You've got to laugh at people who stick on the old exhaust mods, wraps and all the other tat you can get, when in reality they are probably making it slower and less powerful. You have two options - add more power or make it lighter. Everyone but Lotus seem to add more power; cars are heavier thus it's less involving (read: enjoyable) to drive. Lotus are correct. They follow what F1 cars do, which is to make cars light to get better performance and feedback. People always focus on power output of a car but it's no good if you're lugging around an elephant. An elephant, despite being much more powerful will never be as fast as a light nimble Cheetah. Same with cars. People are tricked into playing top trumps game thinking more is better. It simply is not. Lotus cars provide nimble, quick, amazing feedback, great feeling and smiles all round; it's that what makes people like driving sporty cars - the sensation and experience of driving a machine and the adventures you've had in it. Not sitting with mates bragging how many zillion horses a car has. Cars these days are outputting crazy numbers (seems anything below 500BHP is now considered the 'slow' option - seriously?! 500bhp is a fooking lot of power - scary fast power). Can you really use it though? Is it really fun to get to 60mph in under 3 seconds - not really. When you've done it a few times the novelty wears thin. What you really want is something that can go around corners, has great acceleration and amazing feedback without worrying about losing your license all the time. This is why Lotus are spot on with their cars and ethos. They deliver something few other manufacturers can. They also look the bees knees too.
Not *everyone* else is so different tho. Mazda also made their 'newest' MX-5, the ND, lighter and slightly less powerful than its predecessor. They might be a bit more watered down than the Lotuses, but they're also a good bit cheaper, and loads of fun, too. Someday, I'm gonna buy one of the V6 Exiges tho, for now, I'll make do with my Miata.
"An elephant, despite being much more powerful will never be as fast as a light nimble Cheetah." Challenge accepted. Now where did I put those rockets?
The 2ZZ doesn't use any cast exhaust parts. Makes me kinda question the whole "25whp just from a long tube header and bigger exhaust pipes." btw, what kind of money do you suppose you have in doing all that engine and exhaust work to a 2ZZ? Because a basic turbo kit for the 2ZZ is like less than 3k and it adds a tell of alot more than 25whp even with the high compression and soft pistons that leads to most kits set to low boost.
Bought a 2005 Elise 3 months ago. Amazing car, light, comfortable and fast. Pretty to look at. Only driven about 500 miles so I'm still getting used to it. Makes my Miata NC feel big and heavy.
@Sam Ros exactly dont let those hp fool you cars like elise cup 250 are extreamly fast most they aclerate like 500 hp cars made by bmw or benz since they weight almost nothing.
I’ve just had an Audi TT RS for the last 4 months.....comfortable, loud, fast, lots of toys........sold it for my second ever Elise the day before yesterday and I couldn’t be happier. The Elise has a soul and spirit that most sports cars don’t have, it’s pure driving heaven
Here's my take. I have a BMW Z4 35iS, in terms of straight line performance the Elise 220 Sport will be ahead but not by much, ride quality and noise aren’t that far behind the Zed but the handling & involvements is light years ahead so let’s call that even. An Elise Sport 220 with a similar spec to my 35iS would costs about 4k less than the Z4, with the closest Porsche 718 & MB SLC being 4k more than the BMW. That make the Elise is a little bargain if you ask me!
you are a preacher, preaching the truth, facts more true than common people could never beleive...cos' you only can feel the emotion, when you drive this sensation al car
I have a series 2 111R sports racer. I have to say that driving these cars is like nothing else I have ever driven. The responsiveness and feedback you get is addictive! Love them!
Buy an elise for twenty grand, sell it a year later for twenty grand. free motoring. a service is 200 quid, an MOT is 40 quid and it does 40mpg. if you're sat reading this in your hot hatchback, make the jump you cannot regret it.
i bought my elise for 15k and sold it 5 years later for 14k then bought a cayman s for 17k and when i sell that it will be worth more than 13k put some money together and i will probably buy something like a noble m400. Wouldnt mind seeing a noble and elise comparison video actually James.
buy a lotus is like buy a masterpiece of course it's expensive they give you one of the best handling car in the world, fast, peace of engineering and rawness is something else its like driving go-cart in the road and it's legal and its fun to drive, they even get to be best sport's car of the year last time and of course porsche is better but lotus is just something else and the best thing is race driver likes it (sorry for my bad english)
Elise is one of my favorite cars ever. But I dont see it as logical to value a car based on its power to weight ratio. If that was the case, motorcycles would cost 3 times as much.
Hmm I have seen this Cup 250 before -> points at the green seat details. On topic, these cars are worth every penny/eurocent, but it's not for everybody. I wanted a raw street legal racecar and that is exactly what I got. Wouldn't trade it for no other car in the same price class.
They are very expensive for what you get. I mean it’s a off the shelf alpine deck and Toyota economy engines. Very cool cars but they are what they are. The cars you mentioned have also evolved as well. The only thing I’ll give these is they’re small number and labor intensive ect.
Here are the prices in Euros, VAT at 20% included (before ANY options): Elise Sport 220: 50 220 € Elise Cup 250: 63 130 € Elise Cup 260: 76 640 € Elise Sprint 220: 56 780 € Exige Sport 350: 75 840 € Exige Sport 380: 91 470 € Exige Sport 410: 112 800 € Exige Cup 380: 110 900 € Exige Cup 430: 128 600 €
My current ride, a Proton, weight 1245kg wet, 1.6l 125hp aeroback sedan with Lotus handling. Can take a corner much, much better than the other car in its class. Can u imagine how it feels like to drive a Lotus? My dream car one day.
You got the point. Elises were never cheap. I'm from Poland and used Elises are very expensive. Prices float around 80k PLN which is about 15-20k Pounds. It is cheaper to buy Grande Punto Sport (120HP) and tune it for 350HP + polybushes and coilovers. T-jet engine is bulletproof, all you need is bigger turbo (TD05) and stronger custom clutch. And even after that everything costs around 10-15k pounds including a base car. BTW do You like tuning? You can tune Your Evora in Komotec for 460HP. After that it goes 0-100km/h around 3.5s and top speed is over 310km/h. Make Your Evora a supercar! :)
MX5 still a lot of fun until you can get the Elise. But when you do, I'm guessing you will think it is worth the wait. Took me over a decade to get mine and no regrets except that I waited so long. For me at least, the perfect weekend play toy and I don't ever plan to sell it. Good luck and stay the course !
Very good points mate lightweight cars are brilliant luv the feel of an elise good video as usual I think there very well priced except here in australia😫
I don't think I'd call it "Click Bait" You just asked a question and for some psychological reason people tend to head towards the negative but instead got an astounding "No the Elise isn't overpriced" . Well Done Liked/Subbd.
had a drive of the base Lotus Elise Sport 1.6 with a Stage 1 Sports Exhaust & TRD Induction Kit it drove & sounded fantastic. Unfortunately it's been sold but the Dealership has just received a red 220 Cup 2016 car with 10000 miles it'll probably blow my budget to smithereens but would it be worth the extra outlay. I am extremely tempted but have never spent that kinda money ever in my lifetime & that's begrudging me somewhat.
Great information! I wish I could afford one. I wish they were still sold in the US. And I wish they had sold the Sport or Club Racer models here with the smaller engine and fewer options.
I’ve looked at so many of these online here in Germany and they remain stubbornly expensive second hand. However, with a cool head and feature for feature, a Boxster always trumps it. Except for turning heads, that is!
Bien sur qu’elle est devenue trop chère, le prix du neuf s’est envolé sur les 10 dernières années mais la voiture est restée sensiblement la même. La raison est simplement que Lotus a eu besoin de dégager plus de marge. Ce n’est plus la même clientèle qui peut s’en acheter une neuve qu’il y a quelques années.. Mais ca reste une super voiture avec un coup de crayon intemporel.
I'm weighing up the options at the moment - I've a Lancia integrale Evo which I'm considering swapping for an Elise - don't get me wrong, the Lancia was a boyhood dream car but is savagely expensive to maintain and fuel economy is whoeful at best, however, it's still 'special' and increasing in value like you wouldn't believe - I've always hankered after an Elise since owing an Excel SE back in the day - decisions, decisions.
Nope, you're not wrong. You're spot on. I've long considered adding an Elise/Exige to my garage (Honda S2000, Subaru WRX STi, SRT Viper GTS, and Mustang). It's a "cute" car, but I'm not sure I'm into "cute" anymore.......
James Martin haha...fair enough. I guess my point is, I went from S2000 (cute) to STi (ugly) to Mustang (kinda cool) to Viper (drop dead gorgeous) and now that I've had an 8.4 litre V10 with 645 hp/600 lb/ft at my disposal in a 3200 lb car, the thought of a Toyota Camary engine isn't very appealing. I'm sure the driving experience is everything they say it is, but........
James Martin very very true. There's an Exige S for sale at Weissach in Vancouver for 62K Canadian. Fairly reasonable. I've thought of checking it out, but deep down I'm afraid I'll love it, and then the wife will change the locks on the doors before I can get it home 😉
A brand new elise is just about out of my price range, but i agree they aren't overpriced, just not dirt cheap. I would buy a second hand one again in an instant and may actually do that. Probably an SC this time. When i sold my elise previously i pretty much got what i had payed for it back which was then used to buy my cayman s. For that reason i think it was good value for money and those who cant afford a brand new elise should certainly consider a second hand one. Lotus will only depreciate so far before they stop losing money.
I saw somewhere it holds its value better than any other car for sale in the UK. A strong case for value, but I do think the 1.6 should be cheaper than it is, as it is considerably slower than the 220
I have just put my deposit down on a 2015 Elise cup racer. Getting rid of my M440i for this little thing. I kind if think im mental but it was great fun although not nearly as fast as my 440i.
Here are the prices in Euros, VAT at 20% included (before ANY options): Elise Sport 220 50 220 € Elise Cup 250 63 130 € Elise Cup 260 76 640 € Elise Sprint 220 56 780 € Exige Sport 350 75 840 € Exige Sport 380 91 470 € Exige Sport 410 112 800 € Exige Cup 380 110 900 € Exige Cup 430 128 600 €
Another interesting video Jay, and quite poinient for me - as I have an Exige V6 and of recent have found myself questioning whether it's worth what I paid for it. The reason being that the rattles and road noise you get when you drive it sometimes remind me of an old classic mini I used to have. I cannot dispute it's performance and impressive road holding, but when I think that a used Porsche Cayman GTS or Audi R8 can be had for the same money, I start to question the value of the Exige. That said it's a great car and always a thrill to drive. I think you hit the nail on the head with your comment about the increase in the cost of cars in general. Many are now way over the affordable mark for most people, and the only reason they are selling is PCP schemes.
Thank you for another great video! What you say is absolutely true and the Elise is worth the money! Like I mentioned in my comment in your last video, I think the Elise Sport 1.6 is the greatest car you can get in terms of "Price-Fun"-ratio...I love the Elise and of course my VX220 :-)
@5:27 Cars are more expensive these days, yeah that is right but irrelevant. The Elise is a performance car, that means the question is whether or not the performance is worth the money. Do you pay just for the performance or a premium for having a handbuilt car that has been produced in small numbers?
As a Lotus fan, it can be tough to justify their prices. In Australia, an A45 is 5k less than a Sport 220, and for that you get a 280kW, AWD, Dual Clutch, full hatch, lush machine with accordingly better fuel consumption. 1st I think, fuel ratings are bogus. Just non real-world tests. How does a 600kg heavier car with AWD, bigger block, more power and torque output, with more interior devices use less fuel? And secondly, when you look at a lotta cars, the drop-top versions are always more expensive for worse ultimate performance. Topless is an expensive feature. When you buy an Elise, you're getting that major feature by default. The car is built as standard with all the strength and power as a topless.
Is it that bad? Yeah, I'm gathering pretty much everything out there is a bit detatched vs an Elise. Sometimes (especially when you haven't driven one like me), it's difficult to factor in driving feedback n sensations into bragging rights. A lotta cars claim equivalent sprint times to Elises for less money, like a Focus RS. Though I seen RS's accordingly have terrible turning circles. I'm guessing Elises can outmatch those beefy low(er) cost rivals in tight circuits. You'd almost expect it being a dedicated sports car
James Martin Yeah like you said in vid, bigger cars cost more in running costs. Of course then you get petrol heads that take precariously high performance cars like GTRs, and rig them for 100s extra hp. Some kinda rich mans nirvanna. Be interested to know how much work they take to maintain
On the depreciation, I bought a 2005 S2 111S in 2011 for £16k, drove it for 12,000 miles and sold it 4 years later for £16k. Today it's worth £22k. Also, if you do ever buy one, never sell it anyway - no car you drive afterwards has any soul.
It has been a dream to own an Elise in the states, but sadly I can't get anything newer than one that is used, or one that came out several years ago. Is it even possible to order an Elise and grab some sort of modders kit to make it legal in the US? As far as I know, there's no law forbidding right-hand-drive vehicles.
you would have to import it without an engine and then do an engine swap. Not really worth it though considering the costs. Register it as a kit car. I dont think the Lotus elise has past any of the USA safety regulations and likely wouldn't pass them had it attempted them. A brand new elise in the future might make it to the USA market.
The US/federal Elises are great cars. They all have the wonderful high revving 2zz motor; you can also buy one with a factory super charger. And they hold their value as James was saying. Why then would you bother importing a new one from the U.K. (which is legally impossible afaik)?
A Evora 400 here in Canada is more expensive than a some what well equipped 911 Carrera s. So, if 911 are overpriced, I think Lotus is overpriced as well (I'm not saying I can find a similar car).
If they dropped the price, they'd probably sell a lot more and increase their profits. However, that increase probably doesn't currently justify the expenditure necessary to expand their facilities. Fingers crossed this changes when the new Elise comes out in 2020, where Lotus might well cash in on the demand for a "new Lotus" and go for some more automation and economies of scale. If they could double their output, and get the asking price across their range down by £5K-10K, this could be the best sweet spot for profit maximization and the ability to carry on investing in new products. They just need to get to 2020 making enough profit to invest in the new Elise. Gales looks like he has a good grasp to the economic realities.. So no, not over priced for their output. Hence the very strong residuals. Perhaps James could do some digging and get some titbits on what Lotus have planned over the next 5 years?
I'm guessing Lotus sells about a quarter of the cars Ferrari do. Plus Ferrari make a lot of money from other things besides selling just road cars. There might well be more margins in the back to basics of the Lotus ethos, but even so, they must need some economies of scale to survive and thrive long term. There's no reason why Lotus shouldn't be aiming for 10,000 units a year as I believe this is the level where profits can sustain the R@D. Apparently the factory has the capacity to do this. I think they'll be doing this in about 10 years time. Just a guess.
Ben Jamin' if they're as handmade as the video suggests they don't gain much efficiency selling more. I'm would bet the managers at Lotus are pricing them correctly. Having said that I'd love it if they were cheaper.
@ Michael Cohen Yep. That's what I said. Lotus are pricing them correctly. @ JM I'm not too surprised it takes three weeks. Maybe some investment in an automated paint shop would help speed/quality and profits?
Having been to the factory a few years ago, it's not as primitive as some people think. Also, Lotus make more money from their engineering side than the car side. Those that look at the Lotus Elise purely from a numbers perspective are missing the bigger picture... it's the driving experience that sets them apart. It's a very different sensory experience. They don't feel like other 'ordinary' cars. Unless you've driven a really low slung, light weight, raw, back to basics sports car such as the Elise, you won't 'get it'. Personally, after trying several of each, I chose a Caterham 7 over the Elise, but it was a tough choice. After that, all mainstream cars seem very dull and unresponsive, even hot hatches and the MX5.
ever since the caterham 160 was launched i've been hoping lotus would make a barebones s1 spec (narrow suspension) elise with a tweaked honda s660 engine and skinny tyres. original spec elise is lighter than the s660 is, so it wouldn't really be slow, especially tuned a bit... not exactly relevant to the vid, i know
Hi Mate a question please and than you I am in the process of looking to buy a Lotus sadly my drive wont let me get an 380 Cup up it as its a bit too wide and low but my second choice is a Cup 250 Iv spec'ed one up and its probably the most expensive in the UK lol but are they as good as Im lead to believe it will be used for going to car shows and grabbing lunch in Torquay harbour runs out into Dartmoor on dry days only so just a lovely toy but your comments would be appreciated Cheers M
Hi Mate thanks so much I watch all your stuff and thank you for your comments I'm getting a new one from Henley Lotus as I am Mr Fussy and want it to be loved from day one so big thanks
Yes. The Elise is overpriced, no question about it. The cheapest one you can buy on the Lotus website is over £50k!! Lotus desperately need a car that mortal men can aspire to own, men who have girlfriends and a house and don't like the idea of living with mum until we're 40. Lotus need to bring back the Elan, price is at about £30k at that price you seriously worry the competition. When they price cars in-line with Porsche, they are not going to come off well, you can talk all day about extruded aluminum chassis, volume sales wont come their way.
That much money, for a 4cly car, is outrageous. Being fast and fun, doesn't justify the price. Motorcycles are more fast and fun to ride, than most cars. But they are appropriately priced.
In my country a base elise costs around $100k, and a used one (IF you can find one, costs around $80k). It's very hard to justify it at that price and really, for the money, I'd rather spend it on a used porsche
An elise 250 cup cost at least MYR300,000 in Malaysia, equivalent to 54k pounds. Even then it's a 2016 manufactured car and labelled as used. So sad to see it in that price range here, totally shattered my dreams of getting one.
I get your argument but I think Lotus are now up against it with the new Alpine. It’s only 1100kg and costs roughly £50k... I love Lotus but it’s hard to argue with that.
How come the prices in euros for Lotus sales on the European continent are about 30% more than the GBP prices (VAT included), while the GBP/EUR exchange rate has been consistently about 1.15 or less? Lotus is making a markup of at least 15% for sales to Europeans on the continent relative the UK prices. Not fair. Legal?
I live in The Netherlands and car are even more expensive then UK. There is an enormous amount of CO2 tax (called BPM) on cars. Example: Ford Mustang ecoboost €57k ; the V8 version €120k. Because of the low weight Elise produce few CO2. This makes the Elise compared to other cars less expensive and dear i say it: cheap. Starting price for sport €33k. Sport 220 €41k, cup250 €51k. Compared it to alternatives: Porsche 718 (71k), Audi TT (47k and do you really want one?), Ferrari, BMW Z4 (57k), Nissan 370z (100k). Strange is you can find a Porsche, Audi , BMW on every street corner. Nissan are pretty rare but Lotus is really in a different league. 850 Lotus to 1609 Ferrari in 2015. So, only one choice really.
£ 32 k AND NO CD PLAYER AND YOU ARE ASKING IF A LOTUS IS OVERPRICED ............. anyone read my mind ? Yes its a beautiful car but at £ 40 K get a mazda mx 5 ser 1 save so cash and have the same fun ......... cars are a waste of money
+citic101 You could always pay Ariel double that for a car with no CD player. Or Caterham. You pay Porsche £110k for a car it doesn't have cruise or parking sensors standard
yes your right but just shows that we must be mad to pay such sums for a car which nearly becomes obsolete as we drive it out of the showroom ......... like your videos , good work
+citic101 In many ways it is less obsolete than many others - an Elise will drive brilliant in 10 years. But have you used a sat nav from 10 years ago?
I'm waiting that my 2002 brg Rover one grows in price, really want it to get a rare oldtimer like a Ferrari Dino with the same price tag..it deserves it...but it will never be...even not in brg...so sad that we are not really understood from the outsiders driving modern cars. So I will sell it when my back will not stand it anymore...sad but true. Amen.
fan 50 i agree. I own a base 911. The figures are much quicker - Car And Driver got 3.4 sec 0-60 (PDK). While I admire the Lotus, comparing it to a 911 is a bit silly. Yesterday, I drove it home 1000 miles from Pretoria (I wouldn’t want to do that in any Lotus!). Today I took it over some local mountain passes in the Cape. While a Lotus would have kept up, I doubt he would have been able to overtake. The 911 is a grand tourer, which can be both a daily driver and a sports car. The Lotus is a sports car. Yes, the Porsche option list is long, but even my base model without any performance mods is quicker, more comfortable, more reliable, and more useful than the Lotus. Yes, it is a bit more expensive, but here in South Africa, it will also keep its value much better.
JayEmm on Cars ah! But in the video, you are (trying to) compare an Elise to a 911... Difficult for me to try an Evora, as I am a wheelchair user and need hand controls. Which was another major reason for choosing Porsche; everyone says the PDK is the best of all two peddle options. My car was very carefully researched (including your own earlier videos!), as I can’t do a test drive (other than sitting in a car in the showroom and seeing if I can load my wheelchair in). I am blown away with this new 911. I plan on using it as a Daily Driver & will hang on to this car, as it is about as close to perfection (for me) as any vehicle can get. Just need to find a clean second hand old G wagon and I shall have the perfect 3 car stable (for me!).
JayEmm on Cars I would go further; and say that the Porsche 911 is a better car than either the Lotus Elise or Evora. The Porsche 911 is rightly used as the measuring board in so many tests. I don’t doubt that the Evora would be a good GT car...but compared to the 911? The Porsche has met, and exceeded all my expectations (which, after watching many videos, including your own, were very high). Looking at some figures here in South Africa it would seem that the Porsche also easily beats the Lotus in terms of depreciation, but I understand this may not be the case in the UK. I have never even been in an Evora, but if you had to drive 1000miles and you were offered either a fully specced Lotus or a base 911, are you really going to claim that you would climb into the Hethel machine, rather than the iconic car from Stuttgart?? As you found when losing your bet on the 911 GTS, this car, with the new engine is a stonker. It is fabulously comfortable, capable, and superior in almost every way to a Lotus. I know you are a bit of a Lotus fanboy, but I would challenge you to do a back to back test / comparison between a base 911 and either an Elise or Evora. Go for the popular PDK, & do a 0-60 test too...I dare you! Come out to South Africa, and I will show you that I could beat a Lotus without touching the throttle pedal!!
Imagine spending 40k on a car with a body that if dinked cannot be fixed, or at least costs lots of money. It's pokey, it's light, the drive is harsh n unforgiving, it's not comfortable to get in n out, it's basically a very expensive sexy go cart for people with more money than sense ..
New, not 35K for a used elise.. They are certainly overpriced here, and dont have the recent upgrades of the new models. You couldn't pay me to go anywhere fleabay either. Wouldn't even dream of buying a car there especially .
You no longer use CDs. But millions still do. Many new cars still have ‘em. And new CDs are released all the time. As are new CD players. Don’t assume nobody enjoys CDs anymore just because you don’t. www.cnet.com/news/a-music-nerds-last-stand-youll-pry-my-cds-out-of-my-cold-dead-hands/
No but the Evora 400 clearly is. I’ve had various valuations of 2016 cars on different dealers websites and the dealers are all overpricing them by 6-10k!!!!......you expect a dealer to make a few thousand profit selling a car but not for your car to lose 10k as soon as you drive it off the forecourt. Wish someone would tell me why Evora 400’s are so overpriced!?
Power to weight ratio is way worse on my 2009 1.8 Audi TT (160bhp) than on my 2001 MK2 with Rover engine. Benched at 148 BHP. The Audi TT however is waaaay faster in all respects (corners, acceleration and top speed) and fuel economy is 1 liter per 12km average on my TT and 1 liter per 8 km on my Elise. Power to weight says very little to nothing anymore when it comes to performance when you have an engine without torque. The standard Elise has the power of an MGB and cannot compete with modern cars with the same horse power. If you are challenged by a current basic Golf you will get that 148bhp sweating. On my last visit to the UK I was outrun by plenty of Ford Focus, old and new, and they have more performance at much less fuel consumption. The (early) Elise MK2 is absolutely a crap car but they can take away everything from me except my Elise. I love this crap car because it's one of the last true CARS. The TT is a perfect 'elevator' . It gets you from A to B fast and comfortable while the Elise is like an old mini. It seems fast and it feels fast because you drive in a 'bubble', and you get out of the bubble with a big smile.
the reason why lotus dont depreciate is beacuse they dont really make that many cars there not super expensive for the type of car they want to be there cars have less gadget and more real hardware engineering there reliable there cheap to run cars like bmw or bezn focus alot on digital gadgets like tft screen massage seats and all sort of stuff that will be made obsolete the moment a model comes out.
just go an drive one...you either want one then or not...who cares for the price... also, the 1.6l Toyota engine isn´t that good...I rather stick with me Rover K16...beats Toyota everytime
Thank you. At last someone is telling it as it is. Yes its finiky to change timing belts but so what, as long as you do it its fine, and its not expensive either. A bog standard Rover engine, but it does the job completely. That's why they chose it. I think they knew what they were doing, I guess.
@@JayEmmOnCars All the stats I have seen indicates that the highest death rate happens on small cars. Lotus Elise is extremely light, why would it not be unsafe on the road? Any car crash could do significant damage to the people inside the car.
It sounds like you are confusing small city cars with an Elise. Which is very well constructed, extremely strong and good in the event of an accident. It's not the same as a city car
Are you seriously saying that the Elise is on par with the Vanquish and therefore it is a bargain only because the chassis tech is the same? Come on..... A bullet goes faster than both and it is $1. Doesn't mean anything... The Elise is cool but it is in today's terms overpriced. The funky look of the car is keeping the price afloat as well as the perceived status of the brand. I am more of en Elise person than a Vanquish person in terms of philosophy but I can't stop thinking that the whole Elise thing is a self-fulfilled prophecy, too many people saying it is cool on TH-cam (mostly Americans) and therefore it has to be true.
No my point was Aston charged more for a car with the same chassis and power-weight ratio. The Elise survives because of its reputation as an excellent drivers' car. If you ever get the chance to drive one, you'll see what I mean.
Lotus is sooooo tiny, I have seen it in real life it is just like a toy car. And interior materials are typical British- low quality, poor fit and finish. I can only imagine how unreliable it is.
Toyota engine, mature running gear now. These are more reliable and have lower running costs (they don't use up tyres and brakes) than probably even a Miata / MX5
You've got to laugh at people who stick on the old exhaust mods, wraps and all the other tat you can get, when in reality they are probably making it slower and less powerful.
You have two options - add more power or make it lighter. Everyone but Lotus seem to add more power; cars are heavier thus it's less involving (read: enjoyable) to drive.
Lotus are correct. They follow what F1 cars do, which is to make cars light to get better performance and feedback. People always focus on power output of a car but it's no good if you're lugging around an elephant. An elephant, despite being much more powerful will never be as fast as a light nimble Cheetah. Same with cars.
People are tricked into playing top trumps game thinking more is better. It simply is not. Lotus cars provide nimble, quick, amazing feedback, great feeling and smiles all round; it's that what makes people like driving sporty cars - the sensation and experience of driving a machine and the adventures you've had in it. Not sitting with mates bragging how many zillion horses a car has.
Cars these days are outputting crazy numbers (seems anything below 500BHP is now considered the 'slow' option - seriously?! 500bhp is a fooking lot of power - scary fast power). Can you really use it though? Is it really fun to get to 60mph in under 3 seconds - not really. When you've done it a few times the novelty wears thin. What you really want is something that can go around corners, has great acceleration and amazing feedback without worrying about losing your license all the time.
This is why Lotus are spot on with their cars and ethos. They deliver something few other manufacturers can. They also look the bees knees too.
Not *everyone* else is so different tho. Mazda also made their 'newest' MX-5, the ND, lighter and slightly less powerful than its predecessor.
They might be a bit more watered down than the Lotuses, but they're also a good bit cheaper, and loads of fun, too.
Someday, I'm gonna buy one of the V6 Exiges tho, for now, I'll make do with my Miata.
FirstName LastName 0-60 will always be fun.
"An elephant, despite being much more powerful will never be as fast as a light nimble Cheetah."
Challenge accepted. Now where did I put those rockets?
The 2ZZ doesn't use any cast exhaust parts. Makes me kinda question the whole "25whp just from a long tube header and bigger exhaust pipes."
btw, what kind of money do you suppose you have in doing all that engine and exhaust work to a 2ZZ? Because a basic turbo kit for the 2ZZ is like less than 3k and it adds a tell of alot more than 25whp even with the high compression and soft pistons that leads to most kits set to low boost.
Removing the big quite factory muffler, for a smaller free flowing one, always makes the car faster.
Bought a 2005 Elise 3 months ago. Amazing car, light, comfortable and fast. Pretty to look at. Only driven about 500 miles so I'm still getting used to it. Makes my Miata NC feel big and heavy.
@Sam Ros exactly dont let those hp fool you cars like elise cup 250 are extreamly fast most they aclerate like 500 hp cars made by bmw or benz since they weight almost nothing.
Thats the kind of clickbait I like....catch our attention but give us value.
it was perfect, keep up the good content
I’ve just had an Audi TT RS for the last 4 months.....comfortable, loud, fast, lots of toys........sold it for my second ever Elise the day before yesterday and I couldn’t be happier. The Elise has a soul and spirit that most sports cars don’t have, it’s pure driving heaven
I have to say that the whole monologue to the camera, without a script, any cuts, hesitations or deviations is very impressive.
Thankyou
Here's my take. I have a BMW Z4 35iS, in terms of straight line performance the Elise 220 Sport will be ahead but not by much, ride quality and noise aren’t that far behind the Zed but the handling & involvements is light years ahead so let’s call that even. An Elise Sport 220 with a similar spec to my 35iS would costs about 4k less than the Z4, with the closest Porsche 718 & MB SLC being 4k more than the BMW. That make the Elise is a little bargain if you ask me!
you are a preacher, preaching the truth, facts more true than common people could never beleive...cos' you only can feel the emotion, when you drive this sensation al car
+Rccarlover Luxembourg Amen Brother
I have a series 2 111R sports racer. I have to say that driving these cars is like nothing else I have ever driven. The responsiveness and feedback you get is addictive! Love them!
another great in depth review as usual.
Buy an elise for twenty grand, sell it a year later for twenty grand. free motoring. a service is 200 quid, an MOT is 40 quid and it does 40mpg. if you're sat reading this in your hot hatchback, make the jump you cannot regret it.
Jonathan Roebuck Need to have 20k first!
this is very true, however if you borrow it, it's a good way to save especially how interest rates are!
i bought my elise for 15k and sold it 5 years later for 14k then bought a cayman s for 17k and when i sell that it will be worth more than 13k put some money together and i will probably buy something like a noble m400. Wouldnt mind seeing a noble and elise comparison video actually James.
If your Elise is doing 40mpg, you aren’t driving it properly...
Add £300 for a set of rear tyres to your annual running costs too.
Great video James, well explained. Lotus should be paying you for this marketing.
Some extremely good points you made, specifically in regards to the automotive industry in general that were very interesting, and enlightening.
buy a lotus is like buy a masterpiece of course it's expensive they give you one of the best handling car in the world, fast, peace of engineering and rawness is something else its like driving go-cart in the road and it's legal and its fun to drive, they even get to be best sport's car of the year last time and of course porsche is better but lotus is just something else and the best thing is race driver likes it (sorry for my bad english)
Elise is one of my favorite cars ever. But I dont see it as logical to value a car based on its power to weight ratio. If that was the case, motorcycles would cost 3 times as much.
Exactly, used second gen elises are especially overpriced
All you have done is make me want one even more lol.d
Intro: "I do love a bit of clickbait". Nice one mate :)
Hmm I have seen this Cup 250 before -> points at the green seat details.
On topic, these cars are worth every penny/eurocent, but it's not for everybody. I wanted a raw street legal racecar and that is exactly what I got. Wouldn't trade it for no other car in the same price class.
They are very expensive for what you get. I mean it’s a off the shelf alpine deck and Toyota economy engines. Very cool cars but they are what they are. The cars you mentioned have also evolved as well. The only thing I’ll give these is they’re small number and labor intensive ect.
Here are the prices in Euros, VAT at 20% included (before ANY options):
Elise Sport 220: 50 220 €
Elise Cup 250: 63 130 €
Elise Cup 260: 76 640 €
Elise Sprint 220: 56 780 €
Exige Sport 350: 75 840 €
Exige Sport 380: 91 470 €
Exige Sport 410: 112 800 €
Exige Cup 380: 110 900 €
Exige Cup 430: 128 600 €
My current ride, a Proton, weight 1245kg wet, 1.6l 125hp aeroback sedan with Lotus handling. Can take a corner much, much better than the other car in its class.
Can u imagine how it feels like to drive a Lotus? My dream car one day.
You got the point. Elises were never cheap. I'm from Poland and used Elises are very expensive. Prices float around 80k PLN which is about 15-20k Pounds. It is cheaper to buy Grande Punto Sport (120HP) and tune it for 350HP + polybushes and coilovers. T-jet engine is bulletproof, all you need is bigger turbo (TD05) and stronger custom clutch. And even after that everything costs around 10-15k pounds including a base car.
BTW do You like tuning? You can tune Your Evora in Komotec for 460HP. After that it goes 0-100km/h around 3.5s and top speed is over 310km/h. Make Your Evora a supercar! :)
Another interesting JayEmm-Video.
These are my absolute dream car, gonna be a loooong time until I can afford that pricetag though. Stuck in the MX5 for now! :)
Not the worst compromise!
MX5 still a lot of fun until you can get the Elise. But when you do, I'm guessing you will think it is worth the wait. Took me over a decade to get mine and no regrets except that I waited so long. For me at least, the perfect weekend play toy and I don't ever plan to sell it. Good luck and stay the course !
Very good points mate lightweight cars are brilliant luv the feel of an elise good video as usual I think there very well priced except here in australia😫
I don't think I'd call it "Click Bait" You just asked a question and for some psychological reason people tend to head towards the negative but instead got an astounding "No the Elise isn't overpriced" . Well Done Liked/Subbd.
wow, first video I’ve watched of yours and great content
Thankyou!
had a drive of the base Lotus Elise Sport 1.6 with a Stage 1 Sports Exhaust & TRD Induction Kit it drove & sounded fantastic. Unfortunately it's been sold but the Dealership has just received a red 220 Cup 2016 car with 10000 miles it'll probably blow my budget to smithereens but would it be worth the extra outlay. I am extremely tempted but have never spent that kinda money ever in my lifetime & that's begrudging me somewhat.
bedeviling
Great video. Not seen a single Evora 400 out here in Dubai yet. They are there but as rare as unicorns.
Great information! I wish I could afford one. I wish they were still sold in the US. And I wish they had sold the Sport or Club Racer models here with the smaller engine and fewer options.
I’ve looked at so many of these online here in Germany and they remain stubbornly expensive second hand. However, with a cool head and feature for feature, a Boxster always trumps it. Except for turning heads, that is!
Excellent review
YES... because you have so much choice in that price range if you don't buy brand new.
Bien sur qu’elle est devenue trop chère, le prix du neuf s’est envolé sur les 10 dernières années mais la voiture est restée sensiblement la même. La raison est simplement que Lotus a eu besoin de dégager plus de marge. Ce n’est plus la même clientèle qui peut s’en acheter une neuve qu’il y a quelques années..
Mais ca reste une super voiture avec un coup de crayon intemporel.
I have a 220 Cup, mega machine and just super fun to drive. Didn’t pay £50k for it though!🤓
I'm weighing up the options at the moment - I've a Lancia integrale Evo which I'm considering swapping for an Elise - don't get me wrong, the Lancia was a boyhood dream car but is savagely expensive to maintain and fuel economy is whoeful at best, however, it's still 'special' and increasing in value like you wouldn't believe - I've always hankered after an Elise since owing an Excel SE back in the day - decisions, decisions.
Nope, you're not wrong. You're spot on. I've long considered adding an Elise/Exige to my garage (Honda S2000, Subaru WRX STi, SRT Viper GTS, and Mustang). It's a "cute" car, but I'm not sure I'm into "cute" anymore.......
James Martin haha...fair enough. I guess my point is, I went from S2000 (cute) to STi (ugly) to Mustang (kinda cool) to Viper (drop dead gorgeous) and now that I've had an 8.4 litre V10 with 645 hp/600 lb/ft at my disposal in a 3200 lb car, the thought of a Toyota Camary engine isn't very appealing. I'm sure the driving experience is everything they say it is, but........
James Martin very very true. There's an Exige S for sale at Weissach in Vancouver for 62K Canadian. Fairly reasonable. I've thought of checking it out, but deep down I'm afraid I'll love it, and then the wife will change the locks on the doors before I can get it home 😉
James Martin I think I may have pushed my luck about as far as I can.....unless....i trade one in.....hmmmmmm...
A brand new elise is just about out of my price range, but i agree they aren't overpriced, just not dirt cheap. I would buy a second hand one again in an instant and may actually do that. Probably an SC this time. When i sold my elise previously i pretty much got what i had payed for it back which was then used to buy my cayman s. For that reason i think it was good value for money and those who cant afford a brand new elise should certainly consider a second hand one. Lotus will only depreciate so far before they stop losing money.
Always liked the Lotus ! Would love to drive one !
with man maths its bargain lol I'd love one great video James cheers from new Zealand
James Martin I'd take the lotus any day over the golf cheers mate
Great video again.
I saw somewhere it holds its value better than any other car for sale in the UK. A strong case for value, but I do think the 1.6 should be cheaper than it is, as it is considerably slower than the 220
I have just put my deposit down on a 2015 Elise cup racer. Getting rid of my M440i for this little thing. I kind if think im mental but it was great fun although not nearly as fast as my 440i.
Same information, other format:
Elise Sport 220:
50 220 €
39 300 GBP
Markup EUR / GBP: 27,79%
Elise Sprint 220:
56 780 €
44 300 GBP
Markup EUR / GBP: 28,17%
Elise Cup 250:
63 130 €
47 400 GBP
Markup EUR / GBP: 33,19%
Elise Cup 260:
76 640 €
59 500 GBP
Markup EUR / GBP: 28,81%
Exige Sport 350:
75 840 €
58 200 GBP
Markup EUR / GBP: 30,31%
Exige Sport 380:
91 470 €
68 500 GBP
Markup EUR / GBP: 33,53%
Exige Sport 410:
112 800 €
86 500 GBP
Markup EUR / GBP: 30,40%
Exige Cup 430:
128 600 €
99 800 GBP
Markup EUR / GBP: 28,86%
Here are the prices in Euros, VAT at 20% included (before ANY options):
Elise Sport 220 50 220 €
Elise Cup 250 63 130 €
Elise Cup 260 76 640 €
Elise Sprint 220 56 780 €
Exige Sport 350 75 840 €
Exige Sport 380 91 470 €
Exige Sport 410 112 800 €
Exige Cup 380 110 900 €
Exige Cup 430 128 600 €
Bankofengland tells me that 22.000 in 1996 is worth 37.900 today.
Another interesting video Jay, and quite poinient for me - as I have an Exige V6 and of recent have found myself questioning whether it's worth what I paid for it. The reason being that the rattles and road noise you get when you drive it sometimes remind me of an old classic mini I used to have. I cannot dispute it's performance and impressive road holding, but when I think that a used Porsche Cayman GTS or Audi R8 can be had for the same money, I start to question the value of the Exige. That said it's a great car and always a thrill to drive. I think you hit the nail on the head with your comment about the increase in the cost of cars in general. Many are now way over the affordable mark for most people, and the only reason they are selling is PCP schemes.
PCP is allowing manufacturers to push up the cash price of a car, when finance becomes expensive again it may be something that they start to regret
Thank you for another great video! What you say is absolutely true and the Elise is worth the money! Like I mentioned in my comment in your last video, I think the Elise Sport 1.6 is the greatest car you can get in terms of "Price-Fun"-ratio...I love the Elise and of course my VX220 :-)
Lotus have always had this problem, in that you don't buy them by the pound
@5:27 Cars are more expensive these days, yeah that is right but irrelevant. The Elise is a performance car, that means the question is whether or not the performance is worth the money. Do you pay just for the performance or a premium for having a handbuilt car that has been produced in small numbers?
What are lotus so slow to depreciate? I'd quite like a run through of figures, stats and depreciation curve analysis.
It is absolutely overpriced! Cause I still can't afford it ;) The same reason why small depreciation is bad! ;)
reason why i got a S2 Exige!
Cheap finance deals driving the inflation in cars and people sign their lives away for it, hurts the cash buyer that manages their money
How much was a Boxster 10 years a go vs now ?
Yess it is!!
As a Lotus fan, it can be tough to justify their prices. In Australia, an A45 is 5k less than a Sport 220, and for that you get a 280kW, AWD, Dual Clutch, full hatch, lush machine with accordingly better fuel consumption.
1st I think, fuel ratings are bogus. Just non real-world tests. How does a 600kg heavier car with AWD, bigger block, more power and torque output, with more interior devices use less fuel?
And secondly, when you look at a lotta cars, the drop-top versions are always more expensive for worse ultimate performance. Topless is an expensive feature.
When you buy an Elise, you're getting that major feature by default. The car is built as standard with all the strength and power as a topless.
Is it that bad?
Yeah, I'm gathering pretty much everything out there is a bit detatched vs an Elise. Sometimes (especially when you haven't driven one like me), it's difficult to factor in driving feedback n sensations into bragging rights. A lotta cars claim equivalent sprint times to Elises for less money, like a Focus RS. Though I seen RS's accordingly have terrible turning circles.
I'm guessing Elises can outmatch those beefy low(er) cost rivals in tight circuits. You'd almost expect it being a dedicated sports car
James Martin
Yeah like you said in vid, bigger cars cost more in running costs. Of course then you get petrol heads that take precariously high performance cars like GTRs, and rig them for 100s extra hp. Some kinda rich mans nirvanna.
Be interested to know how much work they take to maintain
On the depreciation, I bought a 2005 S2 111S in 2011 for £16k, drove it for 12,000 miles and sold it 4 years later for £16k. Today it's worth £22k.
Also, if you do ever buy one, never sell it anyway - no car you drive afterwards has any soul.
It has been a dream to own an Elise in the states, but sadly I can't get anything newer than one that is used, or one that came out several years ago. Is it even possible to order an Elise and grab some sort of modders kit to make it legal in the US? As far as I know, there's no law forbidding right-hand-drive vehicles.
you would have to import it without an engine and then do an engine swap. Not really worth it though considering the costs. Register it as a kit car. I dont think the Lotus elise has past any of the USA safety regulations and likely wouldn't pass them had it attempted them. A brand new elise in the future might make it to the USA market.
The US/federal Elises are great cars. They all have the wonderful high revving 2zz motor; you can also buy one with a factory super charger.
And they hold their value as James was saying. Why then would you bother importing a new one from the U.K. (which is legally impossible afaik)?
A Evora 400 here in Canada is more expensive than a some what well equipped 911 Carrera s. So, if 911 are overpriced, I think Lotus is overpriced as well (I'm not saying I can find a similar car).
Well said !
If they dropped the price, they'd probably sell a lot more and increase their profits. However, that increase probably doesn't currently justify the expenditure necessary to expand their facilities.
Fingers crossed this changes when the new Elise comes out in 2020, where Lotus might well cash in on the demand for a "new Lotus" and go for some more automation and economies of scale.
If they could double their output, and get the asking price across their range down by £5K-10K, this could be the best sweet spot for profit maximization and the ability to carry on investing in new products.
They just need to get to 2020 making enough profit to invest in the new Elise. Gales looks like he has a good grasp to the economic realities..
So no, not over priced for their output. Hence the very strong residuals.
Perhaps James could do some digging and get some titbits on what Lotus have planned over the next 5 years?
I'm guessing Lotus sells about a quarter of the cars Ferrari do. Plus Ferrari make a lot of money from other things besides selling just road cars.
There might well be more margins in the back to basics of the Lotus ethos, but even so, they must need some economies of scale to survive and thrive long term.
There's no reason why Lotus shouldn't be aiming for 10,000 units a year as I believe this is the level where profits can sustain the R@D. Apparently the factory has the capacity to do this.
I think they'll be doing this in about 10 years time. Just a guess.
The elise is Lotus biggest seller to date and esentially saved the company in the 90s.
Ben Jamin' if they're as handmade as the video suggests they don't gain much efficiency selling more. I'm would bet the managers at Lotus are pricing them correctly. Having said that I'd love it if they were cheaper.
@ Michael Cohen
Yep. That's what I said. Lotus are pricing them correctly.
@ JM
I'm not too surprised it takes three weeks. Maybe some investment in an automated paint shop would help speed/quality and profits?
Having been to the factory a few years ago, it's not as primitive as some people think. Also, Lotus make more money from their engineering side than the car side. Those that look at the Lotus Elise purely from a numbers perspective are missing the bigger picture... it's the driving experience that sets them apart. It's a very different sensory experience. They don't feel like other 'ordinary' cars. Unless you've driven a really low slung, light weight, raw, back to basics sports car such as the Elise, you won't 'get it'. Personally, after trying several of each, I chose a Caterham 7 over the Elise, but it was a tough choice. After that, all mainstream cars seem very dull and unresponsive, even hot hatches and the MX5.
ever since the caterham 160 was launched i've been hoping lotus would make a barebones s1 spec (narrow suspension) elise with a tweaked honda s660 engine and skinny tyres. original spec elise is lighter than the s660 is, so it wouldn't really be slow, especially tuned a bit...
not exactly relevant to the vid, i know
I think it’s a great car however a 20-year-old Sorted S1 probably a better buy ?
Hi Mate a question please and than you I am in the process of looking to buy a Lotus sadly my drive wont let me get an 380 Cup up it as its a bit too wide and low but my second choice is a Cup 250 Iv spec'ed one up and its probably the most expensive in the UK lol but are they as good as Im lead to believe it will be used for going to car shows and grabbing lunch in Torquay harbour runs out into Dartmoor on dry days only so just a lovely toy but your comments would be appreciated Cheers M
Hi Mate thanks so much I watch all your stuff and thank you for your comments I'm getting a new one from Henley Lotus as I am Mr Fussy and want it to be loved from day one so big thanks
I may do that matey Ta
Yes. The Elise is overpriced, no question about it. The cheapest one you can buy on the Lotus website is over £50k!! Lotus desperately need a car that mortal men can aspire to own, men who have girlfriends and a house and don't like the idea of living with mum until we're 40. Lotus need to bring back the Elan, price is at about £30k at that price you seriously worry the competition. When they price cars in-line with Porsche, they are not going to come off well, you can talk all day about extruded aluminum chassis, volume sales wont come their way.
That much money, for a 4cly car, is outrageous. Being fast and fun, doesn't justify the price. Motorcycles are more fast and fun to ride, than most cars. But they are appropriately priced.
In my country a base elise costs around $100k, and a used one (IF you can find one, costs around $80k). It's very hard to justify it at that price and really, for the money, I'd rather spend it on a used porsche
An elise 250 cup cost at least MYR300,000 in Malaysia, equivalent to 54k pounds. Even then it's a 2016 manufactured car and labelled as used. So sad to see it in that price range here, totally shattered my dreams of getting one.
Every time I see those mirrors I think Rover 100 City car.
I'd have though the Cayman range a better comparison
Why that massive door hinge? I don't get it.
I get your argument but I think Lotus are now up against it with the new Alpine. It’s only 1100kg and costs roughly £50k... I love Lotus but it’s hard to argue with that.
I have yet to drive the Alpine, it wasn't out when this was filmed, but it just doesn't appeal to me on a looks basis alone
How come the prices in euros for Lotus sales on the European continent are about 30% more than the GBP prices (VAT included), while the GBP/EUR exchange rate has been consistently about 1.15 or less? Lotus is making a markup of at least 15% for sales to Europeans on the continent relative the UK prices. Not fair. Legal?
A lot of the time this is due to other vehicle taxes and costs involved.
I live in The Netherlands and car are even more expensive then UK. There is an enormous amount of CO2 tax (called BPM) on cars.
Example: Ford Mustang ecoboost €57k ; the V8 version €120k.
Because of the low weight Elise produce few CO2. This makes the Elise compared to other cars less expensive and dear i say it: cheap. Starting price for sport €33k. Sport 220 €41k, cup250 €51k.
Compared it to alternatives: Porsche 718 (71k), Audi TT (47k and do you really want one?), Ferrari, BMW Z4 (57k), Nissan 370z (100k). Strange is you can find a Porsche, Audi , BMW on every street corner. Nissan are pretty rare but Lotus is really in a different league. 850 Lotus to 1609 Ferrari in 2015.
So, only one choice really.
£ 32 k AND NO CD PLAYER AND YOU ARE ASKING IF A LOTUS IS OVERPRICED ............. anyone read my mind ? Yes its a beautiful car but at £ 40 K get a mazda mx 5 ser 1 save so cash and have the same fun ......... cars are a waste of money
+citic101 You could always pay Ariel double that for a car with no CD player. Or Caterham. You pay Porsche £110k for a car it doesn't have cruise or parking sensors standard
yes your right but just shows that we must be mad to pay such sums for a car which nearly becomes obsolete as we drive it out of the showroom ......... like your videos , good work
+citic101 In many ways it is less obsolete than many others - an Elise will drive brilliant in 10 years. But have you used a sat nav from 10 years ago?
I'm waiting that my 2002 brg Rover one grows in price, really want it to get a rare oldtimer like a Ferrari Dino with the same price tag..it deserves it...but it will never be...even not in brg...so sad that we are not really understood from the outsiders driving modern cars. So I will sell it when my back will not stand it anymore...sad but true. Amen.
mate the 911 base is not 4.8sec 0-60, pls correct
fan 50 i agree. I own a base 911. The figures are much quicker - Car And Driver got 3.4 sec 0-60 (PDK). While I admire the Lotus, comparing it to a 911 is a bit silly. Yesterday, I drove it home 1000 miles from Pretoria (I wouldn’t want to do that in any Lotus!). Today I took it over some local mountain passes in the Cape. While a Lotus would have kept up, I doubt he would have been able to overtake. The 911 is a grand tourer, which can be both a daily driver and a sports car. The Lotus is a sports car. Yes, the Porsche option list is long, but even my base model without any performance mods is quicker, more comfortable, more reliable, and more useful than the Lotus. Yes, it is a bit more expensive, but here in South Africa, it will also keep its value much better.
Try an Evora. Amazing GT car. So is the 911.
JayEmm on Cars ah! But in the video, you are (trying to) compare an Elise to a 911... Difficult for me to try an Evora, as I am a wheelchair user and need hand controls. Which was another major reason for choosing Porsche; everyone says the PDK is the best of all two peddle options. My car was very carefully researched (including your own earlier videos!), as I can’t do a test drive (other than sitting in a car in the showroom and seeing if I can load my wheelchair in). I am blown away with this new 911. I plan on using it as a Daily Driver & will hang on to this car, as it is about as close to perfection (for me) as any vehicle can get. Just need to find a clean second hand old G wagon and I shall have the perfect 3 car stable (for me!).
PDK is certainly better than the Lotus auto box, no doubt
JayEmm on Cars I would go further; and say that the Porsche 911 is a better car than either the Lotus Elise or Evora. The Porsche 911 is rightly used as the measuring board in so many tests. I don’t doubt that the Evora would be a good GT car...but compared to the 911? The Porsche has met, and exceeded all my expectations (which, after watching many videos, including your own, were very high). Looking at some figures here in South Africa it would seem that the Porsche also easily beats the Lotus in terms of depreciation, but I understand this may not be the case in the UK. I have never even been in an Evora, but if you had to drive 1000miles and you were offered either a fully specced Lotus or a base 911, are you really going to claim that you would climb into the Hethel machine, rather than the iconic car from Stuttgart?? As you found when losing your bet on the 911 GTS, this car, with the new engine is a stonker. It is fabulously comfortable, capable, and superior in almost every way to a Lotus. I know you are a bit of a Lotus fanboy, but I would challenge you to do a back to back test / comparison between a base 911 and either an Elise or Evora. Go for the popular PDK, & do a 0-60 test too...I dare you! Come out to South Africa, and I will show you that I could beat a Lotus without touching the throttle pedal!!
Yes it is overpriced for me! BUt te car itself is pretty cool. Just not the bargain it should be for me
Imagine spending 40k on a car with a body that if dinked cannot be fixed, or at least costs lots of money. It's pokey, it's light, the drive is harsh n unforgiving, it's not comfortable to get in n out, it's basically a very expensive sexy go cart for people with more money than sense
..
I'd kill for those cars in the states. If I could get an elise in California for 35k, I'd drive down to the dealer tomorrow morning, and buy one.
Theres a handful on eBay under 35k. Go get one
New, not 35K for a used elise.. They are certainly overpriced here, and dont have the recent upgrades of the new models. You couldn't pay me to go anywhere fleabay either. Wouldn't even dream of buying a car there especially .
What's a CD player?
You no longer use CDs. But millions still do. Many new cars still have ‘em. And new CDs are released all the time. As are new CD players. Don’t assume nobody enjoys CDs anymore just because you don’t.
www.cnet.com/news/a-music-nerds-last-stand-youll-pry-my-cds-out-of-my-cold-dead-hands/
I may be wrong but I'm pretty sure I've seen 250 cups selling for 42k not 55k
+SuperBigboi18 those will be used.
JayEmm on Cars fair one love the videos by the way keep up the good work
No-one talks about the reliability of Lotus cars. Why?
Thanks! I look forward to it. I know it is difficult to find statistics representative of the marque, rather than just individual experiences.
But what about a Z cars mini 🤔
No but the Evora 400 clearly is. I’ve had various valuations of 2016 cars on different dealers websites and the dealers are all overpricing them by 6-10k!!!!......you expect a dealer to make a few thousand profit selling a car but not for your car to lose 10k as soon as you drive it off the forecourt. Wish someone would tell me why Evora 400’s are so overpriced!?
6k over trade price is fairly normal for a car of that value - it does not leave dealers the profit you think
What if the new Elise had the flat 4 from the Subaru BRZ? Lower CoG.
James Martin boxer engines are pretty wide too. Not sure about the fit in the Elise which is much smaller than the GT86.
Like getting that Lexus V10 in an Exige chassis?
We should get a petition going for that one.
Power to weight ratio is way worse on my 2009 1.8 Audi TT (160bhp) than on my 2001 MK2 with Rover engine. Benched at 148 BHP.
The Audi TT however is waaaay faster in all respects (corners, acceleration and top speed) and fuel economy is 1 liter per 12km average on my TT and 1 liter per 8 km on my Elise. Power to weight says very little to nothing anymore when it comes to performance when you have an engine without torque.
The standard Elise has the power of an MGB and cannot compete with modern cars with the same horse power. If you are challenged by a current basic Golf you will get that 148bhp sweating. On my last visit to the UK I was outrun by plenty of Ford Focus, old and new, and they have more performance at much less fuel consumption.
The (early) Elise MK2 is absolutely a crap car but they can take away everything from me except my Elise. I love this crap car because it's one of the last true CARS. The TT is a perfect 'elevator' . It gets you from A to B fast and comfortable while the Elise is like an old mini. It seems fast and it feels fast because you drive in a 'bubble', and you get out of the bubble with a big smile.
the reason why lotus dont depreciate is beacuse they dont really make that many cars there not super expensive for the type of car they want to be there cars have less gadget and more real hardware engineering there reliable there cheap to run cars like bmw or bezn focus alot on digital gadgets like tft screen massage seats and all sort of stuff that will be made obsolete the moment a model comes out.
just go an drive one...you either want one then or not...who cares for the price...
also, the 1.6l Toyota engine isn´t that good...I rather stick with me Rover K16...beats Toyota everytime
Thank you. At last someone is telling it as it is. Yes its finiky to change timing belts but so what, as long as you do it its fine, and its not expensive either. A bog standard Rover engine, but it does the job completely. That's why they chose it. I think they knew what they were doing, I guess.
The price of lotus is not high, it is an handmade product.
7:50 "elise that's my opinion"
Good video, but the comparisons with a 911 Carerra are totally irrelevant. Apples and oranges.
Got me!
Bmw m3 e46 61k
BMW m3 e92 69k
BMW m3 f80 77k
Will the next m3 be 85k?
25k+ is way overpriced for these, theyre not worth more than 10k regardless of spec
For a car this light, isn't it really unsafe?
Not at all
@@JayEmmOnCars All the stats I have seen indicates that the highest death rate happens on small cars. Lotus Elise is extremely light, why would it not be unsafe on the road? Any car crash could do significant damage to the people inside the car.
It sounds like you are confusing small city cars with an Elise. Which is very well constructed, extremely strong and good in the event of an accident. It's not the same as a city car
Spot on in my opinion.
Are you seriously saying that the Elise is on par with the Vanquish and therefore it is a bargain only because the chassis tech is the same? Come on..... A bullet goes faster than both and it is $1. Doesn't mean anything... The Elise is cool but it is in today's terms overpriced. The funky look of the car is keeping the price afloat as well as the perceived status of the brand. I am more of en Elise person than a Vanquish person in terms of philosophy but I can't stop thinking that the whole Elise thing is a self-fulfilled prophecy, too many people saying it is cool on TH-cam (mostly Americans) and therefore it has to be true.
No my point was Aston charged more for a car with the same chassis and power-weight ratio. The Elise survives because of its reputation as an excellent drivers' car. If you ever get the chance to drive one, you'll see what I mean.
There's no way those cars are that heavy.
No car is 40,000 pounds much less an elise.
Lotus is sooooo tiny, I have seen it in real life it is just like a toy car. And interior materials are typical British- low quality, poor fit and finish. I can only imagine how unreliable it is.
Toyota engine, mature running gear now. These are more reliable and have lower running costs (they don't use up tyres and brakes) than probably even a Miata / MX5
You're a great presenter, you should do a podcast... ! Still ..these are overpriced in my mind. Despite your impeccable man logic...