Phaetus Dragonfly - The best not best hotend?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 พ.ย. 2020
- Would like to thank Phaetus for providing this hotend for testing, there's links to supporting vendors on their website
This video is more of an overview and my thoughts on after using this hotend after a few weeks of use. Hotend reviewing is extremely subjective and there's many factors that can sway your choice.
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10:45 this is an excellent real world experiment. Exactly the piece of knowledge I needed
Thank you for this super in-depth review. I appreciate it a lot!
Excellent video! Thanks for all of the info!
AWESOME video, THANKS for sharing!
Nice job, I'm sold :). Seriously, could you concoct a comparison between the 40W and 50W cartridges in either or both of those hotends?
I am new to your channel.
This review was excellent, and stands out to me due to the amount of useless and contradictory information on the web.
You have earned a subscription. Excellent content and presentation.
Loved my Dragonfly BMS hotend until the heat break broke in half! The set screw design made it almost impossible to keep tight!
Nero3DP CA Is Life!
This is what i'm looking for when i type in "phaetus dragonfly review". It's easy to understand, straight tho the point, and it's honest imo. Thanks for that, dude.
It's a great hotend, I just installed one into a voron with a 0.5cht and the print quality and flow are more than enough for my needs. The Creality mount version is also a fantastic way to upgrade an ender 3.
Great video as always 👍
Interesting hotend. I prefer the Dragen hotend.
Thanks for sharing your experience with all of us 👍😊
Why do you prefer the dragon as opposed to the dragonfly?
Would you prefer this over the Trianglelabs Dragon hotend V2? Also, is it possible to mount the BMG wind to this hotend? I have an Ender 3 pro (should I get the other heatsink?)
I am betwen this dragon fly and a bi metalic heatbrake from slicing engineering for my ender 3. Stefan tried the heatbrake from slice but he got arround 12 cubic mm per second with the stock heater block of the ender 3.
great video overall! I think another way you could test volumetric flow is finding max flow rate using same filament, same temps and same nozzle, extruder etc.... then after estep calibration test max extrusion speed and see when the extruder motor starts clicking or you see filament grinding.
i know this is old comment but how do you test max extrusion speed?? im interested
@@nightninja879 I know CNC Kitchen's method is to heat to temperature and then extrude the same length of filament at different speeds starting slow and going faster each test, then weigh how much was actually extruded each time. Generally when you graph it you'll get a slow drop as you go faster and then the graph suddenly falls off a cliff. That's the limit of that hotend. I think he did a comparison of a bunch of nozzles in the same hotend this way for his bondtech CHT. Also I'm even later than you were.
Got it a few days ago, together with TMC2208, and now I can't manage to get a clean print, should I reduce the flow with this hotend, worked fine with the V6
I'm trying to work out if this can be mounted on a Prusa Mini using the rigid mount screws. Could you tell me what the distance is between opposing pairs please?
New to printing(3mo) and work in fabrication. Trying to keep a relatively tight budget. Any thoughts on reliably printing carbon fibre nylon. We have an ender3 v2 to prototype some parts. I came across this hotend a V6 or a Swiss clone. Also any recomendations on extruders would be helpful, Im assuming direct drive with steel gears?
What's the name of that test thing you showed before the benchy?
I love that cooler design is there a stl available somewhere, the shroud type thing for the v6 that is
Thats the afterburner toolhead, its for most of the voron printers
A comparison of the max volumetric flow rates between different hotends (under equal environment) would be great.
V6/mk8 - dragonfly/copperhead/mosquito/dragon - hf dragon/mosquito - volcano - supervolcano
@@CanuckCreator Battle Royale! Cage Match!
Just got the BMS version of this Dragonfly setup for my ender5 pro. I have the glass beaded thermostat and wondering how the that GD900 thermo grease acts as adhesive so it doesn't pop out of the that brass sleeve? I have a feeling that is not what its for and that a thermo apoxy adhesive is required here.
Recommended retraction settings on Bowden Ender 3?
After knowing the rigid mount of Dragon Hotend, I paid extra 15 bucks for it. The Dragonfly feel just like E3D V6 to me.
Good review :) Not sure about the experiment @10:45; per unit volume, copper has 1.5x heat capacity than that of aluminum, how does turning off the heater relate to real-world usage?
How well the hotend can dump the existing heat into the filament quickly. On someone elses suggestion i did this test again today but a v6 with a copper block and titanium heatbreak. And it performed near the same as the aluminum v6. The intent was to show that having a ss or titanium portion of the heatbreak in the heaterblock impedes heat transfer vs the copper in the bi metallic heatbreak
Triangle labs has a bimetal copper heatbreak and a plated copper heatblock for the v6. They work fantastic! I like the v6 simply because its been around so long and has so much support. Like you said the heat block on this is spacific to it. and Like many of these hotends it may be gone as fast as it appeared!
its been around for awhile, i doubt it will disappear. Also i've seen several reviews and they all praise this, i doubtful such a seemingly successful product will disappear! especially since Phaetus isn't the only vender, Triangle labs also offers this hotend.
5:23 where can i find this tool (or the files for it)?
Question I'm running a dragonfly bms in one printer and a dragonfly bmo in another printer and it seems for whatever reason that the dragonfly bmo requires much cooler temperatures when printing than the bms. Has this been your experience?
I have used different control boards and different thermistors now iseing a pt1000 with amplifier and I'm seeing the exact same result
Fan duct stl please
Is it still good today? Compared to other new hotends?
I wonder how many grams is the Phaetus Hotend with did you weighted any of them if there is a diffrence between the two? I mean Creality mounted version vs Voron style mounted version Hotends?
why not just get the dragon? also for mounting those dragon top mount looks much harder to adapt than the mosquito - thoughts? does the mosq fit a ender 3 mount?
Where did you get your nozzle wrench?
One question I have. When it was enclosed, were you printing with pla, or something else. Just curious because I do print pla as well as abs in my switchwire. But using the dragon v1 it jambs in the heatbreak because of heat creep. I wonder if this design provides better cooling of the heat brake to handle pla in an enclosure? Just curious otherwise I may install a flapper door and fan in my enclosure for when I print pla. Thanks Nero!
Was abs and hips. And for my dragon v1 i havent had any jamming issues with pla. That hotend is installed in my vzero
I'm upgrading my stock original Ender 3 hotend to this :) I want to both print with bigger (0.8mm-1.0mm)nozzles and not loose too much speed, as well as print TPU/PETG which (while PETG is like on the edge of what temperatures PTFE can handle) I don't like printing at high temperatures above 240C where PTFE starts to degrade. Still looks like the best option for an affordable hotend by quite a margin :D
You sure give a LOT of screen time to amputees, kudos for your accessibility first reviews!
amputees? what am I missing?
@@federico9292 hands
What nozzles is this compatible with? I'm considering upgrading my ender 3 for higher temperature and I don't want to have issues with nozzle availability as phaetu nozles don;t seem to be easy to find.
Uses the same nozzles/heaters/thermistors the v6 style hotend uses. So super common
@@CanuckCreator thanks
Why use the dragonfly over the Dragon? Just to save a few dollars? Would love a comparison video.
Same here. Got an answer yet?
Aren't the coppers plated? That'd mean wear resistance depending on they coat it with
Edit: that tapered heatbreak is a GREAT idea
The lack of support on the heatbreak is soooo sad
The Dragon is basically this hotend with a supported heatblock for easy one handed nozzle changes. That's why I picked it over the Dragonfly.
Anybody know anyone who makes a metal rigid dragon style mount?
What is the distance between mounting holes on the bmo(for rigid mount)
Its the same as the dragon. Should be a spec sheet on a vendor page as i dont know off the top of my head
@@CanuckCreator ok, I just asked since you said it was not listed as a perk/selling feature of this hot end. But I'll look up the dragon's spacing. :)
@@CanuckCreator I don't see anything official, but it looks (from cad drawings of mounts people have made) to be about 11.3mm x 11.3mm hole spacing.
I had the dragon hotend,... any difference between dragon vs dragonfly?
Dragonfly is a tad lighter but with an unsupported (rotatable) heatbreak
I'm thinking to make my ender 3 to direct drive and I thinking to get this dragonfly or just get dragon (standard) which is better?
Depends. On an ender3 unless you plan on using large size nozzles often. No point in going with a hf hotend as its doubtful you will be outrunning it.
@@CanuckCreator yeah good point, i'm printing at 70-80mm speed on my ender 3 v2 about 1/4 of times with 0.6mm nozzle for prototyping, the reason I'm thinking of getting dragon (£65) is because of the weight another option is e3d v6 which is like £45. another reason is micro swiss hotend id like £60-70
I noticed today that triangle labs has a creality style dragon hotend, called a lizard I think. Looks pretty cool.
@@jessehigley5283 yeah I saw that too, they like to rename things as they did with matrix extruder which is clearly Hemera clone
@@jessehigley5283 I got two trianglelabs products. They both absolutely sucked. I threw away my money on buying Chinese sh*t. I'm done with Chinese copies.
Edit: sorry for the negativity but this has been my experience🙄
I using e3d volcano (clone of course😊)with klipper, i can get peak of 21 mm^3 , this hotend can rich 38 mm i ges
Would have been nice to see a volcano compared also
The volcano is a high flow nozzle where-as this is a standard flow, So not really in the same class.
How does this compare to a volcano hotend in terms of large nozzle performance
Volcano does beat it by a small margin in terms of raw output..however it as compact as the hf dragon and it also has a much harder time handeling oozing and stringing
@@CanuckCreator “handling oozing and stringing “ you mean the dragon fly?
@@fozbstudios sorry. Thought this was a different video. This is not a high flow hotend. So while it peforms great. The volcano will beat it in applications that require high speeds with a large nozzle. At standard speeds and a .4mm nozzle id go with the dragonfly
@@CanuckCreator no problem! Just discovered this channel. Keep up the good work !
👍😎👍
Do you prefer the Pheatus Dragonfly over the TL Dragon?
prints out of both should be the same, but i do like the supported heaterblock on the dragon
@@CanuckCreator Thanks. I just received my TL Dragon (ordered it after watching your other video comparing hotends). I'll be putting it in a Switchwire that's only half built at the moment.
how is this compared to the dragon?
Functionally near the same with equivalent performance. But lacks the non structural heater block and rigid heater block
@@CanuckCreator so would you say I made the right decision on buying the dragon over the dragonfly? I planned on buying a couple more dragons for my other printers but I bought one last night for my ender 3 just to try out. What thermistor and cartridge did you go with? I'd like to be able to print pei and peek since I am building a switchwire conversion with my ender 3 and want to print high temp stuff like nylon,peek, pc, and pei
I just don't really get its point since it is priced so close to the dragon..
I get that on the pricing side. Imo the bms variant will be the greater seller as its a straight drop in option for creality style printers. So for those that want an easy upgrade without modifications its a great option.
Ender 3 style looks somewhat solid.
But there are better alternatives, like NF Smart and NF Zone radiators combined with breaks. Since they are cheaper, 100% compatible with MK8 / V6 heat blocks and basically the same performance wise.
I think the market they're going for is for people who want a direct swap with "bells and whistles" as nero described without changing too much of the carriage or mounting system. Thus the Mk8 & Groove Mount designs. For Ender 3 and printers like that, hot ends with Mk8 mount is great and you see Micro Swiss hot ends are popular and at the same price. Of course one could upgrade their printer and print adapters, but for a drop in solution it's a really nice addition to the overall selection of hot ends. The melt zone benefit mentioned in the video is the best reason for upgrade.
I know i am a bit late to the video, but what heater cartridge and thermistor assembly did you use?
I just used ones i had in stock. A 50w (i think triangle labs) heater and some random b3950 thermistor
So, would you recommend the dragon over the phaetus for a V0.1?
both the dragonfly and the dragon is made by phaetus.
Where can I get the files for the wrench he use ???
Its on thingiverse, search torque wrench
Does buying something like this necessitate buying any other upgrades in order to use it, given the 500° maximum temp it says it's capable of? I have a stock Ender 3 Pro and I'm new at this.
Where have I seen that heartbreak before? Oh yeah... the copperhead
@@OvidiuBuleandra look man, Phaetus3D are plain and simple thieves.Voron is choosing to support thieves. I wish they wouldn’t and I wish more people cared about intellectual property. If I started a printer and copied Voron just called it something else, they would have issue. But this is okay. It’s not okay.
@@thelightspeed3d712 They shouldn't have made it opensource then. Same as the v6
@@rskl3284 they didn’t? That’s my whole point. Even if it was, they must share attribution! Instead they lie, deny and block everyone. Phaetus is buttho
Me: I'm going to buy a E3d J5 or J6 Chinese knockoff for $6. They do a phenomenal job for the price-point. I have a hard time paying big bucks. I know we need to support innovators but I don't see this as a huge stop forward. Nice video.
It's just too expensive.. $70 is a lot for a hot end.
OMG red filament does not show up well on camera. Well for this kind of thing anyway where you wanna see all the flaws.
Please use a different filament color for the videos, this is hurting my eyes! :(
But still nice video, thanks for the effort.
Oh, man! No, the V6 SHOULD have had a copper (electroless Nickel Plated if I recall correctly on both E3D and the Dragonfly coating) heater block installed ON THE V6 TO LIMIT THE VARIABLE TO ONLY the bi-metallic advantage! (I mean to make a real test would be to make the same heater block and setup etc I know but AT LEAST A HUGE VARIABLE LIKE THAT Could have accounted for the results shown here AS ALUMINUM DISIPATES HEAT MUCH FASTER .. or rather it doesn't act as nice of a reservoir that is slower to heat and cool than the copper BUT thermally more stable to any heat fluctuations - EXACTLY LIKE the Energy LOSS / DISSIPATION EFFECT OF TURNING THE HEATERS OFF! - OF COURSE THE SOLID COPPER BLOCK WILL RETAIN MUCH MORE ENERGY! Q=MCdeltaT .... the Mass matters, the coefficient ... Just ugh darn! If that had just been made the same we could get SO MUCH MORE from these results! I can't say at all that the Bi-metalic heat break (I know MUST HELP - ... I wish the tube was titanium though clearly) was the major contributing factor to the heat block "Retention" & subsequent Deposition more slowly of heat AFTER Cutting the Heater! The test became almost meaningless without the block material being the SAME as the V6 DOES OFFER that same block material! IT IS STILL A "V6" but WAY MORE comparable here! Darn darn darn! Anyway its just sad as ... as far as results, I found Those of the power cutting/extrusion results MOST insightful! To me anyway over the actual prints as I can conceptualize exactly what contributes to that extrusion effect! but now....9:55 ish I've paused it and ..it kills me it's an aluminum block on the V6! The moment I realized the V6 wasn't the E3D Copper block... all my hopes of these results meaning anything went with it! :(
Okay continuing watching! Maybe you addressed this but IF ABLE AT LEAST Ensure the heat block materials are the same AS ALL MY E3D V6 Blocks ARE STOCK COPPER with electroless nickel-plated heater blocks E3D DOES PRODUCE! Literally, IDENTICAL appearance, feel, touch look .. its electroless nickel on copper comes out surprisingly .. well very little variation in appearance despite different manufacturer creating them; its an attribute of the coating type.. ANyway HOPE You DO Account for this as that's a HUGE DIFFERENCE NOT AT ALL MENTIONED (So far probably should finish watching, before commenting - but doesn't seem like there's enough time or any indication you're going to change the heat block on the V6 to be THE SAME MATERIAL sd the other! Only THEN could we have any real idea of the bi-metal heat break being the major contributing factor here* - I say that as clearly if we JUST wanted to conduct an experiment to test the difference of ONLY changing a solid titanium break to a bi-metalic heat break we would keep every last component the same EXCEPT that variable of which we are testing... So here I just refer to it as the most probable contributing factor that one could reasonably assume resulted in this outcome! So far to me, it's still mostly all based on the Heater block material RETAINING that heat when you cut the power! Darn! 0
I stopped watching when he said copper was better than steel. That's just a fools joke. Steel will hold an much more even temperature for a longer period of time, which is much more efficient and better for 3d printing. Also he seems to be confused about what the plating is for on copper nozzles.
AWESOME video, THANKS for sharing!