thank you so much! in my country 30+ year old car models are tax free and would like a retro semi-project car, just to socialize with bmw fanatics haha @@ECPP
My e30 was dead reliable and very cheap to upkeep. The original clutch slave cylinder from 1987 did go out back in 2015 but the oe sachs replacement only costed my $11 on Rock Auto. Other than that the engine was never touched except for routine maintenance. I did change the timing belt as a precaution since I did get it used. Loved that car. Never left me stranded the entire 14 years I owned it.
Maybe I’m just lucky, but my 2011 E90 inline 6 bought new has been the most reliable vehicle I’ve ever owned. Replaced the battery once and the ignition coils; but mainly just glues, rubber window trim and a rear light wire giving out with age. Easy and cheap to fix.
I have 2015 328i with 171000 miles. Regular maintenance being done on that so far good. Although did change rotators, break pads , belt about year ago. Running like a tank i put about 22k miles every year.
I own a 2002 e46 M3 and up to this day I can’t seem to find a suitable replacement for it. Parked right next to my m3 is my Honda s2000. They don’t make ‘em like they used to! Keeping them both for life 👍🏻
2011 bmw 328i e92 n51 coupe - now 165k. Its was a disaster to maintain and crazy expensive. Had to do most repairs myself to reduce expenses. But beautiful car great ride!
Just got a 2024 M340i rwd in black sapphire and is my 1st time owning a BMW. It’s got the shadowline trim which is absolutely beautiful! It’s got the mild hybrid drivetrain coupled with the 8 speed transmission. Love this car!
My 2018 320i has 100k miles. Most mechanically reliable car Iv’e ever owned. Can’t sat that about my Honda CRV before it. Lots of little problems every year.
That’s true the Hondas are not perfect but it’s just that they are cheap when they do break. Some of the late model BMW s are more reliable that so e of the 10-15 year old units
I love the channel. I still miss having not my '07 328i E92. It was very enjoyable to drive. The only problem I had with it was that the starter went out on it. Luckily it was covered my the dealer warranty. I would still like to have another one, because I so enjoyed driving it.
So many things wrong he said, E36 M3s never had an M5x engine, the M3s had either an S50 or S52 , all M5x engines were non M engines. In the USA all E36s after 96 were OBD II, all Euro E36s are OBD1. In the USA a 6MT was NEVER offered for the E36 chassis only a 5MT.
What a great community you've created, on all your channels...i don't need to relive my X1 story in this comment, still feels like a got a two piece, one to the chin and one in the gut...lol ✌️💚
The M54B30 might be the most overlooked BMW engine ever. It is quite a shame too. With 228-235hp and roughly 220ft-lb of torque, it is a sweet little motor. I have a 2001 Z3 3.0i with the M54 motor and after over 100,000 miles the car doesn’t ask me for anything but an oil change every couple thousand miles.
I’ve had BMWs for over 25 years which encompasses two E30s 325i E28 three E46s E34 E39 E31 850i F20 and my current E89 and in all this time I’ve only suffered one worn out power steering pump (E46) top end rebuild E30, water pump E34 apart from that regular servicing, not bad for over 25 years and idiots on the web keep complaining about BMW reliability. I usually always go for the 6 cylinder power plants, my next will be something with the B58 or a M car or maybe change altogether and switch over to Porsche! Note in this time I’ve also had Japanese cars too and they have not been without fault either, auto gearbox issues, blown head gaskets, big end bearings etc.
E46 is a simple car and well build, 325, 328 & 330 loved the front and the wheels, my favorite was the E30 but that’s me am a ‘Old School’ These cars show as how making a simple cars will last a long time, not these new one that are full of technology that when they break down it cost you a ‘Arm & a Leg’ to fix and to much plastic.
I have a plan. Please tell me if it's good or bad. Buy an E90 N54 for roughly $5-10k. Reserve another $10k to make it reliable (by swapping old plastic parts with robust aluminum aftermarket parts), make it cool lookin (wheels, paint, etc), and increase performance (400 hp, nothing crazy). So spend $15-20k total, which is still waaaaay cheaper than anything 5yrs old or younger. What do you think? P.S. I would do this with an N52, but you can't get any significant power gains unless you install a turbo or super charger, which costs $5-7k and would jeopardize its reliability, so you may as well have just gotten an N54 instead.
Interesting plan but I still don’ recommend the n54 as many pasts have not aftermarket options and overall durability is just not there and unless a person is a strong DIYrr, it’s a risk. There is still the open diff which mean it does not have the rear drive grab like you can find in the M3. It just boils down to how much of an adventure you are willing to take in.
@ECPP Near impossible to find an E90 M3 or newer for under $25k, and still, they have their reliability issues as well. But I do like the E46 M3, with its NA S54 achieving 300+ horsepower. If I can find one that wasn't abused by some kid with not so high mileage and for under $20k, I may go that route. Manual is a must tho whether I choose the E90 or E46. Thanks for your advice.
E46 is a rust bucket. In snow and salt areas the towers struts are known to come out of their mounts in the trunk. Most f's series have many electronic problems. I had a E36 and E88. We now own a G42 2024, 230, and she is great.
Currently shopping for a new car and hopping in between the Germans while noticing the best build quality over at BMW's side. Is the base model 318i also reliable and the chassy for 10+ years?
Would you recommend the BMW F30 340i in line or long road reliability because I | Toyota owner I want to change to a BMW F30 3401. Is it as reliable as a Toyota or not? This means that it can withstand daily driving without turbo, electrical, or transmission malfunctions. What is your advice regarding the reliability of the car? Because my hobby is that I researched and they said that Lexus is for permanent purchase and BMW is for rent, and many complained and said that it cannot handle travel or long distances, and if it drives more than 200,000 miles, it will die. What is your advice regarding the reliability of the car?
Of this generation I would stay away from n20 or 4 cylinder engines but then340 and the B58 6 cylinder engines are quite durable and I would have not issue in driving long distance, more so.if they have decent miles on the clock and good service history. They will likely go well over 120000 miles or 200000 kms so any car is a gamble but this one is a safer bet. As reliable as a Toyota Camry for example…..probably not but the trade off in driving dynamics is worth it
@@ECPP Is it true that if the oil cooler is damaged, it will lead to the water pump malfunctioning, and is it expensive or not? Do you recommend it for long travel? I am afraid of its cost
Honesetly, as an Uber or “taxi” service, I wouldn’t, too high cost for too little reward, many of the Ubers here in Canada are Toyota, Volkswagen, etc…. BMW in my mind at least has always been the daily driver you can tear up corners with, but to each their own.
The E46 3 Series did have one scary problem and that's the rear subframe cracking. Before you buy any E46 3 Series make sure the rear subframe is not cracked. Aside from the rear subframe cracking and the weak air conditioning the E46 3 Series car overall is pretty solid.
Yeah nah. F-Series onward do feel quite dead on the steering. thus no ultimate driving machine. i have a 335d e92 that never had any big issues. big factor on reliability is how you treat those vehicles. if you push them when still cold, they will drain your pocket. doesn‘t matter if its a M57 or B58.
yes, should have specified the B47, which was 2013-2018. I believe that was the only version available in the US; I don't recall diesel options before then. This was back when diesel was the green option! @@ECPP
Only got to 110K before I got T-boned and it was totaled. But only oil changes every 10K and transmission pan/filter replacement at 70K. Currently looking for a 2018, which is the last year they made them.@@abhinavdeepsinha3036
Just take a Bimmer, any Bimmer, including the Mini for a wheel alignment.ooops, cant do it on a regular Alignment Machine. You MUST get it done at a BMW Service Center (aka: the Rip-Off zone). So, even reliable versions will suck your wallet dry. Been there, done that.
People love to dump on BWW, but, after almost 50 years of buying cars, I can say that ALL cars have issues. I Have 2 BMWs and a Lexus. My E46 330xi with 184,000 Miles is described by my mechanic as a "tank". It s awesome. My 2017 X3 has has zero issues. Meanwhile my Lexus IS250 is a nightmare, most recently needing a entire new "infotainment" system.
@@martyneary3501 you are absolutely right. No matter which car you have something eventually will break down. I guess it depends on the person if they wanna fix it. But its always good to be meticulous on maintenance.
The most reliable 3 series BMW, or any BMW for that matter, which will cost you nothing in service and repairs, is the BMW you leave in the showroom or on the pre-owned lot..... and buy a Toyota instead. Same with Mercedes and any German abortion on wheels. Leave them where you find them.
please do on 5 series too!
Absolutely already have but have to get it to the cue
thank you so much! in my country 30+ year old car models are tax free and would like a retro semi-project car, just to socialize with bmw fanatics haha @@ECPP
E28 & E34. That's all folks.
@@ECPPthank you cause I’m looking to switch to BMW and have always loved the 5 Series. I’ll be on the lookout for that video ❤
My e30 was dead reliable and very cheap to upkeep. The original clutch slave cylinder from 1987 did go out back in 2015 but the oe sachs replacement only costed my $11 on Rock Auto. Other than that the engine was never touched except for routine maintenance. I did change the timing belt as a precaution since I did get it used. Loved that car. Never left me stranded the entire 14 years I owned it.
They are the best and live on
I miss my old 325i. I'd love to have another one, but people ruin most of them.
BMW Reliability after 2020 has picked up a lot!! Now they are really doing good on consumer reports
Indeed
Maybe I’m just lucky, but my 2011 E90 inline 6 bought new has been the most reliable vehicle I’ve ever owned. Replaced the battery once and the ignition coils; but mainly just glues, rubber window trim and a rear light wire giving out with age. Easy and cheap to fix.
Probably the NA engine?
I have 2015 328i with 171000 miles. Regular maintenance being done on that so far good. Although did change rotators, break pads , belt about year ago. Running like a tank i put about 22k miles every year.
I own a 2002 e46 M3 and up to this day I can’t seem to find a suitable replacement for it. Parked right next to my m3 is my Honda s2000. They don’t make ‘em like they used to! Keeping them both for life 👍🏻
Jesus, E46 M3 & S2000 is a killer combo! RESPECT!
Awesome that generation of M3 is a true driver car. It’s a keeper
@@ECPP Both are true driver's cars. Two automotive gems really.
2011 bmw 328i e92 n51 coupe - now 165k. Its was a disaster to maintain and crazy expensive. Had to do most repairs myself to reduce expenses. But beautiful car great ride!
They are great but become DIY vehicles to keep them affordable
I have a ‘22 330i xdrive. My first BMW. Happy with its performance so far.
Nice. Yes the b48 is a decent drivetrain too
Just got a 2024 M340i rwd in black sapphire and is my 1st time owning a BMW. It’s got the shadowline trim which is absolutely beautiful! It’s got the mild hybrid drivetrain coupled with the 8 speed transmission. Love this car!
I absolutely love my 2006 BMW 325i.
Yes, yes, yes
2007 325ix N53 is a pos as well. Because direct injection..and ignirion disaster! lots of bugs in sooo many areas. Never bmw again.
Miss my e36😢😢😢😢
Just bought the 335i 2007 need a few repairs but I heard there unrealible what y’all think?
I had a 1988 325is was the best car I’ve ever owned. I drove it for 18 years and went 250,000 miles.
Wow that’s a good run. One of their work horse engines
My 2018 320i has 100k miles. Most mechanically reliable car Iv’e ever owned. Can’t sat that about my Honda CRV before it. Lots of little problems every year.
That’s true the Hondas are not perfect but it’s just that they are cheap when they do break. Some of the late model BMW s are more reliable that so e of the 10-15 year old units
I have the exact same car and it’s been great as well that’s good to know. It currently has 62 thousand miles so I should be good
I love the channel. I still miss having not my '07 328i E92. It was very enjoyable to drive. The only problem I had with it was that the starter went out on it. Luckily it was covered my the dealer warranty. I would still like to have another one, because I so enjoyed driving it.
Shout out for the E46 M3! I’m still loving my 02 convertible, I’m second owner since 08. 6spd manual still with original clutch ❤️
I love the E30 best, classic shape, and nice simple, reliable mechanics.
simple Simon
So many things wrong he said,
E36 M3s never had an M5x engine, the M3s had either an S50 or S52 , all M5x engines were non M engines.
In the USA all E36s after 96 were OBD II, all Euro E36s are OBD1.
In the USA a 6MT was NEVER offered for the E36 chassis only a 5MT.
What a great community you've created, on all your channels...i don't need to relive my X1 story in this comment, still feels like a got a two piece, one to the chin and one in the gut...lol ✌️💚
Wow, thank you!
I have an e46 325xi touring.
It has 370 k
Still runs beautifully.
There is an e90 in South Africa currently with 793,160 on the odometer 😮
The M54B30 might be the most overlooked BMW engine ever. It is quite a shame too. With 228-235hp and roughly 220ft-lb of torque, it is a sweet little motor. I have a 2001 Z3 3.0i with the M54 motor and after over 100,000 miles the car doesn’t ask me for anything but an oil change every couple thousand miles.
I’ve had BMWs for over 25 years which encompasses two E30s 325i E28 three E46s E34 E39 E31 850i F20 and my current E89 and in all this time I’ve only suffered one worn out power steering pump (E46) top end rebuild E30, water pump E34 apart from that regular servicing, not bad for over 25 years and idiots on the web keep complaining about BMW reliability. I usually always go for the 6 cylinder power plants, my next will be something with the B58 or a M car or maybe change altogether and switch over to Porsche! Note in this time I’ve also had Japanese cars too and they have not been without fault either, auto gearbox issues, blown head gaskets, big end bearings etc.
Should I fear the turbo models ? Trying to figure out what year they stopped making the naturally aspirated v6 models
My BMW 2020 330i is very reliable almost 50k miles ❤
50k is nothing
no hellcats or coyotes .. like your videos 👍
Thanks a welcome
@@ECPP happy to participate
E46 is a simple car and well build, 325, 328 & 330 loved the front and the wheels, my favorite was the E30 but that’s me am a ‘Old School’ These cars show as how making a simple cars will last a long time, not these new one that are full of technology that when they break down it cost you a ‘Arm & a Leg’ to fix and to much plastic.
I still own my 2002 e46m3! Probably will take it to the grave with me…lol
100 percent
my M340i is the best car I ever bought. No regrets.
Amazing driving cars
Can do a video about the best bmw X5 model to buy.
I have a plan. Please tell me if it's good or bad.
Buy an E90 N54 for roughly $5-10k.
Reserve another $10k to make it reliable (by swapping old plastic parts with robust aluminum aftermarket parts), make it cool lookin (wheels, paint, etc), and increase performance (400 hp, nothing crazy).
So spend $15-20k total, which is still waaaaay cheaper than anything 5yrs old or younger.
What do you think?
P.S. I would do this with an N52, but you can't get any significant power gains unless you install a turbo or super charger, which costs $5-7k and would jeopardize its reliability, so you may as well have just gotten an N54 instead.
Interesting plan but I still don’ recommend the n54 as many pasts have not aftermarket options and overall durability is just not there and unless a person is a strong DIYrr, it’s a risk. There is still the open diff which mean it does not have the rear drive grab like you can find in the M3. It just boils down to how much of an adventure you are willing to take in.
@ECPP Near impossible to find an E90 M3 or newer for under $25k, and still, they have their reliability issues as well. But I do like the E46 M3, with its NA S54 achieving 300+ horsepower. If I can find one that wasn't abused by some kid with not so high mileage and for under $20k, I may go that route. Manual is a must tho whether I choose the E90 or E46. Thanks for your advice.
That G20 is a masterpiece ♥️
Nice
E46 is a rust bucket. In snow and salt areas the towers struts are known to come out of their mounts in the trunk. Most f's series have many electronic problems. I had a E36 and E88. We now own a G42 2024, 230, and she is great.
Yes in salty locations it can be an issue
Great videos you put out so ✔️ I’m subscribed. What’s your opinion or experience on the 2018 330i?
Great cars and the b48, although not perfect it’s solid
So baaically any 328i or 330xi is good but the 335 i need to stay away from because i still wanna be quick but not chasing problems
What a about the F30? Did you forget that model or did you skip it on purpose?
Well…..
Currently shopping for a new car and hopping in between the Germans while noticing the best build quality over at BMW's side. Is the base model 318i also reliable and the chassy for 10+ years?
The recent 4 and 6 cylinder drivetrains are quite reliable
The e90 Clean
That is true, thanks for watching
You didn't like the N54, but what about the N55B30A?
Had a 2017 330xi. Still sad to date i sold it. Hoping to get a 2021 soon
Have you done a video like this for the five series?
Not for awhile but that one is next
@@ECPPwaiting for the video on must reliable 5 series
My BMW 330d E91 2010 Touring is Ok. I hope that the engine will last for some mor years. It’s a little bit old car now. But I like it.
Can you please do a video on newer Mercedes(18-2023) mainly interested in the S,E and c class.
Yea I certainly can
@@ECPP thank you! Wish you’re having a good day.
Your opinion on the 2017 F30 320D?
I have a 2016 x4 m40i i like your opinion on it please.
2 words….great engine
Nice video
Very nice
The 128 and z3 and 4 are great engines
Nice
Opinion’s on the 2017 320i 4 cylinder? I’ve found good reviews but I want to be more informed, is it good or pass?
The crayon smell in my e90 325i is killing me
Cheers
Would you recommend the BMW F30 340i in line or long road reliability because I | Toyota owner
I want to change to a BMW F30 3401. Is it as reliable as a Toyota or not? This means that it can withstand daily driving without turbo, electrical, or transmission malfunctions. What is your advice regarding the reliability of the car? Because my hobby is that I researched and they said that Lexus is for permanent purchase and BMW is for rent, and many complained and said that it cannot handle travel or long distances, and if it drives more than 200,000 miles, it will die. What is your advice regarding the reliability of the car?
Of this generation I would stay away from n20 or 4 cylinder engines but then340 and the B58 6 cylinder engines are quite durable and I would have not issue in driving long distance, more so.if they have decent miles on the clock and good service history. They will likely go well over 120000 miles or 200000 kms so any car is a gamble but this one is a safer bet. As reliable as a Toyota Camry for example…..probably not but the trade off in driving dynamics is worth it
@@ECPP Is it true that if the oil cooler is damaged, it will lead to the water pump malfunctioning, and is it expensive or not? Do you recommend it for long travel? I am afraid of its cost
I would like you to say something about the S58 engine.
Are the N51 engines any good?
Well…..
That’s not good
planning for e92 for my first car
Which engine are you looking at
@@ECPP 320i
G20 owner love it ❤
Nice
Buy a 2011-2012 E90 NA or turbod and live happily
Cheer
Which cars have b58 since Supra has this engine , bmw cars with same engine must be reliable . What are thoughts on newer m2 and m4 ( last 5 years)
The 340i has been surprisingly RELIABLE for me.
nice. what year?
Is a 2006 325i e90 reliable, and good
Fairly, yes. Cooling system services in place? Otherwise decent
I have a 2003 Z4 M54B30 over 200,000 miles on it. Its my daily. Love that thing but parts are very $$$$$$$$$.
Wow, thats a great run
Cool i have a 328i with the inline 6
Nicely done
Is a 2019 320i part of the G20 series? Is this particular model recommended if looking for a reliable car? Thanks for any feedback
Yes it is
Are 2017 330i’s reliable?
Yes
I’m based in South Africa and have been using 320d for Uber now I’m thinking of buying M340 2022 model for Uber. Is this advisable?
Honesetly, as an Uber or “taxi” service, I wouldn’t, too high cost for too little reward, many of the Ubers here in Canada are Toyota, Volkswagen, etc…. BMW in my mind at least has always been the daily driver you can tear up corners with, but to each their own.
The E46 3 Series did have one scary problem and that's the rear subframe cracking. Before you buy any E46 3 Series make sure the rear subframe is not cracked. Aside from the rear subframe cracking and the weak air conditioning the E46 3 Series car overall is pretty solid.
Exactly the rear subframe issue was legit and needed attention before buying
I heard that this Problem was solved with the facelift models
Are xdrive's vs rwd reliable?
Looking at a 2007/8 328i. Is it any good?
i have a 328 xdrive 2009 its say Ulev under the hood they say its better than the Sulev engine thats thrue ? ?
I think that the most reliable BMW is the E36 from 1992 to 1999, because the newer ones are just problematic. Thanks.
true between SMG, VANOS and subframe issues I would agree. But E46 M3 is most fun to drive!
Thanks a lot for sharing and inagree many of the older simpler cars and engines are sturdy.
100 percent great to drive
@@ECPP You're welcome.
I adore my E92, sweet sweet N52 straight six.
Yes a much sweeter piece of pie than the n54
Had several. N52 will go if kept up to somewhere around 260,000. Good luck.
@@kirkgrimmer3497 👍
@@ECPP 👍
@@kirkgrimmer3497go to where?
Yeah nah. F-Series onward do feel quite dead on the steering. thus no ultimate driving machine.
i have a 335d e92 that never had any big issues. big factor on reliability is how you treat those vehicles. if you push them when still cold, they will drain your pocket. doesn‘t matter if its a M57 or B58.
2.0 TDI engine in the 3 series has been the most reliable powerplant, better than any of the gas engines.
Later versions. The early N47 had some issues with timing chains
yes, should have specified the B47, which was 2013-2018. I believe that was the only version available in the US; I don't recall diesel options before then. This was back when diesel was the green option! @@ECPP
How many miles did you do? Any troubles outside of standard maintenance?
Only got to 110K before I got T-boned and it was totaled. But only oil changes every 10K and transmission pan/filter replacement at 70K. Currently looking for a 2018, which is the last year they made them.@@abhinavdeepsinha3036
so the n20 is trash ?
NFSMW BMW M3 is the best
Sweet ride
what about my n55 e90 😢
They are decent but not so much like the B58 engine
I want to know about 2007 325i coup e92 naturally aspirated automatic
What about it
@@ECPP their reliability, should I buy it or skip it?
@@ECPP when I looked at your contents I only found about turbo engine but not about naturally aspirated engine
what happen to the f30 ?
Well…..
@@ECPP lol nevermind.
Its E46 nothing else comperes, of course the 3.0L doesnt really matter if its Diesel or Benzine.
The most reliable BMW is the rental one. When it breaks it's not on you
What do you thanks of the F30 2017 with b48 engine?? In about to buy it
I had a 2004 325i sooooo uncomfortable. It was in 2006 and I was 18 I thought I was doing something 🤣.
Yikes
Toyotas & Honda engines are bulletproof
They clock 500 000miles without major repairs
E46 automatic transmission problems.
What a disgraceful E46 was chosen for this vid !
No F30? It probably is better than the E90.
Just take a Bimmer, any Bimmer, including the Mini for a wheel alignment.ooops, cant do it on a regular Alignment Machine. You MUST get it done at a BMW Service Center (aka: the Rip-Off zone).
So, even reliable versions will suck your wallet dry.
Been there, done that.
Fact
All service centers have become rip-off zones unfortunately.
@@zsb707 But M-B & BMW have taken greed to a whole new level!
Yea
Yea
I babied my e46 back in the day. It was still the least reliable car I ever owned.
I thought this video was about the best
well.....
honestly, if I were to buy a luxury vehicle such as a BMW, I'd just lease them. Putting BMW and reliable in the same sentence is a joke.
Haha, well there are a few solid offerings these days, but selection is important
People love to dump on BWW, but, after almost 50 years of buying cars, I can say that ALL cars have issues. I Have 2 BMWs and a Lexus. My E46 330xi with 184,000 Miles is described by my mechanic as a "tank". It s awesome. My 2017 X3 has has zero issues. Meanwhile my Lexus IS250 is a nightmare, most recently needing a entire new "infotainment" system.
@@martyneary3501 you are absolutely right. No matter which car you have something eventually will break down. I guess it depends on the person if they wanna fix it. But its always good to be meticulous on maintenance.
@@martyneary3501Is your E46 diesel?? Or just regular
@@zureai it is regular gas.
The n20 engine in e90 was a dog. Avoid like the plague
Exactly
bmw 328 i hybrdd need bew hybed bateries sîkñ
Thanks for sharing
bmw
Yes
81000 mupes 11 years
Nice
dad bmw m 3 m 6 5 sieed stick very relbel
Thanks again for watching
Calling any E90 a reliable car is the biggest lie ever told in automotive history
Most are great EXCEPT the 335
Just b58. Anything that ends with 40i. No need to watch anymore lol
Haha
The 2019 is the most reliable
The latest are getting better Indeed
The most reliable 3 Series is a 230i
Did you say BMW 3 Series E90!? I beg to differ my 2008 has been an absolute disaster. Stay away.
Stay away from the turbo versions
save us $275 of gas
Saving is winning
BMW-money pits.
E90 reliable 😂
320d with ppk14yrs, 300k, same battery with energy recovery,maintained by BMW . No issues whatever ! Quality went down the drain after the e90 series.
3³5 54⁰
Cheers
The most reliable 3 series BMW, or any BMW for that matter, which will cost you nothing in service and repairs, is the BMW you leave in the showroom or on the pre-owned lot..... and buy a Toyota instead. Same with Mercedes and any German abortion on wheels. Leave them where you find them.