Spent my 35 Years As a Royal Engineer - Remember the transisition from Cpl to Sgt Well. We were training for a NI Tour in the Infantry Role - There were 8 Cpl's in my Troop and I was the youngest. The OC returned to Germany after his NI Recce & had decided that two of us were to be promoted to local Sgt for the tour & I was one of them. Not popular initially as i was youngest. Luckily my Substansive rank came through at the end of theTour or i would have reverted to Cpl. Interestingly the two of us who were promoted for that our ended up doing an RSM Tour. Happy days. loving the Video's Keith. Best wishes Kev
Takes me back to NI, Palace Barracks. My old Pl Sgt ended up with a beige beret. Ran in to him in Hereford in the late 80’s, he looked well fit. Happy days.
I once had the misfortune to be asked to leave an OR's mess in Catterick camp. We were a TA Regiment staying overnight whilst on an exercise in the area. I had joined my pals in the mess for a pint, and in a very short time I was approached and asked to leave by another NCO as "I had my own mess". I did. Got quickly changed into civvies and went back in to finish my pint. 😃😃.
I'll never forget, I was promoted in McCory Park in Belfast. My mate was at White Rock in Belfast. When we got back to Duisberg we had to attend a regimental dinner. Because we didn't have mess dress we had to wear no 2s. What a great experience.
Battle Stripes is an excellent TV program, I've watched it several times. It reminded me of USMC NCO School at MCB Camp Lejeune, NC back in the mid 1970s. It's still on TH-cam.
Did both junior and senior and SAA and FFQ at Brecon back in the day. Best times of my life in some respect. Echo everything youve said regarding the etiquette and standards of the best club in the world you've earned the right to join. We even had a sub-mess if you want to call it that - the port club! That was a bit pretentious really thinking back....😂
I was 22 when promoted Sgt (tech trade) it felt weird going into the mess for the first time when back at our old recruit training depot. Old ptn recruit trg sgt (now a WO2) took the P!$$ out of me the whole of that first time in the mess. All in good fun as he was a great bloke. Plus, Mess fees can be a shocker. Promoted Sgt 1987 mess dress cost £500, that was a shocker as well, made to measure.
That was very interesting: thank you. One thought leads to another. Perhaps sometime you would be able to discuss the different formal requirements and preferred human attributes needed for NCOs and officers, and for the possible routes for promotion from NCO to officer.
Whilst I can't comment on the SNCO course as i wasn't in the army! I do know more than most civvies about the Sgt's mess. 2 reasons. Mybdad was a Sgt in REME and as an 8 to 10 year old was taken to the Mess for Sunday lunch & other activities. This was a 23 Base Workshop, Wetter, 1970 -72. Having failed to join up due to a spinal cord injury at 18, i became a Civikuan Instructor with the Air Training Corps, and as such was allowed to use tge Wo & Sgt's Mess when on courses & annual camp (granted this was an RAF Mess). Fortunately, because of my dad, i knew the proper way of behaving etc, unlike some other C.I's & a couple of Adult Warrent Officers. I was lucky enough to be invited to a couple of full mess events (quite rare for an ATC civvie instructor) & managed to not blot my copybook. But that was in the late 80's. It must be said that the SNCO Mess was much more civilised than the Officers!
Senior Brecon was thought to be one of the hardest courses to complete, having seen the results it produces excellent SNCO'. If you are in a NATO location, do not expect a US SGT to have the same level as a British infantry SNCO.
Interesting to hear how it works from an infantry perspective. I was in the Gunners and although didn’t make it to Sergeant, remember hearing about something called the Gunnery Careers Course. This was either something guys did for the transition to WO2 from Sgt or Bombardier (full Corporal) to Sergeant. Also remember a course called ‘Army in a Contemporary World’. Might have been part of what was done to become a Stripey. I remember the tv series ‘The Paras’ back in the 80’s and the recruits going off to Brecon to do ‘Basic Brecon’ and I think at some point, ‘Advanced Brecon’. I’m guessing this is just basic infantry skills all infantry soldiers learn and different to the platoon commanders course.
In my day in the Royal Navy, if you acted in a higher rate (rate), you could be temporarily advanced and paid at that rate but still held seniority in your substantive rate. It's confusing that you weren't paid for the acting rank in the army, even though you held the authority and responsibility.
Quite happy I stayed as a Full Screw. Unless there was a clear opportunity for quick progression to S/Sgt, not worth it. Luckily we had a Corporal’s Mess to help with preparation to higher things.
I don't know what it's like now but in the early 2000's the best paid ORs were either single full screws or staff sergeants. Beyond that either taxes or mess bills took away the other benefits financially. I left as a Bombardier (19 Regt RA) in 2003 so never made it into the WO & SGTS mess :)
Wish and sgt mess 16 signals Krefeld chef working there.I got called into mess to pass on a message didn't know I had to remove my chef's hat as we were doing function got reminded by my master chef as he punched me through the door.😂 Another time couple of junior ranks waiting on had drunk all the alcohol waste.One fell into barrier as Rsm was giving speech. That was an experience.They asked why we hadn't stopped them drinking. It was explained by my master chef that was not our role but mess manager.Seen him on a few guards duties after 😂😂
It’s only upon late entry commissioning that you realise the whole JNCO/SNCO/WO cadre is meaningless and without a voice. Just a series of exasperated childrens clubs in peacetime. Officers run the show
In my corps I never actually commanded anyone as a senior rank. I don’t think in my entire career, apart from Op Grapple, did I have junior people working for me; in my case two Cpls. The only mess I was ever part of was an RAF mess at High Wycombe. In 24 years I never purchased mess kit; dodged that.
![Soviet Craftsmanship [Arma Reforger]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LJC093xrZho/mqdefault.jpg)
Spent my 35 Years As a Royal Engineer - Remember the transisition from Cpl to Sgt Well. We were training for a NI Tour in the Infantry Role - There were 8 Cpl's in my Troop and I was the youngest. The OC returned to Germany after his NI Recce & had decided that two of us were to be promoted to local Sgt for the tour & I was one of them. Not popular initially as i was youngest. Luckily my Substansive rank came through at the end of theTour or i would have reverted to Cpl. Interestingly the two of us who were promoted for that our ended up doing an RSM Tour. Happy days. loving the Video's Keith. Best wishes Kev
Takes me back to NI, Palace Barracks. My old Pl Sgt ended up with a beige beret. Ran in to him in Hereford in the late 80’s, he looked well fit. Happy days.
I once had the misfortune to be asked to leave an OR's mess in Catterick camp. We were a TA Regiment staying overnight whilst on an exercise in the area. I had joined my pals in the mess for a pint, and in a very short time I was approached and asked to leave by another NCO as "I had my own mess". I did. Got quickly changed into civvies and went back in to finish my pint. 😃😃.
Great video, Really enjoyed it. Just subscribed!
Thank you very much, Keith.That was very interesting.👍🫡💂♂️
Fascinating video Keith. I remember that documentary and the rather high failure rate from it.
I'll never forget, I was promoted in McCory Park in Belfast. My mate was at White Rock in Belfast. When we got back to Duisberg we had to attend a regimental dinner. Because we didn't have mess dress we had to wear no 2s. What a great experience.
Enjoying your videos Keith. Keep them coming and mind that bloody traffic!
Great vid Tabby, i didn't know it was such a tangled web being a Sargent ,as I am only a semi retired pirate, cheers
Battle Stripes is an excellent TV program, I've watched it several times. It reminded me of USMC NCO School at MCB Camp Lejeune, NC back in the mid 1970s. It's still on TH-cam.
Did recruit, lcpl cadre, ssgt both reg and TA and then commissioned, 40yrs in uniform loved every minute.
"I'd like to become a sergeant but I can't afford the pay rise."
You don't enlist for the money, that's for sure! 😄
Great video as always
I’ve done both courses at Brecon . Fantastic times .
Loved the time with the RGR as I was RGJ . Vickers block . 👍
Did both junior and senior and SAA and FFQ at Brecon back in the day. Best times of my life in some respect. Echo everything youve said regarding the etiquette and standards of the best club in the world you've earned the right to join. We even had a sub-mess if you want to call it that - the port club! That was a bit pretentious really thinking back....😂
Great video very informative enjoyed it thanks.
Thanks Keith, fascinating as ever, keep it up.
I was 22 when promoted Sgt (tech trade) it felt weird going into the mess for the first time when back at our old recruit training depot. Old ptn recruit trg sgt (now a WO2) took the P!$$ out of me the whole of that first time in the mess. All in good fun as he was a great bloke. Plus, Mess fees can be a shocker. Promoted Sgt 1987 mess dress cost £500, that was a shocker as well, made to measure.
That was very interesting: thank you.
One thought leads to another. Perhaps sometime you would be able to discuss the different formal requirements and preferred human attributes needed for NCOs and officers, and for the possible routes for promotion from NCO to officer.
Whilst I can't comment on the SNCO course as i wasn't in the army! I do know more than most civvies about the Sgt's mess. 2 reasons. Mybdad was a Sgt in REME and as an 8 to 10 year old was taken to the Mess for Sunday lunch & other activities. This was a 23 Base Workshop, Wetter, 1970 -72.
Having failed to join up due to a spinal cord injury at 18, i became a Civikuan Instructor with the Air Training Corps, and as such was allowed to use tge Wo & Sgt's Mess when on courses & annual camp (granted this was an RAF Mess). Fortunately, because of my dad, i knew the proper way of behaving etc, unlike some other C.I's & a couple of Adult Warrent Officers. I was lucky enough to be invited to a couple of full mess events (quite rare for an ATC civvie instructor) & managed to not blot my copybook. But that was in the late 80's. It must be said that the SNCO Mess was much more civilised than the Officers!
Well presented with good tips ❤❤❤
And on formal dinner nights, don't forget which way the Port is passed.
To the left
Senior Brecon was thought to be one of the hardest courses to complete, having seen the results it produces excellent SNCO'. If you are in a NATO location, do not expect a US SGT to have the same level as a British infantry SNCO.
Mess dress was the most expensive pyjamas I ever owned.
(I could never get the bloody thing off when I was pissed 😅😅😅)
Interesting to hear how it works from an infantry perspective. I was in the Gunners and although didn’t make it to Sergeant, remember hearing about something called the Gunnery Careers Course. This was either something guys did for the transition to WO2 from Sgt or Bombardier (full Corporal) to Sergeant. Also remember a course called ‘Army in a Contemporary World’. Might have been part of what was done to become a Stripey.
I remember the tv series ‘The Paras’ back in the 80’s and the recruits going off to Brecon to do ‘Basic Brecon’ and I think at some point, ‘Advanced Brecon’. I’m guessing this is just basic infantry skills all infantry soldiers learn and different to the platoon commanders course.
I enjoy your vids and reminiscing thank you
The OR’s Bar is nicknamed the Baggies Bar or the Garrison Club in NZ 🔥
I got my SGT by finishing my Pilots course. Only the British AAC have SGT pilots now. Navy and Air Force are all officers.
@ 77-83 Oakington mainly 😂
I never got there,I got out as a lance Jack after four years.
In NZ it’s done at the school of Feet the Platoon Commanders Cse so both officers and Sgts/Cpls do it at the same time 🔥 done at Waiouru Army Base 🔥
We don’t have Colour Sgts in NZ we do have Staff Sgts 😂
That was the very last Cse I attended before I knocked the head on my Army Career after a chat with the Brigadier in charge of Army training 😂😂😂
In my day in the Royal Navy, if you acted in a higher rate (rate), you could be temporarily advanced and paid at that rate but still held seniority in your substantive rate. It's confusing that you weren't paid for the acting rank in the army, even though you held the authority and responsibility.
Why are lance sgts in the guards allowed in the sgt mess when they're only corporals in other regerments
So glad I got out
Quite happy I stayed as a Full Screw. Unless there was a clear opportunity for quick progression to S/Sgt, not worth it. Luckily we had a Corporal’s Mess to help with preparation to higher things.
Ah, The boat race and bombing runs 😏 Ring any bells for anyone?
I don't know what it's like now but in the early 2000's the best paid ORs were either single full screws or staff sergeants. Beyond that either taxes or mess bills took away the other benefits financially. I left as a Bombardier (19 Regt RA) in 2003 so never made it into the WO & SGTS mess :)
My grandfather in ww2 got promoted in the field and became sgt major. How does that work keith im guessing no courses. Hes not here any longer to ask
Fullscrew was the best rank in the Army.
1st 👍 Western Australia 🇦🇺 🔥
What rank did you leave the army? if you don't mind me being nosey :)
I watched Battlestripes on youtube not long ago, guess who was going for his potential 3 rd stripe on it . Big Vern. lol
If they ever lower the standards at Brecon it will be the end of the Infantry.
Wish and sgt mess 16 signals Krefeld chef working there.I got called into mess to pass on a message didn't know I had to remove my chef's hat as we were doing function got reminded by my master chef as he punched me through the door.😂
Another time couple of junior ranks waiting on had drunk all the alcohol waste.One fell into barrier as Rsm was giving speech.
That was an experience.They asked why we hadn't stopped them drinking.
It was explained by my master chef that was not our role but mess manager.Seen him on a few guards duties after 😂😂
Wo,s and sgt mess
You outrank the late Austrian Painter
👍❤👍❤
Fascinating. I never made it past the REME Bar
Don't forget you were once a waiter at the Sergeants Mess. Don't put yourself down. :)
👍
It’s only upon late entry commissioning that you realise the whole JNCO/SNCO/WO cadre is meaningless and without a voice. Just a series of exasperated childrens clubs in peacetime. Officers run the show
What capbadge? You sound like an LE to avoid lol
Hhahaha.
In my corps I never actually commanded anyone as a senior rank. I don’t think in my entire career, apart from Op Grapple, did I have junior people working for me; in my case two Cpls. The only mess I was ever part of was an RAF mess at High Wycombe. In 24 years I never purchased mess kit; dodged that.