3rd vid about same subject I'm watching on diff channels and yours was by far the best. Thanks a lot! The drawings were super helpful in understanding what I'm doing. Had no clue that the 80 step is supposed to be longest and 220 shorter. Every tip was relevant. You nailed it!
Thank you for your video! This was exactly what I was looking for and you explained the reason why you don’t jump grits perfectly! Thank you for these tips.
Fantastic, Jonathan! That's Exactly how I do it. 😊 And as I don't have a orbital sander, just a vibratory one, I always sand in the direction of the grain. 😊 Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
@Alastair Moore lolol-...you turn to me and say something sexy like “is that it?” I know what you’re trying to say girl, you’re tryin to say ‘aw yea, that’s it’.
Seeing that PS33 120 grit gave me flashbacks when I used to make that stuff. Still the reason why my iPhone can’t read my thumbprints. Klingspor paper is still the best.
Great info thanks, I will say though that the mesh sand paper by Norton doesn’t stay on “hook loop type” very well. I think there isn’t enough felt or whatever it’s made of. Look forward to your vid on this. Thanks again
I haven't had that problem with too much pencil lead on the wood but then again I have only done it for birch and maple so it might differ on different wood species. I use a fat 5.6mm lead that is easy to apply and won't run out any time soon. I do use the harder lead hb that has less graphite in it than the bold leads. I use the abranet sanding mesh and absolutely love it. Lasts longer and the dust collection is amazing. Does skipping certain meshes make any sense? There are 60,80,100,120,150,220,320,400 and so on. It seams to me that 100 and 120 would be interchangeable if you are just going to go up to the next grit anyways. Same as 320 and 400. 320 might be the highest you go if your are going to finish it afterwards but working with epoxy, you sometimes have to sand the epoxy and to get it back to mirror shine, you sand up to 2k and then use buffing compounds after that.
This is a great video, Jonathan, and I have a question, if I may? I’m looking to get a random orbit sander for Christmas and was wonder what you views are on pad savers (appears to be a bit of soft foam which is the same diameter as the sanding disc). Are they worth it please? I’ve seen reviews saying people have damaged the bottom of their sander without it. Could be just their inexperience though. Thanks in advance as always and I hope you and your family are well.
Back in the 8th grade, (eons ago), our wood shop teacher asked the class which removes MORE material, coarse grit or fine grit sandpaper. Those that answered said coarse grit., to which the teacher then said wrong; fine grit does because there is more sanding material contacting the surface of the wood. Coarse grit may remove material FASTER, but fine grit removes MORE. You start sanding with coarse grit and work your way up to a finer grit, otherwise you would be there all day sanding your project with fine grit paper to get the surface smooth.What he said has stuck in my head for for 48 years.
@@LadyBovine I'm just reiterating what my wood shop teacher stated, although I did attempt to test it out once by timing myself while sanding with two different grits to see how much sawdust was produced. It wasn't a very scientific test, and I failed to get any real results for at least two reasons. I had no way of weighing the sawdust that was produced by each grit, and I skipped too many grits because I didn't have anything between 100 and 220.
Your teacher was trying to make a point, but the teacher was wrong. Take your sander, put on some 60 grit and some 220 grit and see after 2 minutes of sanding the same spot, which leaves a deeper hole. Use calipers to measure. The lower grit removes more material AND it does it faster. Yes the 220 grit will contact more surface area of the wood, but it doesn't remove more.
How much pressure do you put on the Sander? For instance on a piece with different layers of paint you want to sand of. I feel like putting pressure and staying for longer on a more "stained" piece. Is that correct?
This is almost better than Taco Tuesday’s 🌮....okay, I lied 🤥 I don’t like tacos as much as my wife, and she doesn’t like these videos as much as me, so it’s a wash! On the real, I do look forward to these videos. As a beginner it is usually helpful knowledge that even if I knew a little bit, I still usually learn more.
Can i ask ,about sanding epoxy resin. I see they start lower and go higher but if u dont have much material to remove probably better to start higher. I just saw at some high grits they used water ,so i do not know if i start from 1000 grit to 4000 if i need to put water or not. Can u help?
Question, when cutting a piece off wood do you guys cut right at the line or just a little before the line, that you measured. Because of that 1/8 (roughly), that the blade is going to take off?
180/220 if you're putting a film finish over it. There's a common misconception that you need to polish it. Try it with sanding to 220. The film makes is crystal clear and fills in the scratches.
In the autobody business sandpaper companies recommend no more than a 100 grit jump. So, theoretically, you could do 80, 120, 220, 320. I know wood is softer than body filler or paint, but would you agree with this?
Definitely not. Don't go more than 30-40 grit at a time with wood. Trust me its way faster to do the 5 I use in the video than to do 80 then 180. Its possible but you'll sand 5 times longer to remove the pencil
Thanks for the video! When sanding to remove material, I find that the earlywood gets sanded away faster leaving the latewood high and makes the face uneven. Any tips to avoid this?
You might want to try replacing your low grit sanding with scraping, either with a card scraper or cabinet scraper. If you like the scraped surface, leave it like that, or finish off with 180 or 220.
@@katzmosestools Are you sure? I also have been doing what Rolly does, and it seems to work well. And the math works, sort of. Each jump in grits goes up by about 50%: 120 is 80 * 1.5 150 is 120 * 1.25 (ok, but it's close to 1.5) 220 is 150 * 1.47 320 is 220 * 1.45 If you add 180 in there, the jumps from 150 to 180 and 180 to 220 are pretty tiny, only about 20%. But I haven't actually done the experiment to see how long it takes with and without the 180 grit.
Be aware of grit contamination between paper transitions - that’s one of the causes of the micro swirlies you can get from your ROS. Another cause is cheap paper, reliable grit consistency can suffer with low quality stuff
Depends on which purpose you are sanding for, and which material you are sanding. There are industries where it makes sense to go up to 1000 grit, and there are some niche scenarios where 4000 grit is also used. Just saying...
I don't care that you went over 2 minutes, you said all that you could in a short time. A trick that I have had success with is the sand with the grain (by hand) with each grit before you progress to a finer grit. This is more effective in the finer the grits, in fact if you do this with 80 grit do it with a light hand as deeper scratches happen with the grain.
Amateur .. I go to 400 after the second paint of layer, and it gives an absolutely incredible look on painted plywood. Like .. it's so nice that you don't even want to touch it. It looks like plastic and it feels like satin. It's hard to explain how nice it looks on trims, cabinets and stuff like that.. parts of some furniture. I even go to 600 or 800 if I have the time.. it starts begin glossy, almost reflective at this point
The pencil “trick” you describe is a little off for best results. Specifically your comment about not going back over sections where the pencil mark gets removed. The point is to make the surface smooth and flat. For best results you should make your passes in a consistent speed pass. If any pencil marks remain, those are low spots. If you go back and concentrate more time on those it will just make them lower. Instead you should put down another set of pencil marks and do a full pass again. Keep repeating that process until you remove all pencil marks in your pass. That way you know it is smooth and flat and the full area has been sanded. It’s tempting to just go back and hit the leftover pencil marks but resist the temptation and you will see the difference in your final finish
Your board should be relatively flat at this stage so I was referring to not continuing in that area once the pencil is gone. You are correct if you're trying to get a board flat but when you get to the final sanding face your board should already be flat from your planer.
*Support What We Do at The Katz-Moses Store-* bit.ly/KMWstore20
Jonathan Katz-Moses - I want so many of the items in your store, but can I get a disabled person's discount? LOL
2 minute Tuesday in 3:18 - it's just a great value!
3rd vid about same subject I'm watching on diff channels and yours was by far the best. Thanks a lot! The drawings were super helpful in understanding what I'm doing. Had no clue that the 80 step is supposed to be longest and 220 shorter. Every tip was relevant. You nailed it!
I hope the intro is just always "welcome to 2-min Tuesdays, do we have an intro? Nope"
Thank you so much for explaining the different types of grits.
Thank you for your video! This was exactly what I was looking for and you explained the reason why you don’t jump grits perfectly! Thank you for these tips.
I stumbled upon your videos a while ago and I have never loved a channel so much, keep up the great work!
Fantastic, Jonathan! That's Exactly how I do it. 😊
And as I don't have a orbital sander, just a vibratory one, I always sand in the direction of the grain. 😊
Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
Tonight is 2 minute Tuesday with my wife!
L. O. L. !
It’s business time.. two minutes in heaven is better than.. one minute in heaven.
welly ftw best Song! 😂
@Alastair Moore lolol-...you turn to me and say something sexy like “is that it?” I know what you’re trying to say girl, you’re tryin to say ‘aw yea, that’s it’.
@@thepromrk it's business time
love the 2 minute videos. strait to the point!!!
Brilliant explanation and to the point. Thank you 👍👍
These videos are the best
Seeing that PS33 120 grit gave me flashbacks when I used to make that stuff. Still the reason why my iPhone can’t read my thumbprints. Klingspor paper is still the best.
What's this? An episode of Three-minute Thursday? On a Tuesday? Wow!
I've started to only use the mesh discs because of the longevity and dust collection. Looking forward to your brand review. - Chris
I used up to 220 grit on my cabinets and doors and they came out great. I agree you don't need more than that
Always great videos, I think 2 minutes Tuesdays should turn into 3 minutes Thursdays :)
Ah yes, my favorite series "Two(-ish) Minute Tuesday" 🤣
We're in quarantine - we got all day...
David Shearer thank you haha. I could be happy with some live streams!
Thank you, awesome video
The BEST intro is always just asking "Do we have an intro yet?....No?...Alright" haha.
I thought that was the intro.
Someone was watching Peter McKinnon in 2020! 😂 Thanks for the tips!
Thanks!
Thank you 😊
That's great help. Thank you
Nice video im going to use it to get the idea across to my students🙏🏿
I’m gonna wait a couple days to watch this video and just consider it THREE MIN THURSDAY
This was so helpful. Thank you
Can I paint over a 80 grit sanded wood? I saw that the darker you want the paint the deeper the sand needs to be.
Have you done video on mesh sandpaper?
Great info thanks, I will say though that the mesh sand paper by Norton doesn’t stay on “hook loop type” very well. I think there isn’t enough felt or whatever it’s made of. Look forward to your vid on this. Thanks again
Abranet by Mirka doesn't have any issue staying on hook and loop, give it a try.
I skip 1 grit every time so it doesn’t take ages. For example i sand from 120 to 180
Could you do a video on how to properly use nailers/brads in woodworking?
Good tips Bud👍
Thanks for sharing that
What should I use for restoring a cutting board. Any suggestions, what steps to take?
I haven't had that problem with too much pencil lead on the wood but then again I have only done it for birch and maple so it might differ on different wood species. I use a fat 5.6mm lead that is easy to apply and won't run out any time soon. I do use the harder lead hb that has less graphite in it than the bold leads.
I use the abranet sanding mesh and absolutely love it. Lasts longer and the dust collection is amazing.
Does skipping certain meshes make any sense? There are 60,80,100,120,150,220,320,400 and so on. It seams to me that 100 and 120 would be interchangeable if you are just going to go up to the next grit anyways. Same as 320 and 400.
320 might be the highest you go if your are going to finish it afterwards but working with epoxy, you sometimes have to sand the epoxy and to get it back to mirror shine, you sand up to 2k and then use buffing compounds after that.
So one grit is a rock. Got it.
I nominate the video to be the first in a transition to three minute Thursday!
Thanks for the info! 😃👍🏻👊🏻
Thanks, JKM!
I use the mirka mesh discs. Great on filler timber whatever really.
Top tip, if you watch this on 1.25x speed then he doesn't go over 2 mins...
Comment of the month contender.
Lol
We can just call this: "no intro-two(ish) min tips and tricks". All jokes aside great information as always. ❤️
which grit should I stop sanding for a stain application, thabks
This is a great video, Jonathan, and I have a question, if I may? I’m looking to get a random orbit sander for Christmas and was wonder what you views are on pad savers (appears to be a bit of soft foam which is the same diameter as the sanding disc). Are they worth it please? I’ve seen reviews saying people have damaged the bottom of their sander without it. Could be just their inexperience though. Thanks in advance as always and I hope you and your family are well.
Do you start with 80 and go up to 220 or vise versa?
You should have called it Three-Minute Thursday ;)
Most of the surfaces off of my tools are in better shape than 80 grit leaves them. I almost always start with 120 -> 150 -> 180 and done.
What about speed selection on the ROS?
Back in the 8th grade, (eons ago), our wood shop teacher asked the class which removes MORE material, coarse grit or fine grit sandpaper. Those that answered said coarse grit., to which the teacher then said wrong; fine grit does because there is more sanding material contacting the surface of the wood. Coarse grit may remove material FASTER, but fine grit removes MORE. You start sanding with coarse grit and work your way up to a finer grit, otherwise you would be there all day sanding your project with fine grit paper to get the surface smooth.What he said has stuck in my head for for 48 years.
This doesn't click in my brain at all. Maybe I'm stupid, but this sounds like a game of semantics
@@LadyBovine I'm just reiterating what my wood shop teacher stated, although I did attempt to test it out once by timing myself while sanding with two different grits to see how much sawdust was produced. It wasn't a very scientific test, and I failed to get any real results for at least two reasons. I had no way of weighing the sawdust that was produced by each grit, and I skipped too many grits because I didn't have anything between 100 and 220.
Your teacher was trying to make a point, but the teacher was wrong. Take your sander, put on some 60 grit and some 220 grit and see after 2 minutes of sanding the same spot, which leaves a deeper hole. Use calipers to measure. The lower grit removes more material AND it does it faster. Yes the 220 grit will contact more surface area of the wood, but it doesn't remove more.
I can't seem to find many posts on disk sizes
What are the pros and cons of using 150mm vs 125mm random orbit sander?
How much pressure do you put on the Sander? For instance on a piece with different layers of paint you want to sand of. I feel like putting pressure and staying for longer on a more "stained" piece. Is that correct?
How do you feel about the color abrasive pads? Some people use those for fine sanding/finishing. I've never gone past 220 grit myself
Which ones?
The red, gray, and white rectangular ones. I see people use them after sand paper. For fine sanding/buffing
Nice Video about sanding! By the way, what kind of a watch are you wearing?
If you use a hand plane you get a better finish and faster too.
This is almost better than Taco Tuesday’s 🌮....okay, I lied 🤥 I don’t like tacos as much as my wife, and she doesn’t like these videos as much as me, so it’s a wash! On the real, I do look forward to these videos. As a beginner it is usually helpful knowledge that even if I knew a little bit, I still usually learn more.
Can i ask ,about sanding epoxy resin. I see they start lower and go higher but if u dont have much material to remove probably better to start higher. I just saw at some high grits they used water ,so i do not know if i start from 1000 grit to 4000 if i need to put water or not. Can u help?
I want to pick up a dovetail jig, but what's the difference between 6:1 and 8:1?
8:1 is typically for hardwood and 6:1 is typically for softwood. Cheers
@@katzmosestools looks like I'm picking up an 8:1, thanks for the reply and keep crankin out awesome content!
Question, when cutting a piece off wood do you guys cut right at the line or just a little before the line, that you measured. Because of that 1/8 (roughly), that the blade is going to take off?
Check out my video called Superior Accuracy in woodworking
Cheers
Thanks
Do you use the pencil trick for each grit?
Yes
What grits for deck?
What is the highest necessary grit for getting a polish on resin?
180/220 if you're putting a film finish over it. There's a common misconception that you need to polish it. Try it with sanding to 220. The film makes is crystal clear and fills in the scratches.
In the autobody business sandpaper companies recommend no more than a 100 grit jump. So, theoretically, you could do 80, 120, 220, 320. I know wood is softer than body filler or paint, but would you agree with this?
Definitely not. Don't go more than 30-40 grit at a time with wood. Trust me its way faster to do the 5 I use in the video than to do 80 then 180. Its possible but you'll sand 5 times longer to remove the pencil
Thanks for the video! When sanding to remove material, I find that the earlywood gets sanded away faster leaving the latewood high and makes the face uneven. Any tips to avoid this?
Use hardwoods. Thats a softwood problem.
You might want to try replacing your low grit sanding with scraping, either with a card scraper or cabinet scraper. If you like the scraped surface, leave it like that, or finish off with 180 or 220.
@@katzmosestools that's what she said!
I'll see myself out...
In my progression, I go from 150 to 220 because that what comes in the packs I buy. Should I also include 180 just to decrease time?
Yes
@@katzmosestools Are you sure? I also have been doing what Rolly does, and it seems to work well. And the math works, sort of. Each jump in grits goes up by about 50%:
120 is 80 * 1.5
150 is 120 * 1.25 (ok, but it's close to 1.5)
220 is 150 * 1.47
320 is 220 * 1.45
If you add 180 in there, the jumps from 150 to 180 and 180 to 220 are pretty tiny, only about 20%. But I haven't actually done the experiment to see how long it takes with and without the 180 grit.
Be aware of grit contamination between paper transitions - that’s one of the causes of the micro swirlies you can get from your ROS. Another cause is cheap paper, reliable grit consistency can suffer with low quality stuff
Plus no dust collection
I think you should change it to 3min Tuesday
WHO needs a intro... 😉
Depends on which purpose you are sanding for, and which material you are sanding.
There are industries where it makes sense to go up to 1000 grit, and there are some niche scenarios where 4000 grit is also used. Just saying...
2 minuteish Tuesdays
Peter McKinnon!
I don't care that you went over 2 minutes, you said all that you could in a short time. A trick that I have had success with is the sand with the grain (by hand) with each grit before you progress to a finer grit. This is more effective in the finer the grits, in fact if you do this with 80 grit do it with a light hand as deeper scratches happen with the grain.
Thank you, Jimmy Kimmel 😅. Good vid.
no 100?
2 Moment Tuesday.
(moment = 90 seconds)
Amateur .. I go to 400 after the second paint of layer, and it gives an absolutely incredible look on painted plywood. Like .. it's so nice that you don't even want to touch it. It looks like plastic and it feels like satin. It's hard to explain how nice it looks on trims, cabinets and stuff like that.. parts of some furniture. I even go to 600 or 800 if I have the time.. it starts begin glossy, almost reflective at this point
Maybe consider 3 Minute Thursday... 😂
Katz-Moses- Hopefully I kept it under two minutes.
Narrator- he never keeps it under two minutes.
Jimmy Kinmel voice
Rather do 3min and explain more :)
Has anyone told you that you sound like Jimmy Kimmel?
Ok, call it 2 to 3 minute Tuesday. Great video though.
I'm going to start calling it 1 minute Tuesdays just so it annoys more people.
@@katzmosestools :)
Jonathan Katz-Moses Maybe you should call it 8 inches Tuesday
.5 mechanical pencil manufacturers rejoice.
Thanks Jimmy Kimmel!
The pencil “trick” you describe is a little off for best results. Specifically your comment about not going back over sections where the pencil mark gets removed. The point is to make the surface smooth and flat. For best results you should make your passes in a consistent speed pass. If any pencil marks remain, those are low spots. If you go back and concentrate more time on those it will just make them lower. Instead you should put down another set of pencil marks and do a full pass again. Keep repeating that process until you remove all pencil marks in your pass. That way you know it is smooth and flat and the full area has been sanded. It’s tempting to just go back and hit the leftover pencil marks but resist the temptation and you will see the difference in your final finish
Basically the same idea as when you use the pencil marks when planing or jointing
Your board should be relatively flat at this stage so I was referring to not continuing in that area once the pencil is gone. You are correct if you're trying to get a board flat but when you get to the final sanding face your board should already be flat from your planer.
Well that was 3 minutes of my life I’ll never get back 👎
I like 2-minute Tuesday not having an intro. Get in, get out.
why do you sound and kinda look like Jimmy Kimmel?