Thank you for you hard work Ryan! When I want to know broad code I go to mike holt when I want to excel in specific codes I go to your Chanel every time!
I have brought up the exception with the state of Wisconsin regarding 376 and the exception in 310.15 in the past. They did not allow the exception to be used in the (more stringent) rule of 376 to 30 ccc. I started another email with the link to your video to get this talked about again within Wisconsin Dsps. I personally believe the exception allows for 31 current carrying conductors to have no ampacity adjustment as long as the exception rules meets the requirements of such conductors. This in regards to 16:15 in your video. Thanks Ryan! Hopefully Wisconsin will see this until then we will not be able to put up a wireway above a panel
love your channel watch everything you put out. on that note. the 4 gang box make up you were using as an example looks to be that the red wire in the 3 wire cable IS in fact not a 3 way but more likely a switched outlet or a fan so that being said that wire would still count. Keep up the great work!
At 16:15 the amperage on the 12/2 NM cables is initially stated as, "regular ampacity is 30A". However, NEC 334.80 limits the ampacity for type NM cable to 60*C, which is 20A, and even with the caveat that regardless of "ampacity and adjustment calculations...the final derated ampacity does not exceed that of a 60*C rated conductor", it is still 20A. So the starting basis for the bundling adjustment appears to be incorrect. The same calculation would yield an adjusted ampacity of 8A. Which would be quite sufficient if the typical branch circuit load is all residential style LED recessed lighting. If I have missed something please let me know. :)
Is there a quantifiable way to determine if a load is considered linear vs nonlinear? Such as a harmonic distortion percentage, or something in particular to look for on an oscilloscope? Because it seems like by strict definition, all loads other than incandescent lighting and ohmic heating, are nonlinear to some extent, even if the harmonics are minimal.
I agree, it isn't perfectly defined. With today's equipment the total harmonic distrortion on a given circuit is so much less than in years past, I can't help wonder if it is a "real" issue (as it relates to counting the neutral).
Dude, winner video. The nec went insane in the 2000 to now time frame and I believe the authors are finally saying enuff. On a different subject, you mentioned a high leg system, which I equate to 120/120/220v power. The weirdness that is electricity is if you connect a two pole breaker between a 120 phase and the 220 phase you get an output of 207v. How??? I have asked senior electricians and electrical engineers for years how this works and no answer. Could you explain it? I would really appreciate it.
Yes. When the neutral is a mandatory part of the return path, that cannot be nullified by balancing the loads, it has to be counted. Like you see on phase-to-neutral 2-wire loads, and "open wye" single phase loads derived from two phases of a 3-phase grid.
@@RyanJacksonElectrical so can we put any range unbalanced system. ? For example A =45amp, B= 55 Amp and C =83 amp. And I have 9 type of this unbalnced 3 phase 5 wire system. I am rotating phase between each other system but any system can be turned off due to fault etc. Do not know what would be impact on customer side source supply side and voltage variation with unbalnced load. Can you please guide me
How do I size a pull can that requires a 4 inch emt that's used for data cable.. I don't have the category or type yet.. I understand the OD part and circular mills but I've only used circular mills on regular 120v through 480v. If I have a given number EX. 100 category 5 / 4 pair type utp.. I've been reading that cat 5 dosnt like more than 25 lbs of tension.. How can I size a pull can and what equation is need..
Circular mils is a measure of how much metal is in the wire. You need the area of both the metal and non-metal. Use the overall OD of the cable. If the cable is non-circular, the largest OD is what matters, as if the entire cable filled a circle equal in diameter to the cable's largest OD. Calculate the corresponding area via A = pi*OD^2/4 for each cable. Add it up. That is what gets limited to generally 40% of the raceway area. This applies for feeders, branch circuits, service conductors, and data cable conduits.
Can ANYTHING in the LINE side of a GFCI receptacle cause it to trip? NOTHING connected to the load side. I've had 3 different receptacles connected to this circuit. It is a home run to breaker panel.
Do you have one GFCI which protects 2 more receptacles downstream? The capacitive current, caused by voltage to ground, will be different in the hot, (120V to ground) than the neutral (maybe 1-2 V to ground). On a long enough circuit, perhaps 100 ft, this might cause enough imbalance to trip the upstream GFCI. A high voltage spike on the hot will make it more likely.
For the hole, that is correct. In fact, I made a proposal to delete that requirement because this exception would always remove it. Instead, they added language indicating that my exception can't be used! :D
@@RyanJacksonElectrical Thank you for your response and all you do. Your knowledge is priceless. I have learned more than you could imagine from watching your videos over the years. Keep up the great work it is much appreciated!
I respect your advice moreso than most NEC code guys, however, (there is always a however, huh?) you say at the beginning that if you are in an older than 2011 codebook we need to get a newer one. I love that, and I agree to that, but in Indiana (where I live) we still test in the 2008 codebook and have to refer to Indiana amendments. So..... it seems to me that every state should always be up to date with the latest codebook within 6 months of any new publication. I am old school when it comes to many things that I feel is better, such as using rigid conduit and EMT for residential. It is better in many ways, but the code allows for NM cable, etc. I have seen so many homes done very sloppy with NM cable which leads me to believe that when they came out with NM cable, more homeowners did the work instead of licensed and/or experienced Electricians. That in itself is very dangerous! Nothing in this world (rules or no rules) will change that in the future from happening. Not saying DIY'ers are all bad, but just watching a video doesn't account for everything in a proper manner. Anyway, Ryan, I enjoy your videos and I appreciate your efforts in keeping us all updated. Continuing education is, and will always be, the best way to keep those of us who want to be up-to-date with knowledge where we prefer tp be. God bless you and keep up the great work. You are very appreciated . Just wish the states would be the same across the nation. Can you, if you can, please put out a video to help us understand why every state doesn't want to comply the same so there is a standard we all need to comply with? I think that we may all be surprised by what we may learn from your knowledge on this subject.
Thank you for you hard work Ryan! When I want to know broad code I go to mike holt when I want to excel in specific codes I go to your Chanel every time!
Thanks Dan!
Thank you for doing these and making them available. Subscribed.
I had the pleasure of listening to your lecture at Griffen Electric awesome presentation with real world pictures thank you.
Ryan this was extremely helpful for me today. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and expertise.
Your videos should be used for Electrical Contractors continue education all over the country, very good, thank you.
Thanks!
Wow this chanel is awesome. Thanks Ryan! Why are there so few subscribers?
I probably need to post more often and more predictably. My schedule is just really crazy right now.
Thanks The way you put everything was easy to understand and helped me understand bundling,CCC and cross sections
I have brought up the exception with the state of Wisconsin regarding 376 and the exception in 310.15 in the past. They did not allow the exception to be used in the (more stringent) rule of 376 to 30 ccc. I started another email with the link to your video to get this talked about again within Wisconsin Dsps. I personally believe the exception allows for 31 current carrying conductors to have no ampacity adjustment as long as the exception rules meets the requirements of such conductors. This in regards to 16:15 in your video. Thanks Ryan! Hopefully Wisconsin will see this until then we will not be able to put up a wireway above a panel
310.14 (A)(2) exception in 2020 code. We are still on 2017 actually just started
Go over their head. They are 100 percent incorrect.
love your channel watch everything you put out. on that note. the 4 gang box make up you were using as an example looks to be that the red wire in the 3 wire cable IS in fact not a 3 way but more likely a switched outlet or a fan so that being said that wire would still count. Keep up the great work!
I don't remember, I took the pic a long time ago.
Ryan; You the man! Loving your videos.
Thanks, Mr. Jackson.
Thank you sooooo much for what you are doing. It helps me a lot to understand.
You're so welcome!
At 16:15 the amperage on the 12/2 NM cables is initially stated as, "regular ampacity is 30A". However, NEC 334.80 limits the ampacity for type NM cable to 60*C, which is 20A, and even with the caveat that regardless of "ampacity and adjustment calculations...the final derated ampacity does not exceed that of a 60*C rated conductor", it is still 20A. So the starting basis for the bundling adjustment appears to be incorrect. The same calculation would yield an adjusted ampacity of 8A. Which would be quite sufficient if the typical branch circuit load is all residential style LED recessed lighting. If I have missed something please let me know. :)
Ampacity adjustment and temperature correction are always based on the actual ampacity. See 334.80.
@@RyanJacksonElectrical That's what I thought, thanks!
Now im confused.......
Thanks for this great video... would you please do a video, how size the ground wire in a circuit..
Muy bien gracias
Is there a quantifiable way to determine if a load is considered linear vs nonlinear? Such as a harmonic distortion percentage, or something in particular to look for on an oscilloscope? Because it seems like by strict definition, all loads other than incandescent lighting and ohmic heating, are nonlinear to some extent, even if the harmonics are minimal.
I agree, it isn't perfectly defined. With today's equipment the total harmonic distrortion on a given circuit is so much less than in years past, I can't help wonder if it is a "real" issue (as it relates to counting the neutral).
Excellent presentation, Ty...
6:30 That wire nut on the grounds is way overloaded LUL ;) max 6 #14. 6:30
all jokes aside.. thanks for the informative vids as always!
Dude, winner video. The nec went insane in the 2000 to now time frame and I believe the authors are finally saying enuff.
On a different subject, you mentioned a high leg system, which I equate to 120/120/220v power. The weirdness that is electricity is if you connect a two pole breaker between a 120 phase and the 220 phase you get an output of 207v. How??? I have asked senior electricians and electrical engineers for years how this works and no answer. Could you explain it? I would really appreciate it.
Thanks for the compliment. I show a high-leg at about 11:15 into this video, which explains the voltages th-cam.com/video/O-1S93wQN5Q/w-d-xo.html
Is ampacity adjustment required if two cables pass through the same hole in a wooden stud, assuming that the two cable are not otherwise bundled?
It depends on the type of cable. For NM and AC cable, yes. See 334.80 and 320.80
hey Ryan would you consider "stack its" as bundling?
If we are talking about the same thing, they provide a separation between cables. My answer would be "no," it is not bundling.
Thanks for the education on the code.
Great video.
So in hidsight when the nuetral carries the Full load, is when its counted?
Yes. When the neutral is a mandatory part of the return path, that cannot be nullified by balancing the loads, it has to be counted. Like you see on phase-to-neutral 2-wire loads, and "open wye" single phase loads derived from two phases of a 3-phase grid.
How much Percentage is allowed for unbalnced load as per NEC ?
Percentage in voltage variation after unbalanced load
@@vishalgulati5847 There really isn't a requirement in the NEC that addresses that.
@@RyanJacksonElectrical so can we put any range unbalanced system. ? For example A =45amp, B= 55 Amp and C =83 amp. And I have 9 type of this unbalnced 3 phase 5 wire system. I am rotating phase between each other system but any system can be turned off due to fault etc. Do not know what would be impact on customer side source supply side and voltage variation with unbalnced load. Can you please guide me
How do I size a pull can that requires a 4 inch emt that's used for data cable..
I don't have the category or type yet..
I understand the OD part and circular mills but I've only used circular mills on regular 120v through 480v.
If I have a given number EX. 100 category 5 / 4 pair type utp..
I've been reading that cat 5 dosnt like more than 25 lbs of tension..
How can I size a pull can and what equation is need..
Circular mils is a measure of how much metal is in the wire. You need the area of both the metal and non-metal.
Use the overall OD of the cable. If the cable is non-circular, the largest OD is what matters, as if the entire cable filled a circle equal in diameter to the cable's largest OD. Calculate the corresponding area via A = pi*OD^2/4 for each cable. Add it up. That is what gets limited to generally 40% of the raceway area. This applies for feeders, branch circuits, service conductors, and data cable conduits.
Can ANYTHING in the LINE side of a GFCI receptacle cause it to trip? NOTHING connected to the load side. I've had 3 different receptacles connected to this circuit. It is a home run to breaker panel.
Do you have one GFCI which protects 2 more receptacles downstream? The capacitive current, caused by voltage to ground, will be different in the hot, (120V to ground) than the neutral (maybe 1-2 V to ground). On a long enough circuit, perhaps 100 ft, this might cause enough imbalance to trip the upstream GFCI. A high voltage spike on the hot will make it more likely.
As I understand 334.80 says you can not use that exception for that example pictured, of nm cables, because you would have to fire caulk that hole???
For the hole, that is correct. In fact, I made a proposal to delete that requirement because this exception would always remove it. Instead, they added language indicating that my exception can't be used! :D
@@RyanJacksonElectrical Thank you for your response and all you do. Your knowledge is priceless. I have learned more than you could imagine from watching your videos over the years. Keep up the great work it is much appreciated!
I'm confused. For testing purposes, do we count the neutrals regardless of the situation?
No
@@RyanJacksonElectrical thank you for the response
Badass, thanks man
I respect your advice moreso than most NEC code guys, however, (there is always a however, huh?) you say at the beginning that if you are in an older than 2011 codebook we need to get a newer one. I love that, and I agree to that, but in Indiana (where I live) we still test in the 2008 codebook and have to refer to Indiana amendments. So..... it seems to me that every state should always be up to date with the latest codebook within 6 months of any new publication. I am old school when it comes to many things that I feel is better, such as using rigid conduit and EMT for residential. It is better in many ways, but the code allows for NM cable, etc. I have seen so many homes done very sloppy with NM cable which leads me to believe that when they came out with NM cable, more homeowners did the work instead of licensed and/or experienced Electricians. That in itself is very dangerous! Nothing in this world (rules or no rules) will change that in the future from happening. Not saying DIY'ers are all bad, but just watching a video doesn't account for everything in a proper manner. Anyway, Ryan, I enjoy your videos and I appreciate your efforts in keeping us all updated. Continuing education is, and will always be, the best way to keep those of us who want to be up-to-date with knowledge where we prefer tp be. God bless you and keep up the great work. You are very appreciated . Just wish the states would be the same across the nation. Can you, if you can, please put out a video to help us understand why every state doesn't want to comply the same so there is a standard we all need to comply with? I think that we may all be surprised by what we may learn from your knowledge on this subject.
At 10:45 the beau teal imbalance of 20amp 15 amp and 10 amp 5 is the difference so 5 x 1.73 =8.65 who needs that big equation
Try that with 10, 10, and 0.
Non linear loads absolutely result in current on the neutral in three phase wye systems. If you used a true RMS ammeter you would definitely read it.
Nice video master
Well done
Wireways vs auxiliary gutters
Amazing
I think counting the 24" raceway and the gutter together.... Is shady.... Should be separate is my vote ...it's not the same ...
Not sure what you mean.