Guilliman : I'm not the Messiah! Citizen of imperium: I say you are, Lord and I should know, I've followed a few! Followers: Hail Messiah! Guilliman : I'm not the Messiah! Will you please listen? I am not the Messiah, do you understand? Honestly! Saint Celestine: Only the true Messiah denies His divinity Guilliman: What? Well, what sort of chance does that give me? All right! I am the Messiah! Citizen of Imperium: He is! He is the Messiah! Guilliman : Now, fuck off! (silence) Citizen of Imperium : How shall we fuck off, O Lord?
Looks to me like Guilliman will become the living avatar of The Emperor. The only vessel in the galaxy that can handle possession by him. Sounds great, right? Maybe. Except for Guilliman, of course, who'll stare behind his own eyes in horror as his father uses him like a puppet as he silently screams and fights back for control of his own body.
I think he can become a separate entity. There were certain circles of society where Thor was more popular than Odin, and Guiliman could potentially end up in a very similar situation.
If this happens Guillimans soul will be destroyed. I am basing this statement on the basis of what happens to posessed Chaos Marines. The demon takes them over and only their Body remains. The emperor posessing Guilliman should work the same way.
There's also a nascent God of the Greater Good forming thanks to all the humans in the Tau empire, much to the horror of the Ethereals. Humanity is freaky man
Honestly, Roboute's apotheosis is probably the only thing that'll even the playing grounds between the Chaos Gods and the material world. He'll likely become something more powerful than a living saint. At the same time, what I think is happening is: Given the Primarchs are half-made of warp stuff, what happened in Godblight was a piece of the Emperor possessing Guilliman, but the aftershock of such a possession awakened Guilliman pysker powers. It has been established that Roboute is psychically sensitive to certain things. When he teleports, he feels like a piece of the Warp, when talking to Cawl's device which requires psyker communion, he gets various degrees of migraine, the next logical leap is he develops psyker powers himself. That being said, I do think the possession has left a side effect already. Fraiter Mathieu was afflicted by disease from Nurgle's cauldron itself, but Guilliman stood in the same room and heard his final words without protective gear and wasn't affected in the least. At least, no more than going to an average hostile atmosphere. I would argue that Guilliman is already a god and he's already on the path to realising that something has changed in him since his revivification, but his path is ultimately about deciding what to do with it. Does he continue to sacrifice like he did in his first life pre-heresy, trying to keep the whole rotten thing functioning. Or does he tear it down and attempt a second Imperium Secundus?
There is already a point in the story where Chancellarius Tieron is watching Guilliman in fight and he says that you could see a play of light a Halo form around his head as he fought the demon
Valrak, I think Guilliman already showed his "godhood" at the end of the book. In the chapter where Guilliman wakes up in Nurgle's realm, I don't think its the Emperor talking through Guilliman, but rather the Emperor waking up the "god" aspect of Guilliman. In the book, nearly every conversation in that chapter shows Guilliman referring to himself as "The Avenging Son" and "Roboute Guilliman", and I don't think the Emperor will hide behind another person's name as evidenced by the HH books where he talks to the chaos gods directly. So the only conclusion that I have is that faith has already started to change Guilliman, resulting in a split personality. Time will tell which personality will win.
I don't know if I have an "issue" exactly, but considering that for oh, say, 9,500 years people have been celebrating Sanguinalia and revering the sacrifice of Sanguinius, what has that done to his Spirit?
It's interesting how Guilliman is getting into the same situation as the Emperor, being called a GOD but at the same time telling people that you aren't.
“I am not a god!” -says the 9-10 foot tall man who has 20+ brothers of the same height and taller each with their own oddly unique abilities and literally can conquer (most) worlds diplomatically
Maybe he'll do both? Considering Guilliman's character, he might guide people to a renewed faith, whilst simultaneously reforming/ weakening the decadent behaviour of the worst elements of the church. Turning faith into a very pragmatic weapon. That way he can both deny being a god and still reap the benefits of faith.
Bear in mind that all the Primarchs have some sort of psychic power. The ability to inspire and bring some form of order to the warp seems like a power that suits Guilliman.
I think Roboute is going to be turned into an Emperor branded version of a primarch chaos prince. The Lion or Dorn are going to show up as Roboute ascends and they'll try to kill him at first, after? I dunno.
Heres a spin on the power of faith turning Gulliman into a god, Sanguinius has been worshipped for 10k years as son of the emporer, his sacrifice honoured etc, he even has a day a year in his honour…. what has that done to his soul in the warp?
@@cryamistellimek9184 sanguinor isnt actually sanguinius mighz be like a shard of him or has a part of his power but you can see what you can assume to be actual sanguinius showing himself in visions to mephiston and dante and like pulling them away from death. Think Sanguinius says hes dead or denies being sanginius whatever but thats probably just sanginus + whatever ppl belive him to which changed him
Like think its implied that sanginor is avatar of sanginius's nobility and stuff and mephiston became avatar for black rage and sanginious is like nobility and rage combined
see the sanguinor isnt known to the imperium at large, but maybe its the faith in sanguinius that allows him to manifest in times of need 🤔🤔 my own train of thought is tied to the vengeful spirit where part of sangiunious soul is trapped, what if faith empowers it enough to fight back against the corruption in the vessal? free the fallen trapped in the ash statues? could it send a signal to mephiston or something allowing for a black legion vs blood angels showdown to free his trapped shard? the possibilities are potentially endless
Everything is going far too smoothly now, i am hoping one of the visions Lorgar was shown happens now: ~The ship burned~ On the deck around him lay a hundred dead mortals and slain ultramarines. The walls of the strategium shuddered, venting air pleasure and feeding the flames sweeping across the entire bridge deck. thrones stood in flames. The fire was already crementing those that had fallen in the last few minutes. Lorgar saw himself at the heart of the flames, his crozius in his gauntlets. The image wore red armour, in mirror of the world bearers he had seen at the eternity gate, and cast its maul aside with an angry florish. whatever battle it had been fighting had taken its toll, the image of himself stood cracked armour, with its face blackened by burn scarring. ´for Monarchia,´the image of Lorgar raged through bleeding gums and split lips. ´for watching me kneel in the dust of my many failures.´ At first Lorgar couldn't make out who his image was addressing. Then, with a grim and wounded majesty, Guilliman staggered from the flames. Silently defiant even as his armour blackened into a burning ruin, the lord of Macragge drew a gladius. His helm was gone, baring a face that remained stoic despite a crushed skull. One arm was gone, ending at the elbow. Blood ran in viscous rivulets from the joints of his armour. His white cloak was aflame. Lorgars image threw his hand forward. Psychic energy so intensely golden it aborted direct sight, haloed and crowned his head with three aetheric horns. A wave of unseen force pounded into the ultramarines liege, hurling him back through the fire and against the wall beyond. Guilliman crashed to the deck, a twitching, ragged marionette with severed strings. and then, with his remaining hand, he reached for the fallen gladius again. Lorgar crushed the hand beneath a crimson boot. ´this my brother, is for every life lost in the name of a lie´. Lorgar hauled the lord of macragge up by the throat, smashing him back against the wall even as he strangled him. ´Your fleet burns. Your astral kingdom dies next´ Guilliman managed a smile //Eye of Terra -p :160-161
Here's an idea - the spirits of the Primarchs are derived from the warp. Did the Emperor reincarnate human heroes from history into the bodies of the Primarchs? Or maybe lesser Gods who existed as relics in the Warp?
Rogal: "aight I'm back with the milk how has it been" Roboute: "well..." Rogal: "what the hell I leave for what a few hundred years and everyone worships you like a god alright I'm done"
I think that Guilliman will definitely get a power up in the books/lore now. After the Emperors intervention, I think he’ll essentially get some residual power left in him, so to speak lol
The emperor tells Guilliman he is the Imperium’s last hope. Basically, this novel is telling us that we’re never getting another loyalist Primarch returning.
The moment Guilliman wields the Emperor's flaming sword gives the Big E a convenient excuse to guide Guilliman how to use the sword's ultimate power while temporarily possessing him
IF Guilly became a god i can see that causing a resurgence in Chaos anyway. You can see citizens, lords etc becoming jealous of his power and falling to chaos.
Guilliman is between loyalist and renegade - leaning more towards renegade. If you listen to what he says to Mathieu's corpse at the end of 'Godblight', he states what he TRULY thinks about The Emperor... especially when you consider that he ordered to make sure ALL records of the conversation weren't possible and to have everyone but him and Mathieu out of the room. Based on his words and actions during that event, I think he's going to end up wanting to find a way to destroy The Emperor.
@@eyeballpapercut4400 makes sense, they piss all over your achievements for that exactly reason, and after the dust is settled it becomes state religion, cruelest irony ever
if by faith both the emperor and Guilamen can become gods, what about Sanguinius that has been celebrated as a saint and saviour for way longer than Guilamen?
I think Guilliman's time in stasis is when he began to accrue faith. This would be the point where people would be making pilgrimages to see him in his timelocked state. This leads me to believe the other living loyalist Primarchs will not get the same change, what with being out of sight and mind for so long. Russ and Corax will likely be "warp things" because of their time in the Eye of Terror, I'm not sure about the Vulkan, Dorn, and the Lion.
This makes godhood sound like it's a curse and/or a burden. To do so would tie them down to perpetual service of the people. Maybe that's why the emperor was so adamant to avoid it. And maybe Roboute as well. I wonder who would be willing to take it up.
First the poster boys were the boys in blue, now your telling me their Primarch is going to be a God, it’s like they are forcing us to like the Ultramarines lol
@@nicholasjoseph9062 lions sleeping so technically he is alive and Corax is in the warp (Primarch analogy) so ya why did they not come back yet it’s not fair
I imagine in the future the Emperor and Ynnead in the warp is going to commit some sort of intense psychic suicide together, which doesn't destroy the chaos gods per say but rather - essentially - completely resets the powers within the warp, and take away any kind of consciousness the chaos gods might have had, as well as fry any chaos worshipper currently linked to them. The dark eldar might also suffer some sort of repercussion from this. That way the imperium will easily be able to clean up any remaining chaos influence within their empire, and will have a lot more resources to combat the other destructive forces such as the necrons, the tyranids and the orks. At this point the imperium will also have created a cease-fire agreement with the Eldar, having agreed to sacrifice their own gods to achieve this new state, so that they partly won't have to deal with each other either, and partly secure a kind of war alliance, to join together against the preforementioned forces. The Eldar will discover some ancient way to eradicate the Necrons since they once used to fight them back in the days. The tyranids will scatter once the Emperor's light disappears from the warp, and might even be scared off by the immense psychic shockwave that would nullify their shadow in the Warp. The orks will be culled like how the imperium and the eldars have learned. Then, when the emperor is finally gone, Guilliman will become the new "god" of the imperium and essentially take his fathers place, having learned from his past mistakes. The joker in this mess is the Tau. I have no idea how they would fit into all this.
So, is this a way to create the Imperium's version of the Daemon-Primarchs. This could mean more of the loyal Primarchs will return in a more divine form. I know recent lore has described Corax as having been changed in his time fighting in the Warp.
In a way this kind of happening to Lord Commander Dante as well. He is seen as a legend and almost a demigod in the eyes of those who know his name and deeds. Although it's not on the same level as Guilliman for obvious reason, but Dante allows his legend to grow because it gives the Imperium hope.
The book makes it pretty clear Guilliman has become suspicious of what the emperor has become hence why the emperor calls him betrayer and liar. Love what they’re doing with his character
Coo stuff. This does open up a lot of intersting directions for Guilliman as a character. A incubating god that resents his own divinity is a great idea, and could let to some really interesting moments and stories. Concerning him going aginst the church, I am really not that sure that he will do so. Because first and foremost Guilliman is pragmatic, and if his ideals gets in the way of what is best for the imperium and humanity as a whole, I think he will always choose what is best for humanity.
I can totally see guilliman getting living saint like power which would probably boost his warp based side like how Corax has his daemon form after spending forever hunting lorgar
I don't know about divine, but he's definitely a rally point on the field. I mean if I were to see him striding the battlefield, I'm gonna stick close to that guy, if possible. I mean it's a freaking Primarch. The Avenging Son himself. Good for us, bad for the enemy.
Crazy thought. Roboute becomes intrigued with this idea of faith and its power. Remembering his beloved brother hawk boy Sanguinis decides to have the entire imperium pray to glorious hawkboy Sanguinis during the next sanguinalia out of curiosity in the power of "faith". Sanguinis is reborn purely through faith. The imperium has birthed a new chaos god through faith alone. After 10k years lorgar has won as faith in the divine would always conquer the imperium. Crazy heresy I know.
40k books always fuck up amount of people. Like seriously? There are only Billions of people in the galaxy? There are BILLIONS ON TERRA. THERE ARE BILLIONS ON MODERN DAY EARTH BRUH
@@toledochristianmatthew9919 Maybe and maybe not. Reportedly that info comes from the chaos god themselves and chaos is extremely untrustworthy. It's more likely that Big E stole something from chaos gods to create the primarchs and there is a sister of silence guarding some kind of gate to chaos.
Big E: I'm not the messiah! Imperial citizens: HE'S THE MESSIAH! Guilliman: I'm not the messiah! Imperial citizens: HE'S THE MESSIAH! Oh how history repeats itself
Matt Ward is laughing out of joy so hard right now... his "Roboute the Spiritual Liege" concept survived several years of player hate, new editions and finally it evolved.
i will say that if the lion ever returns shit will get real RLY fast i can imagine guilliman chosing faith like his father because he must the lion returns and suddenly the lion is like BRO WHAT THE F IS THIS and boom civil war primarch vs primarch
It really feels like there is an analogy/parallel . "God" , in our outside of lore context is the Emperor . The big man in the sky/sitting on the golden throne. Guilliman , is Jesus, the son resurrected to serve for our sins. Would the story go in that direct, with the sacrifice? The return of Guilliman is basically the 2nd coming of Jesus. Is Jesus, a god? He is worshiped yes, prayed too, name invoked for good and ill, but is Jesus a god? If Jesus returned would he claim divinity?
Personally I think faith has always been a power in the universe. I don't know a whole lot about the lore but I always thought it was quite set in stone that latent psychic races like the Orkz have been using it for millions of years, if unintentionally, with their ramshackle armaments that can output a devastating amount of power, despite these creations theoretically being useless, and practically being useless in the hands of any other race. If you look at it like that, then you could also say that faith is a power that can be manufactured within the universe. What this means for the setting as a whole though, I have no idea.
Valrak, I think you are mistaking knowing without a shadow of a doubt he is a god, and believing in a god. If people choose the first option, they are no longer believing in him as a god, they are acknowledging a fact, which would be less powerful, By him denying his godhood, and people ignoring him and believing it anyway they contribute to his strength. Mwaa big kisses!
Yah I wonder why people always forget that. Even in the first book about the Luna wolves doesn't a girl banish a demon by using her faith that the emperor protects?
Theory: he’s going to finish his father’s work and find a way to finish the webway project the emperor was working on right before the Horus Heresy; creating a 40k version of age of Sigmar.
No, It is a different kind of power than the warp. Even persons without any psychic ability can benefit from faith. In fact faith acts as a defense against the warping powers of the chaos gods. In the Godblight book there is a very clear example of this when a crusade of faithful is launched aimed at liberating Iax from Nurgle and they keep going where those without faith would fall over and die instantly, their faith protecting them from disease and corruption.
In book "The Gate of Bones (Volume 2) Warhammer 40,000: Dawn of Fire" one of the main charackters gets an ancient weopon to destroy a "god",its summon souls of fallen imperials, which the Emperor couldnt save , it also lets people get crazy if they dont beleve in the Emperor enough, so you can see where this is heading to.
Ngl, i feel like the best outcome would be for guilliman to kinda accept that godhood but instead of people worshipping him as a god,they look up to him as a human that we all must strive to be
This brings up and interesting question about what if it hadn't been Roboute? Primarchs like Leman and Lorgar believed the Emperor was essentially a god during the Great Crusade. Presumably any of the Primarchs returning would have received the same treatment as Guilliman, would they have embraced godhood more readily?
I'm curious what this means for the other primarchs? Like the emperor said that Guiliman was all he had left. There is alot being put on his shoulders what happens when the lion awakes or one of the primarchs on a strole comes back?
Guilliman : I keep telling you people, I’m not a your new god!
Imperial Citizens : That’s exactly what our god would say! He’s our new god!”
😂😂😂
Guilliman getting flashbacks to how emps felt meeting Lorgar.
Is he jsut a very naughty boy?
I would like your comment but it has the perfect amount of likes.
Life of Brian 40k Ed
"If you haven't read Godblight, leave now"
Me: "No! Stick the spoilers straight into my veins!"
Guilliman : I'm not the Messiah!
Citizen of imperium: I say you are, Lord and I should know, I've followed a few!
Followers: Hail Messiah!
Guilliman : I'm not the Messiah! Will you please listen? I am not the Messiah, do you understand? Honestly!
Saint Celestine: Only the true Messiah denies His divinity
Guilliman: What? Well, what sort of chance does that give me? All right! I am the Messiah!
Citizen of Imperium: He is! He is the Messiah!
Guilliman : Now, fuck off!
(silence)
Citizen of Imperium : How shall we fuck off, O Lord?
Will the real Omnissiah please stand up?
He's not the messiah. He's a very naughty boy.
Life of brian for those who dont know
Looks to me like Guilliman will become the living avatar of The Emperor. The only vessel in the galaxy that can handle possession by him. Sounds great, right? Maybe. Except for Guilliman, of course, who'll stare behind his own eyes in horror as his father uses him like a puppet as he silently screams and fights back for control of his own body.
That would be fitting for 40k
And then Guiliman decides that chaos gods are his only escape
Reminds me of what originally happened to Fulgrim at the beginning of the Horus Heresy.
I think he can become a separate entity. There were certain circles of society where Thor was more popular than Odin, and Guiliman could potentially end up in a very similar situation.
If this happens Guillimans soul will be destroyed. I am basing this statement on the basis of what happens to posessed Chaos Marines. The demon takes them over and only their Body remains.
The emperor posessing Guilliman should work the same way.
just imagine , the lion waking up to find his brother a god , i dont think he will be happy, he'll be pissed
*WHERE ARE MY POSPEX CYCLONIC TORPEDOS!!!!*
I’m glad you finally realised that I’m better than my brothers chapter master
We all know Dorn should have returned instead of you
You're Codex of Astartes is the best toilet paper in the Eternal crusader
@@ChapterMasterValrak shut up valrak
@@ChapterMasterValrak Big Seeth.
@@Blast_S_rank_1 I’m sorry I thought this was America?
Sounds the same exact thing as Waaaagh! Energy. Human believes that Guilliman is a god. Guilliman slowly becomes a god.
There's also a nascent God of the Greater Good forming thanks to all the humans in the Tau empire, much to the horror of the Ethereals. Humanity is freaky man
Guilliman: I'm not your new god!
Citizen: That's what our god would say!
Emperor somewhere in the Warp: *sighs in Emperor*
*sighs in warp storm
@@Trawpenia emperor: this is getting worse
“END MY SUFFERING!”
Guilliman somewhere in there
Emperor somewhere in the Warp: *sighs in Emperor*
Guilliman: Buy primaris and paint them as Ultramarines, this is the last time I ask nicely.
The Wolf King, he say "Nah!"
emperors gunna be like "this is why i didnt want you lot worshipping me"
Guilliman: I don't want to be a god!
The Vast Majority of the Imperium: WELL TO DAMN BAD!!!
Imagine the lion wakes up to see Rowboat Gorillaman ascend to Godhood
How piss.ed would the Lion be hahaha
The Lion Heresy.
What in the Russ is going on here?
@@Heswe-sh2mt and half chapter turned traitor
A good example of FAITH in 40k is Ork's, they have faith the tank will work, so it works and shoots.
Even when the Engine is actually a cardboard box with an engine drawn with crayons.
Da tank will ork
@@grimgoreironhide9985 thats how orks machine work
@@superevolvedshinamalgamleo8168 Or how they can breathe in space because they haven't realised they need air.
Honestly, Roboute's apotheosis is probably the only thing that'll even the playing grounds between the Chaos Gods and the material world. He'll likely become something more powerful than a living saint. At the same time, what I think is happening is:
Given the Primarchs are half-made of warp stuff, what happened in Godblight was a piece of the Emperor possessing Guilliman, but the aftershock of such a possession awakened Guilliman pysker powers. It has been established that Roboute is psychically sensitive to certain things. When he teleports, he feels like a piece of the Warp, when talking to Cawl's device which requires psyker communion, he gets various degrees of migraine, the next logical leap is he develops psyker powers himself.
That being said, I do think the possession has left a side effect already. Fraiter Mathieu was afflicted by disease from Nurgle's cauldron itself, but Guilliman stood in the same room and heard his final words without protective gear and wasn't affected in the least. At least, no more than going to an average hostile atmosphere.
I would argue that Guilliman is already a god and he's already on the path to realising that something has changed in him since his revivification, but his path is ultimately about deciding what to do with it. Does he continue to sacrifice like he did in his first life pre-heresy, trying to keep the whole rotten thing functioning. Or does he tear it down and attempt a second Imperium Secundus?
There is already a point in the story where Chancellarius Tieron is watching Guilliman in fight and he says that you could see a play of light a Halo form around his head as he fought the demon
Valrak, I think Guilliman already showed his "godhood" at the end of the book. In the chapter where Guilliman wakes up in Nurgle's realm, I don't think its the Emperor talking through Guilliman, but rather the Emperor waking up the "god" aspect of Guilliman.
In the book, nearly every conversation in that chapter shows Guilliman referring to himself as "The Avenging Son" and "Roboute Guilliman", and I don't think the Emperor will hide behind another person's name as evidenced by the HH books where he talks to the chaos gods directly.
So the only conclusion that I have is that faith has already started to change Guilliman, resulting in a split personality. Time will tell which personality will win.
I don't know if I have an "issue" exactly, but considering that for oh, say, 9,500 years people have been celebrating Sanguinalia and revering the sacrifice of Sanguinius, what has that done to his Spirit?
Well, his Avatar appears to aid his sons from time to time, no?
@@BaldPolishBiotechnol also he gives visions to his sons
@@ryankujawa7062 That is true as well. I wonder if he could return bodily in the future...
The Sanguinor? Mephiston? The fact that they have some of the most powerful marines alive? Idk man you tell me what it did
Now just watch the Chaos Gods raise up Abbadon to be the Demon Prince equivalent of Gilliman, only to get curb stomped immediately.
Abaddon should never match any of the Primarchs.
Abaddon doesn’t want to ascend
@@TheTrveMothlord Yep, if he ascend to domonhood, he cannot enter real space whenever he wants and need.
It's interesting how Guilliman is getting into the same situation as the Emperor, being called a GOD but at the same time telling people that you aren't.
It happened before it will happen again.
“I am not a god!”
-says the 9-10 foot tall man who has 20+ brothers of the same height and taller each with their own oddly unique abilities and literally can conquer (most) worlds diplomatically
Like father, like son
Maybe he'll do both? Considering Guilliman's character, he might guide people to a renewed faith, whilst simultaneously reforming/ weakening the decadent behaviour of the worst elements of the church.
Turning faith into a very pragmatic weapon. That way he can both deny being a god and still reap the benefits of faith.
Bear in mind that all the Primarchs have some sort of psychic power. The ability to inspire and bring some form of order to the warp seems like a power that suits Guilliman.
I think Roboute is going to be turned into an Emperor branded version of a primarch chaos prince. The Lion or Dorn are going to show up as Roboute ascends and they'll try to kill him at first, after? I dunno.
As a Salamander, I refuse to recognize Guilliman as a God. Complete blasphemy. Heresy as I see it.
VULCAN LIVES *stomp* *stomp*
@@CharinVZain Vulkan Lives brotha!!
DEATH TO THE FALSE GOD!
What about Vulkan?
Heres a spin on the power of faith turning Gulliman into a god, Sanguinius has been worshipped for 10k years as son of the emporer, his sacrifice honoured etc, he even has a day a year in his honour…. what has that done to his soul in the warp?
*coughcough* The sanguinor
The rebirth true one of his sons..? Sanguinor?
@@cryamistellimek9184 sanguinor isnt actually sanguinius mighz be like a shard of him or has a part of his power but you can see what you can assume to be actual sanguinius showing himself in visions to mephiston and dante and like pulling them away from death. Think Sanguinius says hes dead or denies being sanginius whatever but thats probably just sanginus + whatever ppl belive him to which changed him
Like think its implied that sanginor is avatar of sanginius's nobility and stuff and mephiston became avatar for black rage and sanginious is like nobility and rage combined
see the sanguinor isnt known to the imperium at large, but maybe its the faith in sanguinius that allows him to manifest in times of need 🤔🤔
my own train of thought is tied to the vengeful spirit where part of sangiunious soul is trapped, what if faith empowers it enough to fight back against the corruption in the vessal? free the fallen trapped in the ash statues? could it send a signal to mephiston or something allowing for a black legion vs blood angels showdown to free his trapped shard? the possibilities are potentially endless
Everything is going far too smoothly now, i am hoping one of the visions Lorgar was shown happens now:
~The ship burned~
On the deck around him lay a hundred dead mortals and slain ultramarines. The walls of the strategium shuddered, venting air pleasure and feeding the flames sweeping across the entire bridge deck. thrones stood in flames. The fire was already crementing those that had fallen in the last few minutes.
Lorgar saw himself at the heart of the flames, his crozius in his gauntlets. The image wore red armour, in mirror of the world bearers he had seen at the eternity gate, and cast its maul aside with an angry florish. whatever battle it had been fighting had taken its toll, the image of himself stood cracked armour, with its face blackened by burn scarring.
´for Monarchia,´the image of Lorgar raged through bleeding gums and split lips. ´for watching me kneel in the dust of my many failures.´
At first Lorgar couldn't make out who his image was addressing. Then, with a grim and wounded majesty, Guilliman staggered from the flames. Silently defiant even as his armour blackened into a burning ruin, the lord of Macragge drew a gladius. His helm was gone, baring a face that remained stoic despite a crushed skull. One arm was gone, ending at the elbow. Blood ran in viscous rivulets from the joints of his armour. His white cloak was aflame.
Lorgars image threw his hand forward. Psychic energy so intensely golden it aborted direct sight, haloed and crowned his head with three aetheric horns. A wave of unseen force pounded into the ultramarines liege, hurling him back through the fire and against the wall beyond.
Guilliman crashed to the deck, a twitching, ragged marionette with severed strings. and then, with his remaining hand, he reached for the fallen gladius again.
Lorgar crushed the hand beneath a crimson boot.
´this my brother, is for every life lost in the name of a lie´. Lorgar hauled the lord of macragge up by the throat, smashing him back against the wall even as he strangled him. ´Your fleet burns. Your astral kingdom dies next´
Guilliman managed a smile
//Eye of Terra -p :160-161
We don't talk about that book. The writing is terrible.
Chaos has multiple primarchs, things arent smooth at all, the imperium is still loosing
Here's an idea - the spirits of the Primarchs are derived from the warp. Did the Emperor reincarnate human heroes from history into the bodies of the Primarchs? Or maybe lesser Gods who existed as relics in the Warp?
In Terra alone, there is at least 2 quadrillion people. So, I reckon that "trillions believing in Guilliman" is a strong understatement.
Rogal: "aight I'm back with the milk how has it been"
Roboute: "well..."
Rogal: "what the hell I leave for what a few hundred years and everyone worships you like a god alright I'm done"
If anything he’ll become like the Messiah. God reborn in the flesh to bring salvation and all that
I think that Guilliman will definitely get a power up in the books/lore now. After the Emperors intervention, I think he’ll essentially get some residual power left in him, so to speak lol
The emperor tells Guilliman he is the Imperium’s last hope. Basically, this novel is telling us that we’re never getting another loyalist Primarch returning.
Welp....
About that brother
Welp…
The moment Guilliman wields the Emperor's flaming sword gives the Big E a convenient excuse to guide Guilliman how to use the sword's ultimate power while temporarily possessing him
IF Guilly became a god i can see that causing a resurgence in Chaos anyway. You can see citizens, lords etc becoming jealous of his power and falling to chaos.
Guilliman is between loyalist and renegade - leaning more towards renegade. If you listen to what he says to Mathieu's corpse at the end of 'Godblight', he states what he TRULY thinks about The Emperor... especially when you consider that he ordered to make sure ALL records of the conversation weren't possible and to have everyone but him and Mathieu out of the room. Based on his words and actions during that event, I think he's going to end up wanting to find a way to destroy The Emperor.
Lorgar is probably laughing his ass off now. OOuuHHH the hypocrisy.
The Urizen isnt laughing.
He is pissing himself at Sicarus because of a giant crow hunting him.
@@JudicialBrat Sicarius is now the Guard of Guilliman :v
p2
@@akkoo3966 Sicarus, not Sicarius. Sicarius=worthless moron Sicarius=Daemon World that has become Chaos Vatican
an audiodrama already mentioned Lorgar is pissed off after hearing about the Imperial Creed
@@eyeballpapercut4400 makes sense, they piss all over your achievements for that exactly reason, and after the dust is settled it becomes state religion, cruelest irony ever
if by faith both the emperor and Guilamen can become gods, what about Sanguinius that has been celebrated as a saint and saviour for way longer than Guilamen?
Sanguinor is here to save the day.
Tbf, Dante spoke to him in the weird purgatory/afterlife as he was dying, so I’m sure he’s kicking around somewhere in some manner in the immaterium
NECKTIES FOR THE FATHERS DAY AND MUGS FOR THE ARMCHAIR THRONE!
-Ultramarines and successor chapters
I think Guilliman's time in stasis is when he began to accrue faith. This would be the point where people would be making pilgrimages to see him in his timelocked state. This leads me to believe the other living loyalist Primarchs will not get the same change, what with being out of sight and mind for so long. Russ and Corax will likely be "warp things" because of their time in the Eye of Terror, I'm not sure about the Vulkan, Dorn, and the Lion.
Guilliman is now space Jesus. Sent by the emperor to save us all
This reminds me of Monty Pythons 'The Life of Brian'' iconics scene.
"Yes inquisitor, this video title right there!"
Trillions of people? Nah... Many quadrillions... Tens of quadrillions at least...
This makes godhood sound like it's a curse and/or a burden. To do so would tie them down to perpetual service of the people.
Maybe that's why the emperor was so adamant to avoid it. And maybe Roboute as well. I wonder who would be willing to take it up.
First the poster boys were the boys in blue, now your telling me their Primarch is going to be a God, it’s like they are forcing us to like the Ultramarines lol
Because he's the only primarch we have right now that's confirmed breathing
@@nicholasjoseph9062 lions sleeping so technically he is alive and Corax is in the warp (Primarch analogy) so ya why did they not come back yet it’s not fair
Forget Life of Brian, it’s now Life of Guilliman
Allways look on the bright side of life... (whistles)
Hmm! What if Guilliman is becoming the Emperor's Daemon Prince?
Of course, this would mean no such path for Sanguinius returning.
Yes but sanguinuis could still return as a warp entity like the neverborn
I imagine in the future the Emperor and Ynnead in the warp is going to commit some sort of intense psychic suicide together, which doesn't destroy the chaos gods per say but rather - essentially - completely resets the powers within the warp, and take away any kind of consciousness the chaos gods might have had, as well as fry any chaos worshipper currently linked to them. The dark eldar might also suffer some sort of repercussion from this.
That way the imperium will easily be able to clean up any remaining chaos influence within their empire, and will have a lot more resources to combat the other destructive forces such as the necrons, the tyranids and the orks. At this point the imperium will also have created a cease-fire agreement with the Eldar, having agreed to sacrifice their own gods to achieve this new state, so that they partly won't have to deal with each other either, and partly secure a kind of war alliance, to join together against the preforementioned forces. The Eldar will discover some ancient way to eradicate the Necrons since they once used to fight them back in the days. The tyranids will scatter once the Emperor's light disappears from the warp, and might even be scared off by the immense psychic shockwave that would nullify their shadow in the Warp. The orks will be culled like how the imperium and the eldars have learned.
Then, when the emperor is finally gone, Guilliman will become the new "god" of the imperium and essentially take his fathers place, having learned from his past mistakes.
The joker in this mess is the Tau. I have no idea how they would fit into all this.
So, is this a way to create the Imperium's version of the Daemon-Primarchs. This could mean more of the loyal Primarchs will return in a more divine form. I know recent lore has described Corax as having been changed in his time fighting in the Warp.
Lol Lion would be sooooo pissed about Bobby G becoming a god
Warhammer 40k: Age Of Guilliman
Humanity is awakening and evolving and into Orks.
WHAAAAGHHH are you implying?
*Loads holy stubba*
@@whythelongface64 Nuffin, Mr. Inkwizitork. Ain't no 'eresy 'ere.
yeah, this whole "power of faith" thing is just glorified whaagh energy.
@@coryray8436 BETTA NOT BE, IN DA EMPRAH'S NAME, ALL DA SPIKEY GITS WILL GET A PROPA GOOD STOMPIN'!
The writers are devolving is more accurate
Truely the best and most powerful primarch to exist 🍻.no other primarch has or could lead the entire emperium the way he has
so big E = Odin
Gully = Thor
In a way this kind of happening to Lord Commander Dante as well. He is seen as a legend and almost a demigod in the eyes of those who know his name and deeds. Although it's not on the same level as Guilliman for obvious reason, but Dante allows his legend to grow because it gives the Imperium hope.
Wouldnt all the Primarchs be viewed as Gods if the Emperor ascends to godhood? Sounds like a way to resurrect the dead.
The book makes it pretty clear Guilliman has become suspicious of what the emperor has become hence why the emperor calls him betrayer and liar. Love what they’re doing with his character
Trillions is too small of a number of people in the Imperium. There could be trillions of people on a single hive planet.
And there are about 1 million settled worlds with either hundreds of millions up to trillions on them.
imagine the reason why he can get out of his armor is because of the faith of the ppl enhancing him
Coo stuff. This does open up a lot of intersting directions for Guilliman as a character. A incubating god that resents his own divinity is a great idea, and could let to some really interesting moments and stories. Concerning him going aginst the church, I am really not that sure that he will do so. Because first and foremost Guilliman is pragmatic, and if his ideals gets in the way of what is best for the imperium and humanity as a whole, I think he will always choose what is best for humanity.
Really been enjoying the theory vids this week
I can totally see guilliman getting living saint like power which would probably boost his warp based side like how Corax has his daemon form after spending forever hunting lorgar
Before you know it there will be no other chapters......there will only be Ultramarines
I don't know about divine, but he's definitely a rally point on the field. I mean if I were to see him striding the battlefield, I'm gonna stick close to that guy, if possible. I mean it's a freaking Primarch. The Avenging Son himself. Good for us, bad for the enemy.
Crazy thought. Roboute becomes intrigued with this idea of faith and its power. Remembering his beloved brother hawk boy Sanguinis decides to have the entire imperium pray to glorious hawkboy Sanguinis during the next sanguinalia out of curiosity in the power of "faith". Sanguinis is reborn purely through faith. The imperium has birthed a new chaos god through faith alone. After 10k years lorgar has won as faith in the divine would always conquer the imperium. Crazy heresy I know.
40k books always fuck up amount of people. Like seriously? There are only Billions of people in the galaxy? There are BILLIONS ON TERRA. THERE ARE BILLIONS ON MODERN DAY EARTH BRUH
So Guilliman bout to become a Daemon Saint like Corvus?
*Emperor looking over his Primarch recipe which includes a dash of Warp magic*... Always have been
@@beardedsquire I mean didn't the Emperor make deals with beings in the Warp in order to create the Primarchs?
@@toledochristianmatthew9919 Maybe and maybe not. Reportedly that info comes from the chaos god themselves and chaos is extremely untrustworthy. It's more likely that Big E stole something from chaos gods to create the primarchs and there is a sister of silence guarding some kind of gate to chaos.
So the humans are the new orks.
Faith being powerful was always there, the Orks do the exact same thing.
Guilliman becoming a god...
Presumably right after this reveal, Guy Haley will pull off his fake face mask to reveal he was Matt Ward all along! 😬
In before the narrative of Jesus plays out, ending with Guilliman being "crucified" by his own and those he came to save..whatever that looks like.
He'll come back to life in 3 days... lol.. GW ain't that cheeky.
It would be cool to see the Devine intervention come into hus 40k rules and give him a deny the witch aura
The Lion needs to wake up and put an end to this blasphemy!!!
Ultradepression intensifyes
Big E: I'm not the messiah!
Imperial citizens: HE'S THE MESSIAH!
Guilliman: I'm not the messiah!
Imperial citizens: HE'S THE MESSIAH!
Oh how history repeats itself
Matt Ward is laughing out of joy so hard right now... his "Roboute the Spiritual Liege" concept survived several years of player hate, new editions and finally it evolved.
I just want Rob G to go look for his brothers
i will say that if the lion ever returns shit will get real RLY fast
i can imagine guilliman chosing faith like his father because he must
the lion returns and suddenly the lion is like
BRO WHAT THE F IS THIS
and boom civil war primarch vs primarch
I like this more vindication for logar.
It really feels like there is an analogy/parallel . "God" , in our outside of lore context is the Emperor . The big man in the sky/sitting on the golden throne. Guilliman , is Jesus, the son resurrected to serve for our sins. Would the story go in that direct, with the sacrifice?
The return of Guilliman is basically the 2nd coming of Jesus. Is Jesus, a god? He is worshiped yes, prayed too, name invoked for good and ill, but is Jesus a god? If Jesus returned would he claim divinity?
Apparently faith is only a powerful weapon when you worship the Emperor
Hey remember when Valrak said: "I'm gonna try doing videos NOW AND THEN"? :-D glad you are feeling well enough to make all these videos!
And nothing can go wrong … ohh no it all went wrong
Deamon Primarch of Order, by name of the Emperor.
Would be real hypocrisy if after doing what he did to Lorgar, Big E would in fact admit he's a god.
Personally I think faith has always been a power in the universe. I don't know a whole lot about the lore but I always thought it was quite set in stone that latent psychic races like the Orkz have been using it for millions of years, if unintentionally, with their ramshackle armaments that can output a devastating amount of power, despite these creations theoretically being useless, and practically being useless in the hands of any other race. If you look at it like that, then you could also say that faith is a power that can be manufactured within the universe. What this means for the setting as a whole though, I have no idea.
Valrak, I think you are mistaking knowing without a shadow of a doubt he is a god, and believing in a god. If people choose the first option, they are no longer believing in him as a god, they are acknowledging a fact, which would be less powerful, By him denying his godhood, and people ignoring him and believing it anyway they contribute to his strength. Mwaa big kisses!
The Emperor is getting pragmatic about the use of faith and weaponising it. So is Guilliman.
Faith has always been a power for the Imperium, even in the Horus Heresy.
Yah I wonder why people always forget that.
Even in the first book about the Luna wolves doesn't a girl banish a demon by using her faith that the emperor protects?
Robute is an HR manager in power armour, they are usually middle aged women who think they are god like so seems legit.
To accurate...
And works 1h a day and cahes out full pay..
Theory: he’s going to finish his father’s work and find a way to finish the webway project the emperor was working on right before the Horus Heresy; creating a 40k version of age of Sigmar.
Isnt faith warp fuel?
No, It is a different kind of power than the warp. Even persons without any psychic ability can benefit from faith. In fact faith acts as a defense against the warping powers of the chaos gods. In the Godblight book there is a very clear example of this when a crusade of faithful is launched aimed at liberating Iax from Nurgle and they keep going where those without faith would fall over and die instantly, their faith protecting them from disease and corruption.
@@Destyvirago But this is based on the emperors warp power no? They are empowering it with their faith?
In book "The Gate of Bones (Volume 2) Warhammer 40,000: Dawn of Fire" one of the main charackters gets an ancient weopon to destroy a "god",its summon souls of fallen imperials, which the Emperor couldnt save , it also lets people get crazy if they dont beleve in the Emperor enough, so you can see where this is heading to.
Ngl, i feel like the best outcome would be for guilliman to kinda accept that godhood but instead of people worshipping him as a god,they look up to him as a human that we all must strive to be
Ah yes. The lawyer god
This brings up and interesting question about what if it hadn't been Roboute? Primarchs like Leman and Lorgar believed the Emperor was essentially a god during the Great Crusade. Presumably any of the Primarchs returning would have received the same treatment as Guilliman, would they have embraced godhood more readily?
Is it possible that Guilliman is becoming a vessel for some of the fractured shards of the Emperor?
I'm curious what this means for the other primarchs? Like the emperor said that Guiliman was all he had left. There is alot being put on his shoulders what happens when the lion awakes or one of the primarchs on a strole comes back?
Well, he can't go renouncing Godhood yet - the Emperor needs Guilliman to bring him back to proper life. He's got a mission to fulfil.
the smurf is just a placeholder until the onehanded dorn glorious return.