As a diehard Altra supporter and someone who works in run speciality Thomas' comment just triggered me so much lol. People thinking having narrow feet is a justification for a tapered toe box simply don't understand why the extra room is beneficial. People would rather mess up their feet for the sake of fashion then go against the grain lol
Everyone complains about calf soreness but I would take that pain over hip/knee pain from heel striking anyday! Sore muscles means you're using the bod properly. I wish more companies offered zero drop and wider toe boxes
I have been running for 15 years and for about the first 14 I was wearing shoes ranging anywhere from a 4-12 millimeter heel drop. I pronate a good bit but have always just worn neutral shoes. When I started working in run speciality I started researching how shoes impact the body and realized that wearing Altra was a no-brainer. My calves were sore for like 3 weeks when I first started, but now I wear them everyday with no issues. Also my rate of tendon soreness around my ankles has significantly decreased and nagging aches/pains from running have dropped significantly since wearing them. Aside from getting a sale super shoe for workouts/races (like my Endorphin pro 2 lol) I will not be running in anything that isn't a wide toe box low drop shoe.
Most people don't realize their big toe is not aligned with the 1st MTP due to years of wearing shoes with a tapered toebox. That puts our foot out of alignment and affect the whole chain. Well, I didn't know any better for 3 decades
@@fransera I think this comment you made is likely a very accurate insight into why some people are unable to perceive the value of Altras - because their feet are already damaged! Or some proportion might actually have feet that are narrower than they should ideally be for a traditionally shaped shoe and so they don't see that they would be much better off with something like Altra's slim footshape fit.
@@antonroux6737 dude, u know who's feet are not damaged? rich kids who only wear sandels with no wraparound in toe section or as they mention, birkenstocks-likes. hell even if they wear heels all day some heels also don't have wrap around u know.
I absolutely love this shoe. I dont care about the price. People happily pay 100bucks for a shirt when a 50 buck shirt is just as good. Why save on shoes? Its a Peba sole btw.
260$ is too much. I love Altra but they became too corporate…. As someone who doesn’t necessarily need a carbon plate I’ll wait for the Topo Specter 2 which will have a similar stack and shape but will be 100% pebax and around 165$.
Yeah. I used to be an Altra fan after getting the Escalante 2.5, but I feel like their prices have gone kind of crazy especially with what you're getting compared to the competition. Glad they've improved it on this version, but it doesn't sound good enough for that $260 price tag.
@@jimjurek7911 well... To be fair I got the Escalantes on a steep discount and I haven't been able to find an Altra with that much of a discount since. So it could have just been a fluke.
Ok… so that feeling of needing to work harder on longer runs, clearly a 00mm drop. Calves & achillies having more load going through soft tissue for propulsion. Great review
Thomas on On: Price isn't worth discussing, people can decide for themselves what a shoe is worth to them. Thomas on Altra: OMG it's too expensive! Yes it is too expensive, but why aren't these other companies being held accountable for their ridiculous price gouging?
@berthein5476 you missed the point. I'm not talking about a "wide audience." I'm referring to Jim's topic of running companies price gouging their shoes.
Jim, you're expecting consistency from Thomas. He's never done that, he's all about how much clout a brand brings to BITR. He focuses on looks rather than function in running shoes, he focuses on price sometimes but not others, he whines about break-in periods for some shoes but lauds them for others. I long ago accepted I'm getting entertainment and marketing out of him, not real reviews.
I agree with how it feels on the run - a big step up from the first version but that price points hurts a little. As an off and on Altra runner (former barefoot runner), I'm glad I bought it but the market has such strong offerings for cheaper that I don't think I'd buy it again unless I could get it a discount in some way.
I'm excited about this shoe. The newer Altra shoes seem to have a higher collar. I've stopped wearing no show socks. I'm shocked that the laces are long. My v1 carbons are almost 2 short.
I have the old Vanish Carbon 1. Used them in a half marathon in April, definitely noticed the wear after only a few training runs and the race. Still, felt amazing, I'm so glad they made a second and added a full plate and the race loops. Stoked to get these one day! I tried the Meta Speed Sky and Endorphin Edge in a store the day after a run and noticed that slight difference in not using a full plate, interested to see how a full plate helps that.
These or the S/Lab Phantasm 2? I get discounts on both so they'd be ~$165-175 for me which is why it's between those two. 😁 I've used Salomon and Altra in the past and like them both for different reasons. I'm running my first half in late May, and shooting for a full marathon this fall!
Reviewing a zero drop shoe if you don't run in zero drop shoes is completely worthless. Might as well review timberland boots for running and complain about it being too heavy.
Relax! Gave it a fair and honest review. Especially coming from people that review running shoes for a living. The only real criticism was the price, which is justified.
That forefoot lateral sole flare you mention at 3:00 is the devil for me on certain Altra shoes. Cants my feet inwards setting up for excess pronation. Why do they do that? I experienced it on Topo too. Something to do with natural foot shape although you don't see it on all Altra models (like Rivera 4 their slim fit one)
Do you think they're getting away with saying "zero drop" the same way Hoka is getting away with 40mm with the world athletic rules with the Cielo X1? Starting the toe spring at the measurement spot?
Sounds like a nice upgrade. I got last year's model for $100 off last Fall so I'm gonna wear those bad boys out before I consider an upgrade. Especially at that price 😬
"It's a phenomenal Altra. It's a good race day shoe, but definitely a phenomenal Altra." Now that's a backhanded compliment if I ever heard one. 😂I have some Altra Torin 6s I don't even run in-just kick around shoes-but I noticed today the upper is tearing. BITR, because of y'all, I am now Team Topo! Might pick the non-plated Specter 2 for my first marathon this Fall. Are carbon plates even worth the cost for a first-time marathoner? Thanks guys!
@@Believeintherun interesting. On the doctor's of running podcast the founder said it was peba, but had to be asked directly about it, because he was saying the same thing he told you. But when asked directly if it is peba based he said yes.
Altra measures balanced cushion for this shoe at the center of the heel (12%) and center of the first metatarsal (65% ish). The heel and forefoot rocker obviously are not part of that geometry.
I believe it’s the bands connected to the tongue inside the shoe anchoring it in place. Semi-gusset will just have one band, I think I have a Puma like that.
Amazing that ‘foot shaped’ gets criticised more than the ‘not foot shaped’ that most companies choose!
Crazy, isnt it.
The conspiracy against mankind goes on...
As a diehard Altra supporter and someone who works in run speciality Thomas' comment just triggered me so much lol. People thinking having narrow feet is a justification for a tapered toe box simply don't understand why the extra room is beneficial. People would rather mess up their feet for the sake of fashion then go against the grain lol
Good comment. Exactly what I was thinking. Personally I like the look of a wider toebox, obviously a very subjective interpretation.
@@nspeak-vm5cnexactly. And so many reviewers conflate ‘shape’ with ‘toe box width’.
Everyone complains about calf soreness but I would take that pain over hip/knee pain from heel striking anyday! Sore muscles means you're using the bod properly. I wish more companies offered zero drop and wider toe boxes
I have been running for 15 years and for about the first 14 I was wearing shoes ranging anywhere from a 4-12 millimeter heel drop. I pronate a good bit but have always just worn neutral shoes. When I started working in run speciality I started researching how shoes impact the body and realized that wearing Altra was a no-brainer. My calves were sore for like 3 weeks when I first started, but now I wear them everyday with no issues. Also my rate of tendon soreness around my ankles has significantly decreased and nagging aches/pains from running have dropped significantly since wearing them. Aside from getting a sale super shoe for workouts/races (like my Endorphin pro 2 lol) I will not be running in anything that isn't a wide toe box low drop shoe.
it's not just about a "wide toe box" but about not having the shoe push the big toe out of its alignment and bio mechanically optimal position
Most people don't realize their big toe is not aligned with the 1st MTP due to years of wearing shoes with a tapered toebox. That puts our foot out of alignment and affect the whole chain. Well, I didn't know any better for 3 decades
@@fransera I think this comment you made is likely a very accurate insight into why some people are unable to perceive the value of Altras - because their feet are already damaged! Or some proportion might actually have feet that are narrower than they should ideally be for a traditionally shaped shoe and so they don't see that they would be much better off with something like Altra's slim footshape fit.
💯
@@fransera did you buy any correction spacers??
@@antonroux6737 dude, u know who's feet are not damaged? rich kids who only wear sandels with no wraparound in toe section or as they mention, birkenstocks-likes. hell even if they wear heels all day some heels also don't have wrap around u know.
36mm stack is being called low to the ground... unthinkable 5-6 years ago
Remember it's zero drop. So 36mm under the forefoot/front - most with 36-40mm and a 5-8mm drop have less foam under the front of the foot
@@charles-h9e no u rmember that they did not go through the fact tha tit is 35mm specified by manufaturer, long ago.
I absolutely love this shoe. I dont care about the price. People happily pay 100bucks for a shirt when a 50 buck shirt is just as good. Why save on shoes?
Its a Peba sole btw.
260$ is too much. I love Altra but they became too corporate…. As someone who doesn’t necessarily need a carbon plate I’ll wait for the Topo Specter 2 which will have a similar stack and shape but will be 100% pebax and around 165$.
Y'all look high as kites, lmao
And sound it
Damn it 😪 everything was going so well until the pricetag was revealed 😕
Yeah. I used to be an Altra fan after getting the Escalante 2.5, but I feel like their prices have gone kind of crazy especially with what you're getting compared to the competition. Glad they've improved it on this version, but it doesn't sound good enough for that $260 price tag.
Most of their other shoes have gone down in price.
@@jimjurek7911 well... To be fair I got the Escalantes on a steep discount and I haven't been able to find an Altra with that much of a discount since. So it could have just been a fluke.
Ok… so that feeling of needing to work harder on longer runs, clearly a 00mm drop. Calves & achillies having more load going through soft tissue for propulsion. Great review
Thomas on On: Price isn't worth discussing, people can decide for themselves what a shoe is worth to them.
Thomas on Altra: OMG it's too expensive!
Yes it is too expensive, but why aren't these other companies being held accountable for their ridiculous price gouging?
Because Altra isn't providing the same value-add to merit that price point, it's pretty simple.
You think that's bad? Look what Adidas charges for the Pro Evo and what Puma charges for their new RB shoe.
Pumas new RB shoe isnt ment for the wide audience. Its a "lets see how crazy we can make stuff" shoe. They said themselves its a limited run as well.
@berthein5476 you missed the point. I'm not talking about a "wide audience." I'm referring to Jim's topic of running companies price gouging their shoes.
Jim, you're expecting consistency from Thomas. He's never done that, he's all about how much clout a brand brings to BITR. He focuses on looks rather than function in running shoes, he focuses on price sometimes but not others, he whines about break-in periods for some shoes but lauds them for others. I long ago accepted I'm getting entertainment and marketing out of him, not real reviews.
in the UK, this shoe is cheaper than both the saucony pro 4 and the sc elite v4!!
Idk why you'd want a slim shoes? Is hallux valgus nice or what?
"yeah, i'm going to keep doing it till somebody gets hurt." LOL
I agree with how it feels on the run - a big step up from the first version but that price points hurts a little. As an off and on Altra runner (former barefoot runner), I'm glad I bought it but the market has such strong offerings for cheaper that I don't think I'd buy it again unless I could get it a discount in some way.
I'm excited about this shoe. The newer Altra shoes seem to have a higher collar. I've stopped wearing no show socks. I'm shocked that the laces are long. My v1 carbons are almost 2 short.
RunRepeat measured 5.4mm drop on version 1, so I imagine its pretty similar on these
I have the old Vanish Carbon 1. Used them in a half marathon in April, definitely noticed the wear after only a few training runs and the race. Still, felt amazing, I'm so glad they made a second and added a full plate and the race loops. Stoked to get these one day! I tried the Meta Speed Sky and Endorphin Edge in a store the day after a run and noticed that slight difference in not using a full plate, interested to see how a full plate helps that.
How high are y’all?
I will wait for the price drop 😂
These or the S/Lab Phantasm 2? I get discounts on both so they'd be ~$165-175 for me which is why it's between those two. 😁 I've used Salomon and Altra in the past and like them both for different reasons. I'm running my first half in late May, and shooting for a full marathon this fall!
First marathon, honestly S/Lab Spectur, then this one, then Phantasm. Good luck!
Reviewing a zero drop shoe if you don't run in zero drop shoes is completely worthless. Might as well review timberland boots for running and complain about it being too heavy.
Exactly. They talk about the toebox looking goofy. It's function over form peeps. They are high as a kite and clueless
Relax! Gave it a fair and honest review. Especially coming from people that review running shoes for a living. The only real criticism was the price, which is justified.
That forefoot lateral sole flare you mention at 3:00 is the devil for me on certain Altra shoes. Cants my feet inwards setting up for excess pronation. Why do they do that? I experienced it on Topo too. Something to do with natural foot shape although you don't see it on all Altra models (like Rivera 4 their slim fit one)
have you guys been able to get a pair of the escalante racer 2 shoes in?
Do you think they're getting away with saying "zero drop" the same way Hoka is getting away with 40mm with the world athletic rules with the Cielo X1? Starting the toe spring at the measurement spot?
First Like from Spain 🇪🇸. Have a nice day.
Sounds like a nice upgrade. I got last year's model for $100 off last Fall so I'm gonna wear those bad boys out before I consider an upgrade. Especially at that price 😬
"It's a phenomenal Altra. It's a good race day shoe, but definitely a phenomenal Altra."
Now that's a backhanded compliment if I ever heard one. 😂I have some Altra Torin 6s I don't even run in-just kick around shoes-but I noticed today the upper is tearing.
BITR, because of y'all, I am now Team Topo! Might pick the non-plated Specter 2 for my first marathon this Fall. Are carbon plates even worth the cost for a first-time marathoner? Thanks guys!
260 is too much for Altra durability track record for me.
Thanks!
The Vanish Carbon was the cheapest feeling shoe I’ve ever put on. Can’t imagine ever returning to the brand at this point
Cheech and Chong
Did yall smoke a fatty before recording? lmao
Altra says the midsole is peba based
I mean, the co-founder literally told us to our face it's a "proprietary nitrogen-infused super foam," no mention of Peba
@@Believeintherun interesting. On the doctor's of running podcast the founder said it was peba, but had to be asked directly about it, because he was saying the same thing he told you. But when asked directly if it is peba based he said yes.
Thomas @believeintherun, what was the issue with the stack? It’s not zero drop?
I’m not sure I understand the question
Around the 40sec mark in the video, Thomas questions the zero drop in the shoe. However, he doesn’t talk about it later in the video.
Altra measures balanced cushion for this shoe at the center of the heel (12%) and center of the first metatarsal (65% ish). The heel and forefoot rocker obviously are not part of that geometry.
They don’t find the extra room necessary because their toes don’t splay out as they should. Probably from decades of using traditional footwear.
When other news gives you the blues
Still don’t know what a gusset is
I believe it’s the bands connected to the tongue inside the shoe anchoring it in place. Semi-gusset will just have one band, I think I have a Puma like that.
Please veriew merk shoes "Ortuseight" Solar
It gets interesting from 4.53 min. Before that upper, fit crap
Anyone know what jacket Thomas is wearing?
I do. Path Projects Graves PX Shell. I love it. -T
@@Believeintherun Thanks! Good luck in Boston!
These guys are high af.
…mk ultra…😮
Someone got it 😉
These guys are so baked, this channel has totally lost its way
No baking for this video. Maybe you can show us the way.
Just farted
260 lmao
Altra makes impressively poor-value products 👍
Ew, they’re doing the long lace thing even for their race shoes? I wish they’d cut their shoe laces shorter by 4 inches.
Altra is still making shoes…I had no idea
Some of the best btw
@@FDNRunningandMotivation-ws1hd In what world
I just don’t get the zero drop
That's fine. It changed my life running. Options are best