I used to do this commute from South Harrow to Victoria. The best place to change from Picadilly to District is at Hammersmith as the train is on the adjacent platform and you don't have to endure all the district line stops between Acton Town and Hammersmith. On the way back however, change at Baron's court just before Hammersmith if you want to be guaranteed a seat.
Those are the same two stations we used when we did those changes, except that we were changing from D➡️P at Hammersmith and P➡️D at Barons Court because our home station was District-only.
Those cross-platform interchanges are a boon to anyone travelling with heavy luggage from Heathrow to Liverpool Street, as I used to have to do every so often. P to D at Barons Court, then D to C(ircle) at South Ken. Sure beat trying to negotiate the single-interchange route via Holborn.
"You are the quadrupling to my double track" - I've been watching these for years and I'm always trying to guess what the metaphor will be - that's the first time I've got it right 😂😂
I recall the first I realised that something was up on 7/7 was the eastbound Piccadilly line train that stopped at Turnham Green where I was waiting to head to Hammersmith…
The Hammersmith to Acton Town section on the Underground is one of the best because you get this rare distinction of non-stopping trains on a line which happens to be one of my favourites, though TfL should think about proposing to stop all Piccadilly Line trains at Turnham Green
Scouser here , worked and lived west London for 6 months in 2017 . Absolutely loved Turnham Green , a great shop near the station sold some lovely Fred Perry and Levi’s .
I read somewhere that once the new tube trains enter service on the Piccadilly line, they will make Turnham Green an all-day stop as well. Whether they’ll actually do that, though, is another matter.
@@KasabianFan44They had considered making Turnham Green an all day stop for the Picaadilly before, indeed at one time they had Piccadilly trains stopping all day on Sundays, but this didn't last. As the junction for the Richmond and Ealing Broadway branches of the District, this could have some additional use there.
The Metropolitan Line also skips a fair few stations between Harrow-on-the-Hill and Finchley Road, although there is a facility should they ever need to stop there. There are also Fast and Semi-Fast Met trains from/to Amersham that don't always stop at every Met designated Station.
The Piccadilly is always in a hurry. The District is much more laid back. 👍 As for “Not to any kind of scale I mean seriously look at this thing!” ……. Bloody brilliant 😂
And the South Acton branch isn't even on the correct side (not to mention the fact that it's joined on in the wrong direction - oh, I see I just mentioned it ...).
I've been feeding pidgeons in the same locations only in the last three years. Very fond of them, their remembering me, their funny attitude and behavior when they feel safe ....Anyway I unusually was near Waterloo mainline and went to catch a train on a quiet Sunday recently to change at Clapham Junction and then two stops home. Long train, few people, halfway down I plus a young couple got on a carriage a few minutes before departure. A pidgeon started to walk around and the couple were amused and concerned. Doors closed, train left the station. I had not known they do this until later. I thought it would feel trapped and as the next stop would be Clapham Junction it might struggle to get back in fading light. Luckily the train stopped at Vauxhall first, not far away. It/ he / she knew what it was doing I realised and had read the boards better than I did. It waited for the forward double door to open but was concerned by a couple outside and me walking slowly towards it expecting to usher it out. It flew to the luggage rack, but knew it had time. I held my bent arm up to it and walked toward the door in a non threatening way, but it then flew back through the door above the heads of people getting in. It knew what it was doing all along, and probably had a seaon ticket for years. At 64 this only dawned on me then. I knew they have homing skills but i thoght it wouldn't realise where it was. Please vote for this as the most boring and pointless comment ever. I just never knew they did this on purpose.😆
The line was originally an LSWR branch that ran through Hammersmith grove road (next to the H&C Hammersmith Station) to Kensington Addison Road (Now Olympia). The District added its own tracks alongside the LSWR tracks in 1910 or so, and then the LSWR abandoned its tracks in 1916. That made them available for the Piccadilly in 1929. District trains ran a very limited service on the Hounslow branch to 1964.
Towards the end (if not earlier), the District service to Hounslow West was rush-hours only, and non-stop between Hammersmith and Acton Town - which occasionally led to a race between a similarly non-stop Picc train on the parallel track! I well remember c1962 standing on the westbound District platform at Ravenscourt Park around 5.00pm and seeing a Q stock train for Hounslow dash through, with whistle blasting a warning. (Nearly as enjoyable as seeing a Jinty and its goods train coming back from West Kensington to Cricklewood, via South Acton, which had to work hard up the bank from Hammersmith.)
5:29 Unless you’re travelling at rush hour from one of the skipped stations to one on the Piccadilly line, where all the trains are too crowded to change comfortably by Hammersmith (which would be alleviated if you could start at your own station instead), a problem I encountered every day when I lived at Turnham Green and travelled to Russell Square for college 2018-2020! (Indeed, there were genuinely times it was easier to travel backwards to Acton Town just so the trains would be less full!)
Also, side note: I definitely remember mentioning the subject of this video just a few weeks ago (on the Stamford Brook video). Was this one already in the works then, or did I prompt it‽
Loved watching the piccadilly line trains whizzing through Turnham Green and past the stopped District line trains when I was there back in June. Reminded me of what being at somewhere like Carnforth must have been like at one time
I was puzzled the first time I rode the Piccadilly Line out past Acton Town - at Northfields the platform was HIGHER than the carriage floor! Finding out that this line was once part of the District Line made sense.
As a regular commuter on the Acton Town to Hammersmith section of the Piccadilly line, the trains can really whack up some speed. As you enter the Hammersmith section travelling east from Action Town there is a dip where the tracks enter a tunnel before Hammersmith station, thus the trains have to slow down. The fun part is where you get a driver who doesn't begin to brake to the last possible moment and you can feel yourself wondering if the train is going to come off the rails! Some drivers seem to leave it very late...many a time I've wondered if one day there's going to be an accident there.
@@barryredhead5704 I was on the 1938 stock special from Amersham to Harrow on the Hill today, and though I wouldn't think it got to three figures, it certainly seemed faster than the Met train I started on to get to Amersham. I think 'a fair old lick' would be the best way to describe it. It's good to know that an 83 year old tube train has still got a bit of oomph.
Several years ago, they slowed the train speed between Acton Town and Hammersmith - this was done mainly to reduce the number of fatalities at Turnham Green, where the trains would be doing 60mph+ and the trains in both directions were right by the platforms. Now they're limited to a more sedate 35mph.
@@nabbitLine speed was never reduced between Acton Town and Hammersmith. Also, '73 stock cannot achieve 60mph on level track. Line speed is 45mph which is easily achieved.
My one big question which remains still is why do Piccadilly trains stop sometimes as Turnham Green when all the other stops (or non-stops) are much more black and white? (Or blue and green?)
In Santiago, several metro lines have alternate (Green and Red Routes) itineraries for rush hours, skipping certain stations and meeting at line combination stations or at the busiest stations of the line.
It was always a bonus travelling from Uxbridge to Holborn in the 90s going to and from work. Quite exciting - express tube trains. Same happens on the Met.
Now you have an idea how things go on Chicago's North Side "L" system, along with Philadelphia's Broad Street Subway(the only underground 4-track line outside of New York City), and quite a number of subway lines in New York City.
The fast and semi-fast Met Line services also have their pros and cons... many's the time I've missed a train to Watford at Harrow On The Hill but caught it at Moor Park by hopping on the next fast Amersham service! Mind you, if you're trying to get to Northwick Park from Harrow and don't realise you've caught a semi-fast train, it's a long way back from Finchley Road!
Are there still platform predictability problems at Moor Park? I seem to remember that the outbound fast - outbound local wasn't always a x-platform interchange. This would have made your truck of getting a fast to Moor Park and connecting to the overtaken slow to Watford a bit difficult.
@@quantisedspace7047Ah yes, it pays to know which set of doors to stand by to be as close as possible to the underpass entrance! It can be tight margins!
Yes, a "skip-stopping" tale is always welcomed! :D I'm at Acton Town fairly often, and wondered why District trains only had the outside platforms where the Picc line can use all 4?
When they stopped District Line trains going to Hounslow, they were able to raise the track so that at Boston Manor there was no longer a big step down into the train. But. Raising the track meant District Line trains could no longer pass under the bridges.
The Piccadilly line can use all 4 roads on approach to Acton Town. However, in recent times the signalling systems East of Acton Town have been upgraded, so nowadays Piccadilly line trains can only use the Eastbound and Westbound fast tracks to travel between Hammersmith and Acton. You would no longer see a Piccadilly line train hurtling along the Westbound or Eastbound local at say Stamford Brook
As a child it was fun being on a Piccadilly Line train, overtaking a District Line train at certain stations. The only other line that does this is Metropolitan vs Jubilee between Harrow and Baker Street (but thats a whole other video)
Thanks to that 6 (7?) part BBC documentary for the 150th anniversary, I always have a clip of that driver saying "perfect, premiere Piccadilly" playing in my head when I read about the Piccadilly line!
Been on the odd picc that called at all stations years ago. Also went on a met from Baker Street that called at all Jubilee line stations from Finchley Road to Wembley Park. Crossing over sfter Finchley and back just before Wembley. Yonks back
The Santiago Metro in Chile uses skip-stop on sone of its lines - there are some common stations but otherwise every other station is red or green and each colour group of stations is skipped by every other train
I can think of one sporting venue that would have been furious if Gillespie Road had been closed. I suppose a parallel arguement would be the re-opening of York Road. TfL say that it will delay trains by something like 90 seconds, which is unacceptable, yet they are every couple of minutes at peak times. But it is there, and now in an area that has seen a lot of development in the last decade. I've always been told that Frank Pick and Charles Holden held different views regarding the Piccadilly's northern Extension to Cockfosters. Holden thought that 2 more stations might be needed and Pick didn't. However, it was decided to build (almost identical) ventilation buildings at Colina Road, Haringay and Nightingale Road in Wood Green, just to make it easier if Pick was wrong. I'd love that to be expanded on some day.
For many years Covent Garden station was closed on Sundays but the signalling was arranged to force trains to slow to 5mph. On one Sunday morning as I was working an eastbound train the describer was showing, "Arnos Grove. For non-stop stations change at Holborn". It was some forty years after non-stopping trains had been withdrawn from the timetable.
Yes, despite its close proximity to Leicester Square, it's amazing to think of it having once been closed Sundays now, considering the number of people using it since the Sunday calls began in the 80's.
@@ianmcclavin Transport planners in all modes face the problem of unintended consequences. Change the system and people will use it differently, so estimating how traffic patterns might change is always difficult.
A few people have already mentioned other metros where this is done around the world, but this is also done in Japan with a lot of lines. Rather, it's different types of train on the same line as opposed to different lines passing through the same stations. Some lines may only have local line trains that stop at every station, some also have express trains which skip anywhere between 10%-40% of stations, and then some lines also have special express trains (there are often different names) which can skip up to 70% or so of stations. Often if you're on a local line train, you may end up waiting at a station for a few minutes for the express to overtake. Between all the different lines and changing between local/express, sometimes it can feel like you're being juggled between trains. It's great efficiency though, and it's saved me countless hours over the years.
I live very close to Turnham Green station, and I always wished the Piccadilly line started to have Turnham green as a normal stopper as it will speed up my commute and help improve efficiency in my opinion, it will also be more useful to go to the centre of London.
Me too, especially the journey from Turnham Green to Hammersmith which could easily be non-stop on the Piccadilly as opposed to multiple stops with the district
3:56 No problem at all with the lack of consistency in scale, Jago. But you did confuse me by rotating the South Acton branch (called something like the "kettle line", on account of being able to do the return trip before the kettle boiled for the crew's tea) by 180 degrees.
Whenever I see Holloway Road, I always think of Siddy Holloway, knowing the story of how she chose her stage name. Another interesting video for us non-tuber, TH-camrs.
I have been to London once only, and as I went to Heathrow with the Piccadilly, there was some sort of service-disruption, so our train stopped at all stations on the way. So my only experience with the Piccadilly is the train stopping at Chiswick Park, Stamford Brook etc. :).
Until the Elizabeth Line was built to get to Heathrow Airport from Harold wood without having to go up and down stairs with suitcases. Was to go to Stratford cross platform to Central Line then to Mile End to Cross Platform to District Line then to Hammersmith to Cross Platform Piccadilly Line. So knowing where you can cross platform for interchange is handy to know
Cross-Platform interchanges need to be marked on the map. The ones I know of are Stockwell, Euston, H+I, Krapy Rubsnif, Baker Street, Mile End, not to mention all the stuff with branches within the same line.
Im old enough to remember the District Line using the 1938 Stock and operating on Christmas Day but from Upminster it stopped at Hornchurch,Dagenham East,Becontree,Barking Nd Upton Park where we got off to walk to my Aunts house not far from Woodgrange Park.
Sounds like a pre-cursor to lift roulette - whereby you try to get a lift where you want without pressing a button. Like a terminus, the only guarantee is ground (ie. '0') - or '1' on an elevator... 🧐
I've often thought, when i used to go to Heathrow once in a while, how useful it would have been (certainly before Heathrow Express) for a limited stop service, calling at just two or three stations, all the way to Heathrow, although of course the lack of four tracking and/or passing loops at stations would have made that very difficult
Before the Piccadilly was extended from Hounslow West to Heathrow, there was a plan hatched to build a completely new line to Heathrow, I think from Northfields (where the 4-tracking ends), and cut across in a more direct route to Heathrow (not clear what would happen to the 'old' line). How far the plans progressed, or how serious, I know not. Also, the rather large money question came up - obviously it was far too expensive...
The situation as a West Londoner is disappointing. It is always presented as that it is not economical to stop at Turnham Green. But why does Barons Court get served but not Turnham Green? Both stations have similar ridership, Turnham Green slightly smaller but something which probably could be remedied with a slightly better service. Turnham Green is in an area poorly served by the Piccadilly line but has strong connections to bus routes as well as it interchanges with the Richmond branch, Barons Court is in a region which already is well served with Hammersmith and Earl's Court nearby. Turnham Green could make a decent interchange. Each Destination on the western end of both lines are served with 10 minute waits with the exception of Uxbridge (20 minutes) and Northfields (A bit weird in service pattern). This means a person travelling from Richmond to Rayners Lane could either go via Turnham Green and Acton Town, potentially adding 10 mins to their wait time or take a train 1.3 miles out of their way adding 10 mins to your journey time and taking you into the busier Hammersmith. If stations like Turnham Green were served by the Piccadilly line, it would provide a convenient interchange for West London. We also no longer have the South Acton shuttle, partially because it wasn't used much but also because you get a good service from Turnham Green to Gunnersbury. Turnham Green can be a good gateway to get to the North London line, allowing for better interchange between the Piccadilly and the North London line
Super stuff, Jago. Like many others I've always wondered about the background behind the express Piccadilly Line trains at the western reaches, and why there are quadruple tracks as far as Northfields. Thanks for putting the flesh on the bones of my initial limited understanding of this. This sort of information is always really interesting to learn about. On a similar subject, it would be great to learn of the express Metropolitan Line trains that run alongside the Jubilee Line trains from Finchley Road to Wembley Park, especially given the history behind the Jubilee Line and the preceding Bakerloo Line, and the Metropolitan Line itself, which ran from Stanmore. Come to think of it - given the District Line used to run to Shoeburyness, I wonder whether there's some shared history between the District Railway and whoever the precursors to the current C2C services were, as there are disused platforms at Bromley-by-Bow, Plaistow, Upton Park, East Ham, Becontree, and one of the Dagenham stations if I'm correct. 👍🏾 🌟 👏🏾 🚉 ❤
Those would have been the original platforms, long before the district line was added, there are some very good books 📖 about the history of the LTS/ C2C line.
I do wish that the Piccadilly Line would stop at Turnham Green all day, as it would improve connectivity for Richmond Branch passengers, who want to change from the District Line to the westbound Piicaddilly Line. It would also allow Richmond-bound passengers to use the express service and that would free up some seats on westbound District Line trains. The Picadilly Line trains could switch to going straighg through Barons Court non-stop instead, if they need to make up the time.
here's a little oddity: for whatever reason ravenscourt park station is setup to potentially have picc line trains stop there (the platforms and dot matrix displays and almost everything!!) but for whatever reason, there's rarely any picc line services to or from ravenscourt park... im guessing it might also be why services from turnham green are exclusive to specific times via picc line
National Rail services skip stations all the time. But at least you have a complete list of stations it does call at before you get on board. I wonder why the Picadilly line people didn't think of that.
There's nothing more frustrating than standing at Chiswick Park station without an upcoming District line train listed on the departures board, and having to face the impertinence of having a Piccadilly line train pass by every few minutes.
Interesting. I'm surprised Heathrow is not mentioned. I recall travel guidance about bypasses for the long commute from/to the airport, both for travellers and personnel.
If you think about it, the underground is an outlier: most train services skip stations at least some of the time and you have to check where the train is stopping.
I'd always assumed this was a hangover from the (Metropolitan) District Railway's plan to have an express tube from Earl's Court to Mansion House - the tunnels to the west of South Ken were after all build using those powers. I assume the plan involved non-stop trains to the west of Hammersmith and that those new lines were designed to link with the express tube tunnel.
Surprised you didn't add the upcoming plan to switch another district line brand to the pic line soon. You probably know but the plan is to remove the District Line to Ealing Broadway branch completely and have the Pic Line go there instead. This would allow a lot more district line trains to go to the Wimbledon and Richmond branches and as for Ealing Broadway the pic line will take over, which would also mean the Pic line will stop at Chiswick park all the time instead of the district line. This plan will be made possible when the new Pic Line trains are in service so there will be more of them overall, enough to send some to Ealing Broadway to then turn back into London. Something couldn't be more relevant to this video if you tried since it's the exact same thing mentioned in the video about to happen again and a change in where the pic line trains will stop at those stations. Deserves a Part 2 of the video imo.
@@adamfrankowski2768 if the District were to no longer run through Chiswick Park, then the Piccadilly could use its tracks. Slight issue with the platform height, as they are at surface stock height, not tube stock height, so track alterations would be needed.
@@CaseyJonesNumber1 Yes, and there would also need to be a new set of points in each direction to enable trains to transfer from the Piccadilly tracks to the current District tracks and vice versa.
This sort of complex stopping patterns thing is done on other systems. Sydney's suburban system is known for it, for instance. It probably feels unusual because, as you said, most Underground trains stop at all stations.
Some lines in Melbourne have a third track, and allows express (Skip stop ?) trains to pass stopper services. The Third track changes direction depending on time of day. Not to mention the Underground City Loop, which also changes directions depending on time of day. Mornings to get people IN to the city, Afternoons to get people OUT of the city. City to Footscray is 4 tracks, with the now 2 added tracks (Yes that makes 6) for the Vline Regional Rail which was needed in anticipation of the now being constructed Metro Tunnel so they needed to put Vline on to their own track to free up timetable slots on the track.
@@ChannelReuploads9451that’s how you do regional rail. NY decided to do a whole new terminal under GCT when tracks at the original terminal was underutilized and wasted 16B$ instead of $5B for the original proposal
when I first started working in the 1980s in London the underground has somewhat changed. Also, British Rail has also changed who here remembers Liverpool Board Street, Holborn Viaduct stations or The North London Line?
I hope Jago sees this. Once, just once, I caught a Piccadilly line train westbound from Ravenscourt Park. How did that happen? Years of occasionally googling the marvel turn up nothing.
I've occasionally seen Piccadilly trains on the slow lines, and rarely, stopping at the stations on those slow lines. Engineering works, stock movements are the usual reasons. I don't think there's are supposed to stop at those stations though.
I do recall riding a Piccadilly train into town from Ealing Common and on that particular day there was some issue with the District (delays elsewhere on the line, or perhaps strike action), and due to this the train additionally stopped at Chiswick Park, Stamford Brook and Ravenscourt Park. It was a nice bit of novelty to change up the otherwise monotonous commute hearing the automated announcement speak the names of stations you don't normally hear. Interesting that they had these announcements built into the computer for the rare occasion when the train must call at a station not officially on its map.
It was one of those moments that one tends to associate with childhood when everything in the adult world seems strange, but this time I was in my mid 20s and trying to navigate the tube during my first week of a semester abroad. I was in the full thrall of arrogance feeling like I understood all the zones and could get from Cockfosters to Kew Gardens and hit every Pret a Manger in between. But on this occasion I was on the Piccadilly line trying somehow to get to Knightsbridge to meet someone about some John Tenniel engraving that I almost certainly couldn't afford. When my stop came up... and didn't stop... I panicked. But no one else did. Everyone looked bored and distracted as they usually did on the tube. Then, at the next stop, everyone got out and followed the signs quite calmly to the crossover. I followed them, feeling carried along by the tide of folks "in-the-know." I felt very much like a dorky child missing only the note pinned to his coat saying "Please Send this Child to the Correct Platform, and wipe his nose." Oh the things you learn when you are only in your 26th year of life!
If the Piccadilly Line was built today, there would have been fewer stations built in Central London compared to the present line (mainly because it would likely be built to Elizabeth Line Standards), for example Leicester Square & Covent Garden being served by one station for example.
Turnham Green is my stepdad's son and his family's closest station. The lack of a train stopping may or may not have been enough to turn him green at times.
This little oddity makes my daily commute from Acton Town to Earl’s Court faster than when I took the district line from Chiswick Park to Earl’s Court ❤❤❤
The NYC subway used to run skip-stop during rush hour on 7th Ave. The 1 and 9 trains alternated stops. The Long Island Rail Road operates a leapfrog service. Trains make all stops along a stretch of the line and bypass all stops before that. Reducing the number of stops expedites the service.
Ive seen it suggested that with the new stock and signalling on the Piccadilly line that train might be able to stop at Turnham Green all day, without affecting the benefits of the express service between Acton and Hammersmith due to the increased acceleration and tighter head ways been trains.
The Piccadilly line was my first tube ride from Heathrow. Jet lagged we got on a train late on a Friday evening to find lots of party goers carrying their open drinks everywhere. Quite a festive atmosphere. Never saw so many people drinking on public transit as open liquor on transit was long prohibited in Canada.
I did wonder why the train didn’t stop at some stations as I travelled the whole distance on the Piccadilly Line all the way to Heathrow Airport. Just for a joy ride but not much joy when the noise levels became shocking 😅
I seem to remember a met line service in the 80,s that left uxbridge about 7.45 and after rayners lane ran non stop to finchly road or did i just fall alseep lol. Great vid as always jago
I am glad that there are quite a few options to change between Piccadilly and District. That has prevented difficulties a number of times for me so thank God for that.
I would love a quadrupled train track in North London and beyond. Having to.wait _thirty minutes_ for the correct train while allowing expresses through first is aggravating. Mind you, I'd like the tube to actually go somewhere in-between Cockfosters and Epping too, preferably directly, so...
@@quantisedspace7047 Judging by the headway's on the Superloop bus service they don't seem to be expecting many passengers. Certainly not enough to justify a train service.
Sort of convenient that the Hounslow branch was extended to Heathrow and so skipping makes the trip from Heathrow a bit less annoying. Which is where foreigners like me probably see this phenomenon for the first time.
As someone who used to live in Chiswick I absolutely hated that only District was an option to get to central London. My station was Turnham Green and It was frustrating to change on Hammersmith from or to piccadilly, adding so much more time to your commuting. Turnham Green this days is very busy station, especially rush hours and it would be perfect if Piccadilly stops there all day. District is not reliable, especially the Richmond bound, so there were some days when I had to wait for 10 min to get on the tube, sitting on the platform and looking at many Piccadilly trains slowly passing through the station. I know people from Turnham Green fighting for years to make Piccadilly stops there regularly.
So the Picadilly once did "skip-stop" operations? Certain lines in Chicago and Philadelphia used it until the 1990s and 2020, respectively, with trains marked as "A" or "B" (and stops A, B, or A/B to mean all trains), certain physical New York Subway "lines" effectively practice this, but with different "services", the most well known nowadays being the J/Z route (contrary to popular belief, that rapper "Jay-Z" did NOT take his name from this, even though he did grow up in the area) Even certain metro lines in Santiago, Chile, have skip-stop during rush hours (they have "red" and "green" trains, that only share "common" stations)
The Piccallydickally may be faster but what you gain in speed you lose in personal space, optimum body temperature and peace of mind. Also, it's a law of subterranean life that when you get to the bottom of the escalator at Earls Court you always meet head-on the human discharge from the Heathrow train you've just missed. The next two will be heading for Rayner's Lane and then Northfields. I think it's chaos theory or something, ie a butterfly has just flapped into a train in Sydney and had a really pleasant journey.
When I used to live near Tower Hill, I’d always use the easy interchange at Barons Court or Hammersmith to change to the Piccadilly when going to Heathrow (while btw google maps wants you to change at South Ken, annoying!) Often wondered about this too!
At the Heathrow border just east of Hatton Cross the train always slows. I was told that this was part of the agreement to cross the land and that the landowner still gets a fee for each train. Is this true ?
There was never a theatre train from Finsbury Park to Aldwych, if only because there is no connection at Holborn from the southbound main line to the branch. There was, though, a service to take theatregoers home from Aldwych to the norrhern suburbs.
😀 "quarupling to my double track." On another note, in the 1920s there were plans to have a *sextuplicated* -tracked line under 2nd Avenue in Manhattan (NYC) for about three miles. Another 2-3 miles immediately south of that section would have been quadrupled-tracked. The line would have featured Local (Stopping), Express (Fast), and Super-Express (Super-Fast?) services. Unfortunately the Great Depression ended those plans.
"By all accounts it was rather complicated and frustrating for passengers trying to figure out if they could actually get to their destination." New York Subway has entered the chat...
Indeed, the skipping of stations was celebrated in a 1928 farce called 'Passing Brompton Road'. The central character, Dultitia Sloane (wonderful name!!), lived near to the station and blamed her limited social life on the fact that every second train swept through without stopping!
I find that weird and fascinating on how the Piccadilly Line trains pass through stations between Acton Town and Earls Court. Whilst the District Line serves those stations and the District Line S7 Stock trains do stop at those stops between Earls Court and Acton Town.
Gotta love the punctuality of Jago Hazzard always on time.
If only we could get him to run the railways.
He does occasionally go out in solidarity
@@crapmallsWhat,like the RMT ?
@@jerribee1 I’d rather if he ran the country and we could let Mick Lynch (ain’t moving an inch) run the railways
And stays on track.
'The Piccadilly line actually has a history of this sort of thing.' Sounds like delinquent that should have been disciplined in its youth. 😂
I used to do this commute from South Harrow to Victoria. The best place to change from Picadilly to District is at Hammersmith as the train is on the adjacent platform and you don't have to endure all the district line stops between Acton Town and Hammersmith. On the way back however, change at Baron's court just before Hammersmith if you want to be guaranteed a seat.
Those are the same two stations we used when we did those changes, except that we were changing from D➡️P at Hammersmith and P➡️D at Barons Court because our home station was District-only.
Those cross-platform interchanges are a boon to anyone travelling with heavy luggage from Heathrow to Liverpool Street, as I used to have to do every so often. P to D at Barons Court, then D to C(ircle) at South Ken. Sure beat trying to negotiate the single-interchange route via Holborn.
That double-headed lamppost at 3:29 is actually giving out direction s and train times in Morse code.
Why not change at Acton Town on the way back?
@@SDCentralTSV Because our destination was before Acton Town, enough so that a BC changepoint made more sense.
"You are the quadrupling to my double track" - I've been watching these for years and I'm always trying to guess what the metaphor will be - that's the first time I've got it right 😂😂
I recall the first I realised that something was up on 7/7 was the eastbound Piccadilly line train that stopped at Turnham Green where I was waiting to head to Hammersmith…
As someone who’s been very confused with the District and Piccadilly crossover, I’m happy that I’m getting my answer now.
And part of what became the Picadilly anways was intended as "express" for the District.
The Hammersmith to Acton Town section on the Underground is one of the best because you get this rare distinction of non-stopping trains on a line which happens to be one of my favourites, though TfL should think about proposing to stop all Piccadilly Line trains at Turnham Green
Scouser here , worked and lived west London for 6 months in 2017 . Absolutely loved Turnham Green , a great shop near the station sold some lovely Fred Perry and Levi’s .
I read somewhere that once the new tube trains enter service on the Piccadilly line, they will make Turnham Green an all-day stop as well.
Whether they’ll actually do that, though, is another matter.
@@KasabianFan44They had considered making Turnham Green an all day stop for the Picaadilly before, indeed at one time they had Piccadilly trains stopping all day on Sundays, but this didn't last. As the junction for the Richmond and Ealing Broadway branches of the District, this could have some additional use there.
@@ste2442 But was it as good as "Stolen from Ivor"?
@@neilmorrell2819 haha St John’s market , great in the 80s .
Love the photo at 4:54 of the two old trains side by side.
I believe that is the old terminus at Uxbridge Belmont Road station. It’s now the Sainsbury’s car park (pretty much).
The Metropolitan Line also skips a fair few stations between Harrow-on-the-Hill and Finchley Road, although there is a facility should they ever need to stop there. There are also Fast and Semi-Fast Met trains from/to Amersham that don't always stop at every Met designated Station.
Similar to the C2C trains that stop at West Ham, Barking and Upminster whilst passing the District Line trains that stop between those places.
Skipping stations on the met is not as frequent as it used to be.
Harrow-on-the-Hill to Moor Park as well. I'm annoyed they never appeared on the tube map.
@@dee74razwell that’s understandable 💀
What about lords and swiss cottage tho
The Piccadilly is always in a hurry. The District is much more laid back. 👍
As for “Not to any kind of scale I mean seriously look at this thing!” ……. Bloody brilliant 😂
And yet it still takes over an hour to get from the city to Heathrow.
And the South Acton branch isn't even on the correct side (not to mention the fact that it's joined on in the wrong direction - oh, I see I just mentioned it ...).
I've been feeding pidgeons in the same locations only in the last three years. Very fond of them, their remembering me, their funny attitude and behavior when they feel safe ....Anyway I unusually was near Waterloo mainline and went to catch a train on a quiet Sunday recently to change at Clapham Junction and then two stops home.
Long train, few people, halfway down I plus a young couple got on a carriage a few minutes before departure. A pidgeon started to walk around and the couple were amused and concerned. Doors closed, train left the station. I had not known they do this until later. I thought it would feel trapped and as the next stop would be Clapham Junction it might struggle to get back in fading light.
Luckily the train stopped at Vauxhall first, not far away. It/ he / she knew what it was doing I realised and had read the boards better than I did.
It waited for the forward double door to open but was concerned by a couple outside and me walking slowly towards it expecting to usher it out. It flew to the luggage rack, but knew it had time. I held my bent arm up to it and walked toward the door in a non threatening way, but it then flew back through the door above the heads of people getting in.
It knew what it was doing all along, and probably had a seaon ticket for years. At 64 this only dawned on me then. I knew they have homing skills but i thoght it wouldn't realise where it was.
Please vote for this as the most boring and pointless comment ever. I just never knew they did this on purpose.😆
The line was originally an LSWR branch that ran through Hammersmith grove road (next to the H&C Hammersmith Station) to Kensington Addison Road (Now Olympia). The District added its own tracks alongside the LSWR tracks in 1910 or so, and then the LSWR abandoned its tracks in 1916. That made them available for the Piccadilly in 1929. District trains ran a very limited service on the Hounslow branch to 1964.
Towards the end (if not earlier), the District service to Hounslow West was rush-hours only, and non-stop between Hammersmith and Acton Town - which occasionally led to a race between a similarly non-stop Picc train on the parallel track! I well remember c1962 standing on the westbound District platform at Ravenscourt Park around 5.00pm and seeing a Q stock train for Hounslow dash through, with whistle blasting a warning. (Nearly as enjoyable as seeing a Jinty and its goods train coming back from West Kensington to Cricklewood, via South Acton, which had to work hard up the bank from Hammersmith.)
5:29 Unless you’re travelling at rush hour from one of the skipped stations to one on the Piccadilly line, where all the trains are too crowded to change comfortably by Hammersmith (which would be alleviated if you could start at your own station instead), a problem I encountered every day when I lived at Turnham Green and travelled to Russell Square for college 2018-2020!
(Indeed, there were genuinely times it was easier to travel backwards to Acton Town just so the trains would be less full!)
Also, side note: I definitely remember mentioning the subject of this video just a few weeks ago (on the Stamford Brook video). Was this one already in the works then, or did I prompt it‽
👍 Travelling backwards in order to have an easier overall journey is an underrated and commonly overlooked travel strategy.
@@regkray One which is not always understood by ticket inspectors.
Loved watching the piccadilly line trains whizzing through Turnham Green and past the stopped District line trains when I was there back in June. Reminded me of what being at somewhere like Carnforth must have been like at one time
I was puzzled the first time I rode the Piccadilly Line out past Acton Town - at Northfields the platform was HIGHER than the carriage floor! Finding out that this line was once part of the District Line made sense.
As a regular commuter on the Acton Town to Hammersmith section of the Piccadilly line, the trains can really whack up some speed. As you enter the Hammersmith section travelling east from Action Town there is a dip where the tracks enter a tunnel before Hammersmith station, thus the trains have to slow down. The fun part is where you get a driver who doesn't begin to brake to the last possible moment and you can feel yourself wondering if the train is going to come off the rails! Some drivers seem to leave it very late...many a time I've wondered if one day there's going to be an accident there.
@@barryredhead5704100mph? They were either gullible, or winding you up! 😂
@@barryredhead5704 I was on the 1938 stock special from Amersham to Harrow on the Hill today, and though I wouldn't think it got to three figures, it certainly seemed faster than the Met train I started on to get to Amersham. I think 'a fair old lick' would be the best way to describe it. It's good to know that an 83 year old tube train has still got a bit of oomph.
Several years ago, they slowed the train speed between Acton Town and Hammersmith - this was done mainly to reduce the number of fatalities at Turnham Green, where the trains would be doing 60mph+ and the trains in both directions were right by the platforms. Now they're limited to a more sedate 35mph.
@@nabbitLine speed was never reduced between Acton Town and Hammersmith. Also, '73 stock cannot achieve 60mph on level track. Line speed is 45mph which is easily achieved.
@@MrFookface thats true.. max ive managed to hit is in the low 50s and thats going downhill.
You could use a pun for that station where those who do get off at Turnham Green got envious of those thus turning them green lol 😂
My one big question which remains still is why do Piccadilly trains stop sometimes as Turnham Green when all the other stops (or non-stops) are much more black and white? (Or blue and green?)
In Santiago, several metro lines have alternate (Green and Red Routes) itineraries for rush hours, skipping certain stations and meeting at line combination stations or at the busiest stations of the line.
It was always a bonus travelling from Uxbridge to Holborn in the 90s going to and from work. Quite exciting - express tube trains. Same happens on the Met.
Now you have an idea how things go on Chicago's North Side "L" system, along with Philadelphia's Broad Street Subway(the only underground 4-track line outside of New York City), and quite a number of subway lines in New York City.
The fast and semi-fast Met Line services also have their pros and cons... many's the time I've missed a train to Watford at Harrow On The Hill but caught it at Moor Park by hopping on the next fast Amersham service! Mind you, if you're trying to get to Northwick Park from Harrow and don't realise you've caught a semi-fast train, it's a long way back from Finchley Road!
Are there still platform predictability problems at Moor Park? I seem to remember that the outbound fast - outbound local wasn't always a x-platform interchange. This would have made your truck of getting a fast to Moor Park and connecting to the overtaken slow to Watford a bit difficult.
@@quantisedspace7047Ah yes, it pays to know which set of doors to stand by to be as close as possible to the underpass entrance! It can be tight margins!
I remember trying to guess platforms at Moor Park.
Tyler is in the night room.
Yes, a "skip-stopping" tale is always welcomed! :D I'm at Acton Town fairly often, and wondered why District trains only had the outside platforms where the Picc line can use all 4?
When they stopped District Line trains going to Hounslow, they were able to raise the track so that at Boston Manor there was no longer a big step down into the train. But. Raising the track meant District Line trains could no longer pass under the bridges.
The Piccadilly line can use all 4 roads on approach to Acton Town. However, in recent times the signalling systems East of Acton Town have been upgraded, so nowadays Piccadilly line trains can only use the Eastbound and Westbound fast tracks to travel between Hammersmith and Acton. You would no longer see a Piccadilly line train hurtling along the Westbound or Eastbound local at say Stamford Brook
As a child it was fun being on a Piccadilly Line train, overtaking a District Line train at certain stations.
The only other line that does this is Metropolitan vs Jubilee between Harrow and Baker Street (but thats a whole other video)
Arsenal By-The-Way sounds like a rural halt in Herefordshire
District Line stock up to and including the Q type had "Not stopping at" boards on either side of the doors.
Thanks to that 6 (7?) part BBC documentary for the 150th anniversary, I always have a clip of that driver saying "perfect, premiere Piccadilly" playing in my head when I read about the Piccadilly line!
Been on the odd picc that called at all stations years ago. Also went on a met from Baker Street that called at all Jubilee line stations from Finchley Road to Wembley Park. Crossing over sfter Finchley and back just before Wembley. Yonks back
The Santiago Metro in Chile uses skip-stop on sone of its lines - there are some common stations but otherwise every other station is red or green and each colour group of stations is skipped by every other train
I can think of one sporting venue that would have been furious if Gillespie Road had been closed.
I suppose a parallel arguement would be the re-opening of York Road. TfL say that it will delay trains by something like 90 seconds, which is unacceptable, yet they are every couple of minutes at peak times. But it is there, and now in an area that has seen a lot of development in the last decade.
I've always been told that Frank Pick and Charles Holden held different views regarding the Piccadilly's northern Extension to Cockfosters. Holden thought that 2 more stations might be needed and Pick didn't. However, it was decided to build (almost identical) ventilation buildings at Colina Road, Haringay and Nightingale Road in Wood Green, just to make it easier if Pick was wrong. I'd love that to be expanded on some day.
Such history, Thank you.
For many years Covent Garden station was closed on Sundays but the signalling was arranged to force trains to slow to 5mph. On one Sunday morning as I was working an eastbound train the describer was showing, "Arnos Grove. For non-stop stations change at Holborn". It was some forty years after non-stopping trains had been withdrawn from the timetable.
Yes, despite its close proximity to Leicester Square, it's amazing to think of it having once been closed Sundays now, considering the number of people using it since the Sunday calls began in the 80's.
@@ianmcclavin Transport planners in all modes face the problem of unintended consequences. Change the system and people will use it differently, so estimating how traffic patterns might change is always difficult.
0:25 - ‘No sleep til Hammersmith’
A few people have already mentioned other metros where this is done around the world, but this is also done in Japan with a lot of lines. Rather, it's different types of train on the same line as opposed to different lines passing through the same stations. Some lines may only have local line trains that stop at every station, some also have express trains which skip anywhere between 10%-40% of stations, and then some lines also have special express trains (there are often different names) which can skip up to 70% or so of stations. Often if you're on a local line train, you may end up waiting at a station for a few minutes for the express to overtake. Between all the different lines and changing between local/express, sometimes it can feel like you're being juggled between trains. It's great efficiency though, and it's saved me countless hours over the years.
The Japan system is quite fun, even if it can be confusing at times. You almost always have a quick way towards the city if you’re in a suburb
I live very close to Turnham Green station, and I always wished the Piccadilly line started to have Turnham green as a normal stopper as it will speed up my commute and help improve efficiency in my opinion, it will also be more useful to go to the centre of London.
I know your frustration. I used to live in Chiswick and hated that couldnt use Piccadilly from Turnham Green.
Me too, especially the journey from Turnham Green to Hammersmith which could easily be non-stop on the Piccadilly as opposed to multiple stops with the district
3:56 No problem at all with the lack of consistency in scale, Jago. But you did confuse me by rotating the South Acton branch (called something like the "kettle line", on account of being able to do the return trip before the kettle boiled for the crew's tea) by 180 degrees.
Ah yes! The scale factor of -100,00:1. Only Mr. Hazzard could get away with negative scale factors. 😁
Whenever I see Holloway Road, I always think of Siddy Holloway, knowing the story of how she chose her stage name.
Another interesting video for us non-tuber, TH-camrs.
I have been to London once only, and as I went to Heathrow with the Piccadilly, there was some sort of service-disruption, so our train stopped at all stations on the way. So my only experience with the Piccadilly is the train stopping at Chiswick Park, Stamford Brook etc. :).
Until the Elizabeth Line was built to get to Heathrow Airport from Harold wood without having to go up and down stairs with suitcases. Was to go to Stratford cross platform to Central Line then to Mile End to Cross Platform to District Line then to Hammersmith to Cross Platform Piccadilly Line.
So knowing where you can cross platform for interchange is handy to know
I would love to know how Mile End station got the Central Line trains there since I guess the District Line was built first.
@@hublanderuk new works program for extending Central from Liv Street and taking over some NE railway tracks
Cross-Platform interchanges need to be marked on the map. The ones I know of are Stockwell, Euston, H+I, Krapy Rubsnif, Baker Street, Mile End, not to mention all the stuff with branches within the same line.
Im old enough to remember the District Line using the 1938 Stock and operating on Christmas Day but from Upminster it stopped at Hornchurch,Dagenham East,Becontree,Barking Nd Upton Park where we got off to walk to my Aunts house not far from Woodgrange Park.
Sounds like a pre-cursor to lift roulette - whereby you try to get a lift where you want without pressing a button. Like a terminus, the only guarantee is ground (ie. '0') - or '1' on an elevator... 🧐
I've often thought, when i used to go to Heathrow once in a while, how useful it would have been (certainly before Heathrow Express) for a limited stop service, calling at just two or three stations, all the way to Heathrow, although of course the lack of four tracking and/or passing loops at stations would have made that very difficult
Before the Piccadilly was extended from Hounslow West to Heathrow, there was a plan hatched to build a completely new line to Heathrow, I think from Northfields (where the 4-tracking ends), and cut across in a more direct route to Heathrow (not clear what would happen to the 'old' line). How far the plans progressed, or how serious, I know not. Also, the rather large money question came up - obviously it was far too expensive...
The situation as a West Londoner is disappointing. It is always presented as that it is not economical to stop at Turnham Green. But why does Barons Court get served but not Turnham Green?
Both stations have similar ridership, Turnham Green slightly smaller but something which probably could be remedied with a slightly better service.
Turnham Green is in an area poorly served by the Piccadilly line but has strong connections to bus routes as well as it interchanges with the Richmond branch, Barons Court is in a region which already is well served with Hammersmith and Earl's Court nearby. Turnham Green could make a decent interchange.
Each Destination on the western end of both lines are served with 10 minute waits with the exception of Uxbridge (20 minutes) and Northfields (A bit weird in service pattern).
This means a person travelling from Richmond to Rayners Lane could either go via Turnham Green and Acton Town, potentially adding 10 mins to their wait time or take a train 1.3 miles out of their way adding 10 mins to your journey time and taking you into the busier Hammersmith. If stations like Turnham Green were served by the Piccadilly line, it would provide a convenient interchange for West London.
We also no longer have the South Acton shuttle, partially because it wasn't used much but also because you get a good service from Turnham Green to Gunnersbury. Turnham Green can be a good gateway to get to the North London line, allowing for better interchange between the Piccadilly and the North London line
Super stuff, Jago. Like many others I've always wondered about the background behind the express Piccadilly Line trains at the western reaches, and why there are quadruple tracks as far as Northfields. Thanks for putting the flesh on the bones of my initial limited understanding of this. This sort of information is always really interesting to learn about.
On a similar subject, it would be great to learn of the express Metropolitan Line trains that run alongside the Jubilee Line trains from Finchley Road to Wembley Park, especially given the history behind the Jubilee Line and the preceding Bakerloo Line, and the Metropolitan Line itself, which ran from Stanmore.
Come to think of it - given the District Line used to run to Shoeburyness, I wonder whether there's some shared history between the District Railway and whoever the precursors to the current C2C services were, as there are disused platforms at Bromley-by-Bow, Plaistow, Upton Park, East Ham, Becontree, and one of the Dagenham stations if I'm correct. 👍🏾 🌟 👏🏾 🚉 ❤
Those would have been the original platforms, long before the district line was added, there are some very good books 📖 about the history of the LTS/ C2C line.
I do wish that the Piccadilly Line would stop at Turnham Green all day, as it would improve connectivity for Richmond Branch passengers, who want to change from the District Line to the westbound Piicaddilly Line. It would also allow Richmond-bound passengers to use the express service and that would free up some seats on westbound District Line trains.
The Picadilly Line trains could switch to going straighg through Barons Court non-stop instead, if they need to make up the time.
here's a little oddity: for whatever reason ravenscourt park station is setup to potentially have picc line trains stop there (the platforms and dot matrix displays and almost everything!!) but for whatever reason, there's rarely any picc line services to or from ravenscourt park... im guessing it might also be why services from turnham green are exclusive to specific times via picc line
I was hoping to find out why there is a partial Piccadilly service through Turnham Green.
There is also an express station between Manor House and Turnpike Lane because they never quite got around to building a station at Harringay
I didn't mean express station - I meant express ....oh you know what I meant
National Rail services skip stations all the time. But at least you have a complete list of stations it does call at before you get on board. I wonder why the Picadilly line people didn't think of that.
There's nothing more frustrating than standing at Chiswick Park station without an upcoming District line train listed on the departures board, and having to face the impertinence of having a Piccadilly line train pass by every few minutes.
I’ve known it in my time for trains to bypass some stations but this has mostly been due to maintenance issues
Interesting. I'm surprised Heathrow is not mentioned. I recall travel guidance about bypasses for the long commute from/to the airport, both for travellers and personnel.
If you think about it, the underground is an outlier: most train services skip stations at least some of the time and you have to check where the train is stopping.
I'd always assumed this was a hangover from the (Metropolitan) District Railway's plan to have an express tube from Earl's Court to Mansion House - the tunnels to the west of South Ken were after all build using those powers. I assume the plan involved non-stop trains to the west of Hammersmith and that those new lines were designed to link with the express tube tunnel.
Surprised you didn't add the upcoming plan to switch another district line brand to the pic line soon. You probably know but the plan is to remove the District Line to Ealing Broadway branch completely and have the Pic Line go there instead. This would allow a lot more district line trains to go to the Wimbledon and Richmond branches and as for Ealing Broadway the pic line will take over, which would also mean the Pic line will stop at Chiswick park all the time instead of the district line. This plan will be made possible when the new Pic Line trains are in service so there will be more of them overall, enough to send some to Ealing Broadway to then turn back into London. Something couldn't be more relevant to this video if you tried since it's the exact same thing mentioned in the video about to happen again and a change in where the pic line trains will stop at those stations. Deserves a Part 2 of the video imo.
How can Piccadilly trains stop at Chiswick Park when the platforms aren't in the right places for this? Perhaps I'm missing something.
Ealing Broadway without District Railway trains? Unthinkable!
@@michaelmiller641 agree - the District has been at Ealing Broadway since 1879 - it would be unbelievable if it didn't go there any more!
@@adamfrankowski2768 if the District were to no longer run through Chiswick Park, then the Piccadilly could use its tracks. Slight issue with the platform height, as they are at surface stock height, not tube stock height, so track alterations would be needed.
@@CaseyJonesNumber1 Yes, and there would also need to be a new set of points in each direction to enable trains to transfer from the Piccadilly tracks to the current District tracks and vice versa.
This sort of complex stopping patterns thing is done on other systems. Sydney's suburban system is known for it, for instance. It probably feels unusual because, as you said, most Underground trains stop at all stations.
Some lines in Melbourne have a third track, and allows express (Skip stop ?) trains to pass stopper services. The Third track changes direction depending on time of day.
Not to mention the Underground City Loop, which also changes directions depending on time of day. Mornings to get people IN to the city, Afternoons to get people OUT of the city.
City to Footscray is 4 tracks, with the now 2 added tracks (Yes that makes 6) for the Vline Regional Rail which was needed in anticipation of the now being constructed Metro Tunnel so they needed to put Vline on to their own track to free up timetable slots on the track.
@@ChannelReuploads9451that’s peak direction express. NYC has 3 track in the outer boros for that service
@@ChannelReuploads9451that’s how you do regional rail. NY decided to do a whole new terminal under GCT when tracks at the original terminal was underutilized and wasted 16B$ instead of $5B for the original proposal
when I first started working in the 1980s in London the underground has somewhat changed. Also, British Rail has also changed who here remembers Liverpool Board Street, Holborn Viaduct stations or The North London Line?
I remember Holborn Viaduct, Broad Street, and .. isn't the N London Line still extant ? This was pre-thameslink.
I hope Jago sees this. Once, just once, I caught a Piccadilly line train westbound from Ravenscourt Park. How did that happen? Years of occasionally googling the marvel turn up nothing.
maint works on District Tracks , or points problems meaning districts from earls ct could only run wimbledon ??
I've occasionally seen Piccadilly trains on the slow lines, and rarely, stopping at the stations on those slow lines. Engineering works, stock movements are the usual reasons. I don't think there's are supposed to stop at those stations though.
I suspect some sort of unusual working - engineering works on the District perhaps?
I do recall riding a Piccadilly train into town from Ealing Common and on that particular day there was some issue with the District (delays elsewhere on the line, or perhaps strike action), and due to this the train additionally stopped at Chiswick Park, Stamford Brook and Ravenscourt Park. It was a nice bit of novelty to change up the otherwise monotonous commute hearing the automated announcement speak the names of stations you don't normally hear. Interesting that they had these announcements built into the computer for the rare occasion when the train must call at a station not officially on its map.
It was one of those moments that one tends to associate with childhood when everything in the adult world seems strange, but this time I was in my mid 20s and trying to navigate the tube during my first week of a semester abroad. I was in the full thrall of arrogance feeling like I understood all the zones and could get from Cockfosters to Kew Gardens and hit every Pret a Manger in between. But on this occasion I was on the Piccadilly line trying somehow to get to Knightsbridge to meet someone about some John Tenniel engraving that I almost certainly couldn't afford. When my stop came up... and didn't stop... I panicked. But no one else did. Everyone looked bored and distracted as they usually did on the tube. Then, at the next stop, everyone got out and followed the signs quite calmly to the crossover. I followed them, feeling carried along by the tide of folks "in-the-know." I felt very much like a dorky child missing only the note pinned to his coat saying "Please Send this Child to the Correct Platform, and wipe his nose." Oh the things you learn when you are only in your 26th year of life!
If the Piccadilly Line was built today, there would have been fewer stations built in Central London compared to the present line (mainly because it would likely be built to Elizabeth Line Standards), for example Leicester Square & Covent Garden being served by one station for example.
Ah, I always (well not always, perhaps occasionally… ok, once or twice..) wondered how the service pattern west of Earl’s Court came about!
Turnham Green is my stepdad's son and his family's closest station. The lack of a train stopping may or may not have been enough to turn him green at times.
This little oddity makes my daily commute from Acton Town to Earl’s Court faster than when I took the district line from Chiswick Park to Earl’s Court ❤❤❤
Chiswick Park had a new platform built on the eastbound side when the tracks were doubled
The NYC subway used to run skip-stop during rush hour on 7th Ave. The 1 and 9 trains alternated stops.
The Long Island Rail Road operates a leapfrog service. Trains make all stops along a stretch of the line and bypass all stops before that.
Reducing the number of stops expedites the service.
My first thought: Piccadilly line wanted to be like the express trains 😂
Having done a platform interchange from Piccadilly to District at Hammersmith, with 2 large cases, I can thank UERL for doing this...
you did a vid on flagpole / roundels. Collers' Wood has lost its ones , the naked mounting brackets are available to film at present.
This should begat a video on the similar scheme on the Stanmore branch.
Lovely little video as ever
love the old vintage stations, while the new Elizabeth line station is impressive the heritage of the older stations still are my favourites
Thanks for sharing Jago. Very interesting as always pal 👍
Ive seen it suggested that with the new stock and signalling on the Piccadilly line that train might be able to stop at Turnham Green all day, without affecting the benefits of the express service between Acton and Hammersmith due to the increased acceleration and tighter head ways been trains.
Another reason is that tourists from Heathrow could travel through London faster.
Now they can just use the Elizabeth line.
The Piccadilly line was my first tube ride from Heathrow. Jet lagged we got on a train late on a Friday evening to find lots of party goers carrying their open drinks everywhere. Quite a festive atmosphere. Never saw so many people drinking on public transit as open liquor on transit was long prohibited in Canada.
'You might stop at Turnham Green'. That is the story of my life.
I did wonder why the train didn’t stop at some stations as I travelled the whole distance on the Piccadilly Line all the way to Heathrow Airport. Just for a joy ride but not much joy when the noise levels became shocking 😅
I seem to remember a met line service in the 80,s that left uxbridge about 7.45 and after rayners lane ran non stop to finchly road or did i just fall alseep lol. Great vid as always jago
I am glad that there are quite a few options to change between Piccadilly and District. That has prevented difficulties a number of times for me so thank God for that.
Passing Brompton Road!
Great stuff, I did wonder about it on a journey to West Kensington many years ago.
It's the Uxbridge branch that went from the District line to the Piccadilly line that that was a light
Love these videos. 😊
I would love a quadrupled train track in North London and beyond. Having to.wait _thirty minutes_ for the correct train while allowing expresses through first is aggravating.
Mind you, I'd like the tube to actually go somewhere in-between Cockfosters and Epping too, preferably directly, so...
I've been waiting at Blake Hall for quite a long time as well.
Cockfosters -> Epping ? Seems like a job for SuperLoop. Now, if only we could convince TfL to run SuperLoop as a train ?
@@quantisedspace7047 Judging by the headway's on the Superloop bus service they don't seem to be expecting many passengers. Certainly not enough to justify a train service.
Sort of convenient that the Hounslow branch was extended to Heathrow and so skipping makes the trip from Heathrow a bit less annoying. Which is where foreigners like me probably see this phenomenon for the first time.
As someone who used to live in Chiswick I absolutely hated that only District was an option to get to central London. My station was Turnham Green and It was frustrating to change on Hammersmith from or to piccadilly, adding so much more time to your commuting. Turnham Green this days is very busy station, especially rush hours and it would be perfect if Piccadilly stops there all day. District is not reliable, especially the Richmond bound, so there were some days when I had to wait for 10 min to get on the tube, sitting on the platform and looking at many Piccadilly trains slowly passing through the station. I know people from Turnham Green fighting for years to make Piccadilly stops there regularly.
So the Picadilly once did "skip-stop" operations? Certain lines in Chicago and Philadelphia used it until the 1990s and 2020, respectively, with trains marked as "A" or "B" (and stops A, B, or A/B to mean all trains), certain physical New York Subway "lines" effectively practice this, but with different "services", the most well known nowadays being the J/Z route (contrary to popular belief, that rapper "Jay-Z" did NOT take his name from this, even though he did grow up in the area) Even certain metro lines in Santiago, Chile, have skip-stop during rush hours (they have "red" and "green" trains, that only share "common" stations)
The Piccallydickally may be faster but what you gain in speed you lose in personal space, optimum body temperature and peace of mind. Also, it's a law of subterranean life that when you get to the bottom of the escalator at Earls Court you always meet head-on the human discharge from the Heathrow train you've just missed. The next two will be heading for Rayner's Lane and then Northfields. I think it's chaos theory or something, ie a butterfly has just flapped into a train in Sydney and had a really pleasant journey.
When I used to live near Tower Hill, I’d always use the easy interchange at Barons Court or Hammersmith to change to the Piccadilly when going to Heathrow (while btw google maps wants you to change at South Ken, annoying!) Often wondered about this too!
Good to see the maps Jago
At the Heathrow border just east of Hatton Cross the train always slows. I was told that this was part of the agreement to cross the land and that the landowner still gets a fee for each train. Is this true ?
There was never a theatre train from Finsbury Park to Aldwych, if only because there is no connection at Holborn from the southbound main line to the branch. There was, though, a service to take theatregoers home from Aldwych to the norrhern suburbs.
Very Interesting video ❤
Absolutely love traveling on the Piccadilly line woohoo ❤
😀 "quarupling to my double track." On another note, in the 1920s there were plans to have a *sextuplicated* -tracked line under 2nd Avenue in Manhattan (NYC) for about three miles. Another 2-3 miles immediately south of that section would have been quadrupled-tracked. The line would have featured Local (Stopping), Express (Fast), and Super-Express (Super-Fast?) services. Unfortunately the Great Depression ended those plans.
Which of course is why, unusually, you step down off the platform onto the Piccadilly Line trains on the branch out to South Harrow
Good topic. I was interested in seeing this.
"By all accounts it was rather complicated and frustrating for passengers trying to figure out if they could actually get to their destination."
New York Subway has entered the chat...
Indeed, the skipping of stations was celebrated in a 1928 farce called 'Passing Brompton Road'. The central character, Dultitia Sloane (wonderful name!!), lived near to the station and blamed her limited social life on the fact that every second train swept through without stopping!
Was literally sitting on this route thinking this thanks
"No Stop 'til Hammersmith".
I feel an album coming on.
There was a not very successful pop group in the 1960s called The Piccadilly Line".
@@simonwinter8839 I was nodding more in the direction of Motörhead. Well, I *say* nodding.
@@grahamstubbs4962 Not motorman?
Another masterpiece from Jago Hazzard, bravo I say, bravo!
I find that weird and fascinating on how the Piccadilly Line trains pass through stations between Acton Town and Earls Court. Whilst the District Line serves those stations and the District Line S7 Stock trains do stop at those stops between Earls Court and Acton Town.
I was on a Piccadilly line train the other day, and noticed it went straight through Turnham Green. Now I know why.