Clarifying in case it gets lost in translation: the Moondrop LINK app is not required for the DSP to work. The Default profile is baked into the DSP cable right out of the box, so in that regard it is immediately plug-and-play. No additional EQ software is required.
what if people switch cables? will it still sound almost the same? I think it's better for the default preset to be applied on the IEM itself, not on the dsp cable. I saw reviewers get disappointed that they can't use it on their current system with analog as the tuning is baked on the dsp cable.
@alrizo1115 DSP still requires a DAC of some sort. What you're referring to is analog tuning, and the DUSK has been deliberately tuned to match the Blessing2:Dusk in analog due to the universal praise it got. The Default DSP preset is a different flavour, one that is apparently even more universally praised compared to the B2:D, but relies on the DAC chipset in the USB-C connection.
@@alrizo1115doing it on the IEM would have basically been impossible. Let's say you're using the 3.5 mm cable. The signal would go from digital to analog from phone to cable. Then the IEM would have to convert analog to digital, back to analog. That would be such a mess to engineer and tune right.
@@alrizo1115 Crin explained this in his full video but basically the default DSP is just little bits a pieces to make it perfect. The Dusk is supposed to be tuned really well acoustically in analog but due to engineering limitations they included DSP to perfect the tuning. Its quite literally just a free upgrade, I do think it should be included in the form of PEQ files for download as well though.
@crin can you confirm if the analog is indeed B2D preset? because I was going to find B2D in used instead of these. If these fulfill that requirement and their DSP is good too, then this Dusk makes more sense.
Just a note, turns out the sub bass boost on the DF tilt preset is due to issues when using peak filters below 65hz. Apparently reducing it there introduced noise, so they didn't do it.
If only the app was open source so developers or people who know how to fix the apps can fix it using Moondrop open source publicly available code source to work with. And also with opening the code for everyone, it help the development faster and moondo would not be accused of secretly spying on users.
@ is this considered small? or average? my poor little ear holes cant take the massively thick nozzles of the b2d much longer :( i Have pull on the top of my ear to make my ear hole as wide as possible while inserting them to get a decent depth...
Dude, most people don't know how to EQ when a sound signature bothers them. It is truly remarkable to have the work done for them via DSP for most people. The other thing is no one wants to change eq settings on each device each time they plug their IEM in a different device, sometimes you plug a different headphone and you forget to change your EQ profile, it's simply not handy. So an IEM carrying its own EQ is just better.
@@Maihmethis time apparently it's crins sister. Or someone crin knows atleast. He had a post on his channel Edit: or the person was doing a cosplay of the cartoon character. Idk tbh
@@Maihme This is my own version of the history. I bought some Moondrop earphones, among many other Chinese brands, back in 2018/2019. Early on, Moondrop wasn't really focused on making good sounding earphones. They were decent at best but they have always been cheap, just like almost every other Chi-Fi brands back then. One of the things that they did to attract customers is making earphones with "anime aesthetics". From simple box design with nice looking Japanese texts to having anime waifus on their boxes.
@@Maihme a lot of the people in the iem market are weebs (anime fans) so they like the presence of anime "waifus" (the cartoon chiildren) on the boxes.
Thanks Resolve for the review. Crin has actually done this use of one device to show two targets with the TruthEar Zero & Zero:Red, the blue being Harman and Red being IEF, but sadly a lot of reviewers and commentors never touched on what the Red was, instead they simply highlighted how you can get better sound with Hexa from the same stable, showing how they completely missed the point that Crin was making, where he was saying "here is the same device with two tunings, which one is your preference". The Zeros (at US105 combined) were so that you could find the general signature you prefer for when you are buying the really expensive stuff, instead some people even complained that project red was just another cheap Crin tuned IEM.
I don’t think Crin does a good job of explaining the niche of the product. Kudos to Resolve for being the most coherent review of the Dusk to date. I’m personally getting one in hopes that the community will put out their favorite tunes of this or custom tunes to make them sound like other iems
I like both the Analog and DSP tuning, with Analog coming across like a slightly less harsh version of the B2D, but I do prefer the tuning of the DSP default. I still have my issues with the free DSP cable, and concerns with longevity as there have been complaints of the cable failing after a few months, as well I’ve started to have issues with my Moondrop may freedsp cable where it cuts out when listening and needs to be reseated. Achieving something closer to the DSP default tuning through analog means would have stirred up less controversy
Fyi, the Free DSP cable I bought, stopped working within few months..... I hope the QC related to this unit is better than their other recent products cuz I love the tuning...
I’m starting to have issues with the Free DSP cable from my Moondrop May, where it starts to cut out, and needs to be reseated to get recognized by my phone.
It's a 20 dollar cable and it's the same cable that comes with the Moondrop May which is a 60 dollar IEM. I would expect something better on a 360 dollars IEM...
Yes! For so long I am telling people that you can upgrade a good IEM to a GREAT IEM with some slight changes in EQ... And they don't listen ;) So many people keep chasing imaginary end-game product when it's so easy (and fun) to achieve with EQ.
Why care about the app at all, though? The best preset (DSP default) is already baked into the cable; the app is just for applying those bonus gimmicky presets. Just plug and play to your phone or PC with the DSP cable and never even bother with the app.
most of the DAPs have Android and support the terrible Monondrop app, so it's not just a limitation of use with phones.. moreover if you can "upload" the setting into the cable, it's really a great thing and I bet you won't need to do it more than a few times at the beginning, once you find your preferred tuning you just keep it into the cable, and the USB-C cable can be used with phones, DAPs and computers... so in the end it's just an initial adaptation, then it goes smoothly - looking forward to getting my Dusk !
Hot take: if you need to be a "trained listener" to enjoy a pair of IEMs or headphones, then they're not worth it. They should speak for themselves. If you like something, it should be implicit
I don't think anyone would argue one needs to be a trained listener to enjoy something. The distinction is only relevant because in the research, untrained listeners were less discerning and ranked similarly very different tunings. This introduces noise in that dataset by comparison.
In a way I do agree, but if you're already in this hobby for a good amount of time you'd already have a good idea of what you like and what you don't. If you're a new person, then I guess it just depends lol
i disagree to an extent because experience in a hobby is going to make you have vastly different tastes, for example in the reverse the harman tuning is pretty well the most on average disliked tuning in the more experienced side of the hobby and more universally well received by people who havent explored different tunings and preferences not saying its bad or wrong if you like it but it is indeed the case that untrained and experienced listeners have very differing tastes usually and its okay if some things are made for a targeted audience of the more experienced in a hobby. and its also not like the inverse isnt true in the iem community there are many "beginner" iems and tunings
I preordered the Dusk and seeing how there were EQ values provided finally got me to try EQ APO + Peace GUI on my PC. Doing more research on it, I came across profiles for some of my already owned IEM's that get them towards a certain target, and I'm blown away by the new life brought to those IEM's that I stopped using as much. Seeing all the options and sliders to adjust on an EQ definitely put me off from trying it earlier, but having different profiles for specific headphones to get a starting base to tune from made the process a whole lot easier to play around with. Makes me wish that manufacturers would just provide EQ profiles for various targets/preferences along with their headphones. A text file with just a few lines of values is all that's needed to import them through Peace.
I started using EQAPO with oratory1990's presets for Harman for my headphones and then just tweaked to my preferences. Manufacturers providing curves would definitely be cool too but base curves are out there for just about everything.
If you EQ them to be the same with the right measurement gear, they will likely sound the same given the shell design and fit are very similar and you will get the same length mode features for both.
what I don't really get is the "meh" response to the analogue tuning from quite a few reviewers, when it's basically the universally praised B2D tuning with some of its complains (slightly hot upper mids, lack of extention) ironed out. sure, there is the treble peak but I own the Performer 8 which apparently has an even more extreme peak, which I don't think I've heard anyone mention as a problem
B2D was always universally praised but never necessarily universally enjoyed. A lot of nitpicks and criticisms have been issued towards it and it doesn't really take you long to file through forums to see people saying it's a good tuning but not really all that engaging
I think this is due to DSP default being so largely better than Analog, that it creates a big enough gap between the two, making people bash over the Analog unconsciously so they can better emphasize the benefits of DSP.
Resolve was in the comments on Reddit (about this video) and he even stated that it’s good without the DSP cable. Reviewers became enamored with how good it is with DSP so it’s really moreso about wanting that tuning stock. The problem is Crin explained this. Drivers and crossover filters can only do so much passively. If you try to fine tune too much, it creates other issues.
I love the Diffuse Field target (without tilt)! One of the biggest revelations for me when I started messing with DSP equalization. I tried and tried to "enjoy" the Harman target. But the simple truth for me us that Diffuse Field works better for me.
I mean, DSP might sounds like a fancy new tech to anyone who just got into this hobby, but for us old dogs it’s pretty much just a built-in dac cable with eq profiles preloaded which isn’t really new or fancy at all. Anyone could do that easily with a dongle and a eq software on their phone/PC.
Might have to skip then. At this point, I'm not really plugging into my phone for audio unless I'm going outside, at which point I'm not going to be using something at that price point, especially if I'm worried about the cable failing. Would rather have the analog tuning be closer to this new preset, with a nicer 3.5mm cable so I can use it with my normal source.
It was obvious to me already 20 years ago when I started the hobby and the DSP technology has so much more to offer than simple EQ. The stuff that Dirac and Smyth has been doing for years are very impressive and I have just waited for this tech to penetrate into mainstream applications. It still has much more potential to be exloited, especially with earphones and their inherently weak sense of space.
I wish the dusk dsp tuning was the analogue tuning. I can't see me using any of the other tunings. To be honest, I'll probably just use them with the qudelix and eq them to the dsp tuning myself. I can't see me using the moondrop app as it looks awful.
hey resolve why is that the blessing 2 dusk was so well received when the the crin "The dusk"in analog mode has a similar frequency response but why general consensus is that its (The dusk) not that good? is it because the dusk is matching technicalities on an earphone (blessing dusk 2) thats a few years old? the market has pushed so far ahead?
What are the manufacturing tolerances of Moondrop exactly though? Sennheiser mostly has a +/- 1,5db tolerance in place, which already seems large for audiophiles, but is a high standard according to Sennheiser. I would love to know Moondrops actual variance tolerance.
I pre-ordered then cancelled my pre-order. Ultimately, I didn't love the idea of an IEM that doesn't perform nearly as well via 3.5mm as it does USB. Totally understandable, but the vast majority of my listening isn't done on my phone, and I wanted something a bit more versatile without sacrificing sound quality.
Just to reiterate something in the later portion of the video, the DSP cable retains its presets. So if you have USB-C on your computer, you get Dusk Default as the sound signature.
Yeah, I'm really on the fence on this one. I'm not just in it for the sound when buying IEMs. I care about the whole package. The case is okay and I agree that they should have added more tips. What's holding me back is the flimsy looking analog cable. Sure I could use a different one but I'm still paying for that ass-looking cable with the Dusk. I also get what you mean that its jig is about the preset sound signatures. That would be appealing to starting audiophiles I guess but I wouldn't recommend anyone to start in the $300 range.
If it is the same cable as the one which is included with blessing 3 it is actually pretty good. Does not look like much, but it behaves well, is very light/comfortable and everything is functional. I did not like it initially when i got B3 too, but practical use changed that opinion.
Honestly I wish someone would make a DSP dongle (so I don’t need two cables) that isn’t made by moondrop and instead has an actually good configuration utility that exists on PC and Mobile. Then someone can simply copy over the EQ to that!
If I ever decide to pick up a pair, I'd throw the dsp cable in the trash and use a Qudelix 5K to EQ. Honestly don't want to deal with the Moondrop link app or be tied to using an ugly DSP cable. Moondrop Line K cable would pair nicely.
The Qudelix-5K DAC/AMP solves all of this with their universally praised app. Leave all others their personal tastes behind and micro-EQ the hell out of any of your IEMs/headphones. And it's fun too!
I'd like to see an IEM that sticks to its analogue tuning but uses DSP and an app to calibrate the anolgue tuning to a persons own ears. So in the app in plays specific sounds with a different ear gain and you choose what sound best, then a sound for calibrating treble to preference etc.
This is just the enchanted cable approach to EQ which has been tried by others but hasn’t really caught on yet, at least maybe until now. Crinacle might be the guy with enough gravity to turn it into a real thing, crappy firmware notwithstanding.
great review! Talking about the DSP cable, one factor that I feel not talked about is that it basically eliminates all the "pairings" talk whenever an IEM gets released. "oh it needs more power" or "your source is just bad" should not be a factor cause everyone will basically get the same source. also, I wonder if DSP being baked in means that we maybe can get perfect channel matching via some DSP shenanigans in the future? hoping?
It all just shows that once you master the EQ you don't need too many IEMs. Just one or two with quality drivers and good looks. Their tuning doesn't matter - you can adjust it yourself
I have a phone with a 3.5mm jack. I want a mic. Do I need to get a 3.5mm to USB C adapter? Will I lose anything if I do? I typically hate usb c for audio because the connection jostles
Well, seems like my Variations are going to stay my main IEMs for now. I use them with 2 peak filters, one at 250 Hz +2dB Q 0.71 and one at 3000Hz -2dB Q 1 and one high shelf at 8000Hz -2.5dB Q 0.71 to fix the few issues I had with it, like the thin lower midrange and slightly bright treble.
17:05 I thought the exact same when I first saw the DSP/analog squig. What crin claims is that it's either impossible or expensive to do that. Judging from how many people say using the dusk profiled cable on other iems makes them better, I can see how this is the reason. 17:50 yes
@@laundmo no. That thing is the source, but doesn’t allow you to specify the curve you get after applying it. That concept of “destination “, is what’s missing. 3.0 just splits that in two
wondering if upcoming moondrop evo earhooks would play nice with dusk... in theory they could use moondrop link app and dsp profiles. however source power requirements of new dusk could be an issue.
It's far better to use Wavelet. You can use your own tunings, it also has pre amp etc , Squig Eq works as well. , a lot better application. Love it. No need DSP 😂
I’m gonna pass on this hype train perhaps when used prices hit $150 I’ll try it. Just now getting into the meteor, ie600, and sa6 mk2 of the products now that they are affordable.
OMG, exactly what I found by ordering the FREE DSP cable alone. The App sucks. Crashes a lot. I can’t load a graphic EQ from Squiglink, in wavelet format. It does work well with the Soundstage+ preset on a few of my IEMs. Makes the Tangzu Heydays sound great! Another problem is no PC App like you said. And it won’t work with iPhones 14 and under (lightning) I tried it in a 15 and it wouldn’t recognise. Gain is very limited. I’m going to do a full review on just the cable. While a great idea, it needs a lot of work!
I want to share my experiences with long nozzles. I don’t have any problems with large ones like the Red however I can’t get it or the Hexa to fit flush to my ear. I realized it’s the length of the ear tip stem that butts up against the contour. Ironically, the red tip from the 7Hz Zero works for me on the Zero: Red. Lots of zeros lol I used to only focus on the tip outer and inner diameter, but now I’m going to try tip rolling on the Hexa with that in mind when I can. :) If it comes to it, I may have to cut the stem 1 mm at a time tho I think 2-3mm at least would make it fit.
I was excited for these. I listen to a lot of bass heavy music and I replaced my headphones with the Singolo but I can't get a good fit with them. The peak in the treble would annoy me on the analog.
In my experience DSP EQ like the ones found on most DAP's and Aps has a blunting effect on the sound so possibly Crin added the extra treble to compensate for this.
you know people have other priorities in life right? "stop being lazy. learn to do it" is kinda asinine when a lot of folks just want something that sounds decent, then go about their life. crins approach to giving some standardised presets is waaaaay more accessible to a wider audience than "git gud bro".
I think Creative's products are pretty viable for this reason alone. A very intuitive EQ software with compatibility baked into the product. I still use the G6 on my gaming PC for that reason. Pressing a button on the side turns my EQ on and off. At my work desk, I use the Fosi SK01 for physical knobs. Products like these are a good way to bridge that gap for many people, and the DUSK kind of falls into that category.
@@ReverendDr.Thomas Yeah that makes sense, but what I'd do is pick a favorite - an idealized "EQ headphone", something specifically for dialing it in. Or learn what kind of wideband adjustments you like for each of your headphones you could use with EQ available and just be comfortable not doing that for the rest.
Use a Lighting to USB adapter and plug the DSP cable into your iPhone that way. You might need an additional USB-C to USB-A adapter, but as long as you can use it.
3:17 please use the depth gauge on the cslipers (the spike that sticks our the bottom) measuring this way is about as accurate as using a ruler and absolutely should not be sub milmeter precision
Well, it's not a fancy solution, but you can buy a USB-C extension cable to use it with your PC if the case isn't close to you. I remember a lot of cases regarding the poor build on previous B2D such as the faceplate falling off and the shell cracking up, this new Dusk doesn't look much different construction-wise. I prefer something more tank for the price.
I bought the blessing3 last year and it felt very meh until i took the time to EQ the thing. Mostly ended up with just making everything under 1k match the tuning on the Katos, and cutting out the 6k peak. While DSPs technically are the way forward if we want more exotic driver configs, its kind of an issue if you need a 3.5mm jack like i do when I use my iems for stuff like VR or are using a source that doesnt have parametric EQ.
@@americoechevarria8387 Crinacle already released all the EQ settings for each DSP profile so you can tune the analog to the same sound. So you either set the DSP cable to the profile you want (It will save it ON THE CABLE so you dont need to have the app after that) or you EQ the analog with a EQ program on your phone or PC
Does anyone know the best way to connect the dsp cable to an old ipod nano? Is it better to connect it through a 3.5mm adapter OR a lightening adapter? I have no idea. Thank you.
Would you choose this or Focal Bathys? I know we are talking about different things, but since I want the best sound for street usage with smarthphone and this is a USB iem... Also thinking about noise cancellation... The aim seems pretty similar
Kinda depends a little bit on if you need bluetooth connectivity and whether or not you want headphones or iems. Budget also should be considered since they are vastly different in price
Is it possible to change the tuning with the dsp cable but then use it with the analog one? Since I don't have a usb-c port on my pc or an audio interface.
what if you slap on the dsp cable on the blessing 3? can you improve the blessing 3s underwhelming base response? will moondrop sell the dsp/usb c cable on its own?
I want to buy free dsp cable with zero red (mainly because I want mic with usb c) do you think its worth for 30$. It really looks convenient rather than dongles + mic
You could try and use Auto EQ. Though it would probably not get even close to how it actually sounds in real life. (But you'd never know if you didn't try the Dusk lol)
I am glad Crinacle didn't tune the non-DSP version of the earphone to the same target as the default DSP version, because it's getting people to try both sound signatures; it's encouraging them to compare both and decide for themselves. It's encouraging people to learn what DSP is and what its benefits are. It's creating a bit of controversy and conversation, which isn't so bad in this hobby in my opinion. Some may have preferred the analog 3.5mm tuning to be the same as the DSP version, but I'm not one of them. Kudos to Crinacle for demonstrating what DSP can do and why it's so useful, whether we wanted it or not.
Even though the app is jank, especially with the required permissions/privacy concerns, I still see the DSP tech as something exciting. Feels like the frontier of the future for this market, especially in regards to making quality products that average consumers (who aren't in as deep as us audio nerds) will consider buying. Oh wow! I don't need a dongle? And these magic earphones make everything sound delicious?! All the while, with a streamlined EQ process (ideally, anyway lol), we audio goobers benefit from the magic too It would be preferable if the analog tuning was the same as the default DSP preset, but I feel like it kinda makes sense - 2 planar microtweeters fixed the B2 Dusk issue Crin mentioned in his vid, but that sounds like a zingy combo to me lol. On the engineering side of things, it may be a tough issue to solve with this particular housing/configuration, meaning that the DSP capabilities are an all around benefit, ESPECIALLY if the analog tuning still competes reasonably well. Still debating the purchase, but I'm excited to try them out at some point! If Moondrop is able to provide a better app experience, these may turn into a no-brainer buy!
Clarifying in case it gets lost in translation: the Moondrop LINK app is not required for the DSP to work.
The Default profile is baked into the DSP cable right out of the box, so in that regard it is immediately plug-and-play. No additional EQ software is required.
what if people switch cables? will it still sound almost the same? I think it's better for the default preset to be applied on the IEM itself, not on the dsp cable. I saw reviewers get disappointed that they can't use it on their current system with analog as the tuning is baked on the dsp cable.
@alrizo1115 DSP still requires a DAC of some sort. What you're referring to is analog tuning, and the DUSK has been deliberately tuned to match the Blessing2:Dusk in analog due to the universal praise it got.
The Default DSP preset is a different flavour, one that is apparently even more universally praised compared to the B2:D, but relies on the DAC chipset in the USB-C connection.
@@alrizo1115doing it on the IEM would have basically been impossible. Let's say you're using the 3.5 mm cable. The signal would go from digital to analog from phone to cable. Then the IEM would have to convert analog to digital, back to analog. That would be such a mess to engineer and tune right.
@@alrizo1115 Crin explained this in his full video but basically the default DSP is just little bits a pieces to make it perfect. The Dusk is supposed to be tuned really well acoustically in analog but due to engineering limitations they included DSP to perfect the tuning. Its quite literally just a free upgrade, I do think it should be included in the form of PEQ files for download as well though.
@crin can you confirm if the analog is indeed B2D preset? because I was going to find B2D in used instead of these. If these fulfill that requirement and their DSP is good too, then this Dusk makes more sense.
Just a note, turns out the sub bass boost on the DF tilt preset is due to issues when using peak filters below 65hz. Apparently reducing it there introduced noise, so they didn't do it.
@D4rkBlack22 I'm sure they'll improve it. But it does need to be called out right now.
If only the app was open source so developers or people who know how to fix the apps can fix it using Moondrop open source publicly available code source to work with.
And also with opening the code for everyone, it help the development faster and moondo would not be accused of secretly spying on users.
Try Open Source the code, many startups company who has software issues/bugs/glitches are being helped by community.
It's an interesting reason to make what I think is a viable choice. A very targeted and isolated sub-bass emphasis is appealing to a lot of people.
@@ResolveReviewsi'm not so sure, the app has been launched several months ago, it's also used for other Moondrop IEMs and nothing changed.
Thanks for the measuring the nozzle dimension
Yeah, I have the Blessing 2 Dusks and those DESTROY my earholes after a little bit of time. Glad to hear these are smaller.
its ~5.7mm at 3:15 in case ppl cant find it
For all of my nicer iem's, I would get eartune fidelity tips
@ is this considered small? or average? my poor little ear holes cant take the massively thick nozzles of the b2d much longer :( i Have pull on the top of my ear to make my ear hole as wide as possible while inserting them to get a decent depth...
Dude, most people don't know how to EQ when a sound signature bothers them. It is truly remarkable to have the work done for them via DSP for most people. The other thing is no one wants to change eq settings on each device each time they plug their IEM in a different device, sometimes you plug a different headphone and you forget to change your EQ profile, it's simply not handy. So an IEM carrying its own EQ is just better.
I completely agree.
Very true, on device EQ is just way more convenient
This is why I love the qudelix 5k so much
there are pc software plus android software that change eq based on the device you plug in
I choked on my coffee when I heard "Its always nice to see the cartoon children"
Exactly same. "... i guess" part really got me. I have never understood the cartoon childrens in IEM boxes. Where does it comes from?
@@Maihmethis time apparently it's crins sister. Or someone crin knows atleast. He had a post on his channel
Edit: or the person was doing a cosplay of the cartoon character. Idk tbh
@@Maihme This is my own version of the history. I bought some Moondrop earphones, among many other Chinese brands, back in 2018/2019. Early on, Moondrop wasn't really focused on making good sounding earphones. They were decent at best but they have always been cheap, just like almost every other Chi-Fi brands back then. One of the things that they did to attract customers is making earphones with "anime aesthetics". From simple box design with nice looking Japanese texts to having anime waifus on their boxes.
@@8lec_R No in the dusks its the "anime waifu" version of crinacle himself. Hence the glasses and hair color.
@@Maihme a lot of the people in the iem market are weebs (anime fans) so they like the presence of anime "waifus" (the cartoon chiildren) on the boxes.
Thanks Resolve for the review. Crin has actually done this use of one device to show two targets with the TruthEar Zero & Zero:Red, the blue being Harman and Red being IEF, but sadly a lot of reviewers and commentors never touched on what the Red was, instead they simply highlighted how you can get better sound with Hexa from the same stable, showing how they completely missed the point that Crin was making, where he was saying "here is the same device with two tunings, which one is your preference". The Zeros (at US105 combined) were so that you could find the general signature you prefer for when you are buying the really expensive stuff, instead some people even complained that project red was just another cheap Crin tuned IEM.
I don’t think Crin does a good job of explaining the niche of the product. Kudos to Resolve for being the most coherent review of the Dusk to date. I’m personally getting one in hopes that the community will put out their favorite tunes of this or custom tunes to make them sound like other iems
I like both the Analog and DSP tuning, with Analog coming across like a slightly less harsh version of the B2D, but I do prefer the tuning of the DSP default. I still have my issues with the free DSP cable, and concerns with longevity as there have been complaints of the cable failing after a few months, as well I’ve started to have issues with my Moondrop may freedsp cable where it cuts out when listening and needs to be reseated.
Achieving something closer to the DSP default tuning through analog means would have stirred up less controversy
This review, AND the links with more info are really good! Thank-you.
This was the first DSP moondrop that didn’t have noise floor for me.
Noise floor surely is a source issue
brave of you to call people's iem waifu a child
edit: aaaand people are starting to argue in the replies (what have I done?)
All anime characters are children. LITERAL children.
He’s not wrong. That culture is peak cringe
@@NotTheOnlyMattAroundWhat?
Y-you do know that there are old people in anime right?
@@occasionalart7597why are you stuttering in text
@@fesdonomist2xD
Fyi, the Free DSP cable I bought, stopped working within few months.....
I hope the QC related to this unit is better than their other recent products cuz I love the tuning...
I’m starting to have issues with the Free DSP cable from my Moondrop May, where it starts to cut out, and needs to be reseated to get recognized by my phone.
Damn, what garbage 🗑️
It's a 20 dollar cable and it's the same cable that comes with the Moondrop May which is a 60 dollar IEM. I would expect something better on a 360 dollars IEM...
Yes! For so long I am telling people that you can upgrade a good IEM to a GREAT IEM with some slight changes in EQ... And they don't listen ;) So many people keep chasing imaginary end-game product when it's so easy (and fun) to achieve with EQ.
Why care about the app at all, though?
The best preset (DSP default) is already baked into the cable; the app is just for applying those bonus gimmicky presets.
Just plug and play to your phone or PC with the DSP cable and never even bother with the app.
Yeah you just forgot that it's a cheap DSP cable that ends up having lots of problems
@@Rat0713 cables and sources make no difference. The included cable isn't even that bad.
@@kawaiikoto8800 It makes a difference if there are QC issues, longevity, durability issues, and so on. Which there apparently are.
@@terrencebucker placebo
@@kawaiikoto8800no, expensive cable can change 60% of the sound
most of the DAPs have Android and support the terrible Monondrop app, so it's not just a limitation of use with phones.. moreover if you can "upload" the setting into the cable, it's really a great thing and I bet you won't need to do it more than a few times at the beginning, once you find your preferred tuning you just keep it into the cable, and the USB-C cable can be used with phones, DAPs and computers... so in the end it's just an initial adaptation, then it goes smoothly - looking forward to getting my Dusk !
@@ReverendDr.Thomas ok, then I replace "most of" with "many" :)
Hot take: if you need to be a "trained listener" to enjoy a pair of IEMs or headphones, then they're not worth it. They should speak for themselves. If you like something, it should be implicit
I don't think anyone would argue one needs to be a trained listener to enjoy something. The distinction is only relevant because in the research, untrained listeners were less discerning and ranked similarly very different tunings. This introduces noise in that dataset by comparison.
I think in the context of DAC’s and many amplifiers this is a great take. The drivers are a big deal that do stand out though.
In a way I do agree, but if you're already in this hobby for a good amount of time you'd already have a good idea of what you like and what you don't. If you're a new person, then I guess it just depends lol
Well said
i disagree to an extent because experience in a hobby is going to make you have vastly different tastes, for example in the reverse the harman tuning is pretty well the most on average disliked tuning in the more experienced side of the hobby and more universally well received by people who havent explored different tunings and preferences not saying its bad or wrong if you like it but it is indeed the case that untrained and experienced listeners have very differing tastes usually and its okay if some things are made for a targeted audience of the more experienced in a hobby. and its also not like the inverse isnt true in the iem community there are many "beginner" iems and tunings
I preordered the Dusk and seeing how there were EQ values provided finally got me to try EQ APO + Peace GUI on my PC. Doing more research on it, I came across profiles for some of my already owned IEM's that get them towards a certain target, and I'm blown away by the new life brought to those IEM's that I stopped using as much. Seeing all the options and sliders to adjust on an EQ definitely put me off from trying it earlier, but having different profiles for specific headphones to get a starting base to tune from made the process a whole lot easier to play around with. Makes me wish that manufacturers would just provide EQ profiles for various targets/preferences along with their headphones. A text file with just a few lines of values is all that's needed to import them through Peace.
I started using EQAPO with oratory1990's presets for Harman for my headphones and then just tweaked to my preferences. Manufacturers providing curves would definitely be cool too but base curves are out there for just about everything.
How would the DUSK compare to the Blessing 3 if both are EQ'ed to preference (or if you EQ the B3 to approximate the DUSK's Default DSP preset)?
asking the real questions
If you EQ them to be the same with the right measurement gear, they will likely sound the same given the shell design and fit are very similar and you will get the same length mode features for both.
i'd say you get a better looking iem with dusk, also less prone to scratches.
what I don't really get is the "meh" response to the analogue tuning from quite a few reviewers, when it's basically the universally praised B2D tuning with some of its complains (slightly hot upper mids, lack of extention) ironed out.
sure, there is the treble peak but I own the Performer 8 which apparently has an even more extreme peak, which I don't think I've heard anyone mention as a problem
Haha same thought, I compare the fr graph of 3.5mm analog to B2D and its almost identical, Its weird people are calling it bad but B2D good
B2D was always universally praised but never necessarily universally enjoyed. A lot of nitpicks and criticisms have been issued towards it and it doesn't really take you long to file through forums to see people saying it's a good tuning but not really all that engaging
I think this is due to DSP default being so largely better than Analog, that it creates a big enough gap between the two, making people bash over the Analog unconsciously so they can better emphasize the benefits of DSP.
Resolve was in the comments on Reddit (about this video) and he even stated that it’s good without the DSP cable.
Reviewers became enamored with how good it is with DSP so it’s really moreso about wanting that tuning stock.
The problem is Crin explained this. Drivers and crossover filters can only do so much passively. If you try to fine tune too much, it creates other issues.
I love the Diffuse Field target (without tilt)! One of the biggest revelations for me when I started messing with DSP equalization. I tried and tried to "enjoy" the Harman target. But the simple truth for me us that Diffuse Field works better for me.
i would love to get one pair but since i’m an iphone and dap user this dusk won’t be good for me. good thing i saw this video
I mean, DSP might sounds like a fancy new tech to anyone who just got into this hobby, but for us old dogs it’s pretty much just a built-in dac cable with eq profiles preloaded which isn’t really new or fancy at all. Anyone could do that easily with a dongle and a eq software on their phone/PC.
Outstanding job Andrew!
Might have to skip then. At this point, I'm not really plugging into my phone for audio unless I'm going outside, at which point I'm not going to be using something at that price point, especially if I'm worried about the cable failing. Would rather have the analog tuning be closer to this new preset, with a nicer 3.5mm cable so I can use it with my normal source.
Tyll predicted onboard DSP as being the future of headphones. Dude was a Prophet.
It was obvious to me already 20 years ago when I started the hobby and the DSP technology has so much more to offer than simple EQ. The stuff that Dirac and Smyth has been doing for years are very impressive and I have just waited for this tech to penetrate into mainstream applications. It still has much more potential to be exloited, especially with earphones and their inherently weak sense of space.
I wish the dusk dsp tuning was the analogue tuning. I can't see me using any of the other tunings. To be honest, I'll probably just use them with the qudelix and eq them to the dsp tuning myself. I can't see me using the moondrop app as it looks awful.
hey resolve why is that the blessing 2 dusk was so well received when the the crin "The dusk"in analog mode has a similar frequency response but why general consensus is that its (The dusk) not that good? is it because the dusk is matching technicalities on an earphone (blessing dusk 2) thats a few years old? the market has pushed so far ahead?
What are the manufacturing tolerances of Moondrop exactly though? Sennheiser mostly has a +/- 1,5db tolerance in place, which already seems large for audiophiles, but is a high standard according to Sennheiser. I would love to know Moondrops actual variance tolerance.
what iem (without eq/dsp) sounds closest to the new dusk+dsp or jm1?
Great review and well balanced take!
I pre-ordered then cancelled my pre-order. Ultimately, I didn't love the idea of an IEM that doesn't perform nearly as well via 3.5mm as it does USB. Totally understandable, but the vast majority of my listening isn't done on my phone, and I wanted something a bit more versatile without sacrificing sound quality.
If you're not against using EQ, Gizaudio has published the PEQ settings of every Dusk preset
That's what I'm gonna do with my desktop use, just EQ to match the DSP sound, covers all my needs.
Just to reiterate something in the later portion of the video, the DSP cable retains its presets. So if you have USB-C on your computer, you get Dusk Default as the sound signature.
@@ResolveReviews
You wouldn't even need USB-C on your PC, a USB-C to USB-A adapter will do the trick with no issues.
Yeah, I was disappointed you need to use the DSP cable to get the best sound quality, and wish the analog profile was as good.
Yeah, I'm really on the fence on this one. I'm not just in it for the sound when buying IEMs. I care about the whole package. The case is okay and I agree that they should have added more tips. What's holding me back is the flimsy looking analog cable. Sure I could use a different one but I'm still paying for that ass-looking cable with the Dusk.
I also get what you mean that its jig is about the preset sound signatures. That would be appealing to starting audiophiles I guess but I wouldn't recommend anyone to start in the $300 range.
If it is the same cable as the one which is included with blessing 3 it is actually pretty good. Does not look like much, but it behaves well, is very light/comfortable and everything is functional.
I did not like it initially when i got B3 too, but practical use changed that opinion.
Rather pay 300 than get a 200 dollar iem and 100 dollar dac amp
@sergeyivanov2667 This is exactly right, it's the Blessing 3 cable which is very good.
Honestly I wish someone would make a DSP dongle (so I don’t need two cables) that isn’t made by moondrop and instead has an actually good configuration utility that exists on PC and Mobile. Then someone can simply copy over the EQ to that!
Qudelix 5K
Wavelet, equalizer apo, autoeq?
If I ever decide to pick up a pair, I'd throw the dsp cable in the trash and use a Qudelix 5K to EQ. Honestly don't want to deal with the Moondrop link app or be tied to using an ugly DSP cable. Moondrop Line K cable would pair nicely.
App isn't required for default profile
The Qudelix-5K DAC/AMP solves all of this with their universally praised app. Leave all others their personal tastes behind and micro-EQ the hell out of any of your IEMs/headphones. And it's fun too!
I'd like to see an IEM that sticks to its analogue tuning but uses DSP and an app to calibrate the anolgue tuning to a persons own ears. So in the app in plays specific sounds with a different ear gain and you choose what sound best, then a sound for calibrating treble to preference etc.
This is just the enchanted cable approach to EQ which has been tried by others but hasn’t really caught on yet, at least maybe until now. Crinacle might be the guy with enough gravity to turn it into a real thing, crappy firmware notwithstanding.
So if you own an iPhone with lightning connector, this product will not work completely (no DSP)
great review! Talking about the DSP cable, one factor that I feel not talked about is that it basically eliminates all the "pairings" talk whenever an IEM gets released. "oh it needs more power" or "your source is just bad" should not be a factor cause everyone will basically get the same source.
also, I wonder if DSP being baked in means that we maybe can get perfect channel matching via some DSP shenanigans in the future? hoping?
Can we put an 3.5mm adapter on DSP cable? Or how can we use it with our dac amps?
2:50 You know, Crin did this DSP thing to achive the referance level tuning and changing eartips changes tuning too.
Just ordered these to replace some IKKO OH10's - i'm assuming/hoping i'll appreciate the upgrade 🙏
It all just shows that once you master the EQ you don't need too many IEMs. Just one or two with quality drivers and good looks. Their tuning doesn't matter - you can adjust it yourself
Nah, you need a measurement rig for that or perfect ears
I have a phone with a 3.5mm jack. I want a mic. Do I need to get a 3.5mm to USB C adapter? Will I lose anything if I do? I typically hate usb c for audio because the connection jostles
Bass + is not a meme, it’s dope 😂
FR. Why do people hate it xD Its literally perfect for bassheads.
@@basti329 it is actually dope! Haha I have a great time with it!
According to you, which is the a better Iem than Sennheiser IE900? Is it Thieaudio Prestige or something even better?
Well, seems like my Variations are going to stay my main IEMs for now. I use them with 2 peak filters, one at 250 Hz +2dB Q 0.71 and one at 3000Hz -2dB Q 1 and one high shelf at 8000Hz -2.5dB Q 0.71 to fix the few issues I had with it, like the thin lower midrange and slightly bright treble.
17:05 I thought the exact same when I first saw the DSP/analog squig. What crin claims is that it's either impossible or expensive to do that. Judging from how many people say using the dusk profiled cable on other iems makes them better, I can see how this is the reason.
17:50 yes
If Qudelix’s presets were done correctly (where you could define your iem _and_ target curve, it would render this DSP approach useless
since the 3.0 update you have a separate speaker and user EQ - is that what you meant?
@@laundmo no. That thing is the source, but doesn’t allow you to specify the curve you get after applying it. That concept of “destination “, is what’s missing. 3.0 just splits that in two
finally got mine, its great. analog is not bad either cant really decide between it and dsp default
Can I add DSP cable to Blessing 3 to get Dusk sound?
At least Blessing 3 (analogue) is decent?
Can't I just EQ the thing regularly and use it with an amp?
yes. Do that.
@@ResolveReviews Noted thank you.
wondering if upcoming moondrop evo earhooks would play nice with dusk... in theory they could use moondrop link app and dsp profiles. however source power requirements of new dusk could be an issue.
I know that there's a 0% chance that a revision with the DSP tuning being used for the analogue version, but thats what I'm hoping for.
It's far better to use Wavelet. You can use your own tunings, it also has pre amp etc , Squig Eq works as well. , a lot better application. Love it. No need DSP 😂
I’m on the fence about this one.
Bro that bass preset looks incredible 🤤🤤
I’m gonna pass on this hype train perhaps when used prices hit $150 I’ll try it. Just now getting into the meteor, ie600, and sa6 mk2 of the products now that they are affordable.
OMG, exactly what I found by ordering the FREE DSP cable alone. The App sucks. Crashes a lot. I can’t load a graphic EQ from Squiglink, in wavelet format.
It does work well with the Soundstage+ preset on a few of my IEMs. Makes the Tangzu Heydays sound great!
Another problem is no PC App like you said. And it won’t work with iPhones 14 and under (lightning) I tried it in a 15 and it wouldn’t recognise.
Gain is very limited.
I’m going to do a full review on just the cable. While a great idea, it needs a lot of work!
Saw a smile in the thumbnail, had to click!
I want to share my experiences with long nozzles. I don’t have any problems with large ones like the Red however I can’t get it or the Hexa to fit flush to my ear. I realized it’s the length of the ear tip stem that butts up against the contour. Ironically, the red tip from the 7Hz Zero works for me on the Zero: Red. Lots of zeros lol
I used to only focus on the tip outer and inner diameter, but now I’m going to try tip rolling on the Hexa with that in mind when I can. :) If it comes to it, I may have to cut the stem 1 mm at a time tho I think 2-3mm at least would make it fit.
I'm not paying $360 for channel imbalance 💀
I was excited for these. I listen to a lot of bass heavy music and I replaced my headphones with the Singolo but I can't get a good fit with them. The peak in the treble would annoy me on the analog.
Hello from Thailand! I am deciding between the Dusk and Varitions. Could you please help recommend?
His credibility went away with his nail clipper
Do the tips still come off as easy as they did on the Blessing 2? (chance to get stuck in the ear) or did they add a lip to the nozzle?
I think the DF-tilted preset has that sub-bass boost, since the Free DSP cable doesn't allow EQ below 60hz.
Channel matching issues are due to planar drivers, which seem to be very difficult to match.
8:56 Your HRTF may also be constantly fluctuating because you have variable frequency hyperacusis 😂😭😭
In my experience DSP EQ like the ones found on most DAP's and Aps has a blunting effect on the sound so possibly Crin added the extra treble to compensate for this.
you know people have other priorities in life right? "stop being lazy. learn to do it" is kinda asinine when a lot of folks just want something that sounds decent, then go about their life. crins approach to giving some standardised presets is waaaaay more accessible to a wider audience than "git gud bro".
Resolve here - that's fair! I tend to agree with this take, especially for this product.
I think Creative's products are pretty viable for this reason alone. A very intuitive EQ software with compatibility baked into the product. I still use the G6 on my gaming PC for that reason. Pressing a button on the side turns my EQ on and off. At my work desk, I use the Fosi SK01 for physical knobs. Products like these are a good way to bridge that gap for many people, and the DUSK kind of falls into that category.
@@ReverendDr.Thomas Does it have to do with use case? Because that makes sense IMO.
@@ReverendDr.Thomas Yeah that makes sense, but what I'd do is pick a favorite - an idealized "EQ headphone", something specifically for dialing it in. Or learn what kind of wideband adjustments you like for each of your headphones you could use with EQ available and just be comfortable not doing that for the rest.
How does the default DSP tuning compare to the symphonium meteor that you like so much?
Regarding the analogue tuning, I wonder how it will respond to EQ beyond the app.
Will there be a lighting DSP coming in the future?
Lightning is dead, your next iPhone will not have this issue
Use a Lighting to USB adapter and plug the DSP cable into your iPhone that way.
You might need an additional USB-C to USB-A adapter, but as long as you can use it.
Does the DSP cable work well with other multi-BA, Hybrid, DD IEMs? Or does it muck everything up and should only be used with the Dusk?
6:07 he said the thing
What is ur best IEM for gaming especially Valorant and watching movies max price 400 euro's????
The Dusk
3:17 please use the depth gauge on the cslipers (the spike that sticks our the bottom) measuring this way is about as accurate as using a ruler and absolutely should not be sub milmeter precision
Well, it's not a fancy solution, but you can buy a USB-C extension cable to use it with your PC if the case isn't close to you.
I remember a lot of cases regarding the poor build on previous B2D such as the faceplate falling off and the shell cracking up, this new Dusk doesn't look much different construction-wise. I prefer something more tank for the price.
I'd like to see you check out the Softears Studio 4, Crin's sample measures very close to Dusk but with less sub bass (on his rig at least)
You people must need me to make a damn good Iem ! First I wouldn't use BA
How much do they weigh in grams? Are they more than 6 grams per each ear piece
I bought the blessing3 last year and it felt very meh until i took the time to EQ the thing. Mostly ended up with just making everything under 1k match the tuning on the Katos, and cutting out the 6k peak. While DSPs technically are the way forward if we want more exotic driver configs, its kind of an issue if you need a 3.5mm jack like i do when I use my iems for stuff like VR or are using a source that doesnt have parametric EQ.
Sideloading the app is a security red flag.
Can I choose the default eq preset in the app and then change the cable to analog and get the same sound as the dsp preset?
No
@@WarisAmirMohammad so the only thing I can do is choose the default preset and use the dsp cable without the app
@@americoechevarria8387 yes, the dsp is the thing changing the sound
@@americoechevarria8387 Crinacle already released all the EQ settings for each DSP profile so you can tune the analog to the same sound. So you either set the DSP cable to the profile you want (It will save it ON THE CABLE so you dont need to have the app after that) or you EQ the analog with a EQ program on your phone or PC
@@americoechevarria8387 yes
How much better are than the zero reds?
Hey guys, Will those iEM's work when i plug them right into my pc via USB-C cable? Or I need some audio interface to use the EQ usb-c cable ?
Does anyone know the best way to connect the dsp cable to an old ipod nano? Is it better to connect it through a 3.5mm adapter OR a lightening adapter? I have no idea. Thank you.
Would you choose this or Focal Bathys?
I know we are talking about different things, but since I want the best sound for street usage with smarthphone and this is a USB iem... Also thinking about noise cancellation... The aim seems pretty similar
Kinda depends a little bit on if you need bluetooth connectivity and whether or not you want headphones or iems. Budget also should be considered since they are vastly different in price
Is it possible to change the tuning with the dsp cable but then use it with the analog one? Since I don't have a usb-c port on my pc or an audio interface.
no, the tuning is done digitally during conversion in the cable
With all the recent AI boom n all...When can we xpect auto generated captions to be accurate? 😅
what if you slap on the dsp cable on the blessing 3? can you improve the blessing 3s underwhelming base response? will moondrop sell the dsp/usb c cable on its own?
They already do it's the Moondrop FreeDSP.
I want to buy free dsp cable with zero red (mainly because I want mic with usb c) do you think its worth for 30$. It really looks convenient rather than dongles + mic
any close recommendations to dsp dusk sound??
OK so how do I make my OG Dusk sound like the default DSP profile of this one
You could try and use Auto EQ. Though it would probably not get even close to how it actually sounds in real life. (But you'd never know if you didn't try the Dusk lol)
I am glad Crinacle didn't tune the non-DSP version of the earphone to the same target as the default DSP version, because it's getting people to try both sound signatures; it's encouraging them to compare both and decide for themselves. It's encouraging people to learn what DSP is and what its benefits are. It's creating a bit of controversy and conversation, which isn't so bad in this hobby in my opinion.
Some may have preferred the analog 3.5mm tuning to be the same as the DSP version, but I'm not one of them. Kudos to Crinacle for demonstrating what DSP can do and why it's so useful, whether we wanted it or not.
Even though the app is jank, especially with the required permissions/privacy concerns, I still see the DSP tech as something exciting. Feels like the frontier of the future for this market, especially in regards to making quality products that average consumers (who aren't in as deep as us audio nerds) will consider buying. Oh wow! I don't need a dongle? And these magic earphones make everything sound delicious?! All the while, with a streamlined EQ process (ideally, anyway lol), we audio goobers benefit from the magic too
It would be preferable if the analog tuning was the same as the default DSP preset, but I feel like it kinda makes sense - 2 planar microtweeters fixed the B2 Dusk issue Crin mentioned in his vid, but that sounds like a zingy combo to me lol. On the engineering side of things, it may be a tough issue to solve with this particular housing/configuration, meaning that the DSP capabilities are an all around benefit, ESPECIALLY if the analog tuning still competes reasonably well.
Still debating the purchase, but I'm excited to try them out at some point! If Moondrop is able to provide a better app experience, these may turn into a no-brainer buy!
i feel like calling it the autotune for iems
Does the DSP function work with a lightning to USB C connector?
No
17:48
Exactly!