Piranha Plant - G&W Joker - Sonic Hero - Greninja B&K - Olimar Terry - Shulk Byleth - pikachu MinMin - Sheik Steve - Sonic Sephiroth - Sheik P/M - Diddy Kong Kazuya - Sonic Sora - Diddy Kong
Honestly find Shulk's MUs rather interesting. He has a lot of favorable matchups against the new DLC (Steve, Terry, Kazuya, probably some others I'm missing) but Shulk tends to struggle hard against the traditional top tiers, like Palu, Snake, and Pikachu, and he goes even or losing against a lot of swordies.
he has crazy disjointed range for dealing with slow and hard hitting characters like Steve and kazuya but fast characters like pika run circles around him edit: also if I had to guess, pika can edgeguard shulk pretty easily like if the character does to swords, he kinda exemplifies the strengths and weaknesses of swordies to the max with arts and his stats
@@seviyasouji Mostly just a question of if Shulk can keep pikachu out, but pikachu has a good projectile and a very fast speed so shulk has to approach, and shulk thrives off of edgeguard kills, which is hard to do against Pikachu.
I'm a Sephiroth main. I agree that Sheik is pretty rough, but Pikachu is also ridiculously hard for him. Maybe more so. People think of Sephiroth as a slow spacing machine but one factor that is also tough is that a lot of his moves are precision. Really it's only his up-air, forward-tilt, and up-smash that don't require precision. Sort of Neutral-B too but that's just a different thing altogether. Landing meaningful hits on Pika is so hard. Not to mention that Seph is amazing at ledge trapping and solid at edge guards. That strength is pretty much nullified by Pika's total lack of disadvantage. I know Pika is a very generic bad match up but hot damn is he hard for this character. He's definitely got a few bad ones but probably the next worst is Sonic.
Pikachu isn't that bad once you really learn it, I think Tweek even put Sephiroth as winning. Personally I would recommend using Scintilla to counter Pikachu's up-B and neutral-B, as well as using orbs to nullify his neutral-B approaches. Nair is also helpful in this matchup, it is hard to learn at first but completely doable, don't worry!
@@marcmothersole8265 That surprises me a lot that Tweek put him as winning! I appreciate the encouragement! Honestly I actually do have a solid grasp on the match up with both Pika and Sheik. I can win against both for sure. But I've found that generally true in my experience. There's no match up where I feel like they're unbeatable with Seph. Against Pika what I've done that helps is use shield only to parry T-Jolt and focus on maintaining control with Shadow Flare and good spacing with Scintilla to catch Quick Attack and other burst options (sparingly). Luckily Seph has no problem with kill moves so after a little control just landing an F-Tilt or b-air tends to do the trick. Still a good Pika will use his small hurt box and pancaking to evade very effectively but with minimal effort. Maybe I can reevaluate the match up though and see it in Seph's favor!
@@d.a.d.-ohgosh bair doesnt hit pika easily, but you can use fair to poke him offstage, or retreating up air to cover air approaches. Both of these moves are easier to hit small characters with. T-Jolt approach doesn't work as like you said, Scintilla will fuck him up for trying it, AND side B goes through the t-jolt and nullifies it. You can kill Pika with up airs, catch him in shield with d smash, catch him grounded with f-tilts or get a bair read. A reliable method is to knock him offstage (fair is easy to do this with) and then edgegaurd or ledgetrap, if he tries to skip either phase by just quick attacking past you, Scintilla will activate and kill him. NOTE: Scintilla will NOT activate on Pichu's quick attack as it has no hitbox, making it significantly easier for him to get past you. The only matchup I think is REALLY bad for Sephiroth is Joker, I play Aegis for Joker because any good Joker player will never lose to you in this mu, unless you are miles better than them (just being miles better than people is not a reliable tournament winning strategy). Sheik is reliably winnable but definitely favours Sheik. Good luck and have fun bringing despair to Smash.
@@marcmothersole8265 don't think tweek has played very many top level pikas with seph. It's crazy how your opinion can change depending who you play. Pika can low profile most of seph's aerials, which is a huge problem for him. Speed and T Jolt of course make neutral pretty difficult even if orbs intercept t jolt. Coupled with the fact he could get edgeguarded pretty hard by pika, and is tall and incredibly light, it's pretty rough. He also can't camp on ledge because of Tjolt. Meaning it's really hard to adjust to the disadvantage.
If Rex was in smash bros, he would definitely be Pyra and Mythra's worst matchup, cause he would be able to smash them both in ultimate and canonically
Greninja being the standout Hero counter is by far one of the weirdest and unexpected matchups. I didn't expect Greninja to be _anyone's_ worst matchup.
@@Splonton That’s not objective. Sonic’s rushdown game is just as good as his “campiness”, because the character itself basically has no unviable options. That’s why Sonic is a valid contender for best character in the game for a lot of people
@@RealBroccoliHour no it really isn't. The reason his camping playstyle is just objectively more viable is because the vast majority of characters have no answer to it. There's nothing they can do unless the sonic screws something up. With the rushdown style yeah it's still good, but more characters have a solution to being rushed down than being camped out
@@Splonton Sonic’s rushdown is just as good as his camping mainly because of invincible moves like Spin dash and all of its conversions, that’s the whole reason it’s used as a camping tool to begin with. An actually good aggressive Sonic is literally just as oppressive.
you know how painful it is, playing _3 different characters_ and having _ALL_ of their worst MU be Diddy? that chimp lives in my goddamn nightmares....
I play both Kazuya and Ganondorf. Min Min is abysmal in general, considering her arms (obviously) keep them away, because that’s what both characters want. It sucks, but that’s how it just goes.
Gannon definitely, but kazuya is able to get hits that are meaningful on min min. It's hard to get in, but he kills min min when he gets in. Plus Kazuya has gates of hell
I do think Sonic is a worse matchup for Kazuya, but as someone who plays Min Min a lot, I agree that Kazuya feels like a pretty chill matchup. I rarely struggle against him. It's not free, but I agree that Min Min is very, very difficult for Kazuya.
@@juliamedina3322 Basically characters with opressive neutrals are the ones who can win against Kazuya. Pikachu and Sheik feel like a -1, Min-Min is a -2 while Sonic is a -3. Meanwhile Kazuya wins against almost everything who doesn't have immaculate neutral game. Kazuya is basically the most polarizing character in smash.
Here are the characters' worst matchups in roster order, with parentheses around characters whose worst matchup is Steve that have alternate options. Samus/Dark Samus: Pichu and Pokemon Trainer Yoshi: Jigglypuff Fox: Pac-Man Pikachu: Roy, Sonic, Palutena, Simon/Richter, and Byleth Luigi: Fox Sheik: Min Min and Sephiroth Ice Climbers: Ken Roy: Ike Mr. Game and Watch: (Donkey Kong), Pikachu, Captain Falcon, Peach/Daisy, Falco, Lucario, ROB, Wii Fit Trainer, and Piranha Plant Meta Knight: King K. Rool Zero Suit Samus: Mr. Game and Watch, Meta Knight, and Incineroar Snake: Shulk Diddy Kong: Pit/Dark Pit, Pyra/Mythra, and Sora Sonic: (Kirby), Marth/Lucina, Greninja, Mii Gunner, Bayonetta, Joker, Steve, and Kazuya Olimar: Samus/Dark Samus, (Wario), Robin, and Banjo and Kazooie ROB: Wolf and Ridley Wolf: Zero Suit Samus Mega Man: Snake and Duck Hunt Rosalina: (Ryu) Greninja: Hero Palutena: Ness Pac-Man: (Sheik), Diddy Kong, and (Little Mac) Shulk: Mario, Yoshi, Dr. Mario, Corrin, (Inkling), and Terry Cloud: Young Link, Olimar, Mii Brawler, and Cloud Bayonetta: Mewtwo Joker: Zelda, Chrom, and Mii Swordfighter Hero: Villager Min Min: Ice Climbers, (Ganondorf), and Mega Man Steve: Donkey Kong, Kirby, Bowser, Sheik, Ganondorf, Wario, Little Mac, Bowser Jr., Ryu, and Inkling Sephiroth: Luigi and Lucas Pyra/Mythra: Link, Toon Link, Rosalina, (Bowser Jr.), and Isabelle Kazuya: (Bowser) Sora: Dedede
I like how the character that beats Steve and Kazuya, two of the most hated characters in the game, happens to be the absolute most hated character in Ultimate, surpassing even those two.
@@wingedbluj1674 Not to mention the fact that certain characters can reflect it right back at him/her. Oh, and Mr. Game & Watch can absorb it with his trusty little bucket.
As someone who actually plays Sonic, i do kinda get scared whenever i face Kazuya because i know he can kill me at any moment if i'm not carefull. But yeah, if you are carefull and play smart you can wreck Kazuya pretty hard and it is pretty sattisfying.
Awesome stuff!! As a sephiroth main I was suspecting pichu. Sheik can punish a little easier and spam on almost freely attack with her frame data. I would agree with you though
I'd argue MK is just as bad for MinMin as Sheik is. MK can easily easily avoid MinMin's arms because of his multi-jumps and has the speed on the ground to easily catch up her, but most importantly has probably the easiest time in the world, not only getting her offstage, but edgeguarding her.
I’m a Banjo main and I know alot of people say Olimar is terrible but I think that TG has proven the matchup is more than doable. I think he tends to struggle more versus Fox/Greninja , basically just characters who can oppress him and not let him set up his gameplan
As a fellow Banjo main, I would say that in terms of olimar, he has a lot of moves the he can safely smack pikmin away with while setting up his combos, so it's not a big deal. Greninja and fox are super exploitable with his general gameplan because of 1) Fox's weight and 2) Greninja's dependence on grabs. I would say his worst matchup is easily Isabelle, just due to her ability to invalidate his game plan. you have to play some heavy mind games to win.
@@tallen3057 I'm a Banjo main and Isabelle doesn't annoy me nearly as much Fox and Olimar. Yes Isabelle can take away his grenade, but she's still very easy to avoid, and the fun of Banjo is avoiding the opponent till they mess up.
Sonic is definitely a bad matchup for Joker but I wouldn’t say Joker loses that matchup harder than the Pikachu matchup. Bro cannot hit Pikachu it’s a pain in the ass
9:05 I think its undoubtedly ivysaur, steve loses his most oppressive option (block walls) against ivy cause his fair just destroys any blocks not to mention up air literally deletes the character
The problem is while it might be good at destroying blocks on level when recovering the blocks completely stop you. You're trading off an advantage for a loss and up air is good against most characters because of its size.
I'd say for Terry due to being a main of Terry. I'd say Lil Mac because of his super armor. If Mac charges or uses down smash at the ledge, Terry wouldn't be able to recover due to the hit box on Terry's recover. It's painful to deal with.
These videos are really appreciated Jordan! If you want video ideas, maybe a video with something about frame data or a video on how to optimally train amiibos?
I'm surprised you found footage of every single matchup. I'd think there'd be at least one no one's recorded a match of, especially since these are bad matchups.
shulk counter: 6 steve counter: 10 mr game and watch counter: 10 marth/lucina counter: 1 olimar counter: 4 sonic counter: 10 luigi counter: 1 sephiroth counter: 3 palutena counter: 1 yoshi counter: 1 kazuya counter: 1 min min counter: 3 pac-man counter: 3 joker counter: 4 samus / dark samus counter: 2 cloud counter: 3 bayonetta counter: 1 pikachu counter: 5 zero suit samus counter: 3 diddy kong counter: 3 wolf counter: 1 mega man counter: 2 roy/chrom counter: 1 sora counter: 1 pyra and mythra counter: 4 ROB counter: 2 hero counter: 1 fox counter: 1 snake counter: 1 rosalina counter: 1 ice climber counter: 1 metaknight counter: 1 greninja counter: 1 sheik counter: 2 this the final result. the steve counter is redundant, because poppt1 took the second worst matchup for each character.
Piranha:Joker Joker: sonic Herói:greninja Banjo:olimar Terry:SHULK Byleth:Pikachu Min min:sheik Steve:sonic Sephiroth: sheik Pyra/mythra:diddy Kong Kazuya:Sonic Sora:diddy kong
As a seph player there are alot of bad mus for faster characters but i definitely feel like diddy is at least a honorable mention due to how easy it is for him to whiff punish and kill sephiroth while also applying pressure with the monkey flip mix ups, min min is also on the level of sheik imo
shiek generally does pretty good vs. most swordies, i think because they dont have great escape options vs her combos and she is really good at edgeguarding their decent at best recoveries Min min is just a swordie on crack
I main banjo and I would argue falco also if ur using side b as a burst option to go through projectiles a lot idk what ur doing I mean it’s good sometimes but not close to the main use of that move
@@darkmewmewsans5481 There's plenty of people who main a character because they love the franchise they're from. As an example I know someone who mains Ness because Earthbound is his favorite game. I'd assume that it's a similar case for OP since like you said, there's not much appealing about Banjo from a mechanics/gameplay perspective.
@@darkmewmewsans5481 I was born far after the series came out I just like him because I like bears in general as an animal and you can create crafty combos and allows for lots of improv in play which I find fun
As a seph main, i think robin and zss are his worst matchups. they are both extremely fast. they have mid range attacks that can do some noticeable damage. Robin's poison builds up percentage on the light seph making ko easier, and zss stunning seph is not good. zss also has the extended grab which is hard for seph who has no real good out-f-shield. and when you try to use any of seph range attacks, robin reflects or endures while samus either runs away of flips over them and is on top of you before you have a chance to recover and use the up neutral. It may sound odd, but I use slide a lot to initiate combos with seph and it is probably the best scenario for zss. slide, neutral air, down smash, octoslash, throw out a mega flaree in case they go higher, scintilla to edge guard. honestly, that is my best advice for any seph user
Former Sephiroth main, Sheik is a bad matchup but the worst for me was Fox. It's hard to stop Fox pressure, the frame data is insane against Seph and the advantage Fox has over Sheik is weight. Sheik dies far easier than Fox and does less damage even if she can combo you longer
@@marikevangroning1603 Cloud might get gimped, but his neutral is way more oppressive than Sonic's against Steve. Also why I think characters like Aegis, Min min or Rob are worse matchups.
I honestly think that Cloud is an effective counter pick to Sora. He has a bigger sword, he hits harder, and has a much better Anti-combo game on top of being able to match his speed.
I'm not here because i necessarily think you're wrong about the cloud counterpick (though spells really do hurt cloud and sora can edgeguard the crap out of cloud, so i wouldn't say it's too bad if bad at all, but i can see someone saying cloud-sora is good for cloud nonetheless) but did you really just say cloud has better combos than sora? because that is flat out wrong, sora has infinite combos and even not including those sora has some crazy combos with double-jump canceling, such as down-tilt -> double jump cancel nair 1 -> nair 2 -> double jump cancel nair one -> nair 2 -Double jump cancel Fair 1 -> fair 2. -> down tilt -> fair 1/2/3 dealing 55%. all this isn't even talking about how cloud doesn't have much of a combo game in the first place, with is combos usually being a grand total of 2 hits. namely Bair -> Dash attack or Up air -> up air, dealing around 25%.
@@undeadmyth9977 No, it’s that it’s harder to land the Sora combos on Cloud because of the range issue. Also, since Sora’s sword has three different hotboxes, all with different amounts of hitstun, the spacing is also an issue, since you can’t just run up and start the combo from the hilt. Sora has to play with tippers to get anything done, which is a problem because Clouds sword still outranges him. The core issue is the range and that Cloud can match his speed.
I disagree with Min Mins worst mu I think MK is worse. All his moves clank with hers, edgeguards her really well, has his teleport move, and is small with a lot of jumps. Speaking of Min Min I think they’re the hardest for Pyra and Mythra not diddy Kong although he’s up there.
I agree that Meta knight beats minmin, but it’s not worse than shiek. MK does get wall out a bit, and if you wait for him to land after dair camping, it’s not as bad.
I actually main both characters, and I agree that MK is awful for Min Min, and she's awful for Aegis. I do struggle more against Sheik with Min Min than against MK, but both are ridiculously hard. Diddy feels worse than Min Min for Aegis. Min Min is super difficult, don't get me wrong, but in general, when a character can out-neutral Mythra, you're in big trouble, and Diddy's neutral is just insane.
@@xanander4693 I may be biased but Sheik is still a tall character who’s light which means it’s easier to land hits on her than someone like MK but I’ll admit that sheiks needles are harder to deal with than most of MKs kit and speed as well
As a Joker main I'd have to say Pikachu (and Pichu) over Sonic. Pika evades the bait and punish playstyle by just spamming neutral B and is very hard to combo with how small he is. Pika is also one of the few characters that can reliably edgeguard Joker and he can just camp when Arsene is out. If you're a Joker main, try picking up a secondary that does decently against Pika. G&W is a good one that doesn't require too much effort imo
I remember I tried the Olimar (me) vs. the Banjo (bro) matchup. Very abysmal for Banjo. Can't even Side B approach. The Pikmin tanking and making Banjo be stuck in place was horrendously bad for Banjo
Min Min is worse than Sonic for Steve if used correctly. The closest we got was the ft10 with Protobanham and Acola. The issue was that Proto is not a retreater. Even Steven in the sky is in danger and not a threat because of the slight angle on midair up b from Min Min. I would also say that Min Min is MUCH easier to get ready for steve if you don't main her. Her difficulty to main comes from how different many of the matchups have to be played to get the most out of her. Steve you just go meatball stay max range and stay poking. No need to use the hurtbox shift optimize edge guards or ledgetraps or mix up second arm timing care if Steve mines or crafts etc.
My biggest takeaway from this series of videos: Jordan mains a character that is almost half the cast's worst match-up.
Strategy!
And Steve is basically the other half
0:29 Piranha Plant
1:25 Joker
2:46 Hero
3:53 Banjo & Kazooie
4:57 Terry
6:00 Byleth
7:35 Minmin
8:54 Steve
11:34 Sephiroth
13:08 Pyra/Mythra
15:03 Kazuya
16:08 Sora
Thank you
The G.O.A.T ♥️
Piranha Plant - G&W
Joker - Sonic
Hero - Greninja
B&K - Olimar
Terry - Shulk
Byleth - pikachu
MinMin - Sheik
Steve - Sonic
Sephiroth - Sheik
P/M - Diddy Kong
Kazuya - Sonic
Sora - Diddy Kong
@@konkurer775This most definitely did not age well for Hero
@@konkurer775Diddy Kong for Pyra? Really?
Every character's Best Matchup next, take a shot every time you say Ganondorf
Or Little Mac
Or Donkey Kong
I got a buz just reading this. And I don't even drink🤦♂️
His liver would be crying
I think that many shots would kill even the irish-
Villager is a worse mu for plant, pocketing the ball completely defuses plants gameplan and villager can happily camp an approaching plant
Villager and Isabelle are fing terrible for plant. They just nullify his only good move
I ran I to a good villager after I got my plant into elite smash and he damn near made me quit playing plant
the thing with villager being bad matchups is that villager is just a horrendous character in general and at a top level, g&w is more invalidating
this also happens with banjo but for a lesser degree. if u pocket the grenade, it completly nullifies it which is his main advantage state starter.
true, sadly. very specific but very bad for plant
Honestly find Shulk's MUs rather interesting. He has a lot of favorable matchups against the new DLC (Steve, Terry, Kazuya, probably some others I'm missing) but Shulk tends to struggle hard against the traditional top tiers, like Palu, Snake, and Pikachu, and he goes even or losing against a lot of swordies.
he has crazy disjointed range for dealing with slow and hard hitting characters like Steve and kazuya but fast characters like pika run circles around him
edit: also if I had to guess, pika can edgeguard shulk pretty easily
like if the character does to swords, he kinda exemplifies the strengths and weaknesses of swordies to the max with arts and his stats
Shulk only exists to be the DLC slayer lmao
Not sure why some believe the Pikachu and Shulk matchup is favorable for Pika. It’s even imo
@@seviyasouji Mostly just a question of if Shulk can keep pikachu out, but pikachu has a good projectile and a very fast speed so shulk has to approach, and shulk thrives off of edgeguard kills, which is hard to do against Pikachu.
That’s my piranha plant being destroyed by Maister 👀😂
lmao good job even going to tournaments im too scared
You played plant against maister, you deserve a medal
Your a good piranha plant player
I'm a Sephiroth main. I agree that Sheik is pretty rough, but Pikachu is also ridiculously hard for him. Maybe more so. People think of Sephiroth as a slow spacing machine but one factor that is also tough is that a lot of his moves are precision. Really it's only his up-air, forward-tilt, and up-smash that don't require precision. Sort of Neutral-B too but that's just a different thing altogether. Landing meaningful hits on Pika is so hard. Not to mention that Seph is amazing at ledge trapping and solid at edge guards. That strength is pretty much nullified by Pika's total lack of disadvantage. I know Pika is a very generic bad match up but hot damn is he hard for this character. He's definitely got a few bad ones but probably the next worst is Sonic.
Pikachu isn't that bad once you really learn it, I think Tweek even put Sephiroth as winning. Personally I would recommend using Scintilla to counter Pikachu's up-B and neutral-B, as well as using orbs to nullify his neutral-B approaches. Nair is also helpful in this matchup, it is hard to learn at first but completely doable, don't worry!
@@marcmothersole8265 That surprises me a lot that Tweek put him as winning! I appreciate the encouragement! Honestly I actually do have a solid grasp on the match up with both Pika and Sheik. I can win against both for sure. But I've found that generally true in my experience. There's no match up where I feel like they're unbeatable with Seph. Against Pika what I've done that helps is use shield only to parry T-Jolt and focus on maintaining control with Shadow Flare and good spacing with Scintilla to catch Quick Attack and other burst options (sparingly). Luckily Seph has no problem with kill moves so after a little control just landing an F-Tilt or b-air tends to do the trick. Still a good Pika will use his small hurt box and pancaking to evade very effectively but with minimal effort. Maybe I can reevaluate the match up though and see it in Seph's favor!
@@d.a.d.-ohgosh bair doesnt hit pika easily, but you can use fair to poke him offstage, or retreating up air to cover air approaches. Both of these moves are easier to hit small characters with. T-Jolt approach doesn't work as like you said, Scintilla will fuck him up for trying it, AND side B goes through the t-jolt and nullifies it. You can kill Pika with up airs, catch him in shield with d smash, catch him grounded with f-tilts or get a bair read. A reliable method is to knock him offstage (fair is easy to do this with) and then edgegaurd or ledgetrap, if he tries to skip either phase by just quick attacking past you, Scintilla will activate and kill him. NOTE: Scintilla will NOT activate on Pichu's quick attack as it has no hitbox, making it significantly easier for him to get past you. The only matchup I think is REALLY bad for Sephiroth is Joker, I play Aegis for Joker because any good Joker player will never lose to you in this mu, unless you are miles better than them (just being miles better than people is not a reliable tournament winning strategy). Sheik is reliably winnable but definitely favours Sheik. Good luck and have fun bringing despair to Smash.
@@marcmothersole8265 don't think tweek has played very many top level pikas with seph. It's crazy how your opinion can change depending who you play.
Pika can low profile most of seph's aerials, which is a huge problem for him. Speed and T Jolt of course make neutral pretty difficult even if orbs intercept t jolt.
Coupled with the fact he could get edgeguarded pretty hard by pika, and is tall and incredibly light, it's pretty rough. He also can't camp on ledge because of Tjolt. Meaning it's really hard to adjust to the disadvantage.
As another sephiroth main yeah I agree. Skeik is bad, but pika is worse for all the reasons you listed
If Rex was in smash bros, he would definitely be Pyra and Mythra's worst matchup, cause he would be able to smash them both in ultimate and canonically
This f-ing picture at the end of 3 💀
Bruh💀💀💀💀
Pyra and mythra mains wish they were rex
I knew this comment was inevitable
Xenoblade 2 sucks
Greninja being the standout Hero counter is by far one of the weirdest and unexpected matchups. I didn't expect Greninja to be _anyone's_ worst matchup.
Greninja over here channeling Frog from Chrono Trigger, seeking revenge for DQ taking his game's spot.
This list is straight up wrong Hero does not lose to Greninja in fact it's the complete opposite as he destroys Greninja
@@mrwrighthen who destroys hero
@@meinman7591 unironically Hero himself at worst and realistically maybe Pikachu
a character O don't have and a character that dies to a lucky fsmash... fml
Watching the gameplay of Sonic's spin dash just going right through minecart like 50 times: Yup, this has to be Steve's worst matchup
As a Sonic main, I was like, "..... That's genius! I never thought of that!" - also ngl, I'm hyped that Sonic tops Steve 🙌😆
Now someone's gotta make a comprehensive chart showing all these worst matchups in one place
Moral of the story: Sonic may be annoying and boring, but he's a necessary evil to keep the dlc in check
Imo an aggressive Sonic who doesn’t even let you breathe is not boring at all, there’s more than one way to play that character
@@RealBroccoliHour yeah, but objectively the most efficient way to play him is campy, so people in tournament do that instead
@@Splonton That’s not objective. Sonic’s rushdown game is just as good as his “campiness”, because the character itself basically has no unviable options. That’s why Sonic is a valid contender for best character in the game for a lot of people
@@RealBroccoliHour no it really isn't. The reason his camping playstyle is just objectively more viable is because the vast majority of characters have no answer to it. There's nothing they can do unless the sonic screws something up. With the rushdown style yeah it's still good, but more characters have a solution to being rushed down than being camped out
@@Splonton Sonic’s rushdown is just as good as his camping mainly because of invincible moves like Spin dash and all of its conversions, that’s the whole reason it’s used as a camping tool to begin with. An actually good aggressive Sonic is literally just as oppressive.
I love how like 75% of worst matchups are steve, shulk, game and watch, sonic and diddy.
you know how painful it is, playing _3 different characters_ and having _ALL_ of their worst MU be Diddy?
that chimp lives in my goddamn nightmares....
Try picking up Rosalina, stealing the banana with down b is always a pleasure :)
Pick up Steve then
Duck Hunt supposedly does well against Diddy Kong.
I play both Kazuya and Ganondorf. Min Min is abysmal in general, considering her arms (obviously) keep them away, because that’s what both characters want. It sucks, but that’s how it just goes.
Gannon definitely, but kazuya is able to get hits that are meaningful on min min. It's hard to get in, but he kills min min when he gets in. Plus Kazuya has gates of hell
@@dempseyt4976 yeah, the angle on that move has always been disgusting lmao.
@@SaulTeeNutz MU still bad for Kazuya, but it's not unwinnable, it's just difficult. Sonic actually looks unwinnable at top level
I do think Sonic is a worse matchup for Kazuya, but as someone who plays Min Min a lot, I agree that Kazuya feels like a pretty chill matchup. I rarely struggle against him. It's not free, but I agree that Min Min is very, very difficult for Kazuya.
@@juliamedina3322 Basically characters with opressive neutrals are the ones who can win against Kazuya. Pikachu and Sheik feel like a -1, Min-Min is a -2 while Sonic is a -3. Meanwhile Kazuya wins against almost everything who doesn't have immaculate neutral game. Kazuya is basically the most polarizing character in smash.
Here are the characters' worst matchups in roster order, with parentheses around characters whose worst matchup is Steve that have alternate options.
Samus/Dark Samus: Pichu and Pokemon Trainer
Yoshi: Jigglypuff
Fox: Pac-Man
Pikachu: Roy, Sonic, Palutena, Simon/Richter, and Byleth
Luigi: Fox
Sheik: Min Min and Sephiroth
Ice Climbers: Ken
Roy: Ike
Mr. Game and Watch: (Donkey Kong), Pikachu, Captain Falcon, Peach/Daisy, Falco, Lucario, ROB, Wii Fit Trainer, and Piranha Plant
Meta Knight: King K. Rool
Zero Suit Samus: Mr. Game and Watch, Meta Knight, and Incineroar
Snake: Shulk
Diddy Kong: Pit/Dark Pit, Pyra/Mythra, and Sora
Sonic: (Kirby), Marth/Lucina, Greninja, Mii Gunner, Bayonetta, Joker, Steve, and Kazuya
Olimar: Samus/Dark Samus, (Wario), Robin, and Banjo and Kazooie
ROB: Wolf and Ridley
Wolf: Zero Suit Samus
Mega Man: Snake and Duck Hunt
Rosalina: (Ryu)
Greninja: Hero
Palutena: Ness
Pac-Man: (Sheik), Diddy Kong, and (Little Mac)
Shulk: Mario, Yoshi, Dr. Mario, Corrin, (Inkling), and Terry
Cloud: Young Link, Olimar, Mii Brawler, and Cloud
Bayonetta: Mewtwo
Joker: Zelda, Chrom, and Mii Swordfighter
Hero: Villager
Min Min: Ice Climbers, (Ganondorf), and Mega Man
Steve: Donkey Kong, Kirby, Bowser, Sheik, Ganondorf, Wario, Little Mac, Bowser Jr., Ryu, and Inkling
Sephiroth: Luigi and Lucas
Pyra/Mythra: Link, Toon Link, Rosalina, (Bowser Jr.), and Isabelle
Kazuya: (Bowser)
Sora: Dedede
Steve’s worst MU is cloud bc back air beats minecart. This is why Acola has been struggling with Sparg0
and acola says sonic is even mu
I like how the character that beats Steve and Kazuya, two of the most hated characters in the game, happens to be the absolute most hated character in Ultimate, surpassing even those two.
After I fight Sonic, I’m not sad that I lost, I’m just happy it’s over.
Moral of the story
Don’t ban Steve from tournaments
Bring more sonics 🤣
I just just absolutely love the analysis type videos.
I like that this series was also technically an "every character's best matchups" video series, as well.
I never found out what Dedede’s best matchup is
@@Baxter_the_Octopus Probably either Ganon or DK.
@@TheSharkAntliterally the only two matchups I think favor dedede
@@Blackfedoraowner King Dedede apparently has a surprisingly good matchup with Peach. What do you think?
@@TheSharkAnt I would probably say that is even as a Dedede main. I don’t know how Dedede has an advantage over Peach.
Bob's your uncle was always a confusing phrase for me as a kid, I actually had an uncle named Bob so it was just a matter of fact
Great video. Though I am pretty sure Steve's worst matchup is just Spargo
My thought exactly 😂
ya thats just spargo tho. Aint no other clouds beating steves tbh
@@kkokay4I see clouds beating Steves all the time
@@xanander4693that’s spargod cloud
It’s funny how Sonic beats the other two Sega characters
6:46 Not to mention that Pikachu can completely duck under Byleth's Neutral-B.
Why would you use Byleth's Neutral B unless the shield breaks?
@@weirdguy1495 Snipes and damage across the stage?
The uncharged version is good, but the full charge version is too committal for anything other than sniping off stage opponents.
a lot of characters can, you can just cancel it not really something that makes the mu worse since you're not using failnaught in neutral much anyway
@@wingedbluj1674 Not to mention the fact that certain characters can reflect it right back at him/her.
Oh, and Mr. Game & Watch can absorb it with his trusty little bucket.
Steve vs Sonic: I used the cringe to destroy the cringe
I might pick up Sonic because I hate Kazuya
“It’s a sacrifice…I’m willing to make”
As someone who actually plays Sonic, i do kinda get scared whenever i face Kazuya because i know he can kill me at any moment if i'm not carefull. But yeah, if you are carefull and play smart you can wreck Kazuya pretty hard and it is pretty sattisfying.
@@robmacher3253 Thanks for the advice
That Steve vs Sonic match was painful to watch
At least the Sonic won, even if he had to time him out... But oof...I was this close to just skipping to the next fight.
I have a newfound respect for Sonic players.
Thank you very much good sir
id still rather watch steve and kazuya over sonic
Sora being weak to Diddy makes sense. Those Powerwild monkey Heartless in KH1 are my Kryptonite.
Sure Mr. Game And Watch wins against half the matchups but Sonic has an even more important role: the DLC killer.
I am constantly bemused by how Sonic seems to consistently rip his fellow SEGA reps apart by design. First Bayonetta and now Joker.
Steve: I fear no man...but that thing *sees Sonic waving* it scares me
Love these informative videos! A video showcasing the ways characters can play vs different matchups would make for a good series
I would never expect a rich bendy fruit full of Potassium be deadly, but the Chimp proved me wrong😂😂😂
Remember Lanky's fight with K Rool? I think that is what is what Sakurai trying to reference.
Definitely make one of these for smash 64
Awesome stuff!! As a sephiroth main I was suspecting pichu. Sheik can punish a little easier and spam on almost freely attack with her frame data. I would agree with you though
From all my sora experience the worst match up for me has been snake. Just hold/pull a grenade and it renders the three hit useless
Another interesting video you could make is a list of matchups where a low/mid tier beats a high/too tier like DK cloud for example
Apparent Mr. Game & Watch loses to Little Mac.
@@TheSharkAnt It's possible if Game & Watch fails to keep Little Mac offstage
I'd argue MK is just as bad for MinMin as Sheik is. MK can easily easily avoid MinMin's arms because of his multi-jumps and has the speed on the ground to easily catch up her, but most importantly has probably the easiest time in the world, not only getting her offstage, but edgeguarding her.
As a Min Min main, I don't know if MK is as bad as Sheik, but he's definitely up there. MK is insanely hard for Min Min, 100%. I super agree.
@@juliamedina3322 aren't Puff and Greninja also terrible for Min Min ?
Can't you just SDI out of his combos?
I’m a Banjo main and I know alot of people say Olimar is terrible but I think that TG has proven the matchup is more than doable. I think he tends to struggle more versus Fox/Greninja , basically just characters who can oppress him and not let him set up his gameplan
As a fellow Banjo main, I would say that in terms of olimar, he has a lot of moves the he can safely smack pikmin away with while setting up his combos, so it's not a big deal. Greninja and fox are super exploitable with his general gameplan because of 1) Fox's weight and 2) Greninja's dependence on grabs. I would say his worst matchup is easily Isabelle, just due to her ability to invalidate his game plan. you have to play some heavy mind games to win.
@@tallen3057 I'm a Banjo main and Isabelle doesn't annoy me nearly as much Fox and Olimar. Yes Isabelle can take away his grenade, but she's still very easy to avoid, and the fun of Banjo is avoiding the opponent till they mess up.
Sonic is definitely a bad matchup for Joker but I wouldn’t say Joker loses that matchup harder than the Pikachu matchup. Bro cannot hit Pikachu it’s a pain in the ass
9:05 I think its undoubtedly ivysaur, steve loses his most oppressive option (block walls) against ivy cause his fair just destroys any blocks not to mention up air literally deletes the character
The problem is while it might be good at destroying blocks on level when recovering the blocks completely stop you.
You're trading off an advantage for a loss and up air is good against most characters because of its size.
@@Buglin_Burger7878Ivy’s recovery goes through blocks
I'd say for Terry due to being a main of Terry. I'd say Lil Mac because of his super armor. If Mac charges or uses down smash at the ledge, Terry wouldn't be able to recover due to the hit box on Terry's recover. It's painful to deal with.
These videos are really appreciated Jordan! If you want video ideas, maybe a video with something about frame data or a video on how to optimally train amiibos?
I'm surprised you found footage of every single matchup. I'd think there'd be at least one no one's recorded a match of, especially since these are bad matchups.
Steve also struggles against characters with long range (not projectiles), such as Cloud, Sephiroth and Min Min.
shulk counter: 6
steve counter: 10
mr game and watch counter: 10
marth/lucina counter: 1
olimar counter: 4
sonic counter: 10
luigi counter: 1
sephiroth counter: 3
palutena counter: 1
yoshi counter: 1
kazuya counter: 1
min min counter: 3
pac-man counter: 3
joker counter: 4
samus / dark samus counter: 2
cloud counter: 3
bayonetta counter: 1
pikachu counter: 5
zero suit samus counter: 3
diddy kong counter: 3
wolf counter: 1
mega man counter: 2
roy/chrom counter: 1
sora counter: 1
pyra and mythra counter: 4
ROB counter: 2
hero counter: 1
fox counter: 1
snake counter: 1
rosalina counter: 1
ice climber counter: 1
metaknight counter: 1
greninja counter: 1
sheik counter: 2
this the final result.
the steve counter is redundant, because poppt1 took the second worst matchup for each character.
18:30 voice crack lol
Piranha:Joker
Joker: sonic
Herói:greninja
Banjo:olimar
Terry:SHULK
Byleth:Pikachu
Min min:sheik
Steve:sonic
Sephiroth: sheik
Pyra/mythra:diddy Kong
Kazuya:Sonic
Sora:diddy kong
Sephiroth:pyra&mythra actual worst MU
This series is why my Ridley maining ass picked up Mega Man.
Steve's Worst Matchup: Sonic
Sonic mains: **Pop off Celebration**
It's finally out, been very curious about sephiroth and sora lmao
After watching everything, it seems like maining sonic with a pocket diddy would be a good strat.
As a seph player there are alot of bad mus for faster characters but i definitely feel like diddy is at least a honorable mention due to how easy it is for him to whiff punish and kill sephiroth while also applying pressure with the monkey flip mix ups, min min is also on the level of sheik imo
shiek generally does pretty good vs. most swordies, i think because they dont have great escape options vs her combos and she is really good at edgeguarding their decent at best recoveries
Min min is just a swordie on crack
I think Cloud might be better than Sonic vs Steve. Cloud's big fair and bair can break mine cart, and Steve cannot punish on shield.
Bro has game and watch bias
you asked for more ideas, please keep doing every character in a tournament, I love those vids!
Oddly poetic that Smash’s first third party character is good against a lot of the most recent third party additions
I thought Snake was Smash's first third party character.
2:47 Smooth description into the MU
If sephis isnt pika, imma riot
Edit: Fair enough
Sonic eating good with this one
On top of the matchups listed here, i'm aware he's also one of Byleth's worst matchups.
I main banjo and I would argue falco also if ur using side b as a burst option to go through projectiles a lot idk what ur doing I mean it’s good sometimes but not close to the main use of that move
Can you please explain why you main banjo? This isn’t an insult I just don’t understand why anyone wants to play him
@@darkmewmewsans5481 There's plenty of people who main a character because they love the franchise they're from. As an example I know someone who mains Ness because Earthbound is his favorite game.
I'd assume that it's a similar case for OP since like you said, there's not much appealing about Banjo from a mechanics/gameplay perspective.
@@drakejoshofficialyoutubech5569 That’s a fair point, I main Mega Man cause I love the games so I guess that’s fair
@@darkmewmewsans5481 I was born far after the series came out I just like him because I like bears in general as an animal and you can create crafty combos and allows for lots of improv in play which I find fun
@@Eli_Becker fair point, I respect that
Piranha plant also has a horrible matchup against Isabelle and Villager, they have such good answers to ptooie
You should watch and give commentary on some of the larger tournaments
If every one starts maining Sonic to sort of counter Steve, im quiting the game
Say hello to Sonix.
We gotta have an every character's BEST matchup now
Alright, take a shot for every time Ganon is best MU.
So basically you have to out annoying the annoying characters with Sonic and Diddy. Genius.
6:10 the shinymark in question:
Honestly I think Byleth's worst matchup is Min Min by far, but yeah pikachu is pretty bad too
Min min is byleth's worth matchup easily
But pika, shiek, and sonic are similarly hard imo
Sonic is Steve's worst matchup, huh? I guess what it takes to defeat a spammy character... Is another spammy character.
As a seph main, i think robin and zss are his worst matchups. they are both extremely fast. they have mid range attacks that can do some noticeable damage. Robin's poison builds up percentage on the light seph making ko easier, and zss stunning seph is not good. zss also has the extended grab which is hard for seph who has no real good out-f-shield. and when you try to use any of seph range attacks, robin reflects or endures while samus either runs away of flips over them and is on top of you before you have a chance to recover and use the up neutral. It may sound odd, but I use slide a lot to initiate combos with seph and it is probably the best scenario for zss. slide, neutral air, down smash, octoslash, throw out a mega flaree in case they go higher, scintilla to edge guard. honestly, that is my best advice for any seph user
My most played characters really don't like diddy kong: Pit/Dark Pit, Sora, Pyra/Mythra. To compensate it, I also play diddy kong and wolf.
Former Sephiroth main, Sheik is a bad matchup but the worst for me was Fox. It's hard to stop Fox pressure, the frame data is insane against Seph and the advantage Fox has over Sheik is weight. Sheik dies far easier than Fox and does less damage even if she can combo you longer
I'm sephiroth main also and I agree 100% fox is a hard MU too. I also think tho sephiroth worst mu is aegis. Sheik is hard too tho
I think the worst matchup for Steve is cloud
It's crazy how much hate Sonix specifically gets when KEN's sonic is ungodly levels of lame.
i thought cloud was steve’s worst matchup
Spargo vs acola is Steve's worst matchup, steve can gimp cloud a little easier than Sonic
It's close though
@@marikevangroning1603 Cloud might get gimped, but his neutral is way more oppressive than Sonic's against Steve. Also why I think characters like Aegis, Min min or Rob are worse matchups.
It is. Poppit made a lot of mistakes in these worst mu vids.
Ok this has been a really cool and informative series
I honestly think that Cloud is an effective counter pick to Sora. He has a bigger sword, he hits harder, and has a much better Anti-combo game on top of being able to match his speed.
his aerials go crazy into sora too cuz of how floaty he is and how wide they are
I'd imagine Sora basically gets an edgeguard kill on Cloud any percent though. If Sora gets him offstage he could just run off, hold A, Cloud dies.
@@vision4860 If you get Cloud off stage it’s an easy kill, but you’ve got to deal with the giant sword first
I'm not here because i necessarily think you're wrong about the cloud counterpick (though spells really do hurt cloud and sora can edgeguard the crap out of cloud, so i wouldn't say it's too bad if bad at all, but i can see someone saying cloud-sora is good for cloud nonetheless)
but did you really just say cloud has better combos than sora? because that is flat out wrong, sora has infinite combos and even not including those sora has some crazy combos with double-jump canceling, such as down-tilt -> double jump cancel nair 1 -> nair 2 -> double jump cancel nair one -> nair 2 -Double jump cancel Fair 1 -> fair 2. -> down tilt -> fair 1/2/3 dealing 55%.
all this isn't even talking about how cloud doesn't have much of a combo game in the first place, with is combos usually being a grand total of 2 hits. namely Bair -> Dash attack or Up air -> up air, dealing around 25%.
@@undeadmyth9977 No, it’s that it’s harder to land the Sora combos on Cloud because of the range issue.
Also, since Sora’s sword has three different hotboxes, all with different amounts of hitstun, the spacing is also an issue, since you can’t just run up and start the combo from the hilt. Sora has to play with tippers to get anything done, which is a problem because Clouds sword still outranges him.
The core issue is the range and that Cloud can match his speed.
You forgot that shulk can shield art out of terry’s combos 😂
I would love to see a video talking about everyone's worst mu
Why is no one talking about how sonic counters Steve and kazuya and has no bad matchups
To fight cancer *cough* steve you have to fight cancer with cancer *cough* sonic
The video, showcasing the best player for each character, would be interesting to watch
If you play steve, you lose the right to complain about Sonic.
Hi i main sonic. You Right
I disagree with Min Mins worst mu I think MK is worse. All his moves clank with hers, edgeguards her really well, has his teleport move, and is small with a lot of jumps.
Speaking of Min Min I think they’re the hardest for Pyra and Mythra not diddy Kong although he’s up there.
I agree that Meta knight beats minmin, but it’s not worse than shiek. MK does get wall out a bit, and if you wait for him to land after dair camping, it’s not as bad.
I actually main both characters, and I agree that MK is awful for Min Min, and she's awful for Aegis. I do struggle more against Sheik with Min Min than against MK, but both are ridiculously hard. Diddy feels worse than Min Min for Aegis. Min Min is super difficult, don't get me wrong, but in general, when a character can out-neutral Mythra, you're in big trouble, and Diddy's neutral is just insane.
@@xanander4693 I may be biased but Sheik is still a tall character who’s light which means it’s easier to land hits on her than someone like MK but I’ll admit that sheiks needles are harder to deal with than most of MKs kit and speed as well
@@juliamedina3322 true diddy does do good against swordies just like Min min but he also has banana and good stage control with his item
These were a great trio of videos ! Keep it up my guy !
I'm surprised sonic is a bad matchup for some of these characters, i thought people didn't like using sonic.
I predict that Steve's worst match up is Steve.
I had so much fun watching the vids Poppt
Thx for making good videos Poppt
You should do every characters best matchup
This video is the reason why i came back to my sonic
A new best combos or best kill confirms would be so cool
Steve’s worst mu is def cloud. The only person Acola can’t beat is Sparg0
we can conclude that Sheik Sonic and Diddy Kong destroy most of the DLC
As a Joker main I'd have to say Pikachu (and Pichu) over Sonic. Pika evades the bait and punish playstyle by just spamming neutral B and is very hard to combo with how small he is. Pika is also one of the few characters that can reliably edgeguard Joker and he can just camp when Arsene is out.
If you're a Joker main, try picking up a secondary that does decently against Pika. G&W is a good one that doesn't require too much effort imo
Why is Sonic easier for Joker?
I remember I tried the Olimar (me) vs. the Banjo (bro) matchup. Very abysmal for Banjo. Can't even Side B approach. The Pikmin tanking and making Banjo be stuck in place was horrendously bad for Banjo
Min Min is worse than Sonic for Steve if used correctly. The closest we got was the ft10 with Protobanham and Acola. The issue was that Proto is not a retreater. Even Steven in the sky is in danger and not a threat because of the slight angle on midair up b from Min Min. I would also say that Min Min is MUCH easier to get ready for steve if you don't main her. Her difficulty to main comes from how different many of the matchups have to be played to get the most out of her. Steve you just go meatball stay max range and stay poking. No need to use the hurtbox shift optimize edge guards or ledgetraps or mix up second arm timing care if Steve mines or crafts etc.