I love this. Such a brilliant and relevant interview! Will be sure to read the book! I am psychology Ph.D. Candidate and feel quite unhappy with where the APA is heading right now!
Wonderfully insightful. There are a small number of people whose preferred lifestyle is living in prison - even to the extent of deliberately reoffending to get back to prison. The problem seems to revolve around the human rights laws and those adults who for whatever reason seem incapable of taking responsibility for their actions. (The law does not apply to me. Or cannot see the consequences of my actions - either to self or others.)
I disagree a little with the statement that naming unhappiness as depression, shifts responsibility for it outside of ourselves; I have thought myself a little depressed but knew it was because of circumstances that I had not (yet) adjusted to - and quite understandably; the deaths of my family, for instance. I have, in the past, had some counselling but undertook it in the belief that it would produce dreams - which it did, and which I understood, perhaps, better than the counsellor who invaluably aided in their 'production' (for want of a better word). Thank you for this stimulating discussion!
A tremendously good discussion and one which I think holds much wisdom. A very interesting point was the idea of substituting 'depressed' for unhappy'. Truth to tell though, from my own experience of what was somewhat vaguely diagnosed as depression, I ultimately found that while counselling was cathartic, enabling me to discuss the really awful thoughts in my mind I could tell to no one else, it was a battle I had to fight mostly by myself. Medication was tried twice and I found it to be worse than useless. I think even if you are depressed, it's no good expecting the doctor to cure it because it's not that kind of illness. I think I myself got over it by focusing on the people around me. I made myself keep digging for their sake during the worst times. In the end just made myself do things, being as 'normal' and upbeat as I could... with occasional lapses into being a miserable git who no one really wanted to know. It was kind of a case of get knocked down, get up, plod on, get knocked down again, get up and keep going. Damning the thing to hell, refusing to give up out of bloody-mindedness... and I hope a sense of duty to those who loved me. I was lucky to have a lot of support and a lot of leisure, but the mental work I had to do mostly by myself. So even being 'depressed' I think you have that responsibility, to do your best for the sake of others.
haha I can just imagine that I really can. That would have been me too. I've come to believe they know far less than they think they do. How can you, for instance, observe the mental struggles of a middle-aged person, and pin the blame for those struggles on an event in his/her childhood? You have no way of knowing whether, without those experiences, that person wouldn't have developed the same or similar problems. Even if you could follow a reliable chain of cause and effect, I don't see how it helps in any way. I mean... if I had a broken leg and didn't know how it happened, being told it was because I fell down the stairs while drunk would hardly do anything towards the healing of the fracture. I hope I'm making sense haha.
@@ItsJustRyan89 How do you know I'm not a healthcare worker? As it happens no I'm not, but it never does to make assumptions. Also, while I wouldn't make a claim to enormous intelligence, I do my best to think logically and to keep an open mind. And you know, it is possible for someone to hold an opposing view to yours, even a view you consider ridiculous, and still be intelligent. And I would hardly consider pointlessly insulting someone intelligent behaviour. It is hardly going to persuade them to think otherwise than they do.
@@ItsJustRyan89 I wouldn't say so no. I'm asserting that they (psychologists) know less than they think they do, and backing up my assertion by giving an example of where their method/way of thinking, to me, makes no sense. I'm saying I don't understand it because I think it's flawed, not that it's flawed because I don't understand it. There's a difference surely between not understanding something, I don't understand how sound gets turned into radio waves at one end, and then those waves get turned back into sound at the other end, but I know the process works... that it's not 'hokum'. In a sense it's because I do understand the idea somewhat that I think it's a questionable one. I mean if it does help people, if they feel helped by it, fair enough... like acupuncture.
I love this. Such a brilliant and relevant interview! Will be sure to read the book! I am psychology Ph.D. Candidate and feel quite unhappy with where the APA is heading right now!
This is interview has never been more relevant, thank you so much for sharing!
Wonderfully insightful. There are a small number of people whose preferred lifestyle is living in prison - even to the extent of deliberately reoffending to get back to prison. The problem seems to revolve around the human rights laws and those adults who for whatever reason seem incapable of taking responsibility for their actions. (The law does not apply to me. Or cannot see the consequences of my actions - either to self or others.)
I disagree a little with the statement that naming unhappiness as depression, shifts responsibility for it outside of ourselves; I have thought myself a little depressed but knew it was because of circumstances that I had not (yet) adjusted to - and quite understandably; the deaths of my family, for instance. I have, in the past, had some counselling but undertook it in the belief that it would produce dreams - which it did, and which I understood, perhaps, better than the counsellor who invaluably aided in their 'production' (for want of a better word).
Thank you for this stimulating discussion!
A tremendously good discussion and one which I think holds much wisdom. A very interesting point was the idea of substituting 'depressed' for unhappy'. Truth to tell though, from my own experience of what was somewhat vaguely diagnosed as depression, I ultimately found that while counselling was cathartic, enabling me to discuss the really awful thoughts in my mind I could tell to no one else, it was a battle I had to fight mostly by myself. Medication was tried twice and I found it to be worse than useless. I think even if you are depressed, it's no good expecting the doctor to cure it because it's not that kind of illness. I think I myself got over it by focusing on the people around me. I made myself keep digging for their sake during the worst times. In the end just made myself do things, being as 'normal' and upbeat as I could... with occasional lapses into being a miserable git who no one really wanted to know. It was kind of a case of get knocked down, get up, plod on, get knocked down again, get up and keep going. Damning the thing to hell, refusing to give up out of bloody-mindedness... and I hope a sense of duty to those who loved me. I was lucky to have a lot of support and a lot of leisure, but the mental work I had to do mostly by myself. So even being 'depressed' I think you have that responsibility, to do your best for the sake of others.
I was interested in psychology took 101 that was it for me I was told I ask too many.questions many.of which my.professor had no answer to
haha I can just imagine that I really can. That would have been me too. I've come to believe they know far less than they think they do. How can you, for instance, observe the mental struggles of a middle-aged person, and pin the blame for those struggles on an event in his/her childhood? You have no way of knowing whether, without those experiences, that person wouldn't have developed the same or similar problems. Even if you could follow a reliable chain of cause and effect, I don't see how it helps in any way. I mean... if I had a broken leg and didn't know how it happened, being told it was because I fell down the stairs while drunk would hardly do anything towards the healing of the fracture. I hope I'm making sense haha.
@@dan4lau Everything you’ve just said illustrates why you’re not a psychologist,
nor a health care worker nor intelligent.
@@ItsJustRyan89 How do you know I'm not a healthcare worker? As it happens no I'm not, but it never does to make assumptions. Also, while I wouldn't make a claim to enormous intelligence, I do my best to think logically and to keep an open mind. And you know, it is possible for someone to hold an opposing view to yours, even a view you consider ridiculous, and still be intelligent. And I would hardly consider pointlessly insulting someone intelligent behaviour. It is hardly going to persuade them to think otherwise than they do.
@@dan4lau be that as it may, that’s like saying: I don’t understand astrophysics and as a result everything they claim his hokum.
@@ItsJustRyan89 I wouldn't say so no. I'm asserting that they (psychologists) know less than they think they do, and backing up my assertion by giving an example of where their method/way of thinking, to me, makes no sense. I'm saying I don't understand it because I think it's flawed, not that it's flawed because I don't understand it. There's a difference surely between not understanding something, I don't understand how sound gets turned into radio waves at one end, and then those waves get turned back into sound at the other end, but I know the process works... that it's not 'hokum'. In a sense it's because I do understand the idea somewhat that I think it's a questionable one. I mean if it does help people, if they feel helped by it, fair enough... like acupuncture.
Pharmageddon by Dr David Healy and Deadly medicines and organised crime by Peter C Gotzsche delve deeper into the issues raised in the conversation.
Don't we all! Glad to hear someone in the industry sees the issues.
This is why psychoanalysis has been replaced by more effective, evidence based psychotherapeutic forms such as CBT and Internal Family Systems.
Theodore Dalrymple sounds a lot like C.S Lewis.
4 thousand sessions . . . that's called marriage not psychotherapy!