The format in which you presented this upgrade video is spot on! Strait to the point and loaded with information. Love the fact that you even shove non-budget cut/adds in the video! Subscribed and Liked!
Really solid upgrade guide - I really appreciate the upgrades suggested for both budgets. As someone else pointed out, you do hit 2 creatures minimum with Sadistic Shell Game, but every time I've played the deck I stare at it in my hand all game because it's generally not worth the mana to cast it.
Thank you so much! Trust that we're cooking some more up as we speak. And we're certainly looking forward to the next drop from Wizards so that we can actually get ahead of release after deciding to branch into this content!
I focused on valgavoth too much upgrading my deck, pinging people for card draw. But being rakdos. He ain't gonna be out for very long cause you're always considered the threat
Totally understandable- we actually felt like that was one thing the Precon already did super well. So a lot of our suggestions are for ramp to recast, protection to keep him around, or ways to end the game quickly before people can adequately deal with him
Feign Death/Undying Malice are solid, I personally prefer Not Dead After All as the budget version of this effect but the real power of Malakir Rebirth is that it's a Land on the other side of the card which makes it tremendously flexible. MDFCs like that make more hands keepable and provide more plays late game
Sadistic Shell game actually gets at least two creatures as the caster picks last. Not great at that rate, but while the Valgavoth deck might draw too much ire for people to pick multiple things, thats not guaranteed.
I've watched a few videos on precon upgrades, and bay far stands out well, video was well put tother. I love how your intro, it cuts the bs in most MTG videos.
Both are excellent choices! We like to go a little off the beaten path when possible to make it worth watching the video; not that we're the first to think Pyrohemia might be good with Valg
While that's true we just like cards that we're able to control and plan around. Hoping someone plays enough treasure for Mayhem Devil to kill them is less reliable than something like Vengeful Ancestor or Revenge of Ravens.
Both excellent cards! When we were looking at the list, we actually felt like the main thing the Precon did well was trigger Valg so we wanted to account for the ramp, protection, and win cons that he'd need with that damage/draw engine online.
@planarparty I finally had a decent game using some upgrades and 2 of the main cards that helped me win were Razorkin Needlehead and Solphium. My opponents couldn't get rid of either one and I pinged them to death. I didn't use my commander till the last play of the game but it worked out really well. I get you have to sacrifice certain things for other things needed for a deck. Not complaining by any means. I may still tweak it and add some more ramp or card draw myself! Awesome list regardless!
Hell yeah! Razorkin is a beast. On our livestream yesterday we had the same experience- cards with similar effects put in insane amounts of work. Glad you like the suggestions and hope your Valg deck continues to perform!
Sadistic Shell Game is probably a bit better than you think since the caster also gets to pick and picks last, so at worst you kill 2 things since they can't pick your stuff. Still not great rate, but it's twice as good at least :P But also it's very good if another player is ahead of the everyone else, since then it's very likely to kill 4 things.
Thanks for pointing this out! The reality is that you're probably paying 5 to kill the one thing you want to AND somebody's 1/1. Very true that it can kill minimum two things tho
In (almost) any two color deck you’d be better off playing ANY land that taps for both colors in the case of cards with heavy pips. And you’ll exhaust those quickly since you don’t want to be playing a lot of tapped lands in the first place so Evolving and Terramorphic just shouldn’t make the cut!
Valid concern! We recommend playing a LOT of protection for Valgavoth and keeping an eye on the tempo around the board. Valgavoth can afford to play more of the one-for-one protection spells like Not of The World and Bolt Bend because it provides the cards to make those trades. But if you were gonna play some extra draw to cover the event that Valg gets slugged, what are your top picks?
@@planarparty Removing draw is a mistake. Instead, replace it with tutors (Gamble, Insatiable Avarice, Beseech the mirror), and draw affects that work WITH your commander (Gix, Yawgmoth Praetor, Ob Nixilis, Captive Kingpin) or to protect you (Karazikar, the Eye Tyrant, Kardur Doomscourge).
There are still cards that draw independent of Valgavoth in the deck, the ones that got cut are the least efficient. This is a mana-hungry deck so skipping my fifth turn to play Karazikar and hoping people see through the ruse to attack other players isn't as reliable as just playing the correct engine pieces Also, in general, people know that tutors are good so we focused on recommending more specific synergy pieces. Captive Kingpin is definitely a good alt Commander to just throw in as a redundancy but could also be considered a win-more card
As @spelltype said Akki is more affordable, we also do what we can to try and recommend cards people might not have thought of vs. a known powerhouse like Karlach (unless they're too perfect to ignore like Pyrohemia in this case)
@@planarparty The reason she is more money is just cause she does everything akki does, but better, and at a cheaper mana cost with less restrictions. If karlach is not a choice, then Moraug, Fury of Akoum with nice fetch lands like fabled passage and the like would work nicely as well
We are saying the same thing! Karlach is a better card than Akki Battle Squad. However, our line for budget recommendations is 5 dollars. Moraug is also very good but more money and less consistent than Akki, in this particular deck I would be playing Akki first then Moraug if there's room. Moraug is better in a deck with more colors (more fetches) or a deeper focus on landfall
You need to really read Sadistic Shell Game again. Because you clearly didnt read what it does. Not saying its a good card, but definitely better than you think.
@@spelltype I never said it was good, but your whole idea of it being bad is based on the minimum you get out of it. It is a political card. The first player is not going to pick their own creature. So why would the others? I get that if people want to minimize your value they would pick the same creature, but then you are assuming everyone does that every game and in my experience this doesnt actually happen quite often. Wished it was an instant, because that would make it a lot better. But I don't think its as bad as you make it out to be.
If you make the changes we recommend to Valgavoth, it will be pretty commanding and difficult to suggest that anyone politic in your favor. While it's possible to get serious value from Sadistic Shell Game it's in my nature to assess the floor of a card with a lot more value than its ceiling. I would much rather a hand full of cards that are always capable of doing something than a hand full of cards that are good "if". The floor of Sadistic Shell Game is destroying an inconsequential creature of your opponents' choice (likely a token or mana dork) as well as being able to destroy one creature of your choice (which does bypass Hexproof in a cool way) for 5 mana. Really cool design, strong in other decks, but unfortunately just not efficient enough for how powerful Valg can be in our opinion
@@planarparty Reading your explanation, I completely get your opinion on the card. I also get why you value it so low. My point wasn't that it was a good card in this deck. I merely wanted to point out that this is more of a political card and that it has some serious upside if used correctly. I still think even in its best case the card is not something I would use in most decks. Outside of maybe a very political deck where you want to lean into such a thing. But the card is better than your initial observation. This was what my first reply was about. I think maybe there is/was some misunderstanding. I have played it in this deck for the first few games I played with it. I am still upgrading the Precon, I was missing a whole bunch of cards for it and have ordered some of them online. When I upgrade it more I wil cut this card more than likely. Thing is, the card performed a lot better than what you claimed. At least in the games I had it and played it. Those might have been outliers though. So as a whole I can definitely understand your sentiment on the card and your evaluation on it. Personally I also rather not play cards that depend on the opponent. Specially if it hinges on the card being good or bad in a sense. This is also why I never play these types of cards normally. But I wanted to give this card a fair shot, before just dismissing it as so many others have. I don't think it's good to evaluate a card without having at the very least tested it. Hope you get where I am coming from and what I am saying. Peace! ✌
Totally get where you're coming from! And this is a constructive conversation to have so I'm happy you brought it up for us to clarify the stance. You'll also note that Shell Game is in the second half of cards we're cutting which are more likely to be cards that are good, just not quite good enough.
The format in which you presented this upgrade video is spot on! Strait to the point and loaded with information. Love the fact that you even shove non-budget cut/adds in the video! Subscribed and Liked!
Oh wow thank you so much
Thanks homie! Your time is valuable, gotta get you off the TH-cam and back to the Commander table (with a better deck)
Was a pleasure making this video with B dawg.
no it wasn't you liar
Really solid upgrade guide - I really appreciate the upgrades suggested for both budgets. As someone else pointed out, you do hit 2 creatures minimum with Sadistic Shell Game, but every time I've played the deck I stare at it in my hand all game because it's generally not worth the mana to cast it.
Ahhh yeah good point. I missed that. Still bad
Glad our theory is matching up with your experience. It's a cool card but Valg is just too high power for something this cute
@@planarparty I replaced it with Soul Shatter...though I also ordered a Gix's command. Both are solid replacements.
This is actually a good upgrade guide tf
We do our best!
I was so sad to find out you only have 4 precon videos. Your format is straight fire, look forward to more
Thank you so much! Trust that we're cooking some more up as we speak. And we're certainly looking forward to the next drop from Wizards so that we can actually get ahead of release after deciding to branch into this content!
This has some banger upgrades, nice stuff guys
Thank you! Though to be fair it doesn't take much for Valg to pop off 😅
I focused on valgavoth too much upgrading my deck, pinging people for card draw. But being rakdos. He ain't gonna be out for very long cause you're always considered the threat
Totally understandable- we actually felt like that was one thing the Precon already did super well. So a lot of our suggestions are for ramp to recast, protection to keep him around, or ways to end the game quickly before people can adequately deal with him
My first input ever on anything Magic related! ANOTHER and cheaper alternative for Malakir Rebirth, Feign Death. :)
Feign Death/Undying Malice are solid, I personally prefer Not Dead After All as the budget version of this effect but the real power of Malakir Rebirth is that it's a Land on the other side of the card which makes it tremendously flexible. MDFCs like that make more hands keepable and provide more plays late game
Sadistic Shell game actually gets at least two creatures as the caster picks last. Not great at that rate, but while the Valgavoth deck might draw too much ire for people to pick multiple things, thats not guaranteed.
Very good point and something I missed. Thanks for pointing that out
I've watched a few videos on precon upgrades, and bay far stands out well, video was well put tother.
I love how your intro, it cuts the bs in most MTG videos.
Thanks for saying so dude! We both have ADD so we try to cut dead air when we can 😂
Great video!
Thank you!!
thanks for the vid. i recently got this precon and this video is a huge help. can you guys do an upgrade vid for the Ulalek precon too?
Card’s nuts!!
Definitely. It really pulls its weight in the stream. If you haven't seen it the link is in the description!
Methinks Enduring Tenacity + Exquisite Blood would be most devious
Absolutely worth including
Surprised no sheoldred the apocalypse or bowmasters tbh
Both are excellent choices! We like to go a little off the beaten path when possible to make it worth watching the video; not that we're the first to think Pyrohemia might be good with Valg
Mayhem Devil could be a counter to a play when an opponent would sacrifice a huge amount of token for a big effect
While that's true we just like cards that we're able to control and plan around. Hoping someone plays enough treasure for Mayhem Devil to kill them is less reliable than something like Vengeful Ancestor or Revenge of Ravens.
@@planarparty makes sense, thank you for reply
Quite sad to not see Sheoldred or even Razorkin Needlehead on the list 🥺💔
Both excellent cards! When we were looking at the list, we actually felt like the main thing the Precon did well was trigger Valg so we wanted to account for the ramp, protection, and win cons that he'd need with that damage/draw engine online.
@planarparty I finally had a decent game using some upgrades and 2 of the main cards that helped me win were Razorkin Needlehead and Solphium. My opponents couldn't get rid of either one and I pinged them to death. I didn't use my commander till the last play of the game but it worked out really well. I get you have to sacrifice certain things for other things needed for a deck. Not complaining by any means. I may still tweak it and add some more ramp or card draw myself! Awesome list regardless!
Hell yeah! Razorkin is a beast. On our livestream yesterday we had the same experience- cards with similar effects put in insane amounts of work. Glad you like the suggestions and hope your Valg deck continues to perform!
Sadistic Shell Game is probably a bit better than you think since the caster also gets to pick and picks last, so at worst you kill 2 things since they can't pick your stuff. Still not great rate, but it's twice as good at least :P But also it's very good if another player is ahead of the everyone else, since then it's very likely to kill 4 things.
5 mana kill 2 is also bad!! But definitely better than I thought
Thanks for pointing this out! The reality is that you're probably paying 5 to kill the one thing you want to AND somebody's 1/1. Very true that it can kill minimum two things tho
Liked and subscribed -- where's the onlyfans?
10k subs = onlyfans
@spelltype Shopping around for tassels now
Cutting evolving wilds. Blasphemy!
ITS A BAD CARD
We generally think it's unnecessary in any two color deck. Landfall could be an exception but definitely not outside of that.
In (almost) any two color deck you’d be better off playing ANY land that taps for both colors in the case of cards with heavy pips. And you’ll exhaust those quickly since you don’t want to be playing a lot of tapped lands in the first place so Evolving and Terramorphic just shouldn’t make the cut!
Fabled Passage is the better version, cheap prismatic vista
So cut most of the draw in the deck? because the commander draws cards? the commander that is probably going to be killed? No thanks...
Valid concern! We recommend playing a LOT of protection for Valgavoth and keeping an eye on the tempo around the board. Valgavoth can afford to play more of the one-for-one protection spells like Not of The World and Bolt Bend because it provides the cards to make those trades.
But if you were gonna play some extra draw to cover the event that Valg gets slugged, what are your top picks?
Yes. That is exactly what we're saying. You don't play Valg until you have setup and Valg draws 3 cards by himself in one cycle.
@@planarparty Removing draw is a mistake. Instead, replace it with tutors (Gamble, Insatiable Avarice, Beseech the mirror), and draw affects that work WITH your commander (Gix, Yawgmoth Praetor, Ob Nixilis, Captive Kingpin) or to protect you (Karazikar, the Eye Tyrant, Kardur Doomscourge).
There are still cards that draw independent of Valgavoth in the deck, the ones that got cut are the least efficient. This is a mana-hungry deck so skipping my fifth turn to play Karazikar and hoping people see through the ruse to attack other players isn't as reliable as just playing the correct engine pieces
Also, in general, people know that tutors are good so we focused on recommending more specific synergy pieces. Captive Kingpin is definitely a good alt Commander to just throw in as a redundancy but could also be considered a win-more card
why akki and not karlach ?
We try to keep budget around $5 or ideally below it. Karlach is $10
As @spelltype said Akki is more affordable, we also do what we can to try and recommend cards people might not have thought of vs. a known powerhouse like Karlach (unless they're too perfect to ignore like Pyrohemia in this case)
@@planarparty The reason she is more money is just cause she does everything akki does, but better, and at a cheaper mana cost with less restrictions. If karlach is not a choice, then Moraug, Fury of Akoum with nice fetch lands like fabled passage and the like would work nicely as well
We are saying the same thing! Karlach is a better card than Akki Battle Squad. However, our line for budget recommendations is 5 dollars.
Moraug is also very good but more money and less consistent than Akki, in this particular deck I would be playing Akki first then Moraug if there's room. Moraug is better in a deck with more colors (more fetches) or a deeper focus on landfall
Actually sadistic shell game can kill at least 2 creatures because you are the last choosing player
Sure can! The thing you want to and a thing your opponents all agree on, which just isn't worth 5 mana in this particular deck
You need to really read Sadistic Shell Game again. Because you clearly didnt read what it does.
Not saying its a good card, but definitely better than you think.
It's still bad. 2 mana remove 2 and one is not under your control is horrible.
@@spelltype I never said it was good, but your whole idea of it being bad is based on the minimum you get out of it.
It is a political card. The first player is not going to pick their own creature. So why would the others?
I get that if people want to minimize your value they would pick the same creature, but then you are assuming everyone does that every game and in my experience this doesnt actually happen quite often.
Wished it was an instant, because that would make it a lot better. But I don't think its as bad as you make it out to be.
If you make the changes we recommend to Valgavoth, it will be pretty commanding and difficult to suggest that anyone politic in your favor. While it's possible to get serious value from Sadistic Shell Game it's in my nature to assess the floor of a card with a lot more value than its ceiling. I would much rather a hand full of cards that are always capable of doing something than a hand full of cards that are good "if".
The floor of Sadistic Shell Game is destroying an inconsequential creature of your opponents' choice (likely a token or mana dork) as well as being able to destroy one creature of your choice (which does bypass Hexproof in a cool way) for 5 mana. Really cool design, strong in other decks, but unfortunately just not efficient enough for how powerful Valg can be in our opinion
@@planarparty Reading your explanation, I completely get your opinion on the card. I also get why you value it so low.
My point wasn't that it was a good card in this deck. I merely wanted to point out that this is more of a political card and that it has some serious upside if used correctly.
I still think even in its best case the card is not something I would use in most decks. Outside of maybe a very political deck where you want to lean into such a thing.
But the card is better than your initial observation. This was what my first reply was about. I think maybe there is/was some misunderstanding.
I have played it in this deck for the first few games I played with it. I am still upgrading the Precon, I was missing a whole bunch of cards for it and have ordered some of them online. When I upgrade it more I wil cut this card more than likely.
Thing is, the card performed a lot better than what you claimed. At least in the games I had it and played it. Those might have been outliers though. So as a whole I can definitely understand your sentiment on the card and your evaluation on it.
Personally I also rather not play cards that depend on the opponent. Specially if it hinges on the card being good or bad in a sense.
This is also why I never play these types of cards normally. But I wanted to give this card a fair shot, before just dismissing it as so many others have.
I don't think it's good to evaluate a card without having at the very least tested it.
Hope you get where I am coming from and what I am saying. Peace! ✌
Totally get where you're coming from! And this is a constructive conversation to have so I'm happy you brought it up for us to clarify the stance. You'll also note that Shell Game is in the second half of cards we're cutting which are more likely to be cards that are good, just not quite good enough.