Here's the article with decklists and additional builds, btw: www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/budget-magic-is-lingering-souls-good-in-2023-15-rare-black-white-tokens-historic
@@hawktitan7896 Yup. Ratchet Bomb was a four of playset in my sideboard when Lingering Souls was in standard. Sever the Bloodline was decent too, though it was hilarious when I was the one who ran a token deck one weekend and my opponent tried to wipe my board of spirits with Sever the Bloodline, and I sacrificed the token they were targeting so Sever did nothing to my other spirits. That's why Ratchet Bomb is better, as well as fitting into any deck cuz it was colorless.
I remember playing this deck in standard with Sorin and honor of the pure, one of my all time favorite decks. I still have is sleeved in paper lol. thanks for the memories!
So, I absolutely love this deck!! I've always wanted a viable tokens deck, since I love the archetype, just a shame Bitterblossom isn't in the format yet... Speaking of that, do you think Skrelv's Hive is a worthy inclusion? If you were to build a non-budget version, what would you consider as an upgrade?
I came 2nd after a year of playing magic in a 40 person modern tournament back in 2017, I miss when you could still bring that sort of list to a modern tournament and do well.
I kind of like your calm and slightly lower energy this video, Seth! It's no big deal but I've been watching your videos forever, and I understand that a higher energy level with more vivid emotions and reactions is what works on TH-cam, so you are just doing what works, but personally I prefer when you are a bit less hyped 😅 the energy in this video is very cozy and familiar 👍
For Historic especially, but arguably for Standard/Explorer as well, mythics are much easier on the FTP budget than rares. If you had, due to the kind of person you are, wanted to run some number of Mondraks in this deck, it would actually be less of a strain on the budget than if they were rares.
@@NuclearRaven13 Maybe one Doomed Traveler and one Start//Finish for 2 Mondrak at the top end? The other Travelers could maybe be swapped out for Shambling Ghasts if the increased density of 4 drops (with Mondrak arguably being a 5 drop) is a concern.
Yep. Get ready for this to flood the Best or 1 ladder in Historic. Also, SB Tech: If your opponent's deck is sweeper-heavy, consider *Plumb the Forbidden* as a blowout source.
I like running sorin lord of innistrad in decks like these, it works great because of how many tokens it can produce over a couple turns along with giving a +1+0 emblem the turn it comes out
@@MTGGoldfish force of virtue rivals it tbh. I actually removed intangible over force in my modern decks and Leyline of the Meek because in a world of busted things you have to be able to compete and tapping out for a two mana enchantment just isn't good enough anymore. Intangible is better in a more fair world though.
Do you think a couple rumor gatherers would fit in the deck/sideboard? Basically turns every raise the alarm type card into an opt on top of the token generation. Maybe it's too slow?
Hmm, I like that idea. It is slow, but card advantage (that doesn't add rares to the deck to increase the budget) could be good in grindy matchups. Worth trying at least.
I wish tokens were still viable in modern I occasionally run them and I have a U/W instant speed token list but there's just too much bs that's singlehandedly beats tokens these days. Having to always block Ragavan, Fury, Urzas saga can win through a board of tokens. There's just an abundance of singular things more powerful than the whole army of tokens.
After Gen Z is Gen Alpha, so apparently it goes Greek. But even if it did loop, it wouldn't go back to Boomer. the Boomers are actually Gen W, but they were nicknamed the Baby Boomers, because they came from the post WW2 Baby Boom (in the same way that Millennials is a nickname for Gen Y) Edit: I continued watching and you did google it, but Gen Alpha is not Gen A
So my thinking there is: if we wait until turn two we get to see the card our opponent drew for their turn to maximize our changes of resolving Wedding Announcement on turn three. If Duress gets countered, that's fine, since we're likely be taking the counter anyway to try to resolve Wedding Announcement. I didn't consider the possibility of Test of Talents though, which is the ultimate blowout, since it can't counter Wedding Announcement and gets rid of all of our Duresses. Honestly, I think I'd play it the same way again, mostly because Test of Talents isn't heavily played, so the odds of that happening are low.
Auriok Champion would be the best. For Anointed Priest I like that it dodges things like Bonecrusher Giant which kill Soul Warden. Warden would be fine too though.
I think the article hasn't been published, yet. I'm getting a 404 from the link. The deck was super sweet, I was hoping to see some other versions of it!
Sorry! There was an issue with the editing. It's up now! www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/budget-magic-is-lingering-souls-good-in-2023-15-rare-black-white-tokens-historic
No, I agree. I don't mind them at all. I see alchemy very similarly to Modern Horizon: Some staples are broken (and WotC should just fix them) and I wish they had never happened, but the vast majority of cards are fine-to-great and enable fun decks. I also like most of the buffs and nerfs to paper cards. I'm always excited to see historic videos on Goldfish; the format is in a very fun state with people playing tons of idiosyncratic janky decks. One thing I do find annoying is that Seth feels the need to complain almost any time an Alchemy card appears on screen. In what world are either of the two "Alpha Jund" cards we just saw problematic (i.e., stronger than other 3 drops that would be played in historic)? I can understand that Seth does not want to play decks that revolve arround Alchemy cards, I can accept that he really dislikes the idea of Alchemy, but is the "complaining like a metronome" really necessary? Comes across as almost performative to me.
Arena budget is super weird because all rares cost the same (one rare wildcard), so for Arena budget the most important thing is keeping the total number of rares/mythics down, so yeah, even though those cards aren't expensive in paper, they cost a "rare" price on Arena, so they are out of budget :(
Someone mentioned Rite of Oblivion, which seems perfect for the deck. Rumor Gatherer might be the best Wedding Announcement replacement. Don't make tokens but should draw a bunch of cards.
Yeah. I still think the Lingering Souls + Virtue + Sorin deck in block constructed was the strongest deck (relative to the rest of the format) I've ever played. It was seriously like an 80% win rate deck outside of mirror matches. I won so many tix on MTGO before they banned it.
It might be, but in general I think our matchup against Jund is so hilariously good we mostly don't want to take out any of our token producers. Jund is built on one-for-one removal spells, and having a deck full of cards that put four bodies on the battlefield is basically unbeatable for them (unless they draw sideboard sweepers, than the have a chance).
😂😂😂 is it sad match two again control I saw the casting Raise the alarm into supreme verdicts resolution coming. Seth was so hyper focused he forgot to let it resolve 🤣.
@@MTGGoldfish ha ha it happens. I've cost myself matches with mistakes. I had an easy 5-0 in a vintage cube and lost the match on a mistake. Magic is hard.
Oh wow, if you skip the intro somewhere to the middle of a video his voice is still annoying but it is almost tolerable.. I might review older videos and try this..
You should be able to. It came in a jumpstart set. If you go to your collection and set the filters to show cards you don't own it should show up (and you can spend wildcards for it).
In addition to the Treasure helping you Souls into Souls Flashback on the same turn, there's also the argument that Dispute is closer to the same mana value as the other Instants in the deck (including Sideboard), so when you're holding up both you're being more mana efficient.
This reminds me of how recently I wanted to play historic once again, because I had enjoyed it quite a lot in the past (it was my go-to format on Arena for a while), but then I remembered, that they shoved alchemy into historic and that that was the reason why I stopped playing it...
![The most beautiful equation in math, explained visually [Euler’s Formula]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/f8CXG7dS-D0/mqdefault.jpg)
Here's the article with decklists and additional builds, btw: www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/budget-magic-is-lingering-souls-good-in-2023-15-rare-black-white-tokens-historic
would love to see this with green splash for verdant command and march of multitude at some point on idk much abrew?
can also run driver//despair 😳
I was like, "Don't play the raise the alarm, don't play the raise the alarm..." Doh! No worries Seth! It's the sickness!
I assume when people GG that early, it's new players that think it means "have a good game."
Considering Seth was playing in a quite high rank match, I don’t think it’s really the case😢
I used to assume that was what it meant.
So it's supposed to be GLHF?
@@daem0nfaust Nah, its either used at the end for sportsmanship or at the start for jerks who think they'll crush you
That's generous!
Very nostalgic video, lingering souls, jund and snapcaster in the same show.
It's like 2014 Modern, but on Arena!
@@MTGGoldfish and we love it:)
There's nothing quite like Lingering souls, flashback lingering souls :)
Good thing Rachet Bomb has got it going on.
Spectral possession, Flashback lingering souls, end step raise the alarm, make a couple soldiers
@@hawktitan7896 Yup. Ratchet Bomb was a four of playset in my sideboard when Lingering Souls was in standard. Sever the Bloodline was decent too, though it was hilarious when I was the one who ran a token deck one weekend and my opponent tried to wipe my board of spirits with Sever the Bloodline, and I sacrificed the token they were targeting so Sever did nothing to my other spirits. That's why Ratchet Bomb is better, as well as fitting into any deck cuz it was colorless.
BW Tokens was my first modern deck, bought the Modern Event deck and slowly upgraded it. Wish it was still playable.
Lingering souls..such a nostalgic card. One of the greatest card design ever made.
Hard agree. One of my favorites.
Seth crushing Jund with budget tokens: “look at what they need to mimic a fraction of our power”
I still play an upgraded BW tokens in modern and still have a ton of fun with it
I have a U/W tokens list in modern that's really strong. The issue is freaking fury wrecks creature decks especially tokens.
Yeah! That was actually my inspiration for this list. Can play almost the same deck on Arena now.
@@winssports4830 Fury is legit the #1 enemy of this deck. It's almost worse than a sweeper. Definitely need tech in s/b for red decks.
@@RockThisCrib I run the tech and it still isn't good enough lol. I might have to try shining shoal. My deck even has counters since it's U/W.
I play B/W Smallpox in modern, because I love what that deck does, and lingering souls is one of my favorites cards in the deck!
I thought there would be 15 rare tokens, and I was very confused.
Thanks for troopering on Seth, hope you feel better soon!
I remember playing this deck in standard with Sorin and honor of the pure, one of my all time favorite decks. I still have is sleeved in paper lol. thanks for the memories!
Thank you brother Set for making this video despite your sickness 😷 🙌 🙏 💙 💯 👌 😷. It was fun.
So, I absolutely love this deck!! I've always wanted a viable tokens deck, since I love the archetype, just a shame Bitterblossom isn't in the format yet...
Speaking of that, do you think Skrelv's Hive is a worthy inclusion? If you were to build a non-budget version, what would you consider as an upgrade?
Ahhh lingering souls...I wasn't playing during its heyday but it harkens back to a simpler time in MTG. ❤
I came 2nd after a year of playing magic in a 40 person modern tournament back in 2017, I miss when you could still bring that sort of list to a modern tournament and do well.
I kind of like your calm and slightly lower energy this video, Seth! It's no big deal but I've been watching your videos forever, and I understand that a higher energy level with more vivid emotions and reactions is what works on TH-cam, so you are just doing what works, but personally I prefer when you are a bit less hyped 😅 the energy in this video is very cozy and familiar 👍
Thank you Seth for the show
I know it’s budget, but Castle Aredenvale seems perfect for the deck
This deck makes me happy. I played Battle Screech when it first got printed, and it's got tons of nostalgic value for me.
Seth, I love the band tees! I'm also an old school BW tokens player in Modern circa 2014 so this deck warms my heart
Wishing you get better soon, Seth!
The raise the alarm with the wrath on the stack 😅 hope you get better!
For Historic especially, but arguably for Standard/Explorer as well, mythics are much easier on the FTP budget than rares. If you had, due to the kind of person you are, wanted to run some number of Mondraks in this deck, it would actually be less of a strain on the budget than if they were rares.
Its always those darn lands
if hypothetically one wanted to add some mondraks, what should you cut?
@@NuclearRaven13 Maybe one Doomed Traveler and one Start//Finish for 2 Mondrak at the top end? The other Travelers could maybe be swapped out for Shambling Ghasts if the increased density of 4 drops (with Mondrak arguably being a 5 drop) is a concern.
Aw, you sound pretty rough, Seth. Get some rest, buddy, you definitely sound like you need it. Always happy for some content but health is important!
Wizards brings back poison counters, and Seth, probably better known as Saffron Olive, gets sick 🧐🤔 coincidence?.... I think not
Yep. Get ready for this to flood the Best or 1 ladder in Historic.
Also, SB Tech: If your opponent's deck is sweeper-heavy, consider *Plumb the Forbidden* as a blowout source.
Spicy
It will not flood anything because it's not very good.
It’s pretty slow for laddering
Ohh, Plumb sounds awesome. I'm going to add a copy or two somewhere. Good call.
Lol thanks for toughing this video out Seth, get better soon and take it easy
When we say we want more sick MTG content we’re talking about the deck tech, not the presenter! Great episode though Seth, hope you’re feeling better.
Much love for the Trampled by Turtles shirt!!!
I like running sorin lord of innistrad in decks like these, it works great because of how many tokens it can produce over a couple turns along with giving a +1+0 emblem the turn it comes out
Yeah! Sorin is sweet in these decks, but not on Arena yet :(
@@MTGGoldfish i find this to be horribly upsetting and something wizards needs to rectify immediately.
Horn of gondor and skrelv's hive work really well to generate tokens as well
I played a Sultai Mulch list back in Innistrad Block Constructed. Lingering Souls + Intangible virtue were a menace.
Punishing the early GGs is one of the greatest feelings in magic ❤
B/W Tokens is one of my favorite archetypes. I've played a version of this deck for years. Intangible Virture is such a gross card in token strats.
Intangible Virtue is super strong. I really think it might be the best anthem of all time.
@@MTGGoldfish force of virtue rivals it tbh. I actually removed intangible over force in my modern decks and Leyline of the Meek because in a world of busted things you have to be able to compete and tapping out for a two mana enchantment just isn't good enough anymore. Intangible is better in a more fair world though.
Get well Soon Seth, better known as SaffronOlive!
getting that mental reset can be way more important, hope you feel better soon😷❤
Do you think a couple rumor gatherers would fit in the deck/sideboard? Basically turns every raise the alarm type card into an opt on top of the token generation. Maybe it's too slow?
Hmm, I like that idea. It is slow, but card advantage (that doesn't add rares to the deck to increase the budget) could be good in grindy matchups. Worth trying at least.
I enjoy tokens decks for the same reasons I like aristocrats, you feel so good when your opponent uses any targeted removal
I wish tokens were still viable in modern I occasionally run them and I have a U/W instant speed token list but there's just too much bs that's singlehandedly beats tokens these days. Having to always block Ragavan, Fury, Urzas saga can win through a board of tokens. There's just an abundance of singular things more powerful than the whole army of tokens.
Why isn't rite of oblivion in this deck somewhere? Isn't that like the best removal spell with a lot of disposable creatures?
Hmm, yeah, that seems like an oversite. Should be in the sideboard at least.
Feel better, Seth!
Awww Seth you sound so sick 😢 hope you feel better soon dude 🤧
That shake scoop though 😂
Lingering souls brings back memories 😂
I played this deck, had 7 tokens with 2 intangible virtues, and got triple end the festivitiesed.
alpha jund is also extremely apt because its as if the cards are in testing/early release
Built it right after finishing this video! :3
That shame scoop haha
Get well soon Seth.
After Gen Z is Gen Alpha, so apparently it goes Greek. But even if it did loop, it wouldn't go back to Boomer. the Boomers are actually Gen W, but they were nicknamed the Baby Boomers, because they came from the post WW2 Baby Boom (in the same way that Millennials is a nickname for Gen Y)
Edit: I continued watching and you did google it, but Gen Alpha is not Gen A
A for Alpha and Alchemy!
This deck makes want to play best of 3
I love running hanweir militia in a deck like this
I have always seen Good Game at the start of an Arena match to mean, have a good game/GLHF kinda deal. 5:20
31:20 Seth, you never Duress on two in that scenario 😂
Why didn't he do it turn 1??? I was so confused
So my thinking there is: if we wait until turn two we get to see the card our opponent drew for their turn to maximize our changes of resolving Wedding Announcement on turn three. If Duress gets countered, that's fine, since we're likely be taking the counter anyway to try to resolve Wedding Announcement. I didn't consider the possibility of Test of Talents though, which is the ultimate blowout, since it can't counter Wedding Announcement and gets rid of all of our Duresses. Honestly, I think I'd play it the same way again, mostly because Test of Talents isn't heavily played, so the odds of that happening are low.
Hope you feel better soon! Also, everyone shame scoops now and again.
Ohw, what a cute madness deck
Seth! Feel better!
Get well soon Seth!
Its weird that i love your sick voice more??? Anyway. Great video as always
Why not Soul Warden instead of Anoiter Priest? I'd love for Auriok Champion to be added to Arena.
Auriok Champion would be the best. For Anointed Priest I like that it dodges things like Bonecrusher Giant which kill Soul Warden. Warden would be fine too though.
I think the article hasn't been published, yet. I'm getting a 404 from the link.
The deck was super sweet, I was hoping to see some other versions of it!
Sorry! There was an issue with the editing. It's up now! www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/budget-magic-is-lingering-souls-good-in-2023-15-rare-black-white-tokens-historic
@@MTGGoldfish Thank you!!!
How do i get those snazzy Ron Spears plains? Its my favorite land and i had no idea it was on arena until this video.
As always, love the content!
They were in the store at one point, but I'm not sure if you can still get them. They should return eventually though.
@@MTGGoldfish Bummer. Guess I'll be on the lookout in the store. The unfinity lands will have to do in the meantime.
I feel like Start//Finish should see more play in graveyard decks.
am i the only one who actually enjoys alchemy and likes it being in historic?
Yes
Yes
No, I agree. I don't mind them at all.
I see alchemy very similarly to Modern Horizon: Some staples are broken (and WotC should just fix them) and I wish they had never happened, but the vast majority of cards are fine-to-great and enable fun decks. I also like most of the buffs and nerfs to paper cards.
I'm always excited to see historic videos on Goldfish; the format is in a very fun state with people playing tons of idiosyncratic janky decks. One thing I do find annoying is that Seth feels the need to complain almost any time an Alchemy card appears on screen. In what world are either of the two "Alpha Jund" cards we just saw problematic (i.e., stronger than other 3 drops that would be played in historic)? I can understand that Seth does not want to play decks that revolve arround Alchemy cards, I can accept that he really dislikes the idea of Alchemy, but is the "complaining like a metronome" really necessary? Comes across as almost performative to me.
@@DCode504 i definitely agree. fable of the mirror breaker and greasefang are way more problematic than 2 random value cards
Gen Z is Zoomer. That newer Jund is Covid Baby Jund.
i know shes a rare but i wish kaya geist hunter was here
A decade ago?!?!?!? Christ I'm old
I want to make b/w tokens for modern, there is kaya for tokens and such. Should try that next
Feel like the deck needs a blood artist effect to help make board wipes painful
Was Castle Ardenvale, and Castle Lockwain out of the budget?
Arena budget is super weird because all rares cost the same (one rare wildcard), so for Arena budget the most important thing is keeping the total number of rares/mythics down, so yeah, even though those cards aren't expensive in paper, they cost a "rare" price on Arena, so they are out of budget :(
Am I mistaken or can you run Kaheera as companion for the main deck?
to my knowledge, the doomed traveler is a human so it wouldn’t work
@@terranceilion6704 Oh, missed that. It's one of the weaker cards, though. I think garrison cat has a similar effect.
If you cut Doomed Traveler you can.
Not playing the Start when tapped out on the Memory Deluge but instead in their turn when they still had Mana up is tilting the fuck out of me so much
Hurm, now what if I wanted to play something like this in Artisan? Wonder what goes in for Legion's Landing and Wedding Announcement.
Someone mentioned Rite of Oblivion, which seems perfect for the deck. Rumor Gatherer might be the best Wedding Announcement replacement. Don't make tokens but should draw a bunch of cards.
33:40 wtf lol
Lingering souls and Intangible virtue are actually both banned in innistrad block construction. Stronk tokens.
Yeah. I still think the Lingering Souls + Virtue + Sorin deck in block constructed was the strongest deck (relative to the rest of the format) I've ever played. It was seriously like an 80% win rate deck outside of mirror matches. I won so many tix on MTGO before they banned it.
That scoop in game 2 of match 2 is absolutely wild to me
Why do Magic players do that as soon as they stumble? That game was far from over
It was 100% over. Opponent had a 5 loyalty Teferi and Seth had no threats left against a hand full of cards.
@@markwalker8846 5 Loyalty Teferi? Against the Jarsyl deck? Maybe you're in a different timeline :P
Match 2, while sideboarding isn't it worth it to bring in soul guide lantern? Neuters the alchemy card and goyfs
It might be, but in general I think our matchup against Jund is so hilariously good we mostly don't want to take out any of our token producers. Jund is built on one-for-one removal spells, and having a deck full of cards that put four bodies on the battlefield is basically unbeatable for them (unless they draw sideboard sweepers, than the have a chance).
Zoomer is gen Z
Mardu Pyromancer in historic would work too I bet
😂😂😂 is it sad match two again control I saw the casting Raise the alarm into supreme verdicts resolution coming. Seth was so hyper focused he forgot to let it resolve 🤣.
Lol, yeah. Oops.
@@MTGGoldfish ha ha it happens. I've cost myself matches with mistakes. I had an easy 5-0 in a vintage cube and lost the match on a mistake. Magic is hard.
As it's alchemy based, may I suggest "Fake Jund" rather than Alpha Jund
Don't overdo it, Seth.
I'm not so upset with the punt, we all punt sometimes, I just wish you hadn't have shame scooped.
Dang I didnt see emrakul
Did you play each opponent 3 times? Coincidence?
Decklist article is getting a 404 error page not found, as of an hour from posting
Yeah, it's still being edited. I'm going to remove the link for now and i'll add it back in as soon as its done.
Ugg.. MTGRemy! Stacy's mom/ratchet bomb is all I hear when Lingering Souls get mentioned.
the sudden skipping forward makes it confusing.
Oh wow, if you skip the intro somewhere to the middle of a video his voice is still annoying but it is almost tolerable.. I might review older videos and try this..
could you mak3e a control version of this with thoughtseize and gobokhan siege?
Could the deck do with hidden stockpile?
Generation A(lchemy)
I love me some tokens!
Gen Y,Z, and Alpha don’t actually make sense. Gen X was the Roman numeral for 10, 10th generation since founding of America.
I wonder what's the reason I can't get Battle screech in Arena...
You should be able to. It came in a jumpstart set. If you go to your collection and set the filters to show cards you don't own it should show up (and you can spend wildcards for it).
Get well soon Seth. It would be totally ok with me if you took more time to rest or shifted to brewing while you're not 100%
Ehi Seth, your great voice today feels a bit off! as you mentioned in the begging of the vid! Hope you get better soon ❤
Did you consult Dr. Bear to get taken good care of you? Get well soon!
So you are saying you are not down with the sickness?
Ohhahahaha
Get better soon Seth, spoilers are comin’.
isnt village rites better than deadly dispute? it does the same thing cheaper, and the deck probably prefers the lower cost over a treasure right?
The treasure is actually relevant for when you don't hit land drops. Token decks want 3/4 mana on curve preferably then no more lands.
In addition to the Treasure helping you Souls into Souls Flashback on the same turn, there's also the argument that Dispute is closer to the same mana value as the other Instants in the deck (including Sideboard), so when you're holding up both you're being more mana efficient.
This reminds me of how recently I wanted to play historic once again, because I had enjoyed it quite a lot in the past (it was my go-to format on Arena for a while), but then I remembered, that they shoved alchemy into historic and that that was the reason why I stopped playing it...
The Bo3 meta is also completely different. In Bo1 the match maker won't let you play against anything but 2-card combos or Soul Sisters.