Well Nate you've done it again... Introduced me to yet another brilliant person (in this case someone I did not know) doing amazing work in this world. Daniel Pauly says wise and stunning things. And as usual, your questions and comments served to heighten the delight and insight. Of course, there are many "heavy" elements in a conversation such as this. However, the addition of personal stories and the hints at what might be done, serve up the "delight portions of the conversation, in addition to the OMG, what-have-we-done parts that have me occasionally wanting to hide under the covers.
Raised my eyebrows, Nate. New York State has put emissions reductions goals into place that ‘restore’ CO2 to 1990 levels. With all the work I’ve done in Community Based Social Marketing at this point, I would say that if they had used 1950 as the goal that it would present an unattainable target to which nobody would sign on and create a widespread fatalistic social response. Our Shifting Baseline keeps us from being awake to the idea that 1990 is not good enough. Glad to be part of all of this, and thank you. Mark Haubner
Fabulous guest - I learned so much that I simply did not know. And I loved his attitude which became more evident as the interview progressed. This podcast is an amazing discovery!
The subsidies, the big fleet owners playing golf with the ministers, how this is a political decision. The gill oxygen limitation , didn't know about that. I have been a vegetarian/plant based vegan for the last 30 plus years, the data does support that would be best for the planet. Great conversation.
Great conversation and so much wisdom here! But I also have to wonder why you asked the question about eating salmon.... Of course it's better not to eat them at all. This couldn't be more obvious! And this goes for all meat and dairy as well! We put so much intensive energy, fossil fuel, land resources, and other perfectly edible food into growing these animals. True, individually we can't fix this problem through reduction, but we can preserve much more life and give ourselves a better chance if the majority of us take action and change. No, it won't be enough, but rethinking how and what we eat makes a HUGE difference, if nothing else just for the animals we aren't bringing into the world just to suffer and become our tasty source of pleasure. All the calories and proteins we need are found in plants if we just put in the minimal effort to educate ourselves on which are needed. And there's plenty of tasty options available! I can speak from many years of experience and feel better than ever, and I never get sick either... Didn't even have to worry about this latest plague.... Please consider all the harm done by animal agg, because seriously if we have any hope of stopping this train, the food we eat and the energy that goes into its production is a huge bulk of the task at hand. Not to mention, we could all contribute to stopping this ongoing holocaust on our fellow earthlings.... The suffering is unimaginable, but we all know it is happening and that we contribute to it every time we put animals on our plates.... I really wish this became a more integral part of the climate conversation, because it's not only obvious how much it would help, but it's backed by solid science. A report in the journal Nature found that an area the size of Russia can be restored to natural habitat if we became plant fed, and that same logic can be applied to our suffering seas.... Imagine how different the world would look if you and everyone who cared enough just made this simple shift. Imagine how much more ecologically aware we'd become if we didn't have the cognitive dissonance of eating such suffering every day and burying that reality in our subconscious mind.... I know from experience many people start thinking much more ecologically when they begin to rethink what they eat..... Let's at least try to make that easy change, because the energy question is far more complex and difficult to affect!
Fish can be grown in oceans by growing Diatom Algae and we can restore fish back to the historical peak and even surpass the historical peaks. Diatoms provide both food and oxygen to the fish.
Great dialogue, Nate! I really loved the way Daniel almost always used the term global warming rather than climate change. His two areas of focus, fish migration and fish physiology were on point. Still, the focus on overconsumption without mentioning overpopulation is remiss. Daniel’s allusion to the current “vaccines” slowing the evolution of SARS Cov2 seems a bit naive. Also, weaning civilization off fossil fuels seems like a damned if you do damned if you don’t proposition. I’m still unclear which direction buys the most time.
The oceans have absorbed something like %95 of all additional heating since the start of the industrial revolution. With other positive feedback loops and tipping points.. Are we headed for a Canfield ocean?? If so.. ☠️
Personally I think we're very far away from that - but who really knows. That its happened (many times) before and we are emitting things at a pace (not scale) much faster than volcanic provinces of old, its at least in the distribution of possibiliities. if we somehow pull out all stops and kick growth can in creative ways and become Mordor society it would become more likely.
I am a big fan of Daniel Pauly but always finding irritating that he takes credit for inventing the term of Shifting Baseline. He did not! The term and concept was first proposed by Ian McHarg in 1969 in his manifesto 'Design With Nature' - just giving credit where credit is due here. Otherwise, thank you for this interesting interview :)
@@EvolutionWendy That is not a study. I'm not making a claim, but I would be interested to see a published paper that will show that the claim is valid.
With respect, everyone I know is vxd. We all got - it - at least once, some it was 3 times. I worry about the efficacy of the therapy and "othering" of fellow citizens more than a viral partical. To me, it is all to culty cult and political.
There are thousands of studies out there on this, just type "mutation risks unvaccinated" in google scholar. Niesen et al., 2021 is a recent paper that looks at how Covid vaccination decreases the mutation rate of SARS-CoV-2 for example.
How about a few followup questions instead of statistics? eg., what species of fish? where are they caught? who is catching them? what techniques? disappointing interview......
Daniel Pauley is an international treasure.
Well Nate you've done it again... Introduced me to yet another brilliant person (in this case someone I did not know) doing amazing work in this world. Daniel Pauly says wise and stunning things. And as usual, your questions and comments served to heighten the delight and insight. Of course, there are many "heavy" elements in a conversation such as this. However, the addition of personal stories and the hints at what might be done, serve up the "delight portions of the conversation, in addition to the OMG, what-have-we-done parts that have me occasionally wanting to hide under the covers.
Raised my eyebrows, Nate. New York State has put emissions reductions goals into place that ‘restore’ CO2 to 1990 levels. With all the work I’ve done in Community Based Social Marketing at this point, I would say that if they had used 1950 as the goal that it would present an unattainable target to which nobody would sign on and create a widespread fatalistic social response. Our Shifting Baseline keeps us from being awake to the idea that 1990 is not good enough.
Glad to be part of all of this, and thank you. Mark Haubner
An interview that is as Empowering as it is informative and beyond-timely. Thank you both!
Amazing podcast. The oxygen depletion on the oceans as the principle risk to fishes was a surprising revelation for me. Thank you Nate and Pauli🙏
Don't focus so much on less consumption, but on MORE IMPACT. This has been a highly inspiring conversation, and also extremely interesting. Thank you!
Thank you both Daniel and Nate, keep teaching, teaching, teaching
Thank❤🌹🙏 you, Daniel Pauly and Nate! People, just imagine if we had no military industrial complex😢😢😢😢!
Great discussion, Mr. Pauly is a well of knowledge
This is such devastating news regarding oxygen with our ocean thank you deary and have shared with All 🐟🐬🐋🌏🙏🏼
Fabulous guest - I learned so much that I simply did not know. And I loved his attitude which became more evident as the interview progressed. This podcast is an amazing discovery!
Thanks Nate and Daniel for an enlightening and honest discussion that didn't shy away from the nature of our predicament. #TalkCollapse
The subsidies, the big fleet owners playing golf with the ministers, how this is a political decision. The gill oxygen limitation , didn't know about that. I have been a vegetarian/plant based vegan for the last 30 plus years, the data does support that would be best for the planet. Great conversation.
Another fabulous discussion. I'm learning a great deal from this series. Thanks Nate !
As a fisheries biologist I'm going to enjoy this conversation - Thanks Nate and Daniel!!
Eye opening and interesting from start to finish.
Daniel Pauly is great.
Great interview, wonderful scientist, thanks!
Excellent guest, thank you!
Great conversation and so much wisdom here!
But I also have to wonder why you asked the question about eating salmon....
Of course it's better not to eat them at all. This couldn't be more obvious!
And this goes for all meat and dairy as well!
We put so much intensive energy, fossil fuel, land resources, and other perfectly edible food into growing these animals.
True, individually we can't fix this problem through reduction, but we can preserve much more life and give ourselves a better chance if the majority of us take action and change.
No, it won't be enough, but rethinking how and what we eat makes a HUGE difference, if nothing else just for the animals we aren't bringing into the world just to suffer and become our tasty source of pleasure.
All the calories and proteins we need are found in plants if we just put in the minimal effort to educate ourselves on which are needed. And there's plenty of tasty options available!
I can speak from many years of experience and feel better than ever, and I never get sick either...
Didn't even have to worry about this latest plague....
Please consider all the harm done by animal agg, because seriously if we have any hope of stopping this train, the food we eat and the energy that goes into its production is a huge bulk of the task at hand.
Not to mention, we could all contribute to stopping this ongoing holocaust on our fellow earthlings....
The suffering is unimaginable, but we all know it is happening and that we contribute to it every time we put animals on our plates....
I really wish this became a more integral part of the climate conversation, because it's not only obvious how much it would help, but it's backed by solid science.
A report in the journal Nature found that an area the size of Russia can be restored to natural habitat if we became plant fed, and that same logic can be applied to our suffering seas....
Imagine how different the world would look if you and everyone who cared enough just made this simple shift.
Imagine how much more ecologically aware we'd become if we didn't have the cognitive dissonance of eating such suffering every day and burying that reality in our subconscious mind....
I know from experience many people start thinking much more ecologically when they begin to rethink what they eat.....
Let's at least try to make that easy change, because the energy question is far more complex and difficult to affect!
"The more we push toward the edge, the more we need scientists."
Watched/listen to a couple of his talks, impressive. Especially the pictures of sport fishing in Florida to illustrate shifting baselines.
Another truly great interview
Thank you for this informative conversation
Diatoms can be grown in and around Salmon cages,
to keep the water clean and also to grow live feed for the Salmon.
Worldometer just ticked down oil by one year.
14,779 Days to the end of oil (~40 years)
65,953,314 Net population growth this year
Fish can be grown in oceans by growing Diatom Algae and we can restore fish back to the historical peak and even surpass the historical peaks. Diatoms provide both food and oxygen to the fish.
North Atlantic peak fish - 1975. Worldwide - 1996
Wow!
Cod went first. When the oceans die, we follow soon. ❤️❤️🌎❤️❤️
Great dialogue, Nate! I really loved the way Daniel almost always used the term global warming rather than climate change. His two areas of focus, fish migration and fish physiology were on point. Still, the focus on overconsumption without mentioning overpopulation is remiss.
Daniel’s allusion to the current “vaccines” slowing the evolution of SARS Cov2 seems a bit naive. Also, weaning civilization off fossil fuels seems like a damned if you do damned if you don’t proposition. I’m still unclear which direction buys the most time.
Do NOT eat farmed salmon! It`s shit and everything about it is shit! It`s an embarrasment...I`m norwegian :/ It`s not fish, just another pollutant....
Oh crap are we in deep trouble
The oceans have absorbed something like %95 of all additional heating since the start of the industrial revolution. With other positive feedback loops and tipping points.. Are we headed for a Canfield ocean?? If so.. ☠️
Personally I think we're very far away from that - but who really knows. That its happened (many times) before and we are emitting things at a pace (not scale) much faster than volcanic provinces of old, its at least in the distribution of possibiliities. if we somehow pull out all stops and kick growth can in creative ways and become Mordor society it would become more likely.
👍
Wow, I never knew fish migrate not for food but to breathe. Even small temperature rises can mean they can't breathe.
Great discussion, but disappointing human population wasn't mentioned as needing to be addressed.
I am a big fan of Daniel Pauly but always finding irritating that he takes credit for inventing the term of Shifting Baseline. He did not! The term and concept was first proposed by Ian McHarg in 1969 in his manifesto 'Design With Nature' - just giving credit where credit is due here. Otherwise, thank you for this interesting interview :)
“Another fine kettle of fish Ollie”
Respectfully, I would like to see a study about the claim that viruses are mutating more rapidly because of unvaccinated people.
Makes complete sense this claim would be pushed by drug companies and msm.
Also respectfully, the mathematics is that the more people who are infected the more mutations arise.
@@EvolutionWendy That is not a study. I'm not making a claim, but I would be interested to see a published paper that will show that the claim is valid.
With respect, everyone I know is vxd. We all got - it - at least once, some it was 3 times.
I worry about the efficacy of the therapy and "othering" of fellow citizens more than a viral partical. To me, it is all to culty cult and political.
There are thousands of studies out there on this, just type "mutation risks unvaccinated" in google scholar. Niesen et al., 2021 is a recent paper that looks at how Covid vaccination decreases the mutation rate of SARS-CoV-2 for example.
Dying seas, dying biosphere... Collective suicide
'Keep on shopping, everything is fine'
Funny when he tells about his youth and Germany, he sounds a bit like Moroder in the "Giorgio by Moroder" daft punk tune :)
Why not grow fish in the open oceans, instead of trying to impose conservation solutions.
It is quite easy to grow the native fish in the open oceans.
The cold winters are coming back.
How about a few followup questions instead of statistics? eg., what species of fish? where are they caught? who is catching them? what techniques? disappointing interview......