Ive been binge watching these videos for over an hour at this point and they are hands down the best tutorials on youtube. Thanks for this wealth of knowledge
I was just explaining to someone this idea of pre-loading. The best physical description I came up with was the idea that steep jumps want to redirect your bike up. But your center of gravity is still moving forward. So if you don’t preload, you induce a forward roll and that results in the buck (like sprinting into a knee high wall). So pushing into and against the force created by the compression (redirection) moves that vector up without a roll and you just follow the flight arc. But the key is totally holding that compression in until the end. I always like to have people think about keeping their legs pretty much straight until the top of the arc just to exaggerate that movement until it’s muscle memory. Great vid again guys!
That’s actually a great explanation and makes totally sense. I’ve heard somewhere if you get better at jumps, you can feel them in your feet, like muscle memory.
As someone who rides only rigid bikes, I had a really hard time with people explaining the concept of preload as "loading the suspension" and then telling me to do it without suspension. This is a much better explanation, thank you!
Thank you for further unlocking my understanding of this bit of black magic ! I’m hesitant about not preloading into steep faced jumps but you guys are the second group of people who say I’m over thinking it !
I'm always amazed how clear you both can explain things. It's always explained in the best words that I can imagine, and than suddenly everything becomes clear. I'm Dutch speaking, but when I'm riding and practicing I keep on hearing in English the important words that make it happen. So I'm practicing tricks with English in my head :-) This is for every video that you make. Thank you for your video's, they've learned me a lot. After looking at your video's, I never can wait to practice.
Hey Simon - I met you out at Duthie a few months ago as you were prepping for a class, and you directed me to your videos here on YT. These things are fantastic! Some of the best tutorials I've seen yet, and really helping my riding. Thanks, man!
I think the really valuable bit of information here is the explicit point about the ‘direction of the knee caps’ when creating pre-load. This concept unlocks the process. Feel that movement forward as part of the whole, and you will feel the ‘control’ great jumpers (not me then!) feel as they prep a jump. Once mastered, the ‘degree and direction’ of that forward and down movement of the knee caps become almost your flight controls for different jumps. I’ve never read this, but I suspect the reason good jumpers appear to have the perfect speed for jumps they have never seen is that they use this ‘knee cap’ flight control during the jump. They can feel the jump pushing back and moderate that by moderating the direction and force of that knee cap forward and down direction.
Love this note. We talk about 'volume control' when jumping so that you can tweak your outcomes as needed based on speed, conditions and intended outcomes in the moment with exactly what you are describing. Being able to understand and imagine it is the start of being able to do it. -Simon
you are a good coach and well presented and explained. I had a crack at some steep rocky sections today and felt way more comfortable in the neutral position. Great videos keep them coming! From Down Under
I'm re-watching this and other Fluidride jumping videos the day after riding a bunch of Duthie trails for the first time (namely Gravy Train and HLC). I got bucked (not badly; just had a scary, long, nose heavy flight off the lip) on the very same HLC "ski" jump you're riding in this video. I went brakeless down the whole hill and was too active stomping into the compression/g-out, standing up too early and then just riding over the lip like that at high speed which kicked my rear wheel. It's like there's two distinct compression zones (g-out, lip) that more or less need to be treated as one longer one and I had some success slowing down a bit and thinking of it that way. This video really illustrates the body position during that process. I've also been inconsistent on feeling in control on smaller lipped jumps, especially higher speed "long and low" ones and now I know why! I guess I needed the context of a season or so of developing some rudimentary jumping technique for this video to make sense to me, but now it's very helpful.
this is really good, most tutorials go from a bunny hop to jump, on a bunny hop you lean back heels down to get the front up, its totally the opposite apparently. Will give this a shot, thanks and makes a lot of sense
I consider hopping and jumping two different skills as hops do require a slightly different movement. Hopping also requires use of the arms, something that should be left out with jumps for the most part. Hope it works well for you! -Simon
Vid is great cuz he’s riding a stumpy and not some crazy DH bike - my wife rides a stumpy and trying to get her more comfortable on jumps so this is very helpful and illustrates the fact that most people don’t need as much suspension as they think they do 👍🏻
If you master the preload for induced compression to achieve a hop and nail the timing you will also time the lift off perfectly. Preload works across the gambit also and gives you extra traction on a berm as well as achieving a float over terrain that slows you down. Just remember it is a fast and forceful movement with varying force.
Once again, invaluable information. A few days ago I got bucked on a small jump after doing several bigger jumps without a problem, which really confused me. (And it hurt - spent the afternoon in hospital with a dislocated finger and plenty of bruises). Now I understand. Thanks!
Oy. That sounds like a rough one! Yeah, it can be surprising that small jumps are actually more technical than bigger jumps. Hope you heal up fast! -Simon
Well not healing as fast as I want to, but keen to get back out there with what I've learned. Question though - what about Rebound? I think I had the rebound setting on the back wheel set incorrectly. So, I'm now assuming near maximum rebound damping at the rear, and closer to lowest at the front? Will that work (or not work) for short steep jumps vs other types of jumps? Just trying to figure this so I don't finish up back in hospital 🙂 Thanks!! Love your work @@Fluidride
@@quantumkookaburra You should have them set so that when you stand up centered over the bottom bracket, you get equal compression (travel used) when you push down through the legs only (no arm push). You should also get both ends returning at the same rate. This is a basic idea for setting the bike up. You will likely be somewhere in the middle of your rebound settings at each end. Balance front and rear is really important. You might seek some help or just use this basic guideline to get 'close' with your settings. Hope this helps! -Simon
@@Fluidride Thanks for taking the time to reply Simon! Good advice - I may be over thinking things. I'm 65 (years old) and just bought my first MTB. Been riding about 3 months. But I'm not one to wait - wanna ride Rampage 🙂 Well, maybe not, but, go big or go home. I'm in Australia, and struggling to find a coach. But I better before I bend it instead of send it 🙂
So often I watch videos that break down jumping and I just end up with a head full of disjointed mess…. But I trust you folks, so I hit play. Love the clarity of this explanation. Can’t wait to give this a shot - you’ve taken all the confusing bits and turned it into a simple flow; the question is can I turn that into some tidy, reliable jumps?
Thank you. I hope it helps! Keep in mind that we do offer video review services through both Fluidride and FluidrideOnline websites if you want me to take a look at your jumping.
I believe I saw you do this knees forward technique on a short video on approaching drops. Then I think you punched your feet into the pedals to get the bike to safely clear the edge of the drop and land on both wheels. I’ll have to hunt that down and rewatch it. Great video. Found it, knees forward as one approaches the edge of the drop and then shift hips back.
GO Linnea! Thanks a lot for this vid! In my area we have few big jumps and loads of small steep faced ones. I have not managed the timing right, resulting in losing my balance when jumping. I will try pre loading a bit sooner as you showed, and I feel confident that it will improve my technique!
Literally just rode Duthie last week (first time in Seattle area)! Recognized that lush green immediately. So different than here in SoCal, it was epic.
I wish the trails I ride had jumps like these, but it's mainly more natural, technical and sometimes slower terrain..so these types of videos are a bit foreign to me. I like the idea of starting out with the natural compression jumps.. they look super fun. Gotta try and find some similar trails around here because the jealousy is killing me!
Yeah, we are blessed for sure. But think of it this way: When you go through a long compression on a trail, even if not a jump, you are getting some skills practice for this as it's a very similar sensation to a long jump ramp hold. You can also think of jumping off natural terrain (featuring) as the ultimate in bringing your own compression into something on trail where a lot of the outcome is a result of the compression you make (pre-load). With this in mind you can get some reps on most rides. -Simon
@@Fluidride Yea I'm always looking for stuff to boost off, so I guess I'm getting some practice for bigger jumps without really thinking about it. Thanks Simon.
I’ve watched this video and your other jumping videos several times. Every time I watch them I learn more and more. Thanks for that. One question though: what would happen if I continue to hold compression after the rear tire leaves the lip? My problem is that I release compression too early. I can’t manage to get that take off/pop with good timing. I’m always early. TIA. 🤟🏼
1. THANK YOU!!! Amazing video, for me, right now! You said ONE sentence that really caught my attention, prompted this longer question - Have either of you ever ridden Deer Valley? Tsunami trail? I have limited experience hitting jumps. Most of my progression has been in the last few months... I was clearing the jumps on Tsunami, so I'm able to ride pretty well at this point (jumps - do NOT talk to me about Upper Fireswamp! LOL) Anyway - there is ONE jump on Tsunami that consistently bucks me. It's maybe 30-35 feet long. It has a nice long, downhill run in... and a TINY ramp. It's maybe 1.5 bike lengths - I never stopped to measure it... but tiny relative to all the other jumps on the trail. "The jump is so short, it might kick us" - is that IT? Am I just not preloading enough? After the first few times, I got scared... rolling on that front tire, for maybe 10-15 feet ALMOST otb, uncontrolled tends to do that to me. LOL Anyway - thank you! Preload with perfect timing - that's basically the 'secret' is what I am hearing, yes?
I don't know the trail or jump, but sounds like it has a bit too short a ramp for the length of the run in. Not sure if this is a gap, but my suggestion if you aren't worried about clearing it or going big then come in a bit more slowly and focus on letting the bike accelerate into the jump as you near it (releasing the brakes). This could create a better quality interaction with the jump as you might be using so much speed that you can't move comfortably into the jump and end up under pre-loading or getting kind of pushed into the short face of the jump. Of course if this is a gap you have to make then take that into consideration and use good judgement with this. This idea can help riders reduce speed needed to jump, which lessens our fear response on trail. Practice this where it's safe to do so. -Simon
LOVE IT, @@Fluidride!!!!! Thank you Simon!! Literally and physically slowing down in jumps is something I'm working on. LOL - that resulted in an OTB in a bike jump park a few weeks ago. -ouch. Recovering now, and I'm VERY excited to get back out there and try all the techniques you guys have taught me! :-) That jump is not a gap, but about a 25' long table that's dramatically short. Meaning it's only a 3 to 4 foot lip height and it's one of those where the table is beaten down so much that the last 5 feet of the table is grooved out at the same angle as the landing. Which is only SLIGHTLY more steep than the trail - virtually no transition between landing and trail. Anyway - YOU GUYS ROCK and I have an idea of how hard it is to produce these videos... HUGE props to you and your team! Thank you!!!!
How do you know where to start preloading when riding a new jump, if Simon isn't there laying down cones? In "Gauging Jump Speed: Practice Like a Pro #40" the cones for the kicker start a bike length out from the edge of the kicker ramp, while the pink cones in this video for the short faced jumps are near the bottom of where the jump starts.
Really great question! Basically the pre load (compression we make) should blend into the loading (compression the jump offers). This is the basic tenet that your never want to steer away from. The kicker ramp is VERY short, so I want the whole bike to be loaded before interaction with the little ramp. Basically, I'm making the bike think the jump is more than a wheel base long. If I load late into such a short ramp, I'll get bucked in the process. With the dirt jump, the takeoff is a bit longer -- just over a bike length -- which allows me to load slightly later as my whole bike fits on the jump. Hopefully this makes sense. I actually think of the kicker ramp as being more like featuring off natural terrain as the front and rear wheels are never on the ramp at the same time. -Simon
Everybody has a different way to describe and teach this skill. Everybody learns differently. This is as technical an explanation as I have seen. Nice job!
My front wheel always seems to drop off as soon as it leaves the lip of a jump rather than continuing to drive upwards till the back wheel reaches the lip. Some say to lean back with locked arms to drive the front wheel up, same say to row the bars to your hips. Please give me your advice on how to keep the front wheel going upward off a jump. I can jump ok, but would get much more air and distance if I could get that right. Thanks
The only thing I can think of if that you might be too far back on the bike. The rider should stay centered over the bottom bracket and their own legs. Be sure compression is being held through legs only and that the front wheel is not unloading until after interacting with the lip of the jump. If you aren't able to figure out what is going wrong, we do offer video based feedback on both our Fluidride website and our FluidrideOnline platform for $39. Hopefully staying centered on the bike and holding pressure though your legs will sort this out. Arms should not be used when learning to jump. Keep your arms relaxed as you jump. Doing this will help you stay balanced over your own legs, which is what is needed. I hope this helps! -Simon
That HLC g-out is intimidating! I always feel like I'm going to buckle if I charge in at full speed! What's a good way to progress on that one? Right now I'm braking a fair bit until halfway down the entry slope, then letting it go to make sure I'm accelerating into the jump.
Do not go full speed down that hill into the jump by any means. There is a big tree about half way down on the right I think. I'm on the brakes till that tree then off the brakes and into the jump. Always important to accelerate toward a jump, so enter slowly up top and let your speed build toward takeoff.
Most of the compression is building in the legs, but is just more visually apparent in the bike. Hard tails and even rigid bikes jump just fine, and follow the same basic rules! -Simon
You mention that you don't need to preload for the jumps on A-line. As someone who currently cases ~40% of the jumps on A-Line, I find it hard to convince myself that I don't need to preload for the 3-4 steeper-faced "high & short" jumps. It feels like I have to preload & pop to not get bucked by them, but maybe I'm thinking about it wrong..
Not saying that at all. You do need to with speed, but those jumps are crafted to allow you to really feel true compression. What I mean is that they are tailor made for jumping, where as more backwoods spots are not. There are a few jumps there (A-Line and Crank it Up) where the pre-load is offered by a big downhill going into the uphill takeoff, but most do require pre-load. Sorry if I wasn't clear about that. Glad you checked in!
I cannot jump yet, at least not as good as I would love to but I find the small jump really big when I remember how I started jumping. My advice for beginners is to start small and feel the jump, the bike coming into you and how you put it back down before getting into learning to handle bigger forces as they will be big and you need to learn how to control them
Great advice. I love the idea of thinking of it as deciding what to try or not try based on the forces involved. You are correct that this is what takes time to develop - the ability to deal with more and more force - with a a good outcome. -Simon
Thank you for the reply. BTW, great video! I still have a question: I'm able to do bunnyhop like a beginner does, ok but not really great. Still, I'd like to know how to translate that to jumping a table? My current jumping technique is similar to what is shown in the video but I'm afraid of the speed and I'd like to get more height hopping but I cannot seem to find the proper timing. Any advice on that? Thx
@@SunSnowGravity Remember that bunny hops are a bit different than jumps. With a hop, there is no jump so the arms are needed. With a jump, we want to keep the arms out of the mix for the most part. I'd try to keep these two skills in different categories in your mind as you practice. I hope this is helpful!
@@Fluidride yep, it does. Thank you! I'm actually working on correcting the issue I have with using my arms too much when jumping, pulling the handlebar it's my problem
That is super common to see and actually can end up in being pushed around awkwardly because you run into the jump force in an even less compressed state than you would have without any pre-load. Focus on letting the knees move toward the jump ramp as you practice. This is a very subtle move with the knees moving into the jump which creates some loading into the ramp. This trick can be helpful with timing. Also do your best to keep your upper body relaxed (belly button and up) as your lower body presses in (from core to feet). -Simon
Make sense, is it the same for hard tails? Loving the content since your return, keep up the great work and I wish you were in the UK as I suck at jumps! 🤘🤪
Hard tails: yes. Exactly the same. Don’t get fooled by the obvious fact that the shock is part of the process with full sus and not on the hard tail. What is different is that the shock and how the axle path moves with a full sus makes things easier for any given ‘arc of a jump’ and also flatters poor technique. So, the technique is exactly the same, but good technique is even more important. Remember, your legs, body and arms also perform the same function as the suspension!
Glad I read the comments. I had the same question. I only ride a hard tail. Have never even been on a full sis. Might like it too much then I’d have to get another bike 😮
We have 'travel weekends' where we stack up the classes. We get people from all over the country on those weekends and even from around the world. Would love to see you in class sometime! You can make massive progress in 2-3 days if you can come up sometime! If not, stay tuned for more videos:-).
Pre loading feels like jumping off a diving board to me. Where you compress down and then lift off straight up from the back tire off the lip of the jump.
Exactly the same. The loading is mostly in the legs, but shows up visibly via the suspension. I should have mentioned this in the video. But yeah, no change. You will actually get more air a given speed with the same inputs as no energy is lost to the suspension. Riders often confuse this and think the bikes suspension is doing the work. When properly tuned it just shows if our weight is in the right place. -Simon
When I preload my knees are still bent going in so I can manipulate the bike more in the air for whips etc. Is this the wrong approach. It looked Linnea's position would have been too outstretched for me?
The knees should be bent about to where the knee caps are over the toes and the hips are supported by the heels. You can stand up wherever you are and just feel what that means. Not a deep bend. Top jumpers 'typically' don't bend the knees a ton on take off. Of course this is a very dynamic sport with so may possible combinations that you can't really say exactly what someone should look like, but in my experience watching thousands of riders each year in our local park, most bend the knees too much for proper pop off a jump. Linnea's stance is good. She's not a crazy high level jumper, but has improved dramatically and largely because she is standing taller. I hope this helps. We do have some videos on this page of Jason jumping. He is a very high level jumper and super stylish in the air. He stands tall on takeoff. You mention bending knees on during pre-load so you can whip. So long as you are getting good pre-load, and a good flight arc, the way you stood during that pre-load should not affect what you can do in the air.
@@Fluidride Makes sense, great response thank you! I’m fairly new to these and don’t want to develop bad habits that will limit my growth down the line.
Ive been binge watching these videos for over an hour at this point and they are hands down the best tutorials on youtube. Thanks for this wealth of knowledge
Wow. Thank You. Means a lot to me. -Simon
I was just explaining to someone this idea of pre-loading. The best physical description I came up with was the idea that steep jumps want to redirect your bike up. But your center of gravity is still moving forward. So if you don’t preload, you induce a forward roll and that results in the buck (like sprinting into a knee high wall). So pushing into and against the force created by the compression (redirection) moves that vector up without a roll and you just follow the flight arc. But the key is totally holding that compression in until the end. I always like to have people think about keeping their legs pretty much straight until the top of the arc just to exaggerate that movement until it’s muscle memory. Great vid again guys!
That’s actually a great explanation and makes totally sense. I’ve heard somewhere if you get better at jumps, you can feel them in your feet, like muscle memory.
Thanks for this. All great points you made above. -Simon
FINALLY, a video that doesn't just explain 'preload' but shows what you should physically be doing and when to get that 'pop' off a jump or feature. 👍
I have literally deleted every other tutorial as this your explanation is the clearest. Well done sir!
As someone who rides only rigid bikes, I had a really hard time with people explaining the concept of preload as "loading the suspension" and then telling me to do it without suspension. This is a much better explanation, thank you!
Glad it resonated! All about loading the body really.
Thank you for further unlocking my understanding of this bit of black magic ! I’m hesitant about not preloading into steep faced jumps but you guys are the second group of people who say I’m over thinking it !
I'm always amazed how clear you both can explain things. It's always explained in the best words that I can imagine, and than suddenly everything becomes clear. I'm Dutch speaking, but when I'm riding and practicing I keep on hearing in English the important words that make it happen. So I'm practicing tricks with English in my head :-) This is for every video that you make. Thank you for your video's, they've learned me a lot. After looking at your video's, I never can wait to practice.
Hey Simon - I met you out at Duthie a few months ago as you were prepping for a class, and you directed me to your videos here on YT. These things are fantastic! Some of the best tutorials I've seen yet, and really helping my riding. Thanks, man!
Nice! Good to meet you in the park. I'm sure I'll see you there again.
I think the really valuable bit of information here is the explicit point about the ‘direction of the knee caps’ when creating pre-load. This concept unlocks the process. Feel that movement forward as part of the whole, and you will feel the ‘control’ great jumpers (not me then!) feel as they prep a jump. Once mastered, the ‘degree and direction’ of that forward and down movement of the knee caps become almost your flight controls for different jumps. I’ve never read this, but I suspect the reason good jumpers appear to have the perfect speed for jumps they have never seen is that they use this ‘knee cap’ flight control during the jump. They can feel the jump pushing back and moderate that by moderating the direction and force of that knee cap forward and down direction.
Love this note. We talk about 'volume control' when jumping so that you can tweak your outcomes as needed based on speed, conditions and intended outcomes in the moment with exactly what you are describing. Being able to understand and imagine it is the start of being able to do it. -Simon
Great instruction and tips. Linnea sure was smooth coming through those small jumps. Great work!
you are a good coach and well presented and explained. I had a crack at some steep rocky sections today and felt way more comfortable in the neutral position. Great videos keep them coming! From Down Under
Best mtb tutorials on TH-cam imo
Most excellent instruction and editing, explained in a way that really makes sense. Cheers all
This video is perfect timing for where I am in my progression. Thank you Simon and Linnea!
Best jumping tutorial I’ve seen!
Great video, and explanation. Now, I need to practice this, keeping all this in mind.
I'm re-watching this and other Fluidride jumping videos the day after riding a bunch of Duthie trails for the first time (namely Gravy Train and HLC). I got bucked (not badly; just had a scary, long, nose heavy flight off the lip) on the very same HLC "ski" jump you're riding in this video. I went brakeless down the whole hill and was too active stomping into the compression/g-out, standing up too early and then just riding over the lip like that at high speed which kicked my rear wheel. It's like there's two distinct compression zones (g-out, lip) that more or less need to be treated as one longer one and I had some success slowing down a bit and thinking of it that way. This video really illustrates the body position during that process.
I've also been inconsistent on feeling in control on smaller lipped jumps, especially higher speed "long and low" ones and now I know why! I guess I needed the context of a season or so of developing some rudimentary jumping technique for this video to make sense to me, but now it's very helpful.
So great video on how to understand and learn jumping!!!
the knees forward tip is fantastic
This is great! I struggle with my timing on short faced jumps so this was really helpful! Now time to go practice! Thank you!
Yeah, those are actually the most tricky until you get the loading going correctly. Happy Trails!
this is really good, most tutorials go from a bunny hop to jump, on a bunny hop you lean back heels down to get the front up, its totally the opposite apparently. Will give this a shot, thanks and makes a lot of sense
I consider hopping and jumping two different skills as hops do require a slightly different movement. Hopping also requires use of the arms, something that should be left out with jumps for the most part. Hope it works well for you! -Simon
Vid is great cuz he’s riding a stumpy and not some crazy DH bike - my wife rides a stumpy and trying to get her more comfortable on jumps so this is very helpful and illustrates the fact that most people don’t need as much suspension as they think they do 👍🏻
Best explanation yet. Thank you to both of you!
If you master the preload for induced compression to achieve a hop and nail the timing you will also time the lift off perfectly. Preload works across the gambit also and gives you extra traction on a berm as well as achieving a float over terrain that slows you down. Just remember it is a fast and forceful movement with varying force.
Once again, invaluable information. A few days ago I got bucked on a small jump after doing several bigger jumps without a problem, which really confused me. (And it hurt - spent the afternoon in hospital with a dislocated finger and plenty of bruises). Now I understand. Thanks!
Oy. That sounds like a rough one! Yeah, it can be surprising that small jumps are actually more technical than bigger jumps. Hope you heal up fast! -Simon
Well not healing as fast as I want to, but keen to get back out there with what I've learned. Question though - what about Rebound? I think I had the rebound setting on the back wheel set incorrectly. So, I'm now assuming near maximum rebound damping at the rear, and closer to lowest at the front? Will that work (or not work) for short steep jumps vs other types of jumps? Just trying to figure this so I don't finish up back in hospital 🙂 Thanks!! Love your work @@Fluidride
@@quantumkookaburra You should have them set so that when you stand up centered over the bottom bracket, you get equal compression (travel used) when you push down through the legs only (no arm push). You should also get both ends returning at the same rate. This is a basic idea for setting the bike up. You will likely be somewhere in the middle of your rebound settings at each end. Balance front and rear is really important. You might seek some help or just use this basic guideline to get 'close' with your settings. Hope this helps! -Simon
@@Fluidride Thanks for taking the time to reply Simon! Good advice - I may be over thinking things. I'm 65 (years old) and just bought my first MTB. Been riding about 3 months. But I'm not one to wait - wanna ride Rampage 🙂 Well, maybe not, but, go big or go home. I'm in Australia, and struggling to find a coach. But I better before I bend it instead of send it 🙂
So often I watch videos that break down jumping and I just end up with a head full of disjointed mess…. But I trust you folks, so I hit play. Love the clarity of this explanation. Can’t wait to give this a shot - you’ve taken all the confusing bits and turned it into a simple flow; the question is can I turn that into some tidy, reliable jumps?
Thank you. I hope it helps! Keep in mind that we do offer video review services through both Fluidride and FluidrideOnline websites if you want me to take a look at your jumping.
I believe I saw you do this knees forward technique on a short video on approaching drops. Then I think you punched your feet into the pedals to get the bike to safely clear the edge of the drop and land on both wheels. I’ll have to hunt that down and rewatch it. Great video. Found it, knees forward as one approaches the edge of the drop and then shift hips back.
GO Linnea! Thanks a lot for this vid! In my area we have few big jumps and loads of small steep faced ones. I have not managed the timing right, resulting in losing my balance when jumping. I will try pre loading a bit sooner as you showed, and I feel confident that it will improve my technique!
Literally just rode Duthie last week (first time in Seattle area)! Recognized that lush green immediately. So different than here in SoCal, it was epic.
Excellent! You timed it right after our recent rains. Dirt has been epic lately! And yes...super lush in the park! -Simon
Another great explanation. Very clearly presented. Great stuff!
I wish the trails I ride had jumps like these, but it's mainly more natural, technical and sometimes slower terrain..so these types of videos are a bit foreign to me. I like the idea of starting out with the natural compression jumps.. they look super fun. Gotta try and find some similar trails around here because the jealousy is killing me!
Yeah, we are blessed for sure. But think of it this way: When you go through a long compression on a trail, even if not a jump, you are getting some skills practice for this as it's a very similar sensation to a long jump ramp hold. You can also think of jumping off natural terrain (featuring) as the ultimate in bringing your own compression into something on trail where a lot of the outcome is a result of the compression you make (pre-load). With this in mind you can get some reps on most rides. -Simon
@@Fluidride Yea I'm always looking for stuff to boost off, so I guess I'm getting some practice for bigger jumps without really thinking about it. Thanks Simon.
I’ve watched this video and your other jumping videos several times. Every time I watch them I learn more and more. Thanks for that. One question though: what would happen if I continue to hold compression after the rear tire leaves the lip? My problem is that I release compression too early. I can’t manage to get that take off/pop with good timing. I’m always early. TIA. 🤟🏼
Excellent video
1. THANK YOU!!! Amazing video, for me, right now! You said ONE sentence that really caught my attention, prompted this longer question -
Have either of you ever ridden Deer Valley? Tsunami trail? I have limited experience hitting jumps. Most of my progression has been in the last few months... I was clearing the jumps on Tsunami, so I'm able to ride pretty well at this point (jumps - do NOT talk to me about Upper Fireswamp! LOL)
Anyway - there is ONE jump on Tsunami that consistently bucks me.
It's maybe 30-35 feet long. It has a nice long, downhill run in... and a TINY ramp. It's maybe 1.5 bike lengths - I never stopped to measure it... but tiny relative to all the other jumps on the trail.
"The jump is so short, it might kick us" - is that IT? Am I just not preloading enough? After the first few times, I got scared... rolling on that front tire, for maybe 10-15 feet ALMOST otb, uncontrolled tends to do that to me. LOL
Anyway - thank you! Preload with perfect timing - that's basically the 'secret' is what I am hearing, yes?
I don't know the trail or jump, but sounds like it has a bit too short a ramp for the length of the run in. Not sure if this is a gap, but my suggestion if you aren't worried about clearing it or going big then come in a bit more slowly and focus on letting the bike accelerate into the jump as you near it (releasing the brakes). This could create a better quality interaction with the jump as you might be using so much speed that you can't move comfortably into the jump and end up under pre-loading or getting kind of pushed into the short face of the jump. Of course if this is a gap you have to make then take that into consideration and use good judgement with this. This idea can help riders reduce speed needed to jump, which lessens our fear response on trail. Practice this where it's safe to do so. -Simon
LOVE IT, @@Fluidride!!!!! Thank you Simon!!
Literally and physically slowing down in jumps is something I'm working on. LOL - that resulted in an OTB in a bike jump park a few weeks ago. -ouch. Recovering now, and I'm VERY excited to get back out there and try all the techniques you guys have taught me! :-)
That jump is not a gap, but about a 25' long table that's dramatically short. Meaning it's only a 3 to 4 foot lip height and it's one of those where the table is beaten down so much that the last 5 feet of the table is grooved out at the same angle as the landing. Which is only SLIGHTLY more steep than the trail - virtually no transition between landing and trail.
Anyway - YOU GUYS ROCK and I have an idea of how hard it is to produce these videos... HUGE props to you and your team! Thank you!!!!
Great explanation!
Describing the act of jumping a bike seems hard in words. This is another really helpful explanation of the subtle forces involved in take off.
How do you know where to start preloading when riding a new jump, if Simon isn't there laying down cones? In "Gauging Jump Speed: Practice Like a Pro #40" the cones for the kicker start a bike length out from the edge of the kicker ramp, while the pink cones in this video for the short faced jumps are near the bottom of where the jump starts.
Really great question! Basically the pre load (compression we make) should blend into the loading (compression the jump offers). This is the basic tenet that your never want to steer away from. The kicker ramp is VERY short, so I want the whole bike to be loaded before interaction with the little ramp. Basically, I'm making the bike think the jump is more than a wheel base long. If I load late into such a short ramp, I'll get bucked in the process. With the dirt jump, the takeoff is a bit longer -- just over a bike length -- which allows me to load slightly later as my whole bike fits on the jump. Hopefully this makes sense. I actually think of the kicker ramp as being more like featuring off natural terrain as the front and rear wheels are never on the ramp at the same time. -Simon
That makes sense. Thanks for taking the time to dig into the details, as always!
Great video, thank you!!
Everybody has a different way to describe and teach this skill. Everybody learns differently. This is as technical an explanation as I have seen. Nice job!
Thank you!
My front wheel always seems to drop off as soon as it leaves the lip of a jump rather than continuing to drive upwards till the back wheel reaches the lip. Some say to lean back with locked arms to drive the front wheel up, same say to row the bars to your hips. Please give me your advice on how to keep the front wheel going upward off a jump. I can jump ok, but would get much more air and distance if I could get that right. Thanks
The only thing I can think of if that you might be too far back on the bike. The rider should stay centered over the bottom bracket and their own legs. Be sure compression is being held through legs only and that the front wheel is not unloading until after interacting with the lip of the jump. If you aren't able to figure out what is going wrong, we do offer video based feedback on both our Fluidride website and our FluidrideOnline platform for $39. Hopefully staying centered on the bike and holding pressure though your legs will sort this out. Arms should not be used when learning to jump. Keep your arms relaxed as you jump. Doing this will help you stay balanced over your own legs, which is what is needed. I hope this helps! -Simon
That HLC g-out is intimidating! I always feel like I'm going to buckle if I charge in at full speed! What's a good way to progress on that one? Right now I'm braking a fair bit until halfway down the entry slope, then letting it go to make sure I'm accelerating into the jump.
Do not go full speed down that hill into the jump by any means. There is a big tree about half way down on the right I think. I'm on the brakes till that tree then off the brakes and into the jump. Always important to accelerate toward a jump, so enter slowly up top and let your speed build toward takeoff.
thank you!! it helped a lot :)
So the small jumps are often found on cross country courses. So what happens with hard tails or (gasp) rigid bikes?
Most of the compression is building in the legs, but is just more visually apparent in the bike. Hard tails and even rigid bikes jump just fine, and follow the same basic rules! -Simon
You mention that you don't need to preload for the jumps on A-line. As someone who currently cases ~40% of the jumps on A-Line, I find it hard to convince myself that I don't need to preload for the 3-4 steeper-faced "high & short" jumps. It feels like I have to preload & pop to not get bucked by them, but maybe I'm thinking about it wrong..
Not saying that at all. You do need to with speed, but those jumps are crafted to allow you to really feel true compression. What I mean is that they are tailor made for jumping, where as more backwoods spots are not. There are a few jumps there (A-Line and Crank it Up) where the pre-load is offered by a big downhill going into the uphill takeoff, but most do require pre-load. Sorry if I wasn't clear about that. Glad you checked in!
This is the best jumping video, must videos just talk about bigger jumps and they don't really explain much
Very nice 👍🏻 mtb trails , where is this located? Thank you 🙏🏻
Duthie Hill Park in Issaquah, Washington. Just outside Seattle.
I cannot jump yet, at least not as good as I would love to but I find the small jump really big when I remember how I started jumping.
My advice for beginners is to start small and feel the jump, the bike coming into you and how you put it back down before getting into learning to handle bigger forces as they will be big and you need to learn how to control them
Great advice. I love the idea of thinking of it as deciding what to try or not try based on the forces involved. You are correct that this is what takes time to develop - the ability to deal with more and more force - with a a good outcome. -Simon
Thank you for the reply. BTW, great video! I still have a question: I'm able to do bunnyhop like a beginner does, ok but not really great. Still, I'd like to know how to translate that to jumping a table? My current jumping technique is similar to what is shown in the video but I'm afraid of the speed and I'd like to get more height hopping but I cannot seem to find the proper timing. Any advice on that? Thx
@@SunSnowGravity Remember that bunny hops are a bit different than jumps. With a hop, there is no jump so the arms are needed. With a jump, we want to keep the arms out of the mix for the most part. I'd try to keep these two skills in different categories in your mind as you practice. I hope this is helpful!
@@Fluidride yep, it does. Thank you! I'm actually working on correcting the issue I have with using my arms too much when jumping, pulling the handlebar it's my problem
Nice video! I think my problem with jumps are, that I pre load too soon. It looks so easy when you hit those jumps. Now I got something to practice 😅
That is super common to see and actually can end up in being pushed around awkwardly because you run into the jump force in an even less compressed state than you would have without any pre-load. Focus on letting the knees move toward the jump ramp as you practice. This is a very subtle move with the knees moving into the jump which creates some loading into the ramp. This trick can be helpful with timing. Also do your best to keep your upper body relaxed (belly button and up) as your lower body presses in (from core to feet). -Simon
Make sense, is it the same for hard tails? Loving the content since your return, keep up the great work and I wish you were in the UK as I suck at jumps! 🤘🤪
Hard tails: yes. Exactly the same. Don’t get fooled by the obvious fact that the shock is part of the process with full sus and not on the hard tail. What is different is that the shock and how the axle path moves with a full sus makes things easier for any given ‘arc of a jump’ and also flatters poor technique. So, the technique is exactly the same, but good technique is even more important. Remember, your legs, body and arms also perform the same function as the suspension!
Glad I read the comments. I had the same question. I only ride a hard tail. Have never even been on a full sis. Might like it too much then I’d have to get another bike 😮
Yes it is!
I would love to take a class with you in Seattle, if only it was closer to me :-( Nice little video, though.
We have 'travel weekends' where we stack up the classes. We get people from all over the country on those weekends and even from around the world. Would love to see you in class sometime! You can make massive progress in 2-3 days if you can come up sometime! If not, stay tuned for more videos:-).
Pre loading feels like jumping off a diving board to me. Where you compress down and then lift off straight up from the back tire off the lip of the jump.
Is the preload technique doable on a hard tail? I realize the outcome will not be the same but can I get something out of it without full suspension?
Exactly the same. The loading is mostly in the legs, but shows up visibly via the suspension. I should have mentioned this in the video. But yeah, no change. You will actually get more air a given speed with the same inputs as no energy is lost to the suspension. Riders often confuse this and think the bikes suspension is doing the work. When properly tuned it just shows if our weight is in the right place. -Simon
Was that Blackrock in Oregon?
No, it's Duthie Hill Park in Issaquah, Washington near Seattle.
When I preload my knees are still bent going in so I can manipulate the bike more in the air for whips etc. Is this the wrong approach. It looked Linnea's position would have been too outstretched for me?
The knees should be bent about to where the knee caps are over the toes and the hips are supported by the heels. You can stand up wherever you are and just feel what that means. Not a deep bend. Top jumpers 'typically' don't bend the knees a ton on take off. Of course this is a very dynamic sport with so may possible combinations that you can't really say exactly what someone should look like, but in my experience watching thousands of riders each year in our local park, most bend the knees too much for proper pop off a jump. Linnea's stance is good. She's not a crazy high level jumper, but has improved dramatically and largely because she is standing taller. I hope this helps. We do have some videos on this page of Jason jumping. He is a very high level jumper and super stylish in the air. He stands tall on takeoff. You mention bending knees on during pre-load so you can whip. So long as you are getting good pre-load, and a good flight arc, the way you stood during that pre-load should not affect what you can do in the air.
@@Fluidride Makes sense, great response thank you! I’m fairly new to these and don’t want to develop bad habits that will limit my growth down the line.
The theory section of this video was good, but the final practical section I thought could have been in slow-mo, showing the theory put into practice
Haha, I love the zoolander quote "Dance monkey Dance!!".
Great advice. 5:52 🐒🤣
I always hear trails speed what’s that? What’s trail speed 20m
The natural speed a trial wants to take you without lots of pedaling or braking. Hope that makes it more clear. Weird term for sure.
This whole time I’ve been preloading my weight driving my heels down.. 😬
Hopefully this makes a positive change for you then!
🔥🙏🏼
why do these bikes look so bike on them?
I found if you want to clear this jump you have to remember NO BRAKES
brakes are the enemy. So hard to unlearn the instinct though.
is this duthie
Yes, it is!
Great job guys thank you🙏🌵🪨⛰️⚒️🌲🚵♀️