Thanks for the kind words. I am currently getting some significant credentials that will help me get into the instructor field. It’s been quite the challenge behind the scenes (I have been in school over full time for months now).
I just ordered one of these welders. Hopefully it will be in first part of next month. Appreciate all the information you have provided on this welder.
The local stores by me have them in stock for the first time since release, not sure why they switched to that. No problem on making the video 😀👍. I know a lot of people are looking for an affordable option for a mini welder and I think it will fit the bill. It actually does weld really good (far better than most inverter welders do) and considering the alternatives (like a 5k miller or Lincoln) I think it’s one of the best options for many people. A stand alone generator and a portable stick welder could work decent too, but to get a decent and functional setup I can’t see that costing under 2k which is way more than the Vulcan. The other reviews out there seem to be mostly positive and people using it for portable repairs seem to rave about them too. I will be doing a bunch of random jobs with it and I will be reporting back on my thoughts in a number of months 😀👍.
Before I even start the video...Thank you for what you do. I was eyeballing this for a while, trying to come up with the money cause I have been wanting to get a engine driven generator welder for almost a year now and, was at Harbor Freight multiple times drooling.
They do have an equal payment zero interest option on their store credit card for this machine that's 24 or 36 monthly payments depending on the price you get it at. Just don't miss a payment or buy anything that doesn't offer a zero interest deal because their store credit card is about 33% APR right now. I just got this machine with that deal for $67 / month for 24 months
My credit got ruined cause I was out of work for 6 months 2 years ago due to covid ,and being sick, so all my cards went delinquent lol. Gotta wait 7 years now. haha. I would do that tho if I could. Thx bro.
The harbor freight unit for a functional stick welder and generator is hard to beat. To get a stick welder that runs 6010 as good as it does would cost atleast 600-800 (think a esab rogue 180).and another 800$ on a generator to run it, which puts you at about the same price. You could get about 160-170a of mig welder output out of it too with a decent machine, so it definitely can work for a lot of welding. I will be doing a few jobs with it and come back with an opinion in a couple months if it’s a must buy, I think it will be well worth it.
I’ve been looking into this welder for a couple months now but there’s not too many good videos going in depth just a couple minute reviews and it’s been mostly positive but finally somebody did a full breakdown! Awesome video Greg! I don’t really have a use for one right now but I feel like for $1500 bucks it would pay for itself pretty quick with mobile jobs or around the farm.
Honestly for 1500$ I think it really can’t be beat for the cost. The alternative is to pickup a 7-8k generator and a esab rogue 180. You’re still in it for a bit more but you have a portable stick welder and a stand alone generator. The benefit of the outlaw is it will have a lot higher duty cycle, electric start, and it rolls really nice around (rather than screwing with a separate welder, extension cord, etc).
More great content Greg. Keep it coming, I'm sure your helping a lot of people, including me a welder of more years than I can remember. You only have to read the comments to see how the welders are responding to your delivery to know you are doing a good job.......Happy holidays
I am very happy that you made the investment so that you can first hand explain the value of the Vulcan Generator Welder. Great job with your explanation. I have been thinking about purchasing one of these for my son who are just starting out welding. Value of purchase and lasting more than a hot minute is very important. Thanks Greg for all that you do to educate about these types of welding equipment.👍🏼🥇
Many welders simply run poorly on generators because their “power factor” is so bad. Buying a generator welder like the Vulcan assures of a setup that works properly and likely lasts. Running a welder on any random generator (or even on the Vulcan) can definitely have issues and can damage the welder due to poor quality power. I wish the situation was less complex than it is but it’s pretty hard to find a affordable generator and separate welder combo that works properly and will last, the smaller engine drives solve that issue for sure.
Thx for sharing, Can you make a video in this welder with a scratch tig rig hooked up. I'm very curious if it will tig properly and how low in amperage can it go.
I actually do have a scratch start tig rig and I can give it a shot. Since it stick welds it will scratch start tig, the hard part will be how low it goes. They claim the amperage floor is 20amps, which is low enough to do some pretty thin stuff.
I went with the stand alone option. Inverter welder, plasma cutter, air compressor, and a 9000 watt generator. Then add a set of bottles and torch to the pickup bed trailer and pull it around the farm with the tractor.
Honestly that’s a flexible way and will work better for a lot of people. The single process machines like the Vulcan are more or less a simple (likely reliable) setup that works great as it is. Buy it and stick weld without issues. Going the stand alone generator and welder route opens the doors to a lot of equipment incompatibility issues like running poor power factor welders causing breaker trips or not having enough power to max a welder out. With a decent welding machine and a decent generator for portable work I think that solution is better because of the flexibility. If someone only stick welds there might not be a huge benefit, but if someone does mobile work they really need other options besides stick.
They are handy for what they are. I will make a video comparing them to just a stand alone generator with a welder. For many people I think the smaller units like the Vulcan will work well. To me I still think an inverter generator and unit like a esab rogue 180-200 would be a better setup but at a higher price.
@makingmistakeswithgreg yeah around here these generator/welder machines are impossible to get except the high end ones. I only found one unit that was 120A still around 1500$ and sounded like it would die at 80Amps. So generator and small efficient welder is the way I have to go anyways... so very interesting video (this far 😅 )
I run the preditor 8750 generator and the omnipro 220 wielder. I install and repair tunnel carwash equipment (steel, stainless, aluminum) across the country. The leads and power cords have been upgraded to reach 150' given me over 300' of working zone. I retired the ranger 225 and haven't looked back.
Awesome to hear about your setup. I think for a lot of people running a multi process setup on a stand alone generator would be better. Stick welding thin material is tough in comparison to mig or flux core (or even spool gun aluminum vs stick aluminum). Your setup gives the ability to weld a ton of stuff easier than just a straight stick machine.
It seems to have no issues at all at 150a it runs really good. I didn’t max it out since it only has about 3.5 hours on it and I didn’t have any rods big enough to really push it. I will be honest, the fact it runs 6010 1/8 and 5/32 7018 so well I think for its intended use most people would be happy with it.
This HF over the NT Klutch ... that's very interesting. I'm very interested in welding remotely, out in the literal field. Your generator video from a while back was extrEEEEMly helpful and sent me down a very useful learning journey. Thanks for that Greg. This vid .. I love your thorough reviews, bless you for all those like me that you help. Merry Christmas. Fwiw, I have a tractor, and pto generators run clean sine wave, and that is a welder\generator setup I have considered. A pro is that it can also be used to run the whole house or any other project I have. A con is that the pto generators are not as much of a discount as I would like considering that the actual power doesnt come from the device but from the tractor. Still, I like the pto generator idea very much. I also very much like the battery powered remote welders, and I know you have good things to say about the name brand one, but Im afraid the tech is still new and I might get caught in a situation where I didnt know what I should have known. Being the crotchety frugal sob that I am, I also like seeing those guys stick weld with an alternator, which is a nice half step above the emergency dual battery welding that you recently put out an excellent video on. Since Im not in a hurry I might just give that a try too. I love watching all you have to offer.
A pto on a tractor driving a generator head is a solid option. You can typically get real solid output of 10k plus running watts for pretty reasonable prices. The downside is you need a pto on equipment to run it lol. The battery powered units like the fronius I have is a very sweet setup, but I look at it more as an emergency welder than a practical setup. Sure you can power it with a super small sub 2400 watt generator to weld volume, but as it is you’re not going to burn many rods purely on battery. At 3k plus it’s a steep purchase. The smaller engine drives like the klutch and Vulcan are honestly a pretty solid option for “in the middle of nowhere” repairs with stick. They are fairly simple, seem to have good reliability, and for 1500$ with coupon more affordable than a lot of other options. I will do some videos comparing the options on welding in the middle of nowhere 😀👍
@@makingmistakeswithgreg Thanks Greg. To add one tidbit for anyone interested ... the manufacturer specs I have seen all have the ratio of necessary pto horsepower to running KW output of the generator at about 2:1, so, e.g., to run a 10 kw generator requires about 20 hp at the pto. That is well within the range of a lot of small to medium sized tractors.
Thanks for the good review. You should talk about your setup sometime as to how you do field work. I'm especially curious how you approach carbon gouging when you need both air and welder power simultaneously. It doesn't sound as though you use a air pak machine of any sort.
So for my employment I have a big blue diesel with an air compressor. It’s not common for me to air arc with it because I just bring things back to the shop instead. In my “side hustle” aka work I do outside of work I focus more on higher end tig work on aluminum and stainless, or repairing tow trucks. It’s not common for me to need to air arc, and I have a torch setup which works fine for gouging as needed. Right now I am about 1/3rd the way through a very difficult welding program to gain a ton of certification (already did state structural and working on pipe certs). Upon completion I will likely be buying a big engine drive and doing more serious repairs so you will definitely be seeing some portable air arc and repairs in the future. The Vulcan in the video will be used for smaller repairs as a backup to my predator generator.
51:00 min what kind of warranty does it come with? You were talking about if it breaks what would you do I know the harbor freights come a long way with their warranties.
So the standard warranty is 90 day. When Vulcan first came out they did a longer warranty. The option is to buy a 2 year warranty for something like 3-400. I have no doubt the machine will handle the warranty period without much issue (2 year if bought). If you want a better warranty the esab ruffian has a 3 year warranty, and can be serviced by esab dealers. The issue with the harbor freight warranty on the Vulcan is I believe they have to make an attempt to fix it first, which harbor freight doesn’t have a repair shop. It could be interesting getting it repaired. Again I don’t Think the Vulcan will have a failure with general use in that time, but for something that needs reliability the esab ruffian is probably a better option.
I wonder what an older Hobart wire feeder that is meant to run of an engine welder would do hooked to this setup. That might be an experiment worth watching.
I had to look that feeder up and sure enough that’s a pretty trick piece of equipment. So I would believe it would work since it can run on a CC (constant current) power supply. It would work on any D/C CC supply including a d/c power source like an older stick welder. Most modern feeders require a CV (constant voltage) power supply to work properly.
As someone who was a manufacturer a long time go, I see differences in the way products are manufactured. People think it’s planned obsolescence. And, in a way it is, and at the same time, it isn’t. Thinking back, evolution of many products was much slower, say 50 years ago. We saw advances, but they were small and often not enough to spur companies to buy into them until their older equipment didn’t meet their needs, or just broke beyond reasonable repair. But more currently, advances come very quickly. This is true for a lot of industrial equipment that uses electronics and computers. So no one is interested in using equipment for 30 years anymore as it will be hopelessly useless well before then. So there’s little point in making the product last well beyond the time anyone will continue to use it and the used market makes the company nothing, really, so it’s a waste of money and would just increase the price of the product.
@melgross CNC Mills, Lathes, Plasma Cutters, Water Jet, 3D printing, etc. have all significantly evolved and, in many cases, are still evolving to reach the point of voodoo magic. Then there is the home shop ... I look at mine, and besides, the 3D printer is all old tech, the oldest primary motor driven machine being 1945 vintage, and most are of 1960's vintage. I like old cast iron machines that still work well. Long live Vintage Machinery !!!!
Great points. It’s rare to see anything with electronics being used beyond 5-10 years now because it’s more or less obsolete. The amount of development in the last 20 years alone is staggering. The hard part is the cost of keeping up is very high since your old stuff isn’t worth much and the new stuff costs more than the old. Only in cases where the new stuff is unreliable junk do prices of the old stay up lol.
Great videos! 90 day warranty- Over $400 for extended warranty 2yrs, so your better off buying the esab for only a couple hundred bucks more, your thoughts?
The 420 Predator in the welder looks to be a Loncin built engine. The 420 sold in the store that you showed in the video is a RATO built engine. For all practical intents and purposes, they should be interchangeable assuming that the generator on the welder doesn't require a tapered shaft.
@@makingmistakeswithgreg If you can't get the proper engine from HF, the worst would be that you would have to disassemble the engine and take the crankshaft to a machine shop and have the taper cut onto the crankshaft. All in all, really not that difficult.
Greg, my neighbor bought one of these and we compared it to my 20 year old Miller Bluestar. It's a close copy of my old Bluestar. Will the Outlaw last 20+ years? Only time will tell.
The blue star is probably still possible to get parts for, at worst on eBay for used parts. The Vulcan will likely not be possible to repair within a few years (hard to say on parts availability). The thing is though, the modern blue star 185 is over $5k vs $1500 for the Vulcan. That’s a massive difference. Considering how good the Vulcan seems to weld I would spend the money on it and save the rest in the long run to get a bigger unit like a trailblazer. The capability of the sub 200a engine drives aren’t enough to justify 5k price.
Would your predator generator be clean enough to run an Everlast 210 tig? I don’t have 220v at the house, and I might be able to get one from a friend. But so far I’m loving the everlast! I made my first string of non porous beads today on my lunch break 😂 I’m tracking my hours of practice and my goal is to get to 40hrs as soon as possible, lunch dinner, in the mornings… good hood time!
So the 210 everlast doesn’t have power factor correction however I believe the predator will still power it to 210a. My dynasty has no issue maxing out at 210a on the predator and its power factor isn’t perfect. Since tig operates at low voltage it’s far easier to get a lot of amperage out on a generator. And the way it loads a generator is far easier to handle than say striking an arc and hitting 150a immediately. Long story short I think you will hit 210a tig without an issue and atleast 145a stick. Edit: glad you hear you want to practice a lot 😀👍. Expect to suck a lot and make some rough welds for a while. Just think of tig as an artists paint brush. You need to be smooth, consistent, and have patience. No doubt you can do it 👍
I love mine! I also swapped the twist plug outlet with the 3 prong outlet to not need an adapter for my mig. Also there are 2 generations of this welder. The first one has an auto choke system the new one doesn’t.
Interesting on the multiple generations. I figured there was only one since the online manual only showed 1 part number. Generally there will be multiple part numbers for them if there are a bunch of generations. Honestly the manual choke seems to work great so I don’t know that an auto choke is worth it. Glad to hear you like the machine, I am pretty impressed with how well it welds so far. I can’t wait to break it out on some portable jobs soon.
I definitely will. That reactor in the Vulcan is actually bigger than the one in the dial arc 250 I have. They work pretty good at smoothing out dirty d/c, I am sure it will show up nicely on a scope.
Wow this video was quite aptly timed, we had a power cut over the weekend so I had to get the generator out for the fridge/freezer and keep our net up. I though it would be a good opportunity to try and run on of my smaller welders on the geny just as a test for future reference, lets just say it didn;'t go well XD. 3000/3300 watt generator is not enough even for my smallest 10amp welder. A quick question on 6010 rods, I don't think any of my welders have a high enough voltage to keep them lit, I'm reasonably proficient with 6011 rods and obviously other easy to run rods like 7016,7018, 7024, 6013 etc. The 6010s will only hold an arc if I have them with the flux physically touching the base metal, even then they often just spit and put out. I have managed to get them to run a decent bead on plate but anything more than that just turns into a mess, they dig really strongly but don't seem to want to wet out very well, they tent to just dig and leave a trail of weld that look like caulk shitting on wood. If I am really really careful and gentle I can get it to wet out ok but even on 3-4mm they tended to punch holes and gouge but not fill and wet out at all. I have been running them at the top of the specified range (WELD arc 3.2mm 6010, stated amps is 70-100) or even slightly higher. If running them in the middle or lower of there amp range they either wouldn't light or just stick or extinguish in a few seconds. Does this sound like a OCV or running voltage issues or am I the retard in this mess?. I am actually very happy with he performance of the 6011s I have but wanted to try 6010s as everyone on the net (especially north America) raves about them, took ages to get some and its just 2kg box for testing so I'm not really concerned if this isn't going to work but I had thought my either my TIG or new mig should be able to run them. I believe my MIG (xf252 250mp) actually has an OCV over 80volts but still strugling with them. Anyway love the content, hope you have a great holidays and have a few more vids to drop over the break ;)
Regarding the 6010, this should clear it up: 6010 welds like a more aggressive 6011. Many welders won’t run it because they can produce more than 26-28 volts when welding. 6010 needs 30-33v to operate properly. What you described is exactly what happens when the welder can’t produce enough operating voltage. 6010 should have a wider arc and slightly wider bead than 6011, and if you cram it in tight you will produce a narrow chunky weld and typically a lot of undercut. The reason it stays lit with almost zero arc gap is due to the voltage being just under what the machine maxes out at. 60130/6011/7014/7018 all operate under about 26-28v so machines will run those. 6011 is 26-28 which is why some machines also struggle with 6011. If you can weld with 6011 you can weld with 6010, you just need a welder that’s capable of running it 😀. 6010 does produce significantly more penetration, freezes faster, and will run at lower amperage (to fill holes) than 6011. However it’s prone to undercut, blowing through material, and producing very rough looking welds. I like it a lot for repair work but 6011 is my go to on thinner stuff.
I have a small question, my bester mig 200 is a great machine for the price, but i gound the controll knob to be way too sensitive, you have any hacks on this?
So I looked up that machine and located what I believe is its electrical diagram. What I found is that there is likely no easy way to change the resolution (how much it adjusts based on knob turn). Sometimes if the rotary encoder has an issue (it appears to have one of those) is defective or has issues it will jump more than expected. I would definitely call or email the company to see if yours is acting normal, it’s possible the encoder is just bad.
There are similar parts on the ruffian (the internal welder might be different but external components are the same/similar). The main difference is the esab can run tools and weld, the Vulcan can’t do both at the same time. The ruffian has lower stick output. For the 1500$ with coupon the Vulcan is it’s way cheaper than the ruffian. Northern tool makes a klutch that has an attached spool gun for welding aluminum portably, and their standard unit is basically the same as the Vulcan. I am not sure what china based company is making all of them but there are atleast 7 ones that look very similar.
If in the Peoples Republik of Kalifornia, make sure to drain gas out of the carburetor when not in use. The PRK gas is an extra special carburetor unfriendly fuel. For infrequent use, you may be able to switch to a propane carburetor.
If you change the oil after burn-in and every 10 wk hour and/or not later that 6 month , I believe the motor will serve you for years to come.It is hard to see on the video , but vibrations would be my concern . There are some heavy ring cores , and even glue at the bottom is often not enough.
The vibrations to me seem like they are from the engine hunting at idle with no load on it. Once it has any load it smooths right out. The engine and generator are rubber mounted and don’t seem to transfer much to the frame, it’s just when the rpm is a bit unstable with no load the top can rattle.
I didn’t do an open root with it but I have no doubt it would. Generally what kills open root welds is voltage, many welders might run 6010 with a tight arc on a flat plate and then open root needs more voltage and the arc cuts off. I ran 5p+ grey rods on it and had a really long arc without issue.
Hey Greg really appreciate ur videos n the time u take to explain why/how/what of things. I was lookin thru ur videos , I’dno if you’ve ever tested the arccaptain products MiG/tig welders ? Your experience n knowledge can be trusted compared to other people’s , I’ve only seen good reviews but wondering if you would ever review one ?
So I have a arc captain flux core welder that I have used for some things and am going to compare to the harbor freight titanium 125 and a yes welder. Some point soon I will get to it. My thoughts on arc captain are a mixed bag. They are extremely pushy on trying to get people to review their products (I have received no less than 12 emails from them offering free products). The reason so many people on the internet have reviewed them is because so many people got free products from them. It’s hard to get a reliable honest opinion on a product from someone who got it for free and probably wants to not talk bad about it. I am not motivated by doing product reviews on anything unless I bought it with my own money and I am not answering to anyone. Arc captain I guarantee would not want to work with me beyond one video lol. When it comes to arc captain the mini flux core welder I have welds ok, but honestly the titanium 125 is better. The arc captain can’t be adjusted like a proper welder (voltage and wire feed can’t be adjusted separately) and the titanium can. So from the cheap welder perspective there are better options. The issue I have with their better options is from what I have seen they lie about specs. They will claim a machine is 200 amp but it’s actually 160a. Yeswelder is also notorious for this. They often claim things the machine can’t actually do. I don’t want to outright say that arc captain is trying to take advantage of people but it’s hard to not see it like that. That’s why you will see me suggest for people to buy a harbor freight titanium welder. The difference with the titanium line, is whatever the specs and box says it will do. They don’t lie about specs or capabilities. I know that the titanium welders weld the way a welder should weld, and don’t limit someone. Buying a 200a welder that only puts out 160a and has a bunch of weird quarks with settings might actually limit someone in their capabilities. I have thought about buying one of arc captains higher end welders to do a review for people, but I hate to spend the channels money to more or less prove the point that everyone should focus on finding a better option lol.
So why would a separate inverter welder that plugs into the generator fair worse than the built-in inverter welder? Is there a component or ac/dc conversion between the generator and built-in welder that you could tap into to install an additional outlet that would safely run an external inverter welder?
Most inverter welders don’t have power factor correction which in simple terms means that some power that is flowing from the generator to the welder is reflected back at the generator. This causes a serious break down of voltage, a/c wave form, and will cause breakers to trip. In even simpler terms a welder might only consume 4000 watts of power to weld but the breaker sees the amperage equivalent of 7000. The internal welder in the machine was purpose built to run on a generator (likely that particular generator) therefore it doesn’t cause issues. Hooking up most inverter welder machines (which don’t have power factor correction) will have the above issues. The reason I say it’s in your best interest to use a transformer based machine is due to the fact the welder itself won’t be damaged by dirty power or fluctuating voltage like an inverter can be. A transformer machine output will lower as input power suffers but it won’t shut down or have issues. The only downside is running any welder (transformer or not) on a generator is generally not good for the generator unless the welder has power factor correction.
The sheet I have from miller says #2 or #4 ga at 180-200a 60% duty cycle at 50 foot. Honestly I would run #4 if it’s good quality copper. It will be more flexible, lighter, and shouldn’t pose much issue handling 120a all day. If you plan on doing a lot at 150a then go to #2. Just make sure it’s copper and not copper clad aluminum. 👍
It’s a pretty ingenious design to use the spool gun for mig. That opens up portable options for steel mig, aluminum, and even stainless. I am wiling to bet they basically packed in one of their multi process welders in the housing. It would save a ton in engineering costs.
Klutch has a multi-process welder version with a spool gun of this , same manufacturer. I think you loose adjustable Hot Start with their multi-process version. So you can have your MIG welder. Klutch also has one like this but no electric start. You can not use the welder and gen at the same time. Doen not come with lift points. From what I can tell these are not a low THD generator , so it must have a beefy PFC.
The klutch units are quite interesting. The one with a spool gun is a novel idea since you can actually use both normal mig wire, aluminum, and stainless to weld with it. That gives a lot of capability for portable work.
Realistically a minimum generator to run a 200amp mig welder maxed out is around 7500 running watts, and that’s provided the welder has power factor correction. A vast majority of 200a wire welders will trip 30a 240 breakers and realistically you need to be in the 9k+ running watt class with a 40+ amp 240 breaker. There are ways around this but universally you need to have a serious generator to get 200a of mig output. Luckily you can run at reduced output without issue on many generator welders. A good example would be using a 200a machine at under 140a of output to weld thinner stuff, and stick welding anything over 3/16th.
I've got a 200 amp sincro. It's 390 cc . It's got a lot of grunt and I love it. Very heavy. Not good for weldi g indoors .but great for field work. It's just an amazing but big piece of kit.
@@makingmistakeswithgregHey man...I TOTALLY agree with THAT!!! GOOD OLD Lincoln...A Miller well...ANYTHING was just a nice dream to a poor steel dog...🙂
I believe I'd have to pass on this and just get a generator like the Powerhorse 11,050 watt or the 13,000 watt to run my little 200 amp Everlast stick or Vulcan 215 mig along with some other power tools. I'm sure the Powerhorse will be just as loud as the Outlaw but they supposed to produce clean power (which is a plus in my book). Thanks for the video.
If you already have welders buying a generator isn’t a bad way to go. That’s something I am going to talk about in a follow up video on portable welding I am going to do.
@makingmistakeswithgreg Even if I didn't already have those welders I think the generator would be the best option from a cost perspective. $1000 for a 11K watt generator and $350 for the Everlast 200STi and you're still under the price of that Outlaw. Or, get the Titanium 225 stick for $250. If they dont want a stick welder look at the Titanium and Vulcan migs (when on sale) and still be right at the price of the Outlaw. Thanks again for all the vidoes.
I need to reference the internals of the 225 (I opened one up on video) because I thought the same thing. It does have some extra components and power factor correction which the 225 doesn’t, but something really reminded me of the 225. I am sure they custom designed it for the generator. It definitely welds unlike most inverter welders. I would have been super disappointed if it didn’t run 6010.
The Amico Arc 200 has Fantastic Specs and if true could possibly be the Best Bang for yor Back! The New version Claims power factor correction and fan on demand. The only draw back i see is it does not have a dedicated Tig mode.I think it could be the Answer to those who want Esab rogue performance (stick wise) On a Budget!
.93 is a more humble claim. If it actually has it. Like you said, need someone to test it and not get sent a free one or a sales commission code where they can't say anything bad about it. I've seen tests on Yes welders claiming a PFC of 1. Ha Ha. I just paid 825 for the rogue, then it went on sale for 600 a month later. Esab claims it can run on just about any generator that has stable power. It may be like the welder in this vulcan.
@@tsl7881 Yeah So many Fluff Reviews out there.( Not Greg) I just purchased the Arc 200 have not put it through its Paces yet. I am in Canada worked out to about 300 CDN. The rogue 180 is 1200 here we get screwed on everything. I bought it because it can run 6010 and has arc force control
Finally got my power station in the mail. It ran the rogue 200 with 3/32 7018 at 90A ok after I turned the hot start and arc force down to zero. It sometimes overloaded the inverter when I struck the arc with them both on 3. The rogue 200 seems to have a big starting spike around 40-50A that I think is causing my problems, because after the arc starts, it stays around 20-22A pretty consistently . Here's a quick clip I took while running a bead. th-cam.com/video/uRm5WaGE9k4/w-d-xo.htmlsi=h4WoJVibLl8xKRjq
The inrush will generally be pretty substantial on many welders due to how much current is demanded when an arc is struck. I am impressed you got 90a out of it on that. 7018 at 90a out on 120v input is a minimum 2400 watt demand when running plus the starting spike. The welder typically has a perfect power factor and is 88-90% efficient which is amazing. Because of that it’s fairly easy to predict how much power you need to run it. Just take the output amperage setpoint (say 90a) and multiply that by 24 (for 24volt) for 7018 and by 30 for 6010. That number (90x24 7018= 2160) then gets multiplied by 1.10(which represents 90% efficient) and you get the actual loading of the welder. So a 7018 at 90a and 24v multiples by 1.1 equals 2376watts. Very few welders are capable of that level of efficiency.
They do, but atleast they are available as replacement parts. The actual way the Trail Blazers work is going to be a more reliable for the long term from a making of welding current standpoint. Although the newest ones with LCD displays make me wonder.
That’s at 195a which for portable repairs nobody welds at. At 120a for a 7018 1/8th the duty cycle is basically 100%. Most stick welders in the 160-200a class have 30-60% duty cycle at 120a so for all practical purposes the machine will exceed most smaller stick welders. For repair work I mostly use 1/8th 7018/6010 and 3/32 7018, which those you could weld literally non stop without hitting duty cycle.
That leaves you 7 min to watch the slag peel, take some shots for Instagram/ grind out bad spots, tend to burns you might got and if you still have time left maybe prep the next weld...
@@makingmistakeswithgreg That's also at what's required for the duty cycle testing. IIRC it's 103 degrees F. Most of the time under regular conditions the actual duty cycle before the machine overheats and shuts off is a much longer period of time.
By myself I used to never come close to the 25% duty of the old buzz box, until I bought a needle scaler, then I could clean slag real fast. Maybe cleaning welds was always a method to slow you down. A lower duty cycle is not a problem with stick, but MIG or TIG you can run a long beads. Getting the Klutch version with the MIG gun maybe you would have to watch out.
The 420 in the store will NOT work for a replacement engine. All generators use a tapered shaft crankshaft and the one in the store uses a straight shaft crank. You can swap out the crank in the store one with a tapered one and be golden.
McMaster Carr has taper shaft adapters to go from generator head to straight shaft engines. We use them for repower when the onan goes out in a miller Bobcat.
This is one of the most detailed thorough analysis/review of a product I have seen a in a while on TH-cam. I have learnt so much from you. Thank you.
Thank you for taking time to teach us about welding. I hope you have a good Christmas! Best wishes!
Merry Christmas to you too 😀👍
Greg, you make the most detailed and informative welding videos on TH-cam. You really should be an instructor. Keep up the good work.
Thanks for the kind words. I am currently getting some significant credentials that will help me get into the instructor field. It’s been quite the challenge behind the scenes (I have been in school over full time for months now).
I just ordered one of these welders. Hopefully it will be in first part of next month. Appreciate all the information you have provided on this welder.
The local stores by me have them in stock for the first time since release, not sure why they switched to that. No problem on making the video 😀👍. I know a lot of people are looking for an affordable option for a mini welder and I think it will fit the bill. It actually does weld really good (far better than most inverter welders do) and considering the alternatives (like a 5k miller or Lincoln) I think it’s one of the best options for many people. A stand alone generator and a portable stick welder could work decent too, but to get a decent and functional setup I can’t see that costing under 2k which is way more than the Vulcan. The other reviews out there seem to be mostly positive and people using it for portable repairs seem to rave about them too. I will be doing a bunch of random jobs with it and I will be reporting back on my thoughts in a number of months 😀👍.
Before I even start the video...Thank you for what you do. I was eyeballing this for a while, trying to come up with the money cause I have been wanting to get a engine driven generator welder for almost a year now and, was at Harbor Freight multiple times drooling.
They do have an equal payment zero interest option on their store credit card for this machine that's 24 or 36 monthly payments depending on the price you get it at. Just don't miss a payment or buy anything that doesn't offer a zero interest deal because their store credit card is about 33% APR right now.
I just got this machine with that deal for $67 / month for 24 months
My credit got ruined cause I was out of work for 6 months 2 years ago due to covid ,and being sick, so all my cards went delinquent lol. Gotta wait 7 years now. haha. I would do that tho if I could. Thx bro.
The harbor freight unit for a functional stick welder and generator is hard to beat. To get a stick welder that runs 6010 as good as it does would cost atleast 600-800 (think a esab rogue 180).and another 800$ on a generator to run it, which puts you at about the same price. You could get about 160-170a of mig welder output out of it too with a decent machine, so it definitely can work for a lot of welding. I will be doing a few jobs with it and come back with an opinion in a couple months if it’s a must buy, I think it will be well worth it.
I’ve been looking into this welder for a couple months now but there’s not too many good videos going in depth just a couple minute reviews and it’s been mostly positive but finally somebody did a full breakdown! Awesome video Greg! I don’t really have a use for one right now but I feel like for $1500 bucks it would pay for itself pretty quick with mobile jobs or around the farm.
Honestly for 1500$ I think it really can’t be beat for the cost. The alternative is to pickup a 7-8k generator and a esab rogue 180. You’re still in it for a bit more but you have a portable stick welder and a stand alone generator. The benefit of the outlaw is it will have a lot higher duty cycle, electric start, and it rolls really nice around (rather than screwing with a separate welder, extension cord, etc).
It’s a good machine, I’ve been running it for a couple months, no problems running any rods , got a couple vids on it
More great content Greg. Keep it coming, I'm sure your helping a lot of people, including me a welder of more years than I can remember. You only have to read the comments to see how the welders are responding to your delivery to know you are doing a good job.......Happy holidays
Happy holidays to you too. I am glad I can help people out 😀👍.
Wow! Great review! Greg! Very informative and helpful explanation with the product! Thanks for sharing! Keep them coming! 👌👍
I definitely will 😀👍
I am very happy that you made the investment so that you can first hand explain the value of the Vulcan Generator Welder. Great job with your explanation. I have been thinking about purchasing one of these for my son who are just starting out welding. Value of purchase and lasting more than a hot minute is very important. Thanks Greg for all that you do to educate about these types of welding equipment.👍🏼🥇
Sounds like an AI to me
Very nice review! It’s good to be aware of the potential problems when running welders off generators.
Many welders simply run poorly on generators because their “power factor” is so bad. Buying a generator welder like the Vulcan assures of a setup that works properly and likely lasts. Running a welder on any random generator (or even on the Vulcan) can definitely have issues and can damage the welder due to poor quality power. I wish the situation was less complex than it is but it’s pretty hard to find a affordable generator and separate welder combo that works properly and will last, the smaller engine drives solve that issue for sure.
Another great video 😊
Thx for sharing, Can you make a video in this welder with a scratch tig rig hooked up. I'm very curious if it will tig properly and how low in amperage can it go.
I actually do have a scratch start tig rig and I can give it a shot. Since it stick welds it will scratch start tig, the hard part will be how low it goes. They claim the amperage floor is 20amps, which is low enough to do some pretty thin stuff.
I went with the stand alone option.
Inverter welder, plasma cutter, air compressor, and a 9000 watt generator. Then add a set of bottles and torch to the pickup bed trailer and pull it around the farm with the tractor.
Honestly that’s a flexible way and will work better for a lot of people. The single process machines like the Vulcan are more or less a simple (likely reliable) setup that works great as it is. Buy it and stick weld without issues. Going the stand alone generator and welder route opens the doors to a lot of equipment incompatibility issues like running poor power factor welders causing breaker trips or not having enough power to max a welder out. With a decent welding machine and a decent generator for portable work I think that solution is better because of the flexibility. If someone only stick welds there might not be a huge benefit, but if someone does mobile work they really need other options besides stick.
Awesome just today I rewatched your generator video where you mention these 😊
They are handy for what they are. I will make a video comparing them to just a stand alone generator with a welder. For many people I think the smaller units like the Vulcan will work well. To me I still think an inverter generator and unit like a esab rogue 180-200 would be a better setup but at a higher price.
@makingmistakeswithgreg yeah around here these generator/welder machines are impossible to get except the high end ones. I only found one unit that was 120A still around 1500$ and sounded like it would die at 80Amps. So generator and small efficient welder is the way I have to go anyways... so very interesting video (this far 😅 )
I run the preditor 8750 generator and the omnipro 220 wielder. I install and repair tunnel carwash equipment (steel, stainless, aluminum) across the country. The leads and power cords have been upgraded to reach 150' given me over 300' of working zone. I retired the ranger 225 and haven't looked back.
Awesome to hear about your setup. I think for a lot of people running a multi process setup on a stand alone generator would be better. Stick welding thin material is tough in comparison to mig or flux core (or even spool gun aluminum vs stick aluminum). Your setup gives the ability to weld a ton of stuff easier than just a straight stick machine.
Great review Greg really appreciate it load test with 7014 5/32
It seems to have no issues at all at 150a it runs really good. I didn’t max it out since it only has about 3.5 hours on it and I didn’t have any rods big enough to really push it. I will be honest, the fact it runs 6010 1/8 and 5/32 7018 so well I think for its intended use most people would be happy with it.
This HF over the NT Klutch ... that's very interesting. I'm very interested in welding remotely, out in the literal field. Your generator video from a while back was extrEEEEMly helpful and sent me down a very useful learning journey. Thanks for that Greg. This vid .. I love your thorough reviews, bless you for all those like me that you help. Merry Christmas. Fwiw, I have a tractor, and pto generators run clean sine wave, and that is a welder\generator setup I have considered. A pro is that it can also be used to run the whole house or any other project I have. A con is that the pto generators are not as much of a discount as I would like considering that the actual power doesnt come from the device but from the tractor. Still, I like the pto generator idea very much. I also very much like the battery powered remote welders, and I know you have good things to say about the name brand one, but Im afraid the tech is still new and I might get caught in a situation where I didnt know what I should have known. Being the crotchety frugal sob that I am, I also like seeing those guys stick weld with an alternator, which is a nice half step above the emergency dual battery welding that you recently put out an excellent video on. Since Im not in a hurry I might just give that a try too. I love watching all you have to offer.
A pto on a tractor driving a generator head is a solid option. You can typically get real solid output of 10k plus running watts for pretty reasonable prices. The downside is you need a pto on equipment to run it lol. The battery powered units like the fronius I have is a very sweet setup, but I look at it more as an emergency welder than a practical setup. Sure you can power it with a super small sub 2400 watt generator to weld volume, but as it is you’re not going to burn many rods purely on battery. At 3k plus it’s a steep purchase. The smaller engine drives like the klutch and Vulcan are honestly a pretty solid option for “in the middle of nowhere” repairs with stick. They are fairly simple, seem to have good reliability, and for 1500$ with coupon more affordable than a lot of other options. I will do some videos comparing the options on welding in the middle of nowhere 😀👍
@@makingmistakeswithgreg Thanks Greg. To add one tidbit for anyone interested ... the manufacturer specs I have seen all have the ratio of necessary pto horsepower to running KW output of the generator at about 2:1, so, e.g., to run a 10 kw generator requires about 20 hp at the pto. That is well within the range of a lot of small to medium sized tractors.
Thanks for the good review. You should talk about your setup sometime as to how you do field work. I'm especially curious how you approach carbon gouging when you need both air and welder power simultaneously. It doesn't sound as though you use a air pak machine of any sort.
So for my employment I have a big blue diesel with an air compressor. It’s not common for me to air arc with it because I just bring things back to the shop instead. In my “side hustle” aka work I do outside of work I focus more on higher end tig work on aluminum and stainless, or repairing tow trucks. It’s not common for me to need to air arc, and I have a torch setup which works fine for gouging as needed.
Right now I am about 1/3rd the way through a very difficult welding program to gain a ton of certification (already did state structural and working on pipe certs). Upon completion I will likely be buying a big engine drive and doing more serious repairs so you will definitely be seeing some portable air arc and repairs in the future. The Vulcan in the video will be used for smaller repairs as a backup to my predator generator.
51:00 min what kind of warranty does it come with? You were talking about if it breaks what would you do I know the harbor freights come a long way with their warranties.
So the standard warranty is 90 day. When Vulcan first came out they did a longer warranty. The option is to buy a 2 year warranty for something like 3-400. I have no doubt the machine will handle the warranty period without much issue (2 year if bought). If you want a better warranty the esab ruffian has a 3 year warranty, and can be serviced by esab dealers. The issue with the harbor freight warranty on the Vulcan is I believe they have to make an attempt to fix it first, which harbor freight doesn’t have a repair shop. It could be interesting getting it repaired. Again I don’t
Think the Vulcan will have a failure with general use in that time, but for something that needs reliability the esab ruffian is probably a better option.
I wonder what an older Hobart wire feeder that is meant to run of an engine welder would do hooked to this setup. That might be an experiment worth watching.
I had to look that feeder up and sure enough that’s a pretty trick piece of equipment. So I would believe it would work since it can run on a CC (constant current) power supply. It would work on any D/C CC supply including a d/c power source like an older stick welder. Most modern feeders require a CV (constant voltage) power supply to work properly.
An other fantastic video sir!!
Please make sure change the oil after break in 🙂
Definitely will, and I picked up a magnetic drain plug to help out 👍
@allstarwelding has a video doing an oil change
As someone who was a manufacturer a long time go, I see differences in the way products are manufactured. People think it’s planned obsolescence. And, in a way it is, and at the same time, it isn’t. Thinking back, evolution of many products was much slower, say 50 years ago. We saw advances, but they were small and often not enough to spur companies to buy into them until their older equipment didn’t meet their needs, or just broke beyond reasonable repair. But more currently, advances come very quickly. This is true for a lot of industrial equipment that uses electronics and computers. So no one is interested in using equipment for 30 years anymore as it will be hopelessly useless well before then. So there’s little point in making the product last well beyond the time anyone will continue to use it and the used market makes the company nothing, really, so it’s a waste of money and would just increase the price of the product.
@melgross CNC Mills, Lathes, Plasma Cutters, Water Jet, 3D printing, etc. have all significantly evolved and, in many cases, are still evolving to reach the point of voodoo magic. Then there is the home shop ... I look at mine, and besides, the 3D printer is all old tech, the oldest primary motor driven machine being 1945 vintage, and most are of 1960's vintage. I like old cast iron machines that still work well. Long live Vintage Machinery !!!!
Great points. It’s rare to see anything with electronics being used beyond 5-10 years now because it’s more or less obsolete. The amount of development in the last 20 years alone is staggering. The hard part is the cost of keeping up is very high since your old stuff isn’t worth much and the new stuff costs more than the old. Only in cases where the new stuff is unreliable junk do prices of the old stay up lol.
Great videos! 90 day warranty- Over $400 for extended warranty 2yrs, so your better off buying the esab for only a couple hundred bucks more, your thoughts?
The 420 Predator in the welder looks to be a Loncin built engine. The 420 sold in the store that you showed in the video is a RATO built engine. For all practical intents and purposes, they should be interchangeable assuming that the generator on the welder doesn't require a tapered shaft.
Excellent info, thanks for chiming in on that. I knew some people who knew a lot more on the engines would have some ideas 👍👍
@@makingmistakeswithgreg If you can't get the proper engine from HF, the worst would be that you would have to disassemble the engine and take the crankshaft to a machine shop and have the taper cut onto the crankshaft. All in all, really not that difficult.
Bad welds on a welder, now thats actually pretty funny.🤣
I think a lot of viewers could have done a better job for sure lol. The factory definitely wasn’t using the welder itself to make them lol.
Greg, my neighbor bought one of these and we compared it to my 20 year old Miller Bluestar. It's a close copy of my old Bluestar. Will the Outlaw last 20+ years? Only time will tell.
The blue star is probably still possible to get parts for, at worst on eBay for used parts. The Vulcan will likely not be possible to repair within a few years (hard to say on parts availability). The thing is though, the modern blue star 185 is over $5k vs $1500 for the Vulcan. That’s a massive difference. Considering how good the Vulcan seems to weld I would spend the money on it and save the rest in the long run to get a bigger unit like a trailblazer. The capability of the sub 200a engine drives aren’t enough to justify 5k price.
Would your predator generator be clean enough to run an Everlast 210 tig?
I don’t have 220v at the house, and I might be able to get one from a friend. But so far I’m loving the everlast! I made my first string of non porous beads today on my lunch break 😂 I’m tracking my hours of practice and my goal is to get to 40hrs as soon as possible, lunch dinner, in the mornings… good hood time!
So the 210 everlast doesn’t have power factor correction however I believe the predator will still power it to 210a. My dynasty has no issue maxing out at 210a on the predator and its power factor isn’t perfect. Since tig operates at low voltage it’s far easier to get a lot of amperage out on a generator. And the way it loads a generator is far easier to handle than say striking an arc and hitting 150a immediately. Long story short I think you will hit 210a tig without an issue and atleast 145a stick.
Edit: glad you hear you want to practice a lot 😀👍. Expect to suck a lot and make some rough welds for a while. Just think of tig as an artists paint brush. You need to be smooth, consistent, and have patience. No doubt you can do it 👍
I love mine! I also swapped the twist plug outlet with the 3 prong outlet to not need an adapter for my mig. Also there are 2 generations of this welder. The first one has an auto choke system the new one doesn’t.
Interesting on the multiple generations. I figured there was only one since the online manual only showed 1 part number. Generally there will be multiple part numbers for them if there are a bunch of generations. Honestly the manual choke seems to work great so I don’t know that an auto choke is worth it. Glad to hear you like the machine, I am pretty impressed with how well it welds so far. I can’t wait to break it out on some portable jobs soon.
@ yea the first gen didn’t have co alert .
I’m interested in the effectiveness of the large reactor. Can you scope the input and output if you revisit the topic?
I definitely will. That reactor in the Vulcan is actually bigger than the one in the dial arc 250 I have. They work pretty good at smoothing out dirty d/c, I am sure it will show up nicely on a scope.
Wow this video was quite aptly timed, we had a power cut over the weekend so I had to get the generator out for the fridge/freezer and keep our net up. I though it would be a good opportunity to try and run on of my smaller welders on the geny just as a test for future reference, lets just say it didn;'t go well XD. 3000/3300 watt generator is not enough even for my smallest 10amp welder.
A quick question on 6010 rods, I don't think any of my welders have a high enough voltage to keep them lit, I'm reasonably proficient with 6011 rods and obviously other easy to run rods like 7016,7018, 7024, 6013 etc. The 6010s will only hold an arc if I have them with the flux physically touching the base metal, even then they often just spit and put out. I have managed to get them to run a decent bead on plate but anything more than that just turns into a mess, they dig really strongly but don't seem to want to wet out very well, they tent to just dig and leave a trail of weld that look like caulk shitting on wood. If I am really really careful and gentle I can get it to wet out ok but even on 3-4mm they tended to punch holes and gouge but not fill and wet out at all. I have been running them at the top of the specified range (WELD arc 3.2mm 6010, stated amps is 70-100) or even slightly higher. If running them in the middle or lower of there amp range they either wouldn't light or just stick or extinguish in a few seconds. Does this sound like a OCV or running voltage issues or am I the retard in this mess?. I am actually very happy with he performance of the 6011s I have but wanted to try 6010s as everyone on the net (especially north America) raves about them, took ages to get some and its just 2kg box for testing so I'm not really concerned if this isn't going to work but I had thought my either my TIG or new mig should be able to run them. I believe my MIG (xf252 250mp) actually has an OCV over 80volts but still strugling with them.
Anyway love the content, hope you have a great holidays and have a few more vids to drop over the break ;)
Regarding the 6010, this should clear it up: 6010 welds like a more aggressive 6011. Many welders won’t run it because they can produce more than 26-28 volts when welding. 6010 needs 30-33v to operate properly. What you described is exactly what happens when the welder can’t produce enough operating voltage. 6010 should have a wider arc and slightly wider bead than 6011, and if you cram it in tight you will produce a narrow chunky weld and typically a lot of undercut. The reason it stays lit with almost zero arc gap is due to the voltage being just under what the machine maxes out at. 60130/6011/7014/7018 all operate under about 26-28v so machines will run those. 6011 is 26-28 which is why some machines also struggle with 6011. If you can weld with 6011 you can weld with 6010, you just need a welder that’s capable of running it 😀. 6010 does produce significantly more penetration, freezes faster, and will run at lower amperage (to fill holes) than 6011. However it’s prone to undercut, blowing through material, and producing very rough looking welds. I like it a lot for repair work but 6011 is my go to on thinner stuff.
Very informational. Thanks.
No problem😀👍
I have a small question, my bester mig 200 is a great machine for the price, but i gound the controll knob to be way too sensitive, you have any hacks on this?
So I looked up that machine and located what I believe is its electrical diagram. What I found is that there is likely no easy way to change the resolution (how much it adjusts based on knob turn). Sometimes if the rotary encoder has an issue (it appears to have one of those) is defective or has issues it will jump more than expected. I would definitely call or email the company to see if yours is acting normal, it’s possible the encoder is just bad.
I’ve run a 180 amp MiG welder off of mine with no issues. No worries there so far
I still kind of want the Esab Ruffian, but this is definitely tempting.
There are similar parts on the ruffian (the internal welder might be different but external components are the same/similar). The main difference is the esab can run tools and weld, the Vulcan can’t do both at the same time. The ruffian has lower stick output. For the 1500$ with coupon the Vulcan is it’s way cheaper than the ruffian. Northern tool makes a klutch that has an attached spool gun for welding aluminum portably, and their standard unit is basically the same as the Vulcan. I am not sure what china based company is making all of them but there are atleast 7 ones that look very similar.
I can weld and run tools at the same time with my outlaw
If in the Peoples Republik of Kalifornia, make sure to drain gas out of the carburetor when not in use. The PRK gas is an extra special carburetor unfriendly fuel. For infrequent use, you may be able to switch to a propane carburetor.
Definitely, having gas sit in it is not good for longevity. Makes me hope I drained my snow blower last year, I better make sure it starts 💀.
If you change the oil after burn-in and every 10 wk hour and/or not later that 6 month , I believe the motor will serve you for years to come.It is hard to see on the video , but vibrations would be my concern . There are some heavy ring cores , and even glue at the bottom is often not enough.
The vibrations to me seem like they are from the engine hunting at idle with no load on it. Once it has any load it smooths right out. The engine and generator are rubber mounted and don’t seem to transfer much to the frame, it’s just when the rpm is a bit unstable with no load the top can rattle.
Does it run 6010 rods well enough to do a open root weld?
I didn’t do an open root with it but I have no doubt it would. Generally what kills open root welds is voltage, many welders might run 6010 with a tight arc on a flat plate and then open root needs more voltage and the arc cuts off. I ran 5p+ grey rods on it and had a really long arc without issue.
Hey Greg really appreciate ur videos n the time u take to explain why/how/what of things. I was lookin thru ur videos , I’dno if you’ve ever tested the arccaptain products MiG/tig welders ? Your experience n knowledge can be trusted compared to other people’s , I’ve only seen good reviews but wondering if you would ever review one ?
So I have a arc captain flux core welder that I have used for some things and am going to compare to the harbor freight titanium 125 and a yes welder. Some point soon I will get to it. My thoughts on arc captain are a mixed bag. They are extremely pushy on trying to get people to review their products (I have received no less than 12 emails from them offering free products). The reason so many people on the internet have reviewed them is because so many people got free products from them. It’s hard to get a reliable honest opinion on a product from someone who got it for free and probably wants to not talk bad about it. I am not motivated by doing product reviews on anything unless I bought it with my own money and I am not answering to anyone. Arc captain I guarantee would not want to work with me beyond one video lol.
When it comes to arc captain the mini flux core welder I have welds ok, but honestly the titanium 125 is better. The arc captain can’t be adjusted like a proper welder (voltage and wire feed can’t be adjusted separately) and the titanium can. So from the cheap welder perspective there are better options. The issue I have with their better options is from what I have seen they lie about specs. They will claim a machine is 200 amp but it’s actually 160a. Yeswelder is also notorious for this. They often claim things the machine can’t actually do. I don’t want to outright say that arc captain is trying to take advantage of people but it’s hard to not see it like that. That’s why you will see me suggest for people to buy a harbor freight titanium welder. The difference with the titanium line, is whatever the specs and box says it will do. They don’t lie about specs or capabilities. I know that the titanium welders weld the way a welder should weld, and don’t limit someone. Buying a 200a welder that only puts out 160a and has a bunch of weird quarks with settings might actually limit someone in their capabilities.
I have thought about buying one of arc captains higher end welders to do a review for people, but I hate to spend the channels money to more or less prove the point that everyone should focus on finding a better option lol.
So why would a separate inverter welder that plugs into the generator fair worse than the built-in inverter welder? Is there a component or ac/dc conversion between the generator and built-in welder that you could tap into to install an additional outlet that would safely run an external inverter welder?
Most inverter welders don’t have power factor correction which in simple terms means that some power that is flowing from the generator to the welder is reflected back at the generator. This causes a serious break down of voltage, a/c wave form, and will cause breakers to trip. In even simpler terms a welder might only consume 4000 watts of power to weld but the breaker sees the amperage equivalent of 7000. The internal welder in the machine was purpose built to run on a generator (likely that particular generator) therefore it doesn’t cause issues. Hooking up most inverter welder machines (which don’t have power factor correction) will have the above issues. The reason I say it’s in your best interest to use a transformer based machine is due to the fact the welder itself won’t be damaged by dirty power or fluctuating voltage like an inverter can be. A transformer machine output will lower as input power suffers but it won’t shut down or have issues. The only downside is running any welder (transformer or not) on a generator is generally not good for the generator unless the welder has power factor correction.
Thanks for the explanation!
What size of cable leads you would recommend for at least 40-50 feet long. I plan to leave my welder on a trailer.
The sheet I have from miller says #2 or #4 ga at 180-200a 60% duty cycle at 50 foot. Honestly I would run #4 if it’s good quality copper. It will be more flexible, lighter, and shouldn’t pose much issue handling 120a all day. If you plan on doing a lot at 150a then go to #2. Just make sure it’s copper and not copper clad aluminum. 👍
@@makingmistakeswithgregThat #4 is good for EACH lead being 50', correct?
@@makingmistakeswithgreg Thank You
Northern Tool sells one under their brand Klutch. It will Mig Tig and stick new one
It’s a pretty ingenious design to use the spool gun for mig. That opens up portable options for steel mig, aluminum, and even stainless. I am wiling to bet they basically packed in one of their multi process welders in the housing. It would save a ton in engineering costs.
Klutch has a multi-process welder version with a spool gun of this , same manufacturer. I think you loose adjustable Hot Start with their multi-process version. So you can have your MIG welder. Klutch also has one like this but no electric start.
You can not use the welder and gen at the same time. Doen not come with lift points. From what I can tell these are not a low THD generator , so it must have a beefy PFC.
The klutch units are quite interesting. The one with a spool gun is a novel idea since you can actually use both normal mig wire, aluminum, and stainless to weld with it. That gives a lot of capability for portable work.
I hope you can talk about real welder generators that can run 240V mig / flux machines.
Realistically a minimum generator to run a 200amp mig welder maxed out is around 7500 running watts, and that’s provided the welder has power factor correction. A vast majority of 200a wire welders will trip 30a 240 breakers and realistically you need to be in the 9k+ running watt class with a 40+ amp 240 breaker. There are ways around this but universally you need to have a serious generator to get 200a of mig output. Luckily you can run at reduced output without issue on many generator welders. A good example would be using a 200a machine at under 140a of output to weld thinner stuff, and stick welding anything over 3/16th.
you can use a wire feeder
I've got a 200 amp sincro. It's 390 cc . It's got a lot of grunt and I love it. Very heavy. Not good for weldi g indoors .but great for field
work. It's just an amazing but big piece of kit.
I looked up that because I wasn’t familiar with it. Looks like a sweet portable setup. Very simple and I bet very reliable.
My dad wants a genset, was going to give him my old Lincoln ranger 250gxt-I kinda like a backup to my backup,he was a machinist,not a welder
The ranger 250 is a solid reliable unit, that was the first engine drive I ever welded with. I wish they were as affordable as they used to be ☹️.
@@makingmistakeswithgregHey man...I TOTALLY agree with THAT!!! GOOD OLD Lincoln...A Miller well...ANYTHING was just a nice dream to a poor steel dog...🙂
I believe I'd have to pass on this and just get a generator like the Powerhorse 11,050 watt or the 13,000 watt to run my little 200 amp Everlast stick or Vulcan 215 mig along with some other power tools. I'm sure the Powerhorse will be just as loud as the Outlaw but they supposed to produce clean power (which is a plus in my book).
Thanks for the video.
If you already have welders buying a generator isn’t a bad way to go. That’s something I am going to talk about in a follow up video on portable welding I am going to do.
@makingmistakeswithgreg Even if I didn't already have those welders I think the generator would be the best option from a cost perspective. $1000 for a 11K watt generator and $350 for the Everlast 200STi and you're still under the price of that Outlaw. Or, get the Titanium 225 stick for $250. If they dont want a stick welder look at the Titanium and Vulcan migs (when on sale) and still be right at the price of the Outlaw.
Thanks again for all the vidoes.
The welder part of that looks like the stick welder 225 titanium for 250.00 interesting…
I need to reference the internals of the 225 (I opened one up on video) because I thought the same thing. It does have some extra components and power factor correction which the 225 doesn’t, but something really reminded me of the 225. I am sure they custom designed it for the generator. It definitely welds unlike most inverter welders. I would have been super disappointed if it didn’t run 6010.
The Amico Arc 200 has Fantastic Specs and if true could possibly be the Best Bang for yor Back! The New version Claims power factor correction and fan on demand. The only draw back i see is it does not have a dedicated Tig mode.I think it could be the Answer to those who want Esab rogue performance (stick wise) On a Budget!
Looked at the amico's power requirements and it doesn't seem very efficient if it has PFC.
@tsl7881 It says it has a PFC of 0.93 I have not tested this claim though.
.93 is a more humble claim. If it actually has it. Like you said, need someone to test it and not get sent a free one or a sales commission code where they can't say anything bad about it. I've seen tests on Yes welders claiming a PFC of 1. Ha Ha.
I just paid 825 for the rogue, then it went on sale for 600 a month later. Esab claims it can run on just about any generator that has stable power. It may be like the welder in this vulcan.
@@tsl7881 Yeah So many Fluff Reviews out there.( Not Greg) I just purchased the Arc 200 have not put it through its Paces yet. I am in Canada worked out to about 300 CDN. The rogue 180 is 1200 here we get screwed on everything. I bought it because it can run 6010 and has arc force control
It doesn’t take tig to get penetration, just knowing how to weld
😆👌...Now THAT is a WELDERS answer!!! Sweet.
Finally got my power station in the mail. It ran the rogue 200 with 3/32 7018 at 90A ok after I turned the hot start and arc force down to zero. It sometimes overloaded the inverter when I struck the arc with them both on 3. The rogue 200 seems to have a big starting spike around 40-50A that I think is causing my problems, because after the arc starts, it stays around 20-22A pretty consistently . Here's a quick clip I took while running a bead. th-cam.com/video/uRm5WaGE9k4/w-d-xo.htmlsi=h4WoJVibLl8xKRjq
The inrush will generally be pretty substantial on many welders due to how much current is demanded when an arc is struck. I am impressed you got 90a out of it on that. 7018 at 90a out on 120v input is a minimum 2400 watt demand when running plus the starting spike. The welder typically has a perfect power factor and is 88-90% efficient which is amazing. Because of that it’s fairly easy to predict how much power you need to run it. Just take the output amperage setpoint (say 90a) and multiply that by 24 (for 24volt) for 7018 and by 30 for 6010. That number (90x24 7018= 2160) then gets multiplied by 1.10(which represents 90% efficient) and you get the actual loading of the welder. So a 7018 at 90a and 24v multiples by 1.1 equals 2376watts. Very few welders are capable of that level of efficiency.
A trailblazer has computer boards . now the older bobcats and Hobart champion don’t have computer boards.
They do, but atleast they are available as replacement parts. The actual way the Trail Blazers work is going to be a more reliable for the long term from a making of welding current standpoint. Although the newest ones with LCD displays make me wonder.
It would still run 6011
Yep, I am sure it would weld 6011 perfect since 6010 ran so well. 6011 needs less voltage than 6010.
Ur getting a generator, the welder is extra
What was the total cost? 🤷🏾♂️🤔
1500 US dollar in
Paper money plus gov fee called TAX
30% duty cycle is 3minutes of weld time!🤬🤷🏾♂️🤔
That’s at 195a which for portable repairs nobody welds at. At 120a for a 7018 1/8th the duty cycle is basically 100%. Most stick welders in the 160-200a class have 30-60% duty cycle at 120a so for all practical purposes the machine will exceed most smaller stick welders. For repair work I mostly use 1/8th 7018/6010 and 3/32 7018, which those you could weld literally non stop without hitting duty cycle.
That leaves you 7 min to watch the slag peel, take some shots for Instagram/ grind out bad spots, tend to burns you might got and if you still have time left maybe prep the next weld...
@@makingmistakeswithgreg That's also at what's required for the duty cycle testing. IIRC it's 103 degrees F. Most of the time under regular conditions the actual duty cycle before the machine overheats and shuts off is a much longer period of time.
By myself I used to never come close to the 25% duty of the old buzz box, until I bought a needle scaler, then I could clean slag real fast. Maybe cleaning welds was always a method to slow you down. A lower duty cycle is not a problem with stick, but MIG or TIG you can run a long beads. Getting the Klutch version with the MIG gun maybe you would have to watch out.
The 420 in the store will NOT work for a replacement engine. All generators use a tapered shaft crankshaft and the one in the store uses a straight shaft crank. You can swap out the crank in the store one with a tapered one and be golden.
Excellent to know, thanks much for sharing that detail. 👍👍
McMaster Carr has taper shaft adapters to go from generator head to straight shaft engines. We use them for repower when the onan goes out in a miller Bobcat.
@@josiahwales4736that’s good to know!
It's also easy enough to remove the crankshaft, have the taper turned on it, and you'll be good to go.
You do a lot of talking ahead of yourself!🤬🤦🏾♂️😱
And I am right most of the time too 😅
You do great!!
you do alot of bitching and whining. Such an ingrate !