A Budget Helix? Killer Tone for under $100
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 19 มี.ค. 2019
- Yes, yes I know the Helix does so many cool things and sounds great. Yes, I know the V-amp 3 doesn't do the same exact things. BUT, for $100 it's hard to beat it for late night practicing or even as a backup for a gig, especially if you're using good Impulse Responses for cabinet modeling. It takes pedals REALLY well. The effects are quite decent too. Also, you can turn the amp and cabinet modeling off completely and just use it in the effects loop on your amp. It's a great unit for $100.
Buy V-amp3 on amazon: amzn.to/2Cu2TDv
Buy Rat on amazon: amzn.to/2Cu3oxn
You probably already have a Ts9 ;)
Music used with permission from My Darn Jam Tracks: / @mydarnjamtracks2940 - เพลง
It's probably been said before but I am amazed at your willingness to demo the competitions products. It's all about the tone. Thank you sir!
The cat interlude at 3:50 cracked me up!
The music in the inbetween-clips was an excellent ear-palette cleanser. Thank you!
I've had a V-AMP PRO (rack mount) for about 14 years and couldn't quite get the tone I wanted. I purchased a Two Notes C.A.B about 6 months ago and didn't think about turning off the V-AMP cab sim and using the CAB IR as the speaker sim. Just tried and wow what a difference. That a keeper now. By the way sometimes the V-AMPs lose their config, that's down to the lithium battery, simple cheap fix just buy a replacement CR2032.
Hard to believe the VAmp 3 is over a decade old. Still holds up pretty well. It’s not perfect, but mine is still running strong after 10 years. Great for demos.
Hey Brian,
You're the man, cool guy!
Thanks for the video it was super helpful.
Can't tell, but they both sound pretty damn good.
I had the original behringer version of the v amp 3. It was definitely worth the money for studio setting versatility. Lots of different tones.
Sir, you are the only one I have ever witnessed on the Interwebs to make a RAT sound good in a way that made me say "Wow!". Thank you for that experience.
I used to use a V amp2 back in the day for recording when I was a poor teenager. I got a lot of comments about how good the guitar tone was.
Thanks for a simple and effective demo. I've wondered about this hybrid method, but never took the time to test it out. I actually preferred the V-Amp w/ IR's sound, at least through whatever TH-cam may be doing to the sonics. So, while waiting for the Boss Amp Xpander to actually hit the streets, I'm going to experiment with my old Line6 Pod XTLive with cab emulation off and spring for a set of Celestion IR's. Can't hurt to have the quality IR's, no matter what the experimental outcomes.
That amp expander looks killer. And a huge problem solver for a lot of situations I would think.
I'm a fan of "use what you got" and learning to get likable sounds out of just about anything. But...building an inventory to choose from is fun! I haven't used the V-amp (or any of the Pod/Helix stuff), but I like the sound you got out of it. Couldn't tell you which sample was which.
Thanks Brian! Hopefully this helps me selling mine on Reverb 😂
lol
Oh man, long time listener, first time caller here... So I've come full circle and have discovered that I can definitely use pedals with a digital platform. I came up with this set up using the DigiTech RP360 because I wanted to get a more consistent sound. Wow!!! I still prefer a tube amp, but this definitely solves my issue when gigging in a more open air space where I need the PA to do the heavy lifting... And I probably suck at using a mic on my vox!!!
Thanks BW! Once again my brain is itching! Cool vid as usual...
Jack Minear
Brian - I must say you have got me thinking and going down memory lane and highlighting for me that sometimes the magic happens by augmenting these devices with other gear. Am now thinking of pulling my Tonelab LE out of the closet which I indeed used with other pedals in front and disabling the cab and feeding amp. Memory lane led me back to my first multi-FX - Rockman X100, followed by Boss ME-6, Johnson J-Station, then Tonelab LE, well and even Zoom BT100. Wish I would have repaired the Rockman! Now am really thinking that new torpedo CAB-M could integrate nicely with ALL my stuff.
V-amp 2 had some good sounds too. US high gain with the 2x12 cab sim. Add a whisker verb/delay. Nice.
That´s some useful knowledge. Thanks!
It's not just the sound, I've always felt that V-amps FEEL better when you play compared to a Line6 Pod. I had a V amp 2 when I was 14 and I miss how excited I was about it.
I totally agree. My V-Amp Pro was always better at producing a usable tone. Whereas with my POD HD500x I had to wrestle with it for several years, and I have never produced a satisfying tone out of it. Very frustrating.
Thank you sir! Great info
The cat needs a monthly video. Maybe bi-weekly, but at least monthly.
The cat needs an answer to the question!
Awesome video as always
Amazing comparison and explanation man !!! Tks
Great video! Thanks so much for it. Cheers from Brazil
So weird to see the owner of a pedal manufacturer demoing other pedals and gear and actually recommending it. Guitarists chill af bros, na'mean?
You're spot on with the IR stuff. The cabinets tend to sound crap on these devices. Well maybe not the 2000 dollar range, but for sure on the budget models. Thank god for Impulse responses :)
some session / studio musicians have commented on other videos that the first version does in fact have a couple studio-ready cab models they would use for recording with any amp model, but they weren't included on any later version of the V-Amps for some reason...
Playing one, V-Amp 3, at this moment. Well not exactly at this moment because I am typing. It's a great practice tool. Quick and dirty tone machine / sketch pad.
I definitely preferred clip #2, but both had totally usable tones.
I guessed clip 2 as vamp, but thought the first clip sounded best. Super cool video will check out you other products.
Sounds pretty darn good. Wow
I still have and use my V-amp 2 twelve years after I bought it (used).
1: V-Amp, 2. Fender ... the Clean Sound gave it away for me.
Yeah, I can see that. Or hear that. But I think the distortion gave it away for me, thereby enabling me to hear it in the clean sound.
Speaking of under $100. Curious to know your thoughts on the vox amplug? Have you tried any of them out? I use one for late night riffage, and drive it with pedals with some success, although it's less convenient due to cable runs from head to feet. I find that it chews batteries if you are trying to maximize headroom, so I might put a 1.5VDC regulator in it at somepoint to combat the battery chew/headroom.
My favorite effects pedal is my Wampler Ego Compressor, so when Brian Wampler recommended the V Amp 3, I trusted his opinion and purchased a V Amp 3 to give it a try. The unit is much larger than I imagined, and would not fit on a pedalboard, but it doesn't have any stomp buttons, so I just placed it on the floor within easy reach so I can adjust the myriad of settings controlled by the various dials.
The V Amp 3 has so many options, in terms of, the amp, cabinet, and effects modeling, that it offers almost unlimited tone settings. The immediate impact on my guitar playing is that I want to practice twice as long, as normal, because I'm having so much fun playing with all the tones that my other 7-8 (single purpose) effects pedals could never match. Great investment for about $100!
Thats called preset overload. The real secret to any all in one unit is to make 3-5 core sounds with the ability to add effects to those as desired. Start from scratch. Presets can be a fun way to step out of your shoes for a moment though. Hear a tone, imagine a genre and go. A good way to some new playing styles.
I still have the V-Amp 2 and bought the V-Amp 3 a few years ago. Love them!
Is the vamp 3 any better than vamp 2?
@@richardpress9551 Not a big difference in terms of sound quality but it has a few different models
Please do a vid on budget Telecasters (say under $400)
Clip 1 was the V-Amp, 2 was the Deluxe. The Tube Screamer was what stood out the most to me. The clean was definitely a little more compressed, but it was really pronounced with the Tube Screamer. I've always thought that OD really needs a tube amp to sound good. Distortion/ fuzz can work well with digital/ solid state, but something about overdrive really needs tubes.
Of course it wouldn't apply on the V-Amp setup, but when you use real amps, is there a drawback to running the IR on the Captor vs running the IR on the DAW tonewise?
You're just a bad ass person! Thank you!
Aaaaaannd I’m listing my vamp for sale right now because this is gonna make them in demand
Both sound good. I'll pick the most convenient rig
I have the v amp 2. Sounds great, but has a lot of hum (Ola Englund had the same issue in his video). Seems to be coming from the LEDs on the encoders. In edit mode (where all the lights go out), it's fairly quiet. The reverb and effects encoders seem to be the worst offenders, when they're in a position that has 2 lights on, it gets noticeably noisier (regardless of how high the setting is.
Is there any way to shield this better?
Thanks Brian - all good points. You can get good tone from amp modellers. My current practice/recording rig is Hotone Mojo Attack - going into Zoom U44. I use clean (Mojo) side only - the Attack side that supposed to emulate Mesa Boogie is for me fairly useless. But for clean warm jazzy tone Mojo side rules. I took it to local jam session (it has 75W power amp - into 4 Ohms) and had local jazz pro playing through it - his comment was that it was warm and very amp like - he said he still liked his Princeton but he made Hotone sound absolutely great - you could not tell it was that solid state little box going into Evans cab. I wish Hotone made single amp version (Mojo only) for less money - it is $200+ but I am really happy with it. It is perfect little box if you do not want to haul all you gears to just sit in for a few songs - or if you want a backup amp that you can go into PA with if your regular amp croaks (has XLR and cab simulator).
I used to own Vamp 2 and I could immediately recognise the overly compressed clean tone. What made me sell the unit was the fact that using the effects really sucked the life out of the tone. I wonder if they fixed that issue with V3?
I'm impressed because I couldn't figure out which was the real amp. Seems there were shades of Brad Paisley in the riffage, but I could be wrong about that as well. Great video.
I have a line 6 pod upgraded to a ver. 2, I can get some cool sounds but always go back to my regular pedal board set up.
That's pretty amazing tones from the V-amp + pedals and IR's
FWIW, I had a V-amp3 and I don't recall it sounding anything like what you demo'd. It had a typical 'digital' tone profile. Just goes to show what's possible if you know what you're doing. ;-)
always really liked line 6's stuff.
On the fender amp, RAT set-up does sound appart when comparing with TS9 set-up. On V-amp3 there is not much difference (to my ear though) in tone between them. Both sound amazing, just on clean channel V-amp3 sound more focused and tight, but, as I said, not bad at all...
aside from whether you can get it to sound the same - how do they feel to play - how's the interaction as a player?
Excellent video! I use the Fender Twin Reverb!
Years ago i picked up a Korg Pandora headphone amp. I liked it but was disappointed that I couldn't clean up the sound by turning the guitar volume down.
i would just get a wimpier version of the same sound. On a whim I plugged my Boss Overdrive in and set the distortion on the Korg at the minimum that I wanted, about the halfway point. The analog responsiveness of the Boss coupled with the digital Korg worked great! It gave the Pandora that real world response I was looking for.
Made it feel like I was playing through a real amp again.
Neither one had any open-air feedback response nor was loud enough to 'bounce' the pickups, meaning the amp is just pushing perhaps a few watts and no breakup...so what difference is there to notice? Variables of the input stage between each may account for most of what the difference is at lower (clean-ish) volume, no?
In the fx loop running just the cab sim and eq between the tube pre and the tube poweramp the v-amp2 got some serviceable sounds in the early 2000s, but it was the only thing I could afford at the time
Was previously unaware that Behringer marketed a red edition of V-Amp. Did that get them any heat from Line 6, since it’s a really close finish to that of the Pod?
I use the Zoom G1XOn and I love it. It's very cheap, compact and light. You can stack 5 effects and there is a HUGE variety. Also, you can use a bunch of amp sims. You can get almost any tone in it. No complains (considering the price).
It also has a tunner, a drum machine and a loop pedal built in, but I almost never use these.
the g1on the g1XOn - those units have the SAME models as the g5 flagship . i own a g1on and a g3 , a b1 and an old b2 . the g models are fantastic . i have no idea why more people arent hip to these machines . i am guessing its because zoom has a reputation for having crappy distortion and cheap multieffects . i paid 49 for the g1on - on a whim and i was blown away -i use it live -outdoors . three years later i am still using it . i got the g3 for 110 dollars with a exp pedal , ps , manual etc . they are both using the same models and those models are all excellent . the drum machine sounds are crap , but the tuner works really well . there is editor software for the g3 and librarian for both . the g1 - programing it is intuitive and very easy . hats off to zoom . why wampler doesnt know about these ?
I got my G1xon a couple years ago, and still have a lot of fun with it.
@@peteytwofinger I read somewhere that the processors and the software of the G1, G3 and G5 are the SAME. The only thing the G1 lacks is the physical things, like more outputs, more lcds, individual stomp buttons, etc... But the sound IS THE SAME!
Also, regarding the software, there is a free one that can connect to the G1On too, you can edit, save, load and even share your presets there.
Here: tonelib.net/
(It's the ToneLib Zoom, of course...)
I had a look at the G5n in videos and its manuals and while i think it sounds very good especially since its quite inexpensive. Myself coming from 20 years of using Boss modellers i feel it was pretty limited when it came to the editing compared to Boss, that was a bit of a dealbreaker to me. Soundwise i easily prefered the Zoom to the Boss GT100 though and the Boss is far more expensive, so if you can live with the limitations in the Zoom then absolutely go for it.
@@Stefan- What limitations? Do you have examples?
I guessed right that clip 1 was the Behringer, however this is because it reminded me of a certain warmth that I got off my old Boss GT6 so I feel I had an advantage in working it out and spotting that kind of quality that told me which was which. In saying that, I didn't think it was bad, I just thought that the first clip was the behringer. It sounded good. If I had to say what it was that sounded different it probably was that the behringer was a fraction more cloudy sounding (and could be interpreted as warmer or blanket over you speaker cab type sound) than the 2nd clip and this is what made me choose the behringer as clip number1.
All I wanna know is when wull yoi be releasing the new Wampler Calico? I assume it will sound rather sassy?
Heh. This was my first amp. I think mine was version 2, but it might be version 3. Still have it somewhere.
I've heard some pretty big bands have used it on albums.
My biggest problem with it was feature paralysis. I was too new for all of the options.
With the V amp it almost sounded like you could still hear a clean tone under the ts9 and the rat? That's how I could tell them apart.
Digital processing generally seems brighter than analog where there's some natural roll off of the higher freqs, based on my own observations and as best I can tell on YT, the first one has the brighter edge, so I did think clip 1 to be the V-amp 3.
I'm using Zoom MS50G as my amp sim/preamp. Sounds pretty cool too. And might sound better with IRs too
When I first started playing guitar, I got a Zoom G3n and used that as my main amp modeling rig. The tweakability of the amps and cabs in that unit are pretty limited compared to a lot of the newer or higher end modelers, even the newer budget ones honestly. However, I think as a beginner that really benefited me, the simpler options were much more inviting. I think these super budget modelers really do have their place, they offer a huge variety of tonal options for someone who may have no idea what kind of amps are out there. Down the road, they'll probably figure out what they really are drawn too, and then they can invest in some real amps or software VSTs, or even just better modelers. The less potential guitarist we scare away with some of our complicated gear, the better!
I knew the V amp from the clean sound. With the pedals they both sounded good.
On my phone speaker, I could tell that clip one was the Vamp. The character of the pedals came through on clip two and on on clip one they sounded samey.
Wow that V amp 3 sounded great! (At least on youtube)
I prefered the second clip by far at least when it came to the clean sound, but i actually thought that was the Behringer since it sounded more like an ideal sound than clip one which sounded a bit more gritty and less perfect. Having used modellers for many years i feel that they often go more for trying to create an idealised sound of an amp rather than a less perfect sound image, the real amp sound more real and often less perfect. These days making out what is a real amp and a modeller isnt easy, take the comparisons between a Kemper and the profiled amp which you virtually cant hear any difference in.
Hi Brian, could you make these impulse response available for download?
Unfortunately I can't, as I didn't make them. However, you can get them direct from Celestion. I'm using the creamback 65 IR's, 2x12 cabinet
I have the V-Amp 2. Reviews mentioned that the 3 wasn't worth the upgrade.
I guessed right, but it was only a guess. I imagine that either would sound perfectly fine in a mix.
This is very good stuff . What a pleasant surprise to find you reviewing a behringer, of all things. Gives hope to us broke asses out there.
I’d love to learn more about their tube monster pedals. I think it may be an interesting topic, considering the “tube technology” alone. I have one, and it’s fun, but I’m just curious about its guts. Lots of mod and tube swap info online, but nothing I’ve found thus far that discusses any details of what the circuit is doing specifically. What kind of sorcery is it exactly? Can it ever be demystified?
A high-quality cab impulse response plays a HUGE part when it comes to using amp sims. I recently A/B'd the amp sims in Helix Native plug-in ($400) against Karzog's Thermionik amp sims ($50). Using the same Celestion IR's, the Thermionik plug-in was 99.9% as good as the Helix if not better in some cases. The only difference is Helix Native comes with a gazillion effects and Thermionik is just the amp simulations.
i would go for the first being the digital v-amp, but the difference didn't sound as cut and dry as i expected, i had a v-amp at one point, but i preferred the sound of my pod 2.0 so i've gone back to that. I did have a yamaha thr at one point, but to me it didn't live up to the hype, and if i put a pedal in front of it, it just sounded crap, whereas the pod does better with pedals. though nothing digital i've played reacts as well as an analogue amp in this regard, but i've not tried anything real high end.
Okay. I guess I better learn more about impulse responses. But you use them with a real cabinet or they a superior in digital form too? Are they like a lot of digital tone products - you have to wade through a bunch to find the gems? What is the best way for me to get up to speed. I'm a home office player. Recommendation for a low watt or attenuated cabinet (Switchable from .5w, 1w, 5w, 10w?)
Could you do the same thing with a Marshall clean or crunchy sound?
AC30 or 15 is probably even harder to replicate.
For you....Line 6 pod 2.0 or Vamp ? which is better?
I'll put in a plug for the Johnson J-Station. Also a table-top unit like the VAmp, it has multiple amp emulations, some very decent effects, and numerous other features, including storable presets. Generally available 2nd hand for well under $100. I paid much less than that for mine.
Although I had a hard time getting the tone I wanted out of it I did appreciate its ability to handle bass and acoustic as well and I agree the effects were decent. It was the higher gain stuff I couldn't quite get right.
@@trebleboost7 And THAT's why even folks who can afford multiple Fractals and Kempers will still use pedals for their fuzz and distortion!
No freking way! For years I tended to stay clear of Behringer stuff, especially their amp modeling stuff. This sounds too good to be true (and in all honesty with your talents and skill Brian, you can make pretty much anything awesome). You have me curious though, and if I get a chance to test drive this amp modeller in person just maybe I can be convinced to drop me schepticism for this companies guitar amp & modelling gear.
I was given a free Crate Profiler practice amp 7 or 8 years ago by a friend of a friend. I've used it to teach guitar for years, earning a decent living. I'm aware of its limitations but it's a work horse that gets 80% there, in terms of tone.
The second it dies I'm getting a better tiny amp. But it keeps on going.
That is a good option to gig without the risk to ruin your expensive equipment.
You got great tone from that combination. The processors I use, (Korg and Zoom) like pedals after in the chain. I also use Behringer tube microphone preamps last in the signal chain to set a balace of gain/signal hitting the front of my amps. You can dial in guitar attack and volume sensetivity with the preamp and play as loud or quiet as you want with great tones. I don't even use my tube amps (Fender, Vox, and Sunn) anymore and use Roland cube or Behringer V-tone amps for a clean pedal platform. The tube amps are too fragile and costly to fix, not to mention heavy as hell.
Years ago my dada tried using a v amp into the board at a show the other guy had a twin my dads sound just kinda disappeared behind everything else kinda like background atmosphere
Yeaterday I was watchin a Marshall Harrison interview on the streetwise guitar channel and he says uses one of these V-amp3 (Apart from his kemper if he goes to the studio). Loved the cat too
I didn't pause to comment during the video or anything, but I did guess correctly (I guess you'll just have to take my word for it, or not :)) - the VAMP had a tiny bit more sizzle on top, whereas the Deluxe squashed the high end just a little, at least to my ears - but still, that was impressively close considering how inexpensive the VAMP is, and I'll be the first to admit that in a full band mix there's no way I would be able to tell. I actually played around with the predecessor VAMP 2 years back when I worked at a music store, and I remember being impressed by it. For a simple recording setup or quiet practice, modelers really are the way to go. I love my Mesa and all, and I still prefer real amps for jamming with other people or just rocking out on the weekend, but when it's time to sit and learn a song or throw down a track or noodle around with different sounds looking for inspiration, my Boss GT-001 going straight into my computer is the choice every time. For recording - and of course this is just my opinion - a GOOD real amp through a GOOD real cabinet mic'd CORRECTLY with a GOOD microphone in a TREATED ROOM may - or may not - still sound just a little bit better to a trained ear, but if even one of those factors is off then a decent modeler straight into a DAW will generally actually sound better in my experience.
Dumb, non-V-Amp question (though I had one and loved it) Brian. In the intro/intermediate/outro backing track, it sounded to me like the snare was panned slightly right (toward the hats) from its 'typical' dead centre (with the kick) position. Maybe, maybe not, but it sounds killer; 'different but good'... so I was *just wondering*?
Oh wow.
man I dont now witch is witch but the rat on clip one sounded really nice, I thought
2 is v-amp?
I was also wrong.
I had the Vamp 2. No idea where it is now.
Love to see you mess with some Zoom stuff. They're very underrated, and not much internet love.
Is it because of Behringer German roots you put on Adidas cap?
Nope, bad hair day
Clip two is the Fender... I just went by the clean sound.... Nowadays it's hard to tell because electronics have come a lonnngggg way... I have the Katana head and it amazes me...
No idea. I heard a difference and I'm using two dollar headphones on a old Kindle. Both sounded like a good pedal based rig should.
How are you loading the IRs can the V Amp take them?
No I am loading them in a daw, but you can use an IR loader after it and do a similar thing
I use almost 15 year V-amp 2, I was happy with it and I can still use it at stage howaver this unit problem was bank change delay, if you diffrent amp+cab on next channel you get a little delay on it and a mini harsh. Btw Jon Olivas Pain album (Maniacal Renderings) played by Vamp 2 (Matt LaPorte told me at concert) and he uses this on front of an amp direct input.
Clip 1 - amp modeler
Clip 2 - amp
The 2nd clip has a lot more bottom end and just sounds better.
I like the V amp.
I have a super low budget configuration (Yamaha pacifica 112V, Behringer Vamp3, boh second hand).
For my needs (i play mainly at home), I have all it takes, for less than 200 € (225 $).
I have a lot of sounds to explore, and a lot of versatility (a Strat clone with a splittable humbucker, many virtual amps, many effects *just not overdrives and distortions, but you can select some virtual amp with appropriate level of distortion).
In my opinion, PAC112V + Vamp3 is a good configuration for anyone who has low budget, plays mainly at home with earphones, and wants to explore many sounds/many genres.
You can play live too, but you have not pedals, so you need to keep the vamp handy, and you cannot change easily your sound during the song.
I'm in the process of developping silence pedal modeler. You play the guitar, but there's only silence. Featuring True bypass. Looking for an investor.
I've been using a POD 2.0 for a long time for home playing and recording, (very similar in aspect to that V-Amp) but live it does not sound as good as a real amp.
Clip 1 tube amp and clip 2 v amp.
To be honest so hard to tell, but to me listening with headphone I think clip 1 had a more airy, in your face tone, whereas clip 2 was more muffled compressed.
Before I guess, I'd like to suggest trying a Pocket Pod into this V-Amp to see what it sounds like. I have a Pocket Pod; it sounds pretty good if you set it up right, especially for shoegaze tones.
Listening on headphones, I heard more air and low end on the second one, so I guessed that to be the real amp. IDK if that was the right thing to be listening to, but if it was, then I'm getting better with this stuff--yaaay!
That said, I think I like less air sound and low end. I tend to think in terms of a blend with other instruments, though, so less low end on guitar means more low end for the bass.
Oh, yeah, cute kitty! She'd probably enjoy chirping with me. I "talk" to cats all the time, and they love it.
Interesting test. I liked. Can you try with impulse responses? I imagine a situation . You need to go to a gig you have your gear set with a MArshall or Fender amp and you have your pedals. The amp it´s too heavy to carry and you have a crappy Amp on the gig and you can connect to power amp. The test should involve a Gig volume test with Impulse responses. The Dynamics are normally fucked up when you get those cheap Amp modelers. Right?...Nice Cat!