EDIT: I know Evergaol is pronounced Ever Jail. It’s an AI narration. Thanks and enjoy the video 👊😀 One year of cut content research condensed into one video. Following Guilbert the Redeemer of Vengeance we will meet a lot of NPCs that will help us paint a picture about the history of Elden Ring's development before the Network Test. I hope you enjoy, and don't forget to subscribe.
The idea of Invaders like Guilbert constantly hunting you down for killing NPCs is a neat idea that would be interesting to see get touched upon in the future. Reminds me a bit of Gwyndolin's covenant in DS1 that would hunt players who broke the illusion in Anor Londo.
Reminds me of a great Skyrim mod called the sinister 7, where 7 different unique mercenaries/assassins all hunt you down and attempt to murder you at random times throughout the game. Something similar in a fromsoft title would be crazy
I can't never get enough of Kale's voice acting that was simply amazing, you can feel the pain and anger in his voice it's a pity it was cut from the main game.
Something really small but interesting to me, was when Gilbert talked about being summoned. I find that really interesting that a summoned person is either dreaming or in a trance while that is going on. I was always kinda curious as to how the individuals experience/understand being an invader or ally. I know it is pulled from cut content but there is nothing currently ingame that contradicts this. Applying that to the current version of the story paints an very interesting picture for invading NPCs. They're pretty much dreaming about killing you. But the part that makes it potentially sad is when you consider Vyke's invasion. As an invader he's all Frenzy but when you fight him in person he doesn't use Frenzy at all. One could almost take Vyke's invasion as him having a nightmare of being consumed by Frenzy.
@@jootersblaccat Actually he doesn't. After you win the fight all he says about it is "...Right. There you are. Had to work for it, but it's done. Don't say I'm not a man of my word. Here's your prize." Which is basically much in the same fashion of Gilberts dialogue though Gilbert is seemingly initially disoriented by the process which would make sense with him not being from the Lands Between. Blaidd is no stranger to projecting his spirit out of his body, and does as much when we are meeting Ranni's "Gang"
@@Writh811 Or maybe Guilbert is mentally unwell. He talks about his head throbbing and seeing red. Maybe being a Redeemer takes a toll on the Redeemers and not knowing between dreaming and waking is a side effect.
@@min24434 Well, the seeing red dialogue does not happen with the dialogue after Ordovis. The throbbing head and seeing red and sounding all kill crazy, sounds like he woke up from being an Invader (red phantom)
So it seems that elden ring was supposed to have multiple Ranni style quests that spanned the whole map and several npcs, but the question is why they changed their minds. Simply because of time? My biggest hope the dlc, in combination with maybe some more inspired weapon movesets, is that we get some really big and convoluted questlines and not just shorter linear quests. Great video, very interesting watch!
People were already whining about how "complicated" the linear quests were. As much as I wish we had gotten what we see in the video, you just know 7/10 people would be complaining.
It's probably typical development issues - Fromsoft always ships "complete" games at the expense of all the lore ideas left on the cutting room floor. I can't think of a single one of their games that wasn't rehashed shortly before the game's release, including Kings Field and Shadow Tower game (except maybe Sekiro). Their sparse storytelling style actually helps to facilitate this because the players will typically fill in the holes and missing content with speculation based on lore hunting. Sadly, based on previous behavior it's unlikely that the DLC will resolve this or add convoluted quests because it's dangerous for them to retcon since not everyone will pay for the DLC. You'll probably only see completely cut stuff like the Miquella dream mechanics remolded into more short and linear quests. I wouldn't be surprised if the egg in Moghwyn Palace or the giant version of him in the Haligtree is just a trigger to teleport you to an altered map area that has little to do with the existing plot - just a short side story. It's way easier on the dev team.
This is utterly insane, right? And this is like 10%, there has been even crazier stuff, especially relating to Malenia and Miquella. There was a whole quest with all sleeping animals that had mist around them that you could turn into Dreambrew with the help of another npc, which would allow you to get extra lore from almost every single npc. Then this would lead to miquella himself. Malenia had a whole questline and she would call you "sweet tarnished". Then you had a miquella ending. Also the great runes had far more significance. Originally they controlled aspects of reality, Miquella had abundance, Malenia had decay, Godrick had "connectivity". All of this made far more sense, considering the whole "Warped by the powers of the runes". I don't really know why they removed so many lore pieces. The world feels way too empty atm. Especially that you could interact with the demigods would have made the world feel WAY more alive.
@@thelordjesuschrist1404 I have still hope the dream mist quest comes with the DLC. But yeah, quests like in this video or the Mimic quest were all so awesome and much better than the smaller quests (apart from Ranni) we have now. It would have given so much more personality to multiple characters.
I think (based on Miyazaki's own words) that a lot was cut due to rough development and covid. I mean, even on release there was a lot that felt unfinished and we got lots of additions (even whole questlines and NPCs) in the form of patches after release. I'm pretty sure this is a case of too much ambition given the circumstances.
The player getting constantly invaded by a strong NPC character is another concept first used in DS2. If you release Navlaan despite him warning you repeatedly, he will invade you multiple times throughout the game and is a tough invasion at that. Miyazaki was not joking when he said that he really appreciates DS2 for all the new concepts that it helped bring out, may be a little crude.
Just... wow! The sheer scale of all the restoration you've done here is amazing. And it is so cool that we can take a glimpse into the cut content and dev's thought process!
I really wish they kept the Kale dialogue. The whole lore around the Nomads all being murdered and summoning Shabiri as a final act revenge is my favourite piece of lore in the whole game. Finding that mass grave and hearing the Nomads still playing their instruments is probably my favourite moment in any souls game, so hauntingly beautiful
6:04 that's interesting, he thinks that the battle with us was a dream...maybe that could be the lore justification for multiplayer mechanics: when we are summoned to another world or when we invade someone our character falls asleep and fights in this "dream form". After all stagnant time that allowed multiplayer in the dark souls series is not present in elden ring while dreams have a role in the lore, just think about Santa Trina, Fortissax in Fia's dream and the cut dream mist quest, I really hope that the dlc brings it back 🤞 Amazing work as always btw!
They really dropped the ball on multiplayer lore. Clearly got put in the back-burner until late in development. No better example of this than "hunters", merely recycled blues from DS3.
I'm not really into PvP (heck, I forced myself to grind it to max out Covenants in DS3 and hated it), but Covenants as an idea are always fun to mess around with. Mound-Makers especially was really cool as a chaotic-neutral faction that either helps out other players or change their mind and turn their back on you. Same with Darkmoon who assist people that get invaded or Sunlight that encourages "Jolly Cooperation". The way they're integrated into the lore was also just fascinating when it came to opposing factions.
Honestly I think this style of quests would've really made the game feel much more alive, kind of disappointed now how they basically abandonded these awesome stories that had great potential
A lot of Marika's children are tied to different outer gods. There's Rykard and the god-devouring serpent, Malenia and the god of rot, Mohg and the formless mother, and maybe Morgott and the greater will. It would make sense if Radahn were tied to a god of vengeance. This would also provide more pretext for the fight between Malenia and Radahn.
Only two of those are Outer Gods though. The definition of OGs is rather shaky as well. The Japanese interpretation of these "entities" places them much more in the realm of shintoist forces than it does in that of lovecraftian-esque gods, which we shape through the lenses of Bloodborne. SmoughTown has two great videos on this subject.
Pretty sure they cut this pretty much for this reason. I always thought that GRR influence meant that there can be no happy war, and the shattering, where demigods were tainted by madness of their newfound strength (personally really sure that refers to Radahn) and of which no victor emerged, definitely quality
Yeah, I always found it kinda disappointing that Ranni was the only one of the Demigods who got her own fully-developed questline & ending. It never really made sense to me why anyone would pick any of the other endings, given the comparative lack of motivation story-wise to do so (other than our simply wanting to see them of course, which I imagine is what most of us did?). Had Kale & Vyke played a much more significant role in the story, we might have been provided with sufficient reason to want to choose to side with the 3 Fingers & betray Melina but as it stands, I just never felt any real justification for doing so. It would have been even greater if From had given Radahn equal footing with Ranni & given us a questline where we could maybe oppose her, perhaps seeking vengeance for Godwyn's slaying, which also involved hunting down Malenia or something in the process. Her & Mohg being optional bosses never really made any sense to me. Them being part of an equivalent quest for Radahn would actually work much better don't you think?
I mean, REAL players don't "pick" their endings. They don't look everything up to figure out where to go. What is the point? When the entire structure of the game is set up for you to get lost in, and beat over and over, without looking anything up, so you have something to work towards.
It seems like this alpha Jarren NPC, Guilbert, was an iteration on Holy Knight Hodrick, at least aesthetically, and involved in hunting down NPCs. Thank you for this continued amazing work!! 🖤
I think the neutralizing boluses may have been intended for another purpose outside alleviating poison, as they are exceptionally rare as an overworld find and mostly sold by merchants, (although they can be crafted, and their cookbook is sold by a merchant, funnily enough). Maybe they were intended to cure all debuffs, which would imply that vyke giving one to guilbert may suggest he was suffering from something. With his ties to Kalé and his mentions of the three fingers, it’s possible he was starting to fall to the frenzied flame.
I love what we got in the game of course but man so much of these just...god. Kales quest, Guilbert being a kind of active companion more then Yura, more info on Grafting, etc. Its all just so pefect.
I wonder if those butterflies flying near Guilbert the entire time at that fire served the same purpose as the other butterflies that represent the different demigods.
"of all the grudges born of the Shattering", so a reckoning for the nuking of Caelid? Looking back, the reveal footage shows Radahn howling at the sky, gold washing away from him, and (we can imagine) cleansing what part of the rot he can through his burning great rune. Malenia's final actions are given screen time together with most profoundly impactful moment in ER, the shattering of the Ring. That's rather curious, looking back. Perhaps they had a much more relevant purpose for those events at that time.
remember how radahn is burning with a yellow frenzy-looking flame in the first trailer? i wonder if guilbert and the merchants being related in this old quest is related to that
I love the Elden Ring we got but cut content really makes me wish we could play a completed version of these alternate storylines. They're interesting af. Shows the writing process never ends in any part of development considering there's voicelines, code, models etc. Maybe they can mention the changes in books officially. Even if not channels like this makes me appreciate the passion fans have for the game. Thank you for the year of research, was worth it imo
i think they cut the quests because they were out of time. Limgrave as it is right now has close to 0 good quests that i can think of. in fact no memorable quest other than castle morne and defeating godrick.
@@LordOfChaos.x That makes sense and can believe that. True, Limgrave's only starting quest and Varre's sort of and based on other videos he also had a deeper role in the game as did Kale. Makes me wonder what the game's lore would've been like with another year under its belt.
@@LordOfChaos.x Its weird because a lot of these seem basically done and then just cut out. Like, they aren't too different structurally from quests already in the game they just feel much more impactful and interesting.
@@gaynarchist its a big chance we are going to see them in the dlc. Given the dlc remakes the whole overground map. Best case scenario. Vykes quest was for example also in Limgrave.
@@LordOfChaos.x I'm not sure what you mean by that, the DLC takes place in a new area and we have confirmation that the story of the DLC is contained within the DLC.
Oh wow this is amazing but I am sad they cut it. Guilbert & Vykes quest in combination with the Great Caravan would have been perfect. Especially since Kale and Guilbert have god tier voice acting. I would take Kale and Guilberts quest over Hyetta and Yuras any day. They could have still included Hyetta as an optional questline towards the Three Fingers. Guilbert gives more weight to the Malenia and Radahn conflict and that whole God of Vengeance story is interesting. I guess its another Outer God? Also, Vyke who is on the damn cover of the game had his questline cut? I always thought Vyke should have more importance in the game since he, as a Tarnished, was closest to becoming Elden Lord before we arrived in the game.
Funnily enough, I missed Vyke entirely during my playthrough. At least Oscar, who's armor is on the cover of Dark Souls 1, is the first person you meet in-game. And Soul of Cinder is the final boss in 3.
man this version of limgrave with the redeemer hunting you looks sick as fuck!!!! thanks a lot for showing us this! I so wish we could play this version of the game!
the sheer proportion of the alternate lore is something out of an epic, am really makes me imagine what elden ring would've been like if it were this version
The cut content finally gives us a reason for why jerren, or more actually, guilbert is on the front cover. This also makes me think that ensha, or someone else wear the royal remains set, would also have been important later.
This made me think about the quote „The gods demand vengance. Vengance!“ from Patches. Is it possible that this quote hints to his knowlege about the god of vengance?
I seriously feel like they should not have cut the aspects of kales quest, hearing what he talks about his brothers being locked away to suffer, slaugtered in a genocide, would give players more insentive to do the frenzied flame ending and would give more depth and clarity to the golden orders crimes
Your videos and the work you do is incredible man, going through a hard time right now and content like this really helps. Thank you so much and I hope you know we all really appreciate the time and effort you spend on these
its more content than we already have in Limgrave. The only explanation is they ran out of time and had to cut it down since they couldn't finish the quests.
I think it'd be an interesting idea if covenants returned through a "redeemer" system concept for the DLC. Like; on top of avenging merchants; maybe they'd try and avenge the wildlife, innocent NPCs, optional bosses, or even players killed by other invaders. Idk how this system could be incentivised to reward participating players, but I feel like if properly implemented the open world would feel more alive.
i wonder if miyazaki is truly happy with elden ring. it seems the story was goinbg to be grander and on a larger scale. like the game seems like it was going to be completely different. i really hope we can see a few things they cooked up before they had to cut the stuff
@@noamias4897 i hope with the other game coming out it allows them to do everything they want with the dlc. if they can flesh everything out itll be better than the base game
Fantastic as always, Dubi. I've never quite gotten over how the merchants seem to fill the same medieval space as Jewish or Romani merchants at the time. Makes the denouement of Kale's quest all the more heart breaking
Lmao, guilbert feels like the meme version of Bloodbornes Gascoigne. "Is that vengeance i smell" "got any vengeance" "*snifffffffff* veennnngggggeeeeaaaannnccccceee"
It's another amazing questline, and I think it would fit the current lore. Idea of the God of Vengeance wouldn't be much different than idea of Goddess of Rot or Mother of Truths. Plus playing the role of a Redeemer would be also the great way to explain why we are killing so many bosses, quest NPCs or invasions.
In relation to vykes questline its clear you were meant to unbeknownst to the player assist him in finding and slaying NPCs. You can see him kneeling over their corpses on some box art.
The "God of Vengeance" might've been cut because all of the outer gods have something to do with death, a concept that was removed from the current order, while "vengeance" doesn't align with that theming. I also wonder what cut quest content happened outside of Limgrave that we aren't seeing because it wasn't put into the network test. One piece of content I hadn't seen in Elden Ring was Ordovis being stance broken lol; I always parried the crucible knights. Funny that the name Ordovis moved between three different knight placements during development. Btw you should prime the AI voice to pronounce things more correctly, so feed it scripts that say "Everjail" instead of "Evergaol" and so on.
Formless Mother/Mother of Truths that Mogh worships and the Fell God of the giants are not tied to death though. It’s even likely that the god of vengeance might’ve been the Fell God because the Fire Giant sacrifices its limb to it to get a better shot at killing you
Cut contents are made to cut, and most of them would be worse(at least to the devs) then what we have in the final version. But every time I see these kinds of videos I wonder why Kale's quest was cut, given that the entire lore of the merchant clan still exists in the game. Btw, you have a really great voice.
I prefer to think Kalé's questline was cut because it recontextualizes why you take on the frenzied flame if you choose to do so. Hyetta makes it clear that it's seen as a merciful act, to burn away all the suffering in the world until all becomes one, but Kalé's motivations are more akin to just revenge. Which is still compelling, but I don't think it's what they were going for in the end. It might also motivate more people to get the worst ending in the game, considering they would be spurred on from a friend they knew from the start of the game.
@@EldenLord. Well, it's definitely the most downer of an ending for the state of the world, since y'know, everything is dead and burning. The lore setups are interesting, though
The redeemer thing seems to be the devs attempting to try out ways to improve the invasions by using them as punishments for solo players killing npcs, but I'm sure in practice most people just didn't try to kill the merchants and never knew about it, or if they did and realized what happened they would just restart to avoid it completely. I wouldn't be surprised if the god of vengeance was something supposed to be tied directly to multiplayer Also thank you so much for all your hard work decrypting the network test files like this, its very interesting to see these ambitious ideas that ended up getting scrapped
Every fromsoft game feels like such a whole and complete singular work but it’s amazing that for how ambitious the actual release games are, there usually was an even MORE ambitious plan. I’m thinking about bloodborne’s cut moon phases and such.
I can only hope some of this stuff gets restored in the DLC. I feel like the final product we got was more disjointed and confusing than it should have been from all the cut content. Some of this stuff makes more sense than what we got.
Not for Elden ring but there is an in development mod by Abyss1ne for Dark Souls 3 which had a similar development to Elden Ring (Personally I think DS3 is more interesting regarding cut content) The entire plot was different for what we got, it's called Project Eclipse.
2:39 I am unsure if this bit was known beforehand, but I distinictly remember this character being there for the crucible duo fight, I am unsure if it is mandela effect or if it was someone who had seen this cut content and decided to cosplay it, but it just astonishes me to realize that now, I thought my memory was just lying but THERE ACTUALLY WAS ORIGINALLY A NPC WHO HAD BEEN GOING TO FIGHT ORDOVIS!
@Sekiro Dubi I figured as such, I just have no sweet clue why the hell I have a memory of it, as I said, could be Mandela effect, could be cosplay, hell if I know
Damn, if people didn't btch and moan for this game to release maybe we could have gotten the cut content and actually fleshed out endings other than frenzy and ranni.
It would be cool to have Vyke play a more central role in the game. I imagine he and Gideon would be the two main forces at the roundtable hold, trying against each other to lead it, but then Vyke would disappear to embrace the frenzied flame near the end.
Still think a neat questline would have been meeting Vyke premelting, and meeting up with him throughout the game before we inevitably lead to his fall, a la Oscar's cut quest in DS1.
Hyetta was around that far back? Given that she fills in for Kale's second cut questline in pointing the player towards the Three Fingers, I had assumed she was a late addition they'd made by reusing Irina's voice actress and assets. Are there any clues left as to what she was doing originally?
I just wish fromsoft could have taken a few more years developing, just imagine the proportion of the quests, and the implications it would all have lore wise. Its a great game now, but cant stop thinking it could be a lot more
@LordOfChaos.x I'm waiting for a potential definitive edition of Elden Ring that adds some of the cut content and improved multiplayer on a new hardware
It looks to me as though "Redeemers" were meant to be an invasion covenant of sorts in the same vein as Bloody Fingers and Recusants. The God of Vengeance might've been another Outer God. Interesting implications.
I suspect they were to serve the same purpose as the Darkmoon Blades. Those slain by invaders could have had the option to indict invaders by praying to the God of Vengeance. Imagine killing a host and seeing "A grudge has been declared." instead of "You were indicted." I wish Fromsoft had put proper covenants in. I don't like this skyrim feeling of "part of every gang without consequence" that occurs in the released game.
@@korstmahler That would've been great. It would've added some level of consequence to invasions. And also given legitimate reasons to invade those who have invited that chaos; most likely people who are already adept at pvp; you would've gotten a different sort of player and a different sort of interaction. Not to mention increasing the churn of multiplayer interaction in general.
@@truthchanMSV I can only think of 3 quests that are actually rewarding and on par with what we got in earlier Souls games: Millicent, Nepehli Loux and Ranni ( obviously). Maybe Fia's quest as well, cause she's an interesting character. EDIT: Jarburg as well
@@orlando5789 That's a fair opinion. However, you also have to realize that if these massive interconnected questlines were still in the game, there would likely be a *lot* of ways you could break them on accident. You know how harsh and obscure From can be already with quests, so that may have been why they were dialed back in complexity in the first place. I mean, think of how many ways you could break Greirat's questline just by going a little bit too far in the game, as an example.
Thanks for doing all of this, its really awesome to see all iterations of the game. Shame we didn't see it all those questlines fully realized and no amount of copium will make me hope to see those added cuz they would have to do some massive retcons. It would be really awesome if they released a book about the games development, different ideas, iterations, how they planned to implement it and how it changed overtime, original draft etc
EDIT: I know Evergaol is pronounced Ever Jail. It’s an AI narration. Thanks and enjoy the video 👊😀
One year of cut content research condensed into one video. Following Guilbert the Redeemer of Vengeance we will meet a lot of NPCs that will help us paint a picture about the history of Elden Ring's development before the Network Test. I hope you enjoy, and don't forget to subscribe.
Stoked about this! Thanks for all the work you put into this over such a long time!
This was really good, thanks for the hard work.
Thank u Sekiro, i appreciate this
Belo vídeo, meu nobre 👍
So far as I know Gaol still pronounced Jail, just spelled differently. Old English was a rude time without rules.
"A demigod, yes, he may be.. but no one escapes a redeemer."
bro casually dropped the coldest elden ring line
Why is he called Guilbert and not just Chad amirite
I am more impressed by Guilbert casually poise-breaking a Crucible Knight multiple times.
@@MrParadux That's the power of Square Off
@@SekiroDubi Chadbert
Gostoc saying "outward ugliness is a warning of a vile spirit" is really funny
The idea of Invaders like Guilbert constantly hunting you down for killing NPCs is a neat idea that would be interesting to see get touched upon in the future. Reminds me a bit of Gwyndolin's covenant in DS1 that would hunt players who broke the illusion in Anor Londo.
Reminds me of a great Skyrim mod called the sinister 7, where 7 different unique mercenaries/assassins all hunt you down and attempt to murder you at random times throughout the game.
Something similar in a fromsoft title would be crazy
The Blue Sentinels in DS2 worked like that, you could invade sinners that had killed npcs or other players through invasion.
The pale shade in ds3 constantly hunts you if you go against londor.
This was really well done in Bloodborne with Brador the church assassin
DS2 done that with the Forlorn
I can't never get enough of Kale's voice acting that was simply amazing, you can feel the pain and anger in his voice it's a pity it was cut from the main game.
His VA is amazing
Think you mean you can't get enough/could never get enough?
Something really small but interesting to me, was when Gilbert talked about being summoned. I find that really interesting that a summoned person is either dreaming or in a trance while that is going on. I was always kinda curious as to how the individuals experience/understand being an invader or ally. I know it is pulled from cut content but there is nothing currently ingame that contradicts this.
Applying that to the current version of the story paints an very interesting picture for invading NPCs. They're pretty much dreaming about killing you. But the part that makes it potentially sad is when you consider Vyke's invasion. As an invader he's all Frenzy but when you fight him in person he doesn't use Frenzy at all. One could almost take Vyke's invasion as him having a nightmare of being consumed by Frenzy.
Actually, Blaidd has dialogue that implies he was directly fighting with you against dariwill and stands at the evergaol after you beat him together
@@jootersblaccat Actually he doesn't. After you win the fight all he says about it is "...Right. There you are. Had to work for it, but it's done. Don't say I'm not a man of my word. Here's your prize." Which is basically much in the same fashion of Gilberts dialogue though Gilbert is seemingly initially disoriented by the process which would make sense with him not being from the Lands Between. Blaidd is no stranger to projecting his spirit out of his body, and does as much when we are meeting Ranni's "Gang"
@@Writh811 Ah, must've just confused part of it with his Radhan Fest dialogue. Technically there you summon him too though
@@Writh811 Or maybe Guilbert is mentally unwell. He talks about his head throbbing and seeing red. Maybe being a Redeemer takes a toll on the Redeemers and not knowing between dreaming and waking is a side effect.
@@min24434 Well, the seeing red dialogue does not happen with the dialogue after Ordovis. The throbbing head and seeing red and sounding all kill crazy, sounds like he woke up from being an Invader (red phantom)
So it seems that elden ring was supposed to have multiple Ranni style quests that spanned the whole map and several npcs, but the question is why they changed their minds. Simply because of time? My biggest hope the dlc, in combination with maybe some more inspired weapon movesets, is that we get some really big and convoluted questlines and not just shorter linear quests. Great video, very interesting watch!
People were already whining about how "complicated" the linear quests were. As much as I wish we had gotten what we see in the video, you just know 7/10 people would be complaining.
It's probably typical development issues - Fromsoft always ships "complete" games at the expense of all the lore ideas left on the cutting room floor. I can't think of a single one of their games that wasn't rehashed shortly before the game's release, including Kings Field and Shadow Tower game (except maybe Sekiro). Their sparse storytelling style actually helps to facilitate this because the players will typically fill in the holes and missing content with speculation based on lore hunting. Sadly, based on previous behavior it's unlikely that the DLC will resolve this or add convoluted quests because it's dangerous for them to retcon since not everyone will pay for the DLC. You'll probably only see completely cut stuff like the Miquella dream mechanics remolded into more short and linear quests. I wouldn't be surprised if the egg in Moghwyn Palace or the giant version of him in the Haligtree is just a trigger to teleport you to an altered map area that has little to do with the existing plot - just a short side story. It's way easier on the dev team.
This is utterly insane, right? And this is like 10%, there has been even crazier stuff, especially relating to Malenia and Miquella. There was a whole quest with all sleeping animals that had mist around them that you could turn into Dreambrew with the help of another npc, which would allow you to get extra lore from almost every single npc. Then this would lead to miquella himself. Malenia had a whole questline and she would call you "sweet tarnished". Then you had a miquella ending. Also the great runes had far more significance. Originally they controlled aspects of reality, Miquella had abundance, Malenia had decay, Godrick had "connectivity". All of this made far more sense, considering the whole "Warped by the powers of the runes". I don't really know why they removed so many lore pieces. The world feels way too empty atm. Especially that you could interact with the demigods would have made the world feel WAY more alive.
@@thelordjesuschrist1404 I have still hope the dream mist quest comes with the DLC. But yeah, quests like in this video or the Mimic quest were all so awesome and much better than the smaller quests (apart from Ranni) we have now. It would have given so much more personality to multiple characters.
I think (based on Miyazaki's own words) that a lot was cut due to rough development and covid. I mean, even on release there was a lot that felt unfinished and we got lots of additions (even whole questlines and NPCs) in the form of patches after release. I'm pretty sure this is a case of too much ambition given the circumstances.
The player getting constantly invaded by a strong NPC character is another concept first used in DS2. If you release Navlaan despite him warning you repeatedly, he will invade you multiple times throughout the game and is a tough invasion at that. Miyazaki was not joking when he said that he really appreciates DS2 for all the new concepts that it helped bring out, may be a little crude.
They did implemented it without navlaan. Forgot the name of the character but she will invade numerous time in sotfs
truly ds2 2
@ariezon the forlorn?
Just... wow! The sheer scale of all the restoration you've done here is amazing. And it is so cool that we can take a glimpse into the cut content and dev's thought process!
I don't know what was wrong with youtube, but replies to other people ended up under this comment. Sorry
I really wish they kept the Kale dialogue. The whole lore around the Nomads all being murdered and summoning Shabiri as a final act revenge is my favourite piece of lore in the whole game. Finding that mass grave and hearing the Nomads still playing their instruments is probably my favourite moment in any souls game, so hauntingly beautiful
So cool that John Eldenring himself narrated this video!
6:04 that's interesting, he thinks that the battle with us was a dream...maybe that could be the lore justification for multiplayer mechanics: when we are summoned to another world or when we invade someone our character falls asleep and fights in this "dream form".
After all stagnant time that allowed multiplayer in the dark souls series is not present in elden ring while dreams have a role in the lore, just think about Santa Trina, Fortissax in Fia's dream and the cut dream mist quest, I really hope that the dlc brings it back 🤞
Amazing work as always btw!
"In Lordran, the flow of time is convoluted and there's no telling how long your world and mine will remain linked" - Solaire of Astora
They really dropped the ball on multiplayer lore. Clearly got put in the back-burner until late in development. No better example of this than "hunters", merely recycled blues from DS3.
I'm not really into PvP (heck, I forced myself to grind it to max out Covenants in DS3 and hated it), but Covenants as an idea are always fun to mess around with. Mound-Makers especially was really cool as a chaotic-neutral faction that either helps out other players or change their mind and turn their back on you. Same with Darkmoon who assist people that get invaded or Sunlight that encourages "Jolly Cooperation". The way they're integrated into the lore was also just fascinating when it came to opposing factions.
@@leithaziz2716 Yeah, covenants were so fun and it was nice to have a post story reward in the form of covenant items like the Sunlight drip in DS2
if i remember correctly, that solaire line about conviluted time is a mistranslation, though i could be mistaken.
For those of us who are lore-obsessed. This video (like this channel) is gold mine. Thank you for making this!
Honestly I think this style of quests would've really made the game feel much more alive, kind of disappointed now how they basically abandonded these awesome stories that had great potential
Yeah like the merchant’s story
They didn't have the time to develop these stories fully due to the release schedule, it's a shame they had to abandon a lot of stuff behind
At least we kept Ranni's and Volcano Manor's quests, and whatever the Radahn Festival was
A lot of Marika's children are tied to different outer gods. There's Rykard and the god-devouring serpent, Malenia and the god of rot, Mohg and the formless mother, and maybe Morgott and the greater will. It would make sense if Radahn were tied to a god of vengeance. This would also provide more pretext for the fight between Malenia and Radahn.
Only two of those are Outer Gods though. The definition of OGs is rather shaky as well. The Japanese interpretation of these "entities" places them much more in the realm of shintoist forces than it does in that of lovecraftian-esque gods, which we shape through the lenses of Bloodborne. SmoughTown has two great videos on this subject.
Pretty sure they cut this pretty much for this reason. I always thought that GRR influence meant that there can be no happy war, and the shattering, where demigods were tainted by madness of their newfound strength (personally really sure that refers to Radahn) and of which no victor emerged, definitely quality
Might be an indication of some older lore where it wasn't just Empyreans like M&M being touched by the influence of the Outer Gods against their will.
Yeah, I always found it kinda disappointing that Ranni was the only one of the Demigods who got her own fully-developed questline & ending. It never really made sense to me why anyone would pick any of the other endings, given the comparative lack of motivation story-wise to do so (other than our simply wanting to see them of course, which I imagine is what most of us did?). Had Kale & Vyke played a much more significant role in the story, we might have been provided with sufficient reason to want to choose to side with the 3 Fingers & betray Melina but as it stands, I just never felt any real justification for doing so. It would have been even greater if From had given Radahn equal footing with Ranni & given us a questline where we could maybe oppose her, perhaps seeking vengeance for Godwyn's slaying, which also involved hunting down Malenia or something in the process. Her & Mohg being optional bosses never really made any sense to me. Them being part of an equivalent quest for Radahn would actually work much better don't you think?
I mean tbf to the Frenzied Flame ending, the motivation is to save Melina even if it’s against her wishes.
I mean, REAL players don't "pick" their endings. They don't look everything up to figure out where to go. What is the point? When the entire structure of the game is set up for you to get lost in, and beat over and over, without looking anything up, so you have something to work towards.
@@realityvanguard2052absolutely not.
Incredible work Dubi 🔥
It seems like this alpha Jarren NPC, Guilbert, was an iteration on Holy Knight Hodrick, at least aesthetically, and involved in hunting down NPCs. Thank you for this continued amazing work!! 🖤
yeah, reminds me of both Gael and Hodrick, which they share some common origin in DS3
Guilbert using Stamp (Upward Sweep) on a Flamberge gave me flashbacks to being invaded by Hodrick and getting one shot by him.
I think the neutralizing boluses may have been intended for another purpose outside alleviating poison, as they are exceptionally rare as an overworld find and mostly sold by merchants, (although they can be crafted, and their cookbook is sold by a merchant, funnily enough). Maybe they were intended to cure all debuffs, which would imply that vyke giving one to guilbert may suggest he was suffering from something. With his ties to Kalé and his mentions of the three fingers, it’s possible he was starting to fall to the frenzied flame.
I love what we got in the game of course but man so much of these just...god.
Kales quest, Guilbert being a kind of active companion more then Yura, more info on Grafting, etc. Its all just so pefect.
I wonder if those butterflies flying near Guilbert the entire time at that fire served the same purpose as the other butterflies that represent the different demigods.
Smoldering butterflies are found often by bonfires. It seems theyre simply drawn to fire sources.
"of all the grudges born of the Shattering", so a reckoning for the nuking of Caelid? Looking back, the reveal footage shows Radahn howling at the sky, gold washing away from him, and (we can imagine) cleansing what part of the rot he can through his burning great rune. Malenia's final actions are given screen time together with most profoundly impactful moment in ER, the shattering of the Ring. That's rather curious, looking back. Perhaps they had a much more relevant purpose for those events at that time.
Celestial dew seems more useful if you didn't want to be invaded constantly
It's so exciting to see the history of the development of this game that I love so much.
remember how radahn is burning with a yellow frenzy-looking flame in the first trailer? i wonder if guilbert and the merchants being related in this old quest is related to that
Looks like gold to me. But that's an interesting view.
(I think) At the time of that trailer it would have still been the "Red eye" curse and not the flame.
I love the Elden Ring we got but cut content really makes me wish we could play a completed version of these alternate storylines. They're interesting af. Shows the writing process never ends in any part of development considering there's voicelines, code, models etc. Maybe they can mention the changes in books officially. Even if not channels like this makes me appreciate the passion fans have for the game. Thank you for the year of research, was worth it imo
i think they cut the quests because they were out of time. Limgrave as it is right now has close to 0 good quests that i can think of.
in fact no memorable quest other than castle morne and defeating godrick.
@@LordOfChaos.x That makes sense and can believe that. True, Limgrave's only starting quest and Varre's sort of and based on other videos he also had a deeper role in the game as did Kale. Makes me wonder what the game's lore would've been like with another year under its belt.
@@LordOfChaos.x Its weird because a lot of these seem basically done and then just cut out. Like, they aren't too different structurally from quests already in the game they just feel much more impactful and interesting.
@@gaynarchist its a big chance we are going to see them in the dlc. Given the dlc remakes the whole overground map. Best case scenario. Vykes quest was for example also in Limgrave.
@@LordOfChaos.x I'm not sure what you mean by that, the DLC takes place in a new area and we have confirmation that the story of the DLC is contained within the DLC.
Oh wow this is amazing but I am sad they cut it. Guilbert & Vykes quest in combination with the Great Caravan would have been perfect. Especially since Kale and Guilbert have god tier voice acting. I would take Kale and Guilberts quest over Hyetta and Yuras any day. They could have still included Hyetta as an optional questline towards the Three Fingers. Guilbert gives more weight to the Malenia and Radahn conflict and that whole God of Vengeance story is interesting. I guess its another Outer God? Also, Vyke who is on the damn cover of the game had his questline cut? I always thought Vyke should have more importance in the game since he, as a Tarnished, was closest to becoming Elden Lord before we arrived in the game.
Funnily enough, I missed Vyke entirely during my playthrough. At least Oscar, who's armor is on the cover of Dark Souls 1, is the first person you meet in-game. And Soul of Cinder is the final boss in 3.
Keep in mind that the Kalé that's relevant for Vyke & Guilbert is the dream mist one, not the great caravan one.
@@SekiroDubi Both cut quests are awesome so I take either of them :)
@@EldenLord. yeah. I’m clarifying that there’s 2 eras of ER development. This Guilbert-Kalé-Vyke-Hewg is an earlier one.
@@EldenLord. True, Either of them is better than the zero we got.
man this version of limgrave with the redeemer hunting you looks sick as fuck!!!! thanks a lot for showing us this! I so wish we could play this version of the game!
the sheer proportion of the alternate lore is something out of an epic, am really makes me imagine what elden ring would've been like if it were this version
The cut content finally gives us a reason for why jerren, or more actually, guilbert is on the front cover.
This also makes me think that ensha, or someone else wear the royal remains set, would also have been important later.
This made me think about the quote „The gods demand vengance. Vengance!“ from Patches. Is it possible that this quote hints to his knowlege about the god of vengance?
I seriously feel like they should not have cut the aspects of kales quest, hearing what he talks about his brothers being locked away to suffer, slaugtered in a genocide, would give players more insentive to do the frenzied flame ending and would give more depth and clarity to the golden orders crimes
Guilbert is fucking batman
YES
You're a genius, mate. This is so good and it makes Elden Ring even richer.
no one escapes a redeemer
Your videos and the work you do is incredible man, going through a hard time right now and content like this really helps. Thank you so much and I hope you know we all really appreciate the time and effort you spend on these
Amazing how a game that's mostly made out of cut content from earlier games, can have so much cut content itself.
its more content than we already have in Limgrave. The only explanation is they ran out of time and had to cut it down since they couldn't finish the quests.
your videos and the stuff you dig up are genuinely great, you keep finding stuff no one else can trace back
I think it'd be an interesting idea if covenants returned through a "redeemer" system concept for the DLC.
Like; on top of avenging merchants; maybe they'd try and avenge the wildlife, innocent NPCs, optional bosses, or even players killed by other invaders.
Idk how this system could be incentivised to reward participating players, but I feel like if properly implemented the open world would feel more alive.
i wonder if miyazaki is truly happy with elden ring. it seems the story was goinbg to be grander and on a larger scale. like the game seems like it was going to be completely different. i really hope we can see a few things they cooked up before they had to cut the stuff
Hopefully they aren’t rushing the DLC so they can expand on everything they wish they could’ve kept or added to the base game
@@noamias4897 i hope with the other game coming out it allows them to do everything they want with the dlc. if they can flesh everything out itll be better than the base game
Mind-blowing stuff, thank you for your work.
9:59 oh my god the chills i got watching this!!!!! why tf would they cut this amazing acting? this is next to Igon's VA in the DLC oh man
Gilbert sounds like the blue eye orb from ds1. If someone invade get someone to invade them. I wish we had that.
This was awesome, thanks so much! I have high hopes for a Vyke appearance in the DLC.
this content is insane !
Wow, thanks so much Dubi for found it
This is incredible, and thank you for sharing your work. Cut content has always fascinated me and seeing this implemented is incredible work.
Fantastic as always, Dubi. I've never quite gotten over how the merchants seem to fill the same medieval space as Jewish or Romani merchants at the time. Makes the denouement of Kale's quest all the more heart breaking
Its amazing they cut so many of that mans brilliant voice lines. Hes def one of the best.
Lmao, guilbert feels like the meme version of Bloodbornes Gascoigne.
"Is that vengeance i smell" "got any vengeance" "*snifffffffff* veennnngggggeeeeaaaannnccccceee"
“Godrick’s corpse will know what to do” maybe he’s talking about the remembrances? Maybe they had a bigger role lore wise originally
Amazing video. I think having Stormhill shack or something in the map as the hub would’ve been amazing, possibly better than the Roundtable we got
It's another amazing questline, and I think it would fit the current lore. Idea of the God of Vengeance wouldn't be much different than idea of Goddess of Rot or Mother of Truths. Plus playing the role of a Redeemer would be also the great way to explain why we are killing so many bosses, quest NPCs or invasions.
In relation to vykes questline its clear you were meant to unbeknownst to the player assist him in finding and slaying NPCs. You can see him kneeling over their corpses on some box art.
Great video I was not expecting such goodness, thanks!
This...Helps me in hard time waiting for DLC... Thank you so much 😢
that's what I call quality content, thanks for sharing it with us
The "God of Vengeance" might've been cut because all of the outer gods have something to do with death, a concept that was removed from the current order, while "vengeance" doesn't align with that theming. I also wonder what cut quest content happened outside of Limgrave that we aren't seeing because it wasn't put into the network test. One piece of content I hadn't seen in Elden Ring was Ordovis being stance broken lol; I always parried the crucible knights. Funny that the name Ordovis moved between three different knight placements during development. Btw you should prime the AI voice to pronounce things more correctly, so feed it scripts that say "Everjail" instead of "Evergaol" and so on.
Oh definitely. I assume everything after limgrave is maybe 30% finished.
Formless Mother/Mother of Truths that Mogh worships and the Fell God of the giants are not tied to death though. It’s even likely that the god of vengeance might’ve been the Fell God because the Fire Giant sacrifices its limb to it to get a better shot at killing you
Cut contents are made to cut, and most of them would be worse(at least to the devs) then what we have in the final version. But every time I see these kinds of videos I wonder why Kale's quest was cut, given that the entire lore of the merchant clan still exists in the game.
Btw, you have a really great voice.
The voice is AI generated, its not his voice.
I prefer to think Kalé's questline was cut because it recontextualizes why you take on the frenzied flame if you choose to do so. Hyetta makes it clear that it's seen as a merciful act, to burn away all the suffering in the world until all becomes one, but Kalé's motivations are more akin to just revenge. Which is still compelling, but I don't think it's what they were going for in the end. It might also motivate more people to get the worst ending in the game, considering they would be spurred on from a friend they knew from the start of the game.
@@truthchanMSV I personally think the Frenzied Flame is the best ending. Especially since it sets up the Gloam-Eyed Queen.
@@EldenLord. Well, it's definitely the most downer of an ending for the state of the world, since y'know, everything is dead and burning. The lore setups are interesting, though
@@truthchanMSV Yeah its the "worst" ending when it comes to the state of the world.
The redeemer thing seems to be the devs attempting to try out ways to improve the invasions by using them as punishments for solo players killing npcs, but I'm sure in practice most people just didn't try to kill the merchants and never knew about it, or if they did and realized what happened they would just restart to avoid it completely. I wouldn't be surprised if the god of vengeance was something supposed to be tied directly to multiplayer
Also thank you so much for all your hard work decrypting the network test files like this, its very interesting to see these ambitious ideas that ended up getting scrapped
It’s cool to see how same ideas were kept and repurposed into different quest lines
Did they remove these for being too fleshed out?? Christ, the things we did get fully are just as understood if not less than these cut ones
Every fromsoft game feels like such a whole and complete singular work but it’s amazing that for how ambitious the actual release games are, there usually was an even MORE ambitious plan. I’m thinking about bloodborne’s cut moon phases and such.
Holy hell, probably one of the better starts to my Sunday. This was sick dude. Thanks.
I can only hope some of this stuff gets restored in the DLC. I feel like the final product we got was more disjointed and confusing than it should have been from all the cut content. Some of this stuff makes more sense than what we got.
It would be amazing to have a mod based around the cut content of this game
Not for Elden ring but there is an in development mod by Abyss1ne for Dark Souls 3 which had a similar development to Elden Ring (Personally I think DS3 is more interesting regarding cut content) The entire plot was different for what we got, it's called Project Eclipse.
2:39 I am unsure if this bit was known beforehand, but I distinictly remember this character being there for the crucible duo fight, I am unsure if it is mandela effect or if it was someone who had seen this cut content and decided to cosplay it, but it just astonishes me to realize that now, I thought my memory was just lying but THERE ACTUALLY WAS ORIGINALLY A NPC WHO HAD BEEN GOING TO FIGHT ORDOVIS!
It was not possible to play this in any public version of ER. Maybe someone cosplayed it
@Sekiro Dubi I figured as such, I just have no sweet clue why the hell I have a memory of it, as I said, could be Mandela effect, could be cosplay, hell if I know
This was great. Thanks for putting it together.
jumping godrick wouldve been fun as hell but lore wise vyke would annhialite him by himself😭
Damn, if people didn't btch and moan for this game to release maybe we could have gotten the cut content and actually fleshed out endings other than frenzy and ranni.
Certified Elden Ring Classic
Awesome video, man. Thanks for putting this together!
I always thought that the Jerren's sets looks like Holy Knight Hodrick.
Gostoc of all people really just said ugly people can't be trusted, like okay bro sure
Going back to this content post-sote is fascinating
If I had Guilbert help me with Ordovis, my fight would've ended out way more different early game. 😆
It would be cool to have Vyke play a more central role in the game.
I imagine he and Gideon would be the two main forces at the roundtable hold, trying against each other to lead it, but then Vyke would disappear to embrace the frenzied flame near the end.
The amount of cut quests is mind boggling. I hope that the DLC will bring some of them back + add some completely new ones.
Welp, you ready to find out?
@@artezac Ohh yes. In 4hrs and 3 minutes it's midnight where I live. Preload is already finished.
This is awesome! Thank you!
As always, wonderful job!
imagine getting to fight the first boss with the guy on the box art
@@todd3143 OP game
Question. Did Nepheli exist at this point in development?
This is insane man! Very nice
Still think a neat questline would have been meeting Vyke premelting, and meeting up with him throughout the game before we inevitably lead to his fall, a la Oscar's cut quest in DS1.
Truly awesome work and very enjoyable to watch!!
Hyetta was around that far back? Given that she fills in for Kale's second cut questline in pointing the player towards the Three Fingers, I had assumed she was a late addition they'd made by reusing Irina's voice actress and assets. Are there any clues left as to what she was doing originally?
I just wish fromsoft could have taken a few more years developing, just imagine the proportion of the quests, and the implications it would all have lore wise. Its a great game now, but cant stop thinking it could be a lot more
same happened to Dark Souls 2
@LordOfChaos.x I'm waiting for a potential definitive edition of Elden Ring that adds some of the cut content and improved multiplayer on a new hardware
if fromsoftware doesnt add vyke, guilbert and kalé's cut quests back to the game on the DLC, i am playing dark souls III
It looks to me as though "Redeemers" were meant to be an invasion covenant of sorts in the same vein as Bloody Fingers and Recusants. The God of Vengeance might've been another Outer God. Interesting implications.
I suspect they were to serve the same purpose as the Darkmoon Blades. Those slain by invaders could have had the option to indict invaders by praying to the God of Vengeance.
Imagine killing a host and seeing "A grudge has been declared." instead of "You were indicted."
I wish Fromsoft had put proper covenants in. I don't like this skyrim feeling of "part of every gang without consequence" that occurs in the released game.
@@korstmahler That would've been great.
It would've added some level of consequence to invasions. And also given legitimate reasons to invade those who have invited that chaos; most likely people who are already adept at pvp; you would've gotten a different sort of player and a different sort of interaction. Not to mention increasing the churn of multiplayer interaction in general.
God of Vengeance surely sounds like a GRRM thing
WTF???? WHY DID THEY CUT ALL OF THIS?!!!? ITS WAY BETTER THAN WHAT WE GOT
These cut quests are so much better than what we got in the game
How so? The only questline I was dissatisfied with was Rogier's, I felt it cut off too early.
@@truthchanMSV I can only think of 3 quests that are actually rewarding and on par with what we got in earlier Souls games: Millicent, Nepehli Loux and Ranni ( obviously). Maybe Fia's quest as well, cause she's an interesting character.
EDIT: Jarburg as well
@@orlando5789 That's a fair opinion. However, you also have to realize that if these massive interconnected questlines were still in the game, there would likely be a *lot* of ways you could break them on accident. You know how harsh and obscure From can be already with quests, so that may have been why they were dialed back in complexity in the first place. I mean, think of how many ways you could break Greirat's questline just by going a little bit too far in the game, as an example.
@@truthchanMSV The aformentioned quests can already be broken in dumb ways, so I don't think that was no.1 From's concern
@@orlando5789 Yeah, but it probably would've been worse
20:27 i dont know if anyone have notice this, but u can see the "redeemer" or "jiren" corpse next to vyke in the game poster. what do that mean ?
Hehe. I’ve been posting that for a while on Twitter. I think the game cover was made and decided back then
@@SekiroDubi oh now i get it, thats sad that they removed it, but i think maybe we gonna see something related to them in the DLC soon, maaybe...
Get this video into the algorithm folks lol
God.... As usual bunch of contents are just too good.
Thanks for doing all of this, its really awesome to see all iterations of the game. Shame we didn't see it all those questlines fully realized and no amount of copium will make me hope to see those added cuz they would have to do some massive retcons. It would be really awesome if they released a book about the games development, different ideas, iterations, how they planned to implement it and how it changed overtime, original draft etc
So basically Gilbert's salty that his Master Radahn lost to Malenia at his own turf. No wonder they cut this quest lol.
Nice stuff, keep up the good work!
"Slicing off arms, like harvesting ears of wheat"
Ohh... God of Vengeance...