Madame Web Is Just A Reminder of Spider-Man's Bad Ending | Castle Super Beast 244 Clips
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Whenever I remember the Clone Saga, I remember this scene. Peter and Ben Riley angst'ing in an alley while from a rooftop Kaine watches malevolently and watching him is the mysterious Judas Traveler but further back is the enigmatic Scier watching him and from a hidden base the secretive Guant watches everything on his viewscreen. It was that convoluted.
This is why poor Ben got so shafted in Across the Spider-Man I didn’t grow in the 90s but I feel the hatred Lord and Miller have towards that saga.
Pat asking about the Clone Saga and his friend having PTSD is honestly a pretty valid and accurate reaction
Honestly the Clone Saga isn’t nearly as bad as what’s currently going on in Wellis’s run. At least the Clone Saga has fun 90s cheese.
It’s not exactly it being bad that is the problem with the clone saga. At least for parts of it, I’ve heard there’s good stuff there. The problem is that the thing just refused to end for way too long
The funny thing is - No - Madam Web actually "hasn't" become more of a character in the comics . Making this movie even funnier
I mean she was a decently major recurring character in the 80s and stuff, and her replacement was important enough during the 2000s and whatnot, even if not super relevant to most of Spider-Man's stories
She’s the closest thing to a Deus Ex Machina without actually being a god. Her entire purpose is to be a mysterious near omniscient psychic bound to a chair.
@@fist-of-doom487Probably her most memorable moment was being in the Spider-Man vs Juggernaut story.
@@li-limandragon9287 I've been watching 1970s movies recently and god I wish we could just have a weird melancholic story like The Juggernaut walks through every wall in front of him while Spiderman fails as a movie today.
@@hosvet_animation That would be amazing
It's pretty insane how Spider-Man is probably the most popular superhero right now, yet his comic is written by people who openly hate him to the point they admitted to loving angering the fanbase and just make him get beat up and scolded and fail at anything, and only the fact people keep buying the comic in hopes of it getting better keeps them their job.
Thats why Ultimate Spider-Man is so good (Peter Parker run before Miles). Peter develops, the story had a conclusion, and its probably the shortest timeline for a Parker spider man given i think it takes place over 2-3 years I believe (not counting its total publishing run)
@@josephbroseph3003 Ultimate is great to the point I'm confused how it was written by Bendis. It's his best work by a mile. Allthough the worst parts of the Ultimate run are very Bendis-related.
I hate the current run for so many reasons but chief among them is that they've completely lost the plot with how hardship and drama *should* work with this character lol. Nothing bad happening to Peter is a consequence of anything he himself has done or said. It's just arbitrary suffering inflicted on him to enforce fake drama
Even worse is how its basically conditioned Spider-Man fans into hating almost *any* kind of drama or obstruction
@@ScorchedEarth97Wellis and Lowe are the kind of human garbage that need have screenrant articles and controversy to feel validated as human beings.
Joe Quesada though he’s since left was just as bad and forced the “Green Goblin gets Gwen pregnant” storyline because it was supposed to be Peter’s kids originally but “peTEr cANT hAVe kIDs iT mAKes hIM tOo oLD”
Is that why miles is currently being shat on in the comics?
You just know the entire marketing is going to focus on Sydney Sweeny in a Spider-Woman suit despite it probably having a total on screen appearance of 15 seconds in the movie.
What else is there to be excited about cause based on all of Sony's previous choices regarding spider man it doesn't seem like there's much else to look forward to
@@BlurredborderlinesDeadpool 3 looks great especially considering that “What would you prefer yellow spandex line”
@@li-limandragon9287deadpool isnt sony
"The Madame Web tho" sounds 🔥 actual is it was self aware or The Room
Honestly spider man and bad ending are so much the same thing in the comics, the writers actively hate the poor webslinger more than writers hate batman at this point
I'd say Batman has it better in SOME aspects, but I am Batman fan so bias will obviously come up. He gets to have a family of heroes who help him become less brooding as well as a father figure, Alfred and Gordon, to confide in when it comes to his crusade. Pete has May, but he usually doesn't get her involved that much in what he's doing.
Of course, I should clarify what I meant with SOME aspects, since the stuff with Jason and living in Gotham, probably the worst fictional city in a comic book, is a lot worse than anything Spider-Man has to go through. Really, the main difference is that the status quo in Batman's stories tend to have a bit more of a lasting shakeup compared to Pete's.
I was literally just thinking to myself how it seems like the writers in charge of Spidey comics seem to just...HATE HIM.
It's why I stay away from Comics tbh. Too much inconsistency, too much spiteful, overly edgy writing. (Looking at you, guy who made Morlun).
@@CaptainDemo779 The double-edge sword with comics is that they're handled by different writers that change depending on the current run. Contrast this with Mangaka writers who usually handle or oversee their work from start to finish.
One strength I can think of with this method is the possibillity of seeing different directions taken with the material that are equally great in their own way (Long Halloween, Year One, Dark Knight Returns, etc.). But this method tends to do more harm than good.
@@leithaziz2716well define “more harm than good” cause from a creators health standpoint, Western Comics are leagues and bounds better.
I chalk it up to modern writers not knowing how to write drama. Peter has always had a tough life but in recent years it’s just been bullying. The general rule for writing Spider-Man has always been “when Spider-Man wins Peters loses” meaning that Peter has a tough time because of his responsibilities as a hero. These days it’s just random tragedies being thrown at him
Honestly the 90's Spider-Man cartoon is the only "cliffhanger" ending I'm perfectly fine with. My mind always auto-completes it to "And Spider-Man finds her and they live happily ever after". It's not like any one of the dozen "read the manga" anime endings where the story could go off and be concluded in any number of ways
Edit: Yeah getting a lot of agreement but for contrast with a 90's Marvel cartoon that has one of the worst cliffhangers ever. Silver Surfer WHERE THE UNIVERSE IS DESTROYED
Yeah, it frustrated me as a kid, but watching it again as an adult, I was like, "...Yeah, that works."
Yeah like, all the setup you need is there. You might look at it as a depressing note to end on, but there's nothing that implies Peter didn't find her. It's the most complete ending out of any Spider-Man cartoon. Spectacular is amazing, but its ending was screaming "we had more planned".
I never had a problem with the ending even though I would have liked Peter being with Felicia.
I recently rewatched the 90s cartoon and was like "This is actually a decent ending." I mean minus the part where he just randomly spends his day with Stan Lee, that was a little outta left field. But him going "I still need to find the real MJ" and ending on that is pretty acceptable
@@adomisk3047 How is it out of left field, though? Did you miss the entire section of that arc where he's with the Spider-Man actor from the 'real world' where Stan Lee exists, Madame Web bringing him to that world and Spidey talking to Stan about how much he's grown as a character beyond how Stan initially wrote him? xD
Plus the cute touch of Stan commenting on Madame Web who was then voiced by Stan's wife!
Like, of all the Spideys his is genuinely the most complete and best ending you could probably get for the character, honestly.
I swear the Spiderman cartoon is all I think of when I hear and see Madame Webb.
Well that's because she's only been in that one.
I learned about her from the Shattered Dimensions game which was great.
This episode of castle super beast is brought to you by my dad. He was in the Amazon with my mom when she was researching spiders right before she died.
cant tell if this is Spider-man or Hey Arnold
The original Madame Web was killed in the comics about a decade ago (by Kraven's family) and she was replaced by one of the Spider Women, who Madam Web passed her powers to before dying. This movie looks like it's based off the new one, not the crippled old lady one.
I was very confused on why the new Madame Web was a young lady so thank you for the information provided.
Imagine if in the Kraven movie they actually did that as Is a lead in
@MoostachedSaiyanPrince
So at that point why not just fucking do a Spider-Woman movie? Why even bother with Ms stuck in the chair especially when it’s gonna have nothing to do with the character.
@@li-limandragon9287 I think the Gwen Stacy version of Spider-Woman is the version they’d want to use, but I’d bet there is a decent chance the live-action debut of that character is being saved for the post Holland MCU & that is why we are getting a movie about Madame Webb
@@TheJadedJamesThey have a Jessica Drew movie on the backburner, yes. Why she is the only Spider-Woman not in this film. Olivia Wilde is directing it
*Spider-Man TAS:* Ends on a wholesome note with Spidey meeting his creator (in what is by far the best Stan Lee cameo) and telling him how much he's grown since Stan initially wrote him, then goes on alongside Madame Web to find his lost love, which was originally caused by a past mistake of his after not heeding Madame Web's advice.
*Woolie:* BAD END
Woolie forgets that much of that Spidey's development and the reason he was able to defeat Spider-Carnage was thanks to Web, I think xD
that tracks, woolie is the guy that likes having the magic explained.
I don't think he meant Bad End in a "not the Good Ending" way. I think he meant it's a bad ending in how it just ends suddenly when they obviously had more planned.
My friend also tries to justify the ending with this shit. Bro that was supposed to continue and no one can ever continue it. It hurts B. It hurts.
@@gregstinkston7634 it's just a cartoon, homie. relax. you don't see me crying over the My Name is Earl cliffhanger do you?
Why did you remind me.@@miguelnewmexico8641
I'm still confused they didn't go with the hot version of Madame Web like the 90s cartoon
GILF
I respect the GILF love
Missed opportunity. We don't have any senior heroines as a lead in these films, and just following the source material would have given you that.
@@leithaziz2716 TBF I think the movie is based on the character from the comics who takes over her name after she dies.
we need a podcast bit where they learn about Paul
suffering is a stack marker
Paul is not a character he’s just Zeb Wellis manifested into the comics so he cum all over Spidey’s life.
Be the person to write in that email
big fan of Pats GIRL DINNER shirt that has nothing but Astarion on it
The good news is that Spider-Man Unlimited is the sequel to the 90's cartoon and it shows Mary Jane and Peter back together.
That one also ended on a cliffhanger
Wasn't that the one with the Furry planet?
Madame Web is brought to you by the people who brought you Morbius.
No. Woolie was not memeing. The creative team behind Madame Web.
Is the same, as the one behind Morbius.
Madame Web is the Bayonetta to Morb's Godhand.
It's Morbin' Time 2: The Quickening!
1:50
SHOCKER!!
- Spider- Man
Spectacular Spiderman also ended on a cliffhanger, too. 😞
man i distinctly remember seeing some spiderman cartoon on some weird channel i can't remember (i think it had "jet" in the name?) as a kid, loving it, until one day i vaguely remember seeing a bunch of alt universe spidermen stepping into a portal to go do something...and then that was that. and for what must have been nearly 20 years i always just assumed i had missed the final few episodes or something, i remember as a kid trying to find it on tv to hopefully catch how the story actually ended. only now do i find out that is JUST how it ended apparently.
Jetix
"That's naive, that's hilariously naive."
Pat don't ask him a tfap question knowing he won't know the answer then call him stupid for telling him to 'fire blind' and getting upset if he refuses to play
This was such a journey I forgot this was a madame web segment
The wildest thing about the Madame Web trailer is that I saw it online about TWO WEEKS after I first saw the Kraven trailer. Sony really wants to go all in on their “not MCU” cinematic universe.
You know at least Kraven has a good story to tell. I mean sure it's just the one, and you kind of need Spider-Man to tell it but it's there. WTF story are you gonna tell with "Oracle in a chair!"
@@cyberninjazero5659 I am very much not a Kraven fan, but I did find Insomniac's depiction the most interesting one outside of Kraven's Last Hunt. Someone who wants to feel in control with his own end because he's dying.
Which is at least more to bite on than the usual "I want to hunt down a worthy prey".
@@cyberninjazero5659I’d rather an animated adaptation of Kraven’s Last Hunt than this sanitised nice guy hunter version we’re getting.
@@leithaziz2716 How's that interesting? That's the most generic trope that has been done for decades. He literally hunt down worthy prey because he's dying.
"Deep down they want to make something cool"
Yeah, Pat. But the cool thing they want to make is money.
That's the execs. You can't tell me that David Lynch does what he does for money. He does it as a hobby in-between wood furniture projects he builds.
I'm sure plenty of directors and actors want to make money, but many of them actually are passionate about filmmaking. Even the big names like Cruise are about the craft. The execs are usually the money grubbing ones that just see dollar signs.
money *is* cool.
Specifically ESG money.
money is cool
cash is cold
The 90s Spider-Man show is still by far the best in my opinion did so much more and better than any other one. Sucks it was never finished thou there was one more ark planned around him finding his Mary Jane but got canceled sadly.
The New Animated Series was awesome but it got canceled. It wasn’t Spidey who was the cuckhold in that series it was poor MJ.
i like they didnt even talk about Madame Web 90% in this video hahaha
Looks a CW show, my problem is that someone in a Sony boardroom looked at Spider-Woman movie idea and said “Nah, the old bag in a red sock instead”
What’s a good answer to answer Pat’s question “What’s the deal with the Clone Saga?” I think a good answer, to build off of Woolie’s response, would be “Marvel Editorial said we gotta push Kaine for SummerSlam”.
The Clone Saga is one of those things... on a meta- level old-school Spidey fans find it fucking hilarious.
It was basically The Death of Jason Todd, but Marvel didn't have the balls to commit to the bit and changed it like 3 times before canceling and retconning the whole thing. It sucked to live through, but shortly after the fact, was no big deal, and they did some ok things with Ben Reilly.
2006 and beyond though... every fan of Parker just can't. One More Day was Marvel committing to the worst idea they ever had by retconning the growth of the character and a great story to explore (the actual aging of and establishing of a mature relationship between two MAJOR characters in the universe), and erasing literally a generation and a half of comics history, to do something no fan supported, continues to not support, and just makes them depressed to consider. And they keep doubling down on the whole thing.
It's the fucking dumbest.
You know what's really funny? Woolie saying "she's more of character than this" then talking about the 90's animated series and its ending is fucking hilarious because that show made Madame Web a more important character than she has ever been in the comics. She less than 10 appearances before she appears in the show; they then brought her into a story THE YEAR THE SHOW ENDED where she becomes young; fights her daughter and becomes old again; does shit all until 2010 when she dies; gets cloned as part of a tie in to an atrocious event that started the downfall of Ben Reilly and has stayed dead ever since. The old lady got replaced by the redhead who has done even less since becoming Madame Web btw.
And to explain the Clone Saga, it was supposed to be a six month long stor that wouldve went: the clone from the 70's comes back, is revealed as the real one, peter gives him the Spidey mantle and fucks off to live with Mary Jane... the story got dragged out to last 3 years and it just wouldnt fucking end
Apparently Spider-Man comics have hit a continuous and frequently occurring rut of "Spider-Man can never be a happy person"
Its just a bunch of writers and artists taking turns hitting whoever is Spider-Man with a baseball bat while he's already out cold. I think he's gotten cucked, like, twice this year alone.
I find it so ironic Nick Spencer the man who did Hydra Cap (a twist I actually like but was so hated) gave us the best the best Spider-Man run in the decades because he actually likes the character and doesn’t get an erection over pilling misery on Peter like the other writers did to chase headlines.
when I saw that trailer, I had never in my life been more confused by a trailers attempt to explain its own premise......one of the key things Trailers are for and it couldn't even manage that!!
U know when they first did the spider totem thing it was supposed to be this thing that was disproven in the story it was introduced, like literally in order to beat the bad guy of the story Spider-Man injects himself with radioactive chemical and Morlun fuckin poisons himself,JMS run was actually pretty damn good up until Sins past
Sins Past ended up being another thing for Nick Spencer to fix. Ah Nick Spencer taking Spider-Man to great new heights just so Zeb Wells could Charlie Brown football us again
I maintain that Spider-Verse did more harm than good to the story of Spider-Man.
@@cyberninjazero5659 lol
@@kurowasanabe Given how bad the story of Spider-Man was for years beforehand (was it enough to be a decade?) That's a pretty big claim to maintain but I appreciate finding weird hills to die on, so go off
@kurowasanabe I mean, without it, we might have never gotten the spider-verse movies, so... it was worth it, I guess. The movies take what works about Spider-verse stories (Spider-people crossing over and interacting with each other in interesting ways) and ditches what doesn't work (all the convoluted spider-totem lore and the Inheritors).
commenters sleeping on the mob take. that was funny
The insane part is that it isn't the worst ending, I maintain Spider-Man TNAS ending with Peter giving up being Spider-Man because of how bad things got in universe (and the show not getting renewed for more seasons) is probably the darkest ending
The real bad ending is that cyberpunk furry world Spider-Man sequel show that was released to everyone's confusion. And no, I don't mean Sonic SatAm, I mean Spider-Man Unlimited.
@ngmajor6986
Mainframe said they’d do another series if Marvel gave the green light so I still hold out hope.
@@li-limandragon9287
I gave up hope for spectacular Spider-Man ever being resolved a long long time ago...
@@fluidthought42But they said this only last year.
The Magic Spider Artifact really only worked in Noir, and the sole reason for that is that you couldn’t just have a crazy biogenetics research facility in the 1920’s Alt Universe.
It was interesting to see how Noir compensated for his lack of biological spider powers, really only having Wall-Crawling, Agility, and a Spider Sense.
Every other version of the trope has fallen FLAT.
Isn't technically Wall-Crawling, Agility, and Spider-Sense the only things *normal* Spider Man has as well? Webs are an invention (for some reason) and quips are just because he's mildly panicking at all times.
@@The5lackerHe’s also got super strength, speed and toughness. He defeated Firelord that one time.
@@The5lacker i like to think Peter really can make his own webs, they just don't come out of the most heroic area so he just pretends he doesn't.
The sad thing about the Totem aspect about Spidey is it is unironically quite literally the reason the SpiderVerse even exists.
The Inheritors, Ezekiel and Madam Web had to splat against walls so that Miles Morales, Spider-Gwen/Ghost Spider and the SpiderVerse films can webswing
Man I hate the Inheritors and Morlun so much there needs to be a comic where Blade annihilates them all.
And yet the Spiderverse movies managed to explain away a multiverse of Spider-Men without totem horseshit or any of the trash associated with it.
And Miles owes nothing to the totem stuff; he would have been created in the Ultimate Universe and carried over when that died anyway.
I just want a superior foes of spider-man movie
Oh that would be amazing. Who should play Shocker? I want a cool actor who’s good at playing a loser like Ryan Gosling.
Where there's absolutely no mention off Spider-Man for some reason
Madame web is morbius but for woman and I can’t wait to watch it in theaters
It’s baffling that they just don’t do a Spider-Woman movie.
@@li-limandragon9287 yeah all these non spider person movies only to get a movie about a lady who doesn’t even have any spider powers they should have set up their spider-person up first
It's Morbin' Time 2: The Quickening!
Woolie inflicting emotional damage on me with this title.
The Man Cinematic Univere
The Final Morb~
Them talking about Sega being good with no layoffs the day they announce potential layoffs. So good. So perfect. What a beautiful world we live in.
Patrick's stand has morphed from Crazy talk into it's requiem form, C R A Z Y W O R L D
Meanwhile, employees at other game studios: "Oh dear god, please let Pat just forget we exist"
🤣
Tbf, it's the American division that's threatened with Layoffs. More proof they need dem mobs.
It's Morbin' Time 2: The Quickening!
Magic Totem Spider seems way less stupid than a radioactive spider turning a man into part spider... and not just have the radioactive spider just give Peter Parker tumors and cancers instead.
It should be both like Immortal Hulk who’s both demonic/holy and science based.
It’s just people would prefer Spidey not be the chosen one or have any great importance. People don’t like his parents being SHIELD agents either but I was fine with it.
@@li-limandragon9287 Do agree with the 'chosen one' trope being garbage, that crap is used way too much and is a detriment for characters rather than an asset.
I don't hate Chosen One stories. Luke Skywalker, Aragorn, and Captain America were all good characters. But crowbarring it into Spider-Man was god awful and dumb as bricks.
Why?
@@Blurredborderlines Because a big part of his character is that he's supposed to be an everyman hero. He's just a guy from Queens who lucked into a busted powerset, and then became a superhero after a personal tragedy. He's not supposed to have some amazing mystical destiny that defines him and his interactions with the world, he's supposed to be a good person doing what he can, even if it hurts.
@@mimictear6788 Isn't the spider totem an every spider man varient thing? You could choose to see it as how life burdens you with responsibility even if you're just some nobody and the journey is being able to handle it or figuring out how to do so while balancing everything else.
It's fine if people don't like it, it's a very stereotype main character story trope, so your tolerance of it will be different than mine. I stopped reading these comics a while ago once it became clear no one was able to write a character that ever "grows up" once they become one of the faces of the entire enterprise.
@@mimictear6788It’s why people also don’t like the whole his parents being SHIELD agents thing. I thought that one was fine because it doesn’t change the fact he grew up normally.
Thank you for reminding me of my childhood nightmare, the nightmare I lived through in the 90s.
Yet another time we can't see John Cena.
Louis from interview with the vampire(morlun) coming to swallow Spider-Man's beast totem soul no selling everything he did and then beating him to hamburger is laughably dumb.(comics) What happened after that is also dumb AF.
Unironicly, one of the best unions I was ever in had gentleman who would play cards in the back of the wear house. Best benefits, best health care, managers were polite and helpful. Just don't ask about the guys on the back.
At least the Venom movies are stupid but a fun kind of stupid. Also I am with Woolie in all I think of is the cartoon jumping the shark incredibly hard lol.
Are they fun though? The second one had literally one fight scene and it was a mess of shitty CG and bad choreography.
@@wselfwulfwulf9746 i thought the cg was okay... they look like goo monsters, right...? imagine if it was made in like 1993 like was originally planned (MK movie Reptile quality)
@@wselfwulfwulf9746 *I* had fun with it at least lol. Carnage had some visually cool scenes, like when he basically envelopes the prison. I appreciated the fight and this version of Venom being a fun dumb guy.
There are majorly dumb/confusing writing moments though. Some incredibly stupid leaps in logic like Carnage hating Venom with no reason to do so, HACKING via Symbiote in a computer, the why in the fuck would you take a super powered screaming human in a regular ass prison van without even a mouth guard!?
I know that the majority of this conversation is not about the Madame Webb trailer but I just wanted to say that it’s mind blowing to me that Sony has a bunch of really genuinely good and popular spider people, that have been proven to work in other stories and other media and have people wanting to see those characters on film, and yet somehow this is the film they chose to make. Just make the live action Miles Morales movie! And why aren’t Gwen Stacy Spider woman or Silk in Kraven?
Right? I mean, I know John Mulaney's stock has fallen since 2018, but why can't we get a bunch of 2D animated shorts with him as Spider-Ham? Or you just KNOW Nic Cage would be down for a live action black and white Sin City-style Rocketeer-esque punching-Nazis movie as Noir.
@@MrStath1986I would watch either of those, 100%
I don't know much more about Madame Web than her role in the old Spider-Man animated series, but she strikes me as an important quest-giving NPC at best. This sounds to me like Deckard Cain getting his own movie.
The existence of a Madame Webb movie makes me wonder if Sony is strategically holding back on a Gwen Stacy movie, because if you are determined to make a Spider-Man movie with a female lead that is the obvious character to use. Is this character being saved for the MCU? Do they think it will confuse Spider-Verse fans. People would be psyched for Spider-Gwen. Nobody gives a damn about Madame Webb. I’m in the tiny sliver of people who even know who the **** she is and I don’t care
Even a Jessica Drew Spider-Woman movie would be too good for Sony. The obvious move would be to pile money on Emma Stone until she agrees to be Spider-Gwen but there must be some business mandate that they have to cycle through the bottom barrel of Spider-Man’s back catalog rather go for surefire hit ideas.
@@li-limandragon9287 The logical thing to do would be to get a new actress to play a live-action Spider-Gwen that isn’t associated with any of the other movies. The only reason I can seriously imagine them doing Madame Webb instead is because Spider-Gwen is being saved for the MCU (when Tom Holland’s contract runs out, Miles Morales/Gwen Stacy will immediately show up to replace him). But like even if you can’t use Gwen, Cindy Moon & Jessica Drew should beat out Madame Webb.
@@TheJadedJamesNo Emma was amazing as Gwen I’ll accept no other live action version and you wouldn’t need to explain it much, audiences would just accept it at this point.
Literally nobody went into No Way Home or even the Flash complaining about the actors returning just the opposite in fact.
The whole premise of "Coyote vs. ACME" is lifted directly from an episode of "Tiny Toons" back in the 90's where Calamity Coyote sues the ACME company.
I watched the show as a kid, and I didn’t remember if they saved Mary Jane or not. So a few years ago I watched it again on Disney, and saw how they glossed over that 😂. Still not a bad show.
When is the Kangaroo or Stiltman movies
The fact that Paste Pot Pete keeps being ignored is unacceptable
This is going to be an absolute trash fire and I cannot wait to see Sony release it twice
It's Morbin' Time 2: The Quickening!
Madam Web looks hype AF. I can't wait for Spiderman fans to lose their goddamn minds over this EU content! 😂 I'm morbin' out just waiting for it!
Sad thing is it will probably be just kinda boring after all this excitement.
Okay, hear me out, but, “Clone Saga, but good,” isn’t undoable. The main issue the clone saga has is bloat for the sake of continuing the story. Cut a few characters and crunch it down a bit, and there’s a perfectly good 6-to-8-part story there.
Yeah someone did think they could make the clone saga work, its called SpiderVerse
And the Spider Verse also sucks. It's basically a giant Spider-Man themed "I clapped when I saw it"
@@diegomedina9637
Prepare for it to get worse
its deeply funny to me that Spider-Verse exists primarily because Slott can't *not* run an idea into the ground
That the movies have little to nothing to do with them is the icing on the cake
@@ScorchedEarth97
Now the issue at hand is, will they try to be conservative as possible and just keep it to this. Or are we going to follow a billion of Not Peter Parker
@@majdjinn5042Billon not Peter Parker. If they were intelligent they’d at least dump a mountain of money in front of Emma Stone and we’d get a Spider Gwen movie. But that seems way too optimistic.
Madame web vs Kyrie spin off game
you have to check out the comment section for the trailer. holy fuck everyone got the assignment.
Do woolie or Pat know about Paul and all that chicanery?
The fewer people who know about that the better. There is literally nothing about him that makes sense.
No movie or adaptation is ever going to touch that shit. Or the stupidity of 'Evil Spider-Man 'cuz Kraven stabs him with Norman Osborn's sins'. STFG the Spider-books starring Peter have mostly been complete fucking nonsense since 2006; Joe Quesada and Civil War were the worst things to ever happen to the character.
Pat has said a couple of times that he doesn’t want to talk about Paul
The spider totem stuff is so bad that even spiderverse, a movie based on the storyline where the totems are an integral part, discarded that idea.
Aww I had no idea about AVRR, but NOW I wanna see it!
Fun fact: Uwe Boll is apparently back in the business. For some reason.
clone saga gave me ben reily and i'll always be thankful for that if they ever did a clone movie i should be kind of like the clone movie 6th day
We eatin’ GOOD! Services provided by Sony.
I didn’t consider these Spider-man adjacent movies will combine together to form some super-group / cinematic event.
Spider-Man fans: "man, in between NWH, the video games, and Spiderverse, we're eating good!"
Comics and Sony's SSU: "we gotcha!"
Sony and the comic writers are watching us with Spidey like Griffith watching Guts and Casca, they can’t allow this happiness to go unpunished.
Sony's approach to this is so fucking bizarre, honestly. Like I don't understand how they can produce groundbreaking material like the Spider-Verse movies and really great takes like the games, and then decide 'yeah we need 00's superhero trash, someone get me that asshole method actor who bogged down Suicide Squad even more'.
@@MrStath1986 Sony has a lot of favoritism going on where they'll let genuinely incompetent people ruin franchises and cost them millions in losses because they're friends of some studio execs.
As someone pointed out: Instead of firing the team behind Morbius, they let that team make this.
Have yet to see Euphoria though does anyone know if Sydney Sweeney has actual acting abililty? Though I doubt that would matter with this film.
Disney is just sitting in the corner, staring at Sony until the day they finally relent.
Honestly, I hope Sony don't, because the little bits of real good stuff they make massively outweigh the increasingly bland trash of the MCU; that and just 'fuck Disney' in general.
I'm not gonna defend the existence of this movie in any way and I sure hope no one goes to see it, but I will say I don't hate the idea of Spider-Man having a magical origin for his powers in any way. Spider-Man isn't like the Punisher whose origin is deeply ingrained into his character and his motivation and retconning it to somehow be 'destiny' robs it of its power. Spidey got his powers through a random mishap with a spider - what does it matter to me if the spider was magical, radioactive, genetically modified, or injected with a crazy goblin serum? I'd be mad if they retconned something about his upbringing, or about Uncle Ben, because those are the _actual_ important parts of the origin story. Retconning the spider to be a magic thing does nothing to change Spider-Man himself, other than being an excuse for fun (sometimes) stories about meeting other Spider-Men.
Why can't they just do the Ben Riley movie we all deserve? But you know, not badly like the other ones...
Whatever happened to JJ Abrams run of Spider-Man?
Clone Saga I believe came from the Ultimate Spider-Man comics.
Nope. The Clone Saga is from the Main universe and not the ultimate universe.
@@diegomedina9637 Thanks for clarifying!
@@comforteagle721They did do clones in Ultimate Spider-Man as well but not to the same extent. Scorpion was a Spidey clone in Ultimate Marvel which I thought was neat.
But I like the magic spider man explanation and Madame Web….
Flat, dark, shaking camera and wooden performances to keep it afloat.
Warner Bros., a film company whose business is to make and publish films for people to watch and enjoy, just canceling film projects as losses to earn money as a "business move" is one of the stupidest things I heard of.
(I think) That the major problem with Spider-Man ISN'T that he has a status quo, it's that the status quo that they keep giving him SUCKS. And makes every relationship, interaction, conflict both boring, AND predictable. Because even though you may not know what may happen (how badly they'll screw it up), you do know what won't happen no matter how much you want it to. And it just makes all the stories disappointing and unexciting to follow, no matter how well written it is! "No matter how much you polish a turd, it will always be a turd."
And people wonder why I hate Sony enough to blacklist the PS exclusive Spider Man games. All the money those games make? More budget for these shitty MCU-Lite movies.
And man that whole discussion with tax write offs was depressing.....
The only reason why I actually remember madame web is the secret psp in the trailer, solidifying _when_ the MCU takes place
Pat really thinks this year is better for gaming than 2018? No way man!
I watched the trailer after my edible kicked in and I thought I imaged it because of how nonsensical it was.
I'm gonna be honest I don't hate the Spider Totem thing, the whole Web of Fate thing was already there so Spidey getting an actual explanation of his tie to the Web didn't bother me all that much.
I don't necessarily WANT it, but I didn't mind it.
Contentification of Media is how movies like Madam Web and Kraven get released, but Coyote vs Acme doesn't
I liked this movie better when it was called The Terminator.
Why does madam Web have to be a hot young woman with young women friends lmao it feels like the south park diversity meme why couldn’t we get crippled old lady madam web lol that’s my madam web with her red sunglasses 😎😂
The movie will probably be bad but I think they're overreacting when it comes to Web as a character.
Like.
90s Spiderverse is still the only time I found the concept that interesting.
"What Ifs" inform the original.
Seeing a different person get bit seems to just end in tokenization.
So do people actually hate the Spider Totem concept or is that just Pat talking out his ass like he is a expert on things again?
Cause I went "yeah sure thats fine" when I read that compilation
Nah people really did hate it. The main problem is it makes Spider-Man inherently mystical/prophesized. Peter getting dragged into cosmic or mystical stuff is fine but him being inherently in either category is terrible and kind of goes against the core appeal of his character
The Spider Totem is fucking stupid, you're crazy
I do like it but I understand why some people woudn't. Michael Straczynski's run was one of the last good things to ever happen in Spiderman era before Civil War brought us to where we are now.
Oh yeah, they hate that stuff. Doesn’t help that spiderverse came along and tweaked the idea of totems into something more interesting with canon events. Also, funny enough, both the Sony verse and the multiverse comics have vampires as a big problem in both of them
@@ThaltasHey Nick Spencer had one of the GOAT runs... The contrast with the run right after it being catastrophically bad is what made so many Spider-Man fans finally give up. Zeb Wells fucking Gwen Stacy'd the entire fandom what a legend
Spider Totem is terrible, Ezekiel and Morlun were pretty cool though
No Morlun suuuuuuuuucked. Vampire Doomsday followed by more lame spider blood vampires who just went around killing other versions of Spider-Men. Slott even had the gall to make Japanese Spider-Man job to them. Fuck im. I’d take a million terrible Venom Carnage knock off over them.
@li-limandragon9287 He was pretty cool during his first appearance, and that's it.
@@pedroportela6476As a “I’ve never been hit this hard kinda threat” sure. Otherwise nothing to write home about.
P.S. Pat, I urge you to just pirate the movie somewhere when it comes out. It's not worth anyone's money.
Sweet reminder that spiderman TAS and the spiderman PS1 game were the highest peaks of spiderman as a franchise, everything that came after was a downgrade and everything from the last 16 years has been insulting.
-Spetacular Spider-man cartoon
-Spider-man Web of Shadows
-Spider-man shattered dimensions
-Spider-man edge of time
-Amazing Spider-man movie
-The MCU Spider-man movies
-All of the insomniac Spider-man games
-The Spider-verse movies
All of those came out within the last 16 years or so.
I know that everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but please don't treat your own dogshit opinion as fact.
@slifer875
Dude you’re like the fake fans who rag on the MCU and defend the Fox X-Men movies that shat on every character not named Wolverine.
@@pedroportela6476 spiderman movies are shit, spectacular is mostly fine, shattered dimmensions and edge of time were ok, couldnt care less about spiderverse, insomniac spiderman is souless like the MCU.
The only one with a shitty opinion is you.
I am not gonna lie, this looks worse then morbius
I'm just sick and tired of dumping all over Peter Parker. Two major releases in one month with his garbage zoomer replacement taking a shit all over him and saying how he needs to retire and be replaced. It's gross what they're doing to the character to keep him in this perpetual misery spiral.