Here's the thing. If they're right, and we're wrong, what have we lost living this objectively good life? But if WE'RE right and THEY'RE wrong, they stand to lose everything FOR ETERNITY. So as for me and my family - we will shout and praise Doug all of our days.
You guys don't even keep the first commandment. The Messiah was never believed to be God and the trinity was invented 300 years after Jesus. There was never a trinity of Messiah, Yhwh and HG. The Nt doesn't even go back to Jesus and Jewish Christians thought Jesus is just a prophet. So you guys are wrong, even when God exists. On top of that, Yhwh says to keep the law. 😂
@ as a historian I’m more than aware that Simon was called Cephus by Yeshua because “on this rock.. yadda yadda”. You are correct Peter is a romanised name. Pierre, Pedro, Pedros etc all mean “rock or stone”
@@peterhetherington914 The problem is his actual name was supposed to have been Shimon ben Yonah and it was fictional literary character Jesus the Jew (Yeshua ben Yosef) that changed it to Petros, Greek for "rock". Goofy ridiculous superstitious Jew Junk.
3:29:31 yep, I lost a JW friend last summer because I finally told him some scholarly opinions and all he could do was consult his JW phone app. He just doesn't understand that what he reads in that app is filtered by the governing body and it doesn't tell him everything. When you point that out, it goes totally over his head.
He wouldn’t and nobody would be able to even question him on it…. Someone committing magical acts like all the other evil people at the time though would need to in order to put people under the spell that his magic bullshit is real
Given that his followers were Jews, they would, of course, have interpreted events in the light of their scriptures. We are all children of our own age. Hence the historical-critical method is based on the assumptions that give rise to modern science. That the scientific method may have limits does not occur to many people. Yet we see. a hundred years after Einstein’s general theory was formulated and passed its early test but also quantum theory be formulated and prove its tests, and yet the two remain unreconciled. that atomic theory and modern cosmology have stalled despite the huge number of observations. The same may be said about Darwinism and even genetics. The newest candidate for the throne is AI. BUT all the before is a product of human beings as much as theology. I All theology is based on speculation. But so is modern physics and even modern psychology.
reading herodotus makes the hebrew bible seem so silly. he details the entire prophetic process with the fall of croesus and his war with cyrus. "a great kingdom shall fall", croesus takes this mean the persians will fall and ends up losing thinking the prophets were wrong. its clear what the prophets/oracles/magi were, they were intelligence networks who shaped state policy. they used a mix of intelligence and cold-reading, like john edwards. alot of them rely on writings after the fact, as a way to attach cultural knowledge to history as a way to preserve both. theres an egyptian king who defeats the persians because a bunch of field mice ate all the quivers and bowstrings and linen straps on shields. clearly this never happened, but theyre tackling 2 birds with 1 stone by preserving their history in this way.
Guest dude should write a book on this. But he or another would do the world a favor to make a section or another book on healthy deconversion if there’s such a thing
@@VerbotenBiblia My preliminary conclusion is that judaism offered several ways to become a great man. But being annointed is simply irrelevant in this. So if we do not speak abot messiahs, then are we looking for memorable great men? The question is: is Paul's Jesus a great man? No Paul totally neglects Jesus as a mental being and is only interested in his physical aspects. Did anyone note just how carnal Paul really is when it comes to Jesus? Does Mark portray Jesus as a great man? No he depicts Jesus' mind as a deceptor, liar, hypocrit and imposter whose abysmal social skills have his disciples lead Jesus to exection. In Mark Jesus is a warning sign rather than an example to follow. May the warning serve you well. Does the non-pauline pre markan christianity think of Jesus as a great mind? The silence speaks the opposite.
40:00-40:26 i’m not convinced that the author of “Isaiah” 40-55 was from an “isaiah school.” Seems like an independent commentary on Genesis 1-36 that was viewed as important and then inserted into isaiah.
I always thought that Jesus was sacrificed before he could fulfill his prophecy, he was in the act of doing it when it was cut short, someone didn't believe he was who he claimed he was, isn't that the reason the world hates "THEM", if they didn't have him put on a cross, the world would be at peace and not know war. I agree Jesus fulfilled no prophecy, they took his life before he could. The story is, he is going to return and do what he was unable to do back then. This show is just dumb, it makes no sense. If you go to "THEIR" sites, "THEY" even claim this is the Time of his Return, as in he was here, left, and now is returning.
From “jewishhistory” (d0t) 0rg *_“In the Talmud we are told that there are two personifications of the Messiah. One is the Messiah ben David, i.e. the Messiah from the House of David. He is the ultimate Messiah who will redeem the Children of Israel, introduce a time of peace and prosperity, build the Temple, etc. However, there is a precursor: the Messiah ben Joseph, stemming from the tribe of Joseph. This Messiah will die or be killed, according to the prophecy in the Book of Zechariah (_**_12:10_**_).”_*
"Jesus was sacrificed before he could fulfill his prophecy" ... I can't reconcile omnipotence AND incompetence inferred with equal measure. Like with modern conspiracy theories, it's the all-powerful organization that's incapable of doing anything.
_Daniel 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined._ I believe in Daniel it is prophesied for the Messiah to be cut off. Does this prophecy not get fulfilled?
Praise to Doug. For he was even spoken about in 1 Samuel 17:49-50. If not for Doug, Goliath would have triumphed. And his presence throughout not just Christianity but all human religions is proof Jesus is not the messiah. For they had ascribe Doug’s properties onto Jesus. Being a cornerstone. The spiritual rock. I can’t believe Peter had the audacity to call himself a small stone.
Kipp Davis (more specifically Vish) gave me flak for bringing up Tovia Singer and I accidentally derailed the conversation for 10 minutes about why Tovia was a Jewish Apologist and that going to him to undermine Christianity was akin to fighting fire-with-fire and I do appreciate where they were coming from, but I do think there is something to be said about trying to understand how Apologists see the world. Because if you don't understand their thought process and how they get to their conclusions, then you're just going to talk past each other the entire time. Two people can talk about "Jesus' teachings" and mean vastly different things and I think that's late-stage counter-apologetics like you guys are doing, that can get into how they think and formulate their arguments and point to the cracks _inside_ the theology that's probably more successful than the leading them to hard evidence and trying to convince them that they're wrong, because Apologists will always find ways to argue around the evidence, but they can't argue against their Theology, because thems the rules of the game. That is "divinity" to them, it's the line they can't cross.
Theism is a theory about “spirits.” You assume they do not exist. At the same time you accept the possibility of space aliens. This at the same time that you cannot imagine any truly alien life. Indeed, even human life must be taken as a “give”.
Oh. So the Messiah was Golda Meir? 🤔 As far as prophecy is concerned, nowadays it's just sport. The sport is apologizing when the goalpost has to be rolled forward AGAIN.
There are at least 19 other storied identical to Jesus, so why is there a religion made out of his? Common sense isn’t so common I’ll tell you that. Brainwashing is so easy. People just want something to believe in and comfort their fear of death being the end of their existence.
The Ante Nicene explains why these similarities take place. According to Justin Martyr, the reason similar stories exist across different cultures about divine figures, including Jesus, is because demons, upon hearing prophecies about Christ's coming, intentionally mimicked those stories in an attempt to confuse people and discredit the true message of Christianity; however, these imitations were flawed and inaccurate because the demons misunderstood the prophecies
@@stephenmorrison335 An apologist that fashioned himself a philosopher but couldn't be bothered to be a learned man. Instead he rather went around demanding answers about Gods until one satisfied some abstraction he made up in his mind. Justin was a confirmatory seeker and a dupe.
@@stephenmorrison335 Ad populum logic fallacy. How do you reason the golem of a deity you call yhwh/yeshua isn't a spirit playing a trick? If it was the only truth, why is it a truth that takes beliefs, mythos, and morals from other religions and philosophies so plainly? The more people say one thing doesn't make it true.
David said, 'I have never seen the righteous forsaken, or his seed begging for bread>' Yet the scripture tells you how when he was on the run, and sort of leading a band of rebels, he was hungry, so he went asking Nabal, a loyal citizen to the reigning King, for food for himself and his men. When Nabal refused, David was going to slay the family and take what he wanted. It was only the intervention of Nabal's wife Abigail, who offered him food, that saved their lives. Later David took Abigail as his wife. He probably meant, that the righteous, which obviously included himself, did not have to beg, when they were needy , they could always take by force! This incident was the second time that the scriptures record that he was hungry, like the time when he ate the shew bread.
Around 38 minutes in Justin & Derek are discussing the comprehensive & important role of Old Testament prophets - could they be (somewhat) compared to a "shaman" in many other often much older religions? Just wondering.
Passive Isa 2:2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, [that] the mountain of the LORD’S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it. Apocalyptic Lu 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay [them] before me.
Matthew 22 Whose Son is the Christ? Now, while the Pharisees were gathered together, Jesus asked them a question, 42 saying, “What do you think about the Christ? Whose son is he?” They said to him, “The son of David.” 43 He said to them, “How is it then that David, in the Spirit, calls him Lord, saying, The Lord said to my lord, Sit at my right hand, till I may make thine enemies thy footstool? If then David doth call him lord, how is he his son?' Ps 110:1 The LORD says to my lord [(a) or Lord]: “Sit at my right hand until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet.”
@@Age_of_Magpie Yeah, Matthew states that, then proceeds to provide the Male Lineage from Abraham to David to Joseph. Except in the other "script-ure", it is clearly stated several times, that Joseph was NOT the "father", DOH! Apologists will then try to claim Mary/Merriam was a direct descendant of David. Except the misogynistic Jew-Book "holy bible" does not keep track of the Female Lineage, DOH!
@@voidagent "The prophet like Moses," would not be a member (seed) of any tribe but the brother of all of the tribes. Option 1; The prophet like Moses will be from Ishmaelites or Edomites who would live among Israelites. Option 2; He will be from Moses' seed, but his grand, grand grandfather was born after the speech/ promise. Option 3: He will be born an Israelite but no father involvement, legally an Israelite but with no tribe membership. Deuteronomy 18:15 “The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among you, from your brothers-it is to him you shall listen- 16 just as you desired of the Lord your God at Horeb on the day of the assembly, when you said, ‘Let me not hear again the voice of the Lord my God or see this great fire any more, lest I die.’ 17 And the Lord said to me, ‘They are right in what they have spoken. """"18 I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers.""""!!! And I will put my words in his mouth, and he shall speak to them all that I command him. 19 And whoever will not listen to my words that he shall speak in my name, I myself will require it of him.
Hold it...............De 32:31 For their doug [is] not as our Doug, even our enemies themselves [being] judges. They had him Douged because they wouldnt accept the Doug that built the circe! Doug of Dougs, I am Doug and Doug.
1:03:41-1:03:48 Yeah i doubt that. Jesus was somebody who existed (probably attached to a particular group of pharisees) who was co-opted into the movement of Paul. Nothing more solid than that can be said. Did he claim to be the Son of God? Almost certainly not. Did he claim to be the messiah? Probably not. Did he believe the resurrection took place in the middle of history and he was the first fruits? Probably not.
1:10:20 The connection between Moses and the Exile passages Matthew quotes is the post-Exile hope of a new Exodus? To Matthew, it seems, as Moses oversaw the original Exodus, Jesus will the new Exodus (as a new Moses).
"...all seven of the formula citations [OT quotations] in Matthew 1:1-4:16 are drawn from... passages that portray the restoration of Israel as a new Exodus... there are only a limited number of new Exodus passages in the prophets - between ten and fifteen, depending on how one counts them - and Matthew has drawn all seven of his formula citations from these passages." - Dr. Jeremy Holmes, Wyoming Catholic College (“Matthew as Exegete,” Letter & Spirit. 2012-2013, Vol. 8: 55-76.)
I wanna see him talk with Sam Shamoun but knowing Sam he’ll just start yelling at Justin. I wanna see him talk with Cliffe and Stuart but I just see that ending in “we won’t know”
It's pretty simple. Daniel chapter 2:44, Isaiah chapters 2, 11:1-9, 65:17-25, Zechariah chapter 14, Psalm 2, and Micah chapter 4 are not false prophesies about Jesus (God himself in the flesh)... they just haven't happened yet. "Micah chapter 5 verse 4..." Which only points to the triune God...e.g. "My God, My God, why have you forsaken Me?" (Matthew 27:46) ... and "But to the Son He says: "Your throne, O God, is forever and ever.." (Hebrews 1:8). The Persons of the triune God address one another by the title of 'God'. They equally hold the highest postition of authority, which has the title 'God'. Micah 5:2 also states "The One to be Ruler in Israel, whose goings forth are from old, from everlasting." Everlasting means eternity. Jesus has always existed... because He is God himself in the flesh. Then there was an alledged genealogy problem.... 'Sceptics claim that the genealogies of Matthew and Luke contradict, because they supposedly give different fathers for Joseph, the husband of Mary. However, Luke is tracing Mary’s line, showing that she was also a descendant of David, as implied in Luke 1:32. Conversely Matthew traced the legal line from Joseph to David, but this line was cursed because of Jeconiah (Jer. 22:17-30 ). This curse means that if Joseph had been Jesus’s biological father, then Jesus would not have been eligible to sit on King David’s throne. Here are some reasons that Luke should be understood as giving Mary’s line: Luke’s nativity narrative mainly presents Mary’s perspective, while Matthew presented Joseph’s perspective. So readers of the original Greek would realize that the writers intended to present Mary’s and Joseph’s lines respectively. The reason Luke didn’t mention Mary explicitly is that rules for listing Jewish ancestry generally left out the mothers’ names. A clear pointer to the fact that the genealogy in Luke is Mary’s line is that the Greek text has a definite article before all the names except Joseph’s. Any Greek-speaker would have understood that Heli must have been the father of Joseph’s wife, because the lack of an article would mean that he would insert Joseph into the parenthesis (as was supposed) in Luke 3:23. The great New Testament Greek grammarian A.T. Robertson (1863-1934) writes: “‘The absence of the article puts the name outside of the genealogical series properly so-called.’-Godet. This would seem to indicate that Joseph belonged to the parenthesis, ‘as was supposed.’ It would read thus, ‘being son (as was supposed of Joseph) of Heli.’ Luke had already clearly stated the manner of Christ’s birth, so that no one would think he was son of Joseph. Jesus would thus be Heli’s grandson, an allowable meaning of ‘son’.”45 NB: the original Greek had no punctuation or even spaces between words. Indeed, the Jewish Talmud, no friend of Christianity, dating from the first few centuries AD, calls Mary the “daughter of Heli”, which could have come only from this understanding of what Luke meant.'
@Soapy-chan actually, it is. Cyrus II the Great and Messiah is the only person in the bible or jEebus heresies who emancipated Israel, which is the ONLY thing a Messiah does.
@@davidharner5865 sure but you're watching a video where someone shows you all the other passages that talk about the messiah, so you're wrong and lying
Being a rock that transcends time and space, Doug is immune to the paltry rules of Rock Paper Scissors. To Doug every object is nothing but scissors. A blade to be crushed. You should be thankful Doug is not a vengeful god. Or he might’ve been offended by your attempt at humor.
Jews continue to recite The Psalm of David to this day. I think that there is one translation that refers to dogs "nipping" at his hands and feet. That is a loooong way off from "pierce".
Yall do a good job of explaining what the bible IS NOT, now can someone PLEASE make a clear & concise hypothesis video about what you think it might actually be. Your view of It’s true message & intentions if its not what is traditionally believed
John Yohanan 3:17 says, "For (O Yahuah Yahudah Yirah) did not send his Egyptian Pharaoh Son (Messiah) General Yahusha/Joshua Ha Moshiach Simon Justus Arshakuni Bar Giora Izates Mono Bazus II : The Supreme Sovereign Of The Yahudim into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through him might be saved. John Yohanan 17:12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them my Turah disciples in YOUR name ABBA father (YAH). Those whom you have given me I have kept gaurded them, None of them is lost. John Yohanan 5:43“ If another comes in his own demon name Jesus, him you will receive.
@ I'm just tired of being lied to and I want 2 sets of people that really believe what they're saying. They can't both be right. It's hard to make up your own mind when the conversation is always false.
Technically, it's my understanding that Buddha is NOT even a god. He is the ONLY person that I'm aware of who reached the highest spiritual state of Nirvana, but he was still just a man. So he is revered, but NOT a god. Many Buddhists are atheists, IIRC.
@@davidharner5865 except it's not. it's the Americas at best and north and south america. and most of countries call the US america. the viewpoint that denies that is clearly wrong.
I have listened to many of your podcasts and have a pretty clear idea of what I have observed. Both of you were raised in American Evangelical Christianity. That is a problem for you and your listeners. Most Christians come from the same roots. Most Christians are still entangled in the many accretions added on to the bible…such as Inerrancy and ECT(eternal conscious torture) both of which are false dogmas. There are many more which I won’t mention. I am still a Christian and find I can have fellowship with other Christians despite my fundamental differences in how I view the bible, prophecy and other people who are outside of the faith. Studying the end times in my estimation is an unproductive undertaking because any fruit that might come from it is based on false assumptions. Daniel and Revelations were written to encourage people living at the time of the writings. Revelations was written about 68 AD and was encrypted to hide its findings from getting out to the Romans. It was written to give encouragement to people severely persecuted. Real scholars would know that Revelations is in a class of writings that are highly hyperbolic and addressed not to people 2000 years out but to the local readers. Things will not add up and distort what we think we should be doing today when we read Revelations as a far distant event. These Christians that were poorly taught (most of them) worship a bible that contains 66 individual books bound together and are not homogeneous. A lot of the old testament is simply Jewish history with myth mixed in which may or may not be inspired. As a few learned scholars would say ‘The Bible contains the word of God, but the Bible is not the word of God.” We use our gift of reason to decide which writings we should pay attention to. Martin Luther considered Revelations a poor book from which to draw inspiration and doctrine. These days inerrancy is considered a good litmus test as to whether a person is a Christian or not. No wonder people leave the church. Both of you were also poorly taught in your Christian years. You, using reason, began to form you own theories and opinions about the bible. You began to see the inconsistencies and began your journey to pull away from obvious errors. Christians have their apologetics, but I write frequently to them stating that American Evangelicalism carries with it the seeds of its own destruction which is the false doctrine of Inerrancy and ECT. So I am for the most part untouched by those that are decoupling from Christianity because I was trained properly by the best scholars in England during the last part of the 19th century. I know the bible is faulty. That some of its predictions never came true….so what…I didn’t believe in its accuracy in any manner when it was given to the locals at that time. Christians die a slow death when they find out the truth. It is probably easy for you to smash some of the silly arguments the Christians hold up to you. But you might be attacking them and winning the battle by preventing people from placing their faith in a Savior based upon knowing that their faith has been placed in a Book that is not perfect. Once you destroy the book, the powerful doctrine of inerrancy does the rest. So your strong arguments might be based on false assumptions. Had you known in advance and the people you ministered to knew the truth, I would be willing to bet you might still be a Christian today.
Hopeful135, "We use our gift of reason to decide which writings we should pay attention to." Setting aside that a gift necessitates a gift giver, and that you, nor any other it seems, has demonstrated the existence of the latter, can you see how your statement, to the remainder of us, might appear as, "We use our potentially flawed opinions to decide which writings we like the most"?
@@SkeptiQuest That was a nice clever response which proves you might have a potentially flawed opinion. I'm just stating what I believe, and believe it or not, I do care about those who disagree with me. I have stated what I observe which of course is not the absolute truth but we all have to take a position on what we know now. I may change my views in the future but I respect others opinions that disagree with me. Thanks for considering me worthy of a response. cheers
"We use our gift of reason to decide which writings we should pay attention to". Sorry, but IMHO from my personal atheistic viewpoint, at the end of the day no matter which general philosophy/dogma/mindset Christians adhere to, they are still engaging in primitive superstition/unfounded belief in the supernatural based upon blood sacrifice.
Thank for an interesting discussion. Long comment here - Summary: Jesus was a false Messiah. Per the Church, the Hebrew Bible and all its Prophets are 100% valid forever. Therefore, it's fair to ask any Church apologist or Missionary: Where are the following events or prophesies in the Hebrew Bible that the Church claims are in it? The "virgin birth". Where does the Hebrew Bible say that the Messiah will appear twice, be divine, or semi-divine? Where it notes that the Messiah can appear outside of the Messianic Age, or that the Messiah will appear anytime outside of the Messianic Age. Where in the Hebrew Bible does it state that a savior is required to forgive sin, or that the Messiah will be a savior, or have any purpose or ability related to sin? Since the events of the Messianic Age never occurred, all required for the Messiah's presence, how could Jesus have been the Messiah? Ex - "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war anymore" (Isaiah 2:4) What does the following, Zechariah 8:23, mean? “This is what the LORD of Heaven’s Armies says: In those days ten men from different nations and languages of the world ... will clutch at the sleeve of one Jew. And they will say, ‘Please let us walk with you, for we have heard that God is with you.’” The meaning: When the Messianic Age occurs and real Messiah appears, good people will realize that they have been deceived by Paul and the Church, to follow Christianity, and demonize Jews and Judaism. People will realize that the Noahide path is instructed to the World. How and why? Per very Hebrew Bible, in which ironically, the Church claims is 100% true, valid to this day, and will be for all time. This will occur during the Messianic Age. Isaiah 11:9, 10 "Knowledge of God throughout the world, and obedience to God." Since Isaiah 11 and other required prophesies indicting the Messiah's presence never occurred, Jesus was, is, and will always be, yet another false Messiah. The Messiah can only be present during the Messianic age, which didn't occur 2000 years ago, and still has not. Therefore, Jesus was yet another false Messiah. Big picture, I’m extremely grateful for Christianity. I celebrate a return to better beliefs for many who have worshiped the "false gods" of unbalanced pleasure, non-accountability, materialism, infidelity, and more.
Isa 66:3 He that killeth an ox [is as if] he slew a man; he that sacrificeth a lamb, [as if] he cut off a dog’s neck; he that offereth an oblation, [as if he offered] swine’s blood; he that burneth incense, [as if] he blessed an idol. Yea, they have chosen their own ways, and their soul delighteth in their abominations.
For all the debate and the prophecy or whatever Psalm 22 says, Jesus was quoting it - the event has ample text that tells what was said therein was what they were doing to him - prophecy or not. Don't beat a dead horse to death and pretend the basic thing is disproven. Onediscipletoanother "Romans Proves Paul Lied" - fact is Jesus taught the truth of Elohim.
Since Jesus never existed, what's all the Hub, Bub? Silly nonsense, and a waste of time to focus on irrelevant issues. This is the 21st century after all, try to wake up would ya.😎
Expanding on the superchat I did, religious belief and worship will make people eventually accidentally create tulpas. People now (you can read how to make one or read stories and testimonies from reddit and elsewhere) can basically, with enough time, dedication, and effort create a character/whatever form you want and build them from the ground up. You can make whatever personality, what they sound like and with enough time and effort you can visually impose them into your sight and mind. They will also "act" with their own "mind" and they become a lifetime hardcore imaginary companion. When you read and understand how to make one or read about others stories/testimony you can see how it applies to "god". When you pray, constantly think about god, reading whatever religious texts and basing your idea of god on that and whatever headcanon you have and thinking about what they look like you can see how you can eventually have people "talk" to god or "see" god. You also dont even need to base it on something visual either. The majority of the time tulpas start out as a presence or internal voice thats with you and with enough concentration and effort you can have one on your "mind" 24/7 with you if you want and if you want to be lazy you dont need to do the visual part. It probably didnt help back then when you had everyone around you passively forcing with prayer, constant worship and a idealized adoration of a higher being based on whatever deity you had around you. You can see how things can spiral into a nonstop feedback loop with people reinforcing each others delusions and beliefs because one or a group of people that didnt create a tulpa and then you have one or multiple people that accidentally did telling you about what the tulpa based on the god you are all worshipping told him or what they saw. Personally, it ruins the fun knowing that god is all based on our mind tricking itself because you kept passively forcing whatever idea of god you had and made a tulpa not even realizing it and then trying to get people around you to worship the thing you made in your head.
In the Old Testament Isaiah wrote the messianic prophecy 700 years before Jesus came. - ISAIAH 53:1-12 Magnifying Jesus Through Worship and the Word. - Isaiah 53:2a Isaiah’s Prophecy of the Virgin Birth of Jesus. - Isaiah 53:2b-3 Isaiah’s Prophecy of the Sinless Life of Jesus. - Isaiah 53:5-6 Isaiah’s Prophecy of the Sacrificial Death of Jesus, his crucifixion. - Isaiah 53:5a,6b Jesus Took Our Sins. - 2 Corinthians 5:21. - Isaiah 53:7 and 53:8 Jesus Took Our Shame and Jesus took our suffering. - Isaiah 53:10 Isaiah’s Prophecy of the Resurrection of Jesus! It’s very disingenuous how you conveniently skipped all of the above prophecies and went directly to discussing Matthew and then Isaiah 61: 🤦♀️ smh SHADY and your jokes are corny, could not sit thru this video.
"I agree with that sediment." Damn, that almost passed me by. Nice one!
😆😆
I don’t take this humor forgranite.
Here's the thing. If they're right, and we're wrong, what have we lost living this objectively good life? But if WE'RE right and THEY'RE wrong, they stand to lose everything FOR ETERNITY. So as for me and my family - we will shout and praise Doug all of our days.
the problem with these kind of statements are they are founded in fear. An ego response essentially.
@Daniel-Tiger what can I say? I'm a Doug-fearin' man.
Hmm......I wouldnt go that far.
If you believe because you fear hell, then it’s not love or faith driving. It’s fear.
You guys don't even keep the first commandment. The Messiah was never believed to be God and the trinity was invented 300 years after Jesus. There was never a trinity of Messiah, Yhwh and HG. The Nt doesn't even go back to Jesus and Jewish Christians thought Jesus is just a prophet. So you guys are wrong, even when God exists. On top of that, Yhwh says to keep the law. 😂
The two of you vibe very well together 😂👌🏼
Agreed. I feel like we're long lost brothers
The puns at the beginning were rock hard
Agreed, they went right into it with the jokes. Not a rocky start at all!
Solid foundation.
My name is Peter my name means “rock” I have always been of Doug, all blessings to Doug in his rockiness.
The phrase in Matthew is "Simon who is called Peter". All the names in the new testes-ment are the Romanized versions of the Hebrew names.
@ as a historian I’m more than aware that Simon was called Cephus by Yeshua because “on this rock.. yadda yadda”. You are correct Peter is a romanised name. Pierre, Pedro, Pedros etc all mean “rock or stone”
@@peterhetherington914 The problem is his actual name was supposed to have been Shimon ben Yonah and it was fictional literary character Jesus the Jew (Yeshua ben Yosef) that changed it to Petros, Greek for "rock". Goofy ridiculous superstitious Jew Junk.
Banter in this discussion was 11/10. Love you both ❤
Been deep diving Justin’s content. He’s a gangsta.
@Taylordessalines he is an illiterate hater of Culture?
Great Show! Been watching Justin on TikTok for a couple years. Has helped me a bunch. Good to see him on Mythvision!
I love seeing Justin out of tiktok and out with other awesome scholars and commentators. It’s like seeing a friend of a friend succeed.
Amazing. 🥰
3:29:31 yep, I lost a JW friend last summer because I finally told him some scholarly opinions and all he could do was consult his JW phone app. He just doesn't understand that what he reads in that app is filtered by the governing body and it doesn't tell him everything. When you point that out, it goes totally over his head.
OMG! Mythvision, DZ, and Doug are my holy trinity! ❤️❤️
Is it coincidence I’ve been told I look like Sharon Stone my entire life? I think not.
The Trinity is the first non-binary
Listening to the Rolling Stones on the radio as background music while I watch this episode. The Stones song is "Rocks Off" believe it or not! 😃
But my thing is according to Christian’s, Jesus is God. Why would God need to go through any of this stuff?
He wouldn’t and nobody would be able to even question him on it….
Someone committing magical acts like all the other evil people at the time though would need to in order to put people under the spell that his magic bullshit is real
Well most storytellers of the new testament did not see him as a god or at least not as the one.
Given that his followers were Jews, they would, of course, have interpreted events in the light of their scriptures. We are all children of our own age. Hence the historical-critical method is based on the assumptions that give rise to modern science.
That the scientific method may have limits does not occur to many people. Yet we see. a hundred years after Einstein’s general theory was formulated and passed its early test but also quantum theory be formulated and prove its tests, and yet the two remain unreconciled. that atomic theory and modern cosmology have stalled despite the huge number of observations. The same may be said about Darwinism and even genetics. The newest candidate for the throne is AI. BUT all the before is a product of human beings as much as theology.
I
All theology is based on speculation. But so is modern physics and even modern psychology.
Justin and Doug rock hard!
"that's why Peter wanted to be crucified upside down", holy shite man! 🤣
Maintain your Dougnity. Stay hard when the sandstone comes.
RHFD 🪨🙏🪨
reading herodotus makes the hebrew bible seem so silly. he details the entire prophetic process with the fall of croesus and his war with cyrus. "a great kingdom shall fall", croesus takes this mean the persians will fall and ends up losing thinking the prophets were wrong. its clear what the prophets/oracles/magi were, they were intelligence networks who shaped state policy. they used a mix of intelligence and cold-reading, like john edwards. alot of them rely on writings after the fact, as a way to attach cultural knowledge to history as a way to preserve both. theres an egyptian king who defeats the persians because a bunch of field mice ate all the quivers and bowstrings and linen straps on shields. clearly this never happened, but theyre tackling 2 birds with 1 stone by preserving their history in this way.
The thumbnail had me rotff 😂😂
Guest dude should write a book on this. But he or another would do the world a favor to make a section or another book on healthy deconversion if there’s such a thing
These two look like brothers
I love that intro logo hahaha awesome
This video motivated me to write a text asking: Is it possible to be a messiah according to jewish conceptions?
Problem is there are messiahs a plenty in the OT. Anyone "anointed" was moschiach. It all goes out the door in the NT.
@@VerbotenBiblia
My preliminary conclusion is that judaism offered several ways to become a great man. But being annointed is simply irrelevant in this.
So if we do not speak abot messiahs, then are we looking for memorable great men?
The question is: is Paul's Jesus a great man? No Paul totally neglects Jesus as a mental being and is only interested in his physical aspects. Did anyone note just how carnal Paul really is when it comes to Jesus?
Does Mark portray Jesus as a great man? No he depicts Jesus' mind as a deceptor, liar, hypocrit and imposter whose abysmal social skills have his disciples lead Jesus to exection. In Mark Jesus is a warning sign rather than an example to follow. May the warning serve you well.
Does the non-pauline pre markan christianity think of Jesus as a great mind? The silence speaks the opposite.
40:00-40:26 i’m not convinced that the author of “Isaiah” 40-55 was from an “isaiah school.” Seems like an independent commentary on Genesis 1-36 that was viewed as important and then inserted into isaiah.
I always thought that Jesus was sacrificed before he could fulfill his prophecy, he was in the act of doing it when it was cut short, someone didn't believe he was who he claimed he was, isn't that the reason the world hates "THEM", if they didn't have him put on a cross, the world would be at peace and not know war.
I agree Jesus fulfilled no prophecy, they took his life before he could. The story is, he is going to return and do what he was unable to do back then.
This show is just dumb, it makes no sense. If you go to "THEIR" sites, "THEY" even claim this is the Time of his Return, as in he was here, left, and now is returning.
From “jewishhistory” (d0t) 0rg
*_“In the Talmud we are told that there are two personifications of the Messiah. One is the Messiah ben David, i.e. the Messiah from the House of David. He is the ultimate Messiah who will redeem the Children of Israel, introduce a time of peace and prosperity, build the Temple, etc. However, there is a precursor: the Messiah ben Joseph, stemming from the tribe of Joseph. This Messiah will die or be killed, according to the prophecy in the Book of Zechariah (_**_12:10_**_).”_*
"Jesus was sacrificed before he could fulfill his prophecy"
... I can't reconcile omnipotence AND incompetence inferred with equal measure. Like with modern conspiracy theories, it's the all-powerful organization that's incapable of doing anything.
_Daniel 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined._
I believe in Daniel it is prophesied for the Messiah to be cut off. Does this prophecy not get fulfilled?
Praise to Doug. For he was even spoken about in 1 Samuel 17:49-50. If not for Doug, Goliath would have triumphed. And his presence throughout not just Christianity but all human religions is proof Jesus is not the messiah. For they had ascribe Doug’s properties onto Jesus. Being a cornerstone. The spiritual rock. I can’t believe Peter had the audacity to call himself a small stone.
✊🪨
Praise to Doug our lord and savior ❤@@Deconstruction_Zone
Kipp Davis (more specifically Vish) gave me flak for bringing up Tovia Singer and I accidentally derailed the conversation for 10 minutes about why Tovia was a Jewish Apologist and that going to him to undermine Christianity was akin to fighting fire-with-fire and I do appreciate where they were coming from, but I do think there is something to be said about trying to understand how Apologists see the world. Because if you don't understand their thought process and how they get to their conclusions, then you're just going to talk past each other the entire time.
Two people can talk about "Jesus' teachings" and mean vastly different things and I think that's late-stage counter-apologetics like you guys are doing, that can get into how they think and formulate their arguments and point to the cracks _inside_ the theology that's probably more successful than the leading them to hard evidence and trying to convince them that they're wrong, because Apologists will always find ways to argue around the evidence, but they can't argue against their Theology, because thems the rules of the game. That is "divinity" to them, it's the line they can't cross.
Praise Doug 🙏🙏 🎉🎉🎉🎉
RHFD
The heads of theists watching this must be spinning or exploding. 😂
Theism is a theory about “spirits.” You assume they do not exist. At the same time you accept the possibility of space aliens. This at the same time that you cannot imagine any truly alien life. Indeed, even human life must be taken as a “give”.
You guys were on fire for Doug! Funny and informative 😊
Oh. So the Messiah was Golda Meir? 🤔
As far as prophecy is concerned, nowadays it's just sport.
The sport is apologizing when the goalpost has to be rolled forward AGAIN.
34:10 I love the lottery 😂😂😂
Doug it with me to the truth.
Our Doug
is a decent Doug,
he reigns
in Sheboygan above
Hard for Doug.
2:25:00 Thank you Jesus, for saving the stream.
There is power in the name!🙌
Praise Doug 🙏🙏🎉🎉
@QuestionThingsUseLogic Blessed be the name of Doug🙏
@Michael-Archonaeus 🪨👀😇
Doug is the only way to heaven!
@@XxcodyhxX Gotta walk that hard rocky road! Hard rock hallelujah!
There are at least 19 other storied identical to Jesus, so why is there a religion made out of his? Common sense isn’t so common I’ll tell you that. Brainwashing is so easy. People just want something to believe in and comfort their fear of death being the end of their existence.
The Ante Nicene explains why these similarities take place.
According to Justin Martyr, the reason similar stories exist across different cultures about divine figures, including Jesus, is because demons, upon hearing prophecies about Christ's coming, intentionally mimicked those stories in an attempt to confuse people and discredit the true message of Christianity; however, these imitations were flawed and inaccurate because the demons misunderstood the prophecies
@@stephenmorrison335 An apologist that fashioned himself a philosopher but couldn't be bothered to be a learned man. Instead he rather went around demanding answers about Gods until one satisfied some abstraction he made up in his mind. Justin was a confirmatory seeker and a dupe.
@ you may have a point if he was the only one saying this, however that is not the case.
@@stephenmorrison335 Ad populum logic fallacy. How do you reason the golem of a deity you call yhwh/yeshua isn't a spirit playing a trick? If it was the only truth, why is it a truth that takes beliefs, mythos, and morals from other religions and philosophies so plainly? The more people say one thing doesn't make it true.
@ In-fact it's more likely your god is a lying demon. He doesn't fulfill what your god said the messiah would fulfill.
As a baptist, his hands and his feet were shriveled, by the water.
Independent search for Truth
Excellent 😂 thanks very much 😮😅
David said, 'I have never seen the righteous forsaken, or his seed begging for bread>' Yet the scripture tells you how when he was on the run, and sort of leading a band of rebels, he was hungry, so he went asking Nabal, a loyal citizen to the reigning King, for food for himself and his men. When Nabal refused, David was going to slay the family and take what he wanted. It was only the intervention of Nabal's wife Abigail, who offered him food, that saved their lives. Later David took Abigail as his wife. He probably meant, that the righteous, which obviously included himself, did not have to beg, when they were needy , they could always take by force! This incident was the second time that the scriptures record that he was hungry, like the time when he ate the shew bread.
Around 38 minutes in Justin & Derek are discussing the comprehensive & important role of Old Testament prophets - could they be (somewhat) compared to a "shaman" in many other often much older religions? Just wondering.
Passive
Isa 2:2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, [that] the mountain of the LORD’S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.
Apocalyptic
Lu 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay [them] before me.
Jesus did not believe that Messiah would be the son of David. So, the Old Testament-related passages should be carefully examined.
Matthew 22 Whose Son is the Christ?
Now, while the Pharisees were gathered together, Jesus asked them a question, 42 saying, “What do you think about the Christ? Whose son is he?” They said to him, “The son of David.” 43 He said to them, “How is it then that David, in the Spirit, calls him Lord, saying, The Lord said to my lord, Sit at my right hand, till I may make thine enemies thy footstool? If then David doth call him lord, how is he his son?'
Ps 110:1 The LORD says to my lord [(a) or Lord]: “Sit at my right hand until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet.”
Ezekiel 34.24
And I, Yahweh, will be their God, and (my beloved)/(david) servant shall be prince among them; I, Yahweh, have spoken.
@@Age_of_Magpie Yeah, Matthew states that, then proceeds to provide the Male Lineage from Abraham to David to Joseph. Except in the other "script-ure", it is clearly stated several times, that Joseph was NOT the "father", DOH! Apologists will then try to claim Mary/Merriam was a direct descendant of David. Except the misogynistic Jew-Book "holy bible" does not keep track of the Female Lineage, DOH!
@@voidagent "The prophet like Moses," would not be a member (seed) of any tribe but the brother of all of the tribes. Option 1; The prophet like Moses will be from Ishmaelites or Edomites who would live among Israelites. Option 2; He will be from Moses' seed, but his grand, grand grandfather was born after the speech/ promise. Option 3: He will be born an Israelite but no father involvement, legally an Israelite but with no tribe membership.
Deuteronomy 18:15 “The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among you, from your brothers-it is to him you shall listen- 16 just as you desired of the Lord your God at Horeb on the day of the assembly, when you said, ‘Let me not hear again the voice of the Lord my God or see this great fire any more, lest I die.’ 17 And the Lord said to me, ‘They are right in what they have spoken. """"18 I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers.""""!!! And I will put my words in his mouth, and he shall speak to them all that I command him. 19 And whoever will not listen to my words that he shall speak in my name, I myself will require it of him.
What a Dougdamn mess !
2 hrs and 41 min - Peter with a talking dog and talking baby? Sounds like family guy
31:57 My head is going to fall off, I'm nodding so hard. Y'all just crystallized my thoughts into words. Retconning fossils. 🖖🤙
I missed the time when you were sharing your mystical lottery winning. Am I too late to claim my share? 😁
Starts @ 10:40
Let's match up Deuteronomy 18:22 with Matthew 24:34 (Jesus as a prophet)
1:25:10-1:25:15 Ooh, keep in mind that none of that was in Marcion’s Evangelion. It was quite literally manufactured on the fly.
Hold it...............De 32:31 For their doug [is] not as our Doug, even our enemies themselves [being] judges.
They had him Douged because they wouldnt accept the Doug that built the circe! Doug of Dougs, I am Doug and Doug.
We are not the Judean People's Front! We are the People's Front of Judah! SOmething like that. ROFL
Don’t take Doug for granite. 🪨
Why are you guys not showing this to sam shamoun I mean scam shamoun and David Cook
1:03:41-1:03:48 Yeah i doubt that. Jesus was somebody who existed (probably attached to a particular group of pharisees) who was co-opted into the movement of Paul. Nothing more solid than that can be said. Did he claim to be the Son of God? Almost certainly not. Did he claim to be the messiah? Probably not. Did he believe the resurrection took place in the middle of history and he was the first fruits? Probably not.
Zero evidence a YAHWEH-incarnate Jesus the Jew ever existed and multiple proofs in the new testes-ment that he is a fictional literary character.
1:10:20 The connection between Moses and the Exile passages Matthew quotes is the post-Exile hope of a new Exodus? To Matthew, it seems, as Moses oversaw the original Exodus, Jesus will the new Exodus (as a new Moses).
"...all seven of the formula citations [OT quotations] in Matthew 1:1-4:16 are drawn from... passages that portray the restoration of Israel as a new Exodus... there are only a limited number of new Exodus passages in the prophets - between ten and fifteen, depending on how one counts them - and Matthew has drawn all seven of his formula citations from these passages." - Dr. Jeremy Holmes, Wyoming Catholic College (“Matthew as Exegete,” Letter & Spirit. 2012-2013, Vol. 8: 55-76.)
I wanna see him talk with Sam Shamoun but knowing Sam he’ll just start yelling at Justin.
I wanna see him talk with Cliffe and Stuart but I just see that ending in “we won’t know”
14:37-14:40 It reads like an interpolation from the time of chronicles (450ish BCE).
I got a Pet Rock around 1970.
It's pretty simple. Daniel chapter 2:44, Isaiah chapters 2, 11:1-9, 65:17-25, Zechariah chapter 14, Psalm 2, and Micah chapter 4 are not false prophesies about Jesus (God himself in the flesh)... they just haven't happened yet.
"Micah chapter 5 verse 4..."
Which only points to the triune God...e.g. "My God, My God, why have you forsaken Me?" (Matthew 27:46) ... and "But to the Son He says: "Your throne, O God, is forever and ever.." (Hebrews 1:8). The Persons of the triune God address one another by the title of 'God'. They equally hold the highest postition of authority, which has the title 'God'.
Micah 5:2 also states "The One to be Ruler in Israel, whose goings forth are from old, from everlasting." Everlasting means eternity. Jesus has always existed... because He is God himself in the flesh.
Then there was an alledged genealogy problem....
'Sceptics claim that the genealogies of Matthew and Luke contradict, because they supposedly give different fathers for Joseph, the husband of Mary.
However, Luke is tracing Mary’s line, showing that she was also a descendant of David, as implied in Luke 1:32. Conversely Matthew traced the legal line from Joseph to David, but this line was cursed because of Jeconiah (Jer. 22:17-30 ). This curse means that if Joseph had been Jesus’s biological father, then Jesus would not have been eligible to sit on King David’s throne. Here are some reasons that Luke should be understood as giving Mary’s line:
Luke’s nativity narrative mainly presents Mary’s perspective, while Matthew presented Joseph’s perspective. So readers of the original Greek would realize that the writers intended to present Mary’s and Joseph’s lines respectively.
The reason Luke didn’t mention Mary explicitly is that rules for listing Jewish ancestry generally left out the mothers’ names.
A clear pointer to the fact that the genealogy in Luke is Mary’s line is that the Greek text has a definite article before all the names except Joseph’s. Any Greek-speaker would have understood that Heli must have been the father of Joseph’s wife, because the lack of an article would mean that he would insert Joseph into the parenthesis (as was supposed) in Luke 3:23. The great New Testament Greek grammarian A.T. Robertson (1863-1934) writes: “‘The absence of the article puts the name outside of the genealogical series properly so-called.’-Godet. This would seem to indicate that Joseph belonged to the parenthesis, ‘as was supposed.’ It would read thus, ‘being son (as was supposed of Joseph) of Heli.’ Luke had already clearly stated the manner of Christ’s birth, so that no one would think he was son of Joseph. Jesus would thus be Heli’s grandson, an allowable meaning of ‘son’.”45 NB: the original Greek had no punctuation or even spaces between words. Indeed, the Jewish Talmud, no friend of Christianity, dating from the first few centuries AD, calls Mary the “daughter of Heli”, which could have come only from this understanding of what Luke meant.'
“That false prophet that tried to take Doug’s place”
Honi the circle maker?
How is knowledge possible and how do you know that what you think you know is true?
Yahoo Wahoo according to the Cartoon History of the Universe.
Is he in James White’s office?
The bible is a compilation of ancient manuscripts not the word of god😂
The only quote in the bible about an actual Messiah is Isaiah 45:1.
that's not true
@Soapy-chan actually, it is. Cyrus II the Great and Messiah is the only person in the bible or jEebus heresies who emancipated Israel, which is the ONLY thing a Messiah does.
it's not though
@@Soapy-chan research is a goodness
@@davidharner5865 sure but you're watching a video where someone shows you all the other passages that talk about the messiah, so you're wrong and lying
Doug died once it met paper.
Being a rock that transcends time and space, Doug is immune to the paltry rules of Rock Paper Scissors. To Doug every object is nothing but scissors. A blade to be crushed. You should be thankful Doug is not a vengeful god. Or he might’ve been offended by your attempt at humor.
I thought his name was Brian... 🤔
Jews continue to recite The Psalm of David to this day. I think that there is one translation that refers to dogs "nipping" at his hands and feet. That is a loooong way off from "pierce".
Yall do a good job of explaining what the bible IS NOT, now can someone PLEASE make a clear & concise hypothesis video about what you think it might actually be. Your view of It’s true message & intentions if its not what is traditionally believed
If Jesus existed, he was the one who stopped the massacres of children and animals sacrificed to the god Baal-Yahweh.
3 1/2 hours to explain this guys I need a summary please
Jesus was not the Messiah.
None of the messianic prophecies are fulfilled by Jesus, unless you think riding a donkey covers one.
John Yohanan 3:17 says, "For (O Yahuah Yahudah Yirah) did not send his Egyptian Pharaoh Son (Messiah) General Yahusha/Joshua Ha Moshiach Simon Justus Arshakuni Bar Giora Izates Mono Bazus II : The Supreme Sovereign Of The Yahudim into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through him might be saved. John Yohanan 17:12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them my Turah disciples in YOUR name ABBA father (YAH). Those whom you have given me I have kept gaurded them, None of them is lost. John Yohanan 5:43“ If another comes in his own demon name Jesus, him you will receive.
i would really like to see you argue these points with respected Christian pastors.
I'm hoping as Justin's channel grows more, he'll start getting their attention. I'm looking forward to it!
Respected? Might be difficult to find any then.
I've debated a few and even a bishop. Clips are on my channel
pastors aren't good at this
@ I'm just tired of being lied to and I want 2 sets of people that really believe what they're saying. They can't both be right. It's hard to make up your own mind when the conversation is always false.
Technically, it's my understanding that Buddha is NOT even a god. He is the ONLY person that I'm aware of who reached the highest spiritual state of Nirvana, but he was still just a man. So he is revered, but NOT a god. Many Buddhists are atheists, IIRC.
Where you gonna do a phd?
Looking at Cornell, OSU, or Toronto U.
America is two continents, will they both be at peace?
America is either one continent or the name for the US
@Soapy-chan incorrect. 'America' is two continents or one Hemisphere, depending on your viewpoint.
@@davidharner5865 except it's not. it's the Americas at best and north and south america. and most of countries call the US america. the viewpoint that denies that is clearly wrong.
Speaking of myth and reality, wouldn't The Telepathy Tapes be type of gnosis?
I have listened to many of your podcasts and have a pretty clear idea of what I have observed. Both of you were raised in American Evangelical Christianity. That is a problem for you and your listeners.
Most Christians come from the same roots. Most Christians are still entangled in the many accretions added on to the bible…such as Inerrancy and ECT(eternal conscious torture) both of which are false dogmas. There are many more which I won’t mention. I am still a Christian and find I can have fellowship with other Christians despite my fundamental differences in how I view the bible, prophecy and other people who are outside of the faith. Studying the end times in my estimation is an unproductive undertaking because any fruit that might come from it is based on false assumptions. Daniel and Revelations were written to encourage people living at the time of the writings. Revelations was written about 68 AD and was encrypted to hide its findings from getting out to the Romans. It was written to give encouragement to people severely persecuted. Real scholars would know that Revelations is in a class of writings that are highly hyperbolic and addressed not to people 2000 years out but to the local readers. Things will not add up and distort what we think we should be doing today when we read Revelations as a far distant event.
These Christians that were poorly taught (most of them) worship a bible that contains 66 individual books bound together and are not homogeneous. A lot of the old testament is simply Jewish history with myth mixed in which may or may not be inspired. As a few learned scholars would say ‘The Bible contains the word of God, but the Bible is not the word of God.” We use our gift of reason to decide which writings we should pay attention to. Martin Luther considered Revelations a poor book from which to draw inspiration and doctrine. These days inerrancy is considered a good litmus test as to whether a person is a Christian or not. No wonder people leave the church.
Both of you were also poorly taught in your Christian years. You, using reason, began to form you own theories and opinions about the bible. You began to see the inconsistencies and began your journey to pull away from obvious errors. Christians have their apologetics, but I write frequently to them stating that American Evangelicalism carries with it the seeds of its own destruction which is the false doctrine of Inerrancy and ECT. So I am for the most part untouched by those that are decoupling from Christianity because I was trained properly by the best scholars in England during the last part of the 19th century. I know the bible is faulty. That some of its predictions never came true….so what…I didn’t believe in its accuracy in any manner when it was given to the locals at that time.
Christians die a slow death when they find out the truth. It is probably easy for you to smash some of the silly arguments the Christians hold up to you. But you might be attacking them and winning the battle by preventing people from placing their faith in a Savior based upon knowing that their faith has been placed in a Book that is not perfect. Once you destroy the book, the powerful doctrine of inerrancy does the rest.
So your strong arguments might be based on false assumptions. Had you known in advance and the people you ministered to knew the truth, I would be willing to bet you might still be a Christian today.
Hopeful135,
"We use our gift of reason to decide which writings we should pay attention to."
Setting aside that a gift necessitates a gift giver, and that you, nor any other it seems, has demonstrated the existence of the latter, can you see how your statement, to the remainder of us, might appear as, "We use our potentially flawed opinions to decide which writings we like the most"?
@@SkeptiQuest That was a nice clever response which proves you might have a potentially flawed opinion. I'm just stating what I believe, and believe it or not, I do care about those who disagree with me. I have stated what I observe which of course is not the absolute truth but we all have to take a position on what we know now. I may change my views in the future but I respect others opinions that disagree with me. Thanks for considering me worthy of a response. cheers
The nineteenth century..
I am estimating a minimum age of 140 years old.
Jfc! TLDR
"We use our gift of reason to decide which writings we should pay attention to". Sorry, but IMHO from my personal atheistic viewpoint, at the end of the day no matter which general philosophy/dogma/mindset Christians adhere to, they are still engaging in primitive superstition/unfounded belief in the supernatural based upon blood sacrifice.
Thank for an interesting discussion.
Long comment here - Summary: Jesus was a false Messiah.
Per the Church, the Hebrew Bible and all its Prophets are 100% valid forever.
Therefore, it's fair to ask any Church apologist or Missionary:
Where are the following events or prophesies in the Hebrew Bible that the Church claims are in it?
The "virgin birth".
Where does the Hebrew Bible say that the Messiah will appear twice,
be divine, or semi-divine?
Where it notes that the Messiah can appear outside of the Messianic Age,
or that the Messiah will appear anytime outside of the Messianic Age.
Where in the Hebrew Bible does it state that a savior is required to forgive sin,
or that the Messiah will be a savior, or have any purpose or ability related to sin?
Since the events of the Messianic Age never occurred, all required for the Messiah's presence,
how could Jesus have been the Messiah?
Ex -
"Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war anymore" (Isaiah 2:4)
What does the following, Zechariah 8:23, mean?
“This is what the LORD of Heaven’s Armies says:
In those days ten men from different nations and languages of the world
... will clutch at the sleeve of one Jew.
And they will say,
‘Please let us walk with you, for we have heard that God is with you.’”
The meaning:
When the Messianic Age occurs and real Messiah appears, good people will realize that they have been deceived by Paul and the Church, to follow Christianity, and demonize Jews and Judaism.
People will realize that the Noahide path is instructed to the World.
How and why?
Per very Hebrew Bible, in which ironically, the Church claims is 100% true, valid to this day, and will be for all time.
This will occur during the Messianic Age.
Isaiah 11:9, 10
"Knowledge of God throughout the world, and obedience to God."
Since Isaiah 11 and other required prophesies indicting the Messiah's presence never occurred,
Jesus was, is, and will always be, yet another false Messiah.
The Messiah can only be present during the Messianic age, which didn't occur 2000 years ago, and still has not. Therefore, Jesus was yet another false Messiah.
Big picture, I’m extremely grateful for Christianity.
I celebrate a return to better beliefs for many who have worshiped the "false gods" of unbalanced pleasure, non-accountability, materialism, infidelity, and more.
Glad you got that off your chest.
Isa 66:3 He that killeth an ox [is as if] he slew a man; he that sacrificeth a lamb, [as if] he cut off a dog’s neck; he that offereth an oblation, [as if he offered] swine’s blood; he that burneth incense, [as if] he blessed an idol. Yea, they have chosen their own ways, and their soul delighteth in their abominations.
Does that mean Jesus is a very naughty boy?
I knew I wouldn’t be the first to say that.
The intro about Doug … hilarious….😆 😂 …. Cracking up …. Love it …
Didn't Jesus have a twin named Didimus Thomas? Maybe he was Jesus's impersonator?!?
What if the Bible is just like a movie script?
More like an irrational delusional fantasy tale.
The NT was written as a play, with the main author, Arrius Piso, playing the part of jesus and later, Peter. It is called the _script_ ure.
It was the Game of Thrones of its time.
Jesus was not buried in the heart of the earth . Is the proof.
For all the debate and the prophecy or whatever Psalm 22 says, Jesus was quoting it - the event has ample text that tells what was said therein was what they were doing to him - prophecy or not. Don't beat a dead horse to death and pretend the basic thing is disproven. Onediscipletoanother "Romans Proves Paul Lied" - fact is Jesus taught the truth of Elohim.
Since Jesus never existed, what's all the Hub, Bub? Silly nonsense, and a waste of time to focus on irrelevant issues. This is the 21st century after all, try to wake up would ya.😎
Psalm 69 is divine.
vinegar maybe vinalcool has like 6% alchohol, its realy drinkable
Lol you're not a cult leader?? I been following you for over a year
Expanding on the superchat I did, religious belief and worship will make people eventually accidentally create tulpas.
People now (you can read how to make one or read stories and testimonies from reddit and elsewhere) can basically, with enough time, dedication, and effort create a character/whatever form you want and build them from the ground up. You can make whatever personality, what they sound like and with enough time and effort you can visually impose them into your sight and mind. They will also "act" with their own "mind" and they become a lifetime hardcore imaginary companion.
When you read and understand how to make one or read about others stories/testimony you can see how it applies to "god". When you pray, constantly think about god, reading whatever religious texts and basing your idea of god on that and whatever headcanon you have and thinking about what they look like you can see how you can eventually have people "talk" to god or "see" god. You also dont even need to base it on something visual either. The majority of the time tulpas start out as a presence or internal voice thats with you and with enough concentration and effort you can have one on your "mind" 24/7 with you if you want and if you want to be lazy you dont need to do the visual part.
It probably didnt help back then when you had everyone around you passively forcing with prayer, constant worship and a idealized adoration of a higher being based on whatever deity you had around you. You can see how things can spiral into a nonstop feedback loop with people reinforcing each others delusions and beliefs because one or a group of people that didnt create a tulpa and then you have one or multiple people that accidentally did telling you about what the tulpa based on the god you are all worshipping told him or what they saw.
Personally, it ruins the fun knowing that god is all based on our mind tricking itself because you kept passively forcing whatever idea of god you had and made a tulpa not even realizing it and then trying to get people around you to worship the thing you made in your head.
Do people normally come here to post their dissertations? I’m new
In the Old concealed in the New revealed babyyyyyyyyy
so funny seeing christians coping and seething in the comments when someone reads their holy book to them
Derek, Jason Decosta the Pope of AIO is not happy with you.
In the Old Testament Isaiah wrote the messianic prophecy 700 years before Jesus came. - ISAIAH 53:1-12 Magnifying Jesus Through Worship and the Word. - Isaiah 53:2a Isaiah’s Prophecy of the Virgin Birth of Jesus. - Isaiah 53:2b-3 Isaiah’s Prophecy of the Sinless Life of Jesus. - Isaiah 53:5-6 Isaiah’s Prophecy of the Sacrificial Death of Jesus, his crucifixion. - Isaiah 53:5a,6b Jesus Took Our Sins. - 2 Corinthians 5:21. - Isaiah 53:7 and 53:8 Jesus Took Our Shame and Jesus took our suffering. - Isaiah 53:10 Isaiah’s Prophecy of the Resurrection of Jesus! It’s very disingenuous how you conveniently skipped all of the above prophecies and went directly to discussing Matthew and then Isaiah 61: 🤦♀️ smh SHADY and your jokes are corny, could not sit thru this video.
I couldn't either. ☺
The blind leading the blind
👍👍
666 thanks for sharing with that spiritual Lottery win
Who is Doug😂
But there are four different Jesus in the Bible how to deal with that
5 different ones, as you missed Paul. As half of Paul's letters are contested as fraud, we gave even more Iesous figures in the collection
Who us Dough😅