Gail was in a tough situation, but she adored Frank, and treated him like royalty while she was subjected to countless humiliations. How would anyone else feel in that dynamic? This is the place where tell all manuscripts are born.
Zappa was untethered when it came to hooking up w women. Probably one of his worst characteristics, his misanthropy was reflected in his music. I'm more upset for his children who tolerated his lousy parenting in addition to the stress between the parents. But this is all water under the bridge. May they both rest in peace.
Except for Moon, the children don't mention Frank's dalliance with other women and perhaps you're exaggerating the harm it did to them. Ahmet does not nothing but pour accolades on 'Frank' as he calls him. I notice Dweezil now refers to him as Dad. I would not call Frank a lousy parent. When he was in attendance I think he was a very good parent except for discouraging them to go for university education. Only Moon indicates how dishevelled and difficult their upbringing was.
"If I ever was to get married, I'd prefer a sterile deaf mute who likes to wash dishes" ~ Frank Zappa in response to a 1966 fan magazine questionnaire.
@@paulinebutcherbird It is from a book published in 1993 by Omnibus Press, author, Miles. It says that a catalogue record of the book is available from the British Library. The quote is on page 10, it's only a partial quote, the rest of the quote is- "There are so many American women who fit that description philosophically I might as well own one. No, I'd give her to Po Po. Your dad probably owns one; I'll go watch his!"
@@paulinebutcherbird I believe it was just Frank giving smart ass answers to what he thought were typical stupid questions from an interviewer from a teenage fan magazine
@@timfeeley714-25 I don't have that book, Only Barry Miles bio published in 2004 or somesuch. I don't make any sense of the quote anyway. It's a terrible representation of him if it is exact.
I find this totally suspect, Zappa was known as an intense workaholic by virtually everyone which includes his family, band members, and the media. I can't imagine he had that kind of time for groupies while disrespecting his wife, ...who by the way was unusually cruel to her own children. Gail had problems, she deliberately divided Frank's estate leaving two of her children with almost nothing. They both had to sue for more of the proceeds after her death, ...normal mom's don't do that to their kids.
Which part do you find suspect? Frank's infidelities? None of it is made up and in August Moon Zappa's book is coming out in which her descriptions of her father's infidelities makes my details seems like a children's picnic. Also, Gail did not leave Moon and Dweezil with almost nothing. That is incorrect. Instead of dividing it evenly with 25% each, she gave Ahmet and Diva 30% each and Moon and Dweezil 20% each.
@@paulinebutcherbird I just read excerpts from Moon's book, ( not only her words but quotes from Zappa himself), and I was wrong. It appears Frank was an habitual philanderer. I'm not sure about his will and Gail's meddling, but suffice to say some of his kids still don't speak to each other because of it, well done Gail. I also read that Gail was a serious hoarder towards the end, and kept her youngest daughter from attending college because she didn't want to be alone. That was an excerpt from Moon's book along with Frank being a heavy depressive due to his feelings of not having enough fame and notoriety. Truth be told I always saw a certain sadness in his eyes.
I love Frank, but this aspect of him disappoints me. As far as I'm concerned, if you're married you stick by your partner, regardless of any other circumstances.
I think Frank thought he was okay with it since his womanising was out in the open, not secret. He scorned men who carried on infidelity in secret. I think he thought that his open-ness absolved him, but of course, it meant huge suffering on Gail's part.
@@ivanavonmonofsky127 Gail suffered the GTOs at the house for two months before expelling them and from then on they had to rehearse at the Lindy Opera House in a room upstairs, She was not interested in them personally. Lucy came back but she had already left the GTOs when she looked after Dweezil, but you're extending and reading far too much into that. Lucy was more or less on the street so it was helpful for Gail to use Lucy, but it didn't last long. I think your generalisations don't work here.
I loved the book. You got a sense of what life was like at that time. I look up to Frank for his work ethic, creativity and hard-nosed business mind. This aspect of him never bothered me because of his views on sex as a fun activity vs. a meaningful sacred experience with a special person. My mindset is the complete opposite of his, but he was never dishonest about it. Dishonesty and deception is something that, to me, would make it far worse.
@@paulinebutcherbird of course I'll post a review. I listened on Audible and the voice acting was great. It was a great decision to keep it single narrator impersonating the others' voices.
@@MrTonyFury It was not my decision of course. It was Audible's. I think Emma Gregory does a remarkable job of conveying Frank, given she's female and English!
Your comment about Frank's honesty is, I think, the way Frank justified his activity in his mind, because he told Gail about it all and somehow he seemed to think that made it all right. Never mind that she, in the process of suffering so much, seems to have lost hers.
Not completely. A narcissist is someone, among other things, who shows no interest in other people. After my ear operations which made me temporarily deaf and in front of a crowd of people in his hotel room, I told him I couldn't hear him and became tearful, he stood and hugged me sympathetically.
@@paulinebutcherbird HG Tudor does excellent analyses of different types of narcissist. 'Facade Managment' and 'Cognitive Empathy' spring to mind. You don't appear to be a narc so chances are you'll not, by nature, understand the ways of the different types or 'cadres' as Tudor calls them. He extensively points it all out, breaks it all down, including the types or 'cadres' of empaths! He's a diagnosed Narcissistic Psychopath; calls himself 'The Ultra' which I believe is a rarer, more self aware type with high intelligence. I accept it's not fair, nor wise, to diagnose people willy-nilly but my indulgent guess is Frank had mighty strong indications of being an upper type of Narc, but I'm no expert. i'd wager his wife was also one. perhaps a lesser type. HG can be found here on TH-cam if you're not familiar with him! Best wishes.
@@EnterGoldenAge I continue to disagree. The man I knew showed few of the signs of a narcistic personality. He did not have a sense of self-importance; he did not make his achievements seem bigger than they were; never behaved in an arrogant way. The other things listed as narcistic which Frank did show are as much to do with being a recognised rock star as much as a mental illness. In any case, what help does it do to label him in this way?
@@paulinebutcherbird Hello, thank you for your insightful response from experience. Indeed, 'normal' personality types and empaths can have highly narcissistic traits . Having learned of Moon's experiences and insights of life with Frank & Gail, I got the feeling they could possibly be narcissists. I am the daughter of a father with NPD, so my radar can be good. Not all narcissists brag or inflate their achievements. Many pop/rock stars and politicians are 'Greater' narcissists. Greaters keep their facades in better check than lesser types and can be very cool, magnetic and likeable, up to a point. I say it's good to know the signs and types of true Narcissists in this day and age, even if it means digging deeper into past icons as possible examples. This makes them easier to understand. We know not to expect 'normal' or truly empathic behaviours, thus avoid being manipulated, confused or destroyed by them.
My daughter bought me your book for Christmas and I thoroughly enjoyed it, having been a Zappa fan since my school days in the late 60s. I even gave it 5 stars on Goodreads. Before reading it I was hoping it would have given an insight into the relationship between Frank and Captain Beefheart of whom I am also a big fan of. Unfortunately this was only slightly alluded to. Nevertheless a great book.
Please thank your daughter for buying my book for you at Christmas. I understand your disappointment about lack of detail on Captain Beefheart. I too am disappointed that I didn't write down in my diary or in my letters details of those times Frank dragged me out of bed to sit with him and Beefheart at 3am to listen to the blues and their chatter. Had I realised I would be writing about my time at the log cabin many years later, I would have written it down in my diary and letters. I'm also disappointed I missed the jam session at the log cabin when apparently Beefheart and Mick Jagger competed on vocals. I have to make do with the visit to his house with Gail which I did record and the few odd conversations we had.
Pauline your stories are fascinating and frankly I am surprised you don't have at least 200,000 subscribers. So many people are interested in the music but don't know much about the man except what they could glean from interviews and his autobiography and obviously those things have been edited by his own perspective.
That's very kind of you to say, Albert. I don't know how TH-cam works and how one reaches all the thousands of Zappa fans. If you have any clue please let me know!
Thank you Ray for letting me know. The detail comes from the fact that my mother kept my letters in a shoe box for 40 years! Without them, I could not have written it.
It's not just the detail I'm enjoying, but your internal assessment of the chaos and some of the characters, as well as your assessment of Frank and many of his views. I'm not British, but I relate to so much of your thinking as if I were. This is one of the best books I've read in a long time, and I'm an avid reader to the tune of a couple of hundred a year. I really like your style of writing. It just suits me.
It is quite sad to think of what the original dynamic led to, in terms of the 4 siblings. I would venture to say that most famous families, and many wealthy families, run into this stuff. Another reason to be grateful If one grew up in a ( by comparison ) more tight knit, average family.
It certainly did. However, because Gail behaved so badly with the inheritance debacle, it seems to have turned Moon strongly against her mother and as a result she has no empathy left to feel Gail's gut-wrenching pain through her marriage. It is all about my (Moon's) pain.
Indeed. We are all looking forward to it. Of course, this scene I describe will not be in Moon's book because she was 9 months old at the time! There are lots of other stories of this kind that precedes Moon's story which will no doubt start when mine ends around 1972 when Moon was four. Of course, she will no doubt be including the groupies I mention and it will be interesting to see if her view of it matches mine.
@@cathleenwarner1778 I kept in touch with Gail by letter and in 1988 I interviewed Frank. It is on TH-cam. There are five parts: parenting, composing, TV Evangelism, Party Hats, and One last question. Here's the first one. th-cam.com/video/V1ENxcG9-Fs/w-d-xo.html
Hi Pauline, my brother gave me a copy of your book (in Spanish!) and I really enjoyed it. A great read, and I'm not much of a reader myself. Thank you for the stories!!!
If you’re referring to the black and white photo of a dark haired female in this video presentation, that is not Gail, it is Paula Butcher n the orange shirt speaking.
I’ve read Pauline’s, Bobby’s, and Moon’s books. All excellent. Frank in some ways was well adjusted when you consider how many people were kissing his backside. At the same time, he ignored his parenting duties in a profound manner. In some ways he never had to grow up because he was surrounded by steady stream enablers and sycophants. He seems gracious on one hand while detached and distant on the other. Those hurt the most by him were those closest to him; specifically, Gail and his children. Gail appears to have taken out her pain from all his infidelities on their four children. She was a woman in pain, and injured people injure people. She was definitely vindictive toward the end of both Frank’s life and her own. It would be easy to judge Gail, but we weren’t in her shoes. I sincerely hope the Zappa children find healing and closure to all of this. I truly hope they find peace in understanding that we have to accept people for who they are and not who we want them to be. That goes both for reflecting on their parents as well as going forward with one another.
@@paulinebutcherbird my pleasure, it was excellent. You did a fantastic job revealing Frank and Gail as the very human and flawed people that we all are. I honestly love how you, Bob, and Moon reveal that truth from each of your own perspectives. I felt each of you presented Frank and Gail honestly displaying both their strengths and their challenges as people.
Obviously there is truth in what you say, but bringing other women to the house and having sex with them in her house must have been gut-wrenching. And to put it the other way round, when Frank asked for a divorce, Gail threatened to take the children and to ruin him financially. Of course, she wouldn't have been able to ruin him financially but she could take the children, and that was a step Frank couldn't tolerate. So, by the same token, he stayed with Gail for his own reasons. One of those reasons was that Frank knew Gail was the only woman who would put up with his womanising. No other woman would have done so on the scale that Frank carried it. Tit for Tat.
She feared he'd leave her for someone else. Gail wasn't his first choice. There was another girl that he wanted, but Gail was pregnant. His true love broke things off and he married Gale.
I'm not sure where you get your information from. Frank had no 'true' love. In the long term, it was Gail. When he planned to run for president of US, and was asked who his running mate would be, he said Gail.
Don't cry for Gail - She overruled Frank's will and unfairly gave 2 of the 4 kids a higher % of the inheritance. Moon was one of those who was unfairly treated even though she contributed not only to Frank's only top 10 hit, but also gave them her house so that Frank's medical bills could be paid. There was no recognition of this when the inheritance was divided by dying Gail. She has caused much anger, pain and bitterness among the siblings. Frank was a playboy when he could afford to - let's remember he always thought of himself as an "ugly man" so that when some women came his way ready to "do him" - he must have thought he won the lottery and that he'd never have that chance again.... Can you blame him? Also, before you reply- these are the free for all 1960s and 1970s..... Do not judge with 21st Century morality.
I was there, lived with Frank, Gail and Moon, admittedly when Moon was a baby until she was four years old. Moon covers 50 years in her book and was forced to focus on the drama. It was not 50 years of agony. There were happy times but she had no space to describe it. Frank and Gail were not dreadful parents and Moon grew up in a privileged world. Gail's unkind action to divide the inheritance unequally, Moon infers, was because Moon and Dweezil refused to help Gail out when Gail was five million dollars in debt after Frank had been dead a few years. Ahmet and Diva agreed. It was a fit of pique by Gail who had gone through gut-wrenching pain herself with Frank's other women. Moon wanted emotion but Frank and Gail didn't do emotion. Frank knew his attraction to women and throughout his life he used it wherever he could.
He had a hyper focus on his art. His empathy for others appeared to be lacking which probably resulted from his own hurts which he clearly avoided by making his music and the frantic pace of his life. Somewhere along the line he must have decided women were there for his pleasure only and little else. I would give Frank the out if he was totally honest about this with his wife and never lied. If so, she should have walked. I love FZs music but have no doubt he was a Trump level narcissist. In some ways to achieve what he did as an artist, one would have to be. His music will live on and it's a gift.
It's nice that you acknowledge the value of Frank's music. I think there's a broad spectrum of what narcist means. In my experience he was not self-important or unduly concerned about his image more than most of us. I agree with you that maybe Gail should have walked but as I understand it, when Gail did rebel and flit from the home, Frank chased after her. In Moon's book, however, she says Frank wanted a divorce at some point so that obviously did not always happen. It is not clear how that situation was resolved. Moon hints that Gail threatened to ruin him financially. That may have been enough.
@paulinebutcherbird thanks for your insights. All humans are flawed and we don't acknowledge that enough in our culture. FZ was a brilliant musical mind and thart can be admired despite the flawed elements of his personality. But I enjoy hearing the truth about great figures and it affirms we are all imperfect.
Pauline is articulate to the extent that she doesn’t need this interviewer to ask any questions. Maybe a follow up question here and there, but that’s about all. Also, I think that her book would make for an excellent “book on tape.”
Thank you for that lovely compliment, Charles. The book is already in audio form by Audible. Emma Gregory reads it remarkably well, getting Frank and Gail's voices almost spot on, given she's a woman and English.
@@paulinebutcherbird No worries, Pauline slips of the tongue happen! I am an autistic (literally) music nerd, so I notice these things. Just wanted people to know what you were talking about! 💜
@@itsgoingtobeok-justbreathe4808 who are what people? Paul and his wife run a podcast and here they interview Pauline Butcher Bird, who was an English girl who lived and worked in Frank Zappa's log cabin 1968-1971 and wrote a memoir. It shows Frank's home life not shown in other books, from getting up to going to bed, composing and rehearsing with the Mothers, visiting rock stars, freaks, family squabbles and more. It is highly praised by Zappa fans. 'Freak Out! My Life with Frank Zappa, Laurel Canyon, 1968-1971.
Frank said in an interview he had a 12 inch Dong and Gail couldn't satisfy him maybe thats why he had so many partners. The interview is still on TH-cam......... It must have been very difficult and frustrating to have such a lengthy tool and Gail doesn't want to play ball all the time........ you women know best.
@@gianlucad8003that's such a stupid point. Many women decide to stay with cheating partners, for the sake of the children, or they have low self esteem or any other reason without being literally in a cage. That doesn't make cheating ok.
I don't believe that Frank was drug free. He looks high af in many pictures and the band scene at the time was all in. These celebrities try to present an image of integrity and high standards. Gail was a simp, Frank loved being duplicitous.
What's a simp? I have in my possession a copy of a note that Frank delivered to the hotel rooms where the Mothers were staying stating: NO MORE DOPE ON THE ROAD OR YOU WILL BE UNEMPLOYED. We were not allowed to have drugs in the house. He was terrified of being arrested as he had been in 1966 when a disguised police officer asked Frank to make a pornography tape. When he came to collect it the next day, Frank was thrown into jail on a felony charge where he stayed for 14 days in cramped conditions. He said it was the worst experience of his life. Every person who worked for Frank was given the same message - if you use drugs in my vicinity, you are out.
@@paulinebutcherbird His buddy Captain Beefheart smoked herb all time during recording of early albums according to people at sessions. People today say they aren't into stuff but have a vape 🖊 pen and edibles. I think he dabbled. A person that selfish towards his own family has many layers. Genius is never pretty.
@@todds808 I lived in Frank's house and worked for him for three years. None of us were allowed to have drugs. Once, in 1968, when Pamela Zarubica (Suzy Creamcheese) took me to a house where we sat in a circle, the curtains drawn and the door locked, they passed round a 'cigarette' - the first one I'd seen and of course refused. They became more and more quiet. It was so boring. When I got back to the house, Frank was furious and said I'd be dragged into jail if we had been caught even though I didn't anticipate. None of his four children take drugs - fully indoctrinated. Band members record the odd occasion when Frank accepted a 'cigarette' (can't remember what you call them) but all knew that on tour, drugs were out of bounds or they were out. I don't understand why you don't accept it.
This is awful to hear - I mean we all "know" how rockstars are, but that is just appalling behaviour by Zappa. It is important that you tell all these stories. Shame Gail didn't get to write that book. The story reminds me of Kim Gordon's book, about how Thurston Moore treated here - and they were in the same band!
Both examples indicate the general attitude men had toward women in the 1960s. It is why I was so enamoured by Frank myself because he took an interest in what I had to say, and that was so unusual when I was a mere secretary. But to Gail, he seemed to think it was okay to have other women because he was honest about it, and scorned other men who had affairs secretly. And, to some degree, he had a point!
@@theproblembelief7549 Exactly, and as I understand it, but this is not first hand, she did walk away on a couple of occasions and he chased after her to come back. Difficult to refuse.
@@paulinebutcherbird off-topic for this video, but do you recall Zappa studying? His musical output and his awareness of so many cultural and political issues would point to self-study. And in the Real FZ Book he refers, I recall, to the value he placed on public libraries.
@@theproblembelief7549 The day I met Frank Zappa I told him how disappointed I was not to have gone to university and he told me not to regret it and to teach myself in the library, and added that's how he learned. The paradox is that by the time he came to the log cabin, there were no books or newspapers, nor television. From there on, he relied on information brought to him from outsiders. In the five months we lived there, I also never saw a newspaper, heard the news on the radio or television, or read a book!
The relationship structure is actually quite normal from an evolutionary/biological viewpoint. The critical and principle associations are that women seek a strong provider for their children. This he was in every respect, as he was an excellent provider and loved his children. Men instinctively fear their wives being unfaithful, as they may have the responsibility of raising another man's child. This is clearly unacceptable for men, and just as much as we must acknowledge and expect hypergamy from women (the quest/need for a high income partner for sex and reproduction) Women must also bear the brunt of the man's caution. In any circumstances which indicate that his wife is more welcoming toward another male than she is toward him, will result in a natural jealousy. In such a situation, as long as the couple are intelligent and knowledgeable, they will come to an accommodation, as long as they continue to talk to one another. It is the honest communication that will count, and not deferring to any ideological agenda. Generally in Hollywood, the marriages are brief puppet shows, whereas Frank & Gail were long time lovers and married parents with many children. The differences could not be more stark. If anyone imagines that a grown man who must leave home for many months of the year on concert tours, the band will be targeted by groupies. A number of his songs hinge on that premise. I would doubt that Frank had any need to masturbate while on tour personally. Frank was still correct in his jealous desire not to cuckolded by his wife and another man, however. You see the consequences for the male & the female differ enormously. I am also aware that he and Gail also had threesomes etc on occasion, and their entire sex lives were not based on lies and repression, as they are for the apparently blissful couples extant. I should point out that I began writing my comment after a single minute into the show. My immediate concern being that as the ridiculous and disruptive feminist narrative is the only game in town in 2023, it is, and leads to dogmatic views and great amounts of lying and acrimonious finger wagging. Perhaps Gail will be portrayed as the poor lost soul, lost to the influence of a wicked man? I hope I am wrong, but I fear I will not be, for it is women who have run and continue to run the world, and what women say or claim, is taken as the gospel truth. Unimpeachable evidence of shame attributable to male behaviour, which is within the bounds of normality, are always condemned, and the many females who revile Frank, but secretly wish he had desired them, will inevitably turn the tide against Frank & indeed, other men. For what ever men do currently in our corrupted and seriously damaged culture is always wrong. Men are simply incorrect from birth, as very clearly, even their female teachers will frankly observe them as defective females and not effective males. To be male is inherently wrong and evil, men are dolts and fools hell-bent on greater idiocy apparently? Whereas the truth is that men invented, designed and constructed our civilisation, with only an incidental role for the women, who if sane, held their men in high esteem and took care of the incidentals of life (the very easy parts of life like housework and child-rearing) I assure that having performed in that role, I did a far better job of it than my wife ever could, as she was disorganised and sloppy and lazy. It is not work ladies, because real work is hard, very hard. The aforementioned female tasks, which women are abrogating are so ridiculously simple, that any sane couple address this matter early on and take their individual responsibilities seriously, and without question.
I agree with all of your comment up until the final paragraph when it seemed to go off course into feminism and all of that and also your assertion that women run the world. I look at the leaders of all the countries in the world and see that is not true and I don't wish it to be. I like your point, not made by others even though it's well known, that men don't want their partners to dally with other men because of fear of raising another man's child. I also like your acknowledgement that Frank supported Gail and the children in a financially secure environment. However, I would argue it was not a healthy, mental and emotional environment. See Moon's interviews and comments.
We are the current iteration of evolution which is only concerned with creating the next generation. Makes and females are both awful in their own ways. Nasty behavior does not care which kind of reproductive plumbing the person is sporting.
This is some of the most ridiculous bullshit I have ever heard, and it doesn't get any better every time someone retells it. People who write this are doing nothing but stringing words together to justify their own worldview.
Let's keep a balance here. Frank gave Gail respect which is a lot more than many husbands give their wives, in as much as he gave her the business to run in their last years together. He said she was his best friend, and that's also very nice I think.
When the patriarchy is over a new matriarchal society with a "reform " capitalism maybe even democratic socialism. I'ma laugh at the patriarchy as they get selected in a class based society. Western world will do a backwards 180 I hope before ww3 or something hope China or mexico annex the weakened invaders.
It's not a "patriarchy" thing. It's a 1950's and 60's beatnik hippie free love and communication thing. That's why Zappa thought it was okay to ask Gail if he could bang one of his groupies in their house. Zappa was not a religious man. Religion is a mainstay of patriarchal thinking. Patriarchal tradition vehemently rejects the idea of banging a groupie in your wife's bed.
I don't agree with that. I think most people have an understanding of consideration of others, whether they're kids or not. I would point out that Frank had high regard for Gail. After all, he left her in charge of his business. How many husbands do you know would do such a thing? I don't know what Frank's feelings were for these other women but in his book he wrote in 1988 he said, 'I met Gail and I fell in love.'.
@@paulinebutcherbird He cuckolded her. Maybe the most shameful act a person can inflict on a partner. It’s devastating. What could you possibly be thinking?
@@kaivrock I consider physical abuse, which is widespread, much more shameful and injurious, often leading to death, than being cuckolded. Frank was honest in his infidelity. Gail knew about it and he kept her in the loop. Obviously it was not good for Gail, but Frank was not cruel and as I said in my previous comment, he gave Gail the highest regard allowing her to run his business.
Gail was in a tough situation, but she adored Frank, and treated him like royalty while she was subjected to countless humiliations. How would anyone else feel in that dynamic? This is the place where tell all manuscripts are born.
@@djhoneylove5710 agreed. What is not clear from Moon’s book is why Frank did not get a divorce when on at least occasions he told Gail he wanted one.
Zappa was untethered when it came to hooking up w women. Probably one of his worst characteristics, his misanthropy was reflected in his music. I'm more upset for his children who tolerated his lousy parenting in addition to the stress between the parents. But this is all water under the bridge. May they both rest in peace.
Except for Moon, the children don't mention Frank's dalliance with other women and perhaps you're exaggerating the harm it did to them. Ahmet does not nothing but pour accolades on 'Frank' as he calls him. I notice Dweezil now refers to him as Dad. I would not call Frank a lousy parent. When he was in attendance I think he was a very good parent except for discouraging them to go for university education. Only Moon indicates how dishevelled and difficult their upbringing was.
An incredibly tough situation, not easy for anyone!
Indeed. Set out in detail in my book. (can't find the wink emoji)
"If I ever was to get married, I'd prefer a sterile deaf mute who likes to wash dishes" ~ Frank Zappa in response to a 1966 fan magazine questionnaire.
I have never seen this statement by FZ before. Do you have a copy of it, or are you saying it from memory?
@@paulinebutcherbird It is from a book published in 1993 by Omnibus Press, author, Miles. It says that a catalogue record of the book is available from the British Library. The quote is on page 10, it's only a partial quote, the rest of the quote is- "There are so many American women who fit that description philosophically I might as well own one. No, I'd give her to Po Po. Your dad probably owns one; I'll go watch his!"
@@paulinebutcherbird I believe it was just Frank giving smart ass answers to what he thought were typical stupid questions from an interviewer from a teenage fan magazine
@@timfeeley714-25 I don't have that book, Only Barry Miles bio published in 2004 or somesuch. I don't make any sense of the quote anyway. It's a terrible representation of him if it is exact.
@@timfeeley714-25 Hopefully, that's what it was! Thanks for highlighting it though.
I find this totally suspect, Zappa was known as an intense workaholic by virtually everyone which includes his family, band members, and the media. I can't imagine he had that kind of time for groupies while disrespecting his wife, ...who by the way was unusually cruel to her own children. Gail had problems, she deliberately divided Frank's estate leaving two of her children with almost nothing. They both had to sue for more of the proceeds after her death, ...normal mom's don't do that to their kids.
Which part do you find suspect? Frank's infidelities? None of it is made up and in August Moon Zappa's book is coming out in which her descriptions of her father's infidelities makes my details seems like a children's picnic. Also, Gail did not leave Moon and Dweezil with almost nothing. That is incorrect. Instead of dividing it evenly with 25% each, she gave Ahmet and Diva 30% each and Moon and Dweezil 20% each.
@@paulinebutcherbird I just read excerpts from Moon's book, ( not only her words but quotes from Zappa himself), and I was wrong. It appears Frank was an habitual philanderer. I'm not sure about his will and Gail's meddling, but suffice to say some of his kids still don't speak to each other because of it, well done Gail. I also read that Gail was a serious hoarder towards the end, and kept her youngest daughter from attending college because she didn't want to be alone. That was an excerpt from Moon's book along with Frank being a heavy depressive due to his feelings of not having enough fame and notoriety. Truth be told I always saw a certain sadness in his eyes.
Horrible what he put Gail through.
I love Frank, but this aspect of him disappoints me. As far as I'm concerned, if you're married you stick by your partner, regardless of any other circumstances.
I think Frank thought he was okay with it since his womanising was out in the open, not secret. He scorned men who carried on infidelity in secret. I think he thought that his open-ness absolved him, but of course, it meant huge suffering on Gail's part.
@@ivanavonmonofsky127 Gail suffered the GTOs at the house for two months before expelling them and from then on they had to rehearse at the Lindy Opera House in a room upstairs, She was not interested in them personally. Lucy came back but she had already left the GTOs when she looked after Dweezil, but you're extending and reading far too much into that. Lucy was more or less on the street so it was helpful for Gail to use Lucy, but it didn't last long. I think your generalisations don't work here.
Ain't nobody (sic.) perfect.... Especially those of a genius persuasion....Comes with it
@@napoleoninrags1346 Agreed.
Zappa's music and the universe around it isn't for conservative people.
I loved the book. You got a sense of what life was like at that time. I look up to Frank for his work ethic, creativity and hard-nosed business mind. This aspect of him never bothered me because of his views on sex as a fun activity vs. a meaningful sacred experience with a special person. My mindset is the complete opposite of his, but he was never dishonest about it. Dishonesty and deception is something that, to me, would make it far worse.
Thank you Anthony. Your comment could almost be a review. Any chance?
@@paulinebutcherbird of course I'll post a review. I listened on Audible and the voice acting was great. It was a great decision to keep it single narrator impersonating the others' voices.
@@MrTonyFury It was not my decision of course. It was Audible's. I think Emma Gregory does a remarkable job of conveying Frank, given she's female and English!
Your comment about Frank's honesty is, I think, the way Frank justified his activity in his mind, because he told Gail about it all and somehow he seemed to think that made it all right. Never mind that she, in the process of suffering so much, seems to have lost hers.
sounds like frank was a narcissist.
Not completely. A narcissist is someone, among other things, who shows no interest in other people. After my ear operations which made me temporarily deaf and in front of a crowd of people in his hotel room, I told him I couldn't hear him and became tearful, he stood and hugged me sympathetically.
@@paulinebutcherbird HG Tudor does excellent analyses of different types of narcissist. 'Facade Managment' and 'Cognitive Empathy' spring to mind. You don't appear to be a narc so chances are you'll not, by nature, understand the ways of the different types or 'cadres' as Tudor calls them. He extensively points it all out, breaks it all down, including the types or 'cadres' of empaths! He's a diagnosed Narcissistic Psychopath; calls himself 'The Ultra' which I believe is a rarer, more self aware type with high intelligence. I accept it's not fair, nor wise, to diagnose people willy-nilly but my indulgent guess is Frank had mighty strong indications of being an upper type of Narc, but I'm no expert. i'd wager his wife was also one. perhaps a lesser type. HG can be found here on TH-cam if you're not familiar with him! Best wishes.
@@EnterGoldenAge I continue to disagree. The man I knew showed few of the signs of a narcistic personality. He did not have a sense of self-importance; he did not make his achievements seem bigger than they were; never behaved in an arrogant way. The other things listed as narcistic which Frank did show are as much to do with being a recognised rock star as much as a mental illness. In any case, what help does it do to label him in this way?
@@paulinebutcherbird Hello, thank you for your insightful response from experience. Indeed, 'normal' personality types and empaths can have highly narcissistic traits . Having learned of Moon's experiences and insights of life with Frank & Gail, I got the feeling they could possibly be narcissists. I am the daughter of a father with NPD, so my radar can be good. Not all narcissists brag or inflate their achievements.
Many pop/rock stars and politicians are 'Greater' narcissists. Greaters keep their facades in better check than lesser types and can be very cool, magnetic and likeable, up to a point.
I say it's good to know the signs and types of true Narcissists in this day and age, even if it means digging deeper into past icons as possible examples. This makes them easier to understand. We know not to expect 'normal' or truly empathic behaviours, thus avoid being manipulated, confused or destroyed by them.
@@EnterGoldenAge Okay. Well thank you for your input and taking the time.
My daughter bought me your book for Christmas and I thoroughly enjoyed it, having been a Zappa fan since my school days in the late 60s. I even gave it 5 stars on Goodreads.
Before reading it I was hoping it would have given an insight into the relationship between Frank and Captain Beefheart of whom I am also a big fan of. Unfortunately this was only slightly alluded to. Nevertheless a great book.
Please thank your daughter for buying my book for you at Christmas. I understand your disappointment about lack of detail on Captain Beefheart. I too am disappointed that I didn't write down in my diary or in my letters details of those times Frank dragged me out of bed to sit with him and Beefheart at 3am to listen to the blues and their chatter. Had I realised I would be writing about my time at the log cabin many years later, I would have written it down in my diary and letters. I'm also disappointed I missed the jam session at the log cabin when apparently Beefheart and Mick Jagger competed on vocals. I have to make do with the visit to his house with Gail which I did record and the few odd conversations we had.
Pauline your stories are fascinating and frankly I am surprised you don't have at least 200,000 subscribers. So many people are interested in the music but don't know much about the man except what they could glean from interviews and his autobiography and obviously those things have been edited by his own perspective.
That's very kind of you to say, Albert. I don't know how TH-cam works and how one reaches all the thousands of Zappa fans. If you have any clue please let me know!
@@paulinebutcherbird😊
😒@@PeteWicker-ft8hr
I'm reading your book now. I absolutely love its detail. Riveted.
Thank you Ray for letting me know. The detail comes from the fact that my mother kept my letters in a shoe box for 40 years! Without them, I could not have written it.
It's not just the detail I'm enjoying, but your internal assessment of the chaos and some of the characters, as well as your assessment of Frank and many of his views. I'm not British, but I relate to so much of your thinking as if I were. This is one of the best books I've read in a long time, and I'm an avid reader to the tune of a couple of hundred a year. I really like your style of writing. It just suits me.
@@RayWalker-pythonic That is so nice of you to say so, Ray. Thank you.
@@RayWalker-pythonic Reading you very kind words again, and given you are an avid reader, might you find a way to write a review on amazon?
Thank you for letting me know and for reading it.
It is quite sad to think of what the original dynamic led to, in terms of the 4 siblings. I would venture to say that most famous families, and many wealthy families, run into this stuff. Another reason to be grateful
If one grew up in a ( by comparison ) more tight knit, average family.
Very much so.
Having just read Earth To Moon, it affected the whole family.
It certainly did. However, because Gail behaved so badly with the inheritance debacle, it seems to have turned Moon strongly against her mother and as a result she has no empathy left to feel Gail's gut-wrenching pain through her marriage. It is all about my (Moon's) pain.
Moon Zappa has a book coming out this August, Earth to Moon
Indeed. We are all looking forward to it. Of course, this scene I describe will not be in Moon's book because she was 9 months old at the time! There are lots of other stories of this kind that precedes Moon's story which will no doubt start when mine ends around 1972 when Moon was four. Of course, she will no doubt be including the groupies I mention and it will be interesting to see if her view of it matches mine.
@@paulinebutcherbird Did you ever see Frank after 1972 or speak with his kids?
@@cathleenwarner1778 I kept in touch with Gail by letter and in 1988 I interviewed Frank. It is on TH-cam. There are five parts: parenting, composing, TV Evangelism, Party Hats, and One last question. Here's the first one. th-cam.com/video/V1ENxcG9-Fs/w-d-xo.html
Hi Pauline, my brother gave me a copy of your book (in Spanish!) and I really enjoyed it. A great read, and I'm not much of a reader myself. Thank you for the stories!!!
Puturro, I answered this but where's it gone? Suffice to say, thank you to your brother!
Wow. Gail kinda looks like the Get Smart actress, Barbara Feldon. Very beautiful.
I'm confused. There's no photograph of Gail on here.
Oh. I'm sorry. I saw a picture of her on another video when she was in her twenties I guess.@@paulinebutcherbird
You are probably referring to photo I took the day I met her and Frank at rehearsal at Boston Music Hall when I was in college.
If you’re referring to the black and white photo of a dark haired female in this video presentation, that is not Gail, it is Paula Butcher n the orange shirt speaking.
@@paulinebutcherbird😂
I’ve read Pauline’s, Bobby’s, and Moon’s books. All excellent. Frank in some ways was well adjusted when you consider how many people were kissing his backside. At the same time, he ignored his parenting duties in a profound manner. In some ways he never had to grow up because he was surrounded by steady stream enablers and sycophants. He seems gracious on one hand while detached and distant on the other. Those hurt the most by him were those closest to him; specifically, Gail and his children. Gail appears to have taken out her pain from all his infidelities on their four children. She was a woman in pain, and injured people injure people. She was definitely vindictive toward the end of both Frank’s life and her own. It would be easy to judge Gail, but we weren’t in her shoes. I sincerely hope the Zappa children find healing and closure to all of this. I truly hope they find peace in understanding that we have to accept people for who they are and not who we want them to be. That goes both for reflecting on their parents as well as going forward with one another.
Well, there's some profound words which I agree with them all. And thank you for reading my book.
@@paulinebutcherbird my pleasure, it was excellent. You did a fantastic job revealing Frank and Gail as the very human and flawed people that we all are. I honestly love how you, Bob, and Moon reveal that truth from each of your own perspectives. I felt each of you presented Frank and Gail honestly displaying both their strengths and their challenges as people.
@@marcwhite9234 Thank you, Mark.
Gail never left him because she enjoyed the money and fame...living vicariously through him! Give me a break!
Obviously there is truth in what you say, but bringing other women to the house and having sex with them in her house must have been gut-wrenching. And to put it the other way round, when Frank asked for a divorce, Gail threatened to take the children and to ruin him financially. Of course, she wouldn't have been able to ruin him financially but she could take the children, and that was a step Frank couldn't tolerate. So, by the same token, he stayed with Gail for his own reasons. One of those reasons was that Frank knew Gail was the only woman who would put up with his womanising. No other woman would have done so on the scale that Frank carried it. Tit for Tat.
She feared he'd leave her for someone else. Gail wasn't his first choice. There was another girl that he wanted, but Gail was pregnant. His true love broke things off and he married Gale.
I'm not sure where you get your information from. Frank had no 'true' love. In the long term, it was Gail. When he planned to run for president of US, and was asked who his running mate would be, he said Gail.
Don't cry for Gail - She overruled Frank's will and unfairly gave 2 of the 4 kids a higher % of the inheritance. Moon was one of those who was unfairly treated even though she contributed not only to Frank's only top 10 hit, but also gave them her house so that Frank's medical bills could be paid. There was no recognition of this when the inheritance was divided by dying Gail. She has caused much anger, pain and bitterness among the siblings. Frank was a playboy when he could afford to - let's remember he always thought of himself as an "ugly man" so that when some women came his way ready to "do him" - he must have thought he won the lottery and that he'd never have that chance again.... Can you blame him? Also, before you reply- these are the free for all 1960s and 1970s..... Do not judge with 21st Century morality.
I was there, lived with Frank, Gail and Moon, admittedly when Moon was a baby until she was four years old. Moon covers 50 years in her book and was forced to focus on the drama. It was not 50 years of agony. There were happy times but she had no space to describe it. Frank and Gail were not dreadful parents and Moon grew up in a privileged world. Gail's unkind action to divide the inheritance unequally, Moon infers, was because Moon and Dweezil refused to help Gail out when Gail was five million dollars in debt after Frank had been dead a few years. Ahmet and Diva agreed. It was a fit of pique by Gail who had gone through gut-wrenching pain herself with Frank's other women. Moon wanted emotion but Frank and Gail didn't do emotion. Frank knew his attraction to women and throughout his life he used it wherever he could.
He had a hyper focus on his art. His empathy for others appeared to be lacking which probably resulted from his own hurts which he clearly avoided by making his music and the frantic pace of his life. Somewhere along the line he must have decided women were there for his pleasure only and little else. I would give Frank the out if he was totally honest about this with his wife and never lied. If so, she should have walked. I love FZs music but have no doubt he was a Trump level narcissist. In some ways to achieve what he did as an artist, one would have to be. His music will live on and it's a gift.
It's nice that you acknowledge the value of Frank's music. I think there's a broad spectrum of what narcist means. In my experience he was not self-important or unduly concerned about his image more than most of us. I agree with you that maybe Gail should have walked but as I understand it, when Gail did rebel and flit from the home, Frank chased after her. In Moon's book, however, she says Frank wanted a divorce at some point so that obviously did not always happen. It is not clear how that situation was resolved. Moon hints that Gail threatened to ruin him financially. That may have been enough.
@paulinebutcherbird thanks for your insights. All humans are flawed and we don't acknowledge that enough in our culture. FZ was a brilliant musical mind and thart can be admired despite the flawed elements of his personality. But I enjoy hearing the truth about great figures and it affirms we are all imperfect.
@@pc7135 Indeed.
Pauline is articulate to the extent that she doesn’t need this interviewer to ask any questions.
Maybe a follow up question here and there, but that’s about all.
Also, I think that her book would make for an excellent “book on tape.”
Thank you for that lovely compliment, Charles. The book is already in audio form by Audible. Emma Gregory reads it remarkably well, getting Frank and Gail's voices almost spot on, given she's a woman and English.
@@paulinebutcherbird “A woman and English.” Now there’s a winning combination.
@@charleswinokoor6023 Indeed and for her to give a good enough voice representation of Frank Zappa I think is remarkable.
I have several videos I've made of the audio of my book on my YT page: Freak Out! My Life with Frank Zappa
And he wrote broken hearts are for a$$holes?
Does not compute.
I think it computes exactly.
1:57 She's talking about Beggar's Banquet (not Beggar's Opera) the Stones record.
Thank you for the correction. You are the first person to notice. Slip of the tongue of course, but I'll be more wary in future.
@@paulinebutcherbird No worries, Pauline slips of the tongue happen! I am an autistic (literally) music nerd, so I notice these things. Just wanted people to know what you were talking about! 💜
@@lindalinda0316 💕
sorry, but who are these people?
@@itsgoingtobeok-justbreathe4808 who are what people? Paul and his wife run a podcast and here they interview Pauline Butcher Bird, who was an English girl who lived and worked in Frank Zappa's log cabin 1968-1971 and wrote a memoir. It shows Frank's home life not shown in other books, from getting up to going to bed, composing and rehearsing with the Mothers, visiting rock stars, freaks, family squabbles and more. It is highly praised by Zappa fans. 'Freak Out! My Life with Frank Zappa, Laurel Canyon, 1968-1971.
She knew the deal and she was fine with it, end of story.
She wasn't fine with it. It broke her in two, but still she stayed. She liked the show-biz life.
The point is, she wasn't confined it's not like he held her against her will, she decided to stay.@@paulinebutcherbird
@@gianlucad8003 Indeed.
Frank said in an interview he had a 12 inch Dong and Gail couldn't satisfy him maybe thats why he had so many partners. The interview is still on TH-cam.........
It must have been very difficult and frustrating to have such a lengthy tool and Gail doesn't want to play ball all the time........ you women know best.
@@gianlucad8003that's such a stupid point. Many women decide to stay with cheating partners, for the sake of the children, or they have low self esteem or any other reason without being literally in a cage. That doesn't make cheating ok.
I don't believe that Frank was drug free. He looks high af in many pictures and the band scene at the time was all in.
These celebrities try to present an image of integrity and high standards.
Gail was a simp, Frank loved being duplicitous.
What's a simp? I have in my possession a copy of a note that Frank delivered to the hotel rooms where the Mothers were staying stating: NO MORE DOPE ON THE ROAD OR YOU WILL BE UNEMPLOYED. We were not allowed to have drugs in the house. He was terrified of being arrested as he had been in 1966 when a disguised police officer asked Frank to make a pornography tape. When he came to collect it the next day, Frank was thrown into jail on a felony charge where he stayed for 14 days in cramped conditions. He said it was the worst experience of his life. Every person who worked for Frank was given the same message - if you use drugs in my vicinity, you are out.
@@paulinebutcherbird His buddy Captain Beefheart smoked herb all time during recording of early albums according to people at sessions. People today say they aren't into stuff but have a vape 🖊 pen and edibles. I think he dabbled. A person that selfish towards his own family has many layers. Genius is never pretty.
@@todds808 I lived in Frank's house and worked for him for three years. None of us were allowed to have drugs. Once, in 1968, when Pamela Zarubica (Suzy Creamcheese) took me to a house where we sat in a circle, the curtains drawn and the door locked, they passed round a 'cigarette' - the first one I'd seen and of course refused. They became more and more quiet. It was so boring. When I got back to the house, Frank was furious and said I'd be dragged into jail if we had been caught even though I didn't anticipate. None of his four children take drugs - fully indoctrinated. Band members record the odd occasion when Frank accepted a 'cigarette' (can't remember what you call them) but all knew that on tour, drugs were out of bounds or they were out. I don't understand why you don't accept it.
This is awful to hear - I mean we all "know" how rockstars are, but that is just appalling behaviour by Zappa. It is important that you tell all these stories. Shame Gail didn't get to write that book. The story reminds me of Kim Gordon's book, about how Thurston Moore treated here - and they were in the same band!
Both examples indicate the general attitude men had toward women in the 1960s. It is why I was so enamoured by Frank myself because he took an interest in what I had to say, and that was so unusual when I was a mere secretary. But to Gail, he seemed to think it was okay to have other women because he was honest about it, and scorned other men who had affairs secretly. And, to some degree, he had a point!
@@paulinebutcherbird I guess so. In a way he gave Gail the choice to accept it somehow or walk away..
@@theproblembelief7549 Exactly, and as I understand it, but this is not first hand, she did walk away on a couple of occasions and he chased after her to come back. Difficult to refuse.
@@paulinebutcherbird off-topic for this video, but do you recall Zappa studying? His musical output and his awareness of so many cultural and political issues would point to self-study. And in the Real FZ Book he refers, I recall, to the value he placed on public libraries.
@@theproblembelief7549 The day I met Frank Zappa I told him how disappointed I was not to have gone to university and he told me not to regret it and to teach myself in the library, and added that's how he learned. The paradox is that by the time he came to the log cabin, there were no books or newspapers, nor television. From there on, he relied on information brought to him from outsiders. In the five months we lived there, I also never saw a newspaper, heard the news on the radio or television, or read a book!
The relationship structure is actually quite normal from an evolutionary/biological viewpoint. The critical and principle associations are that women seek a strong provider for their children. This he was in every respect, as he was an excellent provider and loved his children. Men instinctively fear their wives being unfaithful, as they may have the responsibility of raising another man's child. This is clearly unacceptable for men, and just as much as we must acknowledge and expect hypergamy from women (the quest/need for a high income partner for sex and reproduction) Women must also bear the brunt of the man's caution. In any circumstances which indicate that his wife is more welcoming toward another male than she is toward him, will result in a natural jealousy.
In such a situation, as long as the couple are intelligent and knowledgeable, they will come to an accommodation, as long as they continue to talk to one another. It is the honest communication that will count, and not deferring to any ideological agenda. Generally in Hollywood, the marriages are brief puppet shows, whereas Frank & Gail were long time lovers and married parents with many children. The differences could not be more stark. If anyone imagines that a grown man who must leave home for many months of the year on concert tours, the band will be targeted by groupies. A number of his songs hinge on that premise. I would doubt that Frank had any need to masturbate while on tour personally. Frank was still correct in his jealous desire not to cuckolded by his wife and another man, however. You see the consequences for the male & the female differ enormously. I am also aware that he and Gail also had threesomes etc on occasion, and their entire sex lives were not based on lies and repression, as they are for the apparently blissful couples extant.
I should point out that I began writing my comment after a single minute into the show. My immediate concern being that as the ridiculous and disruptive feminist narrative is the only game in town in 2023, it is, and leads to dogmatic views and great amounts of lying and acrimonious finger wagging.
Perhaps Gail will be portrayed as the poor lost soul, lost to the influence of a wicked man? I hope I am wrong, but I fear I will not be, for it is women who have run and continue to run the world, and what women say or claim, is taken as the gospel truth. Unimpeachable evidence of shame attributable to male behaviour, which is within the bounds of normality, are always condemned, and the many females who revile Frank, but secretly wish he had desired them, will inevitably turn the tide against Frank & indeed, other men. For what ever men do currently in our corrupted and seriously damaged culture is always wrong. Men are simply incorrect from birth, as very clearly, even their female teachers will frankly observe them as defective females and not effective males. To be male is inherently wrong and evil, men are dolts and fools hell-bent on greater idiocy apparently? Whereas the truth is that men invented, designed and constructed our civilisation, with only an incidental role for the women, who if sane, held their men in high esteem and took care of the incidentals of life (the very easy parts of life like housework and child-rearing) I assure that having performed in that role, I did a far better job of it than my wife ever could, as she was disorganised and sloppy and lazy. It is not work ladies, because real work is hard, very hard. The aforementioned female tasks, which women are abrogating are so ridiculously simple, that any sane couple address this matter early on and take their individual responsibilities seriously, and without question.
I agree with all of your comment up until the final paragraph when it seemed to go off course into feminism and all of that and also your assertion that women run the world. I look at the leaders of all the countries in the world and see that is not true and I don't wish it to be. I like your point, not made by others even though it's well known, that men don't want their partners to dally with other men because of fear of raising another man's child. I also like your acknowledgement that Frank supported Gail and the children in a financially secure environment. However, I would argue it was not a healthy, mental and emotional environment. See Moon's interviews and comments.
We are the current iteration of evolution which is only concerned with creating the next generation. Makes and females are both awful in their own ways. Nasty behavior does not care which kind of reproductive plumbing the person is sporting.
@@DCronk-qc6sn Tes, true what you say.
This is some of the most ridiculous bullshit I have ever heard, and it doesn't get any better every time someone retells it. People who write this are doing nothing but stringing words together to justify their own worldview.
@@jackal59 Blow me retard. You cannot offer an argument.
That’s shitty Frank wouldn’t let her screw around or talk to a guy friend. Patriarchy has given all of us brain-worms hahaha
Let's keep a balance here. Frank gave Gail respect which is a lot more than many husbands give their wives, in as much as he gave her the business to run in their last years together. He said she was his best friend, and that's also very nice I think.
@@paulinebutcherbird Absolutely. Still lopsided when it came to the open-relationship/infidelity thing.
@@Atomic_pavarotti True, but how many marriages would survive scrutiny when put under this kind of microscope?
When the patriarchy is over a new matriarchal society with a "reform " capitalism maybe even democratic socialism. I'ma laugh at the patriarchy as they get selected in a class based society. Western world will do a backwards 180 I hope before ww3 or something hope China or mexico annex the weakened invaders.
It's not a "patriarchy" thing. It's a 1950's and 60's beatnik hippie free love and communication thing. That's why Zappa thought it was okay to ask Gail if he could bang one of his groupies in their house. Zappa was not a religious man. Religion is a mainstay of patriarchal thinking. Patriarchal tradition vehemently rejects the idea of banging a groupie in your wife's bed.
Horrible man. How could anyone treat their wife like that? But then, this era has not aged well at all. Kids today laugh at it.
I don't agree with that. I think most people have an understanding of consideration of others, whether they're kids or not. I would point out that Frank had high regard for Gail. After all, he left her in charge of his business. How many husbands do you know would do such a thing? I don't know what Frank's feelings were for these other women but in his book he wrote in 1988 he said, 'I met Gail and I fell in love.'.
@@paulinebutcherbird He cuckolded her. Maybe the most shameful act a person can inflict on a partner. It’s devastating. What could you possibly be thinking?
@@kaivrock I consider physical abuse, which is widespread, much more shameful and injurious, often leading to death, than being cuckolded. Frank was honest in his infidelity. Gail knew about it and he kept her in the loop. Obviously it was not good for Gail, but Frank was not cruel and as I said in my previous comment, he gave Gail the highest regard allowing her to run his business.
@@paulinebutcherbird "At least he didn't beat her" Right. You've gotta be from that whole pathetic era.
@@kaivrock I hope you're enjoying a better life in the present era!
never a fan
You are not alone. Frank Zappa's music is specialist's taste.
As a fan of his music I find none of this interesting bunch gays and gossip girls pure garbage