So yeah foot pounds has become the regular usage NY many. I just always applaud when someone bucks common usage and uses the "correct" term. But we all know what it means. So how about the torquing down some nuts with and without Red, and with primer? I mean you already have the bolts...
Former Loctite sales rep here. Zinc is a fairly active metal, which is why it's used for sacrificial anodes on boats. You won't gain much using primer/activator. That product is meant for passive metals, such as stainless steel. What the primer does is add another cleaning, and introduces copper ions, which will cause the Loctite to set up. Try your experiment using 316 stainless bolts and nuts, passivated if you can find them.
My experience with stainless fasteners is they are self galling and need no thread lock. Good luck getting them apart under anything but the best of circumstances. God how I hate working with stainless bolts.
@Johnny Table Use a Liberal amount of the right kind of antiseize, and you'll be fine. This excludes the possibility of using threadlocker of course, but nylock is better anyway, except when you can't get to it with a powertool of course. I've built helidecs from extruded aluminium girders that snapped together like laminated flooring. These were then secured with stainless bolts and clamps. We did this as a team, and I was new at the job. I held everyone back because I used too little antiseize on one bolt, and I had to cut it, because it had welded itself together. It's remarkable how little patience a foreman can have with young boys, fun times 🫤
That’s what I’m used to as well, but the other day I did buy some red Loctite in a red tube, I had to double check that I had the correct stuff when I was getting checked out.
Try the test with the fasteners torqued when assembled, probably with holes through a steel bar. This would approximate real world use as the nuts loose on the bolt aren't as "anaerobic" as when stressed under torque. I would definitely be interested in seeing those results. Thank you for your presentation.
Same as I was wondering, as far as I knew, thread lock only properly works when you torque the bolt/nuts. I even used this to my advantage when assembling some structures, just put the thread lock in the bolt, and hand tighten it so I don't lose it around. No need to rush, it will only really get properly locked when tight. It really was annoying when I did have to remove some bolts because of whatever stupid mess I did, but that's the thread lock working as intended, can't complain there.
i like too see proof basically to back claims up! ill get primer next time i need red. cool torque attachment, i want one for very light applications that are also paticular. cool demo and thanks!
Been a mechanic for 40 years & red lock tite is used for bolts & nuts that are imperative that don’t come loose like driveline bolts or any bolts subjected to torsional vibrations- bolts that go round and round. Blue lock tite is used for smaller bolts and bolts that clamp components to something like p/s box to frame. A shot of brake clean before installation if the bolts are greasy. Once the bolts are installed they usually don’t come back out for years so time isn’t an issue.
I use the same logic on rifles: muzzle treatments (especially JP Recoil Eliminators) get Loctite Red, everything else gets Blue. Context: muzzle treatments tend to be directionally biased, so if you set them up in the wrong orientation they can be worse than not installing them at all.
So you might imagine my surprise when I go to remove the front brake calipers from my motorcycle and they are stupidly stubborn. Ended up using my impact wrench to get them off. What do I find? Red Loctite on the threads. Good thing the last shop I got this done at is no longer in business. So instead of a 15 minute pad replacement job, It will be a couple more days for new bolts to come in.
@@MrShadowpanther3 The slider bolts usually have blue lock tite but the caliper brackets on cars,trucks and heavy duty trucks have red lock tite & they are a pain to remove. Don’t want a caliper bracket to come loose.
I just came from a reddit post that was basically a guy ranting about how everyone uses loctite wrong and that it's basically useless on inactive substrates unless you buy the kind of loctite specified for it or use the primer. It got me worried because I've never used the primer and have assembled a lot of stuff with loctite that is plated or anodized. This video proves that it's nearly as good without the primer. Unless it's an absolutely critical part, I'm going to continue to forgo the primer.
I really appreciate the work you put into this! I'm both curious and cynical about manufacturers claims. This is the kind of independent testing that helps everyone AND keeps manufacturers on their toes!
You only really need an activator in 2 cases: 1) If both the screw and the nut are made of alluminium or other unreactive metal or plastics. I tried plastic screws into alluminium and the stuff just stays liquid for days and does not cure at all. 2) If you need it to cure as fast as possible especially for zinc of stainless or if one of the surfaces is active but the other is inert. If you need it to operate right away though then split lock nuts are your friends as the bonding compounds need at least a few hours to cure even half decently even in best case scenarios. In any other case the activators are not very useful.
Great video! Dear fellow Gear-Heads, I owned a national fastener distribution company for 26 years, AND I was a direct distributor of Loctite's Automotive Division products. As many have suggested, the fasteners should be tested under proper load. The #1 reason for fastener failure is improper torquing (under & over). The bolts and nuts should be paired properly according to their "grade", and even plating (in this case "Zinc", which is not only soft, but also acts as a lubricant) affects the torque range. By design, the assembly is meant to stretch, which slightly deforms the threads, especially on the nut. (This is why you should not reuse them, especially the nut. By the 3rd-5th properly torqued reuse, the threads can be completely compromised without you even knowing it.) For this test, there is an additional reason for torquing the assembly. As others have said, anaerobic thread-locking adhesives cure when oxygen is not present. They are specifically formulated for the tight tolerances between metals, especially under "load", where the least oxygen would be present. This is an important feature. Occasionally, we would have auto mechanics complain to our company that the thread-locker tubes they received from us were only half full. This is by design. The adhesive requires a certain amount oxygen in the tube, or it would harden and destroy the shelf life, if any. (So, store it "flat" to expose the most adhesive to the most oxygen in the tube.) Also, unlike some of the other methods of catalyzing, this adhesive doesn't cure in a uniform manner. The strength between those torqued threads will be much higher than any adhesive exposed to air on the assembly. (If practical, you could help insure the curing by applying heat [120 F+ if memory serves me] to the area which will dissipate the oxygen, though it shouldn't be necessary. Adhesive that falls outside the tight fitting metal surfaces , doesn't cure completely and can be wiped off and cleaned up.
I have had things where red Loctite was used and shouldn't have been. It seems like the finer the threads are, the stronger it is. I've had a couple of gun barrels that had red applied to them and they had to be heated up to even think about getting the nut off without damaging it. A friend had a homebrewed radio with the front panel held on with about 20 hex screws, and the builder used red Loctite on every one of them, apparently not thinking the panel would ever have to be removed for future repairs. Even when we heated the screws with a soldering iron, some of them got the hex stripped out and others bent the allen wrenches we were using. When we put it back together, we used new screws and Vibratite.
I believe that what many people don't realize is that both sealants are anerobic sealants meaning that they cure fully in the absence of oxygen. When the bolt/nut is tightened all the air is squeezed out causing the sealant to cure.
True. Liquid LocTite will stay liquid if left sitting out in the open. One thing I see most people and 'testers' do incorrectly is use way too much on the fasteners. A drop or two is all that's needed...not soaking the fastener until it drips. That doesn't help, and just makes a mess. Also, the reason there are different part numbers is the size of the fastener. They have specific uses.
I am not sure you quite got that right. something thats anerobic will cure with or without oxygen, so squeezing all the air out does not make it cure. It will still cure without oxygen basically.
Very interesting video. I would’ve liked to see the nuts holding two metal plates together. I feel that the compression would’ve applied greater force to the threads at contact, over a nut under zero load.
This is how my head works. You did an exceptional job putting this together in a clear and precise way with attention to detail all along the way. Valuable information for anyone wanting to use fasteners in the correct way. Thank you! Subbed with a thumbs up.
Interesting stuff. We use loctite on non-active surfaces often and anodized aluminum seems to be where the activator is most important. I didn’t realize that zinc was “inactive”. Thanks for the great content. I ignored your video for a while because the title which seemed like clickbait yet wasn’t.
It would've been even better to have a comparison with active bolts. Also, the bolts needed to have some compression on the thread (which would be more real-world). Even so, a great video and certainly food for thought!
Manfactures often include an unnecessary step to either sell another product (ex. primer) or give their lawyers a loop hole if their product fails (clean dust free surface) when they know that most of their customers cant abide by it. I use Loctite on light fixtures that were installed on a bridge when clinton was in office, at 3 am, in the rain, cold salty air while on a boom lift with a head lamp. In these conditions i can barely keep my sandwhich clean let alone a bolt. Use lots of loctite and torque to specification. If you need to loosen use either a brake bar or a torch to burn it off.
Sounds like a conspiracy. (Ha ha!) I think it's more likely that Loctite wants to ensure that surfaces are clean and free of oil residue and other coatings. As for loophole, if you don't follow the instructions, it's not a loophole.
@@beansmalone1305Yeah-yeah, we know, with your dirty sandwich & when Clinton was in office(so basically sometime during the 8 yrs he was President from '93 to '01)
I've never bothered with activator/primer and just normally used red or blue depending on how serious I am about wanting something to not come apart. Bond strength is also going to be much more significant depending on surface area of the threads, so keep that in mind with larger, coarse thread nuts and bolts. I've never had red fail to keep something secured.
The only problem to using the activator/primer is locating the stuff when you need it. Few places that sell "Locktite" thread locker also have the activator/primer on the shelf.
Outstanding demonstration. Initial torqueing of the bolts/nut may tighten the gap between the running surfaces and give a more optimum result. Great data presentation. Very clear video.
I've used primer mainly when I need to put the object into service sooner than a 24 hour cure time. A test every hour or two to determine cure time whether primed or not would be interesting.
When I started my HVAC career, I had a journeyman once tell me “ if you want to put something together with nuts and bolts without it coming apart again just put some paint on the threads first”. Dam it actually Works.
@@sparcnut I use double helicoid ambi-fastener threads for all mission critical components. You know, the ones you have to tighten to get loose and loosen to tighten.
We use a red sealant on our pipes at work. We generally only use the primer when we are dealing with Stainless as it doesn't stick very well to the stainless and just runs off. The primer helps it stick to the metal better. In brass or copper it doesn't seem to matter as much. We don't use a lot of zinc.
Seems like there wasn't enough of a difference to worry about. I think I will continue to use it as I always have! But it's a little odd to me that the non-activated breakaway torque raised with 72 hours, but then dropped again. I think there may be some variability in the quality of the bolts and nuts. A better test would be to test 5 of each without timing, then average them, removing the highest and lowest!
Great video. I'd never heard of the need for activator, and I don't clean the bolts either! It would be interesting to run a test with uncleaned bolts vs uncleaned activated
It fails if you do not clean the parts. I have seen it several times. They must be clean, both bolt and thread area. Brake clean works pretty well and is so common now. Spray on and blow off crap with air.
Former Loctite rep here: Older primers (Primer N or Primer T) contained either a copper-ion or an amine dissolved in the carrier solvent. Those compunds drove the resin cure to a much higher level of completion that the stuff used here. I have not checked, but I suspect the older primers have been outlawed due to solvent content and/or toxicity concerns. At the end of the day, some heat (
You can still buy the Loctite copper salt primer from McMaster Carr. Loctite SF 7649. It's expensive though. It makes a huge difference with stainless steel fasteners. Some stainless steel fasteners won't cure Loctite properly. I made the mistake of using primer and green Loctite on a nut and bolt that hadn't been assembled. It cured so fast that it seized up before I could tighten it all the way.
Used Primer N and T for years. (Thankfully, on an infrequent basis.) Just a bizarre exotic aromatic-chemical smell to them. They really sped the cure up better than the current stuff, but it just somehow smelled like it was giving you brain cancer.
I always just cleaned the threads with an aerosol brake cleaner, allowed the surfaces to dry, then applied the threadlocker. I never experienced a problem except for having to heat the bolt or the nut to remove it, using the "Red". Thanks for your efforts in this experiment.
I smacked that subscribe button. First time viewer of your content and was impressed with the video and audio quality. I appreciate the annotations and graphics to clarify what you are explaining. I look forward to more videos.
I found this test interesting, informative, and thought-provoking. I wonder if you would have gotten different results if you loosened torqued samples. I'm thinking (and I am hardly an expert on the subject) that you tested the shear strength of the cured threadlocker and not the ability of the threadlocker to effect sliding between two clamped surfaces. Would the results be similar if the same test was performed using Loctite 243 or 222? That's the real plus of videos like this - makes the curious think about things that they long took for granted. Thanks for your effort and sharing of the results!
Well loctite also cures in anaerobic environment. When the nut is torqued tight, it seals out the air, and allows the loctite to properly cure. This is usually when breaker bar is necessary. He basically just had some half cured, maybe partly cured goop helping raise the number a bit but I suspect torqued nuts would produce significantly higher numbers. You’re likely right on the money with your thought process
Good video and test. The reason for using locktite is so bolt dont back out due to vibration and such. But this shows how well just the thread locker alone works. But if bolts are under correct torque and bolted down tightly, they have little chance of coming loose from vibration
If the nut is loose, won't there be a bigger gap between the sides of the threads, compared to if it's torqued down? It might not be a representative test. It's like testing glue with a 1 mm gap
Good point but I think this test gives a clue as to the difference between primed and not. If the nuts were torqued, break away would have been difficult to measure.
Just saw this video and I really like how you presented the info, well done. So in essence red loctite adds about 15-20 ft-lbs to the torque needed to loosen the nut, without increasing the clamping torque. Then if the nut comes loose it provides about 10-15 ft-lbs of torque to resist the nut vibrating off.
The use of loctite is to prevent a bolt or nut from backing out further from their initial tightening torques if that starts to come loose for some reason. If it's for later work, the red is for stuff that one Hope's will never be loosened again or in a very loooong time. Blue is to hold in blessed stressed or torqued items while still being able to disassemble without going through any special efforts. Torque release tests mean little to me because at no time are the hardware being turned by an outside force. So clean with brake clean and use the loctite of your choice and move on. If one is really concerned, then just safety wire the hardware.
Vibration is an Outside force, I have watched properly torqued nuts spin off aerospace assemblies while being tested on a vibration table, was fun to watch them being flung all over the test cell.....
@@georgecurtis6463 George, not wired as that adds extra weight to a very sensitive payload budget, my observation did not show any locking substance, but there may have been....These payloads were university scientific projects in the early days of rocketry where the learning curve was very steep....Things have greatly improved today....
wow! who would have guessed cleaning the surface adheres better !!!???!!!? wooooww who would have guessed that!! intelligent time spent on this video! well thought out display of information even though it just requires 24hrs wow!!!! .. we really had no idea cleaning the surface makes the adhesive stronger!!! wowie WoooOoOoOoWw!! 🤯🤯🤯🤯
I believe the intended use case is to have the hardware tightened to specified torque values and the tensioned/anaerobic environment activate the curing process.
I agree with your recommendation. I'm not a chem or materials guy, but from what I've heard about bonding details... 🤯 Some adhesives work on a molecular level such that if you have more than _a few molecules'_ thickness of adhesive between the parts, you're not going to get the desired bond. I think epoxies would _not_ be in this group, as they stick to both parts _and_ provide a rigid gap filling material (also like the hot melt used for cardboard boxes)
I have been using Loc Tite products since the 1960s. I have found an additional benefit of using them on auto chassis bolts - the product polymerizes between the threads of the bolt and nut and SEALS the connection from (salt) water and corrosion, making disassembly much easier in climates that use salt on the roads.
I was a motorcycle mechanic at several dealerships, I roadraced motorcycles , Winning six championships, two time national champion. I was my own mechanic. I never used Loctite… I used Elmers wood glue as thread lock. Never had a problem. I still use it.
I would have liked to see the torque tests done at 1, 2, 4, 8, and 16 hours, in those cases I think that the "activated" would show a greater advantage.
Thankfully, we don't need to do that. The author of this video didn't actually read the TDS for loctite 262 and etc where it says to use loctite 7471 or loctite 7649 not the first random primer can you find on the shelf
Yeah no 7471 is 70 percent acetone which is what primes loctite. His wierd looking "surface prep" is heptane, propane, isobutane and ethanol according to the SDS. It would literally do nothing.
Nice job! It shows that the activator is not needed on the zinc bolts. Looks like cleaning and degreasing is what is necessary but that was not included in the tests.
Good work. It defo seems to make a difference, but not enough for me to worry. Have to say, I never knew this either but I've used 271 on everything for years and it has never let me down.
I used Loctite RED on all my fasteners for a motorcycle build and never had a vibration loosening on any connection until a seasonal breakdown. It’s a pretty solid performer.
I only use blue loctite on the motorcycle sub frame mounting bolts as just in case I can use normal hand tools to loosen them without applying heat. Everything else I use a torque specification.
Mechanic here and yes, most of us are fully aware of "the procedure", but the difference in the end result is so minuscule, that we learn to just torque the bolts properly with the correct TYPE AND AMOUNT of loctite. Brake clean does matter though.
Here is something. Loctite also makes a green thread locker. It is made to use with "assembled" hardware sized from #6-32 thru 1/4-20 (imperial sizes). Assemble, then apply the thread locker. It wicks it's way into the assembly, thus keeping vibration from causing the assembly to come apart. Handy stuff. I learned about it from a Loctite rep while peddling car parts in the early '80's. I use it in my hobby...restoring old woodworking machines. Frequently, I disassemble the stands and repaint. Using new hardware, and a drop on easy fastener, I feel confident it will last.
I was told to heat it with torch, lighter or heat gun, cures fast though some comes out and can be wiped off right away or scraped off if that matters to the look of something. It has held nicely, even on metal jewelry with snug fitting parts. I learned something from you I never heard before on the types of metals, a valuable lesson there, as well as letting it cute over time, never tried that.
A couple millwrights I worked with were taking the piston off of a 6" bore cylinder. They came to me after breaking a 2000 lb torque multiplier. It was a 2" fine thread nut. They were to the point of cutting it off when I warmed it up with the rosebud and unscrewed it quite easily with my inch drive air gun. Locktite has it's place and works well.
Isopropyl alcohol leaves an oily film on things. Most folks don't know this, you might be surprised by this. Just put a few drops into your kitchen sink, let it evaporate and run water over it, notice it beading up. My wife was a nail tech and taught me this. Always something to learn as an old mechanical engineer!!
Isopropyl when used correctly does not leave a film, BUT, it has to be dried thoroughly with a clean dry cloth. (which can be problematic on threads) Not left to dry on its own. As mist people do. We call this the 2 rag method of cleaning. This is very well known in industry, including in clean rooms. If you leave it to dry on its own you don’t even need the water to see it. You can actually see the film left behind.
I wonder if the results miight have improved if you change the test a bit. Consider putting the bolt through a hole in some steel stock, apply the thread locker tothe bold and then screw on the nut and torque it down to 20, 40, or more foot lbs. This ensures the thread locker is squeezed betwen the threads, not just between the loose threads. By torque it tight you also create a tension in the bold keeping the threads firmly in contact over the next day or longer wait ppriot to testing. Curious if it make a diffference.
I've used threadlocker on bolts by just cleaning them with carb cleaner, and it's worked very well. Never had any issues. Most of us don't have day's or extra time to paint every fastener every time, seems there would be a better alternative.
As a young man I started using red Loctite 45 years ago in a professional setting. All connecting parts had to be degreased with M.E.K. then primed and let dry and then assembled with the red after approval by an engineer. These were machine repairs for bolts and bushings. When done properly you needed a torch or had to machine them to get them back out.
Thanks for sharing! You might want to repeat this with some shear stress on the thread. The test you've shown us here is without any shear stress ;). I'm positive the results will differ significantly. Example: screw the nut down completely and give it 12 Nm torque. You might want to add 1 or 2 washers to stay 'fair and equal' during release, and finally: put the 2 droplets on the end of the thread so all threadlocker is used inside the nut, so similar to what you did here.
Thanks! Please check out my other videos for some with the nuts tightened down with a clamp load. Here's how Loctite tests breakaway and prevailing torques... th-cam.com/video/PGZCPyi8yBc/w-d-xo.html 😎
Very well done. As a full time maker who often works with aluminum parts, I have to stress to people there is almost never a time to use Red. Red can take threads out with it, particularly with smaller fasteners. Red requires heat and not all items can be heated (electric motors for example) so it should be avoided. Look into standard vs high temp blue. Red is stronger = better are the typical thoughts of makers with little experience. There is a correct thread locker/adhesive or socket for every job. Sure, the wrong one will often work when judged by an amateur. My shop stocks standard blue, high temp blue, red which is kept hidden and sleeve retainer. These are the basics of a well-equipped shop and you can drop the red 98% of the time.
I usually spray the parts with brake cleaner and blow them dry with compressed air. Especially the black oxide coated screws with the oily coating. It's more economical than that high priced activator and they lock right up...
Great video, I've used blue loctite on a daily bases for almost 12 years at work, we would get back 10 and 20+ year old electronic signs for customer service that baked in the sun all summer and froze blowing in the wind all winter( hurricane damaged also). Never seen a nut or bolt missing that was ever there in the first place...😅 Also we found out pretty quick to try not to get loctite on our clothes or on any painted surfaces, it permanently Staines clothes and will either permanently stain or actually remove automotive grade paint over night. Also apparently loctite has an expiration date, I cant remember how long it lasted, 5 years from new I think it was, but I've used blue loctite atleast 5 years after experation at my own house and it still worked just fine, just keep the lid on tight.
@@HacksbyDad No problem👍, I have OCD about certain things so I use loctite on alot of projects. I recently picked up that new orange gel loctite in the little chap stick type tube. I'd be curious to see a test on it, they say its medium strength semi permanent but unlike the red it can be taken loose without a heat source.
Hey, using the activator is to prevent corrosion of the bond not to increase the strength. Dissimilar metals in the end will corrode even if it is just a slight electrical difference.
It may help prevent corrosion, but here is what Loctite states regarding their activator and primer... LOCTITE® SF 7649™ is used where increased cure speed of LOCTITE®anaerobic products is required. It is especially recommended for applications with passive metals or and with large bond gaps. 😎
For the purposes of curing Loctite Threadlocker, zinc plated fasteners are classed as "passivated". Loctite 271 will cure on passivated fasteners, however it will be slower to cure than on steel surfaces. Inactive surfaces are materials such as ceramic, polymers, stainless steel and titanium. Surfaces activators will in most cases result in lower cured strengths as the crosslinking of the polymers produces slightly shorter chains.
Great job on testing a product(s). I haven't reached that point because I am essentially at the beginning of flying SOLO in the DIY-space in late 2023. My Dad was nearly a master in a lot of trade skills and upon retiring from the US Army he achieved Summa Cum-Laude with his Bachelor of Arts degree. I never heard of the terms "active metals" vs "inactive metals", but I do remember studying "ferrous vs non-ferrous" metal; however, I am not a metallurgist. I thought the terms "active" vs "inactive" is applied in chemical reactions, but I am not a Chemist. I think adhesives are tested for tensile strength and torque is testing the rotational strength (axial). I may use one of the products once my Kohler Replacement Starter and I install the starter into our 2017 Cub Cadet XT1 LT46.
Learn something new everyday. TY for the video I cannot say anything is wrong, but I am curious if nuts applied with torque against the bolt head would give different results using the same test criteria.
In the 70’s Loctite marketed “accelerators” in aerosol cans. The thread locker product has a shelf life. I always have 222, 242, and 290 available, in the 21 size (smallest), because I can’t use enough of it within the useful product life. The 290 serves as a high strength thread locker, and it is also a porosity sealer. It will actually wick into the threads of a tightened fastener. The older the product gets, past it’s shelf life, the longer the cure. Added to that shelf life you also have the tolerance of fasteners sourced from hardware stores. It’s a safe bet that results for bond strength and cure time will have a fairly large spread. Northrop Grumman specified Bossard fasteners for everything they built on the projects I worked on. This was to ensure that they had traceable product in all applications. They used contact washers to provide a reliable method for servicing assemblies. They also used threaded inserts in anything that was non-metallic or 6061T6. These inserts were bonded in.
In my industrial manufacturing job we use Loctite 290 wicking threadlocker compound, a very thin green product designed to affix previously assembled parts, to seal a particular pneumatic control component. With the application of Loctite 7649 primer the 290 bonds the parts within seconds and is resistant to 250psi air pressure within minutes.
When I was young and in automotive school we had a loctite rep come and talk to us. This was explained. But years of working autopart sales showed me that most people, even seasoned techs don't know this...
For more... please checkout my Nuts & Bolts playlist... th-cam.com/play/PL_WcGw5s6Cq6YK_s-NNne1838j25ijmii.html 😎
I also have a 2018 Corolla LE, but with Openpilot. What was your best MPG? Mine was 40.5 avg.
@@RinksRides 8
So yeah foot pounds has become the regular usage NY many. I just always applaud when someone bucks common usage and uses the "correct" term. But we all know what it means.
So how about the torquing down some nuts with and without Red, and with primer? I mean you already have the bolts...
*panic sweat* (he knows too much) Take the shot take the shot!?!!!
not correct use = car engines is main use - your silly !
Former Loctite sales rep here. Zinc is a fairly active metal, which is why it's used for sacrificial anodes on boats. You won't gain much using primer/activator. That product is meant for passive metals, such as stainless steel. What the primer does is add another cleaning, and introduces copper ions, which will cause the Loctite to set up. Try your experiment using 316 stainless bolts and nuts, passivated if you can find them.
My experience with stainless fasteners is they are self galling and need no thread lock. Good luck getting them apart under anything but the best of circumstances. God how I hate working with stainless bolts.
@@lifesucks247 LOL too true
My job orders both and they're both in red bottles 😮
@Johnny Table Use a Liberal amount of the right kind of antiseize, and you'll be fine. This excludes the possibility of using threadlocker of course, but nylock is better anyway, except when you can't get to it with a powertool of course.
I've built helidecs from extruded aluminium girders that snapped together like laminated flooring. These were then secured with stainless bolts and clamps. We did this as a team, and I was new at the job. I held everyone back because I used too little antiseize on one bolt, and I had to cut it, because it had welded itself together. It's remarkable how little patience a foreman can have with young boys, fun times 🫤
Wow, I thought stainless would last without bonding. Learn something new everyday.
I've never wanted a graph so badly in my life. Good stuff, sir.
Seriously. Thankfully the table came eventually!
Imagine if he'd done _N_ samples at each elapsed time! 😵
I blame Project Farm for this terrible format of meaningless word dump before showing data in a proper way.
@@JGnLAU8OAWF6 he goes through it pretty fast though, just explaining his procedure. But yeah, i usually slide over to the end :)
😂
Now lets talk about how red loctite comes in a blue tube and blue loctite comes in a red tube.
It's to have a little fun 😁
That’s what I’m used to as well, but the other day I did buy some red Loctite in a red tube, I had to double check that I had the correct stuff when I was getting checked out.
Do you want red or blue loctite?
Um...yes?
That’s so you can distinguish them wearing 3D glasses.
My man spittin’ facts!
Try the test with the fasteners torqued when assembled, probably with holes through a steel bar. This would approximate real world use as the nuts loose on the bolt aren't as "anaerobic" as when stressed under torque. I would definitely be interested in seeing those results. Thank you for your presentation.
100% - nuts need to be torqued to a reasonable spec; definitely not just loosely hanging out mid shaft - run it again! :)
Same as I was wondering, as far as I knew, thread lock only properly works when you torque the bolt/nuts. I even used this to my advantage when assembling some structures, just put the thread lock in the bolt, and hand tighten it so I don't lose it around. No need to rush, it will only really get properly locked when tight.
It really was annoying when I did have to remove some bolts because of whatever stupid mess I did, but that's the thread lock working as intended, can't complain there.
I too would like to see this.
Exactly, the touching threads are sealing the loctite between them from oxygen and would cure properly.
I came to say just that!
Love this! More technical experiments and information and less garbage on TH-cam is a great thing.
You’re like the chill version of project farm.
There no meth in his madness... 😂
Project Farm has turned strange. I stopped following the creator about a year ago. It went from practical knowledge to dispelling rumors and myths.
PF talks like an hamster with ADHD
Project Farm is funnier though
the way he (project farm) talks is so weird.
Far out, I never read the instructions. Been using the stuff wrong for decades. Thanks man. Take care.
Exceptional no-nonsense presentation of valuable/everyday information. Thank you for your contribution!
Thanks! Appreciate it!
i like too see proof basically to back claims up! ill get primer next time i need red. cool torque attachment, i want one for very light applications that are also paticular. cool demo and thanks!
@@HacksbyDad Seconded....thanks for the no-nonsense info! 👍
Sadly the author didn't even use the loctite suggested primer. This is just some random heptane on the glue.
Good video, very similar to @Project Farm videos testing various products and fasteners
Fingernail polish works good to a locked bolts really nice
Loctite, however, doesn't make for a very good fingernail polish.
Been a mechanic for 40 years & red lock tite is used for bolts & nuts that are imperative that don’t come loose like driveline bolts or any bolts subjected to torsional vibrations- bolts that go round and round. Blue lock tite is used for smaller bolts and bolts that clamp components to something like p/s box to frame. A shot of brake clean before installation if the bolts are greasy. Once the bolts are installed they usually don’t come back out for years so time isn’t an issue.
I use the same logic on rifles: muzzle treatments (especially JP Recoil Eliminators) get Loctite Red, everything else gets Blue.
Context: muzzle treatments tend to be directionally biased, so if you set them up in the wrong orientation they can be worse than not installing them at all.
been a farmer for 30 years and you are spot on
So you might imagine my surprise when I go to remove the front brake calipers from my motorcycle and they are stupidly stubborn. Ended up using my impact wrench to get them off. What do I find? Red Loctite on the threads.
Good thing the last shop I got this done at is no longer in business.
So instead of a 15 minute pad replacement job, It will be a couple more days for new bolts to come in.
Learned more in this comment than the entire video
@@MrShadowpanther3 The slider bolts usually have blue lock tite but the caliper brackets on cars,trucks and heavy duty trucks have red lock tite & they are a pain to remove. Don’t want a caliper bracket to come loose.
I just came from a reddit post that was basically a guy ranting about how everyone uses loctite wrong and that it's basically useless on inactive substrates unless you buy the kind of loctite specified for it or use the primer. It got me worried because I've never used the primer and have assembled a lot of stuff with loctite that is plated or anodized. This video proves that it's nearly as good without the primer. Unless it's an absolutely critical part, I'm going to continue to forgo the primer.
The point is not that it works with or without primer. The point is: It depends on the material composition of the fasteners you are using.
I really appreciate the work you put into this! I'm both curious and cynical about manufacturers claims. This is the kind of independent testing that helps everyone AND keeps manufacturers on their toes!
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You had me at when you said you read the instructions…bravo!!
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Who does that?
Great video. I've been using loctite for decades and never used an activator. Just ensure fasteners are clean. Never a problem.
You only really need an activator in 2 cases:
1) If both the screw and the nut are made of alluminium or other unreactive metal or plastics. I tried plastic screws into alluminium and the stuff just stays liquid for days and does not cure at all.
2) If you need it to cure as fast as possible especially for zinc of stainless or if one of the surfaces is active but the other is inert. If you need it to operate right away though then split lock nuts are your friends as the bonding compounds need at least a few hours to cure even half decently even in best case scenarios.
In any other case the activators are not very useful.
Very invormative and not time consuming. Thanks
Great video!
Dear fellow Gear-Heads,
I owned a national fastener distribution company for 26 years, AND I was a direct distributor of Loctite's Automotive Division products. As many have suggested, the fasteners should be tested under proper load. The #1 reason for fastener failure is improper torquing (under & over). The bolts and nuts should be paired properly according to their "grade", and even plating (in this case "Zinc", which is not only soft, but also acts as a lubricant) affects the torque range.
By design, the assembly is meant to stretch, which slightly deforms the threads, especially on the nut. (This is why you should not reuse them, especially the nut. By the 3rd-5th properly torqued reuse, the threads can be completely compromised without you even knowing it.)
For this test, there is an additional reason for torquing the assembly.
As others have said, anaerobic thread-locking adhesives cure when oxygen is not present. They are specifically formulated for the tight tolerances between metals, especially under "load", where the least oxygen would be present. This is an important feature.
Occasionally, we would have auto mechanics complain to our company that the thread-locker tubes they received from us were only half full. This is by design. The adhesive requires a certain amount oxygen in the tube, or it would harden and destroy the shelf life, if any. (So, store it "flat" to expose the most adhesive to the most oxygen in the tube.) Also, unlike some of the other methods of catalyzing, this adhesive doesn't cure in a uniform manner. The strength between those torqued threads will be much higher than any adhesive exposed to air on the assembly. (If practical, you could help insure the curing by applying heat [120 F+ if memory serves me] to the area which will dissipate the oxygen, though it shouldn't be necessary.
Adhesive that falls outside the tight fitting metal surfaces , doesn't cure completely and can be wiped off and cleaned up.
Wow! Thanks! Lots of good information.
I'm thinking of testing other aspects of the activator like cure speed and use on cold fasteners. 😎
I have had things where red Loctite was used and shouldn't have been. It seems like the finer the threads are, the stronger it is. I've had a couple of gun barrels that had red applied to them and they had to be heated up to even think about getting the nut off without damaging it. A friend had a homebrewed radio with the front panel held on with about 20 hex screws, and the builder used red Loctite on every one of them, apparently not thinking the panel would ever have to be removed for future repairs. Even when we heated the screws with a soldering iron, some of them got the hex stripped out and others bent the allen wrenches we were using. When we put it back together, we used new screws and Vibratite.
I believe that what many people don't realize is that both sealants are anerobic sealants meaning that they cure fully in the absence of oxygen. When the bolt/nut is tightened all the air is squeezed out causing the sealant to cure.
True. Liquid LocTite will stay liquid if left sitting out in the open. One thing I see most people and 'testers' do incorrectly is use way too much on the fasteners. A drop or two is all that's needed...not soaking the fastener until it drips. That doesn't help, and just makes a mess. Also, the reason there are different part numbers is the size of the fastener. They have specific uses.
Yep
I am not sure you quite got that right. something thats anerobic will cure with or without oxygen, so squeezing all the air out does not make it cure. It will still cure without oxygen basically.
i didnt really know that. i dont use it but i may need to sometime another.
So these tests of a nut just threaded onto a bolt with no torque pressure wouldn't actually activate the licktite properly?
Very interesting video. I would’ve liked to see the nuts holding two metal plates together. I feel that the compression would’ve applied greater force to the threads at contact, over a nut under zero load.
This is the first test like this that I've ever seen. Thanks for all your work and for sharing your results. This is the best way to learn something.
Thanks! More to come! 😎
The video is good never mind the others. They can do their own tests. Thanks for taking the time to produce this.
This is how my head works. You did an exceptional job putting this together in a clear and precise way with attention to detail all along the way. Valuable information for anyone wanting to use fasteners in the correct way. Thank you! Subbed with a thumbs up.
Interesting stuff. We use loctite on non-active surfaces often and anodized aluminum seems to be where the activator is most important. I didn’t realize that zinc was “inactive”. Thanks for the great content. I ignored your video for a while because the title which seemed like clickbait yet wasn’t.
Thanks for taking the time. Subscribed.
This is as scientific as could be expected from a Dad.
Thanks for the sub! Appreciate it!
It would've been even better to have a comparison with active bolts. Also, the bolts needed to have some compression on the thread (which would be more real-world). Even so, a great video and certainly food for thought!
First thing I noticed too, there's no compression.
Manfactures often include an unnecessary step to either sell another product (ex. primer) or give their lawyers a loop hole if their product fails (clean dust free surface) when they know that most of their customers cant abide by it. I use Loctite on light fixtures that were installed on a bridge when clinton was in office, at 3 am, in the rain, cold salty air while on a boom lift with a head lamp. In these conditions i can barely keep my sandwhich clean let alone a bolt. Use lots of loctite and torque to specification. If you need to loosen use either a brake bar or a torch to burn it off.
Or they require the extra step of a primer to abide by the laws of physics
Sounds like a conspiracy. (Ha ha!) I think it's more likely that Loctite wants to ensure that surfaces are clean and free of oil residue and other coatings. As for loophole, if you don't follow the instructions, it's not a loophole.
I am just going to stop you here and say that you never installed those light fixtures.
@@JediOfTheRepublic I didnt install them. i replaced them.Or replaced parts of them. In the cold at 3am.
@@beansmalone1305Yeah-yeah, we know, with your dirty sandwich & when Clinton was in office(so basically sometime during the 8 yrs he was President from '93 to '01)
I've never bothered with activator/primer and just normally used red or blue depending on how serious I am about wanting something to not come apart. Bond strength is also going to be much more significant depending on surface area of the threads, so keep that in mind with larger, coarse thread nuts and bolts. I've never had red fail to keep something secured.
The only problem to using the activator/primer is locating the stuff when you need it. Few places that sell "Locktite" thread locker also have the activator/primer on the shelf.
The point is not that it works with or without primer. The point is: It depends on the material composition of the fasteners you are using.
Outstanding demonstration. Initial torqueing of the bolts/nut may tighten the gap between the running surfaces and give a more optimum result. Great data presentation. Very clear video.
Thanks! Much appreciated!
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I've used primer mainly when I need to put the object into service sooner than a 24 hour cure time. A test every hour or two to determine cure time whether primed or not would be interesting.
Thank you! I worked on motorcycles and atvs for 40 years and didn’t know this.
When I started my HVAC career, I had a journeyman once tell me “ if you want to put something together with nuts and bolts without it coming apart again just put some paint on the threads first”. Dam it actually Works.
Or use a bolt no longer then actually need. After tightened hammer the end to ruin the thread lol
@@davidhughes8636 if I have extra threads, sometimes I’ll take a file and goober them up. But yes, doing your idea would work.
@@davidhughes8636 Nah, too much work. Some manufacturers of imported junk seem to use an even easier way: just cross-thread every fastener!
Teflon tape works quite nice too
@@sparcnut I use double helicoid ambi-fastener threads for all mission critical components. You know, the ones you have to tighten to get loose and loosen to tighten.
Thank you for sharing that with us. I've never noticed a difference when using it on new or old' clean or not clean threaded connectors! Nice to know!
I like it when people get their point across in less than six minutes.
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We use a red sealant on our pipes at work. We generally only use the primer when we are dealing with Stainless as it doesn't stick very well to the stainless and just runs off. The primer helps it stick to the metal better. In brass or copper it doesn't seem to matter as much. We don't use a lot of zinc.
I'm guessing that's gas-oila red. Great product!
Very well done video, and as a bonus you got many very experienced folks to comment. Thank you!
Thanks! I have no clue as to why this video went somewhat viral with over a million views. 😎
Thank you so much for not using loud feet!!!!!
Seems like there wasn't enough of a difference to worry about. I think I will continue to use it as I always have! But it's a little odd to me that the non-activated breakaway torque raised with 72 hours, but then dropped again. I think there may be some variability in the quality of the bolts and nuts. A better test would be to test 5 of each without timing, then average them, removing the highest and lowest!
Thanks for sharing your thoughts and suggestions. Much appreciated! 😎
I agree James, a larger sample size of each timepoint is needed. n=5 is a good starting point.
Also I've noticed there are samples with higher values on non-activated. Shouldn't that be consistenly the other way around?
He should have tried rust hehe
@MiMiM MiM he used a random activator and read the TDS from 2018 which removed half of the instructions for the glue.
Great video. I'd never heard of the need for activator, and I don't clean the bolts either! It would be interesting to run a test with uncleaned bolts vs uncleaned activated
It fails if you do not clean the parts. I have seen it several times. They must be clean, both bolt and thread area. Brake clean works pretty well and is so common now. Spray on and blow off crap with air.
Thank you for doing real science and not just giving your opinion. We need more of this.
Real science?! I never thought that my testing would be considered science. 😎
Former Loctite rep here: Older primers (Primer N or Primer T) contained either a copper-ion or an amine dissolved in the carrier solvent. Those compunds drove the resin cure to a much higher level of completion that the stuff used here. I have not checked, but I suspect the older primers have been outlawed due to solvent content and/or toxicity concerns. At the end of the day, some heat (
Thanks for the info! 😎
You can still buy the Loctite copper salt primer from McMaster Carr. Loctite SF 7649. It's expensive though. It makes a huge difference with stainless steel fasteners.
Some stainless steel fasteners won't cure Loctite properly. I made the mistake of using primer and green Loctite on a nut and bolt that hadn't been assembled. It cured so fast that it seized up before I could tighten it all the way.
Used Primer N and T for years. (Thankfully, on an infrequent basis.) Just a bizarre exotic aromatic-chemical smell to them. They really sped the cure up better than the current stuff, but it just somehow smelled like it was giving you brain cancer.
I always just cleaned the threads with an aerosol brake cleaner, allowed the surfaces to dry, then applied the threadlocker. I never experienced a problem except for having to heat the bolt or the nut to remove it, using the "Red". Thanks for your efforts in this experiment.
Thanks! 👍😎
Great test.
Thank you 🙏
I smacked that subscribe button. First time viewer of your content and was impressed with the video and audio quality. I appreciate the annotations and graphics to clarify what you are explaining. I look forward to more videos.
Thanks! I appreciate the kind words. I’m still learning this TH-cam thing in my old age. LOL
I found this test interesting, informative, and thought-provoking. I wonder if you would have gotten different results if you loosened torqued samples. I'm thinking (and I am hardly an expert on the subject) that you tested the shear strength of the cured threadlocker and not the ability of the threadlocker to effect sliding between two clamped surfaces. Would the results be similar if the same test was performed using Loctite 243 or 222? That's the real plus of videos like this - makes the curious think about things that they long took for granted. Thanks for your effort and sharing of the results!
Well loctite also cures in anaerobic environment. When the nut is torqued tight, it seals out the air, and allows the loctite to properly cure. This is usually when breaker bar is necessary. He basically just had some half cured, maybe partly cured goop helping raise the number a bit but I suspect torqued nuts would produce significantly higher numbers.
You’re likely right on the money with your thought process
Locktite has always worked well for me. Never seen anything come lose.
Excellent, comprehensive testing ! The results seem to be all over the map. One wonders why #271 might be a choice for parts assembly.
Good video and test. The reason for using locktite is so bolt dont back out due to vibration and such. But this shows how well just the thread locker alone works. But if bolts are under correct torque and bolted down tightly, they have little chance of coming loose from vibration
If the nut is loose, won't there be a bigger gap between the sides of the threads, compared to if it's torqued down? It might not be a representative test. It's like testing glue with a 1 mm gap
Good point but I think this test gives a clue as to the difference between primed and not. If the nuts were torqued, break away would have been difficult to measure.
Just saw this video and I really like how you presented the info, well done. So in essence red loctite adds about 15-20 ft-lbs to the torque needed to loosen the nut, without increasing the clamping torque. Then if the nut comes loose it provides about 10-15 ft-lbs of torque to resist the nut vibrating off.
Not exactly... here's another video that you should find interesting... th-cam.com/video/7yPQIsfv9x8/w-d-xo.html
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The use of loctite is to prevent a bolt or nut from backing out further from their initial tightening torques if that starts to come loose for some reason. If it's for later work, the red is for stuff that one Hope's will never be loosened again or in a very loooong time. Blue is to hold in blessed stressed or torqued items while still being able to disassemble without going through any special efforts. Torque release tests mean little to me because at no time are the hardware being turned by an outside force. So clean with brake clean and use the loctite of your choice and move on. If one is really concerned, then just safety wire the hardware.
Vibration is an Outside force, I have watched properly torqued nuts spin off aerospace assemblies while being tested on a vibration table, was fun to watch them being flung all over the test cell.....
@@regdor8187 and they were loctited or wired ?
@@georgecurtis6463 George, not wired as that adds extra weight to a very sensitive payload budget, my observation did not show any locking substance, but there may have been....These payloads were university scientific projects in the early days of rocketry where the learning curve was very steep....Things have greatly improved today....
@@regdor8187 ok, understood.
could you rewrite that in English?
wow! who would have guessed cleaning the surface adheres better !!!???!!!? wooooww who would have guessed that!! intelligent time spent on this video! well thought out display of information even though it just requires 24hrs wow!!!! .. we really had no idea cleaning the surface makes the adhesive stronger!!! wowie WoooOoOoOoWw!! 🤯🤯🤯🤯
You’re welcome!
I believe the intended use case is to have the hardware tightened to specified torque values and the tensioned/anaerobic environment activate the curing process.
I agree with your recommendation. I'm not a chem or materials guy, but from what I've heard about bonding details... 🤯
Some adhesives work on a molecular level such that if you have more than _a few molecules'_ thickness of adhesive between the parts, you're not going to get the desired bond.
I think epoxies would _not_ be in this group, as they stick to both parts _and_ provide a rigid gap filling material (also like the hot melt used for cardboard boxes)
Correct
I have been using Loc Tite products since the 1960s. I have found an additional benefit of using them on auto chassis bolts - the product polymerizes between the threads of the bolt and nut and SEALS the connection from (salt) water and corrosion, making disassembly much easier in climates that use salt on the roads.
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Cross threading works best
You’re killing me comrade ! 🤣😂
I’m from Russia, we just pound in the bolts 🙃
I was a motorcycle mechanic at several dealerships, I roadraced motorcycles , Winning six championships, two time national champion. I was my own mechanic. I never used Loctite… I used Elmers wood glue as thread lock. Never had a problem. I still use it.
Elmer's wood glue! Now that's a hack I might have to test!
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I would have liked to see the torque tests done at 1, 2, 4, 8, and 16 hours, in those cases I think that the "activated" would show a greater advantage.
Thankfully, we don't need to do that. The author of this video didn't actually read the TDS for loctite 262 and etc where it says to use loctite 7471 or loctite 7649 not the first random primer can you find on the shelf
Yeah no 7471 is 70 percent acetone which is what primes loctite.
His wierd looking "surface prep" is heptane, propane, isobutane and ethanol according to the SDS. It would literally do nothing.
Nice job! It shows that the activator is not needed on the zinc bolts. Looks like cleaning and degreasing is what is necessary but that was not included in the tests.
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Good work. It defo seems to make a difference, but not enough for me to worry. Have to say, I never knew this either but I've used 271 on everything for years and it has never let me down.
Thanks! 👍😎
I had no idea. Thanks for making such a compete test and video.
Vibra-tite for the win !
Just something I heard from a guy that tests the hell out of everything. 👊😎
Thanks! I have Vibra-Tite and some other threadlockers that I'll test and compare in the future. 😎
At the conclusion Red does hold pretty well without the primer. Great job showing the torques and logging them!👍 Thanks for sharing this demo!
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Thank You for information and video
Yes I knew this but since I’m retired and working on only small engines I use blue 242
Nice ! Glad to see someone that provides a good example and experiment Thanks
I used Loctite RED on all my fasteners for a motorcycle build and never had a vibration loosening on any connection until a seasonal breakdown. It’s a pretty solid performer.
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I only use blue loctite on the motorcycle sub frame mounting bolts as just in case I can use normal hand tools to loosen them without applying heat. Everything else I use a torque specification.
Well done. I never used activator an will continue to save my money. Good Job.
Thank you sir, well put together without drama and wasting my time, nice channel.
Thanks! 🤙😎
Mechanic here and yes, most of us are fully aware of "the procedure", but the difference in the end result is so minuscule, that we learn to just torque the bolts properly with the correct TYPE AND AMOUNT of loctite. Brake clean does matter though.
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Here is something. Loctite also makes a green thread locker. It is made to use with "assembled" hardware sized from #6-32 thru 1/4-20 (imperial sizes). Assemble, then apply the thread locker. It wicks it's way into the assembly, thus keeping vibration from causing the assembly to come apart. Handy stuff. I learned about it from a Loctite rep while peddling car parts in the early '80's. I use it in my hobby...restoring old woodworking machines. Frequently, I disassemble the stands and repaint. Using new hardware, and a drop on easy fastener, I feel confident it will last.
Green Loctite... got that covered. th-cam.com/video/amqesHpyCKg/w-d-xo.html
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Yes, wicking grade loctite, works very well
I was told to heat it with torch, lighter or heat gun, cures fast though some comes out and can be wiped off right away or scraped off if that matters to the look of something. It has held nicely, even on metal jewelry with snug fitting parts. I learned something from you I never heard before on the types of metals, a valuable lesson there, as well as letting it cute over time, never tried that.
A couple millwrights I worked with were taking the piston off of a 6" bore cylinder. They came to me after breaking a 2000 lb torque multiplier. It was a 2" fine thread nut. They were to the point of cutting it off when I warmed it up with the rosebud and unscrewed it quite easily with my inch drive air gun. Locktite has it's place and works well.
Awesome story! Thanks for sharing!
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Isopropyl alcohol leaves an oily film on things. Most folks don't know this, you might be surprised by this. Just put a few drops into your kitchen sink, let it evaporate and run water over it, notice it beading up. My wife was a nail tech and taught me this. Always something to learn as an old mechanical engineer!!
Isopropyl when used correctly does not leave a film, BUT, it has to be dried thoroughly with a clean dry cloth. (which can be problematic on threads) Not left to dry on its own. As mist people do. We call this the 2 rag method of cleaning. This is very well known in industry, including in clean rooms. If you leave it to dry on its own you don’t even need the water to see it. You can actually see the film left behind.
I wonder if the results miight have improved if you change the test a bit. Consider putting the bolt through a hole in some steel stock, apply the thread locker tothe bold and then screw on the nut and torque it down to 20, 40, or more foot lbs. This ensures the thread locker is squeezed betwen the threads, not just between the loose threads. By torque it tight you also create a tension in the bold keeping the threads firmly in contact over the next day or longer wait ppriot to testing. Curious if it make a diffference.
I've used threadlocker on bolts by just cleaning them with carb cleaner, and it's worked very well. Never had any issues. Most of us don't have day's or extra time to paint every fastener every time, seems there would be a better alternative.
Thank you for this demonstration, nice video!
Totally thought this would be a bigger difference. Thanks man!!
It does make a difference on cold nuts and bolts. I'm finishing up that experiment now. 😎
As a young man I started using red Loctite 45 years ago in a professional setting. All connecting parts had to be degreased with M.E.K. then primed and let dry and then assembled with the red after approval by an engineer. These were machine repairs for bolts and bushings. When done properly you needed a torch or had to machine them to get them back out.
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Well darn! Never knew this! THanks dude!
Just discovered your channel and all your tests. So much fun, and helpful! Thanks!
Thanks for the support! It is much appreciated!
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Thanks for sharing!
You might want to repeat this with some shear stress on the thread. The test you've shown us here is without any shear stress ;). I'm positive the results will differ significantly.
Example: screw the nut down completely and give it 12 Nm torque. You might want to add 1 or 2 washers to stay 'fair and equal' during release, and finally: put the 2 droplets on the end of the thread so all threadlocker is used inside the nut, so similar to what you did here.
Thanks!
Please check out my other videos for some with the nuts tightened down with a clamp load.
Here's how Loctite tests breakaway and prevailing torques... th-cam.com/video/PGZCPyi8yBc/w-d-xo.html
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Really good data! I always activate on zinc and stainless. The bonds always seemed more resilient.
correct
Very well done. As a full time maker who often works with aluminum parts, I have to stress to people there is almost never a time to use Red. Red can take threads out with it, particularly with smaller fasteners. Red requires heat and not all items can be heated (electric motors for example) so it should be avoided. Look into standard vs high temp blue. Red is stronger = better are the typical thoughts of makers with little experience. There is a correct thread locker/adhesive or socket for every job. Sure, the wrong one will often work when judged by an amateur. My shop stocks standard blue, high temp blue, red which is kept hidden and sleeve retainer. These are the basics of a well-equipped shop and you can drop the red 98% of the time.
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I usually spray the parts with brake cleaner and blow them dry with compressed air. Especially the black oxide coated screws with the oily coating. It's more economical than that high priced activator and they lock right up...
Thanks for your time and effort to share this interesting information with us all.
Great demonstration! Probably using more loctite across the entire thread of the screw is more effective than cleaning.
Interesting. I had never heard of this before. Also interesting is how mixed the results are, especially the 72 hour one.
Thanks! I got my hands on Loctite's primer and am testing it now. Stay tuned for that video. 😎
Great video, I've used blue loctite on a daily bases for almost 12 years at work, we would get back 10 and 20+ year old electronic signs for customer service that baked in the sun all summer and froze blowing in the wind all winter( hurricane damaged also).
Never seen a nut or bolt missing that was ever there in the first place...😅
Also we found out pretty quick to try not to get loctite on our clothes or on any painted surfaces, it permanently Staines clothes and will either permanently stain or actually remove automotive grade paint over night. Also apparently loctite has an expiration date, I cant remember how long it lasted, 5 years from new I think it was, but I've used blue loctite atleast 5 years after experation at my own house and it still worked just fine, just keep the lid on tight.
Nice to know. Thanks for sharing!
@@HacksbyDad No problem👍, I have OCD about certain things so I use loctite on alot of projects. I recently picked up that new orange gel loctite in the little chap stick type tube. I'd be curious to see a test on it, they say its medium strength semi permanent but unlike the red it can be taken loose without a heat source.
Great video. We use activator most of the time when fitting out machining fixtures. For less stressed applications we don't bother
Very scientific approach. Excellent video!
Thanks!
That was a really good demonstration.
Hey, using the activator is to prevent corrosion of the bond not to increase the strength. Dissimilar metals in the end will corrode even if it is just a slight electrical difference.
It may help prevent corrosion, but here is what Loctite states regarding their activator and primer... LOCTITE® SF 7649™ is used where increased cure speed of LOCTITE®anaerobic products is required. It is especially recommended for applications with passive metals or and with large bond gaps. 😎
For the purposes of curing Loctite Threadlocker, zinc plated fasteners are classed as "passivated". Loctite 271 will cure on passivated fasteners, however it will be slower to cure than on steel surfaces. Inactive surfaces are materials such as ceramic, polymers, stainless steel and titanium. Surfaces activators will in most cases result in lower cured strengths as the crosslinking of the polymers produces slightly shorter chains.
Thanks!
I'm testing the activator on nylon, cooled, and heated fasteners too. Just for fun. 😎
Great job on testing a product(s). I haven't reached that point because I am essentially at the beginning of flying SOLO in the DIY-space in late 2023. My Dad was nearly a master in a lot of trade skills and upon retiring from the US Army he achieved Summa Cum-Laude with his Bachelor of Arts degree. I never heard of the terms "active metals" vs "inactive metals", but I do remember studying "ferrous vs non-ferrous" metal; however, I am not a metallurgist. I thought the terms "active" vs "inactive" is applied in chemical reactions, but I am not a Chemist. I think adhesives are tested for tensile strength and torque is testing the rotational strength (axial). I may use one of the products once my Kohler Replacement Starter and I install the starter into our 2017 Cub Cadet XT1 LT46.
Thanks for saving me money I already wouldn't have wasted!!!
LOL! Glad I could help! 😎
You missed the point.
@@DinoNucci No. I actually didn't.
@@mistersmith3986 wrong
Learn something new everyday. TY for the video
I cannot say anything is wrong, but I am curious if nuts applied with torque against the bolt head would give different results using the same test criteria.
In the 70’s Loctite marketed “accelerators” in aerosol cans.
The thread locker product has a shelf life. I always have 222, 242, and 290 available, in the 21 size (smallest), because I can’t use enough of it within the useful product life. The 290 serves as a high strength thread locker, and it is also a porosity sealer. It will actually wick into the threads of a tightened fastener. The older the product gets, past it’s shelf life, the longer the cure. Added to that shelf life you also have the tolerance of fasteners sourced from hardware stores. It’s a safe bet that results for bond strength and cure time will have a fairly large spread.
Northrop Grumman specified Bossard fasteners for everything they built on the projects I worked on. This was to ensure that they had traceable product in all applications. They used contact washers to provide a reliable method for servicing assemblies. They also used threaded inserts in anything that was non-metallic or 6061T6. These inserts were bonded in.
In my industrial manufacturing job we use Loctite 290 wicking threadlocker compound, a very thin green product designed to affix previously assembled parts, to seal a particular pneumatic control component. With the application of Loctite 7649 primer the 290 bonds the parts within seconds and is resistant to 250psi air pressure within minutes.
Thanks! I compared the two in this video… Loctite Red vs Loctite Green
th-cam.com/video/amqesHpyCKg/w-d-xo.html
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Thank you, for the experiment. Didn’t know about the actiivator for thread locker. I will probably use it if I want the tighter bonding
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Awesome experiment I've never looked at the instructions for threadlocker
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When I was young and in automotive school we had a loctite rep come and talk to us. This was explained. But years of working autopart sales showed me that most people, even seasoned techs don't know this...
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