MOI MATCHING AS AN ALTERNATIVE
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 19 พ.ค. 2015
- This video is about MOI matching as an alternative to swing weight matching for your golf clubs. For added information about cutting-edge golf components, go online to www.wishongolf.com.
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Hi Tim, I actually bought the M.O.I. Matching machine (from Maltby)when I was outfitting my shop in '06, & proceeded to painstakingly go through matching my own set, admittedly, I ended up having to re-do it a total of three times after finding the first two just didn't feel the way I wanted after the 1st 4 or 5 rounds. I AM & always have been very glad I stuck with it, as after the third & final build, in which I also made a key alteration to the weight of the shafts I was using & their relative flex, the combined result was quite frankly, so far beyond my expectations it completely blew me away.
There was certainly a symbiosis in the entirety of the fitting for these irons & I can't attribute it all to the M.O.I. matching. Finally having access to my own shop i made a massive right hand build up under the grip essentially keeping the same grip thickness from top to bottom (which complicated the holy hell out of the M.O.I. matching i gotta tellya, & is how i wrecked the 1st build as I M.O.I. matched 1st & then decided I wanted to alter the grip thickness. But until I had my own shop to test out of, I had never had the opportunity, even as a pro, to thoroughly test different shaft weightings & flexes in various combinations for either feel or results. What I ended up going with is the kind of build that no clubfitter in their right mind ever would have recommended, & oddly enough, had such an impact on my ballflight & trajectory, that it altered the way I approached shotmaking with my irons entirely. I went from a screaming mid-low ballflight hard draw player, to a very high slight fade guy, & went from having to spend 10 hours a week practicing to maintain my handicap, to someone who could not touch a club for two month & go out & shoot 74.
I injured my neck & subsequently ended my career in 2012, & found finding work to justify keeping my shop open without standing behind the counter & on the course 5 or 6 days a week completely impossible. After a decade in storage, I took it all out & was preparing to sell it, when I decided I wanted to prepare the whole of my knowledge of the swing, & all aspects of the game itself, including clubwork, & somehow document it in video form, as some sort of legacy kindof, but more just so I had something to show for the decades of hardwork & dedication i put into becoming a decent player & teacher of the game.
I am very nearly at the point where I am ready to embark upon this thing, & am still frustrated that M.O.I. matching isn't more mainstream & the manufacturers haven't adopted it, although it's not easy to imagine how they could adopt it to a form that was conducive to selling clubs off the rack.
Regardless, I do very much plan to spend a fair bit of time on MOI matching in hopes it might garner interest from that player or twenty, ready to figure out how to take the lid off their game & reach their peak potential, because as you mentioned , i do believe it to be the final piece to the puzzle in terms of reaching the apex on ones ability to swing the golfclub.
Thanks for your contributions to the game. They have & will undoubtedly leave a permanent mark & I sincerely believe, MOI matching a some point, will be the way the majority of decent golfers choose to weight match their irons.
Cheers
Jake Johnson
I stumbled across counter weighting clubs last week. Started with my putter then recently changed my driver. I added 40g to the butt end... I could NOT BELIEVE the difference! My timing tempo ball striking and speed drastically all improved. I'm loading the club now as I was a real "hitter" of the ball. Since then I knew there was something in this. This is the best video I have seen explaining MOI matching process for clubs. I'm booking up tomorrow to get correctly fitted. TomWishon in the U.K. Thanks Tom for this A1 talk through.
Tom Hi! Your videos are super. I'm recently certified Wishon club makers in Sweden. This building of golf Clubs with MOI is amazing. So happy with my choice and the opportunity to represent Wishon Golf Technology
Mr. Tutleman wrote about MOI a few years ago as well. To me, it makes allot of sense. Thanks Mr. Wishon
+Blair Phillips
Thanks for your interest. Our company first introduced the equipment and the training to do MOI matching of clubs in a set back in Dec 2003. Since that time there are around 500 clubmakers world wide who can do this as part of their fitting analysis and custom clubmaking work for golfers. Dave T just came along after this to verify that what we were doing was valid as a form of club matching within a set. Thanks much for your interest.
Tom Dana Golf (Dana Upshaw/ my dad) built a MOI set of mp-62's for me and it is a world of difference. Every club feels the same and isaworldof difference.
Just a great person to listen to..
I like Nicklaus's approach - his swing weight and moi was all over the place.
It's Arbitrary , baby
Thanks for this video Tom, Very informative. I have been fit with another custom club maker, initials HG, and they fit me with way to heavy of a club 119 gram shafts and a swing weight of D5. After playing them hard (170) rounds in a year, I pulled a disk out of my cervical neck at c6-7 and had to have a fusion. I know now that my swing which has a 4 degree upright lie angle, needs no more then a D3 swing weight. How can I get fit for a set of you're irons ?
Good explanation.
Thanks Tom, excellent video. My question relates to flat line oscillation (FLO for purposes here) and MOI. First off, forgive me I'm in the throws of beginning to understand the MOI of a club. As I understand it MOI of a club is the measurement of resistance to twist. If so, wouldn't FLO (pre or post adjustment) effect the clubs MOI? Thanks in advance. ~Kyle
watched a video on FLO, puring and spining shafts last night! All 3 are a complete waste of time & money both after watching him explain and show how both he & I, after seeing his demonstrations come to that very conclusion! Simply put, NONE of those methods match what a golf club does when swung! All those measurements never take into account, or fact that a golf club is ONLY swung once at the ball being hit! Therefore making all of those methods complete & utter nonsense as well as a huge waste of time, effort & money!
Im a novice. I experiment with same length irons, but the weight diference from 3 to 4 to 5 to 6 irons and so is not easy. I used common clubs that is not factory manufactured. So I have to add stick on weights. Is there a chart guide availale?
There has to be formula for this MOI so you don’t need a fancy machine. There is usually one club in your bag that you hit the best and most consistent. That usually is the best weight and MOI for you. Now you just build the rest of the clubs to match that club. At the end of the day it’s still overall club weight and swing weight combined to find the right MOI. Normally longer clubs would need less weight and shorter clubs more weight
Can you explain the MOI measurement of clubheads. Is there a standard unit of measure? Does perimeter weighting have a significant effect?
Ty
Measurement of the MOI of clubHEADS is totally different than the MOI of fully assembled golf clubs, as we are discussing in this video. MOI of the head plays a big part in the off center hit performance of a head. MOI of the assembled club deals with how much effort is required by the golfer to swing the club. MOI of the clubhead is done with a very specialized machine. If you are interested you can Google MOI clubhead measurement equipment and click on the IMAGES and see a lot. The typical unit of measurement is grams-centimeter squared, since MOI always involves a mass and a radius of rotation. Perimeter weighting is THE key element in a golf clubhead design that controls the MOI of the head. The more mass you can place far away from the center of gravity (CG) of the head, the higher will be the MOI. In addition, size of the head is a huge part of it too. But this is related to perimeter weighting because when you make a large clubhead, you are putting more weight farther out from the head’s CG. So the bigger the head, the higher the MOI of the head.
But if I just add MASS to a muscle-backed weighted head, wouldn't the MOI go up the same amount as a similar size/mass head of a perimeter-weighted head?
@@tywebb2319 yes.
I have asked this question once before, I bought one of these machines 3 years ago and can't find anyone who knows how to use it I can't even get the instructions from the supplier, so please can anyone enlighten me?
th-cam.com/video/UrtmKOD6otY/w-d-xo.html
How does that machine measure anything going so slow? There is no shaft flex, load or unload, can you further explain the machine? Also, someone below made a comment that he bought one and no instructions came with it and no one replied? Sounds fishy to me.
The weight on a fulcrum and the frequency of a pendulum are two different ways to measure the same thing!!! So one is not more scientific then the other, they both are a measure for MOI. It can be proven (given grips and uncut shafts weigh the same and have the same centre of gravity) that a matched set build on a fulcrum will also match on a certain pendulum. It's just a matter of determining the corresponding fulcrum point and rotational axis :
- the 14" traditional swingweight fulcrum point corresponds to a pendulum with the axis 8.4" outside the butt end (rotation with club armed)
- the traditional MOI measured with a pendulum at the butt end (release of the club) corresponds to a 18.2" fulcrum
- Rotational Axis = (Fulcrum Point - 18.2) * 2 ; with Rotational Axis and Fulcrum Point measured from the butt end of the club towards the clubhead
The difference is that SW matches the feel (resistance) at the beginning and acceleration of the downswing and MOI matches the feel at the release of the club. In short:
- in a MOI set shorter clubs will feel heavier during accelertion and longer clubs lighter, but they will all release the same -> ball should always be played in the same position in the stands.
- SW clubs will all feel the same during acceleration but the shorter clubs will have a lower MOI at the butt, so they will release earlier then longer clubs -> the ball should be placed more at the back in the stands for shorter clubs and more to front for longer clubs.
I guess there is no size fits all; some players prefer to have the same resistance during acceleration (SW) in order to develop a consistant swing, others prefer to have the same release (MOI). And those who want it all should be playing single lenght clubs. 🙂
Why not simply find the swing weight that feels best and gets best result (timing trajectory etc.) with a 36" 9i then do the same with a 44" driver and extrapolate the numbers from there?
Or modify a simple swing weight scale so that you can move the fulcrum according to overall club length...
Moving the fulcrum might work but it's tough to figure out. Just measure MOI using Tutelman's pendulum technique.
Technically speaking, the club head MOI should be measured. This is the primary determinant for whole club MOI. The player should be fitted for shaft separately for swing plane and speed, angle of descent, ball launch angle etc., Max MOI is desirable for all mid handicapped golfers who do not want to work the trajectory or shape a shot! This combination will settle most issues of mishits instead a lengthy and expensive process of redoing fitted clubs.
Why should this become another dimension of complication in an already chaotic golf equipment world?
All that they said about Titanium heads, $ 1000 dollar driver shafts did not contribute to bettering the handicap or the driving distance of club golfers!
When a set of irons are old and if they have served the player well, then the player should pick up another set with similar head design and continue with the favorite shaft.
Perimeter weighted Iron heads with less hosel length or hollow head irons are ideal in most cases. In case of woods, heads with adjustable weights can solve the problem by trial and error easily.
you missed the point of the video. club head MOI has nothing to do with the swing, only the impact.
@@suivzmoi MOI of the club determines the success of a typical swing.
Try fixing a solid metal piece of 250 grams instead of an iron head see the difference.
MOI of a club head, total MOI of the club determines the result.
Why did Tiger woods and Taylor made team take six months to finalize the TW irons?
I have daiwa ms 153 forged and Mizuho TP 2000 irons which are traditional blades with horrific MOI!
Very difficult to play.
Higher MOI clubs will yield better results for majority of the golfers