Sideways RUN-UP will ruin your form and body (Aiming with the legs)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
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BEFORE you comment that "No pro is ever doing this or would never tell you to do this", check out the video I made a while ago: • Re-edited & censored K...
While I am not allowed to use the original footage in that video, I refer to Ken Climo telling the EXACT same thing I am telling you here. Aim with the legs, and go straight in the direction of the intended line. Ken The Champ Climo says you should do this. If you don't believe me, at least believe the 12x, okay?
In this video, I'm sharing my view on the run-up. It should be pretty straightforward. Not strictly so, but enough so you can use the momentum and the shoulder turn to your benefit and not jerk the disc around your body.
My back is too stiff (probably from a diagonal run-up from the youth) to go as straight as I wanted to, but the idea is to walk quite straight - even more than in my examples.
More stuff on Instagram:
/ jaanigoingp. .
I had an 'Aha' moment watching this. accuracy has been my biggest problem with BH drives. Thank you
Needed this today! Workd on maximum distance past 2 weeks. So been going right to left and forgot to go straight for normal shots on round last evening 😅
Thanks for reminder 💪😁
Such simple and straight foward (pun intended) instruction. Thank you! Have you addressed the X-step in your videos? I've gone through the English ones and can't remember off the top of my head, but this video is a great example of what I'm working on. Straight walk-up with shorter X-step. You and all the greats I've watched have something in common....your left knee hardly crosses your right knee in the crossover keeping your hips parallel through that motion. In mine, I have a tendency to get turned around and I'm working hard on shortening it.
Another great vid with practical and useful info. I know I do this occasionally - usually on holes with wonky misaligned tee pads. Whenever I grip lock a throw that is usually the reason. Thanks for the reminder of how important a straight run up is.... cheers!
this is good ..love your videos. I have a aiming technique for stand still.. put my front foot down.. hold the disc in the power pocket.. I look at the crease behind my elbow.. move my back leg till the crease aims at the target.. I have show this to a few and it works for them also.
Thank you so much for explaining the footwork and demonstrating. You simplify it and illustrate in a way that I believe I can duplicate into my game.
Thank you for another great video. Keep up the awesome vids.
Such a good informative video. Can’t wait to try this out in a couple hours. 😅
You’re videos are incredibly helpful. Love this channel.
Could you do a video on the proper way to throw an BH turnover? Throwing anhyzer is challenging (nose angle, bracing, reach back, lean back???) and I struggle with consistency. Thanks!
Okay, I'll think about it
To elaborate on the question, my preferred release angle is a slight hyzer. Im comfortable with a slight body lean, I know the path my arm should take but when I try to throw anny force overs / flex shots, I struggle to get power behind the throw as well as the proper nose angle.
For proper form, should my run up path change compared to hyzer or flat shots? Does the disc path go from high to low? How high? Is the release point different? Any tips on how to give the proper loft to the disc while maintaining a nose down angle? I often feel like I’m pulling and/or grip locking. Thanks again!
Good fundamentals described in perfectly simple terms, thanks 👍
Another great video! Can you do a video on a full throw from a standstill? Most standstill videos just cover short approach shots. Medically I can't run up and have to throw standstill. I would love to get my timing better and add some distance.
What about a one-steppers, like a small stride only?
@DG Spin Doctor I probably could do that. Everytime I try my timing get messed up, so I usually just stop. But if you have an idea for that I will try!
Try using a rocking motion. Rock forwards, rock back and then throw. That helped my standstill immensely
This
Another gem💎
❤❤❤ thank you sir
My pleasure!
Thanks Doc
First of all great channel. I have really tried both and for me the right to left is the most powerful and accurate because I can use the hips and all of the body and then easily rotate on the front leg and at the same time not rounding. And I think more injuries comes with the straight run up because you have to pull more with your arm. Look at Lizotte, Eagle, Albert and many more with straight run up often have problems with the elbow you don’t see that on Mcbeth, Joel Freeman and others with the right to left run up because they can use the whole body and easily get the balance with the rotation on the front leg.
You do you. What ever works, do that. Though funny you mention McBeth who just got out of 6 months injury rehab. Eagle got injured from sidearm, and Simon, I think from over extending in the reachback and throwing crazy trick shots.
Mcbeth got injured by lifting baby
@@Gnildron100 During the European Open?
It was a joke you’re Finnish hedgehog 🦔
@@Gnildron100 "You finnish hedgehog"
basically you should only run up diagonal if you can coil before the x-step like albert tamm or right side dominated players like ricky wysocky or matt orum. they dont turn diagonal with their X-step because they coil before the X-step. Or coil only their Right side kinetic chain. Whatever they do they they dont coil during the X-step like most players. people think you run diagonal because you end up diagonal. but its just the coil and brace aligning to go straight with the release. The finn is right. look at sledgehammer throwers, you absolutely cant brace straight.
I do walk ups rather than run ups, but had an issure with releasing right in tight lines for a long time.
I walk up straight, have done for long. But I realized that 1: tilting my walk up angle to like 10° helps because I do the same mechanics, but more importantly: I noticed in my straight runup that my right foot in in line with the left an the end => right release. So now I walk up to about a disc's width right of my intended right foot plan spot - but straight towards the target - and mindfully step a little bit more left of the last step, so my front leg can brace properly. An slow down everything again again again haha.
It works.
Sounds good to me!
Dude! So true, I’m afflicted by this as well and do the same thing!
I have a bucket list goal to play a round of disc golf with you.
Hmmm...flattered, but... you can ask the hundreds (if not thousands) of players if it was that fun after all. 😀
You helped me so much on my backhand I'm forever greatful. Much respect.
Both Drew and Simon have pretty much the exact same 20 degree diagonal run up in the the slow-mo videos on Overthrow Discgolf (for max power at least). I'm not sure I would call this a 'slight adjustment'. Joel Freeman recently made a video explicitly teaching this style of run up. I really don't think this is adequately addressed in this video. If you're having problems with some amateurs throwing their backs out then probably there are some other contributing factors there as well besides the diagonal run up. I get that you're trying to be short and to the point but I would much prefer a more in depth discussion.
If you already know all this and more, why would you want me to talk about it?
yeah I was thinking about that as well, Joel Freeman's video on the "window" between the legs. He says it helps you get more power, and the slight angle runup is something I have always done anyway. It's not anything crazy like in this video he explains the ams coming in from way off the side and what not, just a slight angle to the runup. In my opinion I assume thats because it helps get your plant foot out in front a little bit instead of directly in line with your back foot. But idk I would definitely be curious to see what dgspindoctor thinks about Joel's video
I think Joel is correct. People just love to hate others online and look for chances to misinterpret others so that they have someone to hate. A slight diagonal runup is perfectly fine if you have to do it and find it helpful, but if you end up rounding because of that, it is not good.
But please, carry on hating, if that makes you feel better. I can handle it. Just feels very, very funny from this side of the fence.
@@dgspindoctor no you're good man, I totally got what you were saying the video, it helps with targeting and not rounding, and some ams are wild with the angles they take lol. Your point is still right on, people just glossed over the train tracks part in your video I think
People love to argue, and here I'm giving them a platform do that. One way or another I'm helping them feel better, and that's what I'm here for.
In my personal opinion, running right to left is an easier way to get your footwork perpendicular to the target. However, in my personal experience it's rare that I will go right to left on the teepad and I will almost always adhere more to the parallel line example. The only exception is a teepad with an irregularly short width that my straight runup and plant will literally fall off the teepad to the front left.
How is the adjustment made? Starting off the teepad to the right, ending back up on the teepad on my "walk line" that would be there on a normal teepad, and then throwing down the same line I would.
There is no reason for people to be going right to left to "make a bigger window" with their legs or to find some "hidden power". This can all be done as you are describing on normal sized teepads. I think people have an issue getting the proper plant distance to the left and x-step mechanics correct. They are trying to replace good footwork with a shortcut that forces them to throw over the line against themselves and they sometimes get a rounded shot that is released on the line and think they did something lol.
I believe what you are teaching is correct and we are in the transition period of the "pull methodology" of teaching which was primarily working right to left across the teepad. A lot of people are upset because what they thought was correct is getting exposed because there are MANY examples of good, powerful shots thrown the way you describe. Keep doing your thing. Those of us who CAN throw 500' know you are teaching correctly.
Thanks! Spot on.
Great video Spin Doctor! Do you have any tips on how to prevent knee injuries in your plant leg?
I just realized the relationship between my body and the disc line the other day. Idk why it took so long, and I’m pretty sure it’s been stated in many videos it just took my brain a while to connect the dots 😅
A lot of it is in the language we use and figuring out the words as a coach to get the person to respond the way you want.
Thank you sir .
Most welcome!
Hyvä video👍. Kuvattu Ruskeasuon hevostalleilla?
Kiitos. Sielläpä.
But why do the pros do what you see the amateurs doing?
Maybe watch the video?
@@dgspindoctor Paul Mcbeth's run up is 45 degrees to the left of the target and then has a controlled over pull. I don't remember your video even acknowledging the pros or why they do this
Yes, he does. Also, I said in the video, that learn the straight run-up first and then adjust if you feel like it. You decided not to acknowledge that to get some ranting done. You also mention only one pro who does it, even if you first alluded to "pros".
If I just told people "Do whatever you feel like or see on screen", nobody would learn anything. I teach the basics from which to continue and find one's own form. That is the basics of teaching.
So yes. Do whatever you feel like. I don't teach it, but if you can make it work, that's cool too. Try teaching some time, it's a lot more complicated and multifaceted than you'd think from that side of the screen.
The "rails" suggestion was awesome! Like the haters in the comments i also saw Freemans video, but this is super helpful and like you said, its the base that needs to be figured out first 🤙🏼
can you explain matty-o accurately throwing 500+'?
No.
MattyO can’t be explained on any level. Throwing, putting, being him in general. He is the best! But maybe not as a general template for teaching amateurs good form basics 😂
Great advice!
Unfortunately I'm so duck footed that I have to over exaggerate my run-up a bit or I'll really yank to the right.
We all have to adjust to our bodies and listen to it all the time.
not to be rude but I'm unsure if this is actually the case and not a symptom of something else. I'm fairly duck footed and miss right when I'm pulling a bit due to bad muscle memory and left when I'm afraid of missing right and not committing fully. I find it helps to focus on knee orientation in your video form review when your feet just don't seem to align with 'good form'. Just an idea. As with all internet advice might help, might not.
Yeah as long as my knee is pointing roughly perpendicular to where I'm aiming when I'm bracing my hit generally happens when I want it to. My foot just looks a little more open than textbook because of the duck thing.
Great content, thanks
Yeahhhh buddy
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he totally goes right to left in his runup.
Just as I said, adjust to your liking and body.
First? And first comment ever on TH-cam 😂
one comment in 15 years? see you in 15 years i guess
So this dude tellin all the pros who do not straight run up they wrong? They bad? The confidence on this guy…
The video is aimed at beginners and people rebuilding bad form. Learn to walk before you run. In his examples he still goes a little left and throws a little right. It's the intentional yoink and pulling with the back muscles you want to avoid.
Thanks for watching. Now, watch another time and really think if your comment was on point or not. Try listening to it, too!
The thing about pros is that they really don't watch form guide videos on YT so that alone should tell us that he isn't talking to the pros, is he?
Why on earth would I teach pros?
Maybe the only video you have that I disagree with.
Sorry.
Foot fault
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just curious on how that "bad form" will hurt yourself?
You will have to rotate your lower back more than it can handle.
@@dgspindoctor I can vouch for that. And after you do it for an extended time and with some power your back can get really bad. I've had a lower back problem from over-rotating with my back for 2 years now and it's not fun. For the first month or two sitting and standing made no difference, felt like someone was just slicing the sides my lower back bone with a knife all day. Still if i tend to stop focusing on my form now i get back pains again.
Yes, and I probably destroyed my back doing exactly that for more than 10 years. You don't notice it right away, of course, but in time you can't but notice it...
To simplify what they are saying, If you're doing a pull around rounding style throw because you dont understand how to work the diagonal run up, what you end up doing is jerking the disc around with your lower back muscles and you will over strain them as you over rotate to get the disc on the target line.
@@sarinhighwind Yes. Your lower back isn't meant to turn with that big of a rotation and speed.
going to try this rn. My shot is all over the place :D
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I thought you were going to say no to start sideways to the intended line. (*see Corey Ellis) But then is see you doing what I have been doing lately, for the sake of simplicity which is eliminating the steps prior to the one right before the X step. I am not sure if I am losing anything by eliminating the set up steps that go before (facing the target, orir to turning 90 degrees) but I do know that simplifying and relying on the timing rather than some sense of speed or strength is what needs to happen, so, thanks again for providing great info!
Corey's runup is the most simple I've seen, and works great!
I have never fully understood the facing the target then turning style play. It's just extra steps that make it more complicated to play. Vs stand sideways, stride, x-step throw.
@@dgspindoctor JohnE McCray also
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I did the joel freeman window thing and that resulted in constant rounding. I can standstill a driver or putter pretty far with it, but throwing putters became impossible if they weren't stable. By readjusting, thanks to this vid, I'm finally getting some decent tosses with my putters.
Spin doctor still creates that window, look at his legs
@@AwesomeotasticGaming difference between the exaggerated freeman window and the way shown here
@@deloriablackwolf1251 true, good point!
Just as I said.
Thanks for the video.
I used to run straight to the basket.
This winter I saw 10+ form videos saying you need to run up from right to left.
Maybe the last step, yes.
Think of it this way.
Cause he's talking about a baseline.
Most newer players even into intermediate and advanced levels dont have a lot of control of where the disc goes, or how to control where the disc goes.
I see intermediate players who round and muscle and their footwork is terrible.
Baseline, stride straight at the target, stagger on your plant. Pretty straightforward right?
The problem is learning WHY you would push the tee box diagonally and understand it vs just doing something before you even understand how to use it.
So in turn, what ends up happening is because a player doesn't understand what they are doing to throw the shot on the diagonal push, they yank the disc around to get it on the target line.
This feels so much better. Keep each foot on its own rail. I've never thought of it that way. I'm definitely the guy that starts back right and goes diagonal to front left regardless of shot.
No wonder my back is killing me. Jaani, your teaching is so spot on. No one teaches like you. Keep it coming.
Any putting tips coming soon or did I miss them.
Thanks againn
I finally got a net and radar and started recording, i must say im that guy thats rounding lol but your video and the new last step video is really showing me things that i definitely need to incorporate. Thanks for the great content as always!
A dumbed down way of looking at this is to have the tip o your toe centered up with your intended exit point?
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Might want to change the title to "your" instead of "you"
I might also change my sleeping habits, geez! Thanks, buddy!
@@dgspindoctor no prob, thanks for the DG lesson! 😀
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Maybe you're should reconsidering make "horse-stance" video to make grammarians happiness? 🤣
I take a last big step thats more out than down the line and feel like I’m losing momentum. Also hurts my lower right side of my back (I’m RHBH). Any advice on how to stop that habit and keep the momentum going down the line?
Sorry, these things you have figure out yourself.
if you know where you want the foot to go drill it really really slow for a few days anytime you can and gradually make muscle memory. If you're not sure where to put your foot try not trying to put it anywhere in particular and only focus on foot orientation if it's getting jacked up because of this and you need to. You need to do LESS of something that being stepping forward (walking) with the right foot. Not more of something or something new. What you don't want to do is wind up swinging the leg around in line with the back foot (i used to do this it's hella bad) so I wouldn't really recommend the overcompensate approach but you could try it as a last resort.
Hope this helps if it doesn't ask someone else don't worry you'll get there.
Heart
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Mitä teippiä käytät sormiin? Jos jaksat, tee video kun teippaat ja muutama hyvä vinkki mitä teippiä tullut testattu. Thnx!
En mä käytä oikeesti, mutta nyt kesän ekat heitot rikkoi ihoa niin pahasti, että oli pakko. En saanut sormea koukkuun näillä teipeillä, eli en aio jatkossakaan käyttää paitsi pakon edessä.
@@dgspindoctor Ok, sitä pelkäsinkin. Heittänyt itse kevät ohuet nahkahanskat käyttäen ja sitten kun kelit +puolella ja ilman hanskat niin iho lähti kiekon mukaan. Ehkä hanska sitten parempi käyttää kun heittää draivit kun ei ole miehen työkädet.
Corey ellis form
Disc golf is about finding what works for you. That doesn't mean the fundamentals aren't important and apply to 99.9% of beginners and intermediates.
This is what I try to tell also in this video.
sure but how about drew gibson?
Thanks for watching.
Now, watch again.
@@dgspindoctor sure but maybe being slightly sideways run-up(slightly off the baseline) like Gibson should be the norm. I do agree with you that the baseline is a great visual aid for learning and probably where people should start. Good video! I like the length and speed, not too long and still insightful
You can always adjust, and even Gibson is still taking a relatively straight run up compared to people who send me their form videos. Even I walk sligthly diagonally, as you can see and as I mention.
Joel Freeman has a distance drive video where he explains the right to left x-step technique, but it’s also implying that you are using good form.
Yes, the so called window between your legs. Doesn't mean you should walk-up across the teepad and turn your hips 90 degrees away from the target like most of the amateurs think is good form. I have never seen a pro do that.
It makes me sad the sun is down 😢TOMORROW IT IS!!! 🥏⛳️