Hi guys.. @ Anthony, If I'm not mistaken @ the 12:00 mark, I thought the canal boat action, was supposed to start on the far left side of the board? By Francis. Then you work your way through the canal on each boat action you take after that. And and yes, In the deluxe version of the game, the Jade was green glass beads. And the tokens were wood pieces with the heat transfer on them. In my opinion, this game had some of the best production I have ever seen, in a long time. Component wise.
29:57 the double servant or Foremant does actually count as 2 servants being removed: “Whenever you need to remove 2 Servants from your Servant pool to the general supply, you may remove your Foreman instead of 2 Servants” so Francis is right. I like that you say this is fast paced, I played a 4 player game and that really dragged out, especially if half of the people have extra gift cards extra. There also seems to be more to think about in a 4 or even 5 player game with more interactions and spaces being taken more often and gift cards being exchanged more often. Would be interested in hearing your thoughts after a 4 or 5 player game
I think all players who contributed to the wall get to do the intrigue action. Also, I found that getting the extra card in the first round is very helpful... more so than the big worker. Love the game and I love watching you guys play.
I also think that you can only put a boat on the first space to the left. I believe you can also put a servant on a boat and move another boat. You can also put the third on a boat and take the reward before or after you move... or wait. We have been getting the reward as a free action so that we may get rewarded after the night move.
The game comes with 14 servants but the rulebook says use 12. On bgg designers said the 2 are extra. Just letting you know for future games. I made the same mistake when I was playing. Servant supplies are supposed to be even tighter.
I think I’m ga-ga for Gugong. The core mechanic is a very clever abstraction of the theme: trade a higher value card for a lower value, which represents sneakily bribing the local officials.
Gugong is a game that I would like to like more than I do. Love the themee and the card mechanic is a puzzle I really enjoy. The game runs a bit too long for me at the 4 and 5 player count. You wait a bit for your turn and because the cards change 3 or 4 times before your turn there is a period that you fall away from the game as you wait for your turn. Now I'm keeping the game and I think I can get it played on occasion, but I have other games like Castles of Burgundy that I don't play enough and enjoy a bit more than Gugong.
Good video. Always glad to see content from you guys and love the fact you did not give into the Twitter mob! Keep up the good work. How does this game compare to a game like Rajas of the Ganges, seems similar from afar. Having actually played it, do you think they are comparable games. I love world history, so I am always interested in games set in various different cultures, times, and places. Please keep the content coming.
I see the common mistake 😌 you are paying with 14 instead of 12 servants. They gave us 2 extra per colour, but I guess we are not used to count components we are starting with. Same thing happened to us on our first play.
Yeah, came here after noticing the exact same thing, 12 servants restriction makes servant generation management quite a challenge, and can hold back the leader in some cases
Awesome! I have the deluxe of this and it's in my top 5. I am curious about ZahnGuo. Since you like Asiany themed games. Have you played Yedo? I think it's my #1.
你普通話說的好。 The funniest part of this game is the slave-trading aspect of it. I don't think those "servants" are coming back from the Wall. Some officials just want a gift, but sometimes one need to sweeten the pot with a "servant."
Is there a video for root? Me and my fiance are thinking of getting it as a stepping stone towards board gaming.... I’m seeing it in the background but cannot find a video haha! If there is none... well there’s my request :)
Daniel Bernard Hey! Funny story actually - we were all set to film Root a few months ago. We learned and played the game a few times, and were pretty disappointed with how it played at two. We tried it with the Riverfolk expansion, and playing co-op against the Automa was marginally more fun, but still not something we really were excited to play again. They had just launched a KS for new Autome and I believe are changing the way the original bot plays (fixing some of the issues many people had with it, I believe). So we decided to table it (figuratively haha) for down the road IF it improves. We didn’t see a point in filming a game for you all that was bound to change and that we didn’t like much anyway after we purchased it. It never does the game justice, and we are sure many people do like it. Anyway, the point is - we would not recommend this to get anyone into gaming. Since it is asymmetrical, you will probably find yourself alpha-gaming unintentionally because your fiancé won’t haves consistent rule set to model throughout the game. I would try something else with clear rules, and good chunky decisions. If you’re looking for something adventurous with cute art, Above and Below is a good one to start with, among many others you see in our PT queue. Good luck!!!
@@fembrulee1883 Awesome!! Thank you soooo much for answering my question and also so many of my unasked but very present questions :p Ill watch your PTs and take a decision from there :)
I like your reviews, but I wish game reviewers would discuss issues with games a bit more in reviews. I have only played Gugong one time, but after our first game, we had an issue with the Wall Decree and great wall action which seemed overpowered. How things like this don't get picked up in play testing is beyond me, but I wish reviewers would talk about these sorts of issues more, and maybe then game developers will spend more time on hopefully stopping this sort of issue. Its a simple house rule to not play with the decree but if I ever buy the game, I will just burn it and throw it in the bin!
I have 20 plays under my belt, and never had any issues with either of those. It's a fair game for everyone. If you wanna do it, you can. And, also, how come you can tell if something is overpowered after and play? I think this is not an issue and that's why noone is taking about that. Really, give the game another try, you might change your opinion. Cheers.
I had the same argument in the BGG thread on Scythe Albion. It's likely the way my brain works and also just what my friends and I are like. We have spent decades breaking down games, movies, books etc. and picking apart their faults, so its just the way my brain works. We generally spend a lot of time arguing\discussing the aftermath of every game we play, and whilst I am sure others do that, I have never seen people do it to the degree we do, and many people I have actually played with in game meetups and groups don't actually like doing that at all, so I am guessing it's something I am good at compared to most. I could spend 3 hours explaining to someone why the Lord of the Rings movies are stupidly written scripts in many sections because the writers didn't understand the source material, and the they apparently had Tolkien experts help with those scripts? There is a discussion here boardgamegeek.com/thread/2089379/overpowered-great-wall-actiondrecree-3-player-game and because we had that exact same circumstance our first game, we all saw this issue immediately.
@@zorbageek8432 great. I know that we have been proved wrong on same thoughts by games by playing them more... You might be far above me and my group when it comes to this... And that's great. I still don't think there are issues with OP stuff in Gugong. I tried many different strategies and they all seems valid. Only spot I'm not certain if it pays itself is Jade.
@@nuuqbgg suppose there is a simple test. Set the game up with that decree and one player use the strategy. The issue for us was being our first game, people added a single cube to the Great wall, which then allowed the other player who had unlocked the double servants and obtained the wall decree to fill it, and then reclaim their servants back. Not every game will play like that and it requires the decree in play, but still I would assume part of the developers game testing a game, they should actually test things removing as much chance as possible i.e. run through testing of games with all combinations of decree's and trying to actively break a game. If they see this you would hope they tweak it. Some games truly amaze me that testing didn't pick up flaws. I only had to play Takenoko a single game to realise the Panda objectives are a clear advantage in points vs difficulty. I only had to play Quadropolis a single time to realise the turn order rules are terrible, and funny because when I then go look for others with same thoughts, I find them and some people house rule these games, but it amazes me that issues were not picked up in testing
I love the effort in trying to say gugong right. Glad to see y'all back!
Hi guys.. @ Anthony, If I'm not mistaken @ the 12:00 mark, I thought the canal boat action, was supposed to start on the far left side of the board?
By Francis.
Then you work your way through the canal on each boat action you take after that.
And and yes, In the deluxe version of the game, the Jade was green glass beads. And the tokens were wood pieces with the heat transfer on them. In my opinion, this game had some of the best production I have ever seen, in a long time. Component wise.
Yes, for 2/3 players there is only 1 canal "track", Anthony should start on most left side
29:57 the double servant or Foremant does actually count as 2 servants being removed:
“Whenever you need to remove 2 Servants from your Servant pool to the general supply, you may remove your Foreman instead of 2 Servants” so Francis is right.
I like that you say this is fast paced, I played a 4 player game and that really dragged out, especially if half of the people have extra gift cards extra. There also seems to be more to think about in a 4 or even 5 player game with more interactions and spaces being taken more often and gift cards being exchanged more often.
Would be interested in hearing your thoughts after a 4 or 5 player game
At 48:25 Francis forgot the 4 points, she just said she would take
I think all players who contributed to the wall get to do the intrigue action. Also, I found that getting the extra card in the first round is very helpful... more so than the big worker. Love the game and I love watching you guys play.
I also think that you can only put a boat on the first space to the left. I believe you can also put a servant on a boat and move another boat. You can also put the third on a boat and take the reward before or after you move... or wait. We have been getting the reward as a free action so that we may get rewarded after the night move.
You actually jump over others and blank spaces in the travel action. I seem to remember having to go one direction in a double move.
holy crap, I've only seen 8 minutes of your playthrough and I already wanna play and most importantly own/buy the game! thanks both! :P
The game comes with 14 servants but the rulebook says use 12. On bgg designers said the 2 are extra. Just letting you know for future games. I made the same mistake when I was playing. Servant supplies are supposed to be even tighter.
Thank you for your video. I appreciate your work so much! :)
I think I’m ga-ga for Gugong. The core mechanic is a very clever abstraction of the theme: trade a higher value card for a lower value, which represents sneakily bribing the local officials.
Cool. Surprised it is so short. Really like this game design. Good that it’s five player and solo.
Gugong is a game that I would like to like more than I do. Love the themee and the card mechanic is a puzzle I really enjoy. The game runs a bit too long for me at the 4 and 5 player count. You wait a bit for your turn and because the cards change 3 or 4 times before your turn there is a period that you fall away from the game as you wait for your turn. Now I'm keeping the game and I think I can get it played on occasion, but I have other games like Castles of Burgundy that I don't play enough and enjoy a bit more than Gugong.
Glad to see this playthrough of a game that seems to divide opinions....I have the KS version but am yet to play.
Love the Lao Zi quote in the back!
What a coincidence! Played my first game this weekend (and won with 62 points). Will look at your playthrough after work.
re: Jade upgrade ... fishtank / vase glass from the dollar store
At around 12 minutes I did not hear what the benefit was to getting the boost or why you would want to put 2 additional workers on it.
Good video. Always glad to see content from you guys and love the fact you did not give into the Twitter mob! Keep up the good work. How does this game compare to a game like Rajas of the Ganges, seems similar from afar. Having actually played it, do you think they are comparable games. I love world history, so I am always interested in games set in various different cultures, times, and places. Please keep the content coming.
Another interesting game with a Chinese theme is Wu Wei. I would love to see you guys take a look at that game and see what your thoughts are on that.
This is such a great game. I get vibes of Trajan but gugong is a much more solid design.
I see the common mistake 😌 you are paying with 14 instead of 12 servants. They gave us 2 extra per colour, but I guess we are not used to count components we are starting with.
Same thing happened to us on our first play.
Yeah, came here after noticing the exact same thing, 12 servants restriction makes servant generation management quite a challenge, and can hold back the leader in some cases
Awesome! I have the deluxe of this and it's in my top 5. I am curious about ZahnGuo. Since you like Asiany themed games. Have you played Yedo? I think it's my #1.
你普通話說的好。
The funniest part of this game is the slave-trading aspect of it. I don't think those "servants" are coming back from the Wall. Some officials just want a gift, but sometimes one need to sweeten the pot with a "servant."
Is there a video for root? Me and my fiance are thinking of getting it as a stepping stone towards board gaming.... I’m seeing it in the background but cannot find a video haha! If there is none... well there’s my request :)
Daniel Bernard Hey! Funny story actually - we were all set to film Root a few months ago. We learned and played the game a few times, and were pretty disappointed with how it played at two. We tried it with the Riverfolk expansion, and playing co-op against the Automa was marginally more fun, but still not something we really were excited to play again. They had just launched a KS for new Autome and I believe are changing the way the original bot plays (fixing some of the issues many people had with it, I believe). So we decided to table it (figuratively haha) for down the road IF it improves. We didn’t see a point in filming a game for you all that was bound to change and that we didn’t like much anyway after we purchased it. It never does the game justice, and we are sure many people do like it.
Anyway, the point is - we would not recommend this to get anyone into gaming. Since it is asymmetrical, you will probably find yourself alpha-gaming unintentionally because your fiancé won’t haves consistent rule set to model throughout the game. I would try something else with clear rules, and good chunky decisions. If you’re looking for something adventurous with cute art, Above and Below is a good one to start with, among many others you see in our PT queue. Good luck!!!
@@fembrulee1883 Awesome!! Thank you soooo much for answering my question and also so many of my unasked but very present questions :p Ill watch your PTs and take a decision from there :)
th-cam.com/video/nTN1mLAHySs/w-d-xo.html&t= and th-cam.com/video/Gup6lTgGdjI/w-d-xo.html both cover Root well :)
I like your reviews, but I wish game reviewers would discuss issues with games a bit more in reviews. I have only played Gugong one time, but after our first game, we had an issue with the Wall Decree and great wall action which seemed overpowered. How things like this don't get picked up in play testing is beyond me, but I wish reviewers would talk about these sorts of issues more, and maybe then game developers will spend more time on hopefully stopping this sort of issue. Its a simple house rule to not play with the decree but if I ever buy the game, I will just burn it and throw it in the bin!
I have 20 plays under my belt, and never had any issues with either of those. It's a fair game for everyone. If you wanna do it, you can.
And, also, how come you can tell if something is overpowered after and play? I think this is not an issue and that's why noone is taking about that.
Really, give the game another try, you might change your opinion.
Cheers.
I had the same argument in the BGG thread on Scythe Albion. It's likely the way my brain works and also just what my friends and I are like. We have spent decades breaking down games, movies, books etc. and picking apart their faults, so its just the way my brain works. We generally spend a lot of time arguing\discussing the aftermath of every game we play, and whilst I am sure others do that, I have never seen people do it to the degree we do, and many people I have actually played with in game meetups and groups don't actually like doing that at all, so I am guessing it's something I am good at compared to most.
I could spend 3 hours explaining to someone why the Lord of the Rings movies are stupidly written scripts in many sections because the writers didn't understand the source material, and the they apparently had Tolkien experts help with those scripts?
There is a discussion here boardgamegeek.com/thread/2089379/overpowered-great-wall-actiondrecree-3-player-game and because we had that exact same circumstance our first game, we all saw this issue immediately.
@@zorbageek8432 great.
I know that we have been proved wrong on same thoughts by games by playing them more...
You might be far above me and my group when it comes to this... And that's great.
I still don't think there are issues with OP stuff in Gugong. I tried many different strategies and they all seems valid. Only spot I'm not certain if it pays itself is Jade.
@@nuuqbgg suppose there is a simple test. Set the game up with that decree and one player use the strategy. The issue for us was being our first game, people added a single cube to the Great wall, which then allowed the other player who had unlocked the double servants and obtained the wall decree to fill it, and then reclaim their servants back. Not every game will play like that and it requires the decree in play, but still I would assume part of the developers game testing a game, they should actually test things removing as much chance as possible i.e. run through testing of games with all combinations of decree's and trying to actively break a game. If they see this you would hope they tweak it.
Some games truly amaze me that testing didn't pick up flaws. I only had to play Takenoko a single game to realise the Panda objectives are a clear advantage in points vs difficulty. I only had to play Quadropolis a single time to realise the turn order rules are terrible, and funny because when I then go look for others with same thoughts, I find them and some people house rule these games, but it amazes me that issues were not picked up in testing
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