Chiang Mai changed the way we travel | Travel Tips
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 มิ.ย. 2024
- Ep.92 We discuss how we've adjusted our travel after 16 months because of an experience in Chiang Mai. This episode digs deep into how we feel about full-time travel.
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Chapters:
00:00 - Start
01:52 - How did we travel before going full-time?
02:59 - Our patterns after 16 months of full-time travel
04:39 - What's the problem with having travel patterns?
06:24 - Having meaningful local experiences while traveling
08:53 - Our "Aha!" moment during our stay in Chiang Mai
10:48 - Staying connected to family and friends is challenging
13:05 - Our challenges and struggles with local experiences
16:23 - Balancing popular tourist site visits with local experiences
18:10 - What we've learned from traveling full-time
20:02 - What has slow travel given to us?
22:07 - What do you think about our travel experiences?
Finding Gina Marie is where we share our lives as full-time travelers and the connections we make along the way.
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One of my favorite things to do is walk. Wander. Pop into local restaurants and coffee shops. This is where Google Maps comes in handy. I wander until I'm a bit tired, then use Google Maps to find my way back. Very rarely do I make plans, at least not big ones. I want to experience a place, not just see the hot spots. It's usually more fun than the hot spots anyhow!
Great video and great insight into the different ways people travel!
Our family loves to immerse ourselves, in local culture when traveling internationally. Here are a few things that have worked for us.
1) start a conversation with the taxi and/or rideshare driver and get some good tips on places to eat.
2) chatting up hotel workers has sometimes produced good results for local experiences.
3) this is our #1 one way. We search for a small local church and attend one of their services either on Sunday or during the week. More times than not people will approach us and introduce themselves, and on the rare occasion that does not happen, we introduce ourselves. This has resulted in us getting excellent advice for things to do, places to eat, and places to avoid. Many times the churchgoer will offer to take us places. We have collected a good list of WhatsApp numbers to keep in touch and many of them are constantly wanting us to come back to their country so they can take us to more places.😊
How great that you have these strategies that are working for you. There are some places where we have great Airbnb hosts, but not all of them. Some are very transactional, unfortunately. We have to work better on engaging our taxi drivers because although some of them will share information even about various sights, many of them don't speak English in the countries we're visiting. And see, good for you. If someone like a fellow churchgoer would offer to take us places, our instinct is to say thank you but reject their offer because we don't want to imposition them! We need to break out of that cycle. We do engage with fellow travelers on our tours and when they are in countries we are interested in, we try to get their information so we can connect when we travel there. We love WhatsApp as well and it has been what has allowed us to keep in touch with our tour guides. We need to stop being so timid at times! Thanks for these suggestions. -Judy
I'm the type of traveler who likes to see the touristy things and then leave and stay in areas where the locals live and hang out. I find I get a much richer experience traveling like this. I'm also not afraid to try and communicate in their language, however limited my knowledge of it may be. All the locals love it when you try and speak their language and will go the extra mile to make your visit that much nicer.
Thanks for sharing your experience! We also have found that locals appreciate when you try to speak the language. Sometimes we haven’t been happy in more residential areas, but that is even true for some places where we’ve lived. When we lived in San Francisco, we avoided the residential neighborhoods that were just rows of homes. We’ve only had modest success in finding true neighborhoods filled with local shops and restaurants that are alongside residences. Thanks for watching! -Judy
We’re so intrigued by this conversation. We are still evolving our travel approach. We do like more authentic experiences too not just sites. It seems we start with sites and then build relationships as we do the ordinary things with people we encounter doing laundry, grocery shopping, morning coffee, etc. Taking classes, and meeting up with others (often from other countries) are also very beneficial.
Thank you so much for watching, Erin. We haven't signed up for classes anywhere. What sort have you taken? We tend to be a little more closed off than we probably should, but again, some of that is feeling introverted. We have been grateful to all the people who we've made connections with, but it sometimes is still hard for us. We're trying to change that. -Judy
Stan has taken language classes along the way. I’ve taken a photography class and a few local house tours. It is hard to find time when traveling because some classes like Spanish lessons take much of the day and can last a week or several. We are very involved with GoWithLess Fasebook group and meet people frequently. It’s been a great way to connect although it is with other travelers.
These are great, Erin. Thank you for sharing them. We've never considered these ideas before, but classes would be a great way to meet people, locals and fellow travelers. -Judy
Agree! 💯💯💯
In Dubai, I did the touristy camel tour in the desert. But in the old part of the city at a craft stand area, I happened to meet an artist refugee from Syria. Listening to his story was the closest I felt to the true Middle East. Making connections like that in travel is amazing ❤️
We are so aligned, Mary! We do enjoy hearing people's stories so much! It's a little hard for us in that we don't shop or buy many things because we have no space to bring them with us. I would think that supporting his business would be meaningful while allowing him to keep his dignity. Some people do not just want a handout. But therein lies one of the dilemmas for us. What did you end up doing? -Judy
@@FindingGinaMarie hi Judy! I’m such a fan of your videos 🤩. Luckily his art was on small postcard size paper. So I was able to purchase from him a beautiful rendering of my name in Arabic. I think that’s why I stopped in, I was interested in finding only small craft items. While staying on a strict budget, I do think it’s possible to occasionally pick up easily packed low-cost crafts from local craftspeople, to meet them and connect as you said, and then maybe keep one memory shoebox to deposit things back home. Or if it’s a pair of earrings or a bracelet it can go with you. Cheers and happy travels 😊
Thank you so much for letting us know our videos are resonating with you. Truly, you have no idea how much it means to us to hear it! That's a nice, small souvenir. We have no "home" to drop things back at, but that's not to say that a visit home can't include these little trinkets for friends and family if the pile is small enough. Great idea! ♥️ -Judy
Good video! It’s an interesting balance, isn’t it?; seeing the sights versus having personal interactions. Slow travel should allow both. Neither of you seem like introverts to me, but I’m sure that I am. As a result, I’ve developed my journaling and sketching while traveling, but I’ve come to realize that the local connections are what make for the best experiences and memories. A quick anecdote: Many years ago, I was friends with an Indian couple here in Minneapolis. When they learned that I was planning a trip to India, the wife arranged for me to stay on her family’s coffee estate in Karnataka. I was there several days, enjoying local and regional visits to the sights and with other relatives (and having some of the best coffee ever!). Would have gone there otherwise? Absolutely not. Do I treasure the memory of that visit? Absolutely and always.
Hi Scott, We'd say we are introverted extroverts. We both really enjoy people, but we need our down time where we are shut away from the world. It's not fun, but it sounds like you can relate a bit. We love hearing your cherished memory. That took a lot of courage for you to do, and it's the kind of offer we'd probably feel guilty or out of our depth to accept. But as you say, it's saying yes to those opportunities that great rich and meaningful connections. We are working on it and trying to say yes when opportunities come up, but they are outside of our comfort zone! Thank you so much for sharing! -Judy
As always, a fantastic video with great insights into slow travel! LOVED all of your aha moments! We, especially my husband, likes to go where the locals live. Wherever we are, he’ll hire a cab for the day and we end up being friends!!! When you show someone from another country that you are truly interested in their way of life, you are complimenting them on their culture. Sometimes it has gotten me a little too much out of my comfort zone - but we have always come out with a friend or two or a family that appreciates that “outsiders” actually visited and showed interest. We love meeting people and I’m never shy about starting conversations. Thank you for sharing.
Thank you so much for watching and for sharing your experiences, Maria! How brave you both are! There are circumstances where it's easier for me to initiate conversations, but it's hard to accept help like this! We are trying and impressed by you both! -Judy
It's easier to meet locals as a solo traveler. I've been to 42 countries and have been invited to home and family gatherings in many countries. I remember those interactions more than the major sites. I find it's easier to connect in smaller places.
Hi Eva, Congratulations to you on your world travel! We love big cities, but we are finding smaller places suiting us more these days. We've been seeking out the cultural places over modern cities. So have you brought a gift to those gatherings or how have you interacted? This is something we really struggle with! -Judy
@@FindingGinaMarie I never brought a gift because usually the invitations are very impromptu.
That actually makes sense. I can appreciate that is the more common experience. -Judy
Hello. My simple epiphany today is that you will write and publish a book some day 🙂.
In some local cultures ("off the beaten path"), your visit and interesting conversation is probably a form of a gift, but I would consider bringing a physical gift of some sort. This makes it more difficult, because you would need to know the *local* customs. Also, the post-visit thank you customs may differ.
Happy discoveries and stay safe.
Because we have no home, we don't have anything to bring unless we buy something local, which probably feels less special than if we brought a gift from the US. It's a good suggestion for people who travel a few months at a time and can bring an extra bag of special items for this purpose. We love the idea of writing a book, but for now we are documenting our lives through our videos. That's not to say it won't ever happen though! Thank you so much for your suggestion! We'll take some time to see how we can modify the idea based on our circumstances. -Judy
@@FindingGinaMarie , Judy I did not have American gift in mind, but I understand your point. I think, expectations also differ depending if you live locally or just "passing by." They also differ depending on the age (generation) of the people. Nothing is simple.
I did not suggest writing a book because you are traveling (many people do). It was because of your personal qualities and your "clarity of thought."
You are very kind, Michael! Thank you very much! Your suggestion is worth some thought. We'll have to figure out how we can implement some of your ideas. And you're right. None of it is simple, but it's comforting to see that it's not just us who see it that way! -Judy
My wife and I are the exact same and we've concluded people are people, we appreciate them when we are able and we appreciate ourselves. Those thoughts will drive us crazy and we need to take it as it goes. We're retired in our 20s so we're trying to learn as quickly as possible
Thanks for watching, and for your comment, Frank. We wish we had traveled more extensively in our younger years and had different priorities. We're trying to make up for it now, though! It's a joy to have more local experiences when we can find them, so good for you to be looking for those opportunities now! -Judy
@FindingGinaMarie we all have our own journeys, don't be so hard on yourselves you guys appear to be great people. The fact that we're trying to discover Human Connections says a lot, keep going and I'll keep watching❤️🙏
Hi. Many years ago I traveled around Europe by car. I visited a few major cities and then realised I preferred the smaller towns, villages and the countryside. To me cites are much the same, yes there are different and unique sites to each city, but they were pretty much, the same. Like groundhog day! I needed the variety and found it easier to meet people in smaller places too. I found that by getting off the beaten track I could still find interesting things to do and see. I love your channel.
❤Zeljka
Thank you so much for sharing this, Zeljka, and for watching! We are finding this to be true for ourselves as well. At one time we absolutely loved big cities, but we're finding that more historical, small, cultural places are resonating more with us, too. ♥️ -Judy
Wow! A lot to unpack here, but a few thoughts...
While P2 is retired, I am still working, which limits how much time we can take for any trip, which is often 14-17 days, but I like to think that we would consider ourselves travelers and explorers, not tourists. The latter is fine, and we definitely schedule time to visit the major attractions in every city. However, we are often self-guided and avoid large organized tours, with a few exceptions, such as city bike tours. This was the perfect way to get our bearings in places like Montreal and Krakow, and the Frauline Maria tour in Salzburg gave P2 her chance to be one with the Von Trapp children.
We also book 70-80% of our international travel in Airbnbs for many of the reasons you share. These are often outside the central business district (CBD) and encourage us to meet people and try different restaurants in Krakow, Istanbul, Prague, Salzburg, Venice, Tuscany (Pienza), Bologna, and later this year in Dublin. They also often require us to walk more and/or use public transit, which allows us to see local restaurants and coffee shops. The Airbnb in Istanbul was also a short walk to one of the city's oldest hammams and you have not lived until you get massaged and scrubbed by a large Turkish man and doused with ice-cold water. Would I do that again? In a heartbeat, especially because the price was less than $20 vs. $200+ at a 'spa,' but also because it was so authentic. I might, however, learn a few Turkish phrases next time, like "that is painful". Speaking of languages, simply learning a handful of words like "thank you" can be invaluable.
The Bologna food tour was a small group but intimate enough with a fantastic guide and exposed us to incredible cheese, balsamic vinegar, and pasta. We ended up with a private cooking class at an agriturismo in Tuscany with an amazing mother-daughter pair, and we look forward to making paella in Spain in a few weeks.
Last I think it is interesting that you mention being introverts. I am a strong 'I' INTJ and P2 is a very strong 'E', but when we travel I am much more open to conversations and meeting new people. At home, however, the perfect size group for me is 4 or less 🙂.
Quick add...several years ago, I worked for a company based outside of Antwerp and was fortunate to have multiple 2-3 week trips there, which allowed me to get to know many of the employees. Being invited to their homes for dinner or to one of their children's school plays made me feel like less of a stranger, especially since going back to my hotel room every night often consisted of watching US television shows in Dutch.
Wow, thank you so much, Tim, for this great peek into your travel experiences. We're both introverted extroverts, so we do enjoy being around people, but then we need to seriously decompress afterwards. I'm not so sure if Kevin would agree with the "you have not lived until you get massaged..."!!! We like many of your activities, which are authentic but wouldn't be so outside of our comfort zone (and in some manner are things similar to things that we have done or been comfortable doing). Kevin was invited to a colleague's home a few times when he did business in Ukraine many years ago, but it was initially awkward because he didn't know what to expect initially and felt like he was impositioning them-apparently it was his colleague's mother's birthday, and he felt guilty about all the food that she put out. But he worked through it and it made for a very meaningful experience. I think we just need to push ourselves. We're open to conversations with new people and even initiating them, but taking them beyond that point is where it gets intimidating! Thanks again; I think this will be helpful to others as well! -Judy
I absolutely love this video and you guys are both so precious. I just left Italy and traveled around to quite a few cities and now I’m heading about 3/4 of Europe. I feel every bit of this video and I totally get what you guys are saying. Best of luck to you and I really hope I get to meet you guys someday.
Thank you so much, BW. Your comment and insights mean a lot to us! We'll be in several cities in Italy this year as well as France, and Albania. Not sure what your schedule looks like, but we'd love to meet up if schedules line up. -Judy
We are full-time travelers, also. This winter has been our first time through Southeast Asia and the culture shock is real! We have enjoyed interacting with locals, but meetups with other nomads has been an absolute live saver for us. Those long conversations about all the issues we full-time travelers encounter has helped us process our experiences and allowed us to feel connected. It’s such a joy to find ourselves again in the same place as our nomad friends! We hope to cross paths with you someday-we’re always up for a coffee and conversation!
Hi Lisa, We've enjoyed the warm winter, but it is crazy how we keeping losing track of what month we are in! Sometimes it feels like it should be summer, but the calendar says otherwise. We'd love to know if there are topics you think we should cover in a future episode. We're currently in Taipei and then we're heading to South Korea for a month before heading to Europe. Any chance you'll be nearby? We'd love a meetup! -Judy
@@FindingGinaMarie We're in Japan now (thanks for those videos -- so helpful!) Looks like we'll miss each other -- we'll be in Canada for the summer, then Europe in the fall.
Bummer. We'll be back in Europe in the fall, but it will be to Albania and then on the island of Sardinia. Keep us posted. We'd love it if it could work out at some point. -Judy
How do you connect with other full time travelers?
@@markreid7 Hi Mark, We probably don't do enough of it, but we meet people on tours and try to keep in touch afterwards while we're still in the same city but also when we then are able to travel to their hometowns (they're not always full-time travelers, but having friends in various cities is equally nice). We are also always willing to try to meet up with our viewers. We've also become friends with tour guides and our Airbnb hosts and have met up with them personally as well. Some people arrange meetups through Facebook groups that are local to the area they're visiting, but that's not something we've done. -Judy
Absolutely love your travel epiphany! We have been traveling for 11 months and I just came to the same realization. We are getting tired of the tourist sights and just craving more local experiences/connections which as you said aren't always as easy to find.
Thank you for sharing your insights, Elly, and for watching! You got there a lot faster than us! Have you come up with ideas about how to implement this? We are open to any and all ideas! We have a few, but we're still working on it! -Judy
@@FindingGinaMarie Hi Judy! We just came to this realization over the last 2 days in Hoi An! So we haven't had much time to brainstorm yet. Open to ideas :) In Malaysia, we probably had some of our most local experiences. Our kids joined a local soccer team, we went to some local events where we were the only foreigners. Our host was wonderful and took us out to show us the city, where he went to school and hung out as a child, tried his favorite local dishes. We also found it very easy there for our kids to make friends with the local kids since everyone speaks English, so it just felt like home in many ways. In Egypt, our kids went to a cultural school where they embraced some of the local traditions and customs. Like you we sometimes find it tough to tell the difference if a person is being kind or wants to sell us something, but we will try to be more open to the locals, like to create more of these meaningful relationships.
Sounds like you are doing all the right things. And it's cool that you've been in places long enough to be able to immerse your kids. We typically stay a month and only longer in a few instances. Forty-two days in Japan was the longest, and that was because our daughter decided to join us for a week or so. TH-cam does tend to have us holed up for some time each week while we're editing and scripting videos and writing blog posts and answering comments, which I'm sure you also have to juggle. So it can be hard to then be outside of our comfort zone when we finally do get out, but we are trying to work on it! -Judy
With the caveat that I’ve done no traveling :), I would feel uncomfortable imposing as you mention. Thinking about it, I’d be wanting to find a way to give back. Maybe the local connection could happen by helping local people with whatever they’re doing? Or maybe looking for local organizations run by local people helping each other and their community that are doing things I can help with? Seems like a nice way to get to know people while helping their efforts for their families and/or their community.
Your suggestion is a good one and one that we've recently been thinking about. We'll see how these opportunities unfold, but they take meaningful effort. We're up for it because we are looking for meaningful connections. We just aren't sure if that's how locals want us to give back, especially in lower income countries, where they may be focused on their own families. -Judy
We love seeing all the iconic sites, but the things we remember the most are our interactions with other people. Next February, we are spending a month in Florence. We are so excited for our extended stay there, and hope that we will make a few friends along the way. There is just no substitute for travel in terms of learning and growth!
Lucky you, Linda! We hope you have an amazing time in Florence! We have learned more about history through our travels than all our schooling! It's been so enlightening to see how food and architecture overlap from country to country. And it's surprised us to see Roman influences in much of our travels, too! Thank you so much for watching and for this comment. -Judy
You've graduated from being tourists to being actual travelers when you start to prioritize connection over notching up highlights..
Thanks for watching, Eva. It may not be the way everyone wants to travel, but it definitely makes us happier and makes our travel feel a bit more meaningful. We appreciate your comment! -Judy
Really enjoyed your video, made me realize that the most memorable part of my travel was in fact the people who shared with me their lives. Thank you.
Thanks, Barry, for sharing your perspective with us and for watching. I think we knew this on a heart level, but it hit home when we realized that we needed to matter to the people around us or to be seen in some meaningful way. As full-time travelers, it's easy to be invisible. -Judy
What a great video. 👍
We love architecture, history, and food. Now combine these with those personal connections and places come alive and memories become so enriched.
Thanks for sharing 👍
Do you find you need more time to adjust to being back in the States? Or is it more like it's nice to be back but you tend to be ready sooner to get back to "normal life" of slow traveling? 🤔
We share the same interests! We have family spread out in the US, but we typically make three stops for about a week apiece. This year we'll be spending a brief amount of time with my brother as well and a trip to celebrate my birth mother's birthday. For as much as we love seeing family and a ton of our friends, time in the US is hectic and stressful. Time in the US is also our most expensive time, so it's hard to slow down while we're there. We need to rent a car for the bulk of it as well and driving as much as we need to also is not fun. Eating out is more expensive, too. Everyone we see wants to go to nice restaurants and we offer to pay at least half of the time. What we spend for a hotel for a week in San Francisco can get us more than a month in other countries. We're also going to try our best to figure out a way to stay ahead of our video production schedule since there is no way we can accomplish what we need to AND release videos while we're in the US. So yes, we can't wait to get back on the road and slow down. But keeping our important relationships alive is critical. -Judy
@@FindingGinaMarie Very well put with the importance of nurturing those relationships. 👍
Thanks again for sharing your journey with us 😊
We are glad to have you join us! -Judy
What an insightful video! I love watching the evolution of your perspective! I crave connecting to locals when I travel, it’s been difficult though because we travel only a few times a year and when we go somewhere we are only there for a brief time. I am hoping that will change moving forward and we are making that effort. Travel is not just about seeing places, it is connecting to the culture and the people visited that makes travel so incredibly rewarding. Travel when done correctly is the greatest ambassador of peace.
We completely agree, Rebecca! We had a lot of hesitations for many reasons about visiting Southeast Asia. We weren't sure what to expect and we thought we'd be very outside our comfort zone. Instead, we found some of the warmest, kindest people, and we are so grateful that we are traveling this way because we're not sure if we would have gotten here otherwise. The world does seem a lot smaller and people aren't so different when you get to live in different countries for even the short time that we stay. Thank you so much for watching. We know you have a LOT on your plate right now! -Judy
@@FindingGinaMarie I always make time for y’all no matter my schedule! 🥰
You are SO sweet, Rebecca! -Judy
😍😍😍
Thank you so much for watching! We hope this conversation resonated with you, too! -Judy
love all your local connections! ☕ Do you have a video just about with visas? Is it easier for you both to get tourist visa off the plane or prefer getting prior online when able? What is the percentage you feel you are using for cash/ currency vs card with the SEAsian countries? Wondering if you ever feel overwhelmed with the new currency each time you visit somewhere new?
Lovely ☺️ that song was to hear! How kind the family was to invite you both into their home!!!🏡
Hi Carolann, Thank you so much for your comment! We don't have a video about visas because they are constantly changing. Do you have specific questions you'd like to know? It may make sense to put together something in a broad manner if that might be helpful. For the most part, if we can get an e-visa from the country's government website, that's our preference. We didn't do that in Egypt because we couldn't trust that we had the government site and when we were looking at other visa companies, the add-on fees were outrageously expensive. Those companies do put a lot of fear into you! A few tips: if the online portal allows you to, request a visa that is for the full allowance of time that you're granted (e.g., 30 days), even if you're only staying two weeks. We had an issue that we'll talk about in a future video where I was one day short on my visa in Vietnam and it created a whole host of issues and wasted time to resolve. The other tip is to give yourself plenty of time (a full month or six weeks in advance if possible) to have the visa come through and when it does, quadruple check it to ensure all the details are correct. People will tell you to do this, you'll know to do this, but JUST DO IT!
Cash/Credit: It definitely depends on the country what percentage of time credit is accepted. We were surprised at how many places in a modern country like Japan didn't take credit cards. Even places that take credit cards will have problems with their readers not working, so we'd always suggest that you have cash on hand. Our Airbnb in Hoi An was going to take our card for the driver to the airport, but at the last minute, their card reader didn't work. We had a reason to need cash at the airport, and had to go to two machines before finding an ATM that worked, so don't shortchange yourself.
We don't really feel overwhelmed by currency changes, but we do have to remember where we are! We had an occasion that we forgot what currency we were dealing with and we gave a $100 USD tip to a bike tour guide. It wasn't *that* good of a tour, but we mentally converted our money based on the previous city we were in. Most of the time we've found locals very helpful with money, but you do need to make sure you don't allow them to take cash out of your hand as a way to "help" or you could find that you've been scammed. We couldn't function without a currency app on our phone, though. They are a lifesaver to help you adjust and get the hang of how the money translates to your home currency.
Hope this helps! -Judy
This was amazing advice! 🎉 Thank you for taking the time to go over this. Do you do any of the virtual mail services or just have someone collect mail for you here in the United States? We have seen many people discuss the virtual addresses or mail scanning companies.
@@owlscoffeecats We discuss it briefly in our Q&A video, which I'll link below, but we use Traveling Mailbox. We have been thrilled by how well it has worked for us. We think it's a huge burden to put on someone to pick up and manage mail. Because I am working on my dual citizenship, I do not want to potentially lose mail because it dropped off the radar of a family or friend. This service sends a notification with a preview of the envelope when we receive mail. We can have the service open and scan it, forward it somewhere, deposit a check, shred, return it, or mark it as junk mail. We pay $150 per year, and that gives us two months free.
📩Traveling Mailbox (Mail forwarding service to wherever we travel): travelingmailbox.com/?ref=1375
Our first Q&A video!: 🎥 th-cam.com/video/E6L8Wh_zMc8/w-d-xo.html (Traveling Mailbox is the last topic of the video)
Have you guys ever considered couch surfing? Sounds like you would enjoy that local experience
Hi Carolina, couch surfing seems terrifying to us. It's in the same bucket as sharing a room in someone's home using Airbnb. If we're missing something, please let us know. We don't want to imposition anyone and we don't want to move around very much. It seems very challenging to some of our introverted tendencies. We'd consider ourselves extroverted introverts and need time away from people to recharge our batteries. Couch surfing doesn't seem like it allows for that, but maybe we need to know more. Thanks for watching! -Judy
Sorry! I posted that comment before you discussed your introversion. Actually, couch surfing would probably be worse than renting a room, being a full on day or two of conversation, touring and eating with your host(s).
@@carolinacadabra8278 I can see that it would be fun if the idea didn't sound so stressful to us! Thanks for the additional insights! -Judy