@@somethingfluffy8674 Oh, Antinous is the name of one of the suitors of Odysseus’ wife Peneople during the Odyssey. One of the major ringleaders of the suitors, Antinous was the most vicious and outright demanding of Penelope’s hand. Him and the rest of the suitors who followed him were so dangerous to Odysseus, the only way he could safely return to Ithaca and not be killed on-sight was if he disguised himself as a beggar and use sabotage to ultimately defeat the suitors and reclaim his throne. In this musical, he’s portrayed as brutish as his Homeric poem version, if not WORSE, because here he’s not just willing to brutally murder Telemachus, but he also wants to have his way with Penelope and force himself on the throne. In another song, when Telemachus makes the mistake of standing up to him, Antinous uses it to mock the prince, beat him up, and nearly kills him in front of the entire entourage of suitors, if not the entire court of Ithaca. Not exactly a nice thing to do, especially to your stepson, but Telemachus represents a potential succession crisis should he come of age to rule, and Antinous and the rest of the suitors don’t want that, so the suitors wanting to kill Telemachus (and Odysseus and Telemachus ultimately having a father-son killing spree on the suitors) fits into the play’s theme of “ruthlessness is mercy upon ourselves”. Yes, Poseidon is justifiably Odysseus’ main enemy through the overall story. However, Antinous is the main enemy who awaits him back home, because the psycho wants him and his son dead so he can rule Ithaca.
@@WriterKing92 hey so I'm just getting into this story. You seem like you know a lot about this. If Penelope is married, why are there suitors to come take her hand? Did something happen to Odysseus
The whole point of Epic is Odysseus learning to embrace ruthlessness in order to get home and protect his family and people. It would lose a lot of its impact and meaning if he didn't "work the knife" a bit to make the story dark.
Love how he actually kind of exposes his intentions accidentally by saying "Only the ocean and I will know". That's impossible since the other suitors are supposed to be the ones holding telemachus while he kills him. Unless of course he is planning to get rid of them later one by one.
Hearing this, yeah. I totally TOTALLY understand why Odyessus goes ABSOLUTELY feral and merciless with his attack. Because the suitors were going to be just as merciless with his family.
“Hold him down while I slowly break his pride, his trust, his faith and his bones” I genuinely don’t know what’s more horrifying: that or Antinous’s plans for Penelope
Definitely Penelope imo , because when you die, that’s it, you’re dead. But being raped and kept alive means you have to live with that trauma for the rest of your life.
I was like ha Odysseus is gonna fu*k this dude up man should've stop worrying about another man's wife and focus on how he's gonna fight the dude whos got the godess of strategy looking out for him been fighting since day one took on a minor godess and won , chose not to kill a cyclops, disrespected tf out of poseidon , stayed loyal while a whole ass godess begged him for love dude is a warrior of the mind good luck thinking some dudes who can't even string a bow are going to take him out. (Yes I know he thinks Odysseus is dead but surely you would still prepare incase that happens lol to be fair the idea of taking over did just now come to him😂)
Imagine if the plot to kill Telemachus and Get In The Water happened at the same time. Like, Odysseus is pleading with Poseidon, then he hears Telemachus scream and the two put their entire conversation on hold because as far as Poseidon is concerned, his favorite piece of leverage is in danger so he rocks the ship until Odysseus gets there and kills the suitors, then before father and son can properly reunite Poseidon tells him to jump in the water or he'll end his son here and now. Then Telemachus experiences the horror of realizing that his father has finally come home only for the sea god to rip him away before they could really do anything.
I haven't read the Odyssey yet so I thought Odysseus and Telemachus all slaughtering all the suitors was a bit of an overreaction, but yeah. I definitely get it now.
@@connortobin3775 I mean, it didn't start as bad, but the suitors did get bolder and more insistent as the years went on. Penelope spent her years buying time, first stating she wasn't ready to admit Odysseus was dead, then saying that she did but needed time to grieve and go through funerary rites (including I think weaving a gunerary shroud for Odysseus that she secretly unwove each night to draw the process out), all the while having to host and feed the suitors due to customs of hospitality (some of them brought gifts of food, livestock, etc to jockey for her hand, but those don't last long when you need to feed over 100 men daily). By the time Odysseus gets back, they are basically devouring the yearly harvest and the the palace is in shambles from their constant use and not enough servants to keep the place running. And of course, at least in the movie adaptation, there was a plot to kill Telemachus in 'self-defense', basically humilate him in a sparring match, then have one of the suitors slip him a knife so when he gets angry and attacks his opponent, the opponent can disarm and kill him and say he did it in the moment, with Telemachus being at fault for bringing a lethal weapon to a spar.
DamN YES, THE LAST PART (well here the first) is really what sets the suitors as real monsters, like damn, they were a treath to Telemachus, Ithaca BUT IT'S STILL NOT ENOUGH???? that's a good chracter building, must be a damn pain to sing though :")
“only the ocean and i will know” yeah- look i know poseidon hates his ass but it is still his son, something both of them have in common; they’ll beat yer ass
Jeez… in that case, Athena has to step in to help Odysseus and even then I don’t know how it will end because Poseidon probably is more powerful than Athena. However, Athena is the goddess of strategy so I don’t know it can go either way, but it will end up being messy. And not with the positive outcome kind of messy where odysseus otters the suitors, but it can go either way, depending on how each of the deity acts
@@PercysADHD_KloeyMatthews Some people are easily sent into trauma reactions, the things we find commonplace may set them off. Sort of how like some people have genuine breakdowns upon seeing a spider, while me and you don't have that specific response, it's just that taken to a darker level since some of the people having the trauma response to this song are probably abuse victims.
@@MammalianCreature I've seen a grown @ss d*** and I'm 13. Also, I have EXTREME arachnophobia lmao (tiny spiders are the worst). But anyway, I think it's just because I'm obsessed with giving my OCs trauma from SA that I don't care anymore.
I think it’s not on the good order. Like the first part with the SA is obviously at the end of the song. Regardless thanks for the edit it’s so great to hear them together ! It’s already one of my favourite song of the musical, such a « good » vilain song. The suitors are asshole but their song is a banger ! So thank you
I suppose this about stringing the bow is another song, it starts like an a new song, right after Penelope talking about stringing the bow. Was Telemachus at home then? He is obvously not during the third song, so it cant happen in any order. But also "hold us down" sounds like it is reprise, since it is "hold us down" and probably original is hold someone else down...
@@fiedyasolyetov5763nono, this is song 37/40, and song 36 is about the challenge Penelope arranges, they had to string Odysseus bow and shoot cleanly through twelve axes (a feat only he can do) and because they're unable to do that they turn to force. from what we now till now there's no "this song (reprise)", there are moments that work like a reprise, but not whole songs
Its amazing how well jay captures emotion and how you can really picture the scene while listening to the songs,i can wait to be blasting these songs when they come out
Odysseus did things somewhat similar during the IlIad, like when they took the youngest son of the King of Troy and kill him throwing him stones before the gates
Herd mentality is a heck of a thing. Get enough angry and upset people together and point them at something to vent their frustration on, and most will go with it, if only because speaking against it may risk the speaker becoming the new target of aggression.
I think the second clip goes first, as it makes sense, then the third, and then the first. IDK, it makes more sense in my opinion, cause it reinforces the (insert thing) "hold 'em down", then repeat, and then so on. Again, this is *my* opinion, if you think otherwise, give me your reasons, lmao (this song is SO fucking good man, I LOVE IT)
@@BlazinIceLionTriggers tend to be based on things you've actually been through (not always hence the gore warning but generally) and SA tends to be one of the biggest ones that gets peopke sadly
Why do i always find the villains incredibly attractive? Is that a red flag ? This song is an absolute masterpiece and headbanger. I can’t wait to see this on stage 🥵
Can we talk about how good a voice actor Jorge is, like I know in the end he didn't end up keeping the role of Antonius, and he just sung it so that people know the song to audition with. But the fact of the matter is he manages to sound pretty much nothing like Odysseus or Poseidon, both characters he plays, as he sings it.
Me listening to king: why is Odysseus suddenly so brutal
Me listening to this: ooohhh
yup!
Lol missed a song 😂
I know he was always a villain, but Epic really makes Antinous really come across as a monstrous character.
Sorry but could you tell me who Antinous is? 😅🙏🏽
@@somethingfluffy8674 Oh, Antinous is the name of one of the suitors of Odysseus’ wife Peneople during the Odyssey. One of the major ringleaders of the suitors, Antinous was the most vicious and outright demanding of Penelope’s hand. Him and the rest of the suitors who followed him were so dangerous to Odysseus, the only way he could safely return to Ithaca and not be killed on-sight was if he disguised himself as a beggar and use sabotage to ultimately defeat the suitors and reclaim his throne.
In this musical, he’s portrayed as brutish as his Homeric poem version, if not WORSE, because here he’s not just willing to brutally murder Telemachus, but he also wants to have his way with Penelope and force himself on the throne. In another song, when Telemachus makes the mistake of standing up to him, Antinous uses it to mock the prince, beat him up, and nearly kills him in front of the entire entourage of suitors, if not the entire court of Ithaca. Not exactly a nice thing to do, especially to your stepson, but Telemachus represents a potential succession crisis should he come of age to rule, and Antinous and the rest of the suitors don’t want that, so the suitors wanting to kill Telemachus (and Odysseus and Telemachus ultimately having a father-son killing spree on the suitors) fits into the play’s theme of “ruthlessness is mercy upon ourselves”.
Yes, Poseidon is justifiably Odysseus’ main enemy through the overall story. However, Antinous is the main enemy who awaits him back home, because the psycho wants him and his son dead so he can rule Ithaca.
Jesus, thank you for explaining in so much detail❤️
@@somethingfluffy8674 You’re welcome!
@@WriterKing92 hey so I'm just getting into this story. You seem like you know a lot about this. If Penelope is married, why are there suitors to come take her hand? Did something happen to Odysseus
I respect that he isn't shying away from the darker aspects of the story.
The whole point of Epic is Odysseus learning to embrace ruthlessness in order to get home and protect his family and people. It would lose a lot of its impact and meaning if he didn't "work the knife" a bit to make the story dark.
@@treynienhuser2616 Very well said.
Except SA I think. As Circe didn’t have that part.
@@ked49Circe and Calypso
I am the monster rawr rawr rawr
Love how he actually kind of exposes his intentions accidentally by saying "Only the ocean and I will know".
That's impossible since the other suitors are supposed to be the ones holding telemachus while he kills him. Unless of course he is planning to get rid of them later one by one.
That is exactly what I also thought
He wants the throne for himself. Of course he’d take them down.
I DIDNT THINK OF THAT OMFG
Hearing this, yeah. I totally TOTALLY understand why Odyessus goes ABSOLUTELY feral and merciless with his attack. Because the suitors were going to be just as merciless with his family.
Ruthlessness is mercy upon ourselves after all.
and NO ONE messes with HIS family
Ya
“Hold him down while I slowly break his pride, his trust, his faith and his bones”
I genuinely don’t know what’s more horrifying: that or Antinous’s plans for Penelope
The most terrifying part is there is no remorse in his voice
Definitely Penelope imo , because when you die, that’s it, you’re dead. But being raped and kept alive means you have to live with that trauma for the rest of your life.
The gate line made my jaw drop
Fr tho really gives an idea of what’s happening >_>
I was like ha Odysseus is gonna fu*k this dude up man should've stop worrying about another man's wife and focus on how he's gonna fight the dude whos got the godess of strategy looking out for him been fighting since day one took on a minor godess and won , chose not to kill a cyclops, disrespected tf out of poseidon , stayed loyal while a whole ass godess begged him for love dude is a warrior of the mind good luck thinking some dudes who can't even string a bow are going to take him out. (Yes I know he thinks Odysseus is dead but surely you would still prepare incase that happens lol to be fair the idea of taking over did just now come to him😂)
@@kaidenking9994ok yeah but that wasn't a normal bow, NO man in Ithaca was able to string that bow. He can string a bow just not THAT one
Imagine if the plot to kill Telemachus and Get In The Water happened at the same time. Like, Odysseus is pleading with Poseidon, then he hears Telemachus scream and the two put their entire conversation on hold because as far as Poseidon is concerned, his favorite piece of leverage is in danger so he rocks the ship until Odysseus gets there and kills the suitors, then before father and son can properly reunite Poseidon tells him to jump in the water or he'll end his son here and now. Then Telemachus experiences the horror of realizing that his father has finally come home only for the sea god to rip him away before they could really do anything.
I love this idea so much
This would be such a cool idea for an AU or smth!
bro i thought odysseus was killing the suitors because he was losing it but ykw i think he’s so right for slaughtering them like animals now lol
Yeah like I would too if I was skilled enough!!
Y'all really never knew anything of the og story huh
I DIDNT REALIZE THE LYRICS FOR THE PENELOPE PART OH GOD-
This song is a vibe but that first part, yikes
That's the point. It's supposed to be "yikes"
@@Rooiku yea fair, I just had heard it before but didn’t really know of the lyrics/it didn’t click in my head before then
@@jokesterrzerotheclown3199 it got dark quick
I love it because it also doubles as sounding cannibalistic
I mean, there's SO much r@pe in greek mythology in general, so not making it tamer so as to be closer to the original story is pretty neat I guess.
Hey I see you rise fan
@@emmaturtle19 Uh oh. Uuuh, portal chop?
I haven't read the Odyssey yet so I thought Odysseus and Telemachus all slaughtering all the suitors was a bit of an overreaction, but yeah. I definitely get it now.
And don't forget: it was over 10 *years* of this.
@@connortobin3775 I mean, it didn't start as bad, but the suitors did get bolder and more insistent as the years went on. Penelope spent her years buying time, first stating she wasn't ready to admit Odysseus was dead, then saying that she did but needed time to grieve and go through funerary rites (including I think weaving a gunerary shroud for Odysseus that she secretly unwove each night to draw the process out), all the while having to host and feed the suitors due to customs of hospitality (some of them brought gifts of food, livestock, etc to jockey for her hand, but those don't last long when you need to feed over 100 men daily). By the time Odysseus gets back, they are basically devouring the yearly harvest and the the palace is in shambles from their constant use and not enough servants to keep the place running.
And of course, at least in the movie adaptation, there was a plot to kill Telemachus in 'self-defense', basically humilate him in a sparring match, then have one of the suitors slip him a knife so when he gets angry and attacks his opponent, the opponent can disarm and kill him and say he did it in the moment, with Telemachus being at fault for bringing a lethal weapon to a spar.
Fan fuct: one of Odysseus men who was eatn from Polyphymous, was the brother of one of Penelopes suitors!
I bet if his brother were still alive, he’d deck him in the balls for what they planned to do to his Captain’s wife.
Lmaooo what-
@@imadeanaccount2638fr tho
@@imadeanaccount2638 defo when that suitor gets too hades , hes getting a real good drop kick too the balls
DamN YES, THE LAST PART (well here the first) is really what sets the suitors as real monsters, like damn, they were a treath to Telemachus, Ithaca BUT IT'S STILL NOT ENOUGH???? that's a good chracter building, must be a damn pain to sing though :")
the suitors pee me off so much but love the vibe
Agreed, i would personally punch every single one of the suitors if i could but their songs are immaculate
@@galaxyspice5805 before the part about SA I was ok and kinda understands there anger
@@mohamedkamara7701 even before the SA part they're still assholes, they're basically incels who can't take no for an answer
Always the bear, always the bear, ALWAYS the goddamn bear
“only the ocean and i will know” yeah- look i know poseidon hates his ass but it is still his son, something both of them have in common; they’ll beat yer ass
Poseidon most likely would help Antinous on his plan, lol
Jeez… in that case, Athena has to step in to help Odysseus and even then I don’t know how it will end because Poseidon probably is more powerful than Athena. However, Athena is the goddess of strategy so I don’t know it can go either way, but it will end up being messy. And not with the positive outcome kind of messy where odysseus otters the suitors, but it can go either way, depending on how each of the deity acts
OMG "I am not letting any part go to waste" and other parts is the same melody as "I am not letting you get in my way" in Mutiny
Timestamp to skip the SA allusions: 0:32
Thank youuu
It's not even that bad lmao. Those lyrics are all metaphorical so it's not really traumatizing.
@PercysADHD_KloeyMatthews Trauma is extremely subjective. What bothers one person might not bother another person
@@PercysADHD_KloeyMatthews Some people are easily sent into trauma reactions, the things we find commonplace may set them off. Sort of how like some people have genuine breakdowns upon seeing a spider, while me and you don't have that specific response, it's just that taken to a darker level since some of the people having the trauma response to this song are probably abuse victims.
@@MammalianCreature I've seen a grown @ss d*** and I'm 13. Also, I have EXTREME arachnophobia lmao (tiny spiders are the worst). But anyway, I think it's just because I'm obsessed with giving my OCs trauma from SA that I don't care anymore.
I think it’s not on the good order. Like the first part with the SA is obviously at the end of the song.
Regardless thanks for the edit it’s so great to hear them together ! It’s already one of my favourite song of the musical, such a « good » vilain song. The suitors are asshole but their song is a banger ! So thank you
I think it’s supposed to be
Hold Us Down - >Hold Him down -> Hold Her Down -> Hold Them Down
@@thesausageman5388 I suppose it is not even one song. Probably is main song and its reprise
I suppose this about stringing the bow is another song, it starts like an a new song, right after Penelope talking about stringing the bow. Was Telemachus at home then? He is obvously not during the third song, so it cant happen in any order.
But also "hold us down" sounds like it is reprise, since it is "hold us down" and probably original is hold someone else down...
@@fiedyasolyetov5763 no, its definetly all one song, the creator just put the wrong order for some reason
@@fiedyasolyetov5763nono, this is song 37/40, and song 36 is about the challenge Penelope arranges, they had to string Odysseus bow and shoot cleanly through twelve axes (a feat only he can do) and because they're unable to do that they turn to force.
from what we now till now there's no "this song (reprise)", there are moments that work like a reprise, but not whole songs
The amount of chills this song(s) sends through my body is awesome.
I love how he gets into the fellings of the sings and also into the characters!!!
Hearing things makes me more excited to see Odysseus kill these fools
This song is so dark and good at the same time
I'm so looking forward to the whole musical to be finished in one nice big package
Whatever Odysseus does to these men, it will be nowhere near what they deserve
Its amazing how well jay captures emotion and how you can really picture the scene while listening to the songs,i can wait to be blasting these songs when they come out
Some how these songs make me hate the Suitors more when I already hated them. But I'll take it.
I really shouldn’t like this song but it’s SO FRICCIN GOOD-
you know the suitors didnt have loving mothers because they plan something this sinister
Plenty of evil people have deeply loving mothers
Odysseus did things somewhat similar during the IlIad, like when they took the youngest son of the King of Troy and kill him throwing him stones before the gates
Herd mentality is a heck of a thing. Get enough angry and upset people together and point them at something to vent their frustration on, and most will go with it, if only because speaking against it may risk the speaker becoming the new target of aggression.
I think the second clip goes first, as it makes sense, then the third, and then the first. IDK, it makes more sense in my opinion, cause it reinforces the (insert thing) "hold 'em down", then repeat, and then so on.
Again, this is *my* opinion, if you think otherwise, give me your reasons, lmao (this song is SO fucking good man, I LOVE IT)
No, you're right, I don't see why the person put it like that.
yeah its definitely in the wrong order haha
He did a great job transferring the odessy in modern times
It does not belong among dumb ass millennials who never read the story. Y'all know nothing just blindly follow this dumb tiktok retelling
Absolutely chilling!! The first one especially
Oh
OH
I love every single one except for the first one because it triggers me. I listened to this without looking at the screen so I didn’t see the warning
Oh god I’m so sorry
But not the part where telemachus comes back to the island and they torture him before killing him
@@BlazinIceLionTriggers tend to be based on things you've actually been through (not always hence the gore warning but generally) and SA tends to be one of the biggest ones that gets peopke sadly
only the ocean and I wil know. WHAT ABOUT THE OTHER SUITORS?
Damn. I thought poseidon was the biggest antagonist. This guy is WAY worse. The song does sound really cool though if you don't understand english
JAW DROPPED
Goodness gracious going through the 1st song is so hard cus its so triggering... Thanks for the compilation tho...
Why do i always find the villains incredibly attractive? Is that a red flag ? This song is an absolute masterpiece and headbanger. I can’t wait to see this on stage 🥵
Can we talk about how good a voice actor Jorge is, like I know in the end he didn't end up keeping the role of Antonius, and he just sung it so that people know the song to audition with. But the fact of the matter is he manages to sound pretty much nothing like Odysseus or Poseidon, both characters he plays, as he sings it.
ugh i swear i’m going to hate loving hold them down because dear gods the meaning is so terrible but the song sounds so GOOD
My guess, Athena comes and save Telumuecus and Penelope! (Sorry for spelling!)
Nope, she comes but rather late
I don’t get the Penelope song
@@trickshotstudio3960 Well the song here is about Sexual abuse, her song is just her talking about how she's holding out until Odysseus came home
Oh, she doesn't need to.
Brace yourself.
@@claran3616 “Create the greatest Warrior”
And in case anyone wants a wholesome version 🥲:th-cam.com/users/shortsFCffjiRrW4Q
Thanks😊
@@Budgiegirl-qu4dq Yw! 🩷❤
Clips are in the wrong order
Can't wait to see how Odsseus kills him
wrong order
It’s the wrong order TvT. The first one is the last one, and the middle one is the first one TvT
think he's redoing this one though..?
ok why did i get so scared when i heard the first part, i fr might skip this song😭😭😭
0:31
Tick tok heavy like a brick rock
Because Telemachus was already 20 years old. At that point he could fine rule by himself