This was a really fun stream that I see has ruffled some feathers. I think everyone should know that my primary point was to show how the Dead Sea Scrolls have been inappropriately marshaled by apologists, and to counteract some of that with some examples of how the Scrolls inform about the textual history of the Bible, sometimes in surprising ways. I can't wait to come back and do it again.
I've viewed your videos three times thus far, with plans to see them again. I can't say enough about how informative they are and how much I appreciate them... and you. Your teaching style is superb.
Can you do it without the hat so we can see your face? Or at least a light from below illuminating your eye area? Seeing a guest properly makes it better.
I really enjoyed the stream. I like your point in your comment regarding apologists, although I confess I don’t really ever listen to them if I can help it. I think if I had to give a reason for why apologists would avoid this material, it’s probably to avoid losing followers, and also because it is likely that a good number of the people listening to the youtube apologists are looking for someone to tell them what they want to hear.
Zecharia Sitchin knocked this out 50 years ago! The El Bibliqu covered this up like a dog with a bone. One of the scholars on the team, I think it was John Allegro outed some of these cover ups and was viciously attacked by fundamentalist orthodox scholars, both Protestant and Catholic! Now we can see what they were so afraid of.
@@labandonaldhock80Bruh wtf, he has been almost completely debunked and not himself or anyone in Camp Sitchen has levied a full response to the debunkers. It is always silence and down-turned chins.
@@therealwhitesky I come from the Brethren, which spawned the Mennonites and Amish. My father had a four year degree from Liberty University, my oldest brother spent 14 and a half years in Africa with Christian Light Bookstores, my younger brother is a retired Bishop. Because the church was full of backsliders I challenged the validity of the process of salvation, sanctification and being filled with the Holy Spirit. This lead me into the origin of the testaments. I am 74 with 55 years into this. A good friend of mine was a very good friend of Sitchin so I had lunch at Columbia University with them twice. This was before the larger library at Ninevah was dis covered. Today there are over 400 libraries unearthed with the same tablets in Akkadian language. My Bishop brother regurgitates the church position that the devil put them there to deceive us in the latter days. No one argues the language translation, except in a few words, even Sitchin changed definitions several times over the years. The He brew word Nephilim, or Nefilim, means those who came down vs those who were cast down he used originally. Christian Evangelicals have their ideas that is why they have their own schools so you do not learn anything contrary to church dogma. I have no interest in converting anyone to anything. I struggled for years after reading the Bible front to back 14 times complete. What ever you believe stick with it, I think the argument is not Sitchins translation or his deductions but whether you label all of the stone tablets, millions, mythology. If anyone looks at the physical evidence we have now, after Sitchin's death, and you still think its mythology, I cant help you. I am a huge student of all religions. The story in the tablets explain the religions better. Sitchin has been vindicated many times over by the International Rabbinical Council. I converted to Judaism to marry a Jewish girl and the getting into Jewish Mysticism, I did what all Jews do for more, went to India to Hindu. There I found a home.! Sitchin believed that Yahwey would return, I disagree with that. Whats so great is that we might live to see if Yahwey bails Israel out of their current dilemma. What people believe one way or another about the mythology or not of the stone tablets, does not really matter. Yahwey was not God.
Well said, ive studied many religions, ancient stories, theology, astrotheology, and i agree - the being called Yahwey IS a god, but is clearly not the sole Source of All , God. How could it be?
…and he displayed his wisdom to them (the other gods) by undoing death by laying his own life down and for that act reigns supreme. Faith in that f/act gives eternal life. What’s the hubbub about?
The problem with biblical history scholars is the firm believer doesn't care. This is only helpful for fence sitters and non believers who are interested in the truth.
Why is it we always hear about male gods or deities coming to Earth and sleeping with human women but we never hear about female gods or deities coming to Earth and sleeping with human men??
Aphrodite banged a few mortals, Achilles mother was a goddess but his dad was mortal, Inanna or Ishtar was trying to bed Gilgamesh who would not massage her vulva.. but some young guy deposited his seed in her as she slept lol. Orpheus was product of goddess and male mortal union too I'm sure
@@robsimpson7319 Despite everything thing that Gilgamesh had done up until that point, I can't blame him for not wanting to get involved with Inanna/Ishtar.
Virginty and monogamy were valued female traits in ancient times and plenty of time after that too. Before we rush to an ethical judgement, this may just reflect human genetic programming.
Regarding Deut 32:43, I doubt there is a conspiracy. At least 7 English translations plus the Septuagint include the reference to "gods" or "angels" "Heavens: Rejoice with God! All you gods: bow down to the Lord!" -- Deu 32:43 CEB 2011 "Tell the heavens to celebrate and all gods to bow down to the Lord," -- Deu 32:43 CEV 2011 "'Rejoice with him, O heavens; bow down to him, all gods" -- Deu 32:43 ESV 1970 "Exult with him, you heavens, glorify him, all you angels of God;" -- Deu 32:43 NAB 1970 "Rejoice, O nations, with his people, bow to him, all you gods" -- Deu 32:43 NCB 1970
"'Rejoice with him, you heavens, and let all of God's angels worship him.'" -- Deu 32:43 NLT 1996 "Praise, O heavens, his people, worship him, all you gods!" -- Deu 32:43 NRSV 1989 "Rejoice, ye heavens, with him, and let all the angels of God worship him;" -- Deu 32:43 LXX 1851 Dan
Thank you! Although I am not a practicing Christian I love to study that in which has influenced western culture in every way. I do not have an opinion upon the spiritual questions this has raised, I am all in for the historical value. From everything I have read and seen, this podcast has put some pieces of the puzzle into place. There should not be controversy, just enlightenment, and or education at the very least, as this is (I am assuming) the whole point is you all are coming from a HISTORICAL viewpoint. I would suggest that if we were 1) to put ourselves in a Babylonian / Egyptian , mind set that all kings proclaimed themselves to be Gods. They had to be in order to have ultimate power over large groups of people. I could write a paper upon how a culture can transform , simply with the beehive mentality, “believe this or burn in hell for eternity”. If it is done slowly , the Romans and Muslims are a prime example . (Or 2) we go into the Ancient Alien stuff. )In order to accurately translate one MUST try to put themselves into this mindset. This was a time when people sacrificed children, and which was a socially acceptable way to make it rain or give thanks to Ba’al .Granted I haven’t a PHD in sociology or archeology but as a recovering Christian, I applaud what you are doing . I left the religion due to the book of Job ., and blaming all of my sins upon a “devil”. Maybe in a deferent time , theologians and pastors would have treated my ligament questions about translations of words and the true spirit of Christianity , with a bit more sincerity instead of thinking the devil was trying to change my mind. Good on you guys! Clearly you do it for the love of your religion , and it seems to me you have true faith . God gave us a brain! Bravo for those that use it!
FUNDAMENTAL christianity or any religion is the issue that can be addressed with The LORD JESUS. satan is a DECEIVER and a LIAR and as someone who was associated with the occult, I can tell you, satan/the enemy will destroy someone who has no RELATIONSHIP with The LORD JESUS. How he does it and how long he allows them to be "successful" will depend on how useful they are to him. First is that THE LORD JESUS is ALIVE (the difference between the dead gods and The ONLY LIVING GOD) and that means every person can ask The LORD JESUS to prove HIMSELF to them individually and personally. I have a PERSONAL RELATIONSHIP with The LORD JESUS CHRIST and was healed of a hereditary heart condition praying in the HOLY SPIRIT in Tongues, my prayer language. Read 1Corinthians 14:2-4, Romans 8:26-27. ALL those "christian sects" who have REJECTED the infilling of THE HOLY SPIRIT with the Evidence (NOT THE GIFT) of speaking in other Tongues ARE NOT OF CHRIST. They cannot understand HIS WISDOM as they are not of HIM - HIS SPIRIT is not with their spirit. Read Romans 8:5-9. They DO NOT HAVE THE MIND of CHRIST. We are COMMANDED to Avoid those who Deny Tongues - The POWER. Read Acts 1:8, 2Timothy 3:5. This is because they DENY the ONLY REASON The LORD JESUS CAME to earth as The Eternal Sacrifice so that we can enter into HIS PLACE of being Sons of The LORD GOD with HIS Authority and Power - 1John 4:17, Hebrews 2:11. WE ARE SPIRITUALLY ALIVE with Power and Authority over the enemy who is wired to KILL STEAL DESTROY - John 10:10, Colossians 2:15, Colossians 2:9-10. The LORD JESUS never formed or endorsed any RELIGION. The christian religion which is FUNDAMENTAL CHRISTIANITY is ROOTED in and under the pagan spirit of sun god worship roman catholicism. It is ANTICHRIST worshiping gods opposed to THE LORD JESUS CHRIST. They are NOT Sons Of The LORD GOD but could be like Adam (1Corinthians 15:45, Romans 5:8-12) before he sinned UNLESS they have EXPRESSLY and KNOWINGLY denied THE REDEMPTIVE POWER OF THE LORD JESUS CHRIST - often participating in ritualism and blood sacrifices to the enemy/satan on the promise of wealth and fame.
If there was valid, even logical, evidence then there wouldn't be apologists, or contrived arguments for the existence of God. They walk around like they're speaking the truth. In my opinion a faith position needs to have more humility.
58:27....Abraham is clearly Worshiping Elyon who is YAWEH at the same time since he gave 1/10 of the offering to Melchizedek , which was mentioned in book of Hebrews... (HEBREWS 7: 1-8) "This Melchizedek was king of the city of Salem and also a priest of God Most High. When Abraham was returning home after winning a great battle against the kings, Melchizedek met him and blessed him. 2 Then Abraham took a tenth of all he had captured in battle and gave it to Melchizedek. The name Melchizedek means “king of justice,” and king of Salem means “king of peace.” 3 There is no record of his father or mother or any of his ancestors-no beginning or end to his life. He remains a priest forever, resembling the Son of God. 4 Consider then how great this Melchizedek was. Even Abraham, the great patriarch of Israel, recognized this by giving him a tenth of what he had taken in battle. 5 Now the law of Moses required that the priests, who are descendants of Levi, must collect a tithe from the rest of the people of Israel,[a] who are also descendants of Abraham. 6 But Melchizedek, who was not a descendant of Levi, collected a tenth from Abraham. And Melchizedek placed a blessing upon Abraham, the one who had already received the promises of God. 7 And without question, the person who has the power to give a blessing is greater than the one who is blessed. 8 The priests who collect tithes are men who die, so Melchizedek is greater than they are, because we are told that he lives on. 9 In addition, we might even say that these Levites-the ones who collect the tithe-paid a tithe to Melchizedek when their ancestor Abraham paid a tithe to him. 10 For although Levi wasn’t born yet, the seed from which he came was in Abraham’s body when Melchizedek collected the tithe from him."
I almost skipped this one, the title doesn't do it justice, fantastic and made me reconsider some of my own theories about Christianity because the Old Testament does indeed talk about Gods having children. Maybe "Is there evidence of Polytheism in early Old Testament texts"
The entirety of Genesis is polytheistic. Read it again but keep this in mind. After it was written it was redacted and revised at least twice. But you can still see all the references to polytheism. Look at the names of gods as well. It helps to use a concordance with the god names but it isn't required to see the variants. The translations are meant to make you think it is one way but you can still see it plain as day.
@@lyndaanneshopjust because the bible talked about other gods( which were called false gods many times)does not take away from the God of Abraham being the one true God and creator.
I looked up Tabor and Harmon as Canaanite deities yet only found their mention as mountains East and West. Any more information on their classification as deities?
Dang! I've watched this and other videos of his A LOT over the last week or two and had NO idea it was the same guy I watched about Constantine and the arch! I loved that video! He's so awesome! Thank you both for revealing TRUTH. I love y'all!
I literally discovered this channel last week and I've been listening non stop since then! I take that info and ask my catholic priest friend questions that he even has to think about.
Hah hah... ok man.... yer goin down! .... And, takin your priest friend with you! You'll be in great company though, and the world will start to look even brighter! :)
Till 325 AD, not a single historian or writer wrote about Jesus Christ or any of his disciples . The dead sea scrolls covering the period from Birth of Jesus to 68 AD , does NOT say one word about Jesus or his 12 Apostles. Hellenistic philosopher Philo Judaeus of Alexandria (20 BCE-50 AD/CE)-alive at the purported time of Jesus, and one of the wealthiest and best connected citizens of the Empire- makes no mention of Christ, Christians or Christianity in his voluminous writings. Nor do any of the hundreds of other historians and writers who flourished during the first THREE centuries of the common era. The DEAD SEA SCROLLS were all written by Pagan Essenes . None of them have been edited by later Christians, as is the case with some other Jewish literature. All the scrolls (except a treasure map known as the Copper Scroll) can be dated prior to A.D. 68 or 69, when the Qumran settlement was believed to have been destroyed by the Romans in the Jewish revolt. The oldest of the scrolls probably goes back to the middle of the third century B.C. The people of Qumran belonged to a Pagan religious group known as the Essenes. Pliny the Elder, who died during the volcanic destruction of Pompeii in the year 79 A.D., described a community of pagan Essenes living on the western shore of the Dead Sea, close to where Khirbet Qumran is situated. John the Baptist was an ascetic Essene . He was a vegan and was uncircumcised . Various literary sources like Josephus and Philo tell clearly that Essenes were ascetics. We also know, from literary testimony, the Dead Sea Scrolls, and the archaeological remains of Qumran, that the Essenes practiced many water baptisms for ritual purification-similar to a dip in the Ganges or the river Pampa or at Thiirunelli. At Qumran, however, all members of the community were baptized with water for ritual purification. Josephus writes, "And as for their piety towards God, it is very extraordinary; for before sunrising they speak not a word about profane matters, but put up certain prayers which they have received from their forefathers, as if they made a supplication for its rising" (Wars, 2.8.5). This testimony accords well with what we know from the Dead Sea Scrolls. Prayer and humility was one thing that the Essenes . When they cooked up stories about Jesus they wrote that Jesus Christ ate the Last Supper in the Essene part of town. Jesus is not historical character, The Dead Sea Scrolls have produced increasing evidence to cement the fact that Jesus Christ never existed and the whole story was cooked up at the First Council of Nicea in 325 AD. Why was the library of Alexandria burnt ? The gospel of Thomas was not written by Jesus' disciple Thomas. Englishman Godfrey Higgins studied Greek, Latin and law at Cambridge . His two-volume, 867-page book Anacalypsis: An Enquiry into the Origins of Languages, Nations, and Religions, was published posthumously in 1836. In his treatise, Higgins writes " the mythos of the Jews and the mythos of the Greeks are all at bottom the same lifted from the ancient mythos of Hindus ; and ... are contrivances under the appearance of histories to perpetuate doctrines," and that Christian editors “either from roguery or folly, corrupted them all.” 1900, Scottish MP John Mackinnon Robertson wrote that Jesus never existed but was an FAKE invention by a first-century messianic cult. He wrote about the First Council of Nicea of 325 AD where powerful forces invented a new god to fit the needs of the society of the time .Robertson specifically mentions the Talmudic story of the Yeshu . Thomas says: "Simon Peter said to them, ‘Make Mary leave us, for females don’t deserve life.’ Jesus said, ‘Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of heaven’" (Thomas 114). AIYOOOOO -even Christians don’t like this When the master of James baby Jesus Christ never existed -- how can his disciple St James exist ? Even since the dead sea scrolls have been discovered CHRISTIANS and JEWS are jumping up and down like demented orangutans claiming that Essenes belong to them. Dead Sea text or Qumran Scrolls have absolutely nothing ZILCH, to do with the Bible of the Torah - never mind the diabolical lies of the Christians and the Jews. For arguments sake -even if messiah Jesus Christ existed , the gospels were written a even a century after Jesus' estimated year of death, by individuals who never met Jesus, and then were edited or forged over the centuries by unknown scribes with their own agendas. Dead sea scrolls have been written by Essenes of the sect of Apollonius For more plz click link ..... ajitvadakayil.blogspot.com/2016/04/apollonius-or-jesus-christ-who-is-real_10.html?m=1
@@pheresy1367 No, instead, he will seek God with all of his heart and with all of his soul, and eventually, through trial and error, from testing others claims, and will eventually come to the conclusion that the Christian doctrine is indeed falsehood, fraudulent and corrupted, and that there is no trinity, and that there is no other besides HA’SHEM [God]. It just happens to be a reoccurring theme throughout the Jewish Scriptures. Those who don’t take the opportunity to seek God thoroughly in this life will utterly be ashamed and disgraced, and will need to immediately convert based on the truth being witnessed and understood. Unfortunately, the Church is the enemy of God.
@@timothya.olmeda7299 Sounds like my own journey you are describing. There is so much more... so much more. Someone once said to me: " forget about getting any answers, just keep asking better questions". Good one, thanks... :-)
No Catholic priest can speak ancient Hebrew. Christianity HAS to skip parts of the OT because of the narrative they portray about Hebrew origins and Yahweh.... I.E. these are cults on top of cults on top of much older more basic hero worship of ancestors.
Hebrews was polytheistic before monotheism was created, A lot of changes were made because the Catholic Church in Rome that put the book together was very controlling, and wanted control of everything. The responses of every creature they proclaim as "the same God" has such different responses , you can obviously tell they are not the same creature. Also Elohim is not the same yawah or jovah , in the original documents, they prove that Jesus did not rise from the dead, his body was moved before the Sabbath more than likely by his brother. I think it is bad and evil to idolize suffer and sacrifice.
Speaking of Michael Heiser, I seem to recall he was involved in the translation of the ESV which used the DSS in place of the MT when they differed. Therefore, the passages in question in Deut 32 translate to: _"When the Most High gave to the nations their inheritance, when he divided mankind, he fixed the borders of the peoples according to the number _*_of the sons of God_*_ ." -- Deu 32:8 ESV_ _"'Rejoice with him, O heavens; bow down to him, _*_all gods,_*_ for he avenges the blood of his children and takes vengeance on his adversaries. He repays those who hate him and cleanses his people's land.'" -- Deu __32:43__ ESV_ Dan
Excellent often overlooked subject. Dr. Michael Heiser explains in-depth where key passages in the Septuagint, Masoretic and DDS have significant differences which contrasts their meaning.
@@lll9409 Were they also forced to cover up the Canaanite pantheon for their Yahweh cult? Both sidestry and bs everyone into belief. Which is ironic if the truly believe in Yahweh wouldn't he be aware of the manipulation.
@Abraham Mani No, there isn't punishment coming for anyone because the book is and has been proven a fake. Although, the entire mythos was never real to begin with. My friendly ape, you are the only one who is attempting to judge others. It not a good look either.
Esoteric Christianity? Search "Fake Ass Christians" by Mark Passio. Interesting topic that would be great evidence to bring up to a Christian apologist! It takes great humility to change once belief when new evidence is presented especially if one's identity was highly invested. It's easier to be prideful and dismiss new information that goes against your preconceived beliefs. But ironically, that's pride. The same reason lucifer got kicked out of heaven. A closed mind is like a closed fist, nothing comes in and nothing goes out. Which is a pure shame because everything can be known, not just "believed"
I’m both, but most Christians don’t accept what I teach, because it goes against tradition, but then again, I tend to be able answer their questions and they can’t answer mine.
One thing I noticed while reading the apocryphal texts is that the words 'prayer' and 'angel' seem to have an extremely broad description. In the Gospel of Judas angel seems to describe both entities as well as every atom and law of physics and prayer seems to be used in reference to meditation, dreaming and deep depression.
Best thing I ever did as a Christian was buy a copy of the Nag Hammadi library, until then I was worried what could have been in it that compromised my understanding of Christianity. Having read it I no wonder worry about it but do have a profound appreciation of the dangers of Gnosticism that was beginning to take route in the early church
I'm a pagan but I study the Bible to know my enemy better than they know themselves. It's very pleasing when I convince apologists they're practicing heresy and have proof to back it up. They don't know their God nor understand their text. The ones who resist are even better. I get them to actually read the older bibles.
Well I hope you like the secular world. Or maybe you prefer a Muslim world? You prefer communism? Soon when Christianity is gone with your help we can all live out our dreams in sodom and Gomorrah.
Paulytheism .. might be a good name for a book about making things up. The lightning strike that made Paul blind for 3 days when he thought he saw jesus.
Thank you for making these videos I am heavily into discerning our origins. I always felt like grooming people to be victims plays into the agenda of psychopaths.
The dead sea scrolls covering the period from Birth of Jesus to 68 AD , does NOT say one word about Jesus or his 12 Apostles. Hellenistic philosopher Philo Judaeus of Alexandria (20 BCE-50 AD/CE)-alive at the purported time of Jesus, and one of the wealthiest and best connected citizens of the Empire- makes no mention of Christ, Christians or Christianity in his voluminous writings. Nor do any of the hundreds of other historians and writers who flourished during the first THREE centuries of the common era. The DEAD SEA SCROLLS were all written by Pagan Essenes . None of them have been edited by later Christians, as is the case with some other Jewish literature. All the scrolls (except a treasure map known as the Copper Scroll) can be dated prior to A.D. 68 or 69, when the Qumran settlement was believed to have been destroyed by the Romans in the Jewish revolt. The oldest of the scrolls probably goes back to the middle of the third century B.C. The people of Qumran belonged to a Pagan religious group known as the Essenes. Pliny the Elder, who died during the volcanic destruction of Pompeii in the year 79 A.D., described a community of pagan Essenes living on the western shore of the Dead Sea, close to where Khirbet Qumran is situated. John the Baptist was an ascetic Essene . He was a vegan and was uncircumcised . Various literary sources like Josephus and Philo tell clearly that Essenes were ascetics. We also know, from literary testimony, the Dead Sea Scrolls, and the archaeological remains of Qumran, that the Essenes practiced many water baptisms for ritual purification-similar to a dip in the Ganges or the river Pampa or at Thiirunelli. At Qumran, however, all members of the community were baptized with water for ritual purification. Josephus writes, "And as for their piety towards God, it is very extraordinary; for before sunrising they speak not a word about profane matters, but put up certain prayers which they have received from their forefathers, as if they made a supplication for its rising" (Wars, 2.8.5). This testimony accords well with what we know from the Dead Sea Scrolls. Prayer and humility was one thing that the Essenes . When they cooked up stories about Jesus they wrote that Jesus Christ ate the Last Supper in the Essene part of town. Jesus is not historical character, The Dead Sea Scrolls have produced increasing evidence to cement the fact that Jesus Christ never existed and the whole story was cooked up at the First Council of Nicea in 325 AD. The FAKE gospels were written after 325 AD after Jesus was cooked up at the first Council of Nicea.. Twelve apostles of Jesus never existed. Jesus Christ names 12 apostles to spread his gospel, and the early Christian church owes its rapid rise to their missionary zeal. Yet, for most of the Twelve, there's scant evidence of their existence outside of the New Testament. The concept of using statistics to prove that 'God authored the Bible' is bullshit. Why was the library of Alexandria burnt ? The gospel of Thomas was not written by Jesus' disciple Thomas. Englishman Godfrey Higgins studied Greek, Latin and law at Cambridge . His two-volume, 867-page book Anacalypsis: An Enquiry into the Origins of Languages, Nations, and Religions, was published posthumously in 1836. In his treatise, Higgins writes " the mythos of the Jews and the mythos of the Greeks are all at bottom the same lifted from the ancient mythos of Hindus ; and ... are contrivances under the appearance of histories to perpetuate doctrines," and that Christian editors “either from roguery or folly, corrupted them all.” 1900, Scottish MP John Mackinnon Robertson wrote that Jesus never existed but was an FAKE invention by a first-century messianic cult. He wrote about the First Council of Nicea of 325 AD where powerful forces invented a new god to fit the needs of the society of the time .Robertson specifically mentions the Talmudic story of the Yeshu . Thomas says: "Simon Peter said to them, ‘Make Mary leave us, for females don’t deserve life.’ Jesus said, ‘Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of heaven’" (Thomas 114). AIYOOOOO -even Christians don’t like this When the master of James baby Jesus Christ never existed -- how can his disciple St James exist ? Even since the dead sea scrolls have been discovered CHRISTIANS and JEWS are jumping up and down like demented orangutans claiming that Essenes belong to them. Dead Sea text or Qumran Scrolls have absolutely nothing ZILCH, to do with the Bible of the Torah - never mind the diabolical lies of the Christians and the Jews. For arguments sake -even if messiah Jesus Christ existed , the gospels were written a even a century after Jesus' estimated year of death, by individuals who never met Jesus, and then were edited or forged over the centuries by unknown scribes with their own agendas. Dead sea scrolls have been written by Essenes of the sect of Apollonius
ATTENTION!!!! JESUS CHRIST LOVES YOU!! JESUS IS COMING FOR HIS BELIEVERS AND FOLLOWERS!!! Humble yourself to repent and Put your faith in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. ACTS 2:38 “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit....
@@AmitKumar-qz2us actually that is wrong Josephus speaks about Jesus in his records and questioning his authority as a historian of that era is pretty ridiculous
I was in a debate with a Christian on line and I was quoting something from the Dead Sea scrolls and said as much his response was the Dead Sea scrolls have no validity as they have been proven to be fake …where does that even come from ? Are pastors telling people that ?
Very interesting, but I may have a slight spanner to put into the works. Whilst the KJV bears out your points about Deuteronomy I also have a copy of the New English Bible published jointly by Oxford University Press and Cambridge University Press in 1970 (Wikipedia says it has 'fallen out of favour' because it was 'of its time'. I wonder if this was the only reason!) This scholarly translation of Deuteronomy 32:43 reads: "Rejoice with him, you heavens, bow down, all you gods, before him; for he will avenge the blood of his sons and take vengeance on his adversaries; he will punish those who hate him and make expiation for his people's land". The second line in particular contradicts the argument about 'removal' of the uncomfortable phrase (in all translations)...it is still there...and were the particular DS Scroll fragments properly translated even as early as 1970? What do you/Dr Kipp make of this?
I have been an atheist since my early 20s some 50 years ago but find all sorts of research interesting be it into various religions, astronomy, archaeology, the development of languages ir whatever. The dead sea scrolls are another interesting find.
Derek I've been listening to your broadcast of your programs and I can tell you that I am just so happy that you are doing them.. These are the programs that the Christian church in general are afraid of... It's no wonder that the fundamentalist call this the mainstream..
You say that Christians downplay the divine council but there is a huge interest in this topic. Look at the work of Dr. Michael Heiser. He has become very well known in the Christian community because of his writings on exactly this topic.
Etymologically I’ve read that “blessed” is an improperly used word for the most part today, as it’s supposed proto-germanic root is “bloedsian” which is based in “blood” and when traced back is a term of ritual marking or consecrating something for sacrifice. Something made a “curse” to give way to a “blissing” which is the result of the blood dressing “blessing”. “Blissed”, in my current understanding is the more accurate way to convey “good things” to someone, rather than using “blessing” which seemingly has this connection in marking something for sacrifice.
Ikr? I valued the information in this video, but I kept wanting to scream, "Spit it out already!" And Derek (is that the host's name?) kept stalling the already slow, slow pace with tooth-grindingly irritating unfunny gags.
It's almost painful to listen to Dr Kipp apologize for his mentors. I'm beginning to understand the complexities of satisfying 3, or more, languages into anything everyone can agree on. Thank you Dr Kipp and Derek.
Till 325 AD, not a single historian or writer wrote about Jesus Christ or any of his disciples . The dead sea scrolls covering the period from Birth of Jesus to 68 AD , does NOT say one word about Jesus or his 12 Apostles. Hellenistic philosopher Philo Judaeus of Alexandria (20 BCE-50 AD/CE)-alive at the purported time of Jesus, and one of the wealthiest and best connected citizens of the Empire- makes no mention of Christ, Christians or Christianity in his voluminous writings. Nor do any of the hundreds of other historians and writers who flourished during the first THREE centuries of the common era. The DEAD SEA SCROLLS were all written by Pagan Essenes . None of them have been edited by later Christians, as is the case with some other Jewish literature. All the scrolls (except a treasure map known as the Copper Scroll) can be dated prior to A.D. 68 or 69, when the Qumran settlement was believed to have been destroyed by the Romans in the Jewish revolt. The oldest of the scrolls probably goes back to the middle of the third century B.C. The people of Qumran belonged to a Pagan religious group known as the Essenes. Pliny the Elder, who died during the volcanic destruction of Pompeii in the year 79 A.D., described a community of pagan Essenes living on the western shore of the Dead Sea, close to where Khirbet Qumran is situated. John the Baptist was an ascetic Essene . He was a vegan and was uncircumcised . Various literary sources like Josephus and Philo tell clearly that Essenes were ascetics. We also know, from literary testimony, the Dead Sea Scrolls, and the archaeological remains of Qumran, that the Essenes practiced many water baptisms for ritual purification-similar to a dip in the Ganges or the river Pampa or at Thiirunelli. At Qumran, however, all members of the community were baptized with water for ritual purification. Josephus writes, "And as for their piety towards God, it is very extraordinary; for before sunrising they speak not a word about profane matters, but put up certain prayers which they have received from their forefathers, as if they made a supplication for its rising" (Wars, 2.8.5). This testimony accords well with what we know from the Dead Sea Scrolls. Prayer and humility was one thing that the Essenes . When they cooked up stories about Jesus they wrote that Jesus Christ ate the Last Supper in the Essene part of town. Jesus is not historical character, The Dead Sea Scrolls have produced increasing evidence to cement the fact that Jesus Christ never existed and the whole story was cooked up at the First Council of Nicea in 325 AD. Why was the library of Alexandria burnt ? The gospel of Thomas was not written by Jesus' disciple Thomas. Englishman Godfrey Higgins studied Greek, Latin and law at Cambridge . His two-volume, 867-page book Anacalypsis: An Enquiry into the Origins of Languages, Nations, and Religions, was published posthumously in 1836. In his treatise, Higgins writes " the mythos of the Jews and the mythos of the Greeks are all at bottom the same lifted from the ancient mythos of Hindus ; and ... are contrivances under the appearance of histories to perpetuate doctrines," and that Christian editors “either from roguery or folly, corrupted them all.” 1900, Scottish MP John Mackinnon Robertson wrote that Jesus never existed but was an FAKE invention by a first-century messianic cult. He wrote about the First Council of Nicea of 325 AD where powerful forces invented a new god to fit the needs of the society of the time .Robertson specifically mentions the Talmudic story of the Yeshu . Thomas says: "Simon Peter said to them, ‘Make Mary leave us, for females don’t deserve life.’ Jesus said, ‘Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of heaven’" (Thomas 114). AIYOOOOO -even Christians don’t like this When the master of James baby Jesus Christ never existed -- how can his disciple St James exist ? Even since the dead sea scrolls have been discovered CHRISTIANS and JEWS are jumping up and down like demented orangutans claiming that Essenes belong to them. Dead Sea text or Qumran Scrolls have absolutely nothing ZILCH, to do with the Bible of the Torah - never mind the diabolical lies of the Christians and the Jews. For arguments sake -even if messiah Jesus Christ existed , the gospels were written a even a century after Jesus' estimated year of death, by individuals who never met Jesus, and then were edited or forged over the centuries by unknown scribes with their own agendas. Dead sea scrolls have been written by Essenes of the sect of Apollonius For more plz click link ..... ajitvadakayil.blogspot.com/2016/04/apollonius-or-jesus-christ-who-is-real_10.html?m=1
Great stream! After reading A History of God by Armstrong, I knew El & YHWH were 2 separate gods who the Canaanites later combined. I had no idea they were individually addressed in the Hebrew Bible. Does the good doctor have a gmail? I would love to ask him a few questions.
El and Jehovah are the same God. Pagans used El like people today generally use god. This guy is a deciever and there are many other scholars with better info
@@Moe-bb3bm elyon ELOHIM is the most High God. YHVH ELOHIM is the Messiah. They didn't borrow from the canaanites. The canaanites borrowed from Abraham
@@djgamingdragon969 Check out Dr Michael Heisner he is an expert at Hebrew and semetic languages. Orthodox karaite Jew Nehemiah Gordon is also a good resource on the Hebrew language. Dr. Roy B. Blizzard is another scholar on the Hebrew.
This discussion giving equal weight to Canaanite narratives against the assertions of the DSS narrative demonstrates a misunderstanding of the essenetic thesis regardless of apologetics
I've been wondering for a long time what's been discovered by Dead Sea scroll scholars, and now, at last, we have this. OK, the Psalm 22 findings are fantastically interesting. This is especially so for me because I've recently been photographing ancient rock-art in north-western Saudi Arabia which seems to illustrate the scenes described in said Psalm. I would like to pass at least two images on to Dr Kipp for consultation. I'm sure he'd find them very interesting, Can you help facilitate this, please?
@@Valhalla0404 Thanks, , but it's probably gotta be Dr Kipp because he's said the things that have prompted me into action. I have rock art with a man surrounded by dogs - Canaan dogs no less, and Dr Kipp rendered a version of Psalm 22 as such. Further more, there's a picture across the valley of a lion pouncing on a man with two Canaan dogs. Archaeologists are saying its proving climate change, no ,more. I beg to differ.
@@cabot100 You know that the Dead Sea scrolls are old testament, wrong? Anyway, I agree if you think that the Jesus story could have been made up by the Romans or someone, and the old testament prophets may have been factors of reworked older stories. You choose the verb 'know', so are you assuming I'm over 2,000 years old and was well connected at that time? I'm flattered. I know very little, but I foster some beliefs, one of which is that the dead sea scrolls are authentic ancient religious documents and are therefore interesting. Is that good enough for yer??
@@identifyspecies know (verb) \ ˈnō \ knew\ ˈnü also ˈnyü \; known\ ˈnōn \; knowing Essential Meaning of know 1: to have (information of some kind) in your mind He knows a lot about the history of the town. Do you know the answer? See More Examples 2: to understand (something) : to have a clear and complete idea of (something) I don't know much about art, but I know what I like. "How could she do that?" "How should/would I know?!" [=I don't know, and you should not expect me to know] 3: to have learned (something, such as a skill or a language) She knows karate/CPR. He knows Spanish. Full Definition of know (Entry 1 of 2) transitive verb 1a(1): to perceive directly : have direct cognition of ( 2): to have understanding of importance of knowing oneself (3): to recognize the nature of : DISCERN b(1): to recognize as being the same as something previously known (2): to be acquainted or familiar with (3): to have experience of 2a: to be aware of the truth or factuality of : be convinced or certain of b: to have a practical understanding of knows how to write 3archaic : to have sexual intercourse with intransitive verb 1: to have knowledge 2: to be or become cognizant -sometimes used interjectionally with you especially as a filler in informal speech know from : to have knowledge of didn't know from sibling rivalry - Penny Marshall know noun Definition of know (Entry 2 of 2) : KNOWLEDGE in the know : in possession of exclusive knowledge or information broadly : WELL-INFORMED I hope that helps you. At best the Abrahamic Religions are amalgamations of pre-existing belief systems, mostly mythological.
@@cabot100 Oh deary me! Am I responsible for causing you to copy and paste a bunch of irrelevant diary entries and to then post them to a random stranger? I was just saying that it's difficult or impossible for me to know the truth about old stories. However, finding authentic remains that seem to add to some of them is fun, and seeing that the Earth is decorated with ancient remains then let's find out what we can abut the past from them, young sir.
I believe I understand why Psalms 22 is important to Christians. BUT, whether the word is 'they dug/pierced' or whether it is 'like a lion', so what? The verse, in context, in no way, prophecies the crucifixion of anyone to come, never mind Jesus. Is it in dispute as to whether the beginning is one or the other? I feel, after this presentation, that it could be argued that it is and that Christians can conclude that the word dig/dug is simply another poetic way of saying 'pierced.' I may have missed it, but what is the ancient Hebrew word for 'pierce?' What I see as the primary problem is that Christian scholars and apologists may have been right about these verses, but again, they do not speak of a crucifixion, let alone a crucifixion of Jesus. Am I missing something? Also, if the Greek is 'dug', it makes no sense to translate it to 'pierce' in English. Corruption somewhere along the line or a scribe's mistake? Anyway, the verse(s) does not predict the crucifixion.
@@arnoldjohnson3317 Faith is a terrible, ultimately, method to use to base one's beliefs. If so, ANYTHING, and EVERY person of differing faiths, can be used to justify belief. Look at the anti-vaxxers, flat-earthers, radical Muslims, etc.
@@timisa58 I read your comment before you edited it. I perceived you to state it didn’t matter what the translation was it would not change your belief in Christianity, as in you have faith in Jesus. I now have no idea what your original reply was . That is why I implied no amount of fact would change your Christian beliefs. I may even have misinterpreted what you originally said thinking you are Christian. My bad.
Dear Richard, it is just the search for legitimization in the Jewish scripture. We have another false Messiah who got executed and died, but some of his followers could not accept reality and searched meaning in the Jewish scripture. So they misread, misunderstood and invented connections to some dead false Messiah they wanted to believe in.
1:41:00 I think his point was really meant to emphasize that the DSS are way older than the MT, not that it was the very oldest existing psalm22 fragment among the DSS. So Dr Kipp Should cut him some slack
Wow! Derek what a great work you did man. Dr Kipp Davis you rock, I am totally blown away, I do not know which video is the best now. Thank you very much.
I finally got time to watch the majority of the rest of this video period by 2 hours 14 minutes, after a very long and laboured explanation of the possibilities that a single verse was somehow transcribed in error. We have the Fuller understanding of that particular phrase and its full context as well. Kudos for actually putting that particular line in context. And here's the rub Regardless of which way you interpret that short line of text. It does not change the idea that his hands and feet were either pierced, in reference to the actual crucifixion, or his hands and feet became as a lion which only references his abilities after his resurrection. However I do like the work that goes into this. I do not like specific additions or subtractions from the original script much like 1st John 5 I believe it's versus seven and eight which never existed even in the King James until the year 1522. And it is clearly the addition of a couple of verses trying to support the trinity concept which according to the baptism of Christ is totally false. If the baptism of Christ you have Christ in the water you have the most high God, his father speaking from the heavens, and you then have the Holy Spirit descending as a dove. Clearly indicating that they are three separate beings with a singular purpose. It's the exact example when they asked us to be at one with God in his purposes. And I believe clearly that Many religious practices have been framed around this false Doctrine really in order to cement their power because the Catholic Church, let's face it, was a political construct, it was not a religious undertaking from its outset. And the Septuagint word that you're talking about is actually a transliteration, not a translation of understanding the possible application. Because when you dig a hole in the earth you've actually pierced the Earth. And he wasn't doing it from that he was transliterating the word which actually means to dig. But Hebrew is full of words that are not precise in their meanings but give you a direction to lean in such as the word for fish which means anything lives in the water. Whether it be what we now call in heel or a starfish or a shark or a whale etc etc etc. So don't be so harsh on the Greek writing. It was interesting when you showed those examples of the Hebrew texts, the Septuagint, and the Dead Sea Scrolls, that the Septuagint is white a bit more accurate in its depiction, even though a couple of the things are rather minor. Minor changes can be important. Yet the Septuagint is more accurate in general. I would also like to reiterate that the difference between dig and pierced is not very much. I spent 10 months living over in Saskatchewan. I've never seen people butcher the English language as much as the Canadians except for the English. They keep pronouncing the J as a j instead of as a y like it was intended to be. The Great Vowel Shift was the one that keeps bugging me.
What could "A pack of evil ones closes in on me, like a lion, my hands and my feet" possibly mean? Closes in on me is the object of the evil ones. Adding 'my hands and my feet' is meaningless. Dug at my hands and feet makes more sense. But why not write bite, or tear? It's bizarre. Anyway, applying this as a prophecy is wild speculative thought.
The image I got with the "dug" version was more like "pulled apart", which is reasonably similar to the usage for digging a well or pit, namely pulling apart the ground to make the pit. That would lead to "pulling apart my hands and feet", as in a person staked out, with their hands and feet pulled apart and staked to the ground, for the circling wild beasts to devour. Note that I know nothing of Hebrew.
I watched this video very early in my renewed faith. Do you know who Dr Michael Heiser? I am not sure, because it had been a while since I watched this. None of this made me question my faith in the creator.
@Abraham Mani Well, aren't you a ray of sunshine?! I simply give my gratitude to a YT creator for posting a video on a great subject and you take it upon yourself to come busting up in here and threaten me with holy violence. **smmfh** No mention of my own personal opinions on the subject which you seem to think I need to hear about, yet you ignorantly assume I'm clueless and require some wooish words from some ancient magic book to give me an instant revelation. Spare me please, your dogmatic words which I've heard so many times over my own short span of existence. I've had that same mythology parading as actuality droned into my ears since before I could eat solid food and disern evil from good. Take your violent rhetoric and turn it upon the fearful who'll swallow it wholeheartedly and become slaves of yourselves and your unknowable god. I have better to do with my limited run here in my meat suit than fall victim to the empty words of a two bit prayer book wielder than yourself. Tell your god about your failure this day and for him to do his own damned dirty work. Neither the words of your book nor the words from any impotent witness of his will move me. Should it be his desire that I know him than an ineffectual man such as yourself can either stand in it's way nor edge it along for then it will be his will and not your own. Be gone.
Satan in the Hebrew concept is not in opposition to YHWH, but he is a cohort or the arms of God to do gods' will, only a few centuries later when Christianity came along drawing on Judaism, isolated Satan to be independent adversary to God to fit their theology or ideology
At about the 18:00 mark in regards to the Sons of Gods, they appear to be "special angels," also known as God's divine council mentioned in Psalm 82: _"God has taken his place in the divine council; in the midst _*_of the gods_*_ he holds judgment:" -- Ps 82:1 ESV_ It appears they were the same angels assigned to the nations at Babel who eventually corrupted the nations, teaching the nations to worship them rather than God. By the time Christ showed up, they belonged to Satan, and Satan controlled all the nations (Luke 4:5-6; Matt 28:18.) It is a little involved, but the primary verses, besides the whole of Psalm 82, are: _"When the Most High gave to the nations their inheritance, when he divided mankind, _*_he fixed the borders of the peoples according to the number of the sons of God_*_ ." -- Deu 32:8 ESV_ _"And lest thou lift up thine eyes unto heaven, and when thou seest the sun, and the moon, and the stars, _*_even all the host of heaven, shouldest be driven to worship them, and serve them, which the Lord thy God hath divided unto all nations under the whole heaven_*_ ." -- Deu __4:19__ KJV_ So, when Israel was led away to serve other gods, the divine council were those other gods. They were (or will be) kicked out of heaven along with Satan (Rev 12.) The angels of Genesis 6:1-4 are a different set who were bound in chains of darkness until the day of judgment. Dan
...but @ 32:32, our guests ADMITTED "IT'S TRUE", ("if you're not on God's side, than who's side are you on"). If not so, I wonder what he was in fact saying was True? 🤔
"They have dug a pit and fallen into it"- a very apt saying!ha ha.And you thought wandering in the same small area for 40 yrs was bad,how about 2,000 + yrs of living in ignorance!
God led them around all that time because of idolatry. Something most people do without realizing. Even Moses didn't get into the promised land for his disbelief in striking the rock. Which is still standing there today. A sect of people stashed those scrolls. You could walk from there to Jerusalem. Once they were murdered, their writings would have been destroyed. The preservation of them brings the more ancient writing forward. This show needs someone to tell them the other viewpoint. If murder is the reason they hid them, and the murderers took over commissioning the establishing of religious text, then correcting as you go has to take place. Perhaps it's why things get revealed as ages pass. It doesn't make Jesus Christ any less to me. It doesn't affect the precepts of Christianity. Satan works constantly to twist and destroy the truth. If you accept Christ and live by the Spirit, you have nothing to fear in eternity. If you deny Christ, you unwittingly serve the god of this world, not God.
In the book The Dead Sea Scrolls Deception by Michael Baigent and Richard Leigh there is a photo of a seal with the name "Josephus" on it and it seems very natural to suspect that this seal could have belonged to Josephus Flavius, however, the authors of this book simply comment on the fact that the name was in Greek and completely ignore the obvious implications. In Josephus' autobiography, Josephus admitted to having received the "...holy books by Titus's concession...", and while it seems reasonable to assume that he kept most of them, it also seems reasonable to assume that he did not want to carry unwanted manuscripts (e.g. duplicates, damaged, uninteresting) all the way to Rome. If this seal is not a fraud then the location that it was found at Qumran would provide a significant clue as to how it came to be left there. In other words, if it was left in a cave along with some scrolls then it could be viewed as a deliberate message intended to communicate to whomever found the scrolls the identity of the person that placed them there. On the other hand, if it was found in the ruins of the settlement, perhaps even in a layer from before the 1st Century, it's significance would be greatly reduced and thus provide some justification for it being ignored by scholars. However, I cannot find any serious discussion of this seal anywhere. (I did find a comment about this seal online in which someone is apparently responding to the suggestion that the seal meant that Josephus actually wrote some of the Dead Sea Scrolls, but I view this as a very unrealistic interpretation.) I would really appreciate it if someone could point me to some reliable information in regards to this seal.
@@arriuscalpurniuspiso More like a double agent. He employed a form of Kabbalah in his writings to communicate the real history of the "Jewish" Revolt to his non-Roman allies. The Gospel authors picked up on these communications and reinterpreted them to create the Gospel accounts.
@@warrensmith8161 I think Arrius Piso is Josephus. And he seized as many Jewish documents as possible to forge the New Testament. He was a sociopath, a mass murderer with multiple aliases and very slick writing skills. I don't buy his origin story at all: a Jewish rebel who poured hot oil on Roman soldiers and ends up adopted by Vespasian. His Complete works are there to historicize the Gospels.
@@arriuscalpurniuspiso I agree that the person that called himself Josephus was not who he claimed to be, but without a clearer connection to Piso, I am drawn in another direction. In his "autobiography" Josephus addresses Justus of Tiberius "...as if he were here present..." I believe that this was intended to be more literal than the uninitiated reader would imagine. In my view Josephus employed the Justus of Tiberius character as a device to tell the truth about the author's actions during and after the Revolt. Near the end of his rant against Justus, Josephus mentions how Justus was caught forging letters of King Agrippa II and then on the completion of the rant, he then immediately refers to the letters that he personally received from King Agrippa II confirming the accuracy of his accounts. If you were an author, would you impeach the reliability of a source, and then immediately cite that source as proof of your honesty? On the other hand, if you want to clandestinely confirm that someone served as a stand-in for you, wouldn't drawing a direct connection between yourself and the stand-in be one means to do it? In this world created by Josephus, Josephus admits to three identities; Josephus, Justus, and Agrippa II (via the forgeries). The idea that others saw these connections is supported by the fact that Josephus, Justus and Agrippa II all supposedly died in the same year (100 CE). Furthermore, the names of two of Josephus' "sons" were "Justus" and "Agrippa". Odd, that Josephus would name his son after his supposed enemy, isn't it? (In this allegoric code employed by Josephus, "sons" and "daughters" can be used to represent works, ideas or events created by the "father" and "mother".) Now, if you can find connections between Piso and Agrippa II, then I will definitely want to take a second look at your approach.
Is there a set 'list' of gods in the 'council of gods' or pantheon? Are the names ever listed? Or was this 'council' more like a nebulous thing that just consisted of any gods beside yahweh? Apologists also forget to tell people that 0% of the new testament is in the dead sea scrolls. When they say Bible they mean old testament (nothing to do with Jesus).
It might be reasonable to assume that as different tribes are assimilated into a nation, the gods of those tribes are assimilated into the nation's pantheon.
I’m very interested in this topic, but it seems completely irrelevant if Heiser’s work isn’t fully accounted for in this. Heiser levies all the same criticisms of Christians and apologists but to alternative consequence. He cites the Dead Sea scrolls for Deut. 32:8, and pretty much basis his entire viewpoint off the difference in this passage in the DSS vs. English translations. Familiarity with this would be a basic requirement for someone presenting on this info, especially with the title “what apologists are not telling you,” when the main apologist in this area tells us this content repeatedly. If we are going to cite a video like this to help fundamentalists reconsider their position against growth, they will see that Heiser isn’t fully considered here and use that as the excuse to completely disregard all the content in this video. It’s a significant oversight. I would ask you to come back and deliver a more succinct presentation that leads with a summary agenda, and fully incorporates Heiser’s position into the presentation, and indicates what he is overlooking.
"Hermon" is a mountain. It is said to be the place where the Genesis 6 event took place. It's where the fallen angels made a pact of mutual imprications to inter marry with humans. 1Enoch is a Dead Sea Scroll.
I now understand this verse of Scripture so much better, "Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of lawlessness be revealed, the son of perdition." Many in the faith will fall away now that they realize how flawed the Holy Bible is. Good job, please return the Texts of Scripture to it's origin, respecting The Word, The Names and the culture of a people in their historical context.
Till 325 AD, not a single historian or writer wrote about Jesus Christ or any of his disciples . The dead sea scrolls covering the period from Birth of Jesus to 68 AD , does NOT say one word about Jesus or his 12 Apostles. Hellenistic philosopher Philo Judaeus of Alexandria (20 BCE-50 AD/CE)-alive at the purported time of Jesus, and one of the wealthiest and best connected citizens of the Empire- makes no mention of Christ, Christians or Christianity in his voluminous writings. Nor do any of the hundreds of other historians and writers who flourished during the first THREE centuries of the common era. The DEAD SEA SCROLLS were all written by Pagan Essenes . None of them have been edited by later Christians, as is the case with some other Jewish literature. All the scrolls (except a treasure map known as the Copper Scroll) can be dated prior to A.D. 68 or 69, when the Qumran settlement was believed to have been destroyed by the Romans in the Jewish revolt. The oldest of the scrolls probably goes back to the middle of the third century B.C. The people of Qumran belonged to a Pagan religious group known as the Essenes. Pliny the Elder, who died during the volcanic destruction of Pompeii in the year 79 A.D., described a community of pagan Essenes living on the western shore of the Dead Sea, close to where Khirbet Qumran is situated. John the Baptist was an ascetic Essene . He was a vegan and was uncircumcised . Various literary sources like Josephus and Philo tell clearly that Essenes were ascetics. We also know, from literary testimony, the Dead Sea Scrolls, and the archaeological remains of Qumran, that the Essenes practiced many water baptisms for ritual purification-similar to a dip in the Ganges or the river Pampa or at Thiirunelli. At Qumran, however, all members of the community were baptized with water for ritual purification. Josephus writes, "And as for their piety towards God, it is very extraordinary; for before sunrising they speak not a word about profane matters, but put up certain prayers which they have received from their forefathers, as if they made a supplication for its rising" (Wars, 2.8.5). This testimony accords well with what we know from the Dead Sea Scrolls. Prayer and humility was one thing that the Essenes . When they cooked up stories about Jesus they wrote that Jesus Christ ate the Last Supper in the Essene part of town. Jesus is not historical character, The Dead Sea Scrolls have produced increasing evidence to cement the fact that Jesus Christ never existed and the whole story was cooked up at the First Council of Nicea in 325 AD. Why was the library of Alexandria burnt ? The gospel of Thomas was not written by Jesus' disciple Thomas. Englishman Godfrey Higgins studied Greek, Latin and law at Cambridge . His two-volume, 867-page book Anacalypsis: An Enquiry into the Origins of Languages, Nations, and Religions, was published posthumously in 1836. In his treatise, Higgins writes " the mythos of the Jews and the mythos of the Greeks are all at bottom the same lifted from the ancient mythos of Hindus ; and ... are contrivances under the appearance of histories to perpetuate doctrines," and that Christian editors “either from roguery or folly, corrupted them all.” 1900, Scottish MP John Mackinnon Robertson wrote that Jesus never existed but was an FAKE invention by a first-century messianic cult. He wrote about the First Council of Nicea of 325 AD where powerful forces invented a new god to fit the needs of the society of the time .Robertson specifically mentions the Talmudic story of the Yeshu . Thomas says: "Simon Peter said to them, ‘Make Mary leave us, for females don’t deserve life.’ Jesus said, ‘Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of heaven’" (Thomas 114). AIYOOOOO -even Christians don’t like this When the master of James baby Jesus Christ never existed -- how can his disciple St James exist ? Even since the dead sea scrolls have been discovered CHRISTIANS and JEWS are jumping up and down like demented orangutans claiming that Essenes belong to them. Dead Sea text or Qumran Scrolls have absolutely nothing ZILCH, to do with the Bible of the Torah - never mind the diabolical lies of the Christians and the Jews. For arguments sake -even if messiah Jesus Christ existed , the gospels were written a even a century after Jesus' estimated year of death, by individuals who never met Jesus, and then were edited or forged over the centuries by unknown scribes with their own agendas. Dead sea scrolls have been written by Essenes of the sect of Apollonius For more plz click link ..... ajitvadakayil.blogspot.com/2016/04/apollonius-or-jesus-christ-who-is-real_10.html?m=1
@@AmitKumar-qz2us "John the Baptist was an ascetic Essene . He was a vegan and was uncircumcised " Locusts and honey are not vegan. "On the eighth day they came to circumcise the child" LK1:59 Are you saying his parents didn't go through with this? I doubt Zecharaiah was brave enough to challenge god again.
@@jamesstaplesvdid you build a time machine, or prove that everything written was false? Or are just another relgious person that has so much faith in something else, it makes you that sure of yourself?
Wonderful session. Even monotheism presents a problem. If you go back through the ages and trace the etymology of the term "God" - got, gott, guo, gup, ghut - you get Sanskrit huta which is the one to which the offering "ahuti" is offered in a Vedic fire ritual. If you trace the term "god" through the concept of "theos", deus, you get "deity", or Sanskrit dyaus, deva which is really an aspirational "higher human quality" attributed to the divine or "ultimate reality", not any "god". Even the concept of a "king of the gods" refers to "the quality that rules humans", specifically "emotion". So "theism" itself, whether mono-, poly- or other, is problematic. At best, it is a "divine reality" as contrasted with "temporal reality". And divine reality is beyond even the "seven realms" (or seven dimensions) of the mind. In other words, it is a reality "beyond the mind", that is, the divine reality is "beyond human comprehension" (an unknowable).
I have a question/point of clarification regarding polytheism, especially in regards to Judaism: We would draw a distinction between the belief in other gods and the worship of other gods. We typically think of polytheists like the Greeks or Romans where all of the gods get attention, adoration, etc. and it is s mistake to think of even very early Judaism like this is absolutely incorrect. The first comment commandment is that "thou shalt have no other gods before me" NOT that there are no other gods. We tend to rationalize that today as a commandment to not give anything that attention we would to god: money or whatever. And this never went away, within the textual Bible, and even the most recent translations maintain this... even if the religious would like it not to, and try to translate it out as much as possible. I am not sure when we went from "only God to worship" to "only god that exists"... I've been looking for years but can't find a clear turning point.. but that's a change in doctrine, not a change, and its why they have to jump through ridiculous hoops to make sense of the Trinity, the bene elohim, the nephilim, etc. Regardless, I wish there was a better word for the polytheism of groups like the Jews as opposed to the of the Greek... and if there is one I am ignorant of, please let me know
One of the best yet. Keep up the good work! This is enlightening, seeing how the 'inerrant' word of god changed over time just like everything else changes.
Went all out nerd from about 1:25:00 on.. Is absolutely awesome!! This is what we call real exegesis.... Have never met an evangelical willing to do this kind of work..😢.
ATTENTION!!!! JESUS CHRIST LOVES YOU!! JESUS IS COMING FOR HIS BELIEVERS AND FOLLOWERS!!! Humble yourself to repent and Put your faith in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. ACTS 2:38 “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit....
@@ChristianSoldier71 Oh dude...sounding like some crazed, wild eyed cultist does not only make you look silly - it really dishonors the name of Jesus of Nazareth...😥😥 How about just getting real - getting human - like Jesus - whom the common people heard gladly - He could sit at the pub - keep it real - have a pint....
Hmm...as a skeptic, I enjoyed your video. But of course i have to look into the bible translations and check others what others have to say. The thing is that if you read the WHOLE of psalm 22 , well you get the idea something is bigger. It begins with a shocking cry of " My God, my god, why have you forsaken me? and and ends with something big. You should talk about the context of psalm 22 because you do get a different idea.
Finally got to finish this. The Psalm 22 presentation is fantastic. That is something you can’t find very easily at all without a scholar like Dr. Kipp. As a matter for consideration, the NET gives a condensed version of his explanation in its footnotes and follows the MT. The NRSV gives a weird option that is also covered in the NET footnote. Totally agree with Derek’s analysis of apologists. Even though I actually am a Christian, what he said is exactly why I prefer to read scholarship that is not favorable towards Christianity, including the stuff on this channel
Out of curiosity, how are you still a Christian if you are aware of the extreme flaws in the "sacred scriptures" of your religion? Don't you have higher expectations of what an omnipotent and all-wise being could inspire/produce for his religion? I would be ashamed of writing a lot of the things in the bible, a lot of it is so backward, incorrect and downright immoral...I'm not attacking, I'm genuinely curious how you reconcile it.
@@Magar6 the world seems pretty imperfect. If something came along that looked perfect it would look entirely out of place. God, it seems to me, is after something that He wants, and what that looks like to us is, unexpected. It has somewhere been said the grace of God makes God attractive to us. That is not how most people think of grace though. They usually think of it as something that makes us attractive to God. However to get to the text directly, the LXX says pierce, and while it makes most Christians squirmish to says this (but it is what it is and I can’t deny the truth), most of the NT quotations of the OT, and use of the OT, is based on the LXX. Sometimes, like here, that causes some confusion that is not easy to explain in regards to one manuscript tradition versus another. However, this only truly problematic if someone is a kind of MT onlyist. Whatever text tradition the NT uses is the one that is authoritative for that particular quote. There is no way around that. It’s an uncomfortable truth for some, but it is what it is. I think it used to bother me, but for whatever reason, I stopped worrying about it lol
@@Magar6 after giving this some more thought, I would say I think people have an expectation of what they think God ought to be like. Then they judge His existence or whether He is good or whatever, based on some presumption they have in their mind, as to how He should be, if He really has all the attributes He says He has. But let me upset people for a moment. If we simply lower the bar of expectations to what we actually see playing out in the text, we would be more at peace with who He is, although many people would like Him less. I truly don’t personally think of that as lowering the bar though. I consider it raising the bar. Maybe viewing God exactly as He shows Himself in the text is too repulsive for many Christians, especially first-world white collar evangelical types. That’s probably why apologists try to make Him sound… lame? I don’t know, wouldn’t you rather an ass-kicking warrior for a God than a hippie? It might sound crass… I don’t know.
@@AnUnhappyBusiness Thanks for the explanation, I respect those points, even though I disagree. For me, I have much higher expectations of what an omnipotent & all-loving being would author or inspire as his holy scriptures. I think if such a being exists and its divine will allows a world where its holy scriptures are indistinguishable from human stories reflecting the attitudes of the time (eg. slavery is acceptable), then said being should not be surprised if those scriptures are dismissed out of hand. I guess I expect more from an omnipotent being. If I were omnipotent, I would produce holy scriptures which are perfect, thoroughly impeccable, and I would accurately translate it into every language, and update it as language usage changes. I would also multiply copies magically by sending angels coming down from the sky to distribute them, so that it's clear which holy book is the true one and so we would not have this world of confusion which we're now in with all the different religions and sects and holy books. (Whilst I'm at it, I'd also not allow children to die of starvation, disease or be raped, that too).
@@AnUnhappyBusiness I'm glad you mentioned the LXX. As an Eastern Orthodox Christian, i was already aware that the Hebrew Masoretic Text had issues. The Orthodox Church is always stressing how the LXX is superior to the MT. I just discovered this Channel and i haven't really heard anything that was faith shattering.
December 2nd 2016 is the day my faith died and I stopped believing in god. It was because of a Dramatic experience. Since then I read and watched videos of Bart Ehrman, Sam Harris and of course Richard Dawkins. I've learned so much from them and believe that based on evidence. Science better explains the origin of life. There are several other men I've learned from and watching TH-cam videos like myth vision. I appreciate your channel.
No one knows the origin of life. The bible does have an inner message that exist throughout spiritual systems in every culture. It is hidden but is also within yourself. Ask within yourself for the TRUTH and it will come to you. When the student is ready the teacher shall appear. Keep the LOVE Keep the FAITH.
@@AdonaiZedek No one knows the origin of life, but we do have some compelling, theory-supported and model-supported hypotheses, that comport better with verification process of the scientific method, than any creation tale in any religious text does.
The #1 thing I've learned from this is to not to use squiggly lines as characters for your language. Try to use distinct characters that can't be eaaily confused with other characters.
Christian here. My understanding of Psalm 22 is that Jesus as a Jew who went to synagogue on Saturdays and had discussions with the doctors of the Jewish law was familiar with Psalm 22 as a psalm of despair. So Jesus is bringing it to his mouth asca reglevtion of his despair. The prophetic connotations are added by Christians due to how close the situation of Asaf? was to the situation Of Jesus. Even then it's not completely literal: Jesus was not surrounded by dogs although the Jews may have thought the Romans were dogs. I don't see a problem if instead of "they pierce at my hands and feet" the original is "my hands and feet are being dug hollow as a lion" seems to me lions have long teeth wich act very similar (dig hollow?) as the long nails the Romans used during crucifixion on hands and feet.
This presentation was super awesome! I really like how you drilled down and looked into the "pierced" vs "lion" issue. Based on the context it does seem to me like either one works. For "pierced" it probably makes more sense for it to be translated "they dug into my hands and feet" as in "they tore into my hands and feet" and this would make sense because dogs are known for digging. Either way, thanks for examining this in detail. A great show!
Dogs are not known for "digging" into flesh, like they dig into dirt. Dogs dig into dirt with their paws. They bite/tear into flesh with their teeth. It is in no way reasonable to think that they would use the word for digging/hollowing out a hole in rock or dirt to describe metaphorical dogs piercing flesh with their natural weapons (i.e., their teeth).
@@JCPRuckus Thanks for taking the time to respond. I think we are always on shaky ground when we say "This can't be a metaphor" or "metaphors can't do that". Anything can be a metaphor. Also, ancient cultures were much more proficient at using metaphors and their rules for how to use metaphors could be broader or different than ours. With that said, lets examine more closely why this metaphor does work even if we don't like it for some reason: 1 Dogs dig. As mentioned, this is one of the things that dogs are best known for doing. 2 In crucifixion they did "dig" into his hands and feet. Now in english this sounds strange and we might prefer to say that they "ripped into him" or "tore into him"... but this is the sort of thing that varies with language and "dug into his hands and feet" might be totally normal in ancient Hebrew. So, given the above, it doesn't really matter if Dogs don't dig into flesh. Dogs dig and the soldiers dug into his hands and feet. The metaphor works and to say otherwise is frankly kind of obtuse.
@@Lpettro - You're completely ignoring that the word for "dig" is used several other times elsewhere , and never in that way. The only thing obtuse is assuming that reading this singular appearance as poetic license is the most reasonable way to interpret it. Is it possible?... Yes. Is it the most likely explanation, especially considering the additional information that "lions" appear repeatedly as a theme in the surrounding text?... No. You're deliberately ignoring the simpler and more direct explanation for one that is far more conditional and based on your speculation rather than the rest of the text. Again, if you want to throw around the word "obtuse", maybe don't ignore Occam's Razor.
@Abraham ManiGood Wizard has sent me, his PropheTranslator the entire book of Austin. He tells followers of Tadaism in Austin 3:15 that : “All we need is 100, or maybe 200 eyewitness testimonies to the resurrection of Harry Potter mentioning his lightning bolt scar. That quantity of witnesses is more than the authors of the Gospels supposedly talked to, and that’s the source of their resurrection claims. We will be able to present our eyewitnesses as evidence and hit Christian apologists with that famous Philosopher Stone Cold’s quip: “ May the magic Word of G-d free you from fears of God’s wrath.
I was really looking forward to the subject material, but, for me, Kipp Davis's halting style of speaking, his multi-level rabbit trails, and his general unpreparedness to speak well on a podcast, made it nearly impossible for me to follow him.
15 minutes in, and I’m checking my various versions of the Bible… and the Brenton (English version of the Septuagint) says bless (not curse) in Job 1:11 like the Dead Sea scroll. So the two oldest versions agree here, and also agree in Deu 32:8 as Dr Michael Heiser points out it not being the children of Israel but sons of God or (lowercase) angels of God I’m surprised that the ESV version didn’t update this, because they corrected Deu 32:8 because of the Dead Sea Scrolls according to Dr Heiser Interestingly, the Dead Sea Scrolls agree with the Masoretic on the paternity age of the decedents of Shem in Genesis, but not with the Septuagint, Samaritan Pentateuch, or Flavious Josephus which has the parents being 100 years older making it impossible for Shem to be Mikezeldeck. (Which is another rabbit hole) Maybe the Samaritans and Josephus were based on the Septuagint as were the people during the time of Christ. Some claim an anti-Christian motive reducing the age in the Descendants of Shem in the Masoretic text like in that “When were the Pyramids built” video on TH-cam, but that argument can’t be used on the Dead Sea Scrolls. They predate the birth of Christ the only begotten (capital letter) Son of God. These little differences are fascinating. Ok back to the video
Belief itself is overrated. Is our tendency to believe acquired by example? Have we been led by expectation? Is the human tendency to take a stand in belief a cultural, traditional compulsion of follow the leader?
I recall a man suggesting that the first sentence of the Bible should start out as: "The head one of the Gods brought forth the Gods." But a Christian mob hunted him down and shot him to death :/
I prefer the creation according to Mel Brooks: In the beginning there was nothing. And god said 'Let there be light'. And there was still nothing. But now you could see it.
@@danielgautreau161 Yes, that is, and will forever be, a good assessment by Mel Brooks :) The one I usually have the most affinity with is Douglas Adams, In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
Hi Derek...how to deal with people who deny and rely on new testament whenever asked about inhuman verses in old testament? Isn't it the same father god
Okay I’m only 10 minutes into it, and I’ll keep listening, but I’m getting the idea that, “oh my gosh, there were some among God’s people who worshipped other Gods!” This shouldn’t be surprising. Maybe Dr. Kipp’s point is that it persisted for so long, I don’t know, I’ll keep listening.
This was a really fun stream that I see has ruffled some feathers. I think everyone should know that my primary point was to show how the Dead Sea Scrolls have been inappropriately marshaled by apologists, and to counteract some of that with some examples of how the Scrolls inform about the textual history of the Bible, sometimes in surprising ways.
I can't wait to come back and do it again.
Love your work Doc! Keep it coming!
I've viewed your videos three times thus far, with plans to see them again. I can't say enough about how informative they are and how much I appreciate them... and you. Your teaching style is superb.
Keep coming back, brother!
Can you do it without the hat so we can see your face? Or at least a light from below illuminating your eye area? Seeing a guest properly makes it better.
I really enjoyed the stream. I like your point in your comment regarding apologists, although I confess I don’t really ever listen to them if I can help it. I think if I had to give a reason for why apologists would avoid this material, it’s probably to avoid losing followers, and also because it is likely that a good number of the people listening to the youtube apologists are looking for someone to tell them what they want to hear.
This also speaks to the size of the massive train wreck of
Gods , Religions , and Bibles.
Really intelligent thinkers couldn’t make it make sense.
Zecharia Sitchin knocked this out 50 years ago! The El Bibliqu covered this up like a dog with a bone. One of the scholars on the team, I think it was John Allegro outed some of these cover ups and was viciously attacked by fundamentalist orthodox scholars, both Protestant and Catholic! Now we can see what they were so afraid of.
Mike heissner debunked him 🤣
Sitchin had all of it correct. He did the work! Most studious man on earth.
@@labandonaldhock80Bruh wtf, he has been almost completely debunked and not himself or anyone in Camp Sitchen has levied a full response to the debunkers. It is always silence and down-turned chins.
@@therealwhitesky I come from the Brethren, which spawned the Mennonites and Amish. My father had a four year degree from Liberty University, my oldest brother spent 14 and a half years in Africa with Christian Light Bookstores, my younger brother is a retired Bishop. Because the church was full of backsliders I challenged the validity of the process of salvation, sanctification and being filled with the Holy Spirit. This lead me into the origin of the testaments. I am 74 with 55 years into this. A good friend of mine was a very good friend of Sitchin so I had lunch at Columbia University with them twice. This was before the larger library at Ninevah was dis covered. Today there are over 400 libraries unearthed with the same tablets in Akkadian language. My Bishop brother regurgitates the church position that the devil put them there to deceive us in the latter days. No one argues the language translation, except in a few words, even Sitchin changed definitions several times over the years. The He brew word Nephilim, or Nefilim, means those who came down vs those who were cast down he used originally. Christian Evangelicals have their ideas that is why they have their own schools so you do not learn anything contrary to church dogma. I have no interest in converting anyone to anything. I struggled for years after reading the Bible front to back 14 times complete. What ever you believe stick with it, I think the argument is not Sitchins translation or his deductions but whether you label all of the stone tablets, millions, mythology. If anyone looks at the physical evidence we have now, after Sitchin's death, and you still think its mythology, I cant help you. I am a huge student of all religions. The story in the tablets explain the religions better. Sitchin has been vindicated many times over by the International Rabbinical Council. I converted to Judaism to marry a Jewish girl and the getting into Jewish Mysticism, I did what all Jews do for more, went to India to Hindu. There I found a home.! Sitchin believed that Yahwey would return, I disagree with that. Whats so great is that we might live to see if Yahwey bails Israel out of their current dilemma. What people believe one way or another about the mythology or not of the stone tablets, does not really matter. Yahwey was not God.
Well said, ive studied many religions, ancient stories, theology, astrotheology, and i agree - the being called Yahwey IS a god, but is clearly not the sole Source of All , God. How could it be?
…and he displayed his wisdom to them (the other gods) by undoing death by laying his own life down and for that act reigns supreme. Faith in that f/act gives eternal life. What’s the hubbub about?
The problem with biblical history scholars is the firm believer doesn't care. This is only helpful for fence sitters and non believers who are interested in the truth.
Why is it we always hear about male gods or deities coming to Earth and sleeping with human women but we never hear about female gods or deities coming to Earth and sleeping with human men??
Plenty of mythological stories of sirens and nymphs dragging sailors to a watery death.
Aphrodite banged a few mortals, Achilles mother was a goddess but his dad was mortal, Inanna or Ishtar was trying to bed Gilgamesh who would not massage her vulva.. but some young guy deposited his seed in her as she slept lol. Orpheus was product of goddess and male mortal union too I'm sure
none of them are BIBLICAL CHARATERS. this is about the bible not greek mythology
@@robsimpson7319
Despite everything thing that Gilgamesh had done up until that point, I can't blame him for not wanting to get involved with Inanna/Ishtar.
Virginty and monogamy were valued female traits in ancient times and plenty of time after that too. Before we rush to an ethical judgement, this may just reflect human genetic programming.
As a former fundi myself, I appreciate this so much. I've been studying this stuff for over a decade, and you guys are SPOT ON. Bravo.
Fundi sounds like one of those deadly Candida fungi
Sure you have
I've been studying all kinds of stuff for 50 years, so bite me.
@@Doo_Doo_Patrol your point?
Fundi means Mason or a builder in swahili... Carpenter-fundi mbao, mason-fundi ujenzi, mechanic-fundi gari
Regarding Deut 32:43, I doubt there is a conspiracy. At least 7 English translations plus the Septuagint include the reference to "gods" or "angels"
"Heavens: Rejoice with God! All you gods: bow down to the Lord!" -- Deu 32:43 CEB 2011
"Tell the heavens to celebrate and all gods to bow down to the Lord," -- Deu 32:43 CEV 2011
"'Rejoice with him, O heavens; bow down to him, all gods" -- Deu 32:43 ESV 1970
"Exult with him, you heavens, glorify him, all you angels of God;" -- Deu 32:43 NAB 1970
"Rejoice, O nations, with his people, bow to him, all you gods" -- Deu 32:43 NCB 1970
"'Rejoice with him, you heavens, and let all of God's angels worship him.'" -- Deu 32:43 NLT 1996
"Praise, O heavens, his people, worship him, all you gods!" -- Deu 32:43 NRSV 1989
"Rejoice, ye heavens, with him, and let all the angels of God worship him;" -- Deu 32:43 LXX 1851
Dan
Thank you! Although I am not a practicing Christian I love to study that in which has influenced western culture in every way. I do not have an opinion upon the spiritual questions this has raised, I am all in for the historical value. From everything I have read and seen, this podcast has put some pieces of the puzzle into place. There should not be controversy, just enlightenment, and or education at the very least, as this is (I am assuming) the whole point is you all are coming from a HISTORICAL viewpoint. I would suggest that if we were 1) to put ourselves in a Babylonian / Egyptian , mind set that all kings proclaimed themselves to be Gods. They had to be in order to have ultimate power over large groups of people. I could write a paper upon how a culture can transform , simply with the beehive mentality, “believe this or burn in hell for eternity”. If it is done slowly , the Romans and Muslims are a prime example . (Or 2) we go into the Ancient Alien stuff. )In order to accurately translate one MUST try to put themselves into this mindset. This was a time when people sacrificed children, and which was a socially acceptable way to make it rain or give thanks to Ba’al .Granted I haven’t a PHD in sociology or archeology but as a recovering Christian, I applaud what you are doing . I left the religion due to the book of Job ., and blaming all of my sins upon a “devil”. Maybe in a deferent time , theologians and pastors would have treated my ligament questions about translations of words and the true spirit of Christianity , with a bit more sincerity instead of thinking the devil was trying to change my mind.
Good on you guys! Clearly you do it for the love of your religion , and it seems to me you have true faith . God gave us a brain! Bravo for those that use it!
You'd love Dr. Michael Heiser's insights. Check his videos out sometime.
FUNDAMENTAL christianity or any religion is the issue that can be addressed with The LORD JESUS. satan is a DECEIVER and a LIAR and as someone who was associated with the occult, I can tell you, satan/the enemy will destroy someone who has no RELATIONSHIP with The LORD JESUS. How he does it and how long he allows them to be "successful" will depend on how useful they are to him.
First is that THE LORD JESUS is ALIVE (the difference between the dead gods and The ONLY LIVING GOD) and that means every person can ask The LORD JESUS to prove HIMSELF to them individually and personally. I have a PERSONAL RELATIONSHIP with The LORD JESUS CHRIST and was healed of a hereditary heart condition praying in the HOLY SPIRIT in Tongues, my prayer language. Read 1Corinthians 14:2-4, Romans 8:26-27.
ALL those "christian sects" who have REJECTED the infilling of THE HOLY SPIRIT with the Evidence (NOT THE GIFT) of speaking in other Tongues ARE NOT OF CHRIST. They cannot understand HIS WISDOM as they are not of HIM - HIS SPIRIT is not with their spirit. Read Romans 8:5-9. They DO NOT HAVE THE MIND of CHRIST.
We are COMMANDED to Avoid those who Deny Tongues - The POWER. Read Acts 1:8, 2Timothy 3:5. This is because they DENY the ONLY REASON The LORD JESUS CAME to earth as The Eternal Sacrifice so that we can enter into HIS PLACE of being Sons of The LORD GOD with HIS Authority and Power - 1John 4:17, Hebrews 2:11. WE ARE SPIRITUALLY ALIVE with Power and Authority over the enemy who is wired to KILL STEAL DESTROY - John 10:10, Colossians 2:15, Colossians 2:9-10.
The LORD JESUS never formed or endorsed any RELIGION. The christian religion which is FUNDAMENTAL CHRISTIANITY is ROOTED in and under the pagan spirit of sun god worship roman catholicism. It is ANTICHRIST worshiping gods opposed to THE LORD JESUS CHRIST. They are NOT Sons Of The LORD GOD but could be like Adam (1Corinthians 15:45, Romans 5:8-12) before he sinned UNLESS they have EXPRESSLY and KNOWINGLY denied THE REDEMPTIVE POWER OF THE LORD JESUS CHRIST - often participating in ritualism and blood sacrifices to the enemy/satan on the promise of wealth and fame.
1:09:59 Derek, you’re such an amazing host. Dope intermission
I can count my subscriptions to channels on one hand. You’re definitely get a finger 👍🏽
If there was valid, even logical, evidence then there wouldn't be apologists, or contrived arguments for the existence of God. They walk around like they're speaking the truth. In my opinion a faith position needs to have more humility.
Salesmen gonna sell.
Amen
My personal definition of theology is "making the obviously absurd intellectually palatable"
When you have nothing to support your claims, you must double down on the claims, even against all logic.
Faith is the abandonment of reason.
58:27....Abraham is clearly Worshiping Elyon who is YAWEH at the same time since he gave 1/10 of the offering to Melchizedek , which was mentioned in book of Hebrews...
(HEBREWS 7: 1-8)
"This Melchizedek was king of the city of Salem and also a priest of God Most High. When Abraham was returning home after winning a great battle against the kings, Melchizedek met him and blessed him. 2 Then Abraham took a tenth of all he had captured in battle and gave it to Melchizedek. The name Melchizedek means “king of justice,” and king of Salem means “king of peace.” 3 There is no record of his father or mother or any of his ancestors-no beginning or end to his life. He remains a priest forever, resembling the Son of God. 4 Consider then how great this Melchizedek was. Even Abraham, the great patriarch of Israel, recognized this by giving him a tenth of what he had taken in battle. 5 Now the law of Moses required that the priests, who are descendants of Levi, must collect a tithe from the rest of the people of Israel,[a] who are also descendants of Abraham. 6 But Melchizedek, who was not a descendant of Levi, collected a tenth from Abraham. And Melchizedek placed a blessing upon Abraham, the one who had already received the promises of God. 7 And without question, the person who has the power to give a blessing is greater than the one who is blessed. 8 The priests who collect tithes are men who die, so Melchizedek is greater than they are, because we are told that he lives on. 9 In addition, we might even say that these Levites-the ones who collect the tithe-paid a tithe to Melchizedek when their ancestor Abraham paid a tithe to him. 10 For although Levi wasn’t born yet, the seed from which he came was in Abraham’s body when Melchizedek collected the tithe from him."
I almost skipped this one, the title doesn't do it justice, fantastic and made me reconsider some of my own theories about Christianity because the Old Testament does indeed talk about Gods having children. Maybe "Is there evidence of Polytheism in early Old Testament texts"
Read Robert Graves. King Jesus, It is about the mother goddess who was married to Yahweh and their divorce. its free as a pdf
The entirety of Genesis is polytheistic. Read it again but keep this in mind. After it was written it was redacted and revised at least twice. But you can still see all the references to polytheism. Look at the names of gods as well. It helps to use a concordance with the god names but it isn't required to see the variants. The translations are meant to make you think it is one way but you can still see it plain as day.
Bramahism....
@@lyndaanneshopjust because the bible talked about other gods( which were called false gods many times)does not take away from the God of Abraham being the one true God and creator.
What a brilliant interview.
Thank you.
I'm binging my way through your videos. They are a soothing balm to my religious trauma scars.
Ok so I’m at 2:48 at the moment and it’s sounding very much like the Mesopotamian stories of the gods with El and the tablet or scroll of destinies.
I looked up Tabor and Harmon as Canaanite deities yet only found their mention as mountains East and West.
Any more information on their classification as deities?
Dang! I've watched this and other videos of his A LOT over the last week or two and had NO idea it was the same guy I watched about Constantine and the arch! I loved that video! He's so awesome! Thank you both for revealing TRUTH. I love y'all!
I literally discovered this channel last week and I've been listening non stop since then! I take that info and ask my catholic priest friend questions that he even has to think about.
Hah hah... ok man.... yer goin down! .... And, takin your priest friend with you! You'll be in great company though, and the world will start to look even brighter! :)
Till 325 AD, not a single historian or writer wrote about Jesus Christ or any of his disciples .
The dead sea scrolls covering the period from Birth of Jesus to 68 AD , does NOT say one word about Jesus or his 12 Apostles.
Hellenistic philosopher Philo Judaeus of Alexandria (20 BCE-50 AD/CE)-alive at the purported time of Jesus, and one of the wealthiest and best connected citizens of the Empire- makes no mention of Christ, Christians or Christianity in his voluminous writings. Nor do any of the hundreds of other historians and writers who flourished during the first THREE centuries of the common era.
The DEAD SEA SCROLLS were all written by Pagan Essenes . None of them have been edited by later Christians, as is the case with some other Jewish literature.
All the scrolls (except a treasure map known as the Copper Scroll) can be dated prior to A.D. 68 or 69, when the Qumran settlement was believed to have been destroyed by the Romans in the Jewish revolt.
The oldest of the scrolls probably goes back to the middle of the third century B.C. The people of Qumran belonged to a Pagan religious group known as the Essenes.
Pliny the Elder, who died during the volcanic destruction of Pompeii in the year 79 A.D., described a community of pagan Essenes living on the western shore of the Dead Sea, close to where Khirbet Qumran is situated.
John the Baptist was an ascetic Essene . He was a vegan and was uncircumcised . Various literary sources like Josephus and Philo tell clearly that Essenes were ascetics.
We also know, from literary testimony, the Dead Sea Scrolls, and the archaeological remains of Qumran, that the Essenes practiced many water baptisms for ritual purification-similar to a dip in the Ganges or the river Pampa or at Thiirunelli. At Qumran, however, all members of the community were baptized with water for ritual purification.
Josephus writes, "And as for their piety towards God, it is very extraordinary; for before sunrising they speak not a word about profane matters, but put up certain prayers which they have received from their forefathers, as if they made a supplication for its rising" (Wars, 2.8.5). This testimony accords well with what we know from the Dead Sea Scrolls.
Prayer and humility was one thing that the Essenes . When they cooked up stories about Jesus they wrote that Jesus Christ ate the Last Supper in the Essene part of town.
Jesus is not historical character, The Dead Sea Scrolls have produced increasing evidence to cement the fact that Jesus Christ never existed and the whole story was cooked up at the First Council of Nicea in 325 AD.
Why was the library of Alexandria burnt ?
The gospel of Thomas was not written by Jesus' disciple Thomas.
Englishman Godfrey Higgins studied Greek, Latin and law at Cambridge . His two-volume, 867-page book Anacalypsis: An Enquiry into the Origins of Languages, Nations, and Religions, was published posthumously in 1836.
In his treatise, Higgins writes " the mythos of the Jews and the mythos of the Greeks are all at bottom the same lifted from the ancient mythos of Hindus ; and ... are contrivances under the appearance of histories to perpetuate doctrines," and that Christian editors “either from roguery or folly, corrupted them all.”
1900, Scottish MP John Mackinnon Robertson wrote that Jesus never existed but was an FAKE invention by a first-century messianic cult. He wrote about the First Council of Nicea of 325 AD where powerful forces invented a new god to fit the needs of the society of the time .Robertson specifically mentions the Talmudic story of the Yeshu .
Thomas says: "Simon Peter said to them, ‘Make Mary leave us, for females don’t deserve life.’ Jesus said, ‘Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of heaven’" (Thomas 114).
AIYOOOOO -even Christians don’t like this
When the master of James baby Jesus Christ never existed -- how can his disciple St James exist ?
Even since the dead sea scrolls have been discovered CHRISTIANS and JEWS are jumping up and down like demented orangutans claiming that Essenes belong to them.
Dead Sea text or Qumran Scrolls have absolutely nothing ZILCH, to do with the Bible of the Torah - never mind the diabolical lies of the Christians and the Jews.
For arguments sake -even if messiah Jesus Christ existed , the gospels were written a even a century after Jesus' estimated year of death, by individuals who never met Jesus, and then were edited or forged over the centuries by unknown scribes with their own agendas.
Dead sea scrolls have been written by Essenes of the sect of Apollonius
For more plz click link .....
ajitvadakayil.blogspot.com/2016/04/apollonius-or-jesus-christ-who-is-real_10.html?m=1
@@pheresy1367
No, instead, he will seek God with all of his heart and with all of his soul, and eventually, through trial and error, from testing others claims, and will eventually come to the conclusion that the Christian doctrine is indeed falsehood, fraudulent and corrupted, and that there is no trinity, and that there is no other besides HA’SHEM [God].
It just happens to be a reoccurring theme throughout the Jewish Scriptures.
Those who don’t take the opportunity to seek God thoroughly in this life will utterly be ashamed and disgraced, and will need to immediately convert based on the truth being witnessed and understood.
Unfortunately, the Church is the enemy of God.
@@timothya.olmeda7299 Sounds like my own journey you are describing. There is so much more... so much more.
Someone once said to me: " forget about getting any answers, just keep asking better questions".
Good one, thanks... :-)
No Catholic priest can speak ancient Hebrew. Christianity HAS to skip parts of the OT because of the narrative they portray about Hebrew origins and Yahweh.... I.E. these are cults on top of cults on top of much older more basic hero worship of ancestors.
Hebrews was polytheistic before monotheism was created,
A lot of changes were made because the Catholic Church in Rome that put the book together was very controlling, and wanted control of everything.
The responses of every creature they proclaim as "the same God" has such different responses , you can obviously tell they are not the same creature.
Also Elohim is not the same yawah or jovah , in the original documents, they prove that Jesus did not rise from the dead, his body was moved before the Sabbath more than likely by his brother.
I think it is bad and evil to idolize suffer and sacrifice.
Speaking of Michael Heiser, I seem to recall he was involved in the translation of the ESV which used the DSS in place of the MT when they differed. Therefore, the passages in question in Deut 32 translate to:
_"When the Most High gave to the nations their inheritance, when he divided mankind, he fixed the borders of the peoples according to the number _*_of the sons of God_*_ ." -- Deu 32:8 ESV_
_"'Rejoice with him, O heavens; bow down to him, _*_all gods,_*_ for he avenges the blood of his children and takes vengeance on his adversaries. He repays those who hate him and cleanses his people's land.'" -- Deu __32:43__ ESV_
Dan
0 no I
Excellent often overlooked subject. Dr. Michael Heiser explains in-depth where key passages in the Septuagint, Masoretic and DDS have significant differences which contrasts their meaning.
@James Barlow lol. Agreed
Bart Erhman has even stronger arguments than that, although it does sound fun as well
Jews say they were forced to mistranslatethe bible into Creek.
@@lll9409 Were they also forced to cover up the Canaanite pantheon for their Yahweh cult? Both sidestry and bs everyone into belief. Which is ironic if the truly believe in Yahweh wouldn't he be aware of the manipulation.
@Abraham Mani
No, there isn't punishment coming for anyone because the book is and has been proven a fake. Although, the entire mythos was never real to begin with.
My friendly ape, you are the only one who is attempting to judge others. It not a good look either.
That was super fascinating. Probably the most interesting talk you've had on your channel.
You can be honest or you can be an apologist, but you can’t be both at the same time.
So what are you now?
So, you are an atheist apologist?
@@endorolfgreenwolf5265
It comes down to will you change your beliefs based on new evidence.
Apologists will not.
Esoteric Christianity? Search "Fake Ass Christians" by Mark Passio. Interesting topic that would be great evidence to bring up to a Christian apologist! It takes great humility to change once belief when new evidence is presented especially if one's identity was highly invested. It's easier to be prideful and dismiss new information that goes against your preconceived beliefs. But ironically, that's pride. The same reason lucifer got kicked out of heaven. A closed mind is like a closed fist, nothing comes in and nothing goes out. Which is a pure shame because everything can be known, not just "believed"
I’m both, but most Christians don’t accept what I teach, because it goes against tradition, but then again, I tend to be able answer their questions and they can’t answer mine.
One thing I noticed while reading the apocryphal texts is that the words 'prayer' and 'angel' seem to have an extremely broad description.
In the Gospel of Judas angel seems to describe both entities as well as every atom and law of physics and prayer seems to be used in reference to meditation, dreaming and deep depression.
Best thing I ever did as a Christian was buy a copy of the Nag Hammadi library, until then I was worried what could have been in it that compromised my understanding of Christianity. Having read it I no wonder worry about it but do have a profound appreciation of the dangers of Gnosticism that was beginning to take route in the early church
"...the Dangers of Gnosticism..?"
I'm a pagan but I study the Bible to know my enemy better than they know themselves. It's very pleasing when I convince apologists they're practicing heresy and have proof to back it up. They don't know their God nor understand their text. The ones who resist are even better. I get them to actually read the older bibles.
If you are a pagan, you believe in multiple gods, are you sure you are a pagan?
@mikepuso There is belief and then there is worship. A bit of a distinction.
I'm absolutely certain beyond doubt.
@@mikepusohe did say "Their God".
Well I hope you like the secular world. Or maybe you prefer a Muslim world? You prefer communism? Soon when Christianity is gone with your help we can all live out our dreams in sodom and Gomorrah.
Damn... This channel need 100 million subscribers... so good...
Agreed deserves at least 600,000 subs at this point, likely suppressed mightily
It never ceases to amaze me how our tongues are a testimony against us!
?
Not interested in truth? That is the Lord, truth
Smh The Lord your God is 1. It doesn’t say 2 or 3, that’s only in the Christian bible
Any chance of giving us the main points and editing this down to about 20 minutes? I just don’t have two plus hours.
I think that it's very important to look @ these issues!! Either you believe in God or your entire life can be upended by vids like this.
So in ancient scriptures we had polytheism and in the New Testament we get Paul ytheism
Paulytheism .. might be a good name for a book about making things up.
The lightning strike that made Paul blind for 3 days when he thought he saw jesus.
LOL. worrh a LOL
Thank you for making these videos I am heavily into discerning our origins. I always felt like grooming people to be victims plays into the agenda of psychopaths.
Yea groomed to be victims
@Abraham Mani
What a narccicisti God you've. He'll banish those to eternal hell who don't follow him...?
The dead sea scrolls covering the period from Birth of Jesus to 68 AD , does NOT say one word about Jesus or his 12 Apostles.
Hellenistic philosopher Philo Judaeus of Alexandria (20 BCE-50 AD/CE)-alive at the purported time of Jesus, and one of the wealthiest and best connected citizens of the Empire- makes no mention of Christ, Christians or Christianity in his voluminous writings. Nor do any of the hundreds of other historians and writers who flourished during the first THREE centuries of the common era.
The DEAD SEA SCROLLS were all written by Pagan Essenes . None of them have been edited by later Christians, as is the case with some other Jewish literature.
All the scrolls (except a treasure map known as the Copper Scroll) can be dated prior to A.D. 68 or 69, when the Qumran settlement was believed to have been destroyed by the Romans in the Jewish revolt.
The oldest of the scrolls probably goes back to the middle of the third century B.C. The people of Qumran belonged to a Pagan religious group known as the Essenes.
Pliny the Elder, who died during the volcanic destruction of Pompeii in the year 79 A.D., described a community of pagan Essenes living on the western shore of the Dead Sea, close to where Khirbet Qumran is situated.
John the Baptist was an ascetic Essene . He was a vegan and was uncircumcised . Various literary sources like Josephus and Philo tell clearly that Essenes were ascetics.
We also know, from literary testimony, the Dead Sea Scrolls, and the archaeological remains of Qumran, that the Essenes practiced many water baptisms for ritual purification-similar to a dip in the Ganges or the river Pampa or at Thiirunelli. At Qumran, however, all members of the community were baptized with water for ritual purification.
Josephus writes, "And as for their piety towards God, it is very extraordinary; for before sunrising they speak not a word about profane matters, but put up certain prayers which they have received from their forefathers, as if they made a supplication for its rising" (Wars, 2.8.5). This testimony accords well with what we know from the Dead Sea Scrolls.
Prayer and humility was one thing that the Essenes . When they cooked up stories about Jesus they wrote that Jesus Christ ate the Last Supper in the Essene part of town.
Jesus is not historical character, The Dead Sea Scrolls have produced increasing evidence to cement the fact that Jesus Christ never existed and the whole story was cooked up at the First Council of Nicea in 325 AD.
The FAKE gospels were written after 325 AD after Jesus was cooked up at the first Council of Nicea..
Twelve apostles of Jesus never existed.
Jesus Christ names 12 apostles to spread his gospel, and the early Christian church owes its rapid rise to their missionary zeal. Yet, for most of the Twelve, there's scant evidence of their existence outside of the New Testament.
The concept of using statistics to prove that 'God authored the Bible' is bullshit.
Why was the library of Alexandria burnt ?
The gospel of Thomas was not written by Jesus' disciple Thomas.
Englishman Godfrey Higgins studied Greek, Latin and law at Cambridge . His two-volume, 867-page book Anacalypsis: An Enquiry into the Origins of Languages, Nations, and Religions, was published posthumously in 1836.
In his treatise, Higgins writes " the mythos of the Jews and the mythos of the Greeks are all at bottom the same lifted from the ancient mythos of Hindus ; and ... are contrivances under the appearance of histories to perpetuate doctrines," and that Christian editors “either from roguery or folly, corrupted them all.”
1900, Scottish MP John Mackinnon Robertson wrote that Jesus never existed but was an FAKE invention by a first-century messianic cult. He wrote about the First Council of Nicea of 325 AD where powerful forces invented a new god to fit the needs of the society of the time .Robertson specifically mentions the Talmudic story of the Yeshu .
Thomas says: "Simon Peter said to them, ‘Make Mary leave us, for females don’t deserve life.’ Jesus said, ‘Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of heaven’" (Thomas 114).
AIYOOOOO -even Christians don’t like this
When the master of James baby Jesus Christ never existed -- how can his disciple St James exist ?
Even since the dead sea scrolls have been discovered CHRISTIANS and JEWS are jumping up and down like demented orangutans claiming that Essenes belong to them.
Dead Sea text or Qumran Scrolls have absolutely nothing ZILCH, to do with the Bible of the Torah - never mind the diabolical lies of the Christians and the Jews.
For arguments sake -even if messiah Jesus Christ existed , the gospels were written a even a century after Jesus' estimated year of death, by individuals who never met Jesus, and then were edited or forged over the centuries by unknown scribes with their own agendas.
Dead sea scrolls have been written by Essenes of the sect of Apollonius
ATTENTION!!!! JESUS CHRIST LOVES YOU!! JESUS IS COMING FOR HIS BELIEVERS AND FOLLOWERS!!! Humble yourself to repent and Put your faith in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. ACTS 2:38 “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit....
@@AmitKumar-qz2us actually that is wrong Josephus speaks about Jesus in his records and questioning his authority as a historian of that era is pretty ridiculous
Very very interesting, you are dismantling more walls than you know. Good show
I was in a debate with a Christian on line and I was quoting something from the Dead Sea scrolls and said as much his response was the Dead Sea scrolls have no validity as they have been proven to be fake …where does that even come from ? Are pastors telling people that ?
Very interesting, but I may have a slight spanner to put into the works. Whilst the KJV bears out your points about Deuteronomy I also have a copy of the New English Bible published jointly by Oxford University Press and Cambridge University Press in 1970 (Wikipedia says it has 'fallen out of favour' because it was 'of its time'. I wonder if this was the only reason!) This scholarly translation of Deuteronomy 32:43 reads:
"Rejoice with him, you heavens,
bow down, all you gods, before him;
for he will avenge the blood of his sons
and take vengeance on his adversaries;
he will punish those who hate him
and make expiation for his people's land".
The second line in particular contradicts the argument about 'removal' of the uncomfortable phrase (in all translations)...it is still there...and were the particular DS Scroll fragments properly translated even as early as 1970?
What do you/Dr Kipp make of this?
I have been an atheist since my early 20s some 50 years ago but find all sorts of research interesting be it into various religions, astronomy, archaeology, the development of languages ir whatever. The dead sea scrolls are another interesting find.
He knows what he’s talking about. But how do I tell this to anyone without sounding like a conspiracy theorist?
Derek I've been listening to your broadcast of your programs and I can tell you that I am just so happy that you are doing them.. These are the programs that the Christian church in general are afraid of... It's no wonder that the fundamentalist call this the mainstream..
You say that Christians downplay the divine council but there is a huge interest in this topic. Look at the work of Dr. Michael Heiser. He has become very well known in the Christian community because of his writings on exactly this topic.
Etymologically I’ve read that “blessed” is an improperly used word for the most part today, as it’s supposed proto-germanic root is “bloedsian” which is based in “blood” and when traced back is a term of ritual marking or consecrating something for sacrifice. Something made a “curse” to give way to a “blissing” which is the result of the blood dressing “blessing”.
“Blissed”, in my current understanding is the more accurate way to convey “good things” to someone, rather than using “blessing” which seemingly has this connection in marking something for sacrifice.
About 50% of this video is "um", "uh", and other small interruptions of thought. Takes forever to get a single point across.
Ikr? I valued the information in this video, but I kept wanting to scream, "Spit it out already!" And Derek (is that the host's name?) kept stalling the already slow, slow pace with tooth-grindingly irritating unfunny gags.
1.25x or 1.5x, thank me later
Over 9,000 views in 24-hours. That's exciting!
As a late comer to your Chanel, man you hit on the questions I myself ask, but I can not answer on my own! Thank you
It's almost painful to listen to Dr Kipp apologize for his mentors. I'm beginning to understand the complexities of satisfying 3, or more, languages into anything everyone can agree on. Thank you Dr Kipp and Derek.
Other sources say Herman and Tabor were mountains. This guy says they were gods. Who to believe?
Really appreciate this video with Dr. Kipp Davis..I've learned alot.
@Abraham Mani I have no FEAR for your rhetorical crap..N I disagree with what you're saying n that's all.
This was a great episode, Dr Kipp is awesome. Always been fascinated by the dead sea scrolls and its really cool to get insight from an expert.
Till 325 AD, not a single historian or writer wrote about Jesus Christ or any of his disciples .
The dead sea scrolls covering the period from Birth of Jesus to 68 AD , does NOT say one word about Jesus or his 12 Apostles.
Hellenistic philosopher Philo Judaeus of Alexandria (20 BCE-50 AD/CE)-alive at the purported time of Jesus, and one of the wealthiest and best connected citizens of the Empire- makes no mention of Christ, Christians or Christianity in his voluminous writings. Nor do any of the hundreds of other historians and writers who flourished during the first THREE centuries of the common era.
The DEAD SEA SCROLLS were all written by Pagan Essenes . None of them have been edited by later Christians, as is the case with some other Jewish literature.
All the scrolls (except a treasure map known as the Copper Scroll) can be dated prior to A.D. 68 or 69, when the Qumran settlement was believed to have been destroyed by the Romans in the Jewish revolt.
The oldest of the scrolls probably goes back to the middle of the third century B.C. The people of Qumran belonged to a Pagan religious group known as the Essenes.
Pliny the Elder, who died during the volcanic destruction of Pompeii in the year 79 A.D., described a community of pagan Essenes living on the western shore of the Dead Sea, close to where Khirbet Qumran is situated.
John the Baptist was an ascetic Essene . He was a vegan and was uncircumcised . Various literary sources like Josephus and Philo tell clearly that Essenes were ascetics.
We also know, from literary testimony, the Dead Sea Scrolls, and the archaeological remains of Qumran, that the Essenes practiced many water baptisms for ritual purification-similar to a dip in the Ganges or the river Pampa or at Thiirunelli. At Qumran, however, all members of the community were baptized with water for ritual purification.
Josephus writes, "And as for their piety towards God, it is very extraordinary; for before sunrising they speak not a word about profane matters, but put up certain prayers which they have received from their forefathers, as if they made a supplication for its rising" (Wars, 2.8.5). This testimony accords well with what we know from the Dead Sea Scrolls.
Prayer and humility was one thing that the Essenes . When they cooked up stories about Jesus they wrote that Jesus Christ ate the Last Supper in the Essene part of town.
Jesus is not historical character, The Dead Sea Scrolls have produced increasing evidence to cement the fact that Jesus Christ never existed and the whole story was cooked up at the First Council of Nicea in 325 AD.
Why was the library of Alexandria burnt ?
The gospel of Thomas was not written by Jesus' disciple Thomas.
Englishman Godfrey Higgins studied Greek, Latin and law at Cambridge . His two-volume, 867-page book Anacalypsis: An Enquiry into the Origins of Languages, Nations, and Religions, was published posthumously in 1836.
In his treatise, Higgins writes " the mythos of the Jews and the mythos of the Greeks are all at bottom the same lifted from the ancient mythos of Hindus ; and ... are contrivances under the appearance of histories to perpetuate doctrines," and that Christian editors “either from roguery or folly, corrupted them all.”
1900, Scottish MP John Mackinnon Robertson wrote that Jesus never existed but was an FAKE invention by a first-century messianic cult. He wrote about the First Council of Nicea of 325 AD where powerful forces invented a new god to fit the needs of the society of the time .Robertson specifically mentions the Talmudic story of the Yeshu .
Thomas says: "Simon Peter said to them, ‘Make Mary leave us, for females don’t deserve life.’ Jesus said, ‘Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of heaven’" (Thomas 114).
AIYOOOOO -even Christians don’t like this
When the master of James baby Jesus Christ never existed -- how can his disciple St James exist ?
Even since the dead sea scrolls have been discovered CHRISTIANS and JEWS are jumping up and down like demented orangutans claiming that Essenes belong to them.
Dead Sea text or Qumran Scrolls have absolutely nothing ZILCH, to do with the Bible of the Torah - never mind the diabolical lies of the Christians and the Jews.
For arguments sake -even if messiah Jesus Christ existed , the gospels were written a even a century after Jesus' estimated year of death, by individuals who never met Jesus, and then were edited or forged over the centuries by unknown scribes with their own agendas.
Dead sea scrolls have been written by Essenes of the sect of Apollonius
For more plz click link .....
ajitvadakayil.blogspot.com/2016/04/apollonius-or-jesus-christ-who-is-real_10.html?m=1
@@AmitKumar-qz2us
Great insight.
He dead sea scrolls are frauds...
Great stream! After reading A History of God by Armstrong, I knew El & YHWH were 2 separate gods who the Canaanites later combined. I had no idea they were individually addressed in the Hebrew Bible. Does the good doctor have a gmail? I would love to ask him a few questions.
Ashera was the wife of El
@@sandeepr1253 True.
El and Jehovah are the same God. Pagans used El like people today generally use god. This guy is a deciever and there are many other scholars with better info
@@Moe-bb3bm elyon ELOHIM is the most High God. YHVH ELOHIM is the Messiah. They didn't borrow from the canaanites. The canaanites borrowed from Abraham
@@djgamingdragon969
Check out Dr Michael Heisner he is an expert at Hebrew and semetic languages.
Orthodox karaite Jew Nehemiah Gordon is also a good resource on the Hebrew language.
Dr. Roy B. Blizzard is another scholar on the Hebrew.
This discussion giving equal weight to Canaanite narratives against the assertions of the DSS narrative demonstrates a misunderstanding of the essenetic thesis regardless of apologetics
So why did the ancient Hebrews move from a polythiistic tradition to a monotheistic tradition?
I've been wondering for a long time what's been discovered by Dead Sea scroll scholars, and now, at last, we have this. OK, the Psalm 22 findings are fantastically interesting. This is especially so for me because I've recently been photographing ancient rock-art in north-western Saudi Arabia which seems to illustrate the scenes described in said Psalm. I would like to pass at least two images on to Dr Kipp for consultation. I'm sure he'd find them very interesting, Can you help facilitate this, please?
@@Valhalla0404 Thanks, , but it's probably gotta be Dr Kipp because he's said the things that have prompted me into action. I have rock art with a man surrounded by dogs - Canaan dogs no less, and Dr Kipp rendered a version of Psalm 22 as such. Further more, there's a picture across the valley of a lion pouncing on a man with two Canaan dogs. Archaeologists are saying its proving climate change, no ,more. I beg to differ.
You know the Jesus of the Bible never existed, right?
@@cabot100 You know that the Dead Sea scrolls are old testament, wrong? Anyway, I agree if you think that the Jesus story could have been made up by the Romans or someone, and the old testament prophets may have been factors of reworked older stories. You choose the verb 'know', so are you assuming I'm over 2,000 years old and was well connected at that time? I'm flattered. I know very little, but I foster some beliefs, one of which is that the dead sea scrolls are authentic ancient religious documents and are therefore interesting. Is that good enough for yer??
@@identifyspecies
know (verb)
\ ˈnō \
knew\ ˈnü also ˈnyü \; known\ ˈnōn \; knowing
Essential Meaning of know
1: to have (information of some kind) in your mind
He knows a lot about the history of the town.
Do you know the answer?
See More Examples
2: to understand (something) : to have a clear and complete idea of (something)
I don't know much about art, but I know what I like.
"How could she do that?" "How should/would I know?!" [=I don't know, and you should not expect me to know]
3: to have learned (something, such as a skill or a language)
She knows karate/CPR.
He knows Spanish.
Full Definition of know (Entry 1 of 2)
transitive verb
1a(1): to perceive directly : have direct cognition of
(
2): to have understanding of
importance of knowing oneself
(3): to recognize the nature of : DISCERN
b(1): to recognize as being the same as something previously known
(2): to be acquainted or familiar with
(3): to have experience of
2a: to be aware of the truth or factuality of : be convinced or certain of
b: to have a practical understanding of
knows how to write
3archaic : to have sexual intercourse with
intransitive verb
1: to have knowledge
2: to be or become cognizant -sometimes used interjectionally with you especially as a filler in informal speech
know from
: to have knowledge of
didn't know from sibling rivalry
- Penny Marshall
know noun
Definition of know (Entry 2 of 2)
: KNOWLEDGE
in the know
: in possession of exclusive knowledge or information
broadly : WELL-INFORMED
I hope that helps you.
At best the Abrahamic Religions are amalgamations of pre-existing belief systems, mostly mythological.
@@cabot100 Oh deary me! Am I responsible for causing you to copy and paste a bunch of irrelevant diary entries and to then post them to a random stranger? I was just saying that it's difficult or impossible for me to know the truth about old stories. However, finding authentic remains that seem to add to some of them is fun, and seeing that the Earth is decorated with ancient remains then let's find out what we can abut the past from them, young sir.
I believe I understand why Psalms 22 is important to Christians. BUT, whether the word is 'they dug/pierced' or whether it is 'like a lion', so what? The verse, in context, in no way, prophecies the crucifixion of anyone to come, never mind Jesus. Is it in dispute as to whether the beginning is one or the other? I feel, after this presentation, that it could be argued that it is and that Christians can conclude that the word dig/dug is simply another poetic way of saying 'pierced.' I may have missed it, but what is the ancient Hebrew word for 'pierce?' What I see as the primary problem is that Christian scholars and apologists may have been right about these verses, but again, they do not speak of a crucifixion, let alone a crucifixion of Jesus. Am I missing something? Also, if the Greek is 'dug', it makes no sense to translate it to 'pierce' in English. Corruption somewhere along the line or a scribe's mistake? Anyway, the verse(s) does not predict the crucifixion.
I can’t imagine what would change your belief in Christianity. That’s why it’s called faith and not fact.
@@arnoldjohnson3317 Faith is a terrible, ultimately, method to use to base one's beliefs. If so, ANYTHING, and EVERY person of differing faiths, can be used to justify belief. Look at the anti-vaxxers, flat-earthers, radical Muslims, etc.
@@timisa58 I read your comment before you edited it. I perceived you to state it didn’t matter what the translation was it would not change your belief in Christianity, as in you have faith in Jesus. I now have no idea what your original reply was . That is why I implied no amount of fact would change your Christian beliefs. I may even have misinterpreted what you originally said thinking you are Christian. My bad.
Dear Richard, it is just the search for legitimization in the Jewish scripture. We have another false Messiah who got executed and died, but some of his followers could not accept reality and searched meaning in the Jewish scripture. So they misread, misunderstood and invented connections to some dead false Messiah they wanted to believe in.
@@arnoldjohnson3317 No sweat. I am not a deist. Just thinking out loud.
1:41:00 I think his point was really meant to emphasize that the DSS are way older than the MT, not that it was the very oldest existing psalm22 fragment among the DSS. So Dr Kipp Should cut him some slack
Wow! Derek what a great work you did man. Dr Kipp Davis you rock, I am totally blown away, I do not know which video is the best now. Thank you very much.
The speaker is Kipp Davis? Amazing video. Explains a lot!
Well done Derek, fantastic show ^^
I finally got time to watch the majority of the rest of this video period by 2 hours 14 minutes, after a very long and laboured explanation of the possibilities that a single verse was somehow transcribed in error. We have the Fuller understanding of that particular phrase and its full context as well. Kudos for actually putting that particular line in context. And here's the rub
Regardless of which way you interpret that short line of text. It does not change the idea that his hands and feet were either pierced, in reference to the actual crucifixion, or his hands and feet became as a lion which only references his abilities after his resurrection. However I do like the work that goes into this.
I do not like specific additions or subtractions from the original script much like 1st John 5 I believe it's versus seven and eight which never existed even in the King James until the year 1522. And it is clearly the addition of a couple of verses trying to support the trinity concept which according to the baptism of Christ is totally false. If the baptism of Christ you have Christ in the water you have the most high God, his father speaking from the heavens, and you then have the Holy Spirit descending as a dove. Clearly indicating that they are three separate beings with a singular purpose. It's the exact example when they asked us to be at one with God in his purposes.
And I believe clearly that Many religious practices have been framed around this false Doctrine really in order to cement their power because the Catholic Church, let's face it, was a political construct, it was not a religious undertaking from its outset.
And the Septuagint word that you're talking about is actually a transliteration, not a translation of understanding the possible application. Because when you dig a hole in the earth you've actually pierced the Earth. And he wasn't doing it from that he was transliterating the word which actually means to dig. But Hebrew is full of words that are not precise in their meanings but give you a direction to lean in such as the word for fish which means anything lives in the water. Whether it be what we now call in heel or a starfish or a shark or a whale etc etc etc. So don't be so harsh on the Greek writing.
It was interesting when you showed those examples of the Hebrew texts, the Septuagint, and the Dead Sea Scrolls, that the Septuagint is white a bit more accurate in its depiction, even though a couple of the things are rather minor. Minor changes can be important. Yet the Septuagint is more accurate in general.
I would also like to reiterate that the difference between dig and pierced is not very much.
I spent 10 months living over in Saskatchewan. I've never seen people butcher the English language as much as the Canadians except for the English. They keep pronouncing the J as a j instead of as a y like it was intended to be. The Great Vowel Shift was the one that keeps bugging me.
Ouch! Do you honestly think Americans pronounce j as y? AHAHAHAHAHA
What could "A pack of evil ones closes in on me, like a lion, my hands and my feet" possibly mean? Closes in on me is the object of the evil ones. Adding 'my hands and my feet' is meaningless. Dug at my hands and feet makes more sense.
But why not write bite, or tear? It's bizarre. Anyway, applying this as a prophecy is wild speculative thought.
The image I got with the "dug" version was more like "pulled apart", which is reasonably similar to the usage for digging a well or pit, namely pulling apart the ground to make the pit. That would lead to "pulling apart my hands and feet", as in a person staked out, with their hands and feet pulled apart and staked to the ground, for the circling wild beasts to devour. Note that I know nothing of Hebrew.
I watched this video very early in my renewed faith. Do you know who Dr Michael Heiser? I am not sure, because it had been a while since I watched this. None of this made me question my faith in the creator.
Is there a specific book anyone recommends to really dive I to the DSS? I would love to read more about this. Myrhvision podcast?
I love the way you guys present this study. Keeping my attention till the end :)
Thanks for posting this one on YT. Such an interesting subject.
@Abraham Mani
Well, aren't you a ray of sunshine?!
I simply give my gratitude to a YT creator for posting a video on a great subject and you take it upon yourself to come busting up in here and threaten me with holy violence. **smmfh**
No mention of my own personal opinions on the subject which you seem to think I need to hear about, yet you ignorantly assume I'm clueless and require some wooish words from some ancient magic book to give me an instant revelation.
Spare me please, your dogmatic words which I've heard so many times over my own short span of existence. I've had that same mythology parading as actuality droned into my ears since before I could eat solid food and disern evil from good.
Take your violent rhetoric and turn it upon the fearful who'll swallow it wholeheartedly and become slaves of yourselves and your unknowable god.
I have better to do with my limited run here in my meat suit than fall victim to the empty words of a two bit prayer book wielder than yourself.
Tell your god about your failure this day and for him to do his own damned dirty work. Neither the words of your book nor the words from any impotent witness of his will move me. Should it be his desire that I know him than an ineffectual man such as yourself can either stand in it's way nor edge it along for then it will be his will and not your own.
Be gone.
Satan in the Hebrew concept is not in opposition to YHWH, but he is a cohort or the arms of God to do gods' will, only a few centuries later when Christianity came along drawing on Judaism, isolated Satan to be independent adversary to God to fit their theology or ideology
At about the 18:00 mark in regards to the Sons of Gods, they appear to be "special angels," also known as God's divine council mentioned in Psalm 82:
_"God has taken his place in the divine council; in the midst _*_of the gods_*_ he holds judgment:" -- Ps 82:1 ESV_
It appears they were the same angels assigned to the nations at Babel who eventually corrupted the nations, teaching the nations to worship them rather than God. By the time Christ showed up, they belonged to Satan, and Satan controlled all the nations (Luke 4:5-6; Matt 28:18.) It is a little involved, but the primary verses, besides the whole of Psalm 82, are:
_"When the Most High gave to the nations their inheritance, when he divided mankind, _*_he fixed the borders of the peoples according to the number of the sons of God_*_ ." -- Deu 32:8 ESV_
_"And lest thou lift up thine eyes unto heaven, and when thou seest the sun, and the moon, and the stars, _*_even all the host of heaven, shouldest be driven to worship them, and serve them, which the Lord thy God hath divided unto all nations under the whole heaven_*_ ." -- Deu __4:19__ KJV_
So, when Israel was led away to serve other gods, the divine council were those other gods. They were (or will be) kicked out of heaven along with Satan (Rev 12.)
The angels of Genesis 6:1-4 are a different set who were bound in chains of darkness until the day of judgment.
Dan
6th, 😮😮😊 34:55
...but @ 32:32, our guests ADMITTED "IT'S TRUE", ("if you're not on God's side, than who's side are you on"). If not so, I wonder what he was in fact saying was True? 🤔
"They have dug a pit and fallen into it"- a very apt saying!ha ha.And you thought wandering in the same small area for 40 yrs was bad,how about 2,000 + yrs of living in ignorance!
God led them around all that time because of idolatry.
Something most people do without realizing.
Even Moses didn't get into the promised land for his disbelief in striking the rock.
Which is still standing there today.
A sect of people stashed those scrolls.
You could walk from there to Jerusalem.
Once they were murdered, their writings would have been destroyed.
The preservation of them brings the more ancient writing forward.
This show needs someone to tell them the other viewpoint.
If murder is the reason they hid them, and the murderers took over commissioning the establishing of religious text, then correcting as you go has to take place.
Perhaps it's why things get revealed as ages pass.
It doesn't make Jesus Christ any less to me.
It doesn't affect the precepts of Christianity.
Satan works constantly to twist and destroy the truth.
If you accept Christ and live by the Spirit, you have nothing to fear in eternity.
If you deny Christ, you unwittingly serve the god of this world, not God.
In the book The Dead Sea Scrolls Deception by Michael Baigent and Richard Leigh there is a photo of a seal with the name "Josephus" on it and it seems very natural to suspect that this seal could have belonged to Josephus Flavius, however, the authors of this book simply comment on the fact that the name was in Greek and completely ignore the obvious implications. In Josephus' autobiography, Josephus admitted to having received the "...holy books by Titus's concession...", and while it seems reasonable to assume that he kept most of them, it also seems reasonable to assume that he did not want to carry unwanted manuscripts (e.g. duplicates, damaged, uninteresting) all the way to Rome.
If this seal is not a fraud then the location that it was found at Qumran would provide a significant clue as to how it came to be left there. In other words, if it was left in a cave along with some scrolls then it could be viewed as a deliberate message intended to communicate to whomever found the scrolls the identity of the person that placed them there. On the other hand, if it was found in the ruins of the settlement, perhaps even in a layer from before the 1st Century, it's significance would be greatly reduced and thus provide some justification for it being ignored by scholars. However, I cannot find any serious discussion of this seal anywhere. (I did find a comment about this seal online in which someone is apparently responding to the suggestion that the seal meant that Josephus actually wrote some of the Dead Sea Scrolls, but I view this as a very unrealistic interpretation.) I would really appreciate it if someone could point me to some reliable information in regards to this seal.
I wouldn't put anything past Josephus. He was a pathological liar, a Roman agent.
@@arriuscalpurniuspiso More like a double agent. He employed a form of Kabbalah in his writings to communicate the real history of the "Jewish" Revolt to his non-Roman allies. The Gospel authors picked up on these communications and reinterpreted them to create the Gospel accounts.
@@warrensmith8161 I think Arrius Piso is Josephus. And he seized as many Jewish documents as possible to forge the New Testament. He was a sociopath, a mass murderer with multiple aliases and very slick writing skills. I don't buy his origin story at all: a Jewish rebel who poured hot oil on Roman soldiers and ends up adopted by Vespasian. His Complete works are there to historicize the Gospels.
@@arriuscalpurniuspiso I agree that the person that called himself Josephus was not who he claimed to be, but without a clearer connection to Piso, I am drawn in another direction.
In his "autobiography" Josephus addresses Justus of Tiberius "...as if he were here present..." I believe that this was intended to be more literal than the uninitiated reader would imagine. In my view Josephus employed the Justus of Tiberius character as a device to tell the truth about the author's actions during and after the Revolt. Near the end of his rant against Justus, Josephus mentions how Justus was caught forging letters of King Agrippa II and then on the completion of the rant, he then immediately refers to the letters that he personally received from King Agrippa II confirming the accuracy of his accounts. If you were an author, would you impeach the reliability of a source, and then immediately cite that source as proof of your honesty? On the other hand, if you want to clandestinely confirm that someone served as a stand-in for you, wouldn't drawing a direct connection between yourself and the stand-in be one means to do it? In this world created by Josephus, Josephus admits to three identities; Josephus, Justus, and Agrippa II (via the forgeries). The idea that others saw these connections is supported by the fact that Josephus, Justus and Agrippa II all supposedly died in the same year (100 CE). Furthermore, the names of two of Josephus' "sons" were "Justus" and "Agrippa". Odd, that Josephus would name his son after his supposed enemy, isn't it? (In this allegoric code employed by Josephus, "sons" and "daughters" can be used to represent works, ideas or events created by the "father" and "mother".)
Now, if you can find connections between Piso and Agrippa II, then I will definitely want to take a second look at your approach.
@@warrensmith8161 good commentary and I will reply to your ideas later today. Thank you for writing.
Is there a set 'list' of gods in the 'council of gods' or pantheon? Are the names ever listed? Or was this 'council' more like a nebulous thing that just consisted of any gods beside yahweh?
Apologists also forget to tell people that 0% of the new testament is in the dead sea scrolls. When they say Bible they mean old testament (nothing to do with Jesus).
It might be reasonable to assume that as different tribes are assimilated into a nation, the gods of those tribes are assimilated into the nation's pantheon.
Of course no NT in DDS, they date from around the time of Jesus, none of the NT existed then.
I’m very interested in this topic, but it seems completely irrelevant if Heiser’s work isn’t fully accounted for in this. Heiser levies all the same criticisms of Christians and apologists but to alternative consequence. He cites the Dead Sea scrolls for Deut. 32:8, and pretty much basis his entire viewpoint off the difference in this passage in the DSS vs. English translations. Familiarity with this would be a basic requirement for someone presenting on this info, especially with the title “what apologists are not telling you,” when the main apologist in this area tells us this content repeatedly.
If we are going to cite a video like this to help fundamentalists reconsider their position against growth, they will see that Heiser isn’t fully considered here and use that as the excuse to completely disregard all the content in this video. It’s a significant oversight. I would ask you to come back and deliver a more succinct presentation that leads with a summary agenda, and fully incorporates Heiser’s position into the presentation, and indicates what he is overlooking.
"Hermon" is a mountain. It is said to be the place where the Genesis 6 event took place. It's where the fallen angels made a pact of mutual imprications to inter marry with humans. 1Enoch is a Dead Sea Scroll.
I now understand this verse of Scripture so much better, "Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of lawlessness be revealed, the son of perdition." Many in the faith will fall away now that they realize how flawed the Holy Bible is. Good job, please return the Texts of Scripture to it's origin, respecting The Word, The Names and the culture of a people in their historical context.
I found out the Job will bless vs. curse about 30 years ago reading my interlinear bible. Huge important!!!
Till 325 AD, not a single historian or writer wrote about Jesus Christ or any of his disciples .
The dead sea scrolls covering the period from Birth of Jesus to 68 AD , does NOT say one word about Jesus or his 12 Apostles.
Hellenistic philosopher Philo Judaeus of Alexandria (20 BCE-50 AD/CE)-alive at the purported time of Jesus, and one of the wealthiest and best connected citizens of the Empire- makes no mention of Christ, Christians or Christianity in his voluminous writings. Nor do any of the hundreds of other historians and writers who flourished during the first THREE centuries of the common era.
The DEAD SEA SCROLLS were all written by Pagan Essenes . None of them have been edited by later Christians, as is the case with some other Jewish literature.
All the scrolls (except a treasure map known as the Copper Scroll) can be dated prior to A.D. 68 or 69, when the Qumran settlement was believed to have been destroyed by the Romans in the Jewish revolt.
The oldest of the scrolls probably goes back to the middle of the third century B.C. The people of Qumran belonged to a Pagan religious group known as the Essenes.
Pliny the Elder, who died during the volcanic destruction of Pompeii in the year 79 A.D., described a community of pagan Essenes living on the western shore of the Dead Sea, close to where Khirbet Qumran is situated.
John the Baptist was an ascetic Essene . He was a vegan and was uncircumcised . Various literary sources like Josephus and Philo tell clearly that Essenes were ascetics.
We also know, from literary testimony, the Dead Sea Scrolls, and the archaeological remains of Qumran, that the Essenes practiced many water baptisms for ritual purification-similar to a dip in the Ganges or the river Pampa or at Thiirunelli. At Qumran, however, all members of the community were baptized with water for ritual purification.
Josephus writes, "And as for their piety towards God, it is very extraordinary; for before sunrising they speak not a word about profane matters, but put up certain prayers which they have received from their forefathers, as if they made a supplication for its rising" (Wars, 2.8.5). This testimony accords well with what we know from the Dead Sea Scrolls.
Prayer and humility was one thing that the Essenes . When they cooked up stories about Jesus they wrote that Jesus Christ ate the Last Supper in the Essene part of town.
Jesus is not historical character, The Dead Sea Scrolls have produced increasing evidence to cement the fact that Jesus Christ never existed and the whole story was cooked up at the First Council of Nicea in 325 AD.
Why was the library of Alexandria burnt ?
The gospel of Thomas was not written by Jesus' disciple Thomas.
Englishman Godfrey Higgins studied Greek, Latin and law at Cambridge . His two-volume, 867-page book Anacalypsis: An Enquiry into the Origins of Languages, Nations, and Religions, was published posthumously in 1836.
In his treatise, Higgins writes " the mythos of the Jews and the mythos of the Greeks are all at bottom the same lifted from the ancient mythos of Hindus ; and ... are contrivances under the appearance of histories to perpetuate doctrines," and that Christian editors “either from roguery or folly, corrupted them all.”
1900, Scottish MP John Mackinnon Robertson wrote that Jesus never existed but was an FAKE invention by a first-century messianic cult. He wrote about the First Council of Nicea of 325 AD where powerful forces invented a new god to fit the needs of the society of the time .Robertson specifically mentions the Talmudic story of the Yeshu .
Thomas says: "Simon Peter said to them, ‘Make Mary leave us, for females don’t deserve life.’ Jesus said, ‘Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of heaven’" (Thomas 114).
AIYOOOOO -even Christians don’t like this
When the master of James baby Jesus Christ never existed -- how can his disciple St James exist ?
Even since the dead sea scrolls have been discovered CHRISTIANS and JEWS are jumping up and down like demented orangutans claiming that Essenes belong to them.
Dead Sea text or Qumran Scrolls have absolutely nothing ZILCH, to do with the Bible of the Torah - never mind the diabolical lies of the Christians and the Jews.
For arguments sake -even if messiah Jesus Christ existed , the gospels were written a even a century after Jesus' estimated year of death, by individuals who never met Jesus, and then were edited or forged over the centuries by unknown scribes with their own agendas.
Dead sea scrolls have been written by Essenes of the sect of Apollonius
For more plz click link .....
ajitvadakayil.blogspot.com/2016/04/apollonius-or-jesus-christ-who-is-real_10.html?m=1
@@AmitKumar-qz2us "John the Baptist was an ascetic Essene . He was a vegan and was uncircumcised " Locusts and honey are not vegan.
"On the eighth day they came to circumcise the child" LK1:59 Are you saying his parents didn't go through with this? I doubt Zecharaiah was brave enough to challenge god again.
@Abraham Mani there was no jesus, so the rest is cartoons
@@jamesstaplesvdid you build a time machine, or prove that everything written was false? Or are just another relgious person that has so much faith in something else, it makes you that sure of yourself?
Wonderful session. Even monotheism presents a problem. If you go back through the ages and trace the etymology of the term "God" - got, gott, guo, gup, ghut - you get Sanskrit huta which is the one to which the offering "ahuti" is offered in a Vedic fire ritual. If you trace the term "god" through the concept of "theos", deus, you get "deity", or Sanskrit dyaus, deva which is really an aspirational "higher human quality" attributed to the divine or "ultimate reality", not any "god". Even the concept of a "king of the gods" refers to "the quality that rules humans", specifically "emotion". So "theism" itself, whether mono-, poly- or other, is problematic. At best, it is a "divine reality" as contrasted with "temporal reality". And divine reality is beyond even the "seven realms" (or seven dimensions) of the mind. In other words, it is a reality "beyond the mind", that is, the divine reality is "beyond human comprehension" (an unknowable).
I keep waiting for the part that apologists won't tell me...
Haven't heard anything new yet.
I have a question/point of clarification regarding polytheism, especially in regards to Judaism:
We would draw a distinction between the belief in other gods and the worship of other gods.
We typically think of polytheists like the Greeks or Romans where all of the gods get attention, adoration, etc. and it is s mistake to think of even very early Judaism like this is absolutely incorrect.
The first comment commandment is that "thou shalt have no other gods before me" NOT that there are no other gods.
We tend to rationalize that today as a commandment to not give anything that attention we would to god: money or whatever.
And this never went away, within the textual Bible, and even the most recent translations maintain this... even if the religious would like it not to, and try to translate it out as much as possible.
I am not sure when we went from "only God to worship" to "only god that exists"... I've been looking for years but can't find a clear turning point.. but that's a change in doctrine, not a change, and its why they have to jump through ridiculous hoops to make sense of the Trinity, the bene elohim, the nephilim, etc.
Regardless, I wish there was a better word for the polytheism of groups like the Jews as opposed to the of the Greek... and if there is one I am ignorant of, please let me know
One of the best yet. Keep up the good work! This is enlightening, seeing how the 'inerrant' word of god changed over time just like everything else changes.
Especially HIS TRUE NAMES!!!! THE BIGGEST DECEPTION EVER !!!!! Yahweh is a canaanites pagan name given to the YISRAEL ALUHIYM!!! YAHUWAH IS CORRECT.
@Abraham Mani you are not understanding my point!! The name jesus is a pagan latin name which does mean SALVATION!!
@Abraham Mani NOR IS yeshua the TRUE name of MASHIAH!!
@Abraham Mani I'll be waiting over here. Let me know when it happens.
Wow what a great presentation by Dr, Kipp.
Went all out nerd from about 1:25:00 on.. Is absolutely awesome!! This is what we call real exegesis....
Have never met an evangelical willing to do this kind of work..😢.
Oh? I heard Evangelical scholarship was actually decent in some regards 🤷🏾♂️.
@Abraham Mani the Bible IS A LIE.
@Abraham Mani 🙄🥱
ATTENTION!!!! JESUS CHRIST LOVES YOU!! JESUS IS COMING FOR HIS BELIEVERS AND FOLLOWERS!!! Humble yourself to repent and Put your faith in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. ACTS 2:38 “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit....
@@ChristianSoldier71 Oh dude...sounding like some crazed, wild eyed cultist does not only make you look silly - it really dishonors the name of Jesus of Nazareth...😥😥
How about just getting real - getting human - like Jesus - whom the common people heard gladly - He could sit at the pub - keep it real - have a pint....
Hmm...as a skeptic, I enjoyed your video. But of course i have to look into the bible translations and check others what others have to say. The thing is that if you read the WHOLE of psalm 22 , well you get the idea something is bigger. It begins with a shocking cry of " My God, my god, why have you forsaken me? and and ends with something big. You should talk about the context of psalm 22 because you do get a different idea.
Derek, what a huuuge show.. over 2 hours of deep dive investigation all put together for us here?!!!! totally, THANK YOU💪💪👍🏼👍🏼❤️🔥❤️🔥..
Thank you
I could watch series of hours-long detailed critical analysis relating Hebrew Bible+its variants (Samaritan Pentateuch, Septuagint, DDS :)
Finally got to finish this. The Psalm 22 presentation is fantastic. That is something you can’t find very easily at all without a scholar like Dr. Kipp. As a matter for consideration, the NET gives a condensed version of his explanation in its footnotes and follows the MT. The NRSV gives a weird option that is also covered in the NET footnote. Totally agree with Derek’s analysis of apologists. Even though I actually am a Christian, what he said is exactly why I prefer to read scholarship that is not favorable towards Christianity, including the stuff on this channel
Out of curiosity, how are you still a Christian if you are aware of the extreme flaws in the "sacred scriptures" of your religion? Don't you have higher expectations of what an omnipotent and all-wise being could inspire/produce for his religion? I would be ashamed of writing a lot of the things in the bible, a lot of it is so backward, incorrect and downright immoral...I'm not attacking, I'm genuinely curious how you reconcile it.
@@Magar6 the world seems pretty imperfect. If something came along that looked perfect it would look entirely out of place. God, it seems to me, is after something that He wants, and what that looks like to us is, unexpected. It has somewhere been said the grace of God makes God attractive to us. That is not how most people think of grace though. They usually think of it as something that makes us attractive to God. However to get to the text directly, the LXX says pierce, and while it makes most Christians squirmish to says this (but it is what it is and I can’t deny the truth), most of the NT quotations of the OT, and use of the OT, is based on the LXX. Sometimes, like here, that causes some confusion that is not easy to explain in regards to one manuscript tradition versus another. However, this only truly problematic if someone is a kind of MT onlyist. Whatever text tradition the NT uses is the one that is authoritative for that particular quote. There is no way around that. It’s an uncomfortable truth for some, but it is what it is. I think it used to bother me, but for whatever reason, I stopped worrying about it lol
@@Magar6 after giving this some more thought, I would say I think people have an expectation of what they think God ought to be like. Then they judge His existence or whether He is good or whatever, based on some presumption they have in their mind, as to how He should be, if He really has all the attributes He says He has. But let me upset people for a moment. If we simply lower the bar of expectations to what we actually see playing out in the text, we would be more at peace with who He is, although many people would like Him less. I truly don’t personally think of that as lowering the bar though. I consider it raising the bar. Maybe viewing God exactly as He shows Himself in the text is too repulsive for many Christians, especially first-world white collar evangelical types. That’s probably why apologists try to make Him sound… lame? I don’t know, wouldn’t you rather an ass-kicking warrior for a God than a hippie? It might sound crass… I don’t know.
@@AnUnhappyBusiness Thanks for the explanation, I respect those points, even though I disagree. For me, I have much higher expectations of what an omnipotent & all-loving being would author or inspire as his holy scriptures.
I think if such a being exists and its divine will allows a world where its holy scriptures are indistinguishable from human stories reflecting the attitudes of the time (eg. slavery is acceptable), then said being should not be surprised if those scriptures are dismissed out of hand.
I guess I expect more from an omnipotent being. If I were omnipotent, I would produce holy scriptures which are perfect, thoroughly impeccable, and I would accurately translate it into every language, and update it as language usage changes. I would also multiply copies magically by sending angels coming down from the sky to distribute them, so that it's clear which holy book is the true one and so we would not have this world of confusion which we're now in with all the different religions and sects and holy books.
(Whilst I'm at it, I'd also not allow children to die of starvation, disease or be raped, that too).
@@AnUnhappyBusiness I'm glad you mentioned the LXX. As an Eastern Orthodox Christian, i was already aware that the Hebrew Masoretic Text had issues. The Orthodox Church is always stressing how the LXX is superior to the MT. I just discovered this Channel and i haven't really heard anything that was faith shattering.
December 2nd 2016 is the day my faith died and I stopped believing in god. It was because of a Dramatic experience. Since then I read and watched videos of Bart Ehrman, Sam Harris and of course Richard Dawkins. I've learned so much from them and believe that based on evidence. Science better explains the origin of life. There are several other men I've learned from and watching TH-cam videos like myth vision. I appreciate your channel.
No one knows the origin of life. The bible does have an inner message that exist throughout spiritual systems in every culture. It is hidden but is also within yourself. Ask within yourself for the TRUTH and it will come to you. When the student is ready the teacher shall appear. Keep the LOVE Keep the FAITH.
@@AdonaiZedek No one knows the origin of life, but we do have some compelling, theory-supported and model-supported hypotheses, that comport better with verification process of the scientific method, than any creation tale in any religious text does.
Look into Bernardo Kastrup, here on TH-cam. Reality is much better news.
The scrolls are not allowed to be authenticated outside Israel.
i have listened to both of you. question: what bible should i buy that explains exactly what psalms 22 says ? richard
I am surprised that the Good News Bible has the best translation of Psalms 22:6
The #1 thing I've learned from this is to not to use squiggly lines as characters for your language. Try to use distinct characters that can't be eaaily confused with other characters.
Is Dr. Kipp writing a book that frames all of this with the same degree of clarity? It's absolutely fascinating to see these details... 👍
I never seem to see anyone giving Allegro props for his work, which to me is the most pure and honest take on the Dead Sea Scrolls.
Christian here.
My understanding of Psalm 22 is that Jesus as a Jew who went to synagogue on Saturdays and had discussions with the doctors of the Jewish law was familiar with Psalm 22 as a psalm of despair. So Jesus is bringing it to his mouth asca reglevtion of his despair. The prophetic connotations are added by Christians due to how close the situation of Asaf? was to the situation Of Jesus. Even then it's not completely literal: Jesus was not surrounded by dogs although the Jews may have thought the Romans were dogs. I don't see a problem if instead of "they pierce at my hands and feet" the original is "my hands and feet are being dug hollow as a lion" seems to me lions have long teeth wich act very similar (dig hollow?) as the long nails the Romans used during crucifixion on hands and feet.
This presentation was super awesome! I really like how you drilled down and looked into the "pierced" vs "lion" issue. Based on the context it does seem to me like either one works. For "pierced" it probably makes more sense for it to be translated "they dug into my hands and feet" as in "they tore into my hands and feet" and this would make sense because dogs are known for digging.
Either way, thanks for examining this in detail. A great show!
Dogs are not known for "digging" into flesh, like they dig into dirt. Dogs dig into dirt with their paws. They bite/tear into flesh with their teeth. It is in no way reasonable to think that they would use the word for digging/hollowing out a hole in rock or dirt to describe metaphorical dogs piercing flesh with their natural weapons (i.e., their teeth).
@@JCPRuckus Thanks for taking the time to respond. I think we are always on shaky ground when we say "This can't be a metaphor" or "metaphors can't do that".
Anything can be a metaphor. Also, ancient cultures were much more proficient at using metaphors and their rules for how to use metaphors could be broader or different than ours.
With that said, lets examine more closely why this metaphor does work even if we don't like it for some reason:
1 Dogs dig. As mentioned, this is one of the things that dogs are best known for doing.
2 In crucifixion they did "dig" into his hands and feet. Now in english this sounds strange and we might prefer to say that they "ripped into him" or "tore into him"... but this is the sort of thing that varies with language and "dug into his hands and feet" might be totally normal in ancient Hebrew.
So, given the above, it doesn't really matter if Dogs don't dig into flesh. Dogs dig and the soldiers dug into his hands and feet. The metaphor works and to say otherwise is frankly kind of obtuse.
@@Lpettro - You're completely ignoring that the word for "dig" is used several other times elsewhere , and never in that way. The only thing obtuse is assuming that reading this singular appearance as poetic license is the most reasonable way to interpret it.
Is it possible?... Yes. Is it the most likely explanation, especially considering the additional information that "lions" appear repeatedly as a theme in the surrounding text?... No.
You're deliberately ignoring the simpler and more direct explanation for one that is far more conditional and based on your speculation rather than the rest of the text. Again, if you want to throw around the word "obtuse", maybe don't ignore Occam's Razor.
@Abraham Mani - Lol... If I haven't been convinced yet, I'm certainly not going to be convinced by some rando in the TH-cam comments.
@Abraham ManiGood Wizard has sent me, his PropheTranslator the entire book of Austin. He tells followers of Tadaism in Austin 3:15 that :
“All we need is 100, or maybe 200 eyewitness testimonies to the resurrection of Harry Potter mentioning his lightning bolt scar. That quantity of witnesses is more than the authors of the Gospels supposedly talked to, and that’s the source of their resurrection claims. We will be able to present our eyewitnesses as evidence and hit Christian apologists with that famous Philosopher Stone Cold’s quip: “
May the magic Word of G-d free you from fears of God’s wrath.
I was really looking forward to the subject material, but, for me, Kipp Davis's halting style of speaking, his multi-level rabbit trails, and his general unpreparedness to speak well on a podcast, made it nearly impossible for me to follow him.
cAn you out it on higher speed maybe?
Multi-level rabbit trails? I have no idea of what you are talking about. He always stayed on topic.
A four minute intro. That's a bit grandiose.
15 minutes in, and I’m checking my various versions of the Bible… and the Brenton (English version of the Septuagint) says bless (not curse) in Job 1:11 like the Dead Sea scroll.
So the two oldest versions agree here, and also agree in Deu 32:8 as Dr Michael Heiser points out it not being the children of Israel but sons of God or (lowercase) angels of God
I’m surprised that the ESV version didn’t update this, because they corrected Deu 32:8 because of the Dead Sea Scrolls according to Dr Heiser
Interestingly, the Dead Sea Scrolls agree with the Masoretic on the paternity age of the decedents of Shem in Genesis, but not with the Septuagint, Samaritan Pentateuch, or Flavious Josephus which has the parents being 100 years older making it impossible for Shem to be Mikezeldeck. (Which is another rabbit hole)
Maybe the Samaritans and Josephus were based on the Septuagint as were the people during the time of Christ.
Some claim an anti-Christian motive reducing the age in the Descendants of Shem in the Masoretic text like in that “When were the Pyramids built” video on TH-cam, but that argument can’t be used on the Dead Sea Scrolls. They predate the birth of Christ the only begotten (capital letter) Son of God.
These little differences are fascinating.
Ok back to the video
Belief itself is overrated. Is our tendency to believe acquired by example? Have we been led by expectation? Is the human tendency to take a stand in belief a cultural, traditional compulsion of follow the leader?
Didn't know the sea scroll had pictures of cartoons.
I recall a man suggesting that the first sentence of the Bible should start out as: "The head one of the Gods brought forth the Gods." But a Christian mob hunted him down and shot him to death :/
I prefer the creation according to Mel Brooks: In the beginning there was nothing. And god said 'Let there be light'. And there was still nothing. But now you could see it.
@@danielgautreau161 Yes, that is, and will forever be, a good assessment by Mel Brooks :) The one I usually have the most affinity with is Douglas Adams, In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
Praise to the man.
@@Wonderboywonderings who communed with Jehovah :)
This is kinda confusing , I want to know who do you believe is the true living God , creator of heaven and earth , ? Thank you
"They dug my hands and feet."
Maybe he had nice feet.
what kind of heart it is, that mocks Jesus Christ
Hi Derek...how to deal with people who deny and rely on new testament whenever asked about inhuman verses in old testament?
Isn't it the same father god
Okay I’m only 10 minutes into it, and I’ll keep listening, but I’m getting the idea that, “oh my gosh, there were some among God’s people who worshipped other Gods!” This shouldn’t be surprising. Maybe Dr. Kipp’s point is that it persisted for so long, I don’t know, I’ll keep listening.