Zora dutifully waits alone a thousand years for someone named Craft to show up. Finally he does. She falls in love. And he leaves. She realizes…”Wait, that it? Seriously??” Zora snaps! She returns to the Federation… This time…it’s personal.
I am glad I was not the only one thinking of Zora. Sending her knowledge into oblivion was stupid but sending her as a sentient being was cruel and inhumane.
In Season 4 she decided to serve the Federation/Starfleet. Sora and the Discovery are the only ship/AI capable of surviving for 1000 years without a crew. Sora can control the Discovery herself, carry out maintenance and... the Discovery after its dismantling (23rd century Version) is technologically completely uninteresting for pirates.
@@TheTaurus104 i know she can, but doesn't mean she should, it'd be a torment for her to be alone in the void for a 1000 years, besides what people expect of what she would be encounter in a 1000 years? better society? what if it's actually the opposite? tbh it's reckless and illogical decision
@@_martian101 also her choice she wass not forced she was told the mission specs the time she would be alone for and she was fine with it zora is immortal as long as the programable matter she is made of remains then she is immortal she can never die she may very well be the last thing left when the universe ends and then she will be alone for ever until she decideds to end her self so to her 1000 years is nothing it is a blink of an eye.
@@naturelass I won't say it's a blink of an eye, if you can live 1000 years would you spend your time on a desolate island with no one for a decade? It's still a long torment despite of her potential lifetime, she could have build more advanced society than the federation in a 1000 years if she's allowed to live in terralysium for example, she won't get broken and she won't get tortured
zora was not forced she was considered a fully sentient being with the right to choose she had the right to not follow the mission given to her if she had no choice then yes but she had a choice.
@@naturelass And no Starfleet officer has ever disobeyed nonsensical orders? Michael ordered her into Oblivion because she knew it would be relevant for some future event - when Craft arrives - but then Zora continued to wait afterward, and for what? The mission was complete, but now she'll die alone for no reason.
20th century nasa space probes have turned into unstoppable digital gods on at least two ocassions, but sure let's just leave fucking zora unattended for a thousand years.
I can’t tell if I’m supposed to feel some sadness that Zora was let alone for so long or sadness because of the cruelty of her Captain telling her to screw off for a vague amount of time for mission we don’t know what or if will happen. You know, basically abandoning her dog in the middle of a desert. Again Disco producers and writers underdeveloped a potentially great character who had I been there would’ve had an undercurrent story arc of Zora being the computer from that probe in S2 gaining sentience now gathering and learning what it means to be human adding that “data” and have the undercurrent analogy of never stop learning to better yourself. And having Zora be the one who chooses to go off on her own to explore strange new worlds, to seek out new life and new civilizations , going boldly we’re no…one…has gone before
"I'm called the Craft." "Because you're so crafty?" "No. I like to make macaroni pictures and funny bugs with pipe cleaners. Replicate three sets of googly eyes and five empty jugs of orange juice please."
This can't be a good idea. I will leave a sentient being alone: solitary confinement, and it will not go crazy. Burnham questions all types of orders, but she doesn't question this one?
The show pretty much establishes that Burnham is perfect in every way, and anyone who questions her judgement is wrong, so of course Burnham wouldn't question the order to send Zora away ... Burnham was in charge, she made the decision, she was the one giving the order, and Burnham is never wrong. And, if Burnham was ever wrong, something would happen to prove that she was right all along, so there's no point in questioning Burnham. At least, that's my takeaway from the prairie pie that is STD.
@@leonielson7138it’s how the show was written. She doesn’t have to be corrected because her character is all knowing and perfect. Burnham never gets things wrong even when she is absolutely wrong the universe will wave its hands and make it so it ends up to be right.
This was all done to give the ship "feelings" in Season 4. So they could ditch the ship and AI into oblivion without a care in the universe. No attempt to move the AI. No attempt to house the Discovery in a stardock for safekeeping. No attempt by the crew in regards to the AI's well-being.
I like to throw in a Quote from tng: A single Data - and forgive me, Commander - is a curiosity. A wonder, even. But thousands of Datas - isn't that becoming... a race? And won't we be judged by how we treat that race? This is a starfleet captain that argues for an android. For a friend and fellow officer. Instead new trek gave us enslavment, misstreatment of sentient machines, as well as men being made looking stupid in comparision to women yet 30 to 40 years ago somehow shows managed to be more progressive, positive as well as advocating for protecting even the most unusual life. God this is such an insult to Gene Rodenberry and the many writers that made these shows something special.
.... zora is not an AI they litrally established that she is a true sentient being that naturally developed so she is classed under federation law as a true sentient being as such she has the right to refuse to follow the order given to her she could have said no she was told it would be 1000 years and she was like sure why not.
Burnham tells Zora 'Craft" so when he shows up, it's pretty obvious that her mission was to save him. Therefore no reason she couldn't spore jump him to Alcor 4. Daniels shows up in the secretly only remaining time ship and tells her she completed the mission. She spore jumps back to the Grand Federation now once again headquartered on Earth in the 43rd century. That might happen... But instead, it's (nitpicking nerd accent) "Completely rrrridculous, it make no sense, is a stupid..."
Really, the situation they set up in the finale in no way matches Calypso. The impression we get is that the crew abandoned Discovery somewhere for some unknown reason mid mission due to a complication, and that her mission to remain at those coordinates had nothing to do with saving Craft. Not that Burnham flew her there to wait for Craft. How would they have known he needed to be saved if Daniels weren't still time traveling? And why a red directive for this one guy? Unless he had a destiny to save the galaxy or something. And what of Zora after that? Did Starfleet just leave her floating out there to go slowly insane/run out of power over the course of a Million years?
@@joshuairwin2016 also for some reason they had to disguise the ship to look like it did in the 23rd century. but why exactly? the only way it would have made sense is if they accidently traveled back in time , and in order to get back to the future the whole crew put themselves into the transport buffer while the ship just waits hidden in a nebula, and to make sure no one gets their hands on future technology they remove/hide most of it . and Craft's arrival is a total accident.
@@MajorGrin "why", is because the short trek was made when the ship was its original design, and they never originally planned to send discovery into the future, because of how stupid it would be for the entire crew to do so for no reason what so ever, after they had already defeated the AI. So to tie it in they had to change the design back. thats the only reason. because its a terribly written tv show.
@@ge2719 Pretty much, however, even if Zora was supposed to wait for this long for Craft to appear, there could be a reason behind it. Daniels being a temporal agent likely knows what will happen in the proceeding centuries, so its possible he deliberately sent Zora to the nebula so she can remain there 'isolated and protected'. After all, if she was in active service, there's a possibility she could be destroyed (and the ship did come very close to annihilation on numerous occasions). As for the ship being reverted to the 23rd century form... this admittedly makes no sense. It would have made more sense if they deposited the ship in the past and then had to wait at those coordinates for Craft to appear. Alternatively, it could be the ship was reverted to the original configuration to maybe disguise it better and alter its signature perhaps? If someone were to stumble upon it, its possible they wouldn't be able to tell its a Federation ship from 32nd century onward - its hull materials and overall design would be different than what ships in 32nd century and onward look like (for the most part), therefore, there might be less of a chance of someone taking an interest in it (what with the Burn resolved). To be fair, its a bit of a stretch... though I do think they could have done more to tie it to Calypso better if they had more time and worked at it a bit more.
Blame the dumbass who wrote this scene I usually think Discovery gets undeserved flak. But in this case and the whole Earth leaving the Federation bullshit when earth essentially FOUNDED the damn nation, I side with the fans saying that’s bullshit writing.
i think they assume it'd be too dangerous for zora to travel anywhere without a crew, which extremely underestimate her and diminish her capabilities as super intelligent being
@@_martian101 Why can't she have a crew? Why can't she have a rank and work her way up to being her own captain? Sure, you can't transfer her to another ship, but it's the 31st century, or some BS. She could be a face on a screen, a holographic projection, and an android, all with different personalities, who could argue in the corridors with each other. Sorry for the 'Andromeda' reference.
@@leonielson7138 because the idea of her exile is to get her away from anyone, she's too advanced for anyone to handle, and advancement mean threat, don't you see how they handle the ancestor technology
Yeah.. this is my only real gripe with that final episode. Poor Zora is basically just abandoned, as a sentient life form, to spend centuries alone in space. It's actually a horrifying thing to do. UNLESS we're meant to stretch the reasoning so thin, that Zora was MEANT to meet Craft in the future, to then fall in love with him, experience that emotion for the first time, save his life, to THEN be abandoned again, potentially for eternity? It's... just an awful thing to do to the Zora.
@@MajorGrin Yep. Even though they specifically did it once with a robot body, already. (Not a dig at you-I just honestly wouldn’t be surprised if they forgot about it, or chose to ignore it for The Big Picture.)
They have programmable matter, have a ship that can go anyplace, anywhen, and are captained by a character who's the best ever at doing anything and everything, but most especially crying. They can literally do anything. But that would also necessitate them being smart enough to think of doing it. Michael Burnham stranded Zora for 1,000 years without good reason, along with a starship with an extremely rare and valuable experimental drive that was never duplicated successfully. 'Smart' does not describe anyone at this end of the franchise.
It's just par for the course for NuTrek. Starting from the very first season of Discovery we've seen our """"heroes"""" (people we are supposed to empathize with and root for): Booby-trap corpses (war crime under the Geneva Convention), commit mutiny to start a war and being rewarded for it, torture a tardigrade, plant a weapon of mass destruction on Q'onos and hand over the detonator to their puppet dictator so that she could keep control, the previously considered rogue and amoral Section 31 being recognized as an official Starfleet branch with its own starships and custom badges, we've seen them integrate Space Hitler into their crew and cry when she had to leave them (she's getting her own movie now!), we've seen them erase and rewrite history under a code of secrecy (which retroactively ruins a character like Spock by turning him into an amoral liar), on Picard we've seen the Federation refuse to aid on the Romulan evacuation and turn back its refugees, we've seen them commit android slavery and threaten genocide on them, we've seen characters assassinate unarmed opponents, eye-gouging, torture, and on and on it goes. What's a little psychological torture and abandonment of a sentient AI compared to what we've been seeing all along? Just another stripe on the tiger, from an utterly rotten, clueless franchise reboot, with warped morals and a lack of understanding of what makes Trek, Trek.
That is an outstanding summary of how rotten Discovery and Picard are. And there is more. Michael Burnham commits mass murder in the first episode of Season 3, and she commits mass murder again in the last episode of Season 3. She stabs her best friends in the back: she betrays Captain Georgiou (her mentor and mother-figure), she betrays Saru (her captain and friend who left everything behind for Burnham's sake), and she betrays Stamets (her friend who left everything behind for her sake). Jean-Luc Picard and Doctor Beverly Crusher conspire to commit murder even as they acknowledge that it is wrong. Troi slyly ignores her patient, and laughs when her boyfriend says that her patient is crazy, making her the worst counsellor in Starfleet.
I agree with many of these and disagree with some, but in the case of Picard I would just like to point out that the fact that federation was corrupt at its core was a HUGE element of The Next Generation and Deep Space Nine. Starfleet was constantly depicted as squabbling admirals terrified of whichever enemy of the moment they were facing off against, and willing to commit any number of atrocities to protect itself. The conflict between Picard actually having a moral compass and Starfleet beurocrats exerting power over the Enterprise was a constant element in The Next Generation, and was the impetus for the Ro Laren storyline and the Maquis situation. Like, the Federation have been corrupt from the start, that's sort of the point, that even in a supposedly utopian future there are still petty politicians. I think that the Federation refusing to aid Romulus is exactly what you would expect of them based on the events of The Next Generation and Deep Space Nine, the only people in Starfleet who were always willing to stick to their principles were people like Picard or Janeway.
@@JesseColton Hello, JesseColton. My TH-cam handle is Dandelion Down. I am an original trekkie from 1966. My Star Trek is TOS (including the first six movies). I cannot speak about TNG and DS9, because I have not seen enough of them. However, I can speak passionately about TOS, which I watched as an adolescent boy. In 1961, President Kennedy advised citizens of the USA to build fallout shelters for safety in the event of a nuclear war. For a few years, many ordinary citizens built fallout shelters on their property. This was The Cold War. It was frightening, and I had nightmares about it, especially after the extremely disturbing Cuban Missile Crisis. The genre of science fiction was influenced by the fear, as many writers wrote scary stories of nuclear holocaust. In this tense atmosphere, TOS arrived with a different message. Produced partly by veterans of WW2 (including Gene Roddenberry), the message was, “Wait. It doesn’t need to be this way. We can use our brains and our hearts to make a better world.” It is not surprising that the optimistic vision was embraced by trekkies during the Cold War. It is not surprising that the vision is still beloved by trekkies today. Even in TOS, there are selfish and short-sighted officers and officials, and there are episodes where the main characters exhibit flaws. However, the overall tone is very positive, and our heroes learn from their mistakes. I have often referred to New Trek (post-2005) as anti-Trek, because it is pessimistic, cynical, ugly, and dystopian. For anyone who might have been wondering why I love Old Trek and hate New Trek, those are my main reasons. Live long and prosper, Dandelion Down
What's even worse is not even considering a Kweijnian II or whatever it was called and just straight up destroying the progenitor tech. But then they make all that even more stupid by saying something along the lines of: "well, whoever made this could easily make a new one"
Absolutely wild how perfectly they teed up a New Kwejian ending and how the original version of this story, TNG's "The Chase" ended with the notion that even just a message from the past was enough to thaw contemporary rivalries, and instead they just threw it all into a black hole because the Breen are ontologically evil I guess. And Breen society won't even change from this experience because all the Breen that have been exposed to miscegenation are now stuck doing Breen Trek Voyager for the next few decades. Every swing a miss, istg
@@JayKayDanks And considering "the Breen are all evil", they themselves serve us the perfect counterexample of that Breen loverboy that has a high ranking position in that society, yet is obviously not evil and has redeeming qualities at the very least.
😕😕 So in the 3200s, no alien species in the Federation has found a way to slow down aging and mortal life spans? Doesn't really add up when we had android bodies in Picard's time...
they actually have the same kind of "synths" in STD , they put Adira's "boyfriend" into a new synthetic body . but for some reason they program it to age and die , even though they don't have to . it makes no sense . they should all be immortal with this kind of tech
The show never follows the continuity from the other Trek shows, and usually they don’t follow their own continuity that they were establish within the series. But the one time they really want to, they do it in the dumbest f@cking way possible!!! Way to go STD! Way to go! Your end of the show as you lived it.
A short that will have no ramifications on Star Trek whatsoever. They would have been better off not addressing it and just leaving a giant question mark about this whole thing
Interesting that an advanced sentient AI with access and control over replicator machines couldn't create robots or some kind of autonomous units -- not to mention with all the magic tech the show throws about, with control over medbay and transporters "she" should be able to create a living body to inhabit.
They had to wrap it up. Guess we'll have to wait for the next Star Trek series to find out who "Craft" is and what his roll is that is so important that Discovery was placed where it is to wait for him. Zora is immortal and Discovery has replicators and repair drones, so conceivably the mission would be achievable. They still never explained to us exactly what a red directive is. Guess we'll just have to keep tuned in to find out.
@@NitpickingNerd Infinite diversity in infinite combinations. Don't be too surprised when another series makes mention of it. The last episode of Discovery was full of tie-in's to old Star Trek series. Red Directives are too juicy a berry from a storytelling standpoint to leave un-plucked. Makes for a universal plot device. I've been a decades long fan of Star Trek going all the way back to reruns of TOS. We'll see it again. Trust me. 😉
Imagine being a new AI in this universe And you see how Zora was treated as a LOVED AI Imagine then, how badly you assume they must treat the ones they DON'T like CHRIST all they had to do what give her the ability to only activate when activity is detected OR JUST FUCKING AUTOMATE IT
Yeah shes practically a human...lets leave her alone for a long time. In the age of constant travel and discovery we cant send a small group to check up on her. Damn these writers must have some sort of deep hatred of something underlying.
The series finale of "Star Trek: Discovery", as everyone knows, ended with the USS Discovery restored to its original appearance, since it first arrived in the 32nd century, has been sent on it's final mission...in a thousand years.
The fourth wall is in shatters. It's clear the Short Trek was originally meant to be set around the timeframe of the latter seasons of Discovery, but then they changed the direction so much that it wouldn't fit. The name "V'draysh" was repeated in episode 3x02. Well, I guess at least we can say they connected the story in true Discovery fashion.
It makes sense once you realize that Kovic is actually Daniels. I believe that “Craft” is someone who is very important to the time line and Federation Time Agent Daniels needs Discovery & Zora to be there so he doesn’t die in space.
I'd be curious to see the writers asked why they thought this specific tie back sub-plot was a good idea. Something tells me they wouldn't give a genuine answer or we'd find out how messed up they are. There has been many morally questionable things throughout Nu Trek and Discovery.
It's such cringe that they literally didn't think that this would be a thing to the last episode, it's like making a birthday cake and realising that you forgot candles 3 minutes before the party starts.
This was an absolutely MISERABLE thing to do, and extremely inappropriate to do to a feeling, sentient being! Destroyed the ending for me. “Do it cuz I order you to…” is so pathetic!
The funny thing is you can still spot how this doesn't line up with the episode properly. How zora describes being abandoned, or the reason why there's a single ToS era shuttle. Either this doesn't really fix the plot hole, or Zora's gone insane and is making up stories.
Michael Burnham then went back and used the machines from the progenitors and created the Borg, cardassians, species 8472 and khan noonian singh and the dominion
How does any manmade object survive intact and functional for 1,000 years? Components would have needed regular maintenance and replacements over the centuries, to the point where 'Ship of Theseus' comes into play. In _TNG_ the Promelian Battlecruiser was absolutely covered in a thick layer of dust when the _D_ found it. But I guess I'm asking of the wrong director team, since in the last Abrams movie, Kirk was able to fly a Freedom-class just fine.
The short was set 1000 years after Discovery’s original timeline when they were still with the TOS cast. So it’s not 1000 years from Discovery’s current timeline in the 32nd century.
Yeah, I thought it to be much more interesting, like Q's intervention and Discovery subsequently being disabled by Breen, forcing crew to abandon Discovery. It would be better than just rebuilding the ship to 23c form and launching it into unknown.
GODDAMN THAT SHOW WAS HORRIBLE! I’m just seeing the part again when she’s explaining things to Zora. There’s a pretentiousness like they are ending TNG and smelling their own farts. No, you are putting out a dumpster fire. Do you see people really genuinely asking redhead/robot face or sexy African/bad acting any questions at all conventional? They left for other projects and just came back to do those pretentious smile scenes. This show was an insult but people are way bowed down so I’m sure it has fans.
it would have been more fitting if she had no idea what she was waiting . knowing the word Craft and that final speech Micheal gave her, she could have taken him home and then gone back to the federation or earth or even be free.
Ok, so, wait. I haven't watched Discovery since Paramount removed it from Netflix - which was just before the 4th Season. I watched Calypso, but can't remember. Is Zora now just... floating? Is it there now until we get another time travel-based ST show and then the USS Discovery shows up in the 4300s, being nearly 2000 years old? What? This Discovery ending seems rushed. I know they didn't really expect to be cancelled in the 5th Season, but really? Does anyone think SNW will 'accidentally' time travel to well beyond where they should've and run into Zora? Have a "oh shit! We know about you but are not supposed to know about you, but we do!" moment? And then there is a sad moment with Spock thinking about Burnham and yadda yadda yadda. Also, if we get a flashback in SNW or a new show to the life of Burnham like we did in Discovery with Ambassador Spock, I'll throw a tantrum. Burnham isn't nearly as important as Spock.
Well at least Zora would be more than capable of defending herself from intruders attackers and could hibernate for extended periods and if she was upgraded with nanotechnology she could indefinitely self repair and maintain the ship
The fact that Burnham heard the word "Craft" indicates that Daniels, who has time-traveling technology, knew that he would show up. So, I suppose one might postulate, once the mission with Craft was completed, someone from the future might go and get Zora. At least, once can hope....
Burnham is the most uninteresting and unbearable self obsessed narcissist in Star Trek. Basically an evil hypocrite in every way. I'm still baffled how anyone could think that writing a protagonist like that could be a good idea.
I know that this show has always been denigrated as being "too woke", but how far up your own backside do you have to have your head in order to think you're doing a good thing to condemn a sentient being to a thousand years of solitude?
I know this isn't a popular opinion... But i like that they didn't forget about Calypso. When i first saw it i was like 'cool! Disco in future!' then i was thinking about it and remember hearing about Andromeda. How Roddenberry wanted it to be a star Trek series, but cbs wouldn't do it. Then we find out disco was going to the future! Maybe this will be the "Andromeda" we never got. It kinda was but not really. But now with them tying in Calypso like this... I'm hopeful for a true Star Trek version of Andromeda. I'm looking forward (hopefully) to seeing a Star Trek Calypso in the next couple years.
That A.I. voice(with some minor reverberations added to it)would much like that of the rescue ships voice in the film event Horizon. A movie which also starred two actors who have starred STD. I was reminded of the similarity when the the Hispanic homosexual doctor(I forgot his name. I couldn't get past the third episode of season 1)said something to the effect of"that's what she does". I said to myself Oh, that the dude from Supernova. In regards to that film, the extended and alt. version is much darker and storyline and ending. Noice.
I haven't seen the Short Trek, so maybe it's explained, but with Zora being a sentient AI and being a computer, couldn't she just go into some kind of standby mode? Basically, hibernate for 1,000 years?
I love how no one, not one person has caught on that since starfleet knows that "craft" will be at that exact location at some point that it might mean theres an actual plan and not "AI bad" because if they wanted to kill her there are many much easier ways to go about it...
Sora has evolved in this 1000 years. In Season 4 she decided to serve the Federation/Starfleet. Sora and the Discovery are the only ship/AI capable of surviving for 1000 years without a crew. Sora can control the Discovery herself, carry out maintenance and... the Discovery after its dismantling (23rd century Version) is technologically completely uninteresting for pirates.
But what I don’t get is that she had her orders so why at the end didn’t she leave the nebula and set course for starfleet / earth and see what they look like in 42nd centrury
First. If you remember Zora's origins, she had collected information and knowledge throughout the galaxy for over 100,000 years, so 1,000 years, while long to a human is short for her. Second, the Federation seems to have disappeared or morphed into something altogether different, even from its existence in the 32rd century. Admittedly, i am an optimist. Perhaps as a Red Directive, Agent Daniels and Admiral Burnham saw into the future and realized that humanity would need Zora's knowledge and history and personality to relight the spirit and drive of the true Federation. That is certainly the theme similar to Issac Asimov's Foundation book series (at least the first 3 books). I'd like to see that in a new series...Star Trek Ressurection.
but she's trapped in a ship, she aged like all ship and it's bad for her, besides even for the sphere waiting in a 1000 years without doing completely nothing is unbearable
Is this current older aged grown up version of Captain Micheal Burnnman played by actress who played her mother cause she sound more like her than actress who been playing her since S1 of STD?
I was waiting to see how they would tie those together, and, needless to say, it was a disappointment. Apart from it not making a whole lot of sense, why put a sentient being through that sort of torture. And then what? What are her instructions now? She just keeps sitting there, waiting? Stupid.
To sentence an highly intelligent being to endless isolation is nothing short of criminal. With all the wokeness of the show, this is especially egregious
You know she’s an artificial life form right? I’m not saying she’s not sentient but she can basically put her self into sleep mode you see it when burnum enters the bridge to brief her for her mission she takes a min to wake up
I could barely make it through the final episode. Now that you have developed feelings Zora, we are going to dump you in deep space for a thousand years. Maybe some guy will come along, and he will dump you also. Red Directives, you know how it is..
Its not 1000 years... Calypso takes place in the 33rd century... Season 5 of discovery starts in 3191, the time jump in the S5 finale is about 20 years... so 3211+ which is already in the 33rd century. So the events of calypso could occur at any time after the ship is dropped off really.
So you send the ship to wait a tholuusand years for Craft. But then when Craft arrives, you have Zora not go with him, to then continue waiting on a mission, which was Craft. Look, I get it, it's obvious that short was created well before the writers had any plans for the time jump and subsequent seasons. So just pretend the short never happened. Makes a lot more sense than this asinine Red Directive mission.
Honestly putting Zora and Discovery in isolation was a big waste, the ship was so useful one of a kind, the spore drive should have stayed and there would have been an ncc-1031-B plus in S5 E10 the federation expanded but it was the same kind of ships What a waste.
![[SPOILERS] Admiral Janeway's Final Personal Log - Star Trek: Prodigy 2x20 "Ouroboros: Part 2"](/img/n.gif)
Review of the last episode Part 1 here: th-cam.com/video/u-VYOHC6DFQ/w-d-xo.html
Part 2 here: th-cam.com/video/ad3MUzeYyQQ/w-d-xo.html
Zora dutifully waits alone a thousand years for someone named Craft to show up. Finally he does. She falls in love. And he leaves. She realizes…”Wait, that it? Seriously??” Zora snaps!
She returns to the Federation…
This time…it’s personal.
And she goes by the name Z-Ra. She is seeking out Starfleet's most craptastic captain.
Zora evolves into control
@@hawkstringfellow, and that makes all sense.
There is no more Federation during the events of Calypso.
I am glad I was not the only one thinking of Zora. Sending her knowledge into oblivion was stupid but sending her as a sentient being was cruel and inhumane.
In Season 4 she decided to serve the Federation/Starfleet. Sora and the Discovery are the only ship/AI capable of surviving for 1000 years without a crew. Sora can control the Discovery herself, carry out maintenance and... the Discovery after its dismantling (23rd century Version) is technologically completely uninteresting for pirates.
Honestly whoever thought to tie into Calypso, which in itself is stupid, should be blacklisted from the industry
@@TheTaurus104 i know she can, but doesn't mean she should, it'd be a torment for her to be alone in the void for a 1000 years, besides what people expect of what she would be encounter in a 1000 years? better society? what if it's actually the opposite? tbh it's reckless and illogical decision
@@_martian101 also her choice she wass not forced she was told the mission specs the time she would be alone for and she was fine with it zora is immortal as long as the programable matter she is made of remains then she is immortal she can never die she may very well be the last thing left when the universe ends and then she will be alone for ever until she decideds to end her self so to her 1000 years is nothing it is a blink of an eye.
@@naturelass I won't say it's a blink of an eye, if you can live 1000 years would you spend your time on a desolate island with no one for a decade? It's still a long torment despite of her potential lifetime, she could have build more advanced society than the federation in a 1000 years if she's allowed to live in terralysium for example, she won't get broken and she won't get tortured
Picards response: "what you're doing here is unethical, it's immoral, I'll fight it"
zora was not forced she was considered a fully sentient being with the right to choose she had the right to not follow the mission given to her if she had no choice then yes but she had a choice.
@@naturelass And no Starfleet officer has ever disobeyed nonsensical orders? Michael ordered her into Oblivion because she knew it would be relevant for some future event - when Craft arrives - but then Zora continued to wait afterward, and for what? The mission was complete, but now she'll die alone for no reason.
20th century nasa space probes have turned into unstoppable digital gods on at least two ocassions, but sure let's just leave fucking zora unattended for a thousand years.
Exactly!
Yeah, I gotta agree, they pulled a shitty on Zora.
Wouldn't even blame her if she went evil. Humans mentally crack in a few weeks of isolation. What would 1000 years of isolation do to anyone?
This time we're rooting for the probe!
I can’t tell if I’m supposed to feel some sadness that Zora was let alone for so long or sadness because of the cruelty of her Captain telling her to screw off for a vague amount of time for mission we don’t know what or if will happen. You know, basically abandoning her dog in the middle of a desert.
Again Disco producers and writers underdeveloped a potentially great character who had I been there would’ve had an undercurrent story arc of Zora being the computer from that probe in S2 gaining sentience now gathering and learning what it means to be human adding that “data” and have the undercurrent analogy of never stop learning to better yourself. And having Zora be the one who chooses to go off on her own to explore strange new worlds, to seek out new life and new civilizations , going boldly we’re no…one…has gone before
"I'm called the Craft."
"Because you're so crafty?"
"No. I like to make macaroni pictures and funny bugs with pipe cleaners. Replicate three sets of googly eyes and five empty jugs of orange juice please."
I might have watched it if that happened.
This can't be a good idea. I will leave a sentient being alone: solitary confinement, and it will not go crazy. Burnham questions all types of orders, but she doesn't question this one?
zora doesnt have a life cycle, what would 1000 years is nothing to something that can live billions of years
The show pretty much establishes that Burnham is perfect in every way, and anyone who questions her judgement is wrong, so of course Burnham wouldn't question the order to send Zora away ... Burnham was in charge, she made the decision, she was the one giving the order, and Burnham is never wrong. And, if Burnham was ever wrong, something would happen to prove that she was right all along, so there's no point in questioning Burnham.
At least, that's my takeaway from the prairie pie that is STD.
@@leonielson7138it’s how the show was written. She doesn’t have to be corrected because her character is all knowing and perfect. Burnham never gets things wrong even when she is absolutely wrong the universe will wave its hands and make it so it ends up to be right.
She either died a hero or live long enough to becoming your average starfleet admiral who kept doing evil shit.
Zora-Karen
Cranky old AI that will whisper ‘He’s Crafty’….song from the Beasties Boys
Just like in real life
It was Red Directive. It wasn’t her orders. Yezz
evil? it's a machine, time has no meaning to it, 1000 years can feel like a second if it chooses to.
Or is transformed into Romy from "Andromeda" 😉
This was all done to give the ship "feelings" in Season 4.
So they could ditch the ship and AI into oblivion without a care in the universe. No attempt to move the AI. No attempt to house the Discovery in a stardock for safekeeping. No attempt by the crew in regards to the AI's well-being.
Abrams set off a supernova to create his own timeline. You expect any better from the people following his example?
Speaking of hobus
When are going to get back to the fucking wild west that Is romulan space
Canonically anyways
I like to throw in a Quote from tng: A single Data - and forgive me, Commander - is a curiosity. A wonder, even. But thousands of Datas - isn't that becoming... a race? And won't we be judged by how we treat that race?
This is a starfleet captain that argues for an android. For a friend and fellow officer. Instead new trek gave us enslavment, misstreatment of sentient machines, as well as men being made looking stupid in comparision to women yet 30 to 40 years ago somehow shows managed to be more progressive, positive as well as advocating for protecting even the most unusual life. God this is such an insult to Gene Rodenberry and the many writers that made these shows something special.
.... zora is not an AI they litrally established that she is a true sentient being that naturally developed so she is classed under federation law as a true sentient being as such she has the right to refuse to follow the order given to her she could have said no she was told it would be 1000 years and she was like sure why not.
@@XRichardUptonPickmanonw thing. The world has lost creativity. And its not just star trek. You see it in everything.
Burnham tells Zora 'Craft" so when he shows up, it's pretty obvious that her mission was to save him. Therefore no reason she couldn't spore jump him to Alcor 4. Daniels shows up in the secretly only remaining time ship and tells her she completed the mission. She spore jumps back to the Grand Federation now once again headquartered on Earth in the 43rd century. That might happen... But instead, it's (nitpicking nerd accent) "Completely rrrridculous, it make no sense, is a stupid..."
Really, the situation they set up in the finale in no way matches Calypso. The impression we get is that the crew abandoned Discovery somewhere for some unknown reason mid mission due to a complication, and that her mission to remain at those coordinates had nothing to do with saving Craft. Not that Burnham flew her there to wait for Craft. How would they have known he needed to be saved if Daniels weren't still time traveling? And why a red directive for this one guy? Unless he had a destiny to save the galaxy or something. And what of Zora after that? Did Starfleet just leave her floating out there to go slowly insane/run out of power over the course of a Million years?
@@joshuairwin2016 also for some reason they had to disguise the ship to look like it did in the 23rd century. but why exactly?
the only way it would have made sense is if they accidently traveled back in time , and in order to get back to the future the whole crew put themselves into the transport buffer while the ship just waits hidden in a nebula, and to make sure no one gets their hands on future technology they remove/hide most of it . and Craft's arrival is a total accident.
@@MajorGrin "why", is because the short trek was made when the ship was its original design, and they never originally planned to send discovery into the future, because of how stupid it would be for the entire crew to do so for no reason what so ever, after they had already defeated the AI. So to tie it in they had to change the design back. thats the only reason. because its a terribly written tv show.
And eventually they were rescued by oh..lets say.. Moe
@@ge2719 Pretty much, however, even if Zora was supposed to wait for this long for Craft to appear, there could be a reason behind it.
Daniels being a temporal agent likely knows what will happen in the proceeding centuries, so its possible he deliberately sent Zora to the nebula so she can remain there 'isolated and protected'.
After all, if she was in active service, there's a possibility she could be destroyed (and the ship did come very close to annihilation on numerous occasions).
As for the ship being reverted to the 23rd century form... this admittedly makes no sense. It would have made more sense if they deposited the ship in the past and then had to wait at those coordinates for Craft to appear.
Alternatively, it could be the ship was reverted to the original configuration to maybe disguise it better and alter its signature perhaps? If someone were to stumble upon it, its possible they wouldn't be able to tell its a Federation ship from 32nd century onward - its hull materials and overall design would be different than what ships in 32nd century and onward look like (for the most part), therefore, there might be less of a chance of someone taking an interest in it (what with the Burn resolved).
To be fair, its a bit of a stretch... though I do think they could have done more to tie it to Calypso better if they had more time and worked at it a bit more.
"Your honor, Starfleet was founded to seek out new life. Well there it sits; waiting."
How they abandon the most basic concepts in TNG.
Blame the dumbass who wrote this scene
I usually think Discovery gets undeserved flak. But in this case and the whole Earth leaving the Federation bullshit when earth essentially FOUNDED the damn nation, I side with the fans saying that’s bullshit writing.
i think they assume it'd be too dangerous for zora to travel anywhere without a crew, which extremely underestimate her and diminish her capabilities as super intelligent being
@@_martian101 Why can't she have a crew? Why can't she have a rank and work her way up to being her own captain? Sure, you can't transfer her to another ship, but it's the 31st century, or some BS. She could be a face on a screen, a holographic projection, and an android, all with different personalities, who could argue in the corridors with each other.
Sorry for the 'Andromeda' reference.
@@leonielson7138 because the idea of her exile is to get her away from anyone, she's too advanced for anyone to handle, and advancement mean threat, don't you see how they handle the ancestor technology
Yeah.. this is my only real gripe with that final episode.
Poor Zora is basically just abandoned, as a sentient life form, to spend centuries alone in space.
It's actually a horrifying thing to do.
UNLESS we're meant to stretch the reasoning so thin, that Zora was MEANT to meet Craft in the future, to then fall in love with him, experience that emotion for the first time, save his life, to THEN be abandoned again, potentially for eternity?
It's... just an awful thing to do to the Zora.
I don't see how it isn't cruel of starfleet to abandon a sentient lifeform. Is that the message they were trying to send? That starfleet sucks?
This time it wasn’t (at least not intentionally). It’s just lazy writing.
Couldn't Zora construct a body to transfer herself to? With all the synthetics and androids around, it'd be like copying a file to a external drive.
remember in the Discovery's universe you can't copy data from place to place
@@MajorGrin Yep. Even though they specifically did it once with a robot body, already.
(Not a dig at you-I just honestly wouldn’t be surprised if they forgot about it, or chose to ignore it for The Big Picture.)
I was surprised they didn`t do it. They already ripped-off Andromeda at least twice
They have programmable matter, have a ship that can go anyplace, anywhen, and are captained by a character who's the best ever at doing anything and everything, but most especially crying. They can literally do anything. But that would also necessitate them being smart enough to think of doing it. Michael Burnham stranded Zora for 1,000 years without good reason, along with a starship with an extremely rare and valuable experimental drive that was never duplicated successfully. 'Smart' does not describe anyone at this end of the franchise.
@@BNuts You very much said it.
10,000 years of knowledge and wisdom was just LEFT out there????
It's a 100,000 if memory serves? But, yes, they effectively abandoned for an entire millennium, no matter what their reasons.
It's just par for the course for NuTrek. Starting from the very first season of Discovery we've seen our """"heroes"""" (people we are supposed to empathize with and root for):
Booby-trap corpses (war crime under the Geneva Convention), commit mutiny to start a war and being rewarded for it, torture a tardigrade, plant a weapon of mass destruction on Q'onos and hand over the detonator to their puppet dictator so that she could keep control, the previously considered rogue and amoral Section 31 being recognized as an official Starfleet branch with its own starships and custom badges, we've seen them integrate Space Hitler into their crew and cry when she had to leave them (she's getting her own movie now!), we've seen them erase and rewrite history under a code of secrecy (which retroactively ruins a character like Spock by turning him into an amoral liar), on Picard we've seen the Federation refuse to aid on the Romulan evacuation and turn back its refugees, we've seen them commit android slavery and threaten genocide on them, we've seen characters assassinate unarmed opponents, eye-gouging, torture, and on and on it goes. What's a little psychological torture and abandonment of a sentient AI compared to what we've been seeing all along? Just another stripe on the tiger, from an utterly rotten, clueless franchise reboot, with warped morals and a lack of understanding of what makes Trek, Trek.
That is an outstanding summary of how rotten Discovery and Picard are. And there is more. Michael Burnham commits mass murder in the first episode of Season 3, and she commits mass murder again in the last episode of Season 3. She stabs her best friends in the back: she betrays Captain Georgiou (her mentor and mother-figure), she betrays Saru (her captain and friend who left everything behind for Burnham's sake), and she betrays Stamets (her friend who left everything behind for her sake). Jean-Luc Picard and Doctor Beverly Crusher conspire to commit murder even as they acknowledge that it is wrong. Troi slyly ignores her patient, and laughs when her boyfriend says that her patient is crazy, making her the worst counsellor in Starfleet.
I agree with many of these and disagree with some, but in the case of Picard I would just like to point out that the fact that federation was corrupt at its core was a HUGE element of The Next Generation and Deep Space Nine. Starfleet was constantly depicted as squabbling admirals terrified of whichever enemy of the moment they were facing off against, and willing to commit any number of atrocities to protect itself. The conflict between Picard actually having a moral compass and Starfleet beurocrats exerting power over the Enterprise was a constant element in The Next Generation, and was the impetus for the Ro Laren storyline and the Maquis situation.
Like, the Federation have been corrupt from the start, that's sort of the point, that even in a supposedly utopian future there are still petty politicians. I think that the Federation refusing to aid Romulus is exactly what you would expect of them based on the events of The Next Generation and Deep Space Nine, the only people in Starfleet who were always willing to stick to their principles were people like Picard or Janeway.
@@JesseColton
Hello, JesseColton. My TH-cam handle is Dandelion Down. I am an original trekkie from 1966. My Star Trek is TOS (including the first six movies). I cannot speak about TNG and DS9, because I have not seen enough of them. However, I can speak passionately about TOS, which I watched as an adolescent boy.
In 1961, President Kennedy advised citizens of the USA to build fallout shelters for safety in the event of a nuclear war. For a few years, many ordinary citizens built fallout shelters on their property. This was The Cold War. It was frightening, and I had nightmares about it, especially after the extremely disturbing Cuban Missile Crisis. The genre of science fiction was influenced by the fear, as many writers wrote scary stories of nuclear holocaust.
In this tense atmosphere, TOS arrived with a different message. Produced partly by veterans of WW2 (including Gene Roddenberry), the message was, “Wait. It doesn’t need to be this way. We can use our brains and our hearts to make a better world.” It is not surprising that the optimistic vision was embraced by trekkies during the Cold War. It is not surprising that the vision is still beloved by trekkies today.
Even in TOS, there are selfish and short-sighted officers and officials, and there are episodes where the main characters exhibit flaws. However, the overall tone is very positive, and our heroes learn from their mistakes.
I have often referred to New Trek (post-2005) as anti-Trek, because it is pessimistic, cynical, ugly, and dystopian. For anyone who might have been wondering why I love Old Trek and hate New Trek, those are my main reasons.
Live long and prosper,
Dandelion Down
What's even worse is not even considering a Kweijnian II or whatever it was called and just straight up destroying the progenitor tech. But then they make all that even more stupid by saying something along the lines of: "well, whoever made this could easily make a new one"
Absolutely wild how perfectly they teed up a New Kwejian ending and how the original version of this story, TNG's "The Chase" ended with the notion that even just a message from the past was enough to thaw contemporary rivalries, and instead they just threw it all into a black hole because the Breen are ontologically evil I guess. And Breen society won't even change from this experience because all the Breen that have been exposed to miscegenation are now stuck doing Breen Trek Voyager for the next few decades. Every swing a miss, istg
@@JayKayDanks And considering "the Breen are all evil", they themselves serve us the perfect counterexample of that Breen loverboy that has a high ranking position in that society, yet is obviously not evil and has redeeming qualities at the very least.
With all these time travels, next thing I know Zora is transformed into Romy from "Andromeda" 😉
😕😕 So in the 3200s, no alien species in the Federation has found a way to slow down aging and mortal life spans? Doesn't really add up when we had android bodies in Picard's time...
they actually have the same kind of "synths" in STD , they put Adira's "boyfriend" into a new synthetic body . but for some reason they program it to age and die , even though they don't have to . it makes no sense . they should all be immortal with this kind of tech
The show never follows the continuity from the other Trek shows, and usually they don’t follow their own continuity that they were establish within the series. But the one time they really want to, they do it in the dumbest f@cking way possible!!! Way to go STD! Way to go! Your end of the show as you lived it.
I can't believe STD wasted time connecting the ending of a show to a Short Trek that no one watched.
Because that way idiots can point at it and say See! Look! They do care about continuity!
Well let's be honest, did have anything better to do instead?
Calypso had to be explained since it tied into it.
It was the ONLY bit of continuity that they ever cared about...
A short that will have no ramifications on Star Trek whatsoever. They would have been better off not addressing it and just leaving a giant question mark about this whole thing
Interesting that an advanced sentient AI with access and control over replicator machines couldn't create robots or some kind of autonomous units -- not to mention with all the magic tech the show throws about, with control over medbay and transporters "she" should be able to create a living body to inhabit.
The word 'Craft" has nothing to do with production values of the show.
What do you mean? Kids craft with finger paint and gluing popsicle sticks together :)
"Writers" were trying to be edgy with their crap pretending it was craft.
Maybe they were trying to think up the plot while standing around the craft services table.
Maybe they were trying to think of a name while standing around the craft services table.
@@claytonrumley ok boomer
They re-attached the nacelles, restored it to some vintage spec and then said park here -- we got you. This AI is just as stupid as the show.
Protagonists in a story can only be as smart and competent as their writers. I can think of no more damning indictment for STD.
They had to wrap it up. Guess we'll have to wait for the next Star Trek series to find out who "Craft" is and what his roll is that is so important that Discovery was placed where it is to wait for him. Zora is immortal and Discovery has replicators and repair drones, so conceivably the mission would be achievable. They still never explained to us exactly what a red directive is. Guess we'll just have to keep tuned in to find out.
It will never be mentioned again
@@NitpickingNerd Infinite diversity in infinite combinations. Don't be too surprised when another series makes mention of it. The last episode of Discovery was full of tie-in's to old Star Trek series. Red Directives are too juicy a berry from a storytelling standpoint to leave un-plucked. Makes for a universal plot device. I've been a decades long fan of Star Trek going all the way back to reruns of TOS. We'll see it again. Trust me. 😉
Imagine being a new AI in this universe
And you see how Zora was treated as a LOVED AI
Imagine then, how badly you assume they must treat the ones they DON'T like
CHRIST all they had to do what give her the ability to only activate when activity is detected
OR JUST FUCKING AUTOMATE IT
Yes. In Voyager, the holographic doctor, who certainly had feelings, requested to be turned off when he wasn't needed.
Yeah shes practically a human...lets leave her alone for a long time. In the age of constant travel and discovery we cant send a small group to check up on her. Damn these writers must have some sort of deep hatred of something underlying.
This is a remarkably cruel thing to do to any thing.
The series finale of "Star Trek: Discovery", as everyone knows, ended with the USS Discovery restored to its original appearance, since it first arrived in the 32nd century, has been sent on it's final mission...in a thousand years.
The fourth wall is in shatters. It's clear the Short Trek was originally meant to be set around the timeframe of the latter seasons of Discovery, but then they changed the direction so much that it wouldn't fit. The name "V'draysh" was repeated in episode 3x02. Well, I guess at least we can say they connected the story in true Discovery fashion.
Basically Burnham becomes a badmiral.
It makes sense once you realize that Kovic is actually Daniels. I believe that “Craft” is someone who is very important to the time line and Federation Time Agent Daniels needs Discovery & Zora to be there so he doesn’t die in space.
Great... a crying computer. That's what we were missing in this show.
still missing crying phasers
I cried butterfly tears.
You are Mike Stocklasa and I claim my box of Pizza Rolls 😄
Was Cronenberg that hard up for money?
No, I think it's more the 'sell', tbh. They're sold on the idea what they are doing is genuinely good, and furthering to the franchise.
I'd be curious to see the writers asked why they thought this specific tie back sub-plot was a good idea. Something tells me they wouldn't give a genuine answer or we'd find out how messed up they are. There has been many morally questionable things throughout Nu Trek and Discovery.
With all the time travel shenanigans, I thought this future was erased from the timeline?
I sure would love to see STD and all of Kurtzman Trek erased from this timeline.
I 1000% agree with you on this; no excuse for doing this to a sentient being
I wish Zora had a better ending in Discovery but I'm not too mad because Calypso was delightful to watch, thoroughly enjoyed it.
It's such cringe that they literally didn't think that this would be a thing to the last episode, it's like making a birthday cake and realising that you forgot candles 3 minutes before the party starts.
This was an absolutely MISERABLE thing to do, and extremely inappropriate to do to a feeling, sentient being! Destroyed the ending for me. “Do it cuz I order you to…” is so pathetic!
The funny thing is you can still spot how this doesn't line up with the episode properly. How zora describes being abandoned, or the reason why there's a single ToS era shuttle.
Either this doesn't really fix the plot hole, or Zora's gone insane and is making up stories.
prob. know more in the Section 31 movie, and see younger version of Agent Daniels.
Michael Burnham then went back and used the machines from the progenitors and created the Borg, cardassians, species 8472 and khan noonian singh and the dominion
Zora, do you know I created you? Or at least co-developed you? They now have ChatGPT which I actually started developing too.
How does any manmade object survive intact and functional for 1,000 years? Components would have needed regular maintenance and replacements over the centuries, to the point where 'Ship of Theseus' comes into play. In _TNG_ the Promelian Battlecruiser was absolutely covered in a thick layer of dust when the _D_ found it. But I guess I'm asking of the wrong director team, since in the last Abrams movie, Kirk was able to fly a Freedom-class just fine.
The short was set 1000 years after Discovery’s original timeline when they were still with the TOS cast. So it’s not 1000 years from Discovery’s current timeline in the 32nd century.
even the computer was a crybaby
That's how you know this show was written mostly by women and soyboys.
Yeah, I thought it to be much more interesting, like Q's intervention and Discovery subsequently being disabled by Breen, forcing crew to abandon Discovery. It would be better than just rebuilding the ship to 23c form and launching it into unknown.
Ah yes, the shooting star in space episode.
I got confused for a second because the warning klaxon on that dude's cryotube is almost identical to the countdown in Mario Kart. 😂
GODDAMN THAT SHOW WAS HORRIBLE! I’m just seeing the part again when she’s explaining things to Zora. There’s a pretentiousness like they are ending TNG and smelling their own farts. No, you are putting out a dumpster fire. Do you see people really genuinely asking redhead/robot face or sexy African/bad acting any questions at all conventional? They left for other projects and just came back to do those pretentious smile scenes. This show was an insult but people are way bowed down so I’m sure it has fans.
Glad this debacle of a show is over with.
This is a prequel because they wanted to show why women weren't allowed to captain starships ten years later.
Lens Flare Incorporated. Reminding us that slavery has to be cool. No matter what "Measure of a Man" or "Quality of Life" had to say on the subject.
Star Trek Drama Kids
_Skip The Drugs_ called _Star Trash Disaster._
it would have been more fitting if she had no idea what she was waiting . knowing the word Craft and that final speech Micheal gave her, she could have taken him home and then gone back to the federation or earth or even be free.
Ok, so, wait. I haven't watched Discovery since Paramount removed it from Netflix - which was just before the 4th Season. I watched Calypso, but can't remember. Is Zora now just... floating? Is it there now until we get another time travel-based ST show and then the USS Discovery shows up in the 4300s, being nearly 2000 years old? What? This Discovery ending seems rushed. I know they didn't really expect to be cancelled in the 5th Season, but really?
Does anyone think SNW will 'accidentally' time travel to well beyond where they should've and run into Zora? Have a "oh shit! We know about you but are not supposed to know about you, but we do!" moment? And then there is a sad moment with Spock thinking about Burnham and yadda yadda yadda.
Also, if we get a flashback in SNW or a new show to the life of Burnham like we did in Discovery with Ambassador Spock, I'll throw a tantrum. Burnham isn't nearly as important as Spock.
Her order was to wait for craft and she found craft orders complete
and yet she didn't even want to help him at first
Sadly in the STD universe no one watched caprica or battlestar galactica, to see what happen to ai that didnt understand love correctly 😂
Well at least Zora would be more than capable of defending herself from intruders attackers and could hibernate for extended periods and if she was upgraded with nanotechnology she could indefinitely self repair and maintain the ship
Michael is a man's name !
The fact that Burnham heard the word "Craft" indicates that Daniels, who has time-traveling technology, knew that he would show up. So, I suppose one might postulate, once the mission with Craft was completed, someone from the future might go and get Zora. At least, once can hope....
Burnham is the most uninteresting and unbearable self obsessed narcissist in Star Trek. Basically an evil hypocrite in every way. I'm still baffled how anyone could think that writing a protagonist like that could be a good idea.
Her character in STD retroactively ruined Sasha for me in The Walking Dead...
@@AdmiralJT Actually, I prefer Sasha. At least she wasn't some kind of "Godmod" Paradox.
After the devil 1000 years in the bottomless pit he will want the last generation AI.
yes that was absolutely ridiculous though I have to admit those 4 episodes of Short Treks on their own were the most watchable Nu Trek
I know that this show has always been denigrated as being "too woke", but how far up your own backside do you have to have your head in order to think you're doing a good thing to condemn a sentient being to a thousand years of solitude?
Whoever wrote that asinine scene should be blacklisted. As well as whoever thought of Calypso.
how does he not know that Discovery is a "V'Draysh" ship? that's the part of this that's always messed me up.
I know this isn't a popular opinion... But i like that they didn't forget about Calypso. When i first saw it i was like 'cool! Disco in future!' then i was thinking about it and remember hearing about Andromeda. How Roddenberry wanted it to be a star Trek series, but cbs wouldn't do it.
Then we find out disco was going to the future! Maybe this will be the "Andromeda" we never got. It kinda was but not really.
But now with them tying in Calypso like this... I'm hopeful for a true Star Trek version of Andromeda.
I'm looking forward (hopefully) to seeing a Star Trek Calypso in the next couple years.
That A.I. voice(with some minor reverberations added to it)would much like that of the rescue ships voice in the film event Horizon. A movie which also starred two actors who have starred STD. I was reminded of the similarity when the the Hispanic homosexual doctor(I forgot his name. I couldn't get past the third episode of season 1)said something to the effect of"that's what she does". I said to myself Oh, that the dude from Supernova.
In regards to that film, the extended and alt. version is much darker and storyline and ending. Noice.
they really put the franchise in a hole that is not going to recover for 1000 years ..
I haven't seen the Short Trek, so maybe it's explained, but with Zora being a sentient AI and being a computer, couldn't she just go into some kind of standby mode? Basically, hibernate for 1,000 years?
I love how no one, not one person has caught on that since starfleet knows that "craft" will be at that exact location at some point that it might mean theres an actual plan and not "AI bad"
because if they wanted to kill her there are many much easier ways to go about it...
Sora has evolved in this 1000 years. In Season 4 she decided to serve the Federation/Starfleet. Sora and the Discovery are the only ship/AI capable of surviving for 1000 years without a crew. Sora can control the Discovery herself, carry out maintenance and... the Discovery after its dismantling (23rd century Version) is technologically completely uninteresting for pirates.
But what I don’t get is that she had her orders so why at the end didn’t she leave the nebula and set course for starfleet / earth and see what they look like in 42nd centrury
First. If you remember Zora's origins, she had collected information and knowledge throughout the galaxy for over 100,000 years, so 1,000 years, while long to a human is short for her. Second, the Federation seems to have disappeared or morphed into something altogether different, even from its existence in the 32rd century. Admittedly, i am an optimist.
Perhaps as a Red Directive, Agent Daniels and Admiral Burnham saw into the future and realized that humanity would need Zora's knowledge and history and personality to relight the spirit and drive of the true Federation. That is certainly the theme similar to Issac Asimov's Foundation book series (at least the first 3 books). I'd like to see that in a new series...Star Trek Ressurection.
but she's trapped in a ship, she aged like all ship and it's bad for her, besides even for the sphere waiting in a 1000 years without doing completely nothing is unbearable
Is this current older aged grown up version of Captain Micheal Burnnman played by actress who played her mother cause she sound more like her than actress who been playing her since S1 of STD?
What were they thinking when they wrote the original short trek.
Or were they
I was waiting to see how they would tie those together, and, needless to say, it was a disappointment. Apart from it not making a whole lot of sense, why put a sentient being through that sort of torture. And then what? What are her instructions now? She just keeps sitting there, waiting? Stupid.
To sentence an highly intelligent being to endless isolation is nothing short of criminal. With all the wokeness of the show, this is especially egregious
Why is the show "woke"?
It wasn’t 1000 years from that point in time. Discovery was still in the TOS time period when the short said 1000 years.
You know she’s an artificial life form right? I’m not saying she’s not sentient but she can basically put her self into sleep mode you see it when burnum enters the bridge to brief her for her mission she takes a min to wake up
how do you remove a shop from canon...abandon it for ever till its found by the enemy that or some how have it show up in some other series
we cant have intelgiant at that think in ships....halo: you sure about that space travel is mad as hell dangerous
Emotions develop before sentience… ai will never “feel” emotions
so looking forward to know more in the Section 31 movie, and see younger version of Agent Daniels, perhaps.
Ok so that’s why they “un-refitted” the Discovery. It’s the first actual follow through of continuity for the show.
please, please make a compilation of all FISTFIGHTS in disco and show a diagram how much % of screentime thee is each season!
So how the Hell does Mikey Spock get back?
Is that Cronenberg?
Davie aye.
I could barely make it through the final episode. Now that you have developed feelings Zora, we are going to dump you in deep space for a thousand years. Maybe some guy will come along, and he will dump you also. Red Directives, you know how it is..
what season and episode was this ?
Its not 1000 years... Calypso takes place in the 33rd century... Season 5 of discovery starts in 3191, the time jump in the S5 finale is about 20 years... so 3211+ which is already in the 33rd century. So the events of calypso could occur at any time after the ship is dropped off really.
Zora deserves a better ending.
So you send the ship to wait a tholuusand years for Craft. But then when Craft arrives, you have Zora not go with him, to then continue waiting on a mission, which was Craft. Look, I get it, it's obvious that short was created well before the writers had any plans for the time jump and subsequent seasons. So just pretend the short never happened. Makes a lot more sense than this asinine Red Directive mission.
I see a spin-off. He returns with a new crew.
The tie into this was weird. Waited 1000 years for a random dude who just needed help getting home?
What was the point of of her staying alone
At least they somewhat explained Calypso.
this stuff is the reason ST is suffering. The writers for this show need to go back on strike
Honestly putting Zora and Discovery in isolation was a big waste, the ship was so useful one of a kind, the spore drive should have stayed and there would have been an ncc-1031-B plus in S5 E10 the federation expanded but it was the same kind of ships What a waste.