manufacturer's don't make centers with adjustable patterns.
Can you give more details - I have the klipsch rp-450c and I am sick of how poorly it performs off center and am searching for a wide sound stage patter for my center. Why I'm watching this video.... But how did you do wore them together? ... How would I keep the same 8 ohm? I have two klipsch rp-400m that I could use if I knew how to do it.... Any advice I would appreciate it
@@tomconnell7154 Your speakers are rated to 50W RMS at 8 ohms, so you could hook them in parallel (4 ohm load net) and use a single 4 ohm 100W resistor in series to both to balance the draw from your amp so it does not sound louder than the other channels. If you don't add the resistor, you take the chance of overloading the amp's center channel (too much power draw).
@@csimetplease forgive me as I am very GREEN on this....couldn't I use a speaker selector box with impedance protection built in to do this as well ? what are you thoughts...any help is appreciated.
@@csimet well I was looking at either the OSD ISS4 or the PYLE PSS4 ....also I am wondering if my Klipsch RP-500M would work better. The amplifier to connect to is the OSD Nero XA5180 - provides 150W per channel (8 Ohms), 250W per channel (4 ohms) do you think either switch would work fine with the speakers hooked up through the switch and that amp? Don't want to hurt the speakers or the amp.
Nice build! I think it would have been good to include a subjective listening portion to the review. Although the frequency response graph is night and day better, it would be good to hear your overall thoughts comparing the quality of the sound in the on vs off axis for both speakers.
That would have been good idea. Maybe it will be a good follow up video. Currently working on 3D printing an enclosure for this to test the differences vs the solid wood enclosure I already built.
Just discovered your channel by recommendation from Erin - wow really awesome video! The end result came out looking sweet and probably performs more than enough for the typical household's living room setup. I'd be very interested in seeing distortion & compression figures - I assume the BMR will be a bottleneck in this regard.
Thanks for coming by. I really appreciate it. And love everything Erin does. He’s such a great asset to the Audio community. The main issues with the BMR arise under 250hz, which is why we crossed it over higher than that. But you are correct. The BMR is low sensitivity and can only handle so much power. This type of design is good for small bedrooms and living rooms. Which is where I felt there really weren’t many good alternatives. When you go larger, there’s a lot of great designs that don’t have the off axis issues I’m describing in the video. Although, admittedly there are still a lot of bad designs as well.
Did you know Cambridge Audio made a commercial version of this design? The aero 5 center, it was part of a surround sound system but they seem to have discontinued it sadly.
Great diy :). How it sounds a longer distance eg. 16ft (5meters).? I have problem withn my tannoy center speaker to get nice clear voice at longer distance.
I'm building pods to test these same BMR drivers in my Jetta so this video is a shot of confidence. I was planning to use a SEAS 1" soft-dome tweeter though because I have heard that they can get a bit "papery" sounding on the high end. Have you seen those Philharmonic speakers using these things. dadgum they get good reviews. And I was planning to cross them over at about 500Hz which seems like a nice compromise to their range and the midbass in the doors.
It’s considered a nominal 4ohm load. Having said that, I was concerned that my surround sound receiver might have issues with that. But I tried it on three different ones I had in the house, and none of them had an issue playing them.
@@Toid sounds good. I’m guessing as long as I don’t turn it up crazy loud and put a big strain on the receiver it will be just fine… looking forward to building them and testing them out. Thanks 🙏
If I understand placement, no speakers are going to be ideal in that placement. Having says that, these so do about the best you can, especially with the eye off axis response. Which is exactly what you would want in that situation
@@Toid One of the machines I work on in my job uses a 3,500 watt CO2 laser. 10.6 micron wavelength (infrared). It runs on 480 volt 3-phase. It's used for an annealing process in manufacturing semiconductors. It's also used in other industries for cutting steel. It's probably a little much for what I need at home🙂 I'm eventually going to get something probably similar to the one you have.
@@Toid Do you have an affiliate relationship with Amazon? I'm thinking about ordering the xTool in a couple weeks just before I head back home next time. Your Amazon link isn't the particular one I need however, I'm looking at one that includes the extension package. If you have an affiliate relationship let me know and I'll send you the link to the one I want to order so you can set up a link where you get credit.
@@mfkhometheater7742 thank you for asking. I am an affiliate with Amazon. Let me know and I’ll send over a link. Also if you would share a project on it with me sometime, I’d love to see what you do with it.
@@Toid I know side to side effects the dispersion off axis left to right, but didn't know how on top of each other would differ. Thinking of how a line array works for example, and still having the stacked small drivers playing lower hz range like this design.
First off, great channel! Love the clarity in explanations and love the craftsmanship. I am looking to add a center speaker to my setup. After gathering some info on ready made speakers I stumbled on diy, and of course I landed on your channel.😄 I'm using a set of old Hepta streets for my fronts, and a set of Canton Fonum 601's as rears. I would really like to add a center speaker, and maybe later add a sub and maybe even height speakers, but I do not know what to look for if I want the sound to match. Can you or anyone else advice me in which direction to look? I would really like to try and build it myself although I've never done it before. Size is not really an issue, but it shouldn't break the bank.😅 Keep up the great work!
Is there a 8ohm variant of the BMR speaker? Or recommend another similar speaker? I’m trying to make a 3 way center but 3 way crossovers don’t take 4ohm speakers.
So what would you say is a good frequency to crossover in general such that the woofers don't cancel out (comb filtering as you taught me) ? I also wish to make a center channel for my home theater as a 3way with a tweeter and midrange in a vertical manner and two woofers one on the left and one on the right? Idk what drivers I'm going to use as of yet but let's go with 5" or 6" woofers, a 1" tweeter and a 4" full range (just throwing numbers out there)
There is no set frequency. you want to figure out the wavelength of the crossover point and then check the center to Center spacing of the woofers and make sure that you have not exceeded that wavelength. That will change based on the size of the woofers and their distance to each other.
@@Toid So based on the length of the wavelength of the crossover point, I have to look at this extract the length of the wave into my units (inches) and I have to makes sure that my woofers center to center to do exceed this wavelength. Its safe to say that the larger the woofers (based on physical limitations of size) the farther apart they're likely to be, which means I'd have to lower the crossover of the woofers to the midrange to make sure the wavelength is larger or the same as the distance center to center of the woofers?
Love this build… would those woofers, and an extra tweeter, with an inbuilt amp & battery make a decent boom box? Boom box has similar off axis challenges
You’d wanna keep it exactly the way it’s designed not add anything extra. But you could add an amp and a battery and have a pretty fun boombox. Or build two of them on either side with the amp and the battery in the middle and that would be fun.
Hello. I have experienced that if you have too bright frequencies in the midrange, it becomes directional in bright frequencies. The best ones are to have as dark a sound as possible, example down to 1.5k in the midrange and a treble that goes down to 1.5k Correct me if this is wrong.
LMAO! , i bought 2 polk audio center channel speakers, but i built bigger speaker cabinets, they were going to become bluetooth speakers ,added a 6" subwoofer and cross over, one i am using for center channel, applied a 6 1/2" lazy susan mount around sub/ firing downward to position any way i want,,,5.1 stereo with the extra sub on center channel sounds amazing, 2 tannoy platinum white towers , JBL sub and Onkyo receiver.Made in 2020
Nice idea but frankly at that size, you could just use a regular MTM driver setup and use it vertically under the TV. The problem is to find the space for a large capable center speaker under your TV that still has a good off axis response.
I've been searching for quality 4" midrange drivers to replace some cheap/weak midranges I have in some existing speakers. I can't seem to find any Dayton speakers that are midrange at all. They have "mid-bass", "mid-woofer" and full range drivers. Are any of those good as a midrange?
What are the downsides to this solution? There must be some reason manufacturers don't offer this option. All audio design choices are a compromise, so what is this design's weaker area? How would increasing the budget alleviate any weaknesses?
Sensitivity although good, isn't as good as it could be if the technology wasn't used through adding mass to control how the modes develop within the driver diaphragm. However I think probably the biggest reason you don't see manufacturers/companies using these is because it's proprietary tech to Tectonic Audio Labs. This means manufacturers of speakers might worry about stocking issues and raising the price of the drivers since there's no competition in the field. But for us as DIYers, we don't need to worry about the production of the drivers or where they come from. So for people like us I think they're amazing little drivers!
How high end is it? I would like to sell my emotivas b1'a and replace them by some not so expensive diy solution. Could you compare it to any store bought normal sepaker?
You could 3-D print this. That is assuming that you have the height or a bed big enough. But I think we might have summer if those videos in the future.
@@Elliott-Designs nice, i did one like the svs prime elevation but with a sealed and 6.5" woofer . my cross over was not quite right but still sounded really really good. i cant wait to see it.
Why do they make most center channel speakers to only go as low as 100hz? I would think as low 80Hz would be better to accommodate the Male voice that can go as low as 85Hz. Especially if they are singing. I would almost think I may be missing out if the singing voice from a song was sent to the center channel and It may not be going low enough.
It really depends on what your subwoofers are capable of in your personal taste. Most larger center channel speaker do you get crossed over at 80 or even 60 Hz. Small speakers like this, you start getting distortion creeping in when you try to cross over to low. You could crosses over at 80 hertz depending on your room. of course, with this being sealed you could really crossing over 80 hertz no matter what if you really wanted to.
Good question. For the price they aren’t bad. But they aren’t good either. Basically they are worth what you are paying, nothing more. I’d rather build something like this or similar for around the same price. You’ll get better performance. But if subversive said they didn’t want to build and only had $60 for a speaker, then I’d offer it as an option.
@@Toid Thanks Nick! Sounds like the best bet is to stay in the higher priced and better reviewed speaker lines or go DIY with your designs or some of similar quality. May I ask what your current/favorite HT speakers are? Thanks again and all the very best to you and yours.
I have some diy skills. I don't know anything about building speakers and my knowledge is very limited. I want to build a home theater setup. I want to use preferably small speakers like one in this video. Would you suggest me to put one of these at each channel left, right, right, back, top and sides. Or would suggest me some different configuration.
I just finished building this after purchasing the plans. I have it paired with klipsch rp-280f towers for L & R channels. This replaced the rp-504c which I was always cranking up the volume and putting closed captions on as my favorite spot in the living room is 40 degrees off axis and I have to admit honestly the rule breaker build sounds so much more audibly clear off axis than the klipsch center channel. I can hear the dialog on movies much more pronounced and LEVEL across the seating from left to right up to around 50 degrees or so. I am not concerned one bit about tamber matching as I was more looking for a better experience with the channel that put out 90 % of movies and television. This thing is a winner!
Thank you! I am so glad to hear that you are enjoying it! That is high praise. Sounds like it is doing exactly what it was intended. It's always good to hear people experiences and see what they paired it with. Thanks again for sharing!
I solved the center speaker problem by no longer using a center. I just run 3 JBL 530s as L/C/R.
Awesome speaker! Awesome video! Pure fire. 🔥🔥🔥🔥
Nice project. It looks like it minimizes typical MTM issues. Size will limit output, but this will work for a lot of setups out there.
I agree. We really wanted to go with something smaller as there aren’t many good options out there. When you go larger there’s quite a few different options that perform similarly. So the goal with this one was to design something that fits an area that seems overlooked.
Came here to learn something about centre speaker, and then I just sit back and enjoyed the craftsmanship of this beautiful solid cherry wood box. Masterclass! So satisfying to watch!
What an amazing video Nick! You really got it all in one video, I wasn't expecting that 😂. Looking forward to sharing my version of the project 😁.
Amazing video! This style really solves a lot of problems, great work!!
I found the music a little dramatic for the video. It was more appropriate for a video of someone climbing Mt. Everest and making itt to the summit.
That's a great solution to the MTM center channel problem with video and measurements to back it up. I've messed with those woofers before... they're little beasts! I bet this setup plays pretty loudly before distortion creeps in.
Thanks Tom. I’m really looking forward to our project. I’m glad this one worked out as well as it did.
Great build. Really appreciate the additional focus on showing the measurements and theory in addition to the practical of the build. Also, with the crossover point so low, it makes me wonder if you could get away with dual 8" drivers to further extend the low end. The box would be pretty big, but if size doesn't matter, or if it's behind a projector screen then it could be a interesting build, even as a tabletop / room speaker. 🤔
I can't believe this video only have 680 likes, you made an outstanding job with this center channel speaker. Beautiful.
Thank you
Very cool project and good idea!! Thx! Facinating how a so important speaker (center) is typically designed to allow placement instead of desiged to reproduce sound correctly on and off axis.
This bmr is on my bucket list of speaker projects to try and listen to. Great video!
By the way, the German DIY loudspeaker magazin "Hobby Hifi" has designed an entire series of speakers based around that tectonic bmr with additional Dayton reference drivers. People seem to be quite impressed. The series is called "daydream" for anyone interested.
Sweet! I’ll check them out. Thank you.
Wow, I'm super impressed you got those boards that flat with just a planer. I thought for sure you were going to joint them or at least use a jointing sled in your planer. Your project came out amazing.
I notice that you don't use any gasket material. I know some drivers have it but this "tweeter"
doesn't nor does the woofers. What's the point of sealing the rest of the box if you leave the drivers unsealed ? Just curious.
Nick, this is an outstanding video! Keep em coming 👍
Thank you.
I bought a xtool last week just can't wait until it arrives!
Great build and great lesson Nick. Thanks!
I was just looking at these drivers today! I want to make a small MTM set up for a practice! Amazing! 🥰
I built this kind of speaker some years ago, because I could not find this anywhere. I used 2 FRSX 5 as a "mini Line" in the middle. Perfect sound.
Great video as always! I have the 10 watt xtool d1 and love it! Inspires me to make more substantial builds with it like this!
I can’t wait to see what you build with it. You always come up with some great ideas! These losers are pretty awesome though, aren’t they?
@@Toid yeah absolutely lasers can do some things that a cnc cannot especially tight corners on cut throughs
That was a nice project, very creative and looks like it turned out quite well. I really liked the way the real wood sandwiched cabinet was cut, assembled and finished. The logic behind the driver choice seems to make sense and the frequency responses were good too. Nice video shooting and editing!
The concept is very interesting! I didn't know I suppose to lay that centre speaker vertically.
Oh, the plans page does not list this plan yet.
They are there now. 😁
@@Toid, Saw them w SVG, DXF as well. Nice!
Great Stuff Nick!!! Very helpful as usual. Love the measurement comparisons. Jealous of the laser cutter. Keep up the great work!!!
Don’t be jealous, just get one 😂😁
I was just searching all of your videos for a center solution for my space and just as I was starting to think there is no solution, you upload this video 🥳🥳🥳 thank you so much 🥹
How did your build go?
Nice.
If you ever make a box out of pine and it doesn't look good, char it and put lacquer on it, it's gonna look good.
Great Design 👍 love the laser 👌 factor again... polyfil behind the bmr 😮hopefully smoothed things out. Great Video 📹
Thanks toid! Finally a build plan id pay for lol
That was fun to watch. Very unique build. Nice work
This video has so many great details. I like the way you showed the brand of sandpaper. Diablo makes great stuff;I have been using Dura-Gold lately. It is more bodywork than woodwork oriented, but I have been happy with the results. I know it takes extra work to create this way, but I always "like" your production work as well as the project itself.
Thank you Dan. I really appreciate you and your insights. It helps me create better videos. I really thank you for that..
Awesome video 💪🏽
Thanks toid. Inspiring
Think I'm gonna build one of these when I get the audio shed set up.
You know you are going to have to show it to me when you are finished!
Ignoring all the expensive tools, you spent $100 + alot of time to beat a sub $50 center speaker?, why not compare it to something highend.
TH-camrs only respond to compliments and as kisses.
Doesn't matter if it's a cheap speaker or a highend one, if it's M-T-M laying flat, it will have a bad horizontal off-axis response and pushing crossover point lower will help a lot. Especially with BMR, which has crazy good off-axis response (they measure pretty good even 90° off-axis).
This is a great design and video. For some reason I do not see the plans in your website.
They are there now. Sorry for the delay
This is one of the reasons why I have the Nubert nuVero surround set - technical perfection.
So 100 bucks for the build and a bank loan for all the gear used 😅
the performance of those BMRs is really amazing. i remember first reading/seeing polar plots of the d'appolito design in one of radio shack's speaker books as a kid and how it controls vertical dispersion (in normal upright mode) - so by flipping it on its side we are getting the worst of both worlds - great vertical dispersion and terrible horizontal.
Yup. Except this design doesn’t have those deficiencies that a typical MTM has.
I am consumed with laser envy. Also, that is a fancy looking fire place!
Thank you. Still working on it. I can’t wait for it to be finished.
Nice build 👏
I cloned the linkwitz Riley speakers to use the 3.5 in BMR for the open baffle tweeter.. it’s incredible. With dispersion and crystal clear
That’s awesome! I do really enjoy the BMR dispersion. They should get more love.
Very well thought-out, very well executed.
Very cool little speaker. I see the appeal for a compact center channel with great off axis response for sure but personally I don't do anything with surround sound. I can see a similar version making a great self powered BT speaker though if the bass is good enough on its own. Also do you think that BMR driver would work in open baffle config instead of its own sealed chamber?
That really worked well. Alot of range and the 1-2khz range didnt dip at all like the centre speaker.....this is a work of art Toids, well done
@toid just got the plans. But I have a little issue. I have a Marantz nr-1609 AVR and the output is only 70watt per channel. And I only have pre-outs for the front left and right speakers. So… will the speaker work if my amp only has 70watt for it?
Looks beautiful bro ,the cherry accents those drivers ❤
Nice build. I would have liked to see the test measurements made at a distance of an average listener (say ~10-15 feet). I went even simpler... I ditched my traditional single center and re-used a pair of older 8 ohm bookshelf speakers I had laying around.
I wired them in parallel to get the 4 ohms my AV needs and placed them on their sides (tweeters to the center) under the TV toed out from each other about 15-25 degrees. It actually works great and improved the center radiation pattern, spreading it out plenty to cover my main listening/seating positions. I can adjust them as needed, based on how wide I need it to cover. I can even phase offset them by setting one back a bit from the other to help remove middle low end dead spots.
I'm surprised that manufacturer's don't make centers with adjustable patterns.
Can you give more details - I have the klipsch rp-450c and I am sick of how poorly it performs off center and am searching for a wide sound stage patter for my center. Why I'm watching this video.... But how did you do wore them together? ... How would I keep the same 8 ohm? I have two klipsch rp-400m that I could use if I knew how to do it.... Any advice I would appreciate it
@@tomconnell7154 Your speakers are rated to 50W RMS at 8 ohms, so you could hook them in parallel (4 ohm load net) and use a single 4 ohm 100W resistor in series to both to balance the draw from your amp so it does not sound louder than the other channels. If you don't add the resistor, you take the chance of overloading the amp's center channel (too much power draw).
@@csimetplease forgive me as I am very GREEN on this....couldn't I use a speaker selector box with impedance protection built in to do this as well ? what are you thoughts...any help is appreciated.
@@tomconnell7154 If the box does impedance matching, then you should be fine. Curious... what unit are you going to use?
@@csimet well I was looking at either the OSD ISS4 or the PYLE PSS4 ....also I am wondering if my Klipsch RP-500M would work better. The amplifier to connect to is the OSD Nero XA5180 - provides 150W per channel (8 Ohms), 250W per channel (4 ohms) do you think either switch would work fine with the speakers hooked up through the switch and that amp? Don't want to hurt the speakers or the amp.
Can this be upscaled to something big in order to become the perfect center channel complement to the Phil BMR monitors?
This is my question as well, if space isn't a concern why not go bigger
You can, but the main issue with going bigger would be the lack of sensitivity in the BMR. This might become problematic with larger woofers.
Please do a 5.1 DIY and a how-to on setting up old working 5.0 speakers with a diy amp and sub
Very Nice!
I wasn't gonna build this speaker, but the music convinced me otherwise 🎶🔊🎼
@@shawnbrennan7075 ha ha, nice. Usually I get the opposite reaction. 😁😂😁
Nice build! I think it would have been good to include a subjective listening portion to the review. Although the frequency response graph is night and day better, it would be good to hear your overall thoughts comparing the quality of the sound in the on vs off axis for both speakers.
That would have been good idea. Maybe it will be a good follow up video. Currently working on 3D printing an enclosure for this to test the differences vs the solid wood enclosure I already built.
I love the TCP 115
Beautiful work as always ☕️👍🏻
Just discovered your channel by recommendation from Erin - wow really awesome video! The end result came out looking sweet and probably performs more than enough for the typical household's living room setup. I'd be very interested in seeing distortion & compression figures - I assume the BMR will be a bottleneck in this regard.
Thanks for coming by. I really appreciate it. And love everything Erin does. He’s such a great asset to the Audio community.
The main issues with the BMR arise under 250hz, which is why we crossed it over higher than that. But you are correct. The BMR is low sensitivity and can only handle so much power. This type of design is good for small bedrooms and living rooms. Which is where I felt there really weren’t many good alternatives. When you go larger, there’s a lot of great designs that don’t have the off axis issues I’m describing in the video. Although, admittedly there are still a lot of bad designs as well.
Yep I agree. Again, really cool design and looking forward to following your future endeavors
Did you know Cambridge Audio made a commercial version of this design?
The aero 5 center, it was part of a surround sound system but they seem to have discontinued it sadly.
I did not know that. That’s really awesome. And you’re right, it’s very similar
Great diy :). How it sounds a longer distance eg. 16ft (5meters).? I have problem withn my tannoy center speaker to get nice clear voice at longer distance.
14:48 nice responce toid!!
It’s pretty amazing! Definitely surprised me in a good way
What sort out output levels can this design reach without noteworthy compression?
What are the crossover parts?
@@_.Dave._ there are listed in the build plans
I'm building pods to test these same BMR drivers in my Jetta so this video is a shot of confidence. I was planning to use a SEAS 1" soft-dome tweeter though because I have heard that they can get a bit "papery" sounding on the high end. Have you seen those Philharmonic speakers using these things. dadgum they get good reviews. And I was planning to cross them over at about 500Hz which seems like a nice compromise to their range and the midbass in the doors.
Hi I couldnt find a link of where to buy one of these...
The Tweeter is 4 ohms, while the woofers are 8 ohms, so do you parallel the woofers and put the tweeter in series for a total of 8 ohms?
Will the crossover for the woofer be the same if i only want a single woofer ?
No
Why not use tebm65 in the center role? It would eat a bit more power and the low end can be provided by woofers to the sides.
What is the final impedance on the speaker? 4? 6? 8? I’m about to build 3 sets of them and just curious. Thanks 🙏
It’s considered a nominal 4ohm load. Having said that, I was concerned that my surround sound receiver might have issues with that. But I tried it on three different ones I had in the house, and none of them had an issue playing them.
@@Toid sounds good. I’m guessing as long as I don’t turn it up crazy loud and put a big strain on the receiver it will be just fine… looking forward to building them and testing them out. Thanks 🙏
@@zeldatearsofthekingdom3577how'd your build go? I built one and I like it. I bought the parts to build two more.
An amazing video.
Please check your email and help me, i would love to invite you to test our projector.
Hi awesome video, may I know what was your final impendance. Thanks.
I absolutely love it. I’m gonna be building two more.
would this speaker work alright as rears with one on each side hung on a wall? the seating would be pushed up against the same wall
If I understand placement, no speakers are going to be ideal in that placement. Having says that, these so do about the best you can, especially with the eye off axis response. Which is exactly what you would want in that situation
I was wondering if you could recommend a pre-built crossover for this speaker?
Beautiful job! I have to get one of those laser cutters.
They definitely can be handy
@@Toid One of the machines I work on in my job uses a 3,500 watt CO2 laser. 10.6 micron wavelength (infrared). It runs on 480 volt 3-phase. It's used for an annealing process in manufacturing semiconductors. It's also used in other industries for cutting steel. It's probably a little much for what I need at home🙂 I'm eventually going to get something probably similar to the one you have.
@@mfkhometheater7742 holy cow! That’s insane!!
@@Toid Do you have an affiliate relationship with Amazon? I'm thinking about ordering the xTool in a couple weeks just before I head back home next time. Your Amazon link isn't the particular one I need however, I'm looking at one that includes the extension package. If you have an affiliate relationship let me know and I'll send you the link to the one I want to order so you can set up a link where you get credit.
@@mfkhometheater7742 thank you for asking. I am an affiliate with Amazon. Let me know and I’ll send over a link. Also if you would share a project on it with me sometime, I’d love to see what you do with it.
nice board. Cherry is great to work.
How would this work out with two of the smaller drivers stacked in the center?
It wouldn’t work well, and it would actually defeat the purpose of what we’re trying to accomplish
@@Toid I know side to side effects the dispersion off axis left to right, but didn't know how on top of each other would differ. Thinking of how a line array works for example, and still having the stacked small drivers playing lower hz range like this design.
First off, great channel! Love the clarity in explanations and love the craftsmanship. I am looking to add a center speaker to my setup. After gathering some info on ready made speakers I stumbled on diy, and of course I landed on your channel.😄 I'm using a set of old Hepta streets for my fronts, and a set of Canton Fonum 601's as rears. I would really like to add a center speaker, and maybe later add a sub and maybe even height speakers, but I do not know what to look for if I want the sound to match. Can you or anyone else advice me in which direction to look? I would really like to try and build it myself although I've never done it before. Size is not really an issue, but it shouldn't break the bank.😅
Keep up the great work!
Is there a 8ohm variant of the BMR speaker? Or recommend another similar speaker? I’m trying to make a 3 way center but 3 way crossovers don’t take 4ohm speakers.
So what would you say is a good frequency to crossover in general such that the woofers don't cancel out (comb filtering as you taught me) ? I also wish to make a center channel for my home theater as a 3way with a tweeter and midrange in a vertical manner and two woofers one on the left and one on the right? Idk what drivers I'm going to use as of yet but let's go with 5" or 6" woofers, a 1" tweeter and a 4" full range (just throwing numbers out there)
There is no set frequency. you want to figure out the wavelength of the crossover point and then check the center to Center spacing of the woofers and make sure that you have not exceeded that wavelength. That will change based on the size of the woofers and their distance to each other.
@@Toid So based on the length of the wavelength of the crossover point, I have to look at this extract the length of the wave into my units (inches) and I have to makes sure that my woofers center to center to do exceed this wavelength. Its safe to say that the larger the woofers (based on physical limitations of size) the farther apart they're likely to be, which means I'd have to lower the crossover of the woofers to the midrange to make sure the wavelength is larger or the same as the distance center to center of the woofers?
@@hermangaviria690 exactly. And larger, of course means crossover earlier.
Love this build… would those woofers, and an extra tweeter, with an inbuilt amp & battery make a decent boom box? Boom box has similar off axis challenges
You’d wanna keep it exactly the way it’s designed not add anything extra. But you could add an amp and a battery and have a pretty fun boombox. Or build two of them on either side with the amp and the battery in the middle and that would be fun.
Hello. I have experienced that if you have too bright frequencies in the midrange, it becomes directional in bright frequencies. The best ones are to have as dark a sound as possible, example down to 1.5k in the midrange and a treble that goes down to 1.5k
Correct me if this is wrong.
can you design a 4x 6.5woofer design
Could you mod the daytun with that full range middle speaker and your crossover, would be a lot easier for us non carpentry.
Can the rule breaker be used as side mains In a vocals only venue.
I’m not sure what you’re asking. But they would make a great stereo speaker or even front mains in a small home theater.
@@Toid i listen to singing without any music. So these will work for me
Really nice, what were your settings on the laser to do that?
LMAO! , i bought 2 polk audio center channel speakers, but i built bigger speaker cabinets, they were going to become bluetooth speakers ,added a 6" subwoofer and cross over, one i am using for center channel, applied a 6 1/2" lazy susan mount around sub/ firing downward to position any way i want,,,5.1 stereo with the extra sub on center channel sounds amazing, 2 tannoy platinum white towers , JBL sub and Onkyo receiver.Made in 2020
Nice idea but frankly at that size, you could just use a regular MTM driver setup and use it vertically under the TV. The problem is to find the space for a large capable center speaker under your TV that still has a good off axis response.
I've been searching for quality 4" midrange drivers to replace some cheap/weak midranges I have in some existing speakers.
I can't seem to find any Dayton speakers that are midrange at all. They have "mid-bass", "mid-woofer" and full range drivers.
Are any of those good as a midrange?
I would highly recommend the new signature series.
Amazing work. Now add a super tweeter :)
What are the downsides to this solution? There must be some reason manufacturers don't offer this option. All audio design choices are a compromise, so what is this design's weaker area? How would increasing the budget alleviate any weaknesses?
Sensitivity although good, isn't as good as it could be if the technology wasn't used through adding mass to control how the modes develop within the driver diaphragm. However I think probably the biggest reason you don't see manufacturers/companies using these is because it's proprietary tech to Tectonic Audio Labs. This means manufacturers of speakers might worry about stocking issues and raising the price of the drivers since there's no competition in the field.
But for us as DIYers, we don't need to worry about the production of the drivers or where they come from. So for people like us I think they're amazing little drivers!
How close was the mic to the speaker when you tested it?
Hello, I’m very new to this! I really want to design a Bluetooth speaker similar to this but how would you design this in winisd?
I have a whole series on WinISD that teaches you it.
Pretty nice. Would have liked more focus on the x-over construction. Those cnc wood tables are bassass.
Cute enclosure! That laser is probably not quite cheap.
More about the x-over please
How high end is it? I would like to sell my emotivas b1'a and replace them by some not so expensive diy solution. Could you compare it to any store bought normal sepaker?
Are these the same drivers used by logitech in some of their computer desktop speakers?
No
This looks like a perfect speaker to built in an amp, battery and wifi module and make it a "boom box".
id think it would be cool to see what you could do with a 3d printer desine apparently at 40% infill its close to hdf in resonant frequency
You could 3-D print this. That is assuming that you have the height or a bed big enough. But I think we might have summer if those videos in the future.
Aha! You should wait to see what I have planned if you're looking at going the 3D printed route 😉
@@Elliott-Designs nice, i did one like the svs prime elevation but with a sealed and 6.5" woofer . my cross over was not quite right but still sounded really really good. i cant wait to see it.
VERY impressive!
Why do they make most center channel speakers to only go as low as 100hz? I would think as low 80Hz would be better to accommodate the Male voice that can go as low as 85Hz. Especially if they are singing. I would almost think I may be missing out if the singing voice from a song was sent to the center channel and It may not be going low enough.
It really depends on what your subwoofers are capable of in your personal taste. Most larger center channel speaker do you get crossed over at 80 or even 60 Hz. Small speakers like this, you start getting distortion creeping in when you try to cross over to low. You could crosses over at 80 hertz depending on your room. of course, with this being sealed you could really crossing over 80 hertz no matter what if you really wanted to.
Nick, That center you built is a fantastic design - as always. I have to ask, Is that Dayton center and it's siblings worth buying? Thanks.
Good question. For the price they aren’t bad. But they aren’t good either. Basically they are worth what you are paying, nothing more. I’d rather build something like this or similar for around the same price. You’ll get better performance. But if subversive said they didn’t want to build and only had $60 for a speaker, then I’d offer it as an option.
@@Toid Thanks Nick! Sounds like the best bet is to stay in the higher priced and better reviewed speaker lines or go DIY with your designs or some of similar quality.
May I ask what your current/favorite HT speakers are? Thanks again and all the very best to you and yours.
I have some diy skills. I don't know anything about building speakers and my knowledge is very limited. I want to build a home theater setup. I want to use preferably small speakers like one in this video. Would you suggest me to put one of these at each channel left, right, right, back, top and sides. Or would suggest me some different configuration.
That would be the perfect configuration. You are spot on.
@@Toid Thanks for giving confirmation, I really appreciate you taking time to reply.
@@uditsaroch1744You should do it! I built one of these for the center and bought the parts to build two more.
LOL!, The oil for the finish cost more than the speaker!
😂👍
Good stuff though, Odies.
Haha, nice